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0:00
[MUSIC]
0:14
Welcome back to another episode of Questions with Crocker with me, Dr. Crocker and my husband, Shane.
0:19
>> Hey. >> Hey, it is after the holidays.
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It is officially 2024 and this is our first podcast of the year.
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We are doing it the night before the podcast is supposed to be out.
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>> Very efficient. >> We are struggling at the start of the year.
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If you're watching on YouTube, the five people that do that,
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you will see that I am in a scrub, no, not a scrub set.
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I am in a, what is it called, a leisure suit?
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I don't even know. >> It's a hoodie. >> A hoodie, but it's got matching pants.
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>> There's too much for our kids wear every day. >> I'm in a hoodie.
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It is from a scrub company I love, Garden Malod.
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They send it to me. >> Yes, they say that. >> Yes.
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>> Garden Malod? >> Yes. I actually checked with my stepdad, his French and he confirmed.
1:03
>> He had a said, "Guardé Maldé." >> That is definitely not how he say it.
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It's a good thing they didn't send you the clothing.
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But I am comfortable because I've been sick and it has not been fun.
1:16
Pretty much we came back from our vacation over the holiday with sickness that has spread
1:21
through the family except for you. >> And now I'm confined to this office of yours,
1:25
which is guaranteed to get me sick. >> I am on the mend because I'm not coughing my lungs out anymore.
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So I think you'll be fine. >> Stay tuned for next episode where Shane is sick.
1:36
>> And you're whining about it? >> Yeah. >> Oh, yeah.
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>> So I'm feeling a little rough,
1:41
looking a little rough, but we appreciate you guys being here.
1:44
So just a reminder on this podcast,
1:46
I am an emergency veterinarian and a general practice hospital owner,
1:50
along with you, my husband.
1:53
And you are an entrepreneur and you bring the business sense,
1:57
the common sense, the humor to these episodes, I would say.
2:00
And so we're back at it in 2024.
2:04
I feel like you're giving me a look. >> I'm gonna say something very, yeah.
2:09
>> I was waiting. I felt like I was, I was teaming you up for that.
2:13
>> No, yeah. >> I was teaming you up for something. So we have people submit questions.
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You can follow us on social media, @questionswithprogress.
2:20
>> I saw the numbers you posted. >> There's actually some one impressive.
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>> I know. We have, I think it said 1600 downloads or so,
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an episode which is amazing. And then a lot of different countries listening.
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So shout out to anyone who is-- >> Of Japanese.
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>> Not-- don't get us in trouble again.
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Shout out to anyone who is not in the states and is listening.
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We appreciate it. I want to do an episode on some point on like international veterinary medicine,
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because it's interesting from people I've interacted with online,
2:48
like how different it is in other countries.
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And so I think that would be a very cool episode.
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People weren't even aware there was vet schools.
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>> I think we need to take the show on the road. >> Oh, there you go.
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>> And hit all the continents. >> Actually, if funny, you should say that.
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>> We'll write that off. >> There's a couple big conferences coming up that I will be at.
3:07
And I actually plan to podcast it, some of them.
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And so it's going to be a great opportunity to podcast with people
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that are specialists in their field or just fun personalities,
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but do it in person. You will be at some of those events.
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You will not be at some of those events. The travel season is starting again.
3:24
So keep an eye out and listen to us on social media,
3:28
because I'll be posting where I'm going to be and when I'll be podcasting.
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And maybe I can interview you, or you can be a part of things in asking questions.
3:36
So that should be exciting. But I did want to talk a little bit first just about the holidays.
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It was exhausting. We travel a lot because our in-laws,
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your parents are in Louisiana. So as go there, do, I don't know, three Christmas events or so
3:53
and then come back Christmas evening night and do Christmas morning here
3:56
and then do all the Christmas events with my family.
3:59
So it's a lot. But we got some good gifts.
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So I want to know, what is your favorite present that you got this Christmas?
4:06
>> My favorite? >> Yeah. >> My golf bag.
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>> Which I got you, yes.
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>> Good, good, good. >> I mean, it's pretty simple.
4:16
You golf so much I just get you a new bag and shoes every single year.
4:19
But at least I was able to get you one that was pretty cool this year
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and you liked it. But you also got to get from her daughter.
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What did she give you? >> My chair that I'm sitting in.
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>> Yes. So it was very sweet and she actually came up with that idea on her own
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and she said, "Dad always has to borrow brother's chair for the podcast."
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So I want to get him a chair. >> This is our plug for sponsorships.
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>> I can't afford chairs.
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>> We bought a chair from Wayfar.
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>> I know, if you're listening. >> We buy a fair amount of things from Wayfar.
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So Wayfar, if you want to hit us up, you can.
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But it was very sweet and the leather chair actually goes well in my office.
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So she did a great job and I just thought she was like-
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>> You were going to podcast from my office. >> Upstairs?
5:00
No. >> Like my chair upstairs?
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>> In the attic upstairs? >> So that's a nice one. >> There's not enough room.
5:05
Okay, we'll talk about that later. Definitely not podcasting up there.
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I'm just glad you didn't make it big enough to do a golf simulator up there.
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>> I did actually. >> Once the kids leave that in their space.
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You cannot take a full swing in there. >> Oh yeah.
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>> Not happening. >> How if things might over the top?
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>> I'm going to measure it later and just make sure.
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So we got some good gifts.
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I really enjoyed Christmas time,
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but I do feel like I need a vacation from the vacation with the sickness.
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But the kids are back in school. We're getting back on schedule.
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I'm actually starting to travel again, starting tomorrow morning.
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So we're ready to be back at it.
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But make sure you pay attention to our channels.
5:42
So you know where I'll be when, because I loved interacting with people in person,
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meet them and when you come to conferences,
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you also can meet people because I know that's your most favorite thing ever.
5:51
>> I did. I've got a day job. I've got to do.
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>> Which your day job has been a little tough to do,
5:58
because we are in full swing renovations
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at the framing stage of our vet hospital.
6:05
So tell everyone what's been going on with that.
6:08
>> I'm now a general contractor. Anybody is looking to renovate at the hospital.
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>> Did you? Okay. >> But legit,
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did you guys know you can just pay a fee
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and say your general contractor in any city?
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I mean- >> I'm in any city. >> Oh, okay.
6:21
>> I mean Texas, you don't have to necessarily have a contract for license.
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Louisiana, you do. >> Okay, got it. >> Texas, you do not.
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>> Got it. Which seems backwards. I feel like Louisiana, you could like,
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pay your way. >> You like to pay your way.
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>> A little easier than Texas. So yes, we have people who are skilled,
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who are doing the work, but you are assembling the different crews
6:43
and managing the job. And you have oversight by other people
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that have helped us with projects in the past. But you're taking this task on.
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And I am trusting you with it.
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>> It's a lot of things. >> But it's a little nerve-wracking.
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It's like our third child.
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And so it's just a lot.
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And we've only had a few minor disagreements
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in the last couple of weeks, I would say. >> I would agree.
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>> And for the most part, we've worked through it, I would say.
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>> I would agree. >> So we're still going strong.
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A, we'll see how it all turns out.
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We'll see who is right and who is wrong. >> We have walls up.
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>> At the end. We do have walls. We have doors.
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We have windows. We have a lot of stuff.
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I mean, I get to do all the fun stuff now,
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picking out flooring, paint, colors.
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And so that's the part I really enjoyed.
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But I think it's gonna be great. >> We're not there yet.
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>> I'm really. >> Past a few inspections before we start.
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>> Before we start slapping green. >> Paint on the wall.
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That's all right. Okay, so let's get into it.
7:43
This podcast is based on your questions that you have about veterinary medicine,
7:46
about things behind the scenes, about practice ownership or emergency medicine,
7:51
whatever you want to know about. And we got a really great question
7:54
from @JMSwift92.
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>> Swifty. >> I don't know, maybe a swifty.
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So many swiftees in our lives.
8:02
And so, JMSwift92,
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I'm gonna pardon the question a little bit,
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because it was a little bit longer. But wanted to know, basically,
8:10
is practice ownership financially worth it?
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And the comparison that was made is that they know an ER vet,
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making $250,000 a year.
8:20
And they want to know, like, should they just go and
8:24
do ER medicine and make $250,000 a year?
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Or can a GP practice owner make more than that
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and have it justify the headache?
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And so I thought it would be a good conversation to have.
8:36
And I think it's interesting because I am an ER doctor
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and I work with many doctors who make $250,000
8:43
plus in the emergency room.
8:46
And I have some thoughts and feelings
8:50
on why someone would choose one or the other.
8:53
So what are your initial thoughts on it?
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>> My initial thought would be, don't make a decision based off the financial impact
8:59
of either one of them. You can be financial successful,
9:03
going either direction, but you have to be ready for both.
9:10
I mean, they're very different in the way you practice,
9:12
the way you think, the way you approach every day, right?
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So I would take that first.
9:20
>> Which is actually an interesting point
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because I think a lot of people looking for jobs
9:26
in this career, lead with money and lead with salary.
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And I have talked against that
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and how there's so many other aspects of a job
9:35
that make a job fulfilling and sustainable.
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And so I love that you started off with that right from the bat
9:41
that like it's not just the financial side of things
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that would push you in the direction of owning your practice versus working.
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>> Yeah, I mean, we've been successful doing both,
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but they are very different in the mentalities. So can you make as much as a practice owner as being ERBAT?
9:56
I think the answer to that is yes, but you have to look at it in multiple buckets.
10:00
It's not just one bucket. It's also dependent on where you're at
10:05
and cost of living and everything else. But if you're GP and you're working in the practice
10:11
in theory, you pay yourself a percentage
10:14
of the revenue that you drive. So if you do 800,000 a year,
10:18
you pay yourself 20% of that at your salary.
10:21
If you have multiple bests that work for you
10:23
or have other revenue sources coming into that practice,
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you typically drop money to the bottom line,
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which is your income. So those two brought together should put you around
10:36
the same number if not more depending on how big a practice is.
10:39
Nessam is a phantom income,
10:42
meaning you may get taxed on it,
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but you can't spend it because you have to reinvest that back
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into the practice if you're working capital. So that's one thing to consider.
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The other is if you're owner, you're building an asset
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that it's someday, hopefully you're able to sell for a profit.
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And if you take that and back out, you know, that number
11:03
over at X number of years, let's say you own the practice for 10 years,
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you sell it for $2 million, you know, you could back that out of 10 years
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and say you made extra X per year in theory.
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So there's different ways to look at it. So the answer is yes, you can make that much money or more.
11:20
You could also make less. But if you're taking that risk as being an owner,
11:26
it's not guaranteed income, but the potential is there.
11:29
So I think there's a couple of important things to pull out of what you said.
11:32
I thought that was very muddy. No, I think it was clear to me,
11:36
but we're going to break it down a little bit more. So first is your personality dictates a lot,
11:42
whether you should go into practice ownership or not.
11:44
I think that if you want to show up to a job,
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do your job, make really good money,
11:49
but leave and not have to deal with anything else,
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then yes, go be an emergency veterinarian
11:55
and make $200,000 plus a year, work less days and enjoy your life, right?
12:00
But if you want... But that's also not easy work.
12:03
No. Make sure that... Emergency work is not easy work.
12:07
It's long hours and it is very difficult.
12:09
Or if you want to invest and grow financially over time
12:15
and you have a vision for practice and you feel very strongly about the way things are done and run
12:20
and you're okay with the fact that like, you're not going to leave at five
12:24
and just be done with everything.
12:26
Then I think practice ownership is something to consider.
12:29
I mean, I got to a point in my career where I didn't have enough say in what was happening in the hospital
12:35
that I could go to the hospital and really enjoy what I was doing.
12:38
I love the patients. I love the clients. But like, the fact that HR decisions were being made
12:43
that were out of my control and other things were being done
12:46
that in the end were hurting the practice and I didn't feel like we're putting it in the right direction.
12:50
I couldn't see myself being at that practice for, you know, 20 plus years
12:54
and not having some form of control.
12:57
Now, emergency, yes, I show up, I work my butt off.
13:01
I have ownership over my shift and I lead, you know, that team
13:04
and I'm a part of a great experience.
13:07
But when I leave, I'm okay leaving and not having to worry about anything else
13:11
having to do with that business. And so it does work for me.
13:14
But I do think that you have to have a certain personality
13:18
to go and practice ownership. But it's definitely not just about the finances.
13:21
Now, the other thing is, are you going to have a single doctor practice
13:25
or are you going to have a multiple doctor practice?
13:27
That is a huge, huge determinant
13:29
of how much money you will make in the long run and whether you can sell your practice in the long run.
13:34
I agree. Because right now, we actually have a ton of people
13:38
on Facebook groups that are like, DBM owners that are single practitioners
13:43
that have taken their practices, built them up.
13:45
They were originally asking for like 1.4 million for them.
13:49
They are down to asking like 600,000
13:51
pretty much for the real estate of their practice.
13:53
Hit us up at, where we at? At, sorry, handbook.
13:57
I'm questions this got occur. Yes. We have some interest in buying practices.
14:02
No, it made me laugh. No, they're like in Maine and California
14:05
and they're a little too far away. I'm in.
14:07
But people, like corporations,
14:09
aren't buying these single doctor practices.
14:12
And other people don't want to buy them
14:14
because the clients have maybe been trained in a certain way or the hours
14:17
or what they want or the location is in.
14:19
And so these single doctor practices can't resale?
14:21
Yeah, I think I mean, even going a step further than that,
14:24
I think we saw a lot of private equity groups
14:27
getting into the market over the last X number of years.
14:30
They drove a lot of valuations up for multi-doctor practices.
14:34
I think maybe some people are still looking at those numbers
14:37
thinking they're going to get some kind of crazy multiple.
14:39
Those multiples don't exist. They were kind of inflated to begin with.
14:43
So keep that in mind too and you're doing your calculations
14:46
that if you think you're going to get, you know, 13 times EBITDA when you go to sale,
14:51
that's probably not the case. You need to look at more realistic numbers.
14:54
Yeah, so I personally would not go into practice
14:58
wanting to be a single practitioner,
15:00
build the practice room me only
15:03
and have that be how it is. But we have some people that have a,
15:07
they've built that practice and they have wanted to employees
15:10
and they control the lifestyle they want and they make enough money to be financially independent.
15:15
So if that's just somebody wants, then it'll be it.
15:18
But I think financially in the long run,
15:22
you make more money if you're a multi-doctor practice.
15:25
Oh, completely. Because you're going to be making money off of the revenue
15:29
that drops down from those additional doctors.
15:31
I agree. And you can choose to work in the practice
15:34
and be paid as a doctor or not. However, you want to do it.
15:37
But I think being a practice owner,
15:40
if you're looking at the financial component of it,
15:42
growing it to at least a two,
15:44
three doctor practice is going to be better
15:46
than being a single doctor practice.
15:48
Bonnitiously. It's going to be more of a lifestyle, maybe not.
15:52
No, it's definitely going to be more of a headache. I mean, we've seen that already.
15:56
The bigger you get, the harder communication is,
15:59
the harder workflow is. Dr. Staten, who I talk about all the time,
16:03
has a huge practice talks about that.
16:05
I mean, the levels of leadership and communication
16:08
you have to have the bigger you get. And I think there's actually a set number
16:12
that I heard one time in a talk that it's like once you get over 20 employees,
16:16
the amount of miscommunication that occurs
16:18
and the inefficiencies that can occur just skyrocket.
16:21
And so you really have to have procedures in place
16:23
to manage that. But the short answer of, can you do it
16:28
and is it financially worth it is yes?
16:31
The long answer is there's a lot more that goes into it
16:35
than just practice ownership versus,
16:38
financially lucrative yard job, essentially.
16:42
Did you think that it matters like how much school debt you have?
16:48
Do you think it matters whether you own your own house
16:51
or idea or not? Do you think your personal finances also play into that?
16:56
Or because my understanding is you can still get financing
17:00
and get things because like vet hospitals
17:02
are looked at as good investments by financial backers.
17:06
But do you think that one maybe keeps somebody
17:09
from becoming a practice owner? Not, I don't think necessarily from a financial standpoint though.
17:14
Now maybe a self-awareness of your own financial situation
17:21
may hinder some people from wanting to take on more debt.
17:24
So somebody may say, look, I'll just go work here,
17:27
pay my debt down, give myself in a better financial position
17:30
and then go buy a practice. But I mean, it shouldn't stop you from being able to buy a practice.
17:36
Yeah, I mean, there is a doctor that I worked at
17:39
with Andalus and I mean, she got out of school
17:41
and she busted her butt and she worked way too many shifts
17:45
and she will even say she like essentially burnt herself out.
17:47
But she made so much money that she paid her debt off in like three years,
17:51
something that it takes people like a lifetime to do.
17:54
And so you certainly could do that. And I feel like I've had times in my life where I've done that
17:59
and I've hustled more and like made more money and then I've had times where I slowed down.
18:03
And so your life stage and different things
18:05
you're doing definitely dictate that a little bit.
18:09
But ultimately, still think it is a good investment in the long run
18:14
to put your time, money and effort into something
18:17
that you're going to grow and is going to be your own
18:20
and you can then like sell down the line.
18:23
I also think it's interesting because there's this big
18:29
conversation being had on social media pretty much all the time.
18:32
But I made a comment in one of our other podcasts about
18:37
veterinary medicine maybe becoming more transactional and less relational.
18:41
And the comments, you know, from pet owners were, you know, your way to expensive.
18:46
You're just in it for the money. And so I think it's interesting when we get commerce like questions of people saying,
18:53
is it worth it being a practice owner like, well, I make good money?
18:57
And then there's almost a sense of shame in our industry
19:02
if we do make a good living.
19:05
And I just don't see that in other industries.
19:08
So do you get that sense in what is your thoughts and feelings?
19:12
I've got very strong opinions on this. I think anybody that goes to school for the only
19:19
the time the veterinarians go to school for and then knowledge that they obtain
19:23
and the passion they have for what they do should be very well compensated for that.
19:29
There's no different than a veterinarian as a dentist or a human doctor.
19:34
And they are very well compensated for what they do to be quite honest.
19:41
I mean, there are tradesmen in these days that probably make more than veterinarians,
19:45
plumbers, electricians, you know, some of those guys today are making
19:48
an hourly rate significantly more than veterinarians are making.
19:53
So I could understand where some owners would feel like
19:58
it's expensive to take their animal to the
20:03
doctor, but there's a lot of other calls to go into that.
20:07
And I'm necessarily going in the doctor's pockets, paying the technicians, paying the real estate,
20:12
paying the taxes, paying for the medications, etc.
20:15
All that stuff is so expensive these days that a lot of that's going to supplement other things
20:21
besides the veterinarian.
20:23
Well, and when you look at people with advanced degrees that got some sort of doctorate or
20:28
advanced degree, other human doctors, lawyers, and us, we are dramatically paid less than them
20:35
because there is this perception that if we make a good living, if we, you know, have a nice house,
20:41
if we drive a nice car, and I've even gotten these comments on social media when people have
20:44
seen, you know, our house in the back under something and they're like, oh, you know, like,
20:49
how many pets did you overcharge to have to like afford that?
20:53
It's frustrating that a lot of dual income going into that
20:57
and other investments and other parts. But we shouldn't have to.
21:01
We shouldn't have to make an excuse for working hard and making a good living.
21:06
Like, I went to school. I did the work.
21:08
I, you know, do the work every day and I show up and I'm good at my job.
21:13
And I shouldn't have to be ashamed that I make good money doing something I love to do.
21:19
And so I wish we could remove the, you know, I guess, correlation that pet owners make with us
21:26
making a good living by working hard and being a good, you know, business owner with your
21:32
taking advantage of me and my pet. I think those two things need to be uncoupled because they're not related at all.
21:37
The reality is everything is more expensive in the world right now.
21:40
The reality is we have people in our profession that are so extremely underpaid and we have
21:45
to charge more to try to make up for how low our margins have been for so long and how much
21:50
we have undercharge pets for so long. Yeah, I mean, I think I mentioned this couple podcasts ago.
21:54
When I look at other businesses we own in the margins associated with those businesses,
22:00
they are significantly stronger than that of the bet industry.
22:04
Now again, our prices are probably low in comparison to what we pay.
22:08
So it drops our margins down, but still overall, I don't think the margins are as good as
22:13
I've seen in several other businesses.
22:16
They are. And, you know, we intentionally have tried to be in that mid-range of veterinary hospitals.
22:23
We could certainly jack our prices up compared to some of the other local hospitals, but we're
22:27
trying to be intentional about what we're doing and helping us.
22:31
I need more money. I want to make more money by bringing more clients through the door that really buy into our culture
22:40
as a practice by bringing people in that want us to do like high-level surgeries and do
22:45
procedures like ultrasounds and things that they maybe can't get elsewhere.
22:48
I want to let them come because they are having an experience.
22:52
They feel like it's worth the value, but it is interesting.
22:54
I did read a comment the other day on one of my posts and I think a veterinary technician made it.
23:00
And this owner was complaining because they went and their dog's annual was like $250.
23:05
And they listed like all the things they got for that, but they're basically said,
23:09
you shouldn't even upcharge for medication. That's just wrong to even make money off medication.
23:13
And this person was like $250 is like what most like people spend on like
23:21
ridiculous things throughout the year.
23:25
And you're like that's such a small amount of money when you look at it by month and
23:28
you're getting all this value. And then you also think we should just give away medications.
23:33
In what world do people get medications just giving away to them?
23:38
That doesn't happen. Someone pays for it at some point in time.
23:41
Yeah, I think it would be interesting to put those people to say,
23:45
what is the equivalent medication in human medicine, Paulston?
23:49
And you know versus that vet med because there's probably some overlap in meds
23:56
where you see significantly higher charges in human medicine.
24:00
You do a vet med. Well, yeah, I mean, even when I've gone to get medications for our kids and if we didn't have
24:04
like our insurance on file, right, or it wasn't the generic one, they're like,
24:07
oh, well, it's, you know, $300 for a week of whatever.
24:11
And I'm like, wait a second, you know, and then they run your insurance.
24:14
So they're like, oh, it's $10. Like, how is that possible?
24:18
So there's a huge disconnect and the problem is you can be on social media and be trying to
24:24
educate people and talk to people, but you're going to have people that had bad experiences
24:29
in a difficult time with their pet and they are forever going to take that experience with
24:33
that one veterinary hospital and just fan the flames.
24:38
That and there's people that are unhappy people in general.
24:41
That's true. I mean, they're probably complaining about their lunch they had to date.
24:45
It'll also. That's true. This is a note to young veterinarians.
24:48
There's going to be unhappy people and you can do the best job ever you can communicate.
24:53
Really well, you can diagnose the pet correctly, make the best recommendations
24:57
and they will still be unhappy.
24:59
And those are the people that you just have to like say, okay, I did my job.
25:03
I did the best I could. Yeah, and just keep going.
25:06
And that is a part of being a veterinary medicine.
25:09
I would say for the most part is rewarding and I do feel valued by clients.
25:14
We got so many wonderful notes and treats from people over the holidays and people just
25:20
thanking us and shout outs on social media.
25:23
And so it is better than not trying to help people and not trying to do it.
25:30
But definitely the negativity and the feeling of a lose-lose when it comes to
25:36
making money and taking care of your team, but helping pets, it is a very, very thin line to walk.
25:43
I feel like. I feel like we did a 360.
25:45
What do you mean? What do we start with?
25:47
It's conversation.
25:49
We started with wanting to know if it is financially worth it to be a practice owner.
25:57
Yes. So the answer is yes. There you go.
25:59
You can just fast forward to the end of the podcast and we'll say yes.
26:02
No. Potentially. Part of it is you just have to know what you're getting into.
26:06
Yeah. And you have to know that you're going to.
26:09
And follow your passion because if you're good at what you do and you're passionate about it,
26:14
the money will follow. Can I ask you a serious question?
26:17
What? What would be your passion in this?
26:20
In this? Like we know it, not the podcast in us owning the vet hospital because you're like very engaged,
26:28
you're doing the renovation. Like what do you love about it?
26:32
Because I know what I love about it. I know what I'm trying to create.
26:35
I know what I'm I care about the industry.
26:37
I care about the pets in our community. I love our team.
26:40
I love just being a veterinarian and doing that side of it.
26:45
But like what are the parts of it that you really enjoy?
26:47
I like the startup phase.
26:50
I like the turnaround phase. I like the early growth phase.
26:54
And then I get bored.
26:56
So that means we sell it or a lot of YouTube.
27:01
Okay. Y'all heard it heard it here first. We're now in the market for our second vet practice.
27:05
We're not selling anytime soon. So.
27:08
I made a decision. We're looking for a fourth child at this point in time.
27:11
I got to get this renovation done first. Yes.
27:13
And if you want to follow along on the renovation,
27:16
on my personal social media on Instagram, they have channels now.
27:21
And they actually created a veterinary Renault update channel.
27:25
And so people can see the hospital. We're asking questions.
27:27
I asked about seating in the lobby the other day. Getting good feedback.
27:31
And so it's just a fun way to interact and kind of see the progress.
27:34
You can also follow the hospital itself on TikTok or Instagram.
27:38
or Facebook @AVAHVet.
27:42
So I'm excited to show everybody the journey.
27:44
And I'm excited that we will still be married at the end of this
27:47
and like each other. It needs a lot of lipstick. It does.
27:50
It needs some lipstick. But we're slowly turning things around.
27:54
So when you see where it started and then where it ends up,
27:57
it's going to be a pretty shocking difference in change.
28:00
So I can see the vision. It's going to be great.
28:03
I think that's it. I am talked out. I feel like I'm about to lose my voice.
28:06
Anything else you need to say? Nope.
28:09
Feeling good? Yep. Ready for bed?
28:11
Yep. We too. All right.
28:13
If you guys enjoyed this episode or if you have additional questions for us,
28:17
please reach out at questions with Crocker.
28:19
You can listen to us on Apple or Spotify or watch us on YouTube.
28:23
And we would love for you to leave a review and give us some quick input.
28:27
Things you like, things you want to learn more about.
28:29
And we hope you have a wonderful day. And thanks for listening.
28:32
Bye. (upbeat music)
28:36
(knocking)
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