0:00

the u s is home to be peace

0:02

largest workforce in the world and

0:04

we've invested more than one hundred forty

0:06

billion dollars in america since two

0:08

thousand and five we

0:11

support more than two hundred forty thousand

0:13

jobs here

0:13

a workforce aiming to

0:16

deliver the energy america needs to

0:18

day one developing lower carbon

0:20

alternatives see how we're

0:22

investing in america at bp

0:24

dot com slash investing in

0:26

america

0:33

years with report claimed and you are

0:35

one server drain the

0:38

bill is passed you

0:41

could watch the house floor yesterday and

0:43

say wow this is a bill

0:45

that was brokered by negotiations

0:47

on both sides it's getting bipartisan

0:49

support it's going to pass the senate

0:52

this

0:52

is a good a good day

0:54

for american democracy

0:59

rachel siegel as an economics reporter

1:01

for the post in for the last couple of weeks

1:03

she's been on a hill and that's because of the

1:05

debt ceiling negotiations that me really

1:07

brought the global economy to it's knees

1:10

so yes rachel says this

1:12

could be seen as a good day for democracy

1:15

but also

1:16

there was negotiating over the debt ceiling and

1:18

the first place which a lot of people argued should

1:20

never have been the case and

1:23

this is something that is just a part of

1:24

governing but in divided government

1:27

we of course cannot allow the perfect to be the enemy

1:29

of the good this deal fails

1:32

fails completely and that's why

1:34

these members and others will be

1:36

absolutely opposed to the deal

1:39

and will will do everything in our power

1:42

to stop

1:43

there were a lot of really sour feelings about

1:45

why we were even they are in the first place and what

1:48

it signals about where things are in washington

1:50

neither side got what they wanted but

1:52

leadership of both parties are still

1:55

claiming victory it's amazing

1:57

and really a bit of a head scratcher

2:00

four months and especially

2:02

the last couple of weeks the two

2:04

sides the house to opie and

2:06

the white house were on such

2:08

opposite ends of these negotiations

2:11

and we really only saw some

2:13

members on the far right side of the g

2:16

p and some members on the progressive

2:18

side of the democratic party saying that they couldn't

2:20

support this bill

2:26

from the newsroom of the washington post

2:28

this is post reports are emerging

2:31

saying on your guest rooms today it's

2:33

thursday june first today

2:37

we unpack what exactly ended up in this

2:39

deal and we talk about

2:41

how negotiating on the debt ceiling at all

2:43

could hurt our global reputation

2:49

now

2:49

the taxes ninety nine pages long

2:51

i'm sure there's a lot of things in there were

2:53

rachel what are some of the key

2:55

points out of their that stood out to you what

2:58

exactly is in this bill

3:00

so that final ninety nine page

3:03

bill that finally got released over

3:05

the weekend includes a couple

3:07

of mean bullet points first

3:10

it's a spends the debt limit until

3:12

twenty twenty five that

3:14

helps us get out of this immediate

3:16

deadline that we were staring down on

3:18

june fifth it also does something

3:20

for democrats which basically puts this off

3:23

until after the twenty twenty four

3:25

election so that's one key thing

3:27

that both resolves the current problem

3:29

and kicked things a little further down the road then

3:32

there are other things that were more priorities

3:35

for republicans for

3:37

example the bill cut some i

3:39

r s funding the by an administration

3:42

ultimately agreed to pare back

3:44

about twenty billion dollars

3:47

of the eighty billion dollars that was supposed

3:49

to go to an expansion of the i r s

3:52

there were some progressive democrats that were

3:54

very upset about this but it was a real key

3:56

point that republicans had

3:57

been pushing for and

4:00

their thing that republicans have been pushing for were

4:02

new work requirements for certain federal

4:04

food stamp programs and federal

4:06

welfare benefits that means

4:08

that there are some new work requirements for snap

4:12

we're still trying to figure out the exact details

4:14

but basically the deal raises

4:16

the age at which adults will be required

4:19

to work in order to receive food stamps

4:21

from fifty to fifty four

4:25

you

4:26

know it sounds like they're actually

4:28

work quite a bit of cuts that are coming

4:30

out of this bill and i know that speaker kevin

4:32

mccarthy was very insistent that that

4:34

was what they were going into get yet

4:36

i also saw a fair amount of

4:39

republicans particularly those further

4:41

on the right in the very conservative

4:43

house freedom caucus expressing

4:45

dismay with the bill some even saying

4:48

we're not even going to support this bill

4:51

what did kevin mccarthy get out of the steel

4:53

wire those republicans on a happy

4:55

with the cuts that were in there for

4:57

days members of the house freedom caucus

5:00

which is one of the farther right groups

5:02

within the republican party has been really

5:05

really angry with the final agreement that kevin

5:07

mccarthy brokered with biden over the weekend

5:10

they are message basically is

5:12

that the final agreement really went

5:14

very far back on the and initial

5:16

proposal that republicans passed earlier

5:18

this spring what they had been pushing

5:21

for were really aggressive spending

5:23

cuts to what they say put

5:25

the country on a totally new spending

5:27

and that trajectory and they

5:30

say that that's not what they got

5:34

they say that mccarthy really

5:36

backtracked in order to make certain concessions

5:38

and finally come to an agreement with the white house

5:41

and they oppose the bill before it was even

5:43

final they came out really strong encouraging

5:45

other republicans to to fact

5:47

i want to be very clear not

5:49

one what public and should go for this deal

5:52

not one they've cast doubt

5:54

on kevin mccarthy his leadership in the first place

5:57

ultimately that level of criticism

5:59

really

5:59

stay contained to a small enough number

6:02

of lawmakers that it didn't threaten the bill

6:04

by it really did underscore the

6:06

tension that is put against kevin mccarthy

6:09

and his pretty precarious hold

6:11

over a party that has so many different factions

6:13

right now

6:18

and for his part what has speaker mccarthy

6:21

said about the deal mccarthy is

6:23

really proud tonight

6:25

we're going to do something we haven't

6:27

done before tonight

6:30

we're going to give america hope

6:32

be guess today as he was walking back and forth

6:35

to open up the house floor before the full house

6:37

voted on the bill he looked really

6:39

proud of himself he had this real beaming

6:41

smile and that was a different facial expression

6:44

then we'd seen on him for much of the last couple of

6:46

weeks when he was really in the thick of these negotiations

6:49

he says that it was a fair bill that it

6:51

ultimately did succeed in

6:53

securing certain spending cuts

6:56

and and ultimately getting to a place

6:58

that averted this kind of economic

7:00

doom but he's really proud of the negotiations

7:02

and completely disagrees with the way

7:05

the house freedom caucus characterized as the agreement

7:07

what

7:08

i'd love to look a little bit at some

7:10

of the issues members on the other side of

7:12

the aisle had with this deal and in particular

7:14

those were the new work requirements

7:17

that were added to some federal programs like

7:19

he would mentioned earlier know the

7:21

entire negotiations this had seem to

7:24

be a really sticking issue that particularly

7:26

progressive members of the democratic party

7:29

did not want to add work

7:31

requirements to programs like snap

7:33

also known as food stamps ritual

7:36

before we get into how they feel

7:38

about the final bill could you unpack

7:40

that a little bit for me why is the

7:42

issue of work requirements as it

7:44

relates to programs like food stamps the just

7:46

sticking issue particularly for a liberal members

7:49

of the democratic party

7:51

what i was hearing from some of them are liberal

7:53

members of the democratic party was basically

7:55

the food stamps or any

7:57

sort of negotiation around work requirements

7:59

just

7:59

had no place in a debt ceiling

8:02

argument

8:03

for requirements

8:05

for a real source of contention

8:07

throughout these negotiations and the

8:09

end result was a little bit quirky so

8:12

the agreement does impose

8:15

new work requirements for snap

8:17

benefits which used to be called food stamps

8:20

basically by raising the age

8:22

at which people would still have to work or

8:24

be in a training program in order to qualify

8:27

veterans people who are and housed

8:29

and young adults who like foster care

8:32

would be exempt from certain snap

8:34

work requirements but then there was

8:36

a little quirk to the

8:38

congressional budget office which does a lot

8:40

of estimates for what the spill it actually

8:43

look like actually said

8:45

the an additional seventy eight thousand

8:47

people per month would actually

8:49

qualify for snap because of this expanded

8:51

eligibility which would cost more

8:53

but still have more people qualifying for the program

8:58

president

8:59

biden was sort of messaging

9:01

that it seems like things could

9:03

have been far worse and that this was a better

9:05

shake out of that deal is that

9:07

a fair characterization of how the

9:10

president's talking about the spill what is he

9:12

said about things like these new work requirements

9:14

or the deal in general president

9:16

biden appears very

9:18

proud of the deal as well we have heard

9:20

of much less from the white house than we have

9:23

from the house to a p there's

9:25

actually been quite a bit of frustration from democrats

9:28

that the messaging from the white house has not been

9:30

stronger on this deal i couldn't

9:32

speak to the crowd of reporters that have been

9:34

following the geo p negotiators'

9:37

up and down the halls of the hill for weeks where

9:39

is there really just has not been that much of an opportunity

9:41

to hear from president biden but

9:43

he stayed optimistic through this whole process

9:46

he was certain that he would be able to broker

9:48

a deal with kevin mccarthy and

9:50

he says that this deal not only

9:53

averts the significant

9:55

spending cuts that republicans were seeking

9:57

but also includes a lot of the priorities

9:59

democrats had been pushing for and

10:02

of course avoids bumping up against that

10:04

stuff feeling democrats

10:05

had been saying

10:07

that this deal had a lot of red lines

10:09

that they absolutely do not want to vote

10:11

for but at the last minute a lot of democrats

10:14

came out and supported it what exactly

10:17

was the calculus behind their why was

10:19

it worth it end up supporting the steal

10:21

a lot of democrats did come forward

10:23

to support the deal in the and actually more

10:25

democrats voted in the house to

10:27

support the bill than republicans dead and

10:30

i think that it boil down to a couple of things

10:32

first june fifth is very

10:34

close there really is not enough time

10:37

to revise the spell

10:40

or to have a lot of open negotiations

10:42

you figure out what should change

10:45

what should be tweaked tear june fifth is

10:47

just a couple of days away and i think that there

10:49

was a very serious recognition

10:51

of what would happen if this build a

10:53

not go through if the u s became

10:55

dangerously close to defaulting on it's

10:57

debt there was a lot of messaging

10:59

around the bill that essentially said not

11:02

everyone is going to get what they why but the end result

11:04

really was palatable

11:06

enough to and moderates and

11:09

and really enough people with them both parties

11:11

to get them to support the bill without all

11:13

that much hesitation making down to it you

11:16

know you spent a lot of time

11:18

on the hill last week you saw

11:20

the leader mccarthy going in and out of these negotiations

11:24

i'm really wondering after everything

11:26

that we saw in all of the build up to

11:29

what could have been a catastrophic economic

11:31

event did it seem like there is any

11:33

reconsidering of whether the debt

11:35

ceiling should be something

11:37

that can be held up like this

11:39

i know there had been calls for eliminations

11:42

of the debt ceiling the president to bypass

11:44

congress but didn't seem like on the hill

11:47

there was any kind of momentum to

11:49

do away with the debt ceiling and all after this

11:52

i

11:52

think that that's one of the questions that

11:55

lawmakers could be considering a little

11:57

bit more thoughtfully once

11:59

us

11:59

finally over i think that there was so much

12:02

stress and focus

12:04

and anxiety and contention around

12:07

figuring out what to do about this immediate deadline

12:10

there was obviously a lot of frustration that boiled

12:12

over that had some lawmakers saying

12:15

what can we do to make sure we're not in this

12:17

situation again but really the prevailing

12:20

focus and energy was on

12:22

how to hammer out a deal and

12:24

there were some days where it looked like that wouldn't be

12:26

possible there were some days where one

12:29

of the g o p negotiators' came out of a meeting

12:31

and said talks are on pause and and yesterday

12:34

he told us that things had really blown

12:36

up a couple of times over the course of these negotiations

12:39

they would take a couple steps back and i'm kind of inched

12:41

forward now are finally on the

12:43

other side of it by it

12:45

so much of the focus over the last couple weeks was

12:47

just figuring out what to do before early

12:49

june

12:53

after the break will get him a how this

12:55

deal kicks the debt ceiling gun road in

12:58

what this close call means for our economy

13:00

going forward will be right

13:02

back

13:09

the u is home to be peace

13:11

largest workforce in the world and

13:13

we've invested more than one hundred forty

13:16

billion dollars in america since two

13:18

thousand and five we

13:20

support more than two hundred forty thousand

13:22

jobs here

13:23

a workforce

13:24

aiming to deliver the energy america

13:26

needs to day one developing lower

13:29

carbon alternatives see

13:31

how we're investing in america and

13:33

bp dot com slash investing

13:35

in america

13:43

so the good news is that it does

13:45

seem like the worst catastrophe

13:48

that could have come out of a default is not going

13:50

to happen but in the run

13:52

up to all of this the tension that surrounded

13:54

it ritual do you have a sense of how

13:57

others were watching this whether that be

14:00

other nations perhaps even the federal

14:02

reserve but did the

14:05

tension and debate and be near

14:07

miss that we almost had here have

14:09

any ramifications in a how people

14:11

are going to interact with the united states

14:13

dollars or the us economy going forward

14:16

it came really close there were

14:19

a lot of other world leaders

14:22

who look at the united states

14:24

and look at this particular process

14:26

and the politics around it and just cannot

14:28

fathom the risk

14:31

that comes along with this the united

14:33

states is one of the

14:35

foundations of the global economy

14:37

so many nations rely on dollars

14:40

and the strength of the us economy to

14:42

protect and shield and service they're dead

14:45

and they were looking at the political

14:47

drama unfolding on capitol hill and at the white

14:49

house and waiting for

14:51

a title way of to hit their own shores

14:53

if the united states couldn't get it's act together

14:57

it

14:59

doesn't look like there were tangible

15:01

consequences to the global economy that would

15:03

have com if there was an actual default but

15:06

i do think that there was a level of just

15:08

sort of growing alarm

15:10

or skepticism about why the united

15:12

states handles it's process this way in the first

15:14

place and then at the federal

15:16

reserve this was just one more piece

15:19

of that the great uncertainty that

15:21

we talk about off and on this show it the federal

15:23

reserve has enough on it's plate

15:25

in terms of shield at an economy it still trying

15:27

to get inflation down and still trying to head off a recession

15:30

it's now june first and i don't

15:33

think it would have been all that much of a comfort

15:35

to them to know that this debt ceiling impasse wouldn't

15:37

have come together with

15:38

just a couple of days before the default deadline

15:43

did any of this alarm and uncertainty

15:45

seem to weigh on speaker mccarthy in

15:47

the last week when you're on capitol hill

15:49

did he speak at all as

15:51

to the impact

15:53

even just these negotiations were having

15:55

on america's public image mccarthy

15:58

would talk about it and i think that

16:00

was a message for by both parties

16:02

and their own ways both parties would use

16:04

this imminent deadline to try

16:06

and pressure the other side to make

16:09

concessions and negotiated interestingly

16:12

they were a couple of far right republicans who

16:14

cast doubt on this early june

16:16

deadline by others really

16:18

used it to their advantage to say we are

16:20

taking up against the clock here republicans

16:23

also criticised the white house for waiting

16:25

a long time to come to the negotiating table

16:27

in the first place and were really able

16:30

to use it to their advantage and keep a lot of

16:32

negotiations on their terms saying

16:35

we've had a proposal forward for months

16:37

you haven't wanted to come to the negotiating table

16:39

and now we've really only got a handful of days to figure

16:41

this out

16:42

you know a little while ago we

16:45

had a collie tony ram on the show and

16:47

he introduced a little piece of

16:49

history that i found it interesting which was that the last

16:51

time there was a big debt ceiling showdown

16:53

in two thousand and eleven the country's credit

16:56

rating was downgraded should we

16:58

expect anything like that to happen

17:00

again that

17:01

was one of the big fears on the list

17:03

of doomsday scenarios that would have com

17:06

if we defaulted or even came

17:08

close to defaulting and

17:11

so far it seems like that as another thing

17:13

that has thankfully been averted this

17:15

is on a path to pass

17:17

the senate by a vote sometime in the next

17:20

couple of days it's already cleared

17:22

more than enough support and the house president

17:24

biden will get it signed as quickly as possible

17:26

and hopefully those things will help wipe

17:29

away the slate of really really

17:31

disaster scenarios like a credit

17:33

downgrade and obviously all the consequences

17:35

that would have come for the american people to know

17:39

in the debt ceiling agreement as you had said

17:41

the debt ceiling is raised for about two years

17:44

until twenty twenty five but rachel

17:46

disastrous kind of kick the can down the road

17:48

i mean this was such an alarming

17:51

of van for so many people just

17:54

seem like there's anything that could prevent

17:56

it from happening again or we potentially

17:58

going to be back in this

17:59

they shun in january twenty twenty five think

18:03

that's one of the questions that will have to

18:05

answer in the meantime i certainly

18:07

hope for not back on this so in january

18:09

twenty twenty five talking about a near

18:12

her default on the country's debt

18:14

by it it could go two ways you

18:16

could have lawmakers really

18:19

thoughtfully sit back and say okay

18:21

this was a really bad path to

18:23

go down for too long what can

18:25

we do to make sure that this doesn't happen again or

18:28

as sometimes happens in washington

18:30

the next crisis head and the next issue

18:33

sucks up all the oxygen and takes all the

18:35

attention and makes it so that suddenly

18:37

and january twenty twenty five or right back where we started

18:41

might be too early to answer that but whether

18:43

this becomes a really hard

18:46

memory for people and get them to change something

18:48

that will have to watch of the next eighteen months

18:53

while rachel i look forward to the next

18:55

time you are back on the show with her it's to

18:57

talk about the debt ceiling or the federal

18:59

reserve again thank you so much for

19:01

all of this today it was great talking to you thank

19:03

you for having me

19:09

ritual siegel is an economics reporter

19:11

for the post that's it for

19:14

post reports thanks for listening today

19:17

shows produced by game o'connor it

19:19

was mixed by sean carter and edited

19:21

by maggie payment if you want to

19:23

show your support for the show please

19:25

subscribe to the washington post it's

19:27

a great way to support the work we do go

19:30

to washington post dot com slash

19:33

subscribe are

19:34

margin saying we'll be back tomorrow

19:37

with more stories from the washington

19:38

post

19:44

the u is home to be peace

19:46

largest workforce in the world and

19:49

we've invested more than one hundred forty

19:51

billion dollars in america since two

19:53

thousand and five we

19:55

support more than two hundred forty thousand

19:57

jobs here

19:58

a workforce

19:59

aiming to deliver the energy america

20:02

needs to on developing lower

20:04

carbon alternatives see

20:06

how we are investing in america and

20:08

bp dot com slash investing

20:10

in america