0:00

Quest Love Supreme is a production of iHeartRadio.

0:04

What's Up?

0:05

This is unpaid bill from Quest Love Supreme. On

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Today's Classic QLs. We travel back to

0:09

January of twenty twenty two for our conversation

0:11

with the legend Dougie Fresh. This

0:14

is part one.

0:28

Shall we started?

0:31

We can't do call Dog such

0:34

a roll call episode?

0:37

Are you.

0:38

Yell it out?

0:41

I will think of a solution so we can get back

0:43

to le call audio. Can you work

0:45

on I actually thought.

0:46

Of one today, Like we can just we can

0:49

just do our own, our

0:51

own verse by

0:53

ourselves. We can say that yeah, and

0:56

the supreme is ourselves.

0:57

But the whole thing is the reaction to

1:00

you what

1:02

the other person.

1:03

Says exactly and then

1:05

and then our guest wants to hear.

1:07

They can kind of get an idea.

1:08

Sometimes well okay, I'll think I got

1:10

a good idea.

1:11

We go back into a studio in person with people

1:14

and we do our role calls there. Now

1:16

I'm good on that,

1:18

all right, Fante? You can always

1:20

be even if we're live all

1:22

together in a studio with a.

1:24

Guest being yeah, we just passed you.

1:26

I'm I'm with it.

1:29

Can we make Fonte like Max headrom though, like he's

1:31

just like on a TV.

1:32

You can just see his head. Can I start this please?

1:34

Oh?

1:36

No, small talk, ladies and gentlemen.

1:39

Yeah, that was the small talk. Ladies and gentlemen.

1:41

Welcome to another episode of

1:43

Quest Love Supreme. I'm your

1:45

host Quest Love and the Supreme

1:48

team is with me strong all

1:51

five of you or four of you? I still

1:53

don't know the proper number anyway. Uh

1:56

unpaid bill, Congratulations, Thanks

1:59

friend. I think you're yeah,

2:01

you're you're you're doing big things

2:03

in your life right now. What you got going on?

2:06

Thanksgiving?

2:07

Uh? Grammys? Uh,

2:09

movies. Uh, that's

2:11

it. That's all

2:14

you can ask for life jobs.

2:16

I'm good.

2:17

I was like, life is good,

2:19

brother, good still dropping.

2:21

I kind of kind of at the point where you were, well, I kind

2:24

of hit a plateau in Yeah.

2:26

So I'm down probably like thirty right now. I'm

2:28

down probably like thirty seven, you know what I mean.

2:31

And so I've been just switch it up

2:33

a little bit, and I'm gonna start going meatless.

2:35

Maybe like one or two days a week, just to try, you know.

2:37

I see.

2:38

So, uh, we're we're switching it up a little bit.

2:41

Well, I'm about to let you know this what my

2:43

heck? I got dandy lion, garlic, spinach,

2:46

and cucumber. So hopefully this

2:49

will do the trick and get me off that plateau.

2:52

I was just gonna eat some sweet potatoes. But

2:55

yeah, I'm gonna think less. See

2:59

that'll do it. That'll do it. Yeah, that called will

3:01

put it on you.

3:03

Yeah, I'm good.

3:05

Still got the three jobs. Moving down to

3:07

where the black folks live in l A. Really excited.

3:09

You got a new apartment, talk about it.

3:13

Apartment right now?

3:14

Yeah, no, this is my mama house. But

3:18

in LA, I got me in a nice spot.

3:20

So now my parents got another bed sleeping.

3:22

I ain't got to sleep on the couch.

3:23

And I'm down with a black folks.

3:25

Where do black people live in l A?

3:26

Just if they're lucky

3:29

there? They live in South La

3:31

Inglewood, you know I live. I got I'm

3:33

letting the murder by the drum circle and whatnot, which

3:36

is kind of like, really dope, it's being highly

3:38

gentrified right now because that's where the stadium

3:40

is and then putting in the train, so LA

3:43

is it really expansion gentrification on level

3:45

three.

3:46

The football stadium?

3:47

Yeah, yeah, I went there to see

3:50

uh the last Rolling

3:52

Stones La Show. Yeah, I heard

3:54

it, and I didn't realize they dropped that joint like

3:56

right in the middle of the hood.

3:58

Yeah, right in Inglewood.

4:00

The second you step off the pavement,

4:03

you're definitely in Inglewood.

4:05

Yes, it's not as

4:07

long as that people can afford to stay.

4:09

Yeah, it's yeah, right

4:12

right right in the middle of it.

4:13

Steve, how are you? Yes, I'm

4:16

good. How are you okay?

4:19

Where am I? How are you? Yeah?

4:21

I know where you are. Okay.

4:24

Let your many followers know that you're good.

4:27

Yeah, boss man, and congrats

4:29

on the witch Call. We forgot to congratulation well

4:33

the Oscars and all that, But then the short

4:36

film you did shout

4:42

Okay, you didn't realize I directed a

4:44

second film. Sometimes

4:47

when when when there's a little buzz on you and then

4:49

people start and you know,

4:52

I got a call from

4:53

a team hove

4:55

to uh settle.

4:57

Well.

4:57

The thing was is that I knew without

4:59

something on that level, he would not come to the

5:01

Rock and Roll Hall of Fame. So I

5:04

told the staff, let me direct something

5:07

and that will lure him to it.

5:08

Without that, he wouldn't have come. He would have just you

5:11

know, phoned in.

5:11

All

5:14

right, this.

5:14

Is probably the longest.

5:17

Wow, we never going to four minutes without

5:19

even acknowledging our guests right now, we

5:21

haven't.

5:21

Talked in a while. We sorry, guests, we.

5:23

Haven't talked to It's been a minute, Okay.

5:26

So what I will quickly say about

5:29

our guest today is, if

5:32

if I were compiling a

5:35

list of the most charismatic

5:38

figures in

5:40

hip hop or maybe in music, I

5:42

wouldn't hesitate to put this gentleman.

5:45

This gentleman will probably and

5:48

I'm trying to keep the quest level

5:50

hyperbole down to a minimum,

5:53

he's probably, if

5:55

not in my top three, maybe

5:58

he is my number

6:00

one most charismatic

6:03

figure that I know in

6:06

hip hop. And the evidence of

6:08

that for me is, and

6:10

I'm going beyond hip hop and going to music, the

6:12

evidence is in the

6:15

in the thirty five years that I've been fortunate

6:17

enough to see him

6:20

perform. Throughout those decades,

6:23

I've never not seen him elevate

6:26

any event.

6:29

To the highest level.

6:31

Like I've never seen him walk

6:34

in any situation with fear or

6:37

trepidation. It's

6:39

and to me, like, you know, I'm

6:41

a guy who wire overthinking like oh, I can't go out

6:43

there. You know, they don't know who

6:45

I am whatever, like, forget generational,

6:48

forget genre. I've seen him rock with you

6:51

know, Prince Tom, Cruise, Heavy

6:54

D, Chuck

6:57

Brown, like every from every genre I've

6:59

just he's the

7:01

the most charismatic and you know, stupid

7:04

charismatic. Will Smith's charismatic. I

7:06

can name a gazillion Jay Z's

7:08

charismatic. But you know this,

7:12

our gentleman, This, our guest today

7:15

is.

7:15

The world's greatest entertainer.

7:17

Yes, literally, lady

7:19

ladies and gentlemen, our guest today is

7:22

officially known for

7:24

the and

7:27

not for the Please

7:34

give it up for Doug E.

7:37

Fresh on Quest Left Supreme.

7:40

Flowers. Let

7:43

me tell you it is an honor.

7:45

It is an honor, and I appreciate

7:48

y'all giving me or

7:51

rather having such a long delay on

7:53

the introduction because I felt

7:55

because I felt like I got caught up with all

7:57

of y'all too, and I felt like it

7:59

was family conversation and

8:02

I was able to hear it close

8:04

up in person, you know. So yeah,

8:07

thank you and thank you for having me on your show,

8:09

Quest, I appreciate it.

8:10

With the Supreme Team and

8:12

that name Supreme Team.

8:15

Hip Hip Hop

8:18

for y'all to use that name is

8:21

a very powerful thing because

8:23

back on w HBI it

8:26

was the world famous supreme.

8:28

Team show Keys, Holla

8:31

and Justice.

8:32

Yes, yes,

8:36

I know you did.

8:36

That's what look, you are the

8:39

ultimate collector. So

8:41

I know that when I mentioned something like that,

8:44

you would you either know it or

8:46

you would appreciate it, you know. So

8:48

I and I appreciate you, and

8:50

I appreciate you having me on your show.

8:52

Thank you know what I.

8:53

Think, Even though I'm going to start

8:56

before that, I do believe

8:58

that you are indeed, and

9:00

I think about till today, you

9:03

are indeed the first

9:05

beat boxer the world has

9:07

seen, because I believe that

9:11

your cameo and

9:13

Beat Street did predate

9:15

the Fat Boys. So even though you

9:17

know, a lot of the world credits

9:21

Buffy, rest in peace to Buffy as

9:24

the first beat boxer they ever seen. If

9:27

we really look at the timeline for all

9:29

this hip hop heads that saw

9:31

Beat Street in nineteen eighty three, the

9:34

disco three Fat Boys didn't come out until

9:37

nineteen eighty four, so technically, and

9:39

it's weird, I don't think at the time, and

9:42

I remember the Christmas rap from

9:44

Beat Street. I think at the time you

9:47

might have been so effortless

9:50

in doing what you were doing. I don't think

9:52

it even registered to us that you

9:54

were doing drums with your

9:56

mouth.

9:57

Right, you know what I mean.

9:59

And it was a funny.

10:00

It was us trying to make

10:02

people kind of laugh and

10:05

feel good. But it's deep that you

10:07

picked that up because I actually

10:10

did the movie at the time,

10:13

because there was a scout who

10:16

went up to Savoy Matter and

10:18

I was performing on that show with the Crash

10:20

Crew, Master Don and the

10:23

Deaf Committee, and I

10:25

believe at that time. I don't think the foss

10:27

MC's was on that show at the time,

10:30

but I performed there and then she gave me

10:32

a card. And when she gave me

10:34

a card that said Beach Street on it,

10:36

she said, do you want to be in a movie? Because

10:39

what you're doing would be

10:42

unbelievable to seeing a movie. And I'm gonna

10:44

tell you some information. So I went there and

10:47

he started to see what I do, and he

10:49

was like, I don't care what I gotta do, I gotta get

10:51

you in this movie now. Originally run DMC

10:54

was supposed to be in Beach Street. What And

10:57

That's what I'm telling you. I think you know, I'm

11:00

give you

11:01

the.

11:08

Yeah, I know. Well y'all, well, y'all done, ran

11:10

to the right y'all.

11:11

And ran in the right store tonight because

11:13

this and everything and

11:15

by the way and everything is free,

11:18

just by the way, just so you know, it's.

11:23

Just free. So they're

11:26

right.

11:27

So but this is how it went. I

11:29

was supposed to do beat when I was doing Beach

11:31

Street. Harry Belafonte

11:34

wanted me to do something where

11:36

this thing with the beat box could be

11:38

showcased. So what happened

11:41

is Run, DMC and Russell came

11:43

up there and they were going

11:46

to be in Beach Street, but I

11:48

don't think Russell felt good about

11:50

them just doing a little segment in

11:53

it. He wanted them to do more. And

11:55

then we and then it was me run

11:58

in the elevator and d M s see and

12:01

in the room. So they

12:03

started doing one of their records, the rhyms

12:05

to the second album that came out, the

12:08

beat that sound a little bit like suck MC's.

12:11

I don't know the exact song, but they was saying.

12:13

The King of Rocket album.

12:15

The next album, right, yeah, it's.

12:18

Right, the last song inside

12:20

too.

12:21

It got done. Yeah,

12:23

I got like a little it got a little kind

12:26

of thing to it.

12:27

So I'm in the elevator and we

12:29

started doing it and he said, and he looked

12:31

at Russell and he said, Yo.

12:33

This will be crazy.

12:34

We should get Dug to do the beatbox

12:36

on this, and we could do this whole thing in the movie

12:39

with And then we started coming

12:41

up with the idea to do it, and then

12:43

and then Harry was excited

12:46

about it. But then Russell pulled

12:48

out. And after he pulled out,

12:50

then he brought in Treacherous three. And

12:53

when he brought in Treacher's Three, Treacher's Three

12:55

knew me as a kid because they knew me

12:57

from going into Bobby Robinson's record

12:59

shop or all the time. So when they

13:01

seen me, they said, hey, you

13:04

know, Harry said, mister Bellafonte

13:06

said, you know, is it any way that

13:09

you can have Dougie do this with you? Because I think

13:11

this routine is unbelievable. So if

13:13

you listen to the rhyme, they mentioned

13:15

me multiple times and the rhyme,

13:18

he said, you know, you know that kid Dougie fresh

13:20

from down the block, because I.

13:22

Really lived down the block,

13:24

you know, so

13:27

when.

13:28

You were their labelmates too, because

13:30

the right.

13:31

Right, I was yeah, yeah,

13:34

yeah, no, no, just Having

13:36

Fun came out on

13:38

on Enjoy. But

13:41

what happened is that that was after,

13:44

you know, Treacher's three was already

13:46

established.

13:46

But I let out Just Having Fun and.

13:49

I did the movie because

13:52

at the time, I felt like I

13:54

needed to let people who understand

13:57

the beat Box and I needed to do something,

13:59

and I started to see a lot of.

14:01

People trying to, you

14:03

know, kind of kind of go there with it.

14:05

In the time we grew up in hip hop, it

14:07

was about being as original as possible,

14:10

so if you did something, it would

14:12

be considered biting. But see, biting

14:15

was only considered bad

14:18

because the only way to make hip hop

14:20

survive and to be pure

14:22

creatively, it was necessary

14:25

for you to feel that kind of pressure.

14:27

So somebody say you're a bito. That

14:30

was kind of like the worst thing that you can ever

14:32

be called in your life, you know what I mean?

14:36

It was crazy?

14:37

Well, okay, and the be Box was

14:39

made up in eighty I introduced it in eighty

14:41

two, but I made it up in eighty

14:44

one. See, because I

14:46

started in eighty one at

14:48

Harlem World.

14:50

That's where I started.

14:52

And when I made it, I

14:55

made it because I used to play the trumpet

14:57

and when I played the trumpet.

14:59

I used to.

15:00

There was a teacher in my class named brother Lee.

15:03

Brother Lee was I went to as two A one

15:05

and Brother Lee really quick. Brother Lee

15:08

was in there and he said, what do you want to play?

15:10

And I pointed to the percussions and the drums.

15:13

He said, well, you can't play that jet. You got to play

15:15

the trumpet.

15:16

I said, well, why you asked me, Brother Lee, I mean baby,

15:19

and he said he said, I understand, He

15:21

said, but I want you to play the trumpet. So I

15:24

took the trumpet home every day.

15:26

And when I took the trumpet home, I would practice

15:28

it, take the mouthpiece, boil it,

15:30

do the whole thing, do all of the exercises.

15:33

And then one day when I came back to school,

15:36

Brother Lee was gone because they cut all

15:38

the music programs in school. So

15:40

I gave them the trumpet back. And I

15:42

was still walking home. And when I

15:44

was walking home, I would pass by the mom and

15:47

pop record shops. So at that time

15:50

Grandma asked a flash hat out. It was

15:52

a Friday night. Everybody was freaking

15:55

the highs right and I

15:57

would always say it, right there you go,

16:00

and I would always hear the baseline and

16:07

when I would hear the baseline, then all

16:09

of a sudden, I hear all of these other things.

16:11

So I would walk back and forth and I would

16:14

just kind of try to keep adding

16:16

more and more and more.

16:18

Ideas to the beat, to the point

16:20

that I had maybe seven eight nine

16:22

things going on at the same time.

16:24

I'm not thinking.

16:29

And I'm going crazy now, but I'm

16:31

not thinking about it, right, let me tell you

16:33

this true story. I'm not thinking about

16:35

it. So then I go to Barry's house

16:38

where we used to practice, because me

16:40

and Will Barry b that's

16:43

right, we go over there and practice because

16:46

that was the practice house.

16:48

Long story short.

16:49

I'm in there doing the beatbox and I'm doing I

16:51

think I was doing in Peace to President because it's like.

16:56

Right, and I'm going to piece the president. And

16:59

then all of a.

16:59

Sudden his mother comes in the room and say,

17:01

that was a nice beat. I liked that beat that was

17:03

playing. And he said, Ma, that

17:06

wasn't the record.

17:07

That was him. And now he said

17:09

that was him, and then she said, well, whatever

17:11

it was, it was a nice beat.

17:13

And then he turned around and looked at me and said,

17:15

yo, you know what you should do that

17:17

in the big Park tomorrow because Mike

17:19

and Dave was throwing jams out in.

17:21

The Big Park. He said, Yo, you should call

17:23

it the human beat Box. I said, I'm not going to do that.

17:25

That's crazy.

17:26

I'm not doing that. You're trying to make

17:28

me look crazy. He said, I'm telling you,

17:30

yo, what you just did was crazy. So then

17:32

I went out to the Big Park and

17:34

when I did it, everybody

17:37

lost their mind.

17:38

And that was the beginning of the

17:40

Beatbox.

17:41

And that was nineteen eighty one. That

17:44

was okay, eighty two.

17:47

What Burrow did you premiere that in?

17:50

I premiered it in Harlem. I

17:52

prepared it in Harlem.

17:54

And then after which was a

17:56

fascinating piece that I think you'll appreciate

17:58

too, is that Curtis

18:01

Blow came out with one

18:03

hundred and twenty fifth Street, the

18:05

people laying the concrete, and it was on

18:07

you know, you know, you know, you're like, you

18:10

know, So what happened? Craziest

18:13

story? I was doing the Beatbox.

18:15

I was on Flyers with the Cold Crush,

18:18

Busy Bee with the Funky

18:20

four with Fantastic

18:23

with treacherous street feelers like I'm on I'm

18:25

rolling now.

18:26

So now what happened Is.

18:28

Curtis Blow was outside and this was the

18:30

first time Harllow Week had somebody

18:33

up. Curtis Blow was the first hip hop artist

18:35

to perform at Harllow Week. Before

18:37

that, it was never no hip hop. So

18:39

when Curtis Blow was there, they forgot

18:41

to give him turntables because

18:44

it wasn't normal. So I'm walking

18:46

down the street. But I'm walking down the

18:48

street.

18:50

They see me. No, that's Dougie Fresh right

18:52

there.

18:53

No Dougie come over here, and Curtis said

18:55

to me, He said, Dougie, is it possible

18:57

for you to get on and do the beatbox for me?

19:00

Because I have no turntables,

19:02

the band, there's no band. The band

19:04

only know how to play for whoever's getting on

19:07

next. There's no CD, there

19:09

was no cassette, there was nothing. I

19:11

was standing there.

19:11

I was like this crazy Curtis Blow

19:14

is asking me to get on with him. Are you crazy?

19:16

I was like, oh, mister Blow, Uh,

19:19

no problem, sir, I reckon. You do that

19:22

right, sir.

19:22

That I got on and when I got

19:25

on, Frankie Krocker was on BLS.

19:27

And this is when Harlem Week was big, so

19:30

it was probably like fifteen thousand people

19:32

outside, I got on and I did

19:34

the beat box and that was the first

19:36

time Curtis Blow heard the beat

19:38

box.

19:39

And that was way before the

19:41

fire Boys.

19:42

Okay, se y'all.

19:43

Did see ya. That's why I'm giving you that feet.

19:45

I get it.

19:46

And then I asked them later. I asked some later.

19:49

I said, curt when you did this

19:51

and you know that I create, you know you know

19:53

that I did this, I said, it didn't feel

19:55

a little funny with you in there doing

19:57

doing. He said, Dougie, you know, he

20:00

just asked me to come in and produce. And

20:02

he said,

20:04

I said, I'm

20:07

just trying to understand.

20:09

I said, did you He said, Dougie, it

20:11

was just so crazy. I was under so much.

20:13

I said,

20:15

I don't worry about it, man, I said, I just wanted

20:17

to know, you know what I mean, because

20:20

if I did it for you,

20:22

you called me to do it, then it

20:25

was kind of strange for me to hear that you produced

20:28

the fact voice and then the

20:30

tradition and hip hop was

20:33

not about you when you

20:35

do something, see

20:37

you, you're trying to create

20:40

your own sigmaents you

20:42

were looking to do and I didn't

20:45

need to.

20:45

Do to beat box. I just it

20:48

found me.

20:49

And there had to be a life lesson in that though,

20:51

Doug, don't you feel like at the end of the days that you were so

20:53

young and that happened to you, You feel like in

20:55

retrospect, was there some type of life

20:58

lesson and that Yeah,

21:00

you.

21:00

Know what's interesting with the life lesson? I

21:03

always feel this way, and this is the truth.

21:06

I say to myself.

21:08

If the music program was never cut

21:10

at I is two o one and Brother

21:13

Lee was no.

21:13

Longer there, would I have created

21:16

the beat box? I don't know.

21:18

And then on top of that, what's

21:20

really fascinating is Brother Lee.

21:23

Later on I found out it's

21:25

Malcolm Lee's father. Why

21:30

brother Lee is also

21:32

a jazz musician whose brother is

21:34

Spike Lee.

21:39

Billy was your teacher.

21:44

Malcolm Lee's father was your

21:46

music teacher.

21:47

And then guess what When when I made

21:49

my records and I came out, I

21:51

found out.

21:52

I said, I got to talk to Brother Lee and

21:54

I'm going.

21:55

To ask you what was you gonna say?

21:57

Well, I'm I'm the.

21:59

Trumpet

22:00

about.

22:03

I said, I said, Brother Lee, I'm getting ready to perform

22:05

at Madison Square Garden. I said,

22:08

I want you to know that I made up

22:10

this thing called the beatbox,

22:12

and I made it up because of

22:15

you having me play the trumpet.

22:17

And I said, you know, I want you to perform

22:20

with me at the garden. He said, Dougie,

22:22

I'm so proud of you. He said, but man,

22:24

I don't know if I can handle performing at the

22:26

garden. He was a jazz physician. He said,

22:28

I might be too much for me. I said,

22:30

well, I just want you to know that

22:32

what you did and what and what

22:35

happened from from the way all of these

22:37

things landed turn this thing

22:39

into something that in hip hop

22:41

we call the fifth element. And

22:44

I just want you to know that you are

22:46

the reason or one of the reasons

22:49

how this thing became

22:51

what it is and it was the deepest

22:53

thing in the world. And then I wound up working

22:55

with his son Malcolm on Girl Trip

22:58

and and and it's

23:00

fascinating circle ties

23:03

together.

23:05

I have a theory, especially

23:08

in hip hop, those who

23:10

pioneer, those who go first,

23:13

really never get the glory.

23:15

Those who go second always

23:18

get the shine.

23:19

So yes, I think

23:21

in this case, because we technically

23:23

think of you as the second, you also

23:26

improved or be

23:28

boxing even though you were the first,

23:31

and even though you came out with a single, the original

23:33

human Betpop whatever. Right,

23:36

I still say that, you

23:38

know, it's a good thing you came second, because

23:40

I don't know why, but it's just like, you

23:43

know, Marley Marrole started the noise thing, but then

23:45

the Bomb Squad came in and really started the

23:47

noise thing.

23:48

You know, they weren't there right right.

23:51

East, these first white rappers, and yeah they had success,

23:53

but Eminem really like, whoever does it

23:56

second in hip hop always capitalizes

23:59

it better. We

24:04

gotta stuff from the beginning. First

24:07

of all, where were you born? Where were

24:10

you born?

24:11

I was born here in the US, but

24:13

as a kid, I was taken back and forth

24:15

to Barbados. So it's

24:18

kind of like you would consider

24:20

it kind of like a dual dig it citizenship

24:22

in a kind of a way, you know, because as

24:24

a kid, that's how my parents

24:27

kind of moved. And then my grandfather's

24:29

from Trinidad and my grandma's

24:32

from Barbados, so they was kind of

24:34

they didn't know whether I should stay in Barbados

24:37

or should I be.

24:39

So then I'll ask you then when

24:41

people are asking you about the

24:44

origins of hip hop and

24:46

being as though a lot of the first generation

24:50

of that culture came

24:52

from the Islands. Do you do you

24:56

what is your true belief on where

24:58

hip hop was born? Is

25:00

it the Bronx or do we have to

25:02

say that technically you

25:05

know the composites of

25:07

all the residents of the islands,

25:11

that's where it was born. And what are

25:13

you seeing on these islands that lead you because

25:16

something's happening there that's bringing

25:18

it to America.

25:20

So right right,

25:22

it's a very interesting question.

25:24

Well, my sister introduced

25:27

me to hip hop here in the US,

25:30

but my family was so diverse

25:32

in their music selection that

25:34

it made it easy for me to take Soca

25:38

reggae and Go

25:41

Go and R and

25:43

B and all of these other musics, and it

25:45

just it.

25:46

Was just one of these things where

25:47

you're influenced by

25:49

all of these things, but in

25:52

the form of hip hop

25:54

in the way that I learned it, because

25:57

I am the first child

26:00

of the first generation in hip

26:02

hop, meaning that

26:05

I am the beginning of like

26:08

all of these people that came before me. I learned

26:10

from DJ Hollywood. So

26:12

my sister came home and said, there

26:15

is this guy named DJ Hollywood who's rapping.

26:18

I said, let me hear what he say. She said, he go

26:20

ring a.

26:20

Dinger ding the dong, the dong dong, the dang

26:23

the dang dang, d ding the dong dong to the

26:25

hip hop.

26:26

She wopped the box before anything

26:29

I've ever heard.

26:30

And when she told me, say it again, say it again,

26:32

and I'm trying to catch it.

26:34

Then my brother brought in a tape

26:37

with Grandma's top flies in the series

26:39

five, and when he brought these

26:41

pieces in, and then my family lived

26:43

in the Bronx and also in Harlem.

26:46

So the point I'm making is that

26:49

in the form that I learned

26:52

hip hop here, meaning

26:54

like I think the influence goes

26:56

back way further than

26:59

we really understand stand. But

27:01

the pieces that I learned from watching

27:04

Hollywood, watching Our

27:07

love Bugstarsky, being able

27:09

to sit on the side of the stage

27:11

at Harlem World when Busy the Battle Kumo

27:14

d being there in the

27:16

contest. I was in that contest in

27:18

eighty one. So we

27:20

were taking all of these elements as

27:23

far as like weird it it originate, It

27:25

originated in Harlem, it originated

27:28

in the Bronx, it originated in Brooklyn.

27:30

There was movements going on all over.

27:33

Do you guys attribute as we we have some historians

27:35

here. I'm curious.

27:36

I'm like, do you attribute any of this to like scatting

27:38

and at all? Or do you just go straight to the

27:42

well.

27:42

That's why I'm saying on the levels, because

27:45

see, if you're looking at it on the levels

27:47

that I'm talking about, you could say Calypso

27:50

and Soca, our original storytellers.

27:53

You could say Yellow Man and Nico

27:55

Demus, and you can go back even

27:57

further than that, but just use them as

27:59

a blue print. I'm getting

28:01

married and the morning, you

28:04

know, like like all of these different

28:08

pieces is what made up

28:10

what we do.

28:11

And then even and

28:13

this is.

28:14

My experience, you know that

28:17

that I seen all

28:19

of these elements come together, and

28:22

they were influencing me. Whenever

28:24

I would go to a certain borough in the

28:26

Bronx, I would get a particular

28:29

kind of hip hop. When I'm in Harlem,

28:31

I watch Hollywood burn

28:34

the Apollo down. See, Hollywood

28:36

is the architect of crowd

28:38

participation, and I

28:41

learned I learned the skill directly

28:43

from him. So I know I

28:46

know things about it that

28:48

nobody You will never know

28:51

this because it doesn't exist.

28:52

Any like he had it.

28:55

He gave it to me and I

28:57

understand the dynamics of it that

28:59

like be another kid might not like

29:02

Batman's school grew up watching me, so

29:04

he understands some of the dynamics of it.

29:07

So what I'm saying is is that it just

29:09

kept evolving because everybody

29:11

was doing it in their own experience. So

29:14

I can only respond to the

29:16

experience that I had.

29:17

But I was in all of the burrows, most

29:20

of the burrows, studying it, you

29:22

know.

29:22

Okay, So that leads me to

29:24

what I said at the at the top of the show, which

29:27

is the thing that I admire

29:30

and the thing that I want to learn

29:33

from you the most. Tarik actually learned this

29:35

from you. You have

29:38

a way of commanding the

29:40

crowd that's not forced

29:43

because usually in hip hop people

29:45

have to at

29:47

least the modus operandi.

29:50

Yeah, the modus operandi rus Come.

29:53

It's a full twelve yelling

29:57

and like the

30:00

idea of what you imagine, like

30:03

Freddie Fox to be like shoe

30:05

off the microphone.

30:07

But you, but

30:09

you are.

30:10

So the thing that made me pay attention to your

30:13

your crowd control. And the thing is

30:15

is like the one level that I lack

30:19

in my life journey is the ability

30:22

to really communicate in

30:24

a way that I'm not in my head

30:27

like you know, because this is the thing, like right before

30:29

I address a crowd or whatever, suddenly I'm in

30:31

my head, like, man, I want to look like

30:33

a nut out here.

30:35

So what I want to.

30:36

Know is I'm certain now that this is

30:38

like your fourth decade in

30:42

the industry, that now you just do it

30:44

out off of muscle in marine, like you know how

30:46

to capture the crowd. But in

30:48

those first ten years, like even

30:51

without the show in Lottie Dottie,

30:53

Like, in those first ten years, how

30:56

are you psyching yourself up? Because you, you,

30:59

to me, are like hip hop's

31:01

true version. I've seen most stuff do this. Also,

31:04

you're the true version of like when

31:06

I watch a comedian do crowd work. You

31:09

know, even without a single, without a

31:11

song, you walk on the stage, you know how

31:13

to engage the crowd, how to talk to them, things

31:16

to do, and it always works.

31:18

Like I know you've seen you learn it from

31:20

Hollywood.

31:20

But for the first ten years, like the

31:23

first five years, say okay,

31:25

right before the show eighty four, you're

31:27

doing CrowdWork, Like what are you saying to yourself

31:30

before, Like are you ever nervous in any

31:32

situation, like damn,

31:34

who I got tonight?

31:35

A bunch of white people at a corporate party?

31:38

Like how do I do this? Like?

31:40

Wow, right, I remember we did

31:42

that. We did a corporate party together one

31:44

time. I remember that time.

31:46

There's no crowd, you can't frock.

31:48

So what is your what is

31:50

your motivational I need the motivational talk

31:53

on how you deal with crowd work and

31:55

why do you do so well?

31:57

I used to see Apollo want to

31:59

sing a come out and he sing and

32:01

I watched him practice before he got

32:03

on.

32:04

He'll be like this. I believe he's.

32:06

Singing the notes and everything is tight. It's

32:09

he's pictures perfect. When the showtime

32:11

starts and he walks out there,

32:14

I believe it.

32:15

And the audience boom

32:17

right before he even finishes.

32:19

It's because they feel the

32:22

frequency of fear. And

32:24

when they smell it and they feel it, they

32:26

automatically get out of here.

32:28

Man, Yo, were you don't believe it?

32:30

You don't believe it, We believe.

32:32

Get out, yo. Who's next? Now?

32:34

If it's a little kid, If it's a little

32:36

kid, it's fascinating. Little kid

32:38

get up there and he'll be like I believe

32:40

they'd be like, all right, come on, shorty, you're gonna

32:42

do it.

32:42

Let's go. Yeah. Yeah, it's encouragement

32:45

because he's a younger kid, you see what I'm

32:47

saying, And they don't want to boo him because

32:49

they want to build him up to

32:52

be come as great as they

32:54

see him having the confidence to at least

32:56

get up on that stage. But if it's

32:58

an if it's a.

32:59

Person who is giving,

33:02

like coming up there and you start

33:04

singing and they feel fear, the frequency

33:07

automatically makes them boom. So

33:09

through these little lessons, I

33:11

advance the technology that I

33:13

learned from Hollywood, and I learned from

33:16

love Buck and Busy B and I,

33:18

and I was.

33:18

Able to change.

33:21

I guess like you said, I played

33:23

with it so much that I

33:25

don't even think about the frequency.

33:28

I feel the frequency and.

33:30

I just respawd to the

33:32

frequency, or I

33:35

make the frequency what I wanted to.

33:37

Be right, and I'm

33:39

and I bring you to that

33:42

frequency.

33:43

You see what I'm saying. It's interesting.

33:45

Can you tell us what you feel like in your body?

33:47

Is this is going on like in your body?

33:50

Don't you tell us?

33:51

How do you how do you talk yourself out

33:53

of fear. Okay, all right to

33:55

read no, no, no for real.

33:57

That's a good question.

34:02

As it is taping.

34:02

Tarika has left the Tonight Show for four months,

34:06

so thus forcing me in a position

34:08

where I have to address the audience something

34:11

I hate doing.

34:13

I don't know.

34:13

I don't know if it's that I feel Hollywood

34:16

or feel you know,

34:18

like, ladies and gentlemen, welcome

34:20

to the ROUTO.

34:21

Did well?

34:22

See that's the part right there. That's

34:24

the part right there where it goes wrong.

34:27

See, the fear is because you're doing

34:29

something and being something that's

34:31

not as authentic as you.

34:33

So the key is to be you

34:36

and to.

34:37

Be you as best

34:39

like be you and enjoy

34:42

being you, and don't make it

34:44

like you're trying to fit into

34:47

something and replace it. Don't

34:49

replace anything, Just

34:52

be you. And the energy

34:55

is so honest that people

34:57

will feel that frequency and

34:59

they will accept it and make

35:01

it what it is, like the same way

35:03

like your conversation now is

35:05

so real that it's making

35:08

me respond to you like I'm responding

35:11

because I can feel what you're saying,

35:14

and because I feel it, it makes

35:16

me talk to you like this, And

35:18

that is the same thing. You have to do, and

35:21

fear comes from

35:23

your thinking. Don't

35:25

think, feel it and

35:28

be you when you think.

35:31

That's where fear lives. Fear

35:33

live in thought. Fear

35:36

can't exist when it's

35:38

just pure energy and

35:41

truth.

35:41

See, fear and truth can't.

35:44

Fear and truth can never be in the

35:46

same room together because truth

35:48

exposes care.

35:50

You see what I'm saying.

35:51

So as much as you be yourself,

35:54

fear can't be around. Like right

35:56

now, I'm telling y'all the truth, and it doesn't

35:59

matter to me how you feel.

36:01

About my truth because

36:04

it's truth. Now.

36:05

If I was fearful, it's because

36:08

I want you to feel a particular

36:10

way about me. But I'm not concerned

36:13

with your feelings right now. I'm only

36:15

concerned with making sure you

36:17

feel the truth.

36:19

And when you feel the truth, you can determine

36:21

how you feel about me. You may like

36:23

me, you may not, but guess what,

36:26

you know what you gonna get when you deal with me.

36:30

You understand truth right.

36:32

Right, And I'm saying and I'm saying it in this

36:34

way to make you understand that your.

36:37

Truth is good. Your truth

36:39

is good.

36:40

And you don't like he that's

36:42

that's his space, But your space

36:45

is you know, you're coming from a completely

36:48

different space, and that

36:50

space you're coming from it's

36:52

a good space. You just

36:54

don't know it because you haven't been using

36:57

it.

36:58

You understand what I'm.

36:59

Saying, being for use it right now, so you

37:02

know, we will see how it goes till.

37:10

I feel like at some point, even

37:12

for Dougie Fresh, there's

37:15

an energy in your body that you may

37:17

have to either suppress for the moment or

37:20

figure you know what I mean, Like it's something different

37:22

going on in here sometimes than out there

37:24

to get to what they need.

37:25

But given what they need right

37:28

you're always you know the

37:30

reason why the energy is not bothering

37:33

me because my level of focus

37:36

is on what

37:39

I want, and what I want is I want

37:41

to save a life.

37:42

I want to fix this problem. See

37:44

what happens is this when people

37:46

are dealing. And it's a fascinating how

37:48

this all ties in together because

37:51

see, when a person panics,

37:55

the panic stops them

37:57

from making a disc

38:00

that they would have made if they didn't panic. So

38:03

if a person can focus

38:06

on what they're doing, panic

38:09

can't get in. Because you're

38:11

focused on what you're doing, now

38:13

you'll feel things. Panic could be

38:15

at the door knocking but you're

38:18

focused, and it's

38:20

it's it's part of a I

38:22

guess a technique. Like even like

38:24

when I work out right, say I run,

38:27

I run, and I don't use no music.

38:30

And sometimes what I do is when

38:32

I'm running, I'm.

38:33

Taking my mind

38:37

and I'm focusing on something

38:39

and I'm training it to.

38:42

Focus on that. And you know

38:44

how the mind work.

38:44

There's always a new thought that come in.

38:47

Even when somebody's talking to you, there's a new

38:49

thought. But I train

38:51

my mind to block all.

38:54

The things, and I am focused

38:56

on that.

38:57

And when I'm ready, I will let

38:59

you tell me what I will

39:02

let And I hope I ain't bugging y'all

39:04

out, but okay,

39:06

okay, I will, I will. I will

39:08

decide when I want that thought

39:10

to come in, and I decide

39:12

if I want that thought or use that thought.

39:15

Because the focus is

39:17

what is what I'm looking at, And in

39:20

order for me to be effective at that thing

39:22

that I'm doing, I

39:24

have to stay focused. If I'm performing and

39:27

something is going on and I'm

39:29

not focused on the audience,

39:32

let's say I'm I'm too.

39:34

Divided, you know what I mean.

39:36

I'm trying to, you know, get

39:38

this happening I'm trying to get my man in the

39:40

club. I'm trying to make sure my

39:42

girl is situated. I'm trying to make sure yo

39:45

yo yo yo sound man like.

39:47

It's too much.

39:48

So if you're able to take

39:51

and focus on something, the

39:53

impact of it is powerful.

39:56

And then when you're focused on it and you trage

39:58

your mind to think like that, then

40:00

what happens is that there's no fear

40:02

in it because you're

40:05

focused, and there's no panic because

40:07

that thing you're focused on is the

40:10

only thing that matter.

40:11

Think about are meditation.

40:13

I was about to say, a marriage sound like what we talk about.

40:16

I don't have no problems with it, but I guess

40:19

in a form I do what kind of I guess it's

40:21

like a form of meditation, because when

40:23

I'm running, I may be running for seventy

40:25

minutes, sixty minutes, ninety minutes, and

40:29

every time my mind is

40:31

trying to take me someplace else,

40:34

I'd be like, no, no, no, no, we're staying

40:36

here.

40:37

Yeah, you're doing it.

40:39

I keep grabbing it meditation, and I put it right

40:41

back.

40:42

I go like this, no, right here,

40:44

And then I practice it so much

40:47

to the point that people don't

40:50

know how hard it is to think about

40:52

the same thing for ten minutes with

40:54

any interruptions, just ten minutes.

40:56

If they try to meditate, they know it.

41:00

That's what. Yeah.

41:01

Yeah, So I kind

41:04

of incorporate that in a lot

41:06

of things because I feel like fear

41:09

is not real, but it's real

41:11

to you when you're going through it. So

41:14

if I'm able to you

41:16

know, control the

41:19

outcome by my focus,

41:22

then fear can't get in there.

41:24

So if I'm dealing with a situation

41:27

like city college, if I'm dealing with a

41:29

situation where I see somebody

41:31

who got shot at a club or a

41:34

family member instead of me

41:37

kind of king, I'm focused

41:40

and I deal with that, and it's I'm

41:42

so focused that I'm

41:44

not allowing nothing to

41:46

stop me. And anybody that's giving me anything

41:50

I can hear when it's something I

41:52

need, but if it's ah,

41:54

oh my god, I don't

41:56

need that, you know, meaning like

41:59

if you said so, Doug, I got to ride for

42:01

so and so I can

42:03

hear you and I would grab the person and

42:06

put them in the ride. So

42:08

it's a focus for being able to understand

42:12

what's necessary.

42:13

I don't know if I went too far with this, but I.

42:15

Mean it's

42:17

an earful Yeah.

42:19

A question for you, Doug, because you've, you know,

42:21

in terms of your faith, because we

42:23

know that you've been involved with like scientology

42:26

for a while. Is that having that kind of focus,

42:28

Is that something that you know you learned

42:30

in that faith? How does that help you as an entertainer?

42:33

It's funny, that's a that's a real good

42:35

question, bro. You know what, I didn't

42:37

get that from scientology. I discovered

42:40

it from just running, you

42:42

know. And I'm running, like my running

42:44

is the thing I love to do, you

42:47

know. So when I'm running, I

42:49

started to discover how my

42:51

mind is all over the place trying

42:54

to keep itself busy

42:57

because I'm trying you know,

42:59

you're running it. He's trying to breathe and

43:02

so so all of a sudden, I

43:04

said.

43:05

Yo, the mine is panic

43:07

ging, Yo, doggie, why are you pushing me

43:09

like this? Yo? You know this is too heavy?

43:11

So why you got me? And then I would

43:13

like this, shut up, bro, shut

43:16

up, shut up, shut up.

43:18

Like all right, and I'll be like we're

43:21

doing this right here, and now

43:24

I want you to relax, don't

43:26

panic, and breathe and

43:29

and and not to the degree to say if

43:31

I needed to slow down. You slow

43:34

down, but don't

43:37

panic. See that's the

43:39

part that piece right there.

43:42

Don't panic you

43:45

See what I'm.

43:45

Saying A

43:47

good buddy of mine is it's actually your too,

43:49

DJ, my man, DJ skills.

43:51

That's that's my guy.

43:52

Oh that's a bad man. That's a bad man.

43:55

Yeah, it's a bad bad Yeah. And

43:57

he was telling me, uh, going out with you.

43:59

He was like, yeah, Dougie, he will work out before

44:01

the show. He always tells me, like, Yo, Doug, workout or

44:04

you'll run or whatever for the show.

44:06

Shower kind of have your time and then you do it. So

44:09

I always highly of you.

44:10

Man.

44:11

Well, I think when

44:13

you mentioned when we mentioned meditation earlier,

44:15

what I what I do know is

44:18

the sort of common factor, the

44:20

reason why people jog, the reason why

44:22

we work out, the reason you

44:25

know. I've said in past episodes about like advanced

44:27

breathing techniques and sexual

44:30

activity, like anything that causes you,

44:34

yes, anything that causes you to breathe,

44:36

like it's your last breath. Somehow

44:39

your mind your mind goes into

44:42

another which is another is weird to

44:44

say.

44:44

I kind of want to know.

44:46

I don't want to know, but I do want to know

44:48

what what the mind state

44:50

is to a person that's about to drown,

44:53

because I also believe I

44:55

almost drowned.

44:56

That's how I came That's another that's how I

44:58

came up with this. I said, kid

45:01

almost dropped, almost dropped the Central Park Lake.

45:04

Me and two of my friends took a little boat.

45:07

We took one of them little boats. He was cutting school.

45:09

They talked me into it, and I jumped

45:12

on the boat with him, and we didn't even have use

45:15

was pushing out with a little log, and

45:17

then all of a sudden one he had heard

45:19

the siren, so he.

45:20

Knew he wasn't supposed to be doing nothing. So

45:23

he had fear. He jumped

45:25

into that water. He started swimming,

45:27

and so when he jumped, the boat pushed back, and.

45:29

All of a sudden, the other one was there. I said,

45:31

man, I ain't jumping in that water.

45:33

Come on me, and he let's just roll back, and

45:35

all a sudden he's like, yo, come on, man, come on.

45:37

So his fear he.

45:38

Transferred it to his cousin. His

45:41

cousin jumped out the boat started swimming.

45:43

Then he said, oh, come on, man, the cops is gonna

45:45

get us. I'm telling you the cops gonna get you.

45:47

You know, here we are young. I said,

45:50

man, I don't care what he saying. I'm rolling this damp

45:52

boat, you know.

45:53

So I get closer to the ship. I

45:55

think that I'm getting I'm close enough.

45:58

He's panicking. I allowed his fear to

46:00

get in me. I jumped in the water. I'm

46:02

doggy podder. I'm saying, this is close enough.

46:05

I think I'm good. And I put

46:07

my feet down under me, thinking that the ground

46:10

was there.

46:11

There wasn't no ground. There wasn't

46:13

no ground. It wasn't no ground. And

46:15

I started.

46:18

Right, wow, I mean when i'm and

46:20

then my man came in and he grabbed

46:23

me and pulled me in right.

46:24

And when he pulled me in, I'm spinning. I'm spinning

46:26

the water up.

46:27

So now when I go to the pool,

46:30

and this is a real story, I'm over

46:32

here.

46:32

Everybody's in the five.

46:33

Feet sixteen you know, summertime pool

46:36

is with everybody else. Girl, I'm

46:38

over in the little four feet or the three feet, sitting

46:40

in here with my feet water. I'm

46:42

just shook. I'm shook, like to my point

46:45

it was crazy. Then I said, I

46:47

can't live my life like this. This is crazy.

46:49

I said, this is not even. This makes me

46:51

feel crazy. Every time I'm getting in water, I'm

46:54

shuk. So that one day I

46:56

went to Hawaii to to go do

46:58

a show because this was on for a while.

47:01

I got in a WHI the dude was sitting

47:03

out on the raft and my man, my sound

47:05

man, said, Yo, come swim out. Man, Yo,

47:07

come come out here. So I said, I said,

47:10

all right, I got to break this. I jump in

47:12

the water and I swim out. I get to the

47:14

raft. He said, there, talk to me, asked

47:16

me like two different things. He said, well, I gotta go.

47:18

I'm jumping off the raft. He jump off the raft

47:21

and he swims back to the to

47:23

the beach. I'm sitting there going, damn,

47:26

this is crazy. I gotta go all the way back now.

47:28

So I jump. So I jump in the water and

47:30

I started swimming. And when I started swimming, I said,

47:33

I stopped. And then I lay in the water

47:35

and I'm floating and I said, wow,

47:38

now I get it. I said. The reason

47:41

why I almost drowned,

47:44

it's not because I can't swim. It's

47:46

because I panicked. And

47:49

when I panicked, it

47:51

took everything out of me. It

47:54

made me not think. It

47:56

just made me just

47:59

how swired here. Yeah, yeah,

48:01

it took everything out of me. And

48:03

I said, if I

48:06

relax, if I breathe,

48:09

and if I trust myself,

48:12

and if I allow this

48:15

to make sure that that fear is not there,

48:18

then it's not as hard.

48:20

And that lesson is

48:23

the lesson that I have applied

48:25

in every aspect of my life, from

48:27

that time that I drown to the time

48:30

that I discovered that. And then I learned

48:32

that when you run, even when

48:34

you breathe it most people

48:37

stop running because

48:39

they panic when they're breathing.

48:41

It's getting cut short, right,

48:44

So the key is

48:46

to think and focus on the

48:48

breathing and then you relax,

48:52

the same way if a person is you

48:54

know, you know you're going into a stressful

48:56

situation.

48:57

You have to relax and

49:00

then the energy will flow. And

49:02

I mean, I hate to say it like this suit, but.

49:04

We're keeping it real on this little com y'all.

49:06

Y'all took me. I didn't even think. But

49:09

even if you're losing the fireproom, bro, if

49:11

you don't die, you

49:14

don't.

49:16

And there's a dougie fresh.

49:24

Like you're sitting there like this, I

49:27

don't want nobody to have me.

49:29

I don't want nobody to see me, and

49:31

then I.

49:32

Ain't gotta go. You see what I'm saying.

49:34

But until i'm

49:36

I'm keeping it so real. And I know y'all know

49:38

it's true that if you don't

49:41

relax, y'all, if you don't

49:43

relax, it's crazy.

49:45

So that's a that's a big part

49:50

of controlling fear.

49:53

You can't control fear unless

49:56

you relax.

50:02

We got to get to the show eventually, But

50:06

I do have one question. You mentioned.

50:10

A legendary Harlem figure that

50:13

I don't know anything about besides his

50:15

record labels, But could

50:18

you please like we've heard everything

50:20

about Jersey and Sugar

50:22

Sugar Hill with Sylvia and Bobby in

50:26

Jersey, but a lot of people don't

50:28

know that the Bobby Robinson that

50:30

runs Enjoy Records is another Bobby

50:33

Robinson I know nothing

50:35

about. And you know, I'm a fan

50:37

of the Godfather of Harlem and

50:40

Bobby Robinson's character this

50:43

season, Yeah he's been

50:46

Yeah, Bobby Robinson's sort of been a

50:48

figure in the first In the second season, he owns

50:50

a local record store.

50:51

Obviously, Okay, I saw the first season.

50:55

So obviously you know, like I can see

50:57

like you own a record store and then you start your label.

51:00

Oh YadA YadA, YadA woo.

51:01

But can you talk about Bobby

51:04

Robinson and what he meant to the community of

51:06

Harlem like and your dealings with

51:08

him, Like what was he like?

51:10

Bobby? Bobby Robinson was

51:12

a very mild mannered,

51:15

low key, community

51:18

friendly guy

51:21

who was not a very big guy. But

51:24

he was a guy

51:27

that.

51:28

All of us respected because

51:31

he had his own record shop. He

51:34

would go to his record shop, he had the

51:36

Mamo Pop Record shop and you would you would

51:38

hear everything that came out from

51:40

the Treacher's Free, from the Feelers, from Coolkow,

51:43

from anybody from Funky four. And he

51:45

was the first guy out there doing

51:47

it. But the problem is is that in

51:50

the community, Bobby Robinson

51:52

was also known as a guy who

51:55

did not pay and he did not pay

51:57

no rappers. So

51:59

so I when I did

52:01

the deal with him, I got

52:03

some money up front from him because

52:06

I knew based on the history

52:08

of what he did with the trust. I used to sit in

52:10

Bobby Robinson's record shop and

52:13

watch Treacher's Three come in there, and LA

52:15

would be like.

52:16

Joe, we're Bobby Man, I'm looking for my money.

52:18

Man.

52:19

I would watch mo D coming it goes

52:21

Bobby in here, Yo, where's he at?

52:23

And I would watch how people

52:27

respected Bobby because

52:29

he was the guy who looked like he knew more than

52:31

us we were kids, but it

52:34

looked like he didn't

52:37

either explain what was going

52:39

on, or he

52:41

was doing things and didn't really

52:44

come clean on what he was doing.

52:47

You under saying.

52:48

Okay, so okay, So nineteen

52:51

eighty one and I

52:53

get a deal with Enjoy Records,

52:56

What how's the deal broker?

52:59

Like, what is housing k

53:01

or fair deal for Enjoy Records?

53:03

Are you giving me and you're Bobby Robinson?

53:06

Are you giving me and my crew like five

53:08

hundred bucks to do one

53:10

side? Or like, what's what

53:13

kind of deal my striking with you? If you're Bobby

53:15

Robinson? I want to make a rap record.

53:17

Bobby Robinson is not giving you a deal

53:20

where you really know what you're

53:23

gonna get.

53:24

You might get ten center record, you

53:26

might get twelve cents a record or fifteen

53:29

cents a record, But he is not sitting

53:31

down with a lawyer and going through a deal

53:33

with you. He know you're a hungry young

53:35

kid who could rap and he's just trying

53:37

to put the record out and he's saying,

53:39

no, here, sign this, and

53:42

we're gonna work it out. And there's no way for

53:44

you to take account to how

53:46

many records he sold because he's selling

53:48

them out the trunk or he's passing

53:50

them around as to mom and pop distribution.

53:54

Bobby Robinson was a

53:56

guy that for me, I

53:58

watch every hit pop artists

54:01

that he had signed, from Grandmaster Flash

54:04

to Funkie four to Treacherous

54:06

three.

54:07

And feel his four. I watched all

54:09

of them.

54:10

He had them all and he never

54:14

dealt with them in a way that

54:16

they felt confident that they were going to get

54:19

compensated.

54:19

For their music.

54:20

And with me, I just did one single

54:23

with him with two sided because I

54:25

did get Fresh Doug on the other side,

54:27

because I needed to have something out

54:30

because I seen what was going on in

54:32

regards to people believing that I might

54:34

have got it from Fat

54:36

Boys, which originally was Disco

54:39

three. So when I got with him, it

54:41

was only for strategic purposes.

54:44

It wasn't he.

54:44

I knew that Bobby Robinson

54:47

was not a guy that would pay you,

54:49

and he would not He was not a guy that you

54:52

could see yourself making money with.

54:54

So you went with Enjoyed, just so that

54:56

you could stop the bleeding of the

54:59

fat boys being the

55:01

soul creators of the beat

55:03

box.

55:04

Like I gotta get in the okay,

55:07

I get it marketing right right.

55:09

So I strategically, I said, if I hit

55:11

him with the movie, if I hit him with

55:13

just having fun and Get Fresh tough, because

55:15

remember I said, for all the sounds

55:17

you beat boxes are doing, all you bit

55:20

from me, I should be sewing some

55:22

say yay what they should be going From the time

55:24

you hit this robing, your career is ruined.

55:27

That's the way I opened it up, you

55:29

know what I mean. And then and so once

55:32

I did that, it was to make people

55:35

know. And then out in Long

55:37

Island in eighty two, I

55:39

met Biz.

55:41

And then I would have.

55:42

Biz with me everywhere because Biz

55:44

was coming to my house and he was going

55:47

to the store for my mother. He was

55:49

going to the store for my grandmother, and he was

55:51

up under me because he was trying to learn

55:53

the beat box.

55:54

So I had him there you talking,

55:58

yes, business, Biz was This

56:00

is one of the members, the first members

56:03

of the Get Fresh Crow.

56:04

Did not know.

56:07

You that that's

56:13

my brother. I love him. He's on this

56:15

new album that I just let out. I

56:17

mean, that's one of our list times together.

56:21

And then and and he's his

56:23

family, you know what I mean.

56:25

So and then eventually and then it

56:28

got a little weird because he's trying to do the

56:30

beat box. I'm doing it and I'm

56:32

like, yo, Biz, you know you're biting straight

56:34

up.

56:34

I can't let you do that.

56:36

And he's like, all right, all right. And then

56:38

that's when he went to Magic. But I was

56:41

with Magic first. But Magic

56:43

was trying to get me to battle everybody.

56:46

So I didn't like that. I didn't like

56:48

how Magic were trying to get

56:50

me to go in there and battle every

56:52

single person that he had. That

56:55

that he didn't like because he was getting high

56:57

at the time and he.

56:58

Wasn't the same as the Magic from w HBI,

57:02

you know what I mean.

57:03

Doug one more enjoyed eraror

57:05

question that I gotta know about, you

57:08

know, because I come from a lineage of musicianship.

57:12

You know.

57:12

And all respect to Keith le Blancin

57:14

and Doug win Bush of sugar Hill.

57:17

To talking about Pumpkin Baby.

57:20

Pumpkins.

57:22

So for our listeners that don't know Pumpkin

57:25

Pumpkin was the you know, for Keith

57:27

le Blancin and and Doug

57:29

win Bush to be the house band of sugar

57:31

Hill Records over at Enjoy

57:34

Records up in Harlem. The

57:37

leader was Pumpkin the drummer.

57:39

And you know if you if you're if

57:41

you're a beat, heead you

57:43

know if you collect records. Then

57:46

his interpolation of tower

57:49

power squid cakes, it

57:51

was done.

57:52

I think even better.

57:54

You know, I prefer LOVET

57:57

by Spoony g that break more

57:59

than the original breakdown it

58:01

should have came from.

58:02

Can you tell me anything about I knew nothing

58:04

about Pumpkin.

58:05

What was he?

58:06

Let me tell you about original.

58:08

Pumpkin, right right, right

58:11

right Pumpkin. Pumpkin was

58:15

unbelievable.

58:17

One day and this is what happened with

58:19

Bobby Robinson, And this is what made me do

58:21

it like I did it. Pumpkin was

58:23

in there and I told him a beat I wanted

58:26

him to play.

58:27

He played a beat. He'll go to the keyboards.

58:29

I said, give me this sound. He'll go in there. He'll

58:31

pick up the sound. If you need him to play

58:33

the bass and grab the bas and put that in there.

58:36

Pumpkin was like a one man

58:39

man and what happened.

58:41

And if you listen to love rap

58:44

when it's going that

58:49

beat, and then if you hear in the back, you

58:52

here the percussions.

58:53

That's Spoony G's.

58:54

Brother and his name is Pooci all

58:57

of them little brother Poochie

59:00

is Spoony Jeans brother.

59:02

Never knew that b this

59:05

this thing runs so deep.

59:07

But but Pumpkin, and

59:09

before Pumpkin passed, Pumpkin

59:12

came to the studio and he kept saying, Dougie,

59:14

let me.

59:14

Let me play a beat for you tonight. Come on, Dougie,

59:16

mean, let's go back to back. Let's do beat. And

59:19

in the middle of everything going on before

59:22

me and were before me and it were able to

59:24

get together.

59:24

He passed away. But Pumpkin

59:27

was a guy that

59:29

that's why we did this. That's why he did this song.

59:31

Pumpkin and the All Stars. We

59:33

remember that one because Pumpkin

59:35

and if you have.

59:38

Oh, that was his cod kidnamed Fly Fly

59:41

Tiedel Jackson.

59:44

We crazy,

59:53

look, look, look Pumpkin was. Pumpkin

59:55

was honestly as a drummer,

59:58

as a musician, he was a

1:00:00

guy that you could tell your ideas

1:00:03

too, and he would be able

1:00:06

to give you the idea just

1:00:08

like you wanted it and add some things

1:00:11

that was really really good. So my first

1:00:14

record I was gonna do was

1:00:16

a song with Pumpkin, but we never

1:00:19

got to finish it.

1:00:20

I was going to say, because if it wasn't

1:00:22

for Pumpkin passing away, would

1:00:25

you have worked with Teddy Riley for

1:00:28

the show in nineteen

1:00:30

eighty five if Punkin were

1:00:32

still alive, would you go on to Pumpkin instead

1:00:35

of Teddy Riley?

1:00:37

I would have probably went to

1:00:39

Pumpkin.

1:00:39

But also I was I was

1:00:42

teaching Teddy about hip hop

1:00:44

because Teddy was from.

1:00:46

The church, church kid.

1:00:48

Right, so we used to cut school

1:00:50

and that's when I introduced him to

1:00:52

swing. And

1:00:55

that was the beginning of it because

1:00:57

because the drums, you know, let

1:01:00

me talk to you as a producer now like

1:01:03

on the d X or the DMX,

1:01:05

the button in the back would determine how much

1:01:07

swing that you put into a beat.

1:01:10

If I'm going that's

1:01:13

swinging, run DMC's beat is

1:01:15

to be like now,

1:01:17

it's more like right

1:01:20

action.

1:01:21

So what I brought was so

1:01:26

that's swing, that's swing,

1:01:29

that swing. And I did it because

1:01:31

Greg Greg g from

1:01:34

the disco for owed me some

1:01:36

money because I did a show for him,

1:01:38

because he was a promoter on the side,

1:01:41

and because he owed me money, he lent

1:01:43

all of his equipment to Teddy. And

1:01:45

when he lent it to Teddy, he said, yo, man,

1:01:48

I ain't got the money right now for Joe. If

1:01:51

you want to work on your music and you want to get

1:01:53

your joint done, yo, I got the equipment

1:01:55

over there at Teddy's house.

1:01:56

I said, really, he said, yeah.

1:01:59

So I went over there.

1:02:01

Teddy had all of his equipment over there,

1:02:04

and right over there is when I

1:02:07

started to make up the pattern of this

1:02:09

show. The drums, and then that's when

1:02:11

I hit that shaker and

1:02:13

I as when, huh.

1:02:15

How many tracks were you?

1:02:17

Like?

1:02:17

What equipment made the show?

1:02:20

I use?

1:02:21

I used the DX drum machine,

1:02:24

and I use a

1:02:26

series of keyboards because my manager

1:02:29

was the one in.

1:02:31

The studio that played everything.

1:02:34

Because it's

1:02:36

just a complicated story, man.

1:02:38

But

1:02:40

but you know, but the truth

1:02:43

of the matter is that I

1:02:47

know that the show would

1:02:49

have never became what

1:02:51

it is if I didn't have Teddy

1:02:54

there to be able to to

1:02:56

to express my ideas

1:02:58

the way that I express you

1:03:01

know.

1:03:01

What I mean.

1:03:01

I was gonna say, the show is one of the

1:03:03

most unusual formatic

1:03:08

songs I've ever heard, because

1:03:12

if you really, if you really break down the

1:03:14

show, the show is

1:03:16

almost like it's

1:03:19

almost like I wouldn't say interludes, but

1:03:21

I would almost say seven vignettes

1:03:23

because nothing, nothing repeats

1:03:26

twice like then here we go, here we go, Come on.

1:03:28

It's almost like it's like every hooks could

1:03:31

be a hook every four bars,

1:03:34

and I know you guys aren't dealing with

1:03:36

like pro tools and cut

1:03:38

these four bars, so it's

1:03:40

almost like I feel like you had to

1:03:42

map out that entirely sequence.

1:03:45

I did, I did, I did. I went

1:03:48

over there.

1:03:48

I sat down, and this is when

1:03:50

I first learned how to count the bars

1:03:52

and arrange it.

1:03:53

So I sat down and I arranged the

1:03:55

whole thing.

1:03:57

And when I arranged it, I went over there his house

1:03:59

after I'm made up the track. Because this is how

1:04:01

y'all understand this, because y'all are musicians

1:04:04

and y'all know the game.

1:04:05

You go there, you feel the music, and you make

1:04:08

it up.

1:04:08

After you make it up, I would take the tape

1:04:10

home and then I would, you know, play

1:04:12

around with it. I'll go to Will's house Battery's

1:04:15

house, and I'll come back and say I like this.

1:04:17

I like this, and so I wanted I didn't.

1:04:19

I just structured it where I want the horn

1:04:21

to hit here, I want this to be. And

1:04:24

I learned how to structure

1:04:26

it based on how many

1:04:28

bars everything was on the

1:04:30

song. And then after it

1:04:33

was all done, then I had to go back and

1:04:35

program the drums so.

1:04:40

So I can separate all

1:04:42

of these pieces.

1:04:43

So you don't want even pacing, No,

1:04:46

I just I just programmed it like

1:04:48

that Teddy. I told Teddy

1:04:51

what I wanted to do, and he

1:04:53

knew how to work the equipment, and

1:04:55

so he sat down and whatever

1:04:57

I was asking him to do, he would

1:05:00

do it.

1:05:00

I'll say, like Teddy was the one who came

1:05:02

up with the.

1:05:03

Drum roll, so

1:05:05

so because I was doing a drum roll and

1:05:07

mom was cool. But then and he

1:05:10

heard mine and it was in his like

1:05:12

a combination of what I was doing and

1:05:15

what he added to it, which made it better. So

1:05:18

the other part that any contribution

1:05:20

that anybody was trying to make

1:05:23

to the song, if it felt good and if

1:05:25

it worked, it didn't matter.

1:05:26

Who came up with it.

1:05:28

It was about making this thing

1:05:31

as hot as it could be. Like when I hit

1:05:33

the shaker. I hit the shaker by

1:05:35

accident because it was I was looking

1:05:37

for something else. And then when I hit the shaker,

1:05:40

I just started to you know, because

1:05:42

I'm doing the bee box and all of that.

1:05:44

I said, I started,

1:05:46

I started really moving

1:05:48

it.

1:05:48

And then when I was working with the drum machine

1:05:51

Teddy, I said I want swing in it, and

1:05:54

he was like okay, and he put a little I said,

1:05:56

no, I got to swing harder than that, and then

1:05:58

he started saying no, I got to swing. I

1:06:00

said, that's it right there, that's

1:06:03

swing and nobody

1:06:05

was using it.

1:06:06

Man, not like that.

1:06:07

I'm gonna tell you to

1:06:10

be alive and

1:06:12

of age in nineteen eighty five.

1:06:15

I'm probably the last human

1:06:19

that got on the

1:06:22

train of the show right

1:06:25

before it took off, because I

1:06:27

spent the entire summer of

1:06:29

nineteen eighty five in California where

1:06:33

it was all about Toddy

1:06:35

T's batter Ram the batter I

1:06:38

remember, right,

1:06:42

I like, yeah, my cousins, My

1:06:44

cousins were bangers whatever like and literally

1:06:47

that's all you only heard

1:06:50

batter Ram. So to

1:06:52

spend June, July and August

1:06:54

in California in

1:06:57

the Altadena Pasadena with

1:06:59

my teenage cousins.

1:07:00

Only hearing batter Ram.

1:07:03

I come back home to

1:07:05

Philly and this is this

1:07:07

is I know that nineteen eighty five is probably

1:07:10

the last regional

1:07:12

year for hip hop, where like only

1:07:15

regions, you only dealt with their regions and it

1:07:17

wasn't like fully national yet. And

1:07:20

I got home and

1:07:23

saw, you know, the landed. My plane

1:07:25

landed like three or four in the afternoon. Got

1:07:27

home and I remember like talking

1:07:30

to the kids on the block and

1:07:33

I just knew I was up on something

1:07:35

that they weren't up on. And

1:07:37

I was like, Yo, y'all know about batter Ram Now

1:07:39

I'm from Philly, right. They looked

1:07:42

at me like I

1:07:44

was an alien. They're like, what the

1:07:47

hell is a batter Ram. I'm like, right, you

1:07:49

can't stop. I'm singing the first verse

1:07:51

and everything. They just looked at me like it

1:07:54

was like the block was laughing

1:07:56

at me. They're like, nah, we only

1:07:58

know about the show and Lotty Dottie. And I was like, like,

1:08:00

the did

1:08:02

not know about this. Literally, this is like two

1:08:05

days before school started. And

1:08:07

they told me, nah, this is this

1:08:09

has been number one on Power ninety nine

1:08:11

for three months. In a row like, that's

1:08:14

the that's the last time I felt so late

1:08:16

on something that the whole world was up

1:08:18

on.

1:08:19

You still had you still had till nineteen ninety

1:08:21

one to get back on it again. Because I was gonna say, did

1:08:24

did the New Jack City?

1:08:25

I wanted to know the story between on the New Jack City

1:08:27

situation and how it became kind

1:08:30

of that scene and in that movie,

1:08:32

and how you even allowed them.

1:08:34

To use it.

1:08:35

Yeah, because I felt like it came back and the Ninjack

1:08:37

City it just gave it new life.

1:08:39

I mean the show never I think, no

1:08:42

gave it was timeless.

1:08:43

Yeah, no doubt, no doubt.

1:08:50

For starters.

1:08:51

I guess we should ask you, how

1:08:54

did you hook up with Slick Rick to

1:08:56

start this group?

1:08:58

Well that's an interesting question because

1:09:02

slick Rick was well,

1:09:05

he wasn't slick Rick.

1:09:07

He was Ricky ri right,

1:09:09

he was Ricky d And

1:09:12

he was with his crew that

1:09:15

man, y'all, y'all asked some questions.

1:09:17

Man, Well,

1:09:20

yeah, it was the Cango Cup.

1:09:21

But where I seen him, see the Kango crew

1:09:23

was in his school. Where

1:09:26

he was doing his thing was up

1:09:28

at the Cadet Club in

1:09:30

the Bronx. Now Rick

1:09:33

was moving around with different

1:09:36

guys trying to get his get his hip hop

1:09:38

thing going on.

1:09:39

And there was a guy named Donald d. And

1:09:42

there was another dude named June loves.

1:09:48

Syndicate.

1:09:49

All no, this is another guy and he

1:09:51

calls himself now Dandy down. He's still

1:09:53

alive, right, But it was these three guys.

1:09:56

Me and Tito was hanging out.

1:09:58

One night, Tito came by my house from the

1:10:00

Fearless Four and we

1:10:02

hung out and we went uptown and they had

1:10:04

an EMC contest. Now, I

1:10:06

was known to take a

1:10:09

lot of EMC contests because

1:10:12

my style was was basically

1:10:14

the new thing with.

1:10:15

The beat box.

1:10:16

I'm rhyming, it's crowd participation,

1:10:19

I'm dancing, it's Harlem, it's

1:10:22

a whole nother thing.

1:10:23

There's melody. So there was

1:10:25

a new dimension and hip hop coming in.

1:10:27

Long story short, me and Tito got on

1:10:29

and the girls loved Tito, so

1:10:32

it was like a It was like a it was like,

1:10:34

let's go get this money Tito. But then

1:10:36

they said we couldn't be in it

1:10:38

because they looked at him as a professional

1:10:41

and they looked at me as a professional.

1:10:43

Even though I didn't have a record out at the time.

1:10:45

Nothing major, but this is

1:10:47

what So Rick, June Love,

1:10:49

and Donald D was in the contests.

1:10:52

So when they was in the contest, the Cold Crush Brothers

1:10:55

was in the contest too. So this

1:10:57

is how the story goes. I was

1:10:59

there whe watching June and

1:11:01

watching them.

1:11:02

I say, Yo, these dudes is nice.

1:11:04

I said, yo, yo, t don't look at the nice and

1:11:06

he was like yeah, yeah, and Tila Rock was up

1:11:08

there and he's like, yeah, you know it's

1:11:10

yours. It's yours, yo. That's

1:11:12

another right, that's ah

1:11:15

another story. So we up

1:11:17

there and all of a sudden, say, yo, I

1:11:19

heard Rick, and so the rhyme that you hearing

1:11:21

him say on the show was the rhyme

1:11:23

that I heard him say in the contest. And

1:11:26

so when he said that rhyme in the concert, I said, Yo, the

1:11:28

kid is nice, said the kid. Donald D was rhyming

1:11:30

about a beef patty. And when he brought

1:11:32

the beef patty, so they burned it

1:11:34

and they flipped it on the other side and gave

1:11:37

it to him, and they tried to hide it, you know what I'm

1:11:39

saying, And he wrote a rhyme about the beef.

1:11:41

I was like, yo, these dudes are ill because I haven't

1:11:43

heard nobody rhyme like this. You know, long

1:11:46

story short, June Love stopped.

1:11:48

June Love was gonna team up

1:11:51

with Greg Nice. June

1:11:53

Love got murdered. So the style

1:11:56

that you hear Greg Nice's rhyme in

1:11:59

is June style.

1:12:02

Ok So, the great Nice style of fear

1:12:04

the fan

1:12:07

that is based on June

1:12:11

Love.

1:12:11

Right, And June Love was a part of Cago

1:12:14

Crew.

1:12:15

Okay, you're following me, got

1:12:18

it.

1:12:19

I'm trying to another.

1:12:20

Beat boxer, Greg Nice, right,

1:12:22

But.

1:12:22

Greg NICs was also under my guidance

1:12:26

because the feel Is four. He wanted

1:12:28

to do the beatbox for the Feelings four because

1:12:32

they wanted something to balance out

1:12:35

what they wasn't doing, and because

1:12:37

I.

1:12:37

Rhymed the beat buzz.

1:12:39

So Greg Nice was another piece

1:12:41

that he was going with Feelers for. So

1:12:44

that's my man all that, But I'm just telling

1:12:46

you he started to transition into

1:12:49

the Junie Love style because he was

1:12:51

going to do the beatbox.

1:12:52

For June Love. And when June

1:12:54

Love.

1:12:55

Lost his life, Greg

1:12:57

basically took the style and then

1:12:59

he went forward with it. So like all

1:13:01

I was going on, Rick seeing

1:13:03

me get on, and then I'm doing parties

1:13:06

throughout the whole city. So everywhere

1:13:08

I go, Rick is like, yo, jugie

1:13:11

freshman. Yo, you think you could put

1:13:13

me on with you? I said, Yo, I gotta hear

1:13:15

you, man, I gotta hear all night. You know, see if you're

1:13:18

good whatever you know? I say, Yo, you seem

1:13:20

like a cool dude. Say yeah, man, my name is

1:13:22

Ricky de Man. I say, yeah, I see you downtown,

1:13:24

man, at Ron said, was kind of slick. He

1:13:26

said, yeah, man, I'm nice. So I would go all

1:13:29

of these different places and I would see him. He

1:13:31

would be pressing me, like everywhere

1:13:33

I go.

1:13:33

I'm in the door. He's like, yo, Doug,

1:13:36

put me on.

1:13:36

I get off stage, and then he'll

1:13:38

be standing there. He was like, y'all see you get

1:13:40

on, man, Yo, do you think we could

1:13:43

go back on? You could put me on with you?

1:13:45

And I'll be like, I can't do that,

1:13:47

man. I just got off. And one day I'm

1:13:49

going down the hill and Comment Avenue and

1:13:51

Harlem and he's I see him

1:13:53

on the phone. I don't know

1:13:55

how he was on the corner on the

1:13:58

phone while.

1:13:59

I'm walking down there. The odds is like a

1:14:01

billion to one. I take

1:14:03

him over to Will's house. I got this

1:14:05

little drum machine, the RX seven

1:14:08

that I got from OC from

1:14:10

Feelings spoiled one of his dj because

1:14:12

it was crazy Eddy and oc Oc

1:14:15

was trying to sell me the drum machine. So you

1:14:17

know, you when you were broke, you're trying

1:14:19

to borrow somebody drum machine and trying to

1:14:21

get.

1:14:21

As most out of it as you can. And

1:14:23

then you know you gotta, you know, to stress

1:14:25

you then you give it back, you know how that

1:14:28

was? So yeah, So Rick

1:14:30

came over and I

1:14:32

say, yo're come over into the house, man. And

1:14:35

then right then and there is when

1:14:37

I say, yo, let me see what you got. I

1:14:39

got on.

1:14:40

A couple of other dudes got on. And that was

1:14:42

the day that he started

1:14:44

lotty ditting. And when he

1:14:47

said it, he couldn't he couldn't even finish

1:14:49

the rhyme because we was laughing for

1:14:51

at least an hour. I mean, it was

1:14:53

like, yo, let me tell you something.

1:14:56

Bro Rick was so goddamn

1:14:58

funny. I'm talking about like

1:15:00

he was h hilarious. I

1:15:03

mean to the point that we all in

1:15:05

there holding our stomach. He can't

1:15:07

finish the rhyme. Then all of a sudden,

1:15:10

out there and then the rhyme. He said, I told you

1:15:12

I was nice. I told you I was nice.

1:15:16

Wait are there any other

1:15:19

takes of Lotty

1:15:21

Doddy that we've not heard because.

1:15:23

It's just you JUSTO. Yeah, there's a couple, I.

1:15:25

Mean alternative takes of it.

1:15:28

Nah.

1:15:28

Now what we did and what

1:15:30

we did on Wax was

1:15:33

when we made that. That was because

1:15:35

my manager at the time say, Yo, why

1:15:37

don't y'all do that thing called Lotti Doddy

1:15:40

that all the kids are talking about in the street

1:15:42

because Lotty Dotty was created in eighty

1:15:45

four. And what I did is

1:15:47

when I seen them, when I heard the rhyme, I

1:15:49

say, Yo, this rhyme would be crazy if

1:15:52

I did the beatbox and I just

1:15:54

come in with different words and I

1:15:56

changed the beat so that it doesn't

1:15:59

get boring, and I say, yeah,

1:16:01

this.

1:16:01

Will be good. And then all of a sudden, I said

1:16:03

that we get and then he was excited. I said,

1:16:05

and we could take all the rap contests.

1:16:07

He was like, yeah, yeah, that's what I want.

1:16:09

Because he felt that he got jerked when

1:16:12

he was at the Cadet Court because they didn't

1:16:14

they didn't win, so he

1:16:16

had this big thing on his shoulder saying

1:16:19

I'm taking every contest. So then we

1:16:21

started going around in the city just

1:16:23

taking every contest.

1:16:25

And then when we.

1:16:26

Did it on record, we took

1:16:28

out the second part to Lottie Dottie

1:16:30

because we mentioned Vanessa.

1:16:33

Ways williams, Oh yeah,

1:16:37

you told me. Wait a minute,

1:16:39

Wait a minute, God, this

1:16:42

is like the rabbit hole of life. I

1:16:44

just gotta do you have any

1:16:46

of those tapes? From

1:16:49

course, okay, I'm

1:16:51

coming to your ri of course.

1:16:54

Literally more more

1:16:56

than the twelve inch there

1:16:58

was. There was again Philadelphian. There

1:17:01

was a dude, my go

1:17:03

to cheese steak guy every

1:17:06

Sunday, my go to

1:17:09

steak guy, like he would have

1:17:11

He would have like he had cousins

1:17:14

from New York that always

1:17:16

put him on to like those

1:17:18

t Connection tapes and those Parlem

1:17:21

World tapes. So when

1:17:23

I'm, you know, Sunday after church my

1:17:26

routine, I get a cheese steak after church, and

1:17:28

he's always playing some live whatever.

1:17:31

And one of these Sundays he had

1:17:34

like much of my mom's dis may this is the

1:17:36

first time I'm here and treator like a prostitute

1:17:38

a live version, and

1:17:41

I snuffed back. I was like, Mom, I'm gonna

1:17:43

get some potato chips, and I stuck

1:17:46

up to him. I said, and

1:17:48

I had one of those like my mom's you know

1:17:50

you always record over your mom's tapes or whatever.

1:17:52

And I had like one of her old gout, like

1:17:54

one of the gospel tapes that she just walked from

1:17:57

church and was like, yo, can

1:17:59

you can you meet me? Gods

1:18:01

it don't be back tomorrow for lunch. And

1:18:04

I lived with it's

1:18:06

a live version of YouTube, just

1:18:08

doing your whole routine. And I studied

1:18:10

that ship to the tape. Pop

1:18:13

it popped and I never got I gotta

1:18:15

get that back again.

1:18:16

But yo, yo, yo, yo, that's

1:18:18

crazy you're saying that. I mean, you know, see

1:18:21

when we when we.

1:18:23

Treat him like a prostitute, we were already

1:18:25

doing that and that was going to be the next thing

1:18:28

we was gonna let out and some other things

1:18:30

that we had right. But what was crazy

1:18:32

is when I hurt Jay and them do

1:18:35

it with.

1:18:35

The beat, it changed the whole

1:18:38

vibe of it. It wasn't like the

1:18:40

same or it wasn't the same.

1:18:42

Yeah, Like I'm probably the only person that like

1:18:45

when I heard it, I was like, man, I don't want

1:18:47

it with music.

1:18:47

I want it with Dougie, right right right.

1:18:50

But you know it's crazy, it's real like

1:18:52

that.

1:18:52

And that's interesting because, like

1:18:55

I said about frequency, going

1:18:57

back to that, it was a match

1:19:00

of a frequency. You see, see

1:19:02

when you doing the beat box people think

1:19:04

is easy or simple. It's like the

1:19:06

way you if you're playing the drums, you're

1:19:09

playing to align

1:19:12

your spirit with the

1:19:15

person that you're playing for. You're

1:19:18

not playing like a drum machine.

1:19:20

You're playing like a spirit. So

1:19:22

when they're doing this and not, you gotta

1:19:25

flow. So what Lottie Dottie

1:19:27

is it's to match,

1:19:31

to match him and to move

1:19:33

with him and to make him be

1:19:35

the best he can be. It

1:19:37

wasn't about me. It was about

1:19:39

how can how can we make

1:19:42

this be the best? And

1:19:44

I had to match the

1:19:46

way the energy move. If I don't match

1:19:49

the way the energy move, you're just liking

1:19:51

me.

1:19:52

But I don't just want you to like me. I

1:19:54

want you to like what's going on.

1:19:56

I want you to feel it.

1:19:58

So it has to move, you know what

1:20:00

I mean. And that's how that's the reason

1:20:02

why I treat him like a prostitute lives

1:20:05

better than the drum machine.

1:20:08

Yes, it is how okay,

1:20:10

so by September.

1:20:13

First of all, let me just declare that I probably

1:20:15

think that the show Lotti

1:20:18

Dottie is one of the greatest

1:20:21

twelve inches of all time.

1:20:23

For any.

1:20:26

I'm afraid to ask, I pray the

1:20:28

answers. Yes, I hope you still own your

1:20:30

publishing for Lottie Dotty because

1:20:34

it's probably the most sampled

1:20:37

song of in hip hop history.

1:20:40

Yes I do, Yes, I do, Yes,

1:20:42

I do. But not only do I own

1:20:45

all of the publishing.

1:20:47

I made sure Rick owns his publisher

1:20:50

and the story and the other

1:20:53

side of this.

1:20:53

Story, which only requests

1:20:55

love and the Supreme Team could

1:20:58

get, is when I made the show a

1:21:01

quest. When I did just having

1:21:03

fun, I called it just having fun

1:21:05

because I was learning about the studio and I

1:21:07

knew Bobby Robinson wasn't gonna pay nobody,

1:21:10

so I wasn't gonna try to do everything

1:21:12

that I could do with him.

1:21:13

That was Number one.

1:21:14

Original human beatbox was with

1:21:17

Entertainment Records and Vincent Davis.

1:21:19

I had an argument with him because

1:21:22

I made the beat up and

1:21:24

he put that bing bing link sound

1:21:26

in there and it sounded.

1:21:28

Like I hated it.

1:21:30

Man.

1:21:32

You know, I'm gonna tell you, I love the guitars,

1:21:35

but I hated that sound because I

1:21:37

had a different idea that

1:21:39

I felt was better, and me and him got into

1:21:42

a conflict, So that vocal was

1:21:44

just a practice, a rough vocal

1:21:47

on what I was getting ready to come back and

1:21:49

do better. So then I left

1:21:51

the studio and I started doing

1:21:54

shows.

1:21:54

I stacked up.

1:21:55

All my money and when I went

1:21:57

in there, I made the show and

1:22:00

Dotty, and when I told Rick about the show,

1:22:02

he said that idea is whack.

1:22:04

That ain't gonna work.

1:22:06

So then I said, Rick, I said, trust

1:22:08

me, I know what I'm talking about,

1:22:10

the same way I told you that this

1:22:12

beatbox thing is going to work with this

1:22:15

routine.

1:22:17

So then what happened.

1:22:18

He trusted me and we went

1:22:20

into the studio and I made this show and

1:22:22

I made Lottie Dotty. I took it the Profile

1:22:24

Records. Profile Records heard

1:22:27

it. He said, this is the worst music

1:22:29

I've ever heard. He said, who's

1:22:31

that guy sounding like that? And what's

1:22:34

this little clicking sound that I

1:22:36

keep hearing in the song?

1:22:37

So he said it to me and I said, Steve,

1:22:42

it was it was the owner Coo.

1:22:47

So listen to this. So afterwards,

1:22:49

I said, no problem.

1:22:50

Now I paid all the money I spent ten I

1:22:53

had saved the ten grand I went

1:22:55

to Daily Planet Studio in

1:22:57

New York. So then after that

1:23:00

I went and I said, man, I got to get this record

1:23:02

out. So I took it to WHBI. Jerry

1:23:04

blood Rock played it and

1:23:07

a couple of other guys started getting the crazy

1:23:09

buzz. So I went to this label

1:23:11

called Dain your Records,

1:23:15

right, I said, distributed by Fantasy. So

1:23:17

when I went to him, I said, he

1:23:20

said, yo, I want to distribute the record

1:23:22

for you.

1:23:23

I said, that's cool, I said,

1:23:25

but I'm going to own

1:23:27

it. He said, well,

1:23:29

I want to buy into the ownership.

1:23:31

I said, if you want to buy into the ownership, you got to give

1:23:34

me the money back that

1:23:36

I spent and then we can go from

1:23:38

there.

1:23:39

So then what he did is he gave me the

1:23:41

money back, and then.

1:23:42

Basically I owned the master,

1:23:45

and I brought him in and I gave him a piece

1:23:48

of the master. So in eighty five,

1:23:51

I was the first artist to ever

1:23:53

own their master. You

1:23:55

see, but I learned that because of

1:23:57

what happened over there, and

1:24:00

I watched it. So when I owned

1:24:02

the Master, and I came back, and

1:24:04

when I gave Rip half of the publishing

1:24:07

on the show, and we

1:24:09

both split high for the publishing on Lottie

1:24:12

Dottie, and then from there we moved

1:24:14

forward.

1:24:14

And then now, so was that Reality Records?

1:24:17

Was that you? Was that your Reality Records?

1:24:19

Yeah? See it went from oh and by

1:24:21

the way, and every record after

1:24:24

that, I owned the master,

1:24:26

so it was right.

1:24:29

So what happened is that

1:24:31

I was seeing what was

1:24:33

going on, and you know, I'm

1:24:35

like around seventeen years old, eighteen years

1:24:37

old, but I'm seeing that something

1:24:40

just didn't seem.

1:24:40

Right about how people are

1:24:42

owning your master,

1:24:45

Like I thought that was kind of And then

1:24:47

since I spent the money, I was like,

1:24:49

how you're gonna own it?

1:24:50

So now the record blows up. I go to Roxy.

1:24:53

Cory is in Roxy. The

1:24:55

record is on fire. I mean bro,

1:24:58

When I say fire, I mean five

1:25:01

y'all. So now Corey

1:25:03

comes in there and he said, Yo, could

1:25:06

I talk to you?

1:25:07

I said sure? He said, Yo,

1:25:09

Man, I made a mistake.

1:25:12

Man, I

1:25:15

was wrong.

1:25:17

He said, Man, this thing I

1:25:19

just couldn't see it coming. He said, I

1:25:21

was just seeing run DMC. I couldn't

1:25:23

see nothing.

1:25:24

This was just so unusual, it

1:25:26

was so new, it was so I

1:25:28

didn't know what to think. I said, bro, I

1:25:31

said, it ain't no problem. I was

1:25:33

just giving you the first opportunity because

1:25:35

you got the label. I said, it's okay.

1:25:38

He said, Yo, man, is it any way that we

1:25:40

could do something else?

1:25:41

Are you signing anybody? I said, well, I got to

1:25:43

deal with I got my masters, and

1:25:46

I'm also with the

1:25:48

label. But it's a great deal. I got my publisher,

1:25:50

I got the masters. I said, but maybe we couldn't

1:25:53

down the road. And then after he

1:25:55

got Dana Dan because he.

1:25:57

Wanted to.

1:26:05

Fame that album

1:26:08

right right.

1:26:09

And we didn't mind because Dana was a

1:26:11

part of the family. You know what I mean.

1:26:14

But I'm just showing you how

1:26:17

sometimes once again,

1:26:19

it's back to that fear.

1:26:22

He told me my record was garbage.

1:26:25

I was like, okay, so this

1:26:27

is this leads to my

1:26:30

follow up question. You

1:26:32

two have undoubtedly created

1:26:36

one of the and this is not even a thing where

1:26:38

it's like time has to pass by.

1:26:40

Before we know it's a classic.

1:26:43

But it's like y'all

1:26:45

just hit us with these two singles

1:26:48

and then nothing else. Now

1:26:50

of course, with you like yes, I realized

1:26:53

that Oh my god came out

1:26:55

in eighty six, so you did come

1:26:58

up with an album?

1:27:00

Why they came back?

1:27:01

They did?

1:27:01

Sitting in my car? They didn't come back?

1:27:03

They Yeah, but like, yeah, there

1:27:05

were teen years later, two years he

1:27:08

was going to prison.

1:27:09

Yeah why why did I know?

1:27:11

But even before prison, what was happening

1:27:13

with Slick Rick between nineteen eighty

1:27:15

six in nineteen eighty

1:27:17

nine, before he signed the Deaf Jam, Like why

1:27:21

why didn't why capitalize

1:27:23

on you know, the

1:27:26

hottest single, making you guys

1:27:29

a unit? Like was that just a one off deal?

1:27:31

And okay, now

1:27:33

what happened was is that to

1:27:36

the blame of us both?

1:27:38

I felt that once

1:27:40

again, like I said, I was

1:27:42

already established in the street,

1:27:44

I was moving around. I took Will and Barry

1:27:47

and I brought them together and

1:27:49

that was the first time again.

1:27:51

With two DJs DJ together

1:27:54

at the same time.

1:27:55

There's never been a crew before

1:27:57

the Gift Fresh Crew with two DJs

1:28:00

DJ at the same time. Get

1:28:02

Fresh Crew is the foundation to the executioners

1:28:05

because that because no, I had

1:28:08

two sets and they're playing

1:28:10

at the same time. Not

1:28:13

you get on after me. So I

1:28:16

was really always trying

1:28:18

to push something new. The Deep Box

1:28:20

was new. I had my guys there.

1:28:23

I brought Rick in here. And what happened

1:28:25

with me and Rick was, you know,

1:28:28

I felt that he

1:28:31

was accusing me of

1:28:33

doing something that I didn't

1:28:35

do.

1:28:36

He was accusing me of not

1:28:39

He felt.

1:28:39

Like I was trying to make

1:28:41

all the money of something and that's

1:28:43

not true. I gave him half of the royalty.

1:28:46

I gave him half of the publishing.

1:28:48

I gave him a really good salary

1:28:50

while he was on the road, and also

1:28:52

the other DJs I had a manager. I gave him twenty

1:28:54

percent. The agent.

1:28:56

I gave him, you know, the ten percent

1:28:58

because he was booking the shows all

1:29:00

of these different expenses and everybody.

1:29:02

Had to, you know, get a salary. And

1:29:04

on top of that, I put him in

1:29:07

on what was already in motion. And

1:29:11

I didn't like how we were. We

1:29:13

were like this, you know what I'm saying. And

1:29:15

then when I started to see how people

1:29:18

was getting in his head and people was

1:29:20

coming in trying to.

1:29:20

Get into my head, I didn't really like

1:29:23

the energy. So I said, I

1:29:25

gotta pull out of this. And I didn't want

1:29:28

no money. I didn't want no producer

1:29:30

or no override or

1:29:33

no find this speed. I

1:29:35

was like, bro, you

1:29:37

go ahead and do what you gotta do, because

1:29:40

the energy is not feeling good

1:29:43

no more. And I think we got

1:29:45

too much love for one another for

1:29:47

us. I felt that the magic were

1:29:50

creating is because once

1:29:52

again he trusted me. I

1:29:54

trusted him, and when I felt that

1:29:56

there was a violation of him trusting

1:29:58

me bothered me. And

1:30:01

I was young and I should have just

1:30:03

allowed him to express that, but

1:30:06

I took it personal and I just

1:30:08

say, yo, you go do your thing.

1:30:11

And then when he went over there, Russell

1:30:13

sat him on the bench for

1:30:15

multiple years, And if we're

1:30:17

being real, it's because you

1:30:20

know, at that time, he didn't really know what

1:30:23

to do with him. And over

1:30:25

there depth Jymp, everybody was happy,

1:30:28

but not so happy because we were

1:30:30

we were a little bit of a threat

1:30:33

to people because of

1:30:35

the dynamics of all of the things

1:30:37

that we were bringing together. But I

1:30:40

love Rick, so I didn't want nothing

1:30:43

but the best for him, and I

1:30:45

just felt like, you know, if

1:30:47

the energy is not right, it

1:30:50

doesn't make sense for us to go any further.

1:30:53

Was there any conversation

1:30:56

or reach out to you to do anything

1:30:58

on The Great Adventures Life?

1:31:00

Like did they try

1:31:02

to say something or no.

1:31:05

They tried to. They didn't call

1:31:07

me, but they tried to. They

1:31:10

tried to put me in it because if you listen

1:31:12

to maybe six or seven eight songs, my voices

1:31:15

is throughout the whole album. So they're

1:31:17

trying to balance out the formula

1:31:20

of what it was that we created together.

1:31:22

So when people are listening to that album,

1:31:24

they they're hearing his brilliance

1:31:27

and the excellence of the production, but

1:31:29

they're also feeling my frequency

1:31:32

in there in a subtle way,

1:31:35

because I'm in there, you know,

1:31:37

and I'm in multiple songs.

1:31:39

So they were trying to figure out how

1:31:41

to bring him where he needed to

1:31:44

be. And I look at it like this too.

1:31:45

To be completely transparent, I

1:31:48

think that it was necessary because

1:31:51

Great Adventures of Slick Rick gave him

1:31:53

the platform to express

1:31:56

things that I think was

1:31:58

important for him to express, and we probably

1:32:00

could have figured it out. But I think that would

1:32:03

he have been what

1:32:05

I call the greatest storyteller?

1:32:07

Could he have been that with me? And

1:32:10

could I have been the entertainer

1:32:12

that.

1:32:13

I've grown to become, because maybe

1:32:16

it would have been too much forced from

1:32:18

two different you know what I'm saying. Two

1:32:21

different energies and it would

1:32:23

not really have been as

1:32:25

great as it could have been.

1:32:26

And you know, I just I just

1:32:29

know that.

1:32:29

Like and then when he was about to go to prison, because

1:32:32

he knew it was happening, I went

1:32:34

up to Neurochelle

1:32:37

and vance Wright was up there and I said,

1:32:39

let me hear some of his music, man, and

1:32:41

he played something in her sitting in my car, and

1:32:44

I said, nah, y'all got a drum machine.

1:32:46

Pull that out.

1:32:47

And he was getting ready to do the same thing that

1:32:49

he did with jam

1:32:52

Master Jay. I said, let me do it, and

1:32:54

then I put it in there, and then I kept

1:32:56

the loop in there.

1:32:57

And then when he got out.

1:32:59

Of prison after doing a long, long

1:33:02

rough ride, I was there

1:33:04

for him.

1:33:05

To perform with him

1:33:07

when he got out in LA and

1:33:10

I did that for him to support him,

1:33:12

you know what I mean. And then I had the Senator

1:33:14

to go up and you know, make sure you didn't

1:33:16

get depored in. And then when the Senator became

1:33:18

the governor, I brought the governor in

1:33:21

because I felt like, even

1:33:24

though we're not together, we're

1:33:27

always together.

1:33:30

All right, y'all. I know you want some more and

1:33:32

we got it for you.

1:33:33

That was part one of Quest Love Supreme's

1:33:36

interview with Dougie Fresh.

1:33:37

You ready for part two? All right, stay tuned's

1:33:40

coming up.

1:33:41

West.

1:33:42

Love Supreme is a production of iHeart

1:33:44

Radio. For

1:33:48

more podcasts from iHeart Radio, visit the

1:33:50

iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts,

1:33:53

or wherever you listen to your favorite Chills