0:00

Wanna be more active this winter? Sierra helps

0:02

you save on everything from skis to snow

0:04

boots, sleds to scarves, and if you still

0:06

don't wanna go outside, you can always move

0:09

somewhere warmer. Sierra, let's

0:11

get moving to your local store,

0:13

like now. Go! This

0:16

episode is brought to you by Google Pixel, the

0:18

official fan phone of the NBA and WNBA.

0:21

The new Pixel 8 and Pixel 8 Pro are built different.

0:24

How? Take the Audio Magic Eraser tool.

0:26

It helps block out distracting crowd noise

0:29

so your play-by-play commentary sounds crystal clear.

0:32

The only phone engineered by Google brings out the

0:34

audio you care about, so your

0:36

videos sound as crisp as they look.

0:38

Learn more at googlestore.com/Pixel NBA. Audio Magic

0:40

Eraser requires Google Photos app may not

0:43

work on all audio elements. Shouldn't

0:46

you be at work? When

0:49

the seagulls follow the troll,

0:51

it's because they think sergeants will

0:54

be thrown into the sea. I

0:56

will love it if we beat them. Love it. I'll

1:01

have a low-fat pizza or something like that, or a few biscuits

1:03

and some milk on a Sunday. You can

1:06

pair up if you like, and you can fucking pick

1:08

someone else to open, and you can bring your fucking

1:10

dinner. Oh,

1:15

and they give us a call from Darren Huckabee. Now,

1:18

you know him better than anybody probably. Do you

1:20

back him to score quickly, yes or no? Yes. Only

1:24

a pattern! No! Hello,

1:31

and welcome to Quickly Kevin. Will

1:33

he score? I'm Chris Gull, and we've got an

1:35

injury-ravaged squad today. Before we get onto that, here's

1:38

today's intro. It's courtesy of Daniel Fell, who says,

1:41

mind how you go, Tor André Flau, joining me today, a

1:44

very poorly Ellis James. Hello

1:46

there. I'm fine. I'm one of

1:48

those players who's went

1:50

into plays with a pain barrier. I remember, and I'm

1:53

so annoyed that I can't remember who this was, and

1:55

I might have to do a quick, tap- and

2:00

Google as Chris is speaking, even

2:03

though that's quite annoying, so he gets picked

2:05

up on the microphone. Steve Bruce talking about

2:07

some player who he kept saying, when he

2:09

was manager of Boom City, he kept saying,

2:11

ah he's old school, he's old

2:13

school, like he played with a broken knee,

2:15

but he didn't come off because I knew

2:18

he was all of our subs, so the last 25

2:20

minutes he had a broken knee and he knew it

2:22

was a broken knee when he just carried on, to

2:24

me that's old school. You know, you don't get that

2:27

anymore, do you? To me, that's

2:29

old school. I love

2:31

the old school attitude to uh, attitude,

2:33

erm, to injuries. Best example, Dave Mackay,

2:35

so hard, he broke his leg and

2:38

snapped a stamp on it to ensure

2:40

it was a clean break. Dave

2:42

Mackay would have made the maniacs choice. Recording for the

2:45

top of the Chris Coleman episode, that's all I'm saying.

2:47

I'll tell you who else would have made it, Bert

2:49

Troutman, he'd be here right now recording there with us,

2:52

with a broken neck. Yes, he had an

2:54

old school attitude to injuries. What I love

2:56

about the Bert Troutman clip is that he

2:58

dives at the feet of like

3:00

1950s strikers when you were allowed to just

3:02

kick a goalkeeper into the net and the

3:04

goal would stand. He gets

3:06

up and he just very jingly rubs his neck

3:09

and he can see it's a close check. Oh,

3:11

I couldn't need a plaster that. Oh,

3:17

I think my glands are up actually. I think

3:19

that's what it is. My glands are up. Another

3:21

one, Stuart Piers broke his leg while playing for

3:23

West Ham, trying to come back on after the

3:25

fouls and fizzied had a look at it. It's

3:28

like, come on, let me back on. You've got

3:30

a broken leg to collect psycho. Yeah, there's a

3:32

bit in his book when as a kid, he

3:34

breaks his leg playing for like a youth team

3:36

and then his youth team are playing in Liverpool

3:39

and he gets crunched in the first 10 minutes,

3:41

he's walking a bit jingly on it and

3:44

all the scopes are all watching according to

3:46

him like a soft southerner. And

3:48

then he realises that he's broken his leg. He's

3:50

been walking along with a broken leg for a

3:52

week. Aye,

3:55

apart from when it comes to introducing

3:57

and recording introductions and talk.

4:00

and tales to podcasts, I don't have a much

4:02

faster... Very much the news school.

4:04

The news school. The news school.

4:06

I've put in my hand then. I'm diving. I'm

4:09

waving at the physio. I'm waving

4:11

at the physio saying, I've got to come off. I've

4:14

got to come off. You've grazed your knee,

4:17

Ellis. No, get me off. For

4:19

the benefit of my own career, I have to come

4:21

off. Yeah, so, I mean, we've

4:23

had a hell of a day of it. An injury ravaged

4:25

squad, very much shades of Middlesbrough, November 1996, calling off games,

4:28

but with no Michael, we've had to cancel on Dean

4:30

Saunders this morning. Ellis has made it for the

4:32

top of his correspondence, but in the Chris Coleman

4:34

episode itself, we're all fully fit. And

4:37

at the end of this episode, you'll come back

4:39

to us, slightly in the future, all injury ravaged.

4:41

Yes, an awful lot happens as we speak

4:43

to Chris Coleman, which incidentally, thank you very

4:45

much for allowing me to do that. It

4:48

was one of the best hours of my

4:50

life, I think. How good is this and

4:52

how excited were you? He's such a great

4:54

company. He's such a great company. I

4:56

know that, you know, there's a school of thought,

4:58

isn't there? There aren't podcasts. They're

5:00

holding truth to power. We're meant to

5:02

be journalists. I am the least impartial

5:05

footballer. I present

5:07

to such journalists, such podcasts that you can

5:09

imagine. And

5:11

I don't ask Chris any difficult questions, but

5:13

my God, he's entertaining. It's great fun. Well,

5:16

look, we're going to take it easy on you, Ellis. Chris

5:18

Coleman's coming up, but before that, should we have a tiny

5:20

bit of correspondence? Yes, please. I'm

5:25

Jim Rosenthal and this is the

5:27

Electronic Postbag. You've got

5:29

mail. OK,

5:32

this email comes from Ifan George. OK,

5:34

there's a clue. He says, Hi, guys,

5:36

love the plot. Is that IFAN? Is

5:39

that I-F-A-N? That's I-F-A-N, yes. That's I-F-A-N, then.

5:41

Ifan, I'm glad to hear. Because the Welsh

5:43

letter F is a V and the Welsh

5:45

letter double F is an F. For

5:47

any fans of the Welsh alphabet, well, if you're a fan of

5:49

the Welsh alphabet, you know that. For any people who aren't fans

5:51

of the Welsh alphabet, you know all that. I

5:54

got hauled over the colds this week

5:56

for pronouncing Gordon Dalzell. The

5:59

correct pronunciation is... Gordon D'Elle. Did

6:01

you know this? Yes. Was it D'Elle and Pasco? I

6:03

thought it was D'Elle and Pasco.

6:05

I was going to say I only know that because it was a 1990s detective

6:08

drama called D'Elle and Pasco. I've also been

6:10

calling it D'Elle and Pasco all this time.

6:12

No one's picked me up. Never

6:15

mind. It's such a respect for

6:17

ITV, detective dramas. I've been calling

6:19

it Inspector Morsay. Inspector Morsay. It's

6:22

a mess. It's Poirot. It's

6:25

Poirot, isn't it?

6:28

Just to the side, who was it who played

6:30

Poirot? David... Sous-ché.

6:32

Sous-chet in your world. Yes,

6:35

it was Sous-chet in New Money. One of

6:37

my mates had a car crash and one

6:39

of the witnesses was David Sous-chet and

6:42

it was like an investigation and

6:44

so Poirot had to take the stand as

6:46

a witness from a mate's

6:48

car crash. How is that not

6:51

a tabloid news story? This is

6:53

my mate's number one story. That's

6:55

absolutely fantastic. Poirot.

6:59

I listened to this podcast when I'm not on

7:01

it. You must have talked about that before. I

7:03

don't remember this. How is that not something you've

7:05

become completely familiar with? Never come up with it.

7:07

Never come up. There you go. David Sous-chet was

7:09

a witness. Poirot was a witness from a mate's

7:11

traffic accident. I should add my mate was the

7:14

victim, just to be clear. This

7:16

is amazing. How good is

7:18

that? There must have

7:20

been titters in the courtroom. I

7:23

am bloody Poirot. Right, to the stand.

7:27

He's a reliable witness. He's the

7:29

most reliable. Right,

7:33

Ifan, he says, I both

7:36

love and hate this in equal measure but I'm still

7:38

not convinced Kevin Keegan was present in this town and

7:40

he's sent me a link to

7:43

the Western Telegraph. Okay, do you read the

7:45

Western Telegraph? Oh, that's the newspaper in Pembrokeshire.

7:47

I've been in the Western Telegraph. Have

7:49

you? Because I was born in Offord West.

7:51

So occasionally, if you read out in church,

7:54

like as a sort of eight-year-old, your name

7:57

was mentioned in the Western Telegraph. So it's

7:59

a new story. I've been, I've

8:01

graced the hallowed pages of the Western Telegraph.

8:04

Well, I tell you who else has graced

8:06

the pages. Kevin Keegan. And

8:09

he's kindly said this onto us because

8:11

he says how they've basically

8:13

stretched a rumour out into

8:15

a full article. Now,

8:17

I'm showing you now the Western Telegraph

8:20

website. This article is tagged with celebrities

8:22

and Cardigan. And the headline is football

8:24

legend Kevin Keegan surprise visit to Cardigan.

8:26

Cardigan is a little town otherwise known

8:28

as upper TV and it's where my

8:30

sister used to do Bali. So

8:33

I am absolutely thrilled that

8:36

Kevin Keegan had only been

8:39

there. 17, this is the article, 17 is a football

8:41

legend. Kevin Keegan showed the type of elusive skills that

8:43

won him such renown on the pitch by showing autograph

8:45

hunters a clean pair of heels during

8:48

a surprise visit to Cardigan on Friday.

8:50

What a dribbled pasta. Reports

8:52

on social media claim the former England

8:55

head coach had been spotted at Well

8:57

Pharmacy in Pendray. Am I getting that

8:59

right? Pendray. Yeah. And also at the

9:02

Guild Hall, but photographic evidence remained tantalisingly

9:04

elusive. That's weak. Seeking

9:06

recommendations for a good local restaurant. Mr

9:08

Keegan is said to have told well

9:10

wishes he would love it if someone

9:12

could point him and his family towards

9:14

a decent Italian eatery. Sensing

9:20

the possibility of snatching a late winner, the

9:22

TV side appeared to attract the silver head

9:24

maestro down to an acclaimed Italian restaurant Manucci's

9:27

on Grove New Hill, but staff there

9:33

were remaining tight lipped. I can't say exactly who

9:35

was dining with us, said a spokesman, but I

9:38

know there was definitely a family from Cheshire there.

9:40

And also there were two other high profile guests

9:42

dining with us on Friday evening, which isn't unusual.

9:44

I've had many celebrities dining with us since

9:47

opening in March, but we do respect

9:49

their privacy enough not to disclose it

9:51

on social media Keegan one TV side

9:53

nil. Interesting that because

9:55

usually I come from

9:58

West Wales, but if you go into a. say

10:01

a Chinese restaurant in any of the small towns in West

10:03

Wales, they will usually be a

10:05

picture of Mike Reed.

10:08

They might be a picture of

10:10

Nicholas Lindhurst. Which one? Frank Butcher?

10:12

Frank Butcher. They'll be a picture

10:14

of Nicholas Lindhurst. There might be

10:17

a picture of like

10:22

Pam St. Clement. Someone like that. Those kind of

10:24

people. Yeah. And they had a Chinese

10:26

there in 1987 when they were on their way

10:28

to Tenby or something. And the proprietor

10:32

thought themselves, okay well we

10:34

need a photograph to give evidence

10:36

of this. Because it

10:38

immediately gave the Chinese restaurant cachet. The

10:40

idea that the Chinese side would think,

10:42

no we're gonna respect Keegan's privacy and

10:44

then word will get around. Celebrity land.

10:51

Actually we're like clarages. We're like the Ivy.

10:53

People would be coming to Abritavian or Cardigan

10:55

for their meals because they know they won't

10:57

get hustle. They're kind of playing the long

10:59

game there, aren't they? Yeah. I'd like that.

11:02

By this time next week, Elton John will

11:04

be down there. The

11:07

Ivy will be closing its doors in no time.

11:10

I really like Abritavian or Cardigan. I went to

11:12

a funeral there a

11:14

couple years ago and it was a funeral of quite

11:16

a famous person in the town. And

11:19

I was late. People could,

11:21

because of the way I was dressed, people could work

11:23

out or people had established that I was on the

11:26

way to the funeral. So I was running through the

11:28

town. But I didn't know where the church was because

11:30

I don't know the town brilliantly. Like I've never lived

11:32

there. But people coming out

11:34

of shops going, it's up the

11:36

road, it's the alert! It's not

11:39

the middle, you have six

11:41

minutes! That's a

11:43

sad bit of Richard Coop, is from.

11:49

Quick! It's first in and

11:51

it's actually someone's wedding. Oh yeah, yeah,

11:53

yeah. There you go. Brilliant. Do

11:55

keep your emails coming in. If you want to get in touch

11:57

with the show, here's how. Get

12:01

in touch with the show. Email

12:03

hello at quicklykevin.com. Follow

12:06

us on Facebook and Twitter at Quickly

12:08

Kevin and sign up

12:10

to the mailing list at quicklykevin.com. Alright,

12:15

Chris Coleman is coming up. If

12:17

you want some extra subscriber content

12:19

to this interview, where did he

12:21

get the nickname Cookie from? Maybe a little more on

12:23

the Mohammed Al-Fayed. You can join

12:25

the Quickly Kevin fan club by signing up

12:27

on your Apple podcast app and by going

12:30

to anotherslice.com/quickly Kevin. Two bonus

12:32

episodes every month, extended versions every

12:34

episode, all that good stuff. Right,

12:36

here he is, Ellis'

12:38

favourite. I need to

12:40

say, the Al-Fayed stuff is incredible.

12:42

So if

12:45

you're not a subscriber, you've got

12:48

to change that because the Al-Fayed

12:50

stuff is elite. Top

12:52

draw stuff. Here he

12:54

comes, Quickly Kevin meets Chris Coleman.

13:04

Our guest this week was an accomplished

13:07

defender who played 160 league games for

13:09

his hometown club, Swansea City, before joining

13:11

Crystal Palace in 1991, where he went

13:13

on to be selected in the club's

13:15

centenary 11 of greatest players from their

13:17

first 100 years. Spells

13:19

of Blackburn and Fulham followed across a career that

13:22

included 32 caps for his

13:24

country, Wales. It's a pleasure to welcome

13:26

to Quickly Kevin. Ellis is very excited.

13:29

It's Chris Coleman. Hello

13:31

guys. How are you? I'm

13:33

very good, how are you? I'm

13:35

very good. I'm going to get it out there

13:37

right at the start. Thank you for giving me

13:39

the best month of my life. This is going

13:42

to be the easiest interview you've ever done in

13:44

your life because there's going to be no questions

13:46

to try and catch you out. It's

13:48

just going to be an hour of stroking your ego and then

13:50

we're all going to go home. Thank you

13:52

for allowing me to do that. I love

13:55

you. I'll

13:57

put that out there early doors. I'm in love with you.

14:00

Please just send my wife a couple of those lines because

14:02

maybe she's not using

14:04

the same vocabulary as you are, maybe in

14:06

relation to me, you know. Do

14:09

you ever have to buy a drink in Wales, Chris? You

14:11

know what? Because I was in Greece

14:13

for two years and we live in Winchester, so I go

14:15

back and see my mother and my sisters and my best

14:18

friends in 2016, now that our old

14:20

kicked off, but it's still like, I

14:22

get people coming up, which is really

14:25

nice, and because it was such a

14:27

big thing for us, as you know, as Welsh people and

14:29

the Welsh nation, and I go think,

14:31

let me be forgotten. And we just, it doesn't

14:33

matter how many times it happens to me, I

14:35

just fall straight back into it and I'm, honestly,

14:37

I could sit there and talk to anybody all

14:39

night about that situation because such

14:42

happy memories and I still get a lovely welcome here.

14:44

Does it ever get boring? Because

14:46

Gareth Edwards is asked about

14:49

Santy's Rugby every day of his

14:51

life, and he answers those

14:53

questions with the same enthusiasm that he did in

14:55

like 1973 when he's asked about

14:57

the barbarians to try whatever. When

15:00

anyone goes up to you and says, talk

15:02

to me about beating Russia 3-0 in Toulouse, does

15:04

your heart sink? Are you like, now this is

15:06

great, I love to do this. Well,

15:09

to be honest, Alice, right, if I'm out with

15:11

my friends having a BLM and not getting any

15:13

attention, I walk over to people and say, can

15:15

I just tell you what happened? Can

15:17

I just start this conversation? It

15:22

never gets boring and I could talk about it all day, I

15:24

really couldn't. I'm super,

15:26

super lucky to be

15:28

in a part of it at that time,

15:30

I think. I'll start with a more

15:32

boring football question then. Well, not

15:35

more boring, but it's slightly more serious because you were part

15:37

of a Welsh team that had

15:39

Ian Rushknit and Mark Hughes and

15:41

Dean Saunders and Neville Southall and Ryan

15:44

Giggs and Gary Speed, really,

15:47

really top players. And that team failed to

15:49

qualify for several tournaments. and

16:00

Two Superstars, really, and McBain Ramsey. Did

16:03

the teams you played in, did

16:05

that inform the way you managed

16:07

the team that you were looking

16:09

after? Or did you ever think back

16:11

to those teams that failed to qualify? I think, well, what

16:13

were they doing wrong that we can put right? I

16:16

think the, through no

16:18

fault of the managers at the time, because we

16:21

had two or three different managers, I think it

16:23

was just our preparation. And that

16:25

was down to us as players, because in

16:27

fairness to us, in those days, you

16:29

played hard, tarted hard. Yeah. So

16:33

our preparation wasn't always where it needed to

16:35

be and what it should have been. But

16:37

at the same time, the

16:39

way we prepared also harnessed an incredible

16:41

team spirit. You know, when we just

16:43

missed out with Teddy Ora,

16:46

when we lost to Romania again, but building

16:48

up to that moment, four

16:50

or five years off, it

16:52

was just an amazing experience to be without Welsh

16:55

team, because the team spirit was incredible the way

16:57

we prepared. And Teddy was a disciplinarian when he

16:59

was with Swansea. He was my first manager and

17:01

I loved him. I got a lot, hell of

17:03

a lot to thank Teddy Ora for. He

17:06

took a big chance on me and he

17:08

really molded me and shaped me as a

17:10

young 17-year-old. He gave you your

17:12

debut for Swansea and for Wales. Yes,

17:15

he did. Yeah, I was 17 for Swansea,

17:17

just turned 17. And

17:19

he gave me my debut and then he gave me

17:21

my debut for Wales, because I'd come back

17:23

from Manchester City as I was 16 and I was homesick. So

17:27

I said to my parents, I'm not going back.

17:29

I hated Manchester. And the club was too big

17:31

for me. I was surrounded by players at

17:33

the time. They were amazing. Some of these men

17:35

sent the young players, David White and

17:38

the Innsklet, Paul Moulden, Darren Beckford, Jason

17:40

Bedford. There's a lad called Paul Lake who

17:42

retired early, who was probably the best. Oh,

17:44

yeah, the goal scorer. That was

17:46

Paul Moulden, who was the goal scorer. Paul Lake.

17:49

I've still never seen anything like him as a teenage

17:51

football player. He was an amazing football player and he

17:53

retired early with a knee injury, Paul. But

17:56

man said he had a time when a pool of players, and

17:58

I remember thinking, I'm never ever going to be. anywhere near

18:00

these guys. They're so good. And I was definitely a

18:02

home sick. So I ended up going back to Swansea

18:04

and I was in limbo really

18:06

because Manchester City wouldn't release my contract. They wanted me

18:08

to stay. I wouldn't go back. Luckily,

18:11

Terry Ora spoke with Manchester

18:13

City. They did the deal for

18:15

me to go to Swansea. I actually went on trial

18:17

at the start and then Terry gave me a, in

18:20

them days it was a white TS contract. But

18:22

then I was only there for six months and

18:24

he gave me my chance in the first team

18:26

thankfully for me. So hello, a lot of thanks

18:28

to Terry Ora for it with the Wales team.

18:30

He was different I think because Yeah,

18:33

this is mentioned Ian Rush, Neville Saffold. I mean he's

18:35

just superstars in the name, world

18:37

class plays. Yeah. And Terry

18:39

managed Wales differently than the way he managed

18:41

Swansea. And I think that's a

18:43

big, big feather in his cap because

18:45

he saw what he needed to

18:47

do with Wales and that's what he did. And he

18:50

just, he gave a lot of, a

18:53

lot of responsibility to the changing room to the

18:55

senior players that I just mentioned. And basically they

18:57

ran the changing room, but they were brilliant and

18:59

the team's play was excellent. We missed out to

19:01

Romania that will haunt us

19:04

forever. Yeah. When I became the manager, the

19:06

players is a different generation. Just

19:09

things differently prepared differently. The

19:12

whole football training

19:15

scene was completely different to 20

19:17

years earlier. So, and

19:19

they were already being labeled as the golden generation.

19:22

The Joe Allens and the Ramses

19:24

and the Bails and I always used to fight against

19:26

that at the start because I thought

19:28

they could go on and prove to be the best thing we've

19:31

ever had. But they hadn't done that yet. And I wanted them

19:33

to go and do that. We would only do

19:35

that by qualifying, I suppose, because we'd never done it. So

19:38

I was kind of different, probably with our

19:40

players, when I was a manager than when I

19:42

was a player. And the way

19:44

we did things for Wales, it was pretty much choke

19:46

and cheese really. Flexibility is

19:48

great. That's why there's yoga. Flexibility

19:50

for your insurance coverage is great

19:53

too. That's why there's UnitedHealthcare insurance

19:55

plans. Underwritten by Golden Rule Insurance

19:57

Company, UnitedHealthcare insurance plans offer flexible.

20:00

budget-friendly coverage for medical, vision, dental,

20:02

and more. One of these

20:04

plans may be right for you if you're,

20:06

say, between jobs, coming off your parents' plan,

20:08

turning a side hustle into a full hustle,

20:10

or even missed open enrollment. Want

20:12

more flexibility? Find out more

20:15

about UnitedHealthcareInsurancePlans at uh1.com. Introducing

20:21

Royal Caribbean's newest ship, Icon

20:23

of the Seas, the ultimate

20:25

family vacation. The ultimate

20:27

six slides, eight neighborhoods, zero

20:29

compromise vacation. The ultimate never The ultimate never

20:31

done that, can't wait to do it vacation. The

20:34

ultimate chilling by a different pool every day

20:36

of the week vacation. This is the Icon

20:38

of Vacations. This is the Icon of Vacations. Icon of the Seas,

20:41

Icon of the Seas, arriving in 2024. Cook

20:43

today. Book today. Come

20:45

seek the Royal Caribbean. Ships Registry

20:47

Bahamas. Apple Card is the credit card

20:50

created by Apple. You earn 3% daily

20:52

cash back upfront when you use it to buy

20:54

a new iPhone 15, AirPods, or

20:57

any products at Apple. And you

20:59

can automatically grow your daily cash at 4.15%

21:01

annual percentage yield when

21:04

you open a high yield savings account. Apply

21:06

for Apple Card in the Wallet app on

21:08

iPhone. Apple Card is subject to

21:11

credit approval. Savings is available to Apple Card

21:13

owners subject to eligibility. Savings accounts by Goldman

21:15

Sachs Bank USA, member FDIC, terms apply. So

21:18

you went back to Swansea in 1987. Southampton

21:21

Vitch is such an iconic stadium, but I

21:23

wondered what were the training facilities like? What

21:26

were you training on? What were the pitch? What were the

21:28

facilities? At the end of the times, because

21:30

we trained basically anywhere we could get. We

21:32

didn't have a training pitch. We didn't have

21:34

a training centre. We basically said, where

21:37

are we training this morning? And Teddy

21:39

would say, OK, we had a shot where

21:41

the ground's gone over in Landarsi, in Swansea.

21:43

So we drive over there and we train

21:45

there. The next morning, we'd go, where are

21:47

we training? We're up the Movers Stadium today, trainer.

21:49

And we'd train there. Next day, where we're training,

21:51

we're down in Fairwood. Wherever

21:54

we could get a bit of grass, we'd

21:56

go insane. And it was literally, I mean,

21:59

the training kit. A lot of

22:01

times there wasn't enough to go around and one

22:04

or two of the guys would be training in their

22:06

own socks, not football socks, like the socks that they

22:08

brought into the training that day.

22:11

Because the socks, there wasn't enough pairs of socks

22:13

to go. It was incredible really. But when

22:15

I think back, I got nothing but fun. We

22:18

had nothing. There was no money in football, not where

22:20

we were. It was just the

22:22

honor of playing professional football. And especially if he

22:24

was a swan boy playing for Swansea growing up

22:27

as a Swansea boy, that was the

22:29

biggest honor next to playing for Wales

22:31

that I ever got. But yeah, we didn't have

22:33

a training ground, Chris, is the honest answer to that. When

22:35

you're talking about the lack of

22:38

training ground, I remember talking to Alan Curtis

22:40

who played for swans in

22:42

the early 80s. And he was saying that he used to train behind

22:44

the North Bank. Just play games behind

22:46

the North Bank. Yeah, we did that. Sometimes behind

22:48

the North Bank, we can't say right, we're behind

22:50

the North Bank because we can't get anywhere this

22:52

morning and we'd have a fire on the side,

22:54

on the concrete behind the North Bank. It

22:57

was always like that time when it was right, like

22:59

somebody kicked the ball and go into the toilets. Voted

23:04

the worst toilets in the football league as well. So

23:06

you wouldn't want to play with that ball again. Well,

23:08

yeah, and listen, I've been in there once or twice

23:10

and listen, it deserved that ball. And

23:13

then of course, you bring the ball out of the toilets, only wanted

23:15

to edit, you know what I mean? But

23:19

of course, you just got on with it. That's just the way

23:21

it was, you know. A warm up

23:23

was up and down the terrace for the North Bank.

23:26

Yeah. Ten times up and down the terrace and then

23:28

round the back or five a side on the concrete.

23:30

On the concrete? It's great. Well,

23:33

Kurt told me that they were playing them versus

23:35

Wales five a side, round the back of the

23:37

North Bank on the concrete, between the terrace

23:40

itself and the turnstiles. And

23:42

there might not have been in those days, but sort

23:44

of by the end, before we moved to the Liberty,

23:47

there was like the Mel Nurse powers back there. But

23:50

there was like broken glass on the floor and

23:52

all sorts of stuff. And Kurt said, because he

23:54

was England versus Wales, we were all really competitive,

23:56

so doing slighted tackles on the concrete and all

23:58

sorts of stuff. You were

24:01

at the club by about 87. Yeah.

24:07

Five years previously, we'd come sixth in the

24:09

first division, having been top

24:11

until March. Did you feel

24:14

like you were joining the club five years too late? No,

24:16

I don't know. I was just so happy to be joining

24:18

the club. And

24:23

then when I broke into the first

24:25

team, the dream come true, then it

24:27

wouldn't matter if they were playing in

24:29

the local public of a Swandee City. I'd

24:31

been standing on that very terrace, the North

24:33

Bank, watching them in those days. On

24:36

curd days, Robbie James, my favorite

24:38

players, you know, Badly Lewis, Nigel

24:40

Stevens, Sonola, Wyndham Evans, all like

24:43

the homegrown boys. I was speaking

24:45

to Nigel Stevens about six months

24:47

ago, terrific boy, great boy, Nigel,

24:49

aged 11. When I joined

24:51

Swandee, he was still there, Nigel. Badly

24:54

Lewis also. I worshipped him. And then when I was

24:56

sharing the dressing with him, for me, it was a

24:58

dream come true. I'd watched him, you know, from the

25:00

late 70s to the early 80s when they had that

25:02

run. When the bus

25:04

went around Swandee, when they bought promotion, it was

25:07

the first division, then it was the Premier League.

25:09

Yeah, I'd be pressed. Me and my best mate,

25:11

Bucky, he's got my best mate's best man in

25:13

my wedding. We were following the bus,

25:15

and John Toshack saw me, because I played in Swandee

25:17

School Boys and 11s with his son

25:19

Cameron. Oh, yeah. So John Toshack saw

25:22

me, and he stopped the bus, and he called me

25:24

on at the bus. No! Wow.

25:27

Yeah, as a young boy, you can imagine what that

25:29

did, yeah. It was a pretty amazing feeling, that. The

25:31

other weird thing about those early years of Swandee, you're

25:33

in the third tier of English football, but you win

25:36

the Welsh Cup a couple of times. So

25:38

that means in 1989, you qualify for the

25:40

Cup Winners' Cup, you play Panath and Icos.

25:42

And then a couple of years later, you're

25:44

taking on Monaco, Arsene Wenger, George Weyer, Yuri

25:47

Dukhayev. So you got this

25:49

one hand, you're in the third tier of English football,

25:51

kicking football into the worst toilets in the league systems.

25:53

Then you're in Monaco. How was

25:55

that as an experience? Well, I was there

25:57

for Panath and Icos, but when they played Monaco, I'd

25:59

already played. move to Palace. So I

26:01

missed Monaco. Palace and

26:03

I got experience was just incredible.

26:06

It was incredible playing in Europe.

26:08

We played in the Olympic Stadium there. And

26:11

I think we played there in August. It was

26:13

boiling hot. There was like 60,000 people. And

26:15

they went to clean up and we were

26:18

all like going, oh, come on, Christ's. You can't be

26:20

losing six or seven. You know, it's trying to knickerball

26:22

or something. We ended up scoring two

26:24

goals late. We lost three, too. So we

26:26

brought them back to the vetch and it

26:28

was amazing. And to be

26:30

fair to the Palace and I got supporters, it

26:33

was thousands of them at the vetch. Then it was

26:35

an amazing atmosphere. And we ended up can be three,

26:37

three, three. But that whole European experience

26:39

like for me, I was only 20, I think

26:42

19 or 20 was unbelievable. It's

26:46

unbelievable experience. It really was European

26:48

football. And because like what he touched

26:50

on as well, bearing in mind,

26:52

we were OK, probably then

26:54

the facilities had improved a little bit. But just

26:57

a couple of years earlier, we were training behind

26:59

the North Bank and we didn't have enough training

27:01

and kept to go around, you know, and it

27:04

was that difficult for the club

27:06

financially at the time where they nearly went

27:08

out of business or meant to

27:11

be playing European football was special. Yeah, it

27:13

was amazing. It's a very funny picture, which

27:15

I cannot find on the Internet. Of

27:18

Doug Sharp, who was the chairman at the time, I

27:21

think he ran a building firm, something like that. He

27:23

did. Yeah, yeah. Sharp and Ed. You know,

27:26

he wasn't a rich man by

27:28

like football owner standards. There's

27:30

a picture of him and like Prince Rainier.

27:39

What planet do they know each

27:41

other? They have

27:43

to like a tray of sandwiches. It's

27:49

just so funny. Because Muth had

27:51

beaten Atlanta in 1987. I

27:54

remember that. Newport County had got to the

27:56

court finals of the Cup and his Cup in

27:59

about 81. The Welsh

28:01

clubs, the Welsh clubs who won the

28:03

Welsh Cup were able to go on

28:05

these amazing European Cup winner's cup journeys

28:07

like Cardiff City beat Real Madrid. Barrie

28:09

played against Porto, didn't he? Yes.

28:12

Dynamo Kiev as well, they had some really

28:14

good results, Barrie. Yeah, it was

28:17

amazing. I think it was great for the

28:19

Welsh. I mean, Mirtha, what Mirtha did against

28:21

Atlanta, I mean, Mirtha had a really good

28:23

team, really good. The striker,

28:25

Dye Webley, was an excellent player. Well, because we played

28:27

him in the Welsh a couple of times and he

28:29

remembered him ripping up me and Andrew Melville

28:31

and he was a really good player. Yeah.

28:34

He should have played professionally, Dye Webley, he was an excellent

28:36

player, he really was. But what they

28:38

did against Atlanta and with that whole experience, really

28:40

like I think give everybody a taste for it

28:42

as well, you know. Well, they were the

28:44

first British team to play in Italian teams

28:47

since Iceland, because the Welsh clubs

28:49

were still allowed into Europe, but obviously the English

28:51

clubs were banned because of Iceland. So

28:53

they played Atlanta. If I think I'm right in

28:55

saying this, if not only when the league that

28:58

had played for half a league in Maradona would

29:00

have been a tenor in the past. Oh wow,

29:02

it was that. Oh, what a shame.

29:06

I mean, what is it? Absolute tragedy

29:08

that that's laughing. Oh no. Me

29:12

and Andrew Melville were big friends with Ronnie Walton,

29:14

who was at Swansea for probably 10 years, Ronnie

29:16

Teddy, I was a success student and he was

29:18

a reserve team coach and loved

29:20

his cricket and he was always a part of

29:22

the Hoover, the works that he invited me and

29:24

Andrew Melville up to Murtha once. And

29:27

I got to tell you, it was an experience I

29:29

will never, ever forget for the rest of

29:31

my life. It's Penn and Darrin Park

29:33

is one of my favorite

29:36

football grounds in Britain, I think,

29:38

because it's like a micro version of the vetch

29:40

of Swansea's old ground. Yeah. It's

29:42

a little like a proper football ground, you know, sort

29:44

of great terracing and everything. It's a great place to

29:46

watch football. A difficult place to play football, I'll tell

29:48

you that. Yes, I can imagine. Yeah. I

29:51

went to watch the Swans play Murtha in a

29:53

pre-season friendly once. Because Cardiff

29:55

at the Bob Bank, Swansea at

29:57

the North Bank and Murtha at the Wank

29:59

Bank. So I was stood on the... And

30:04

he was standing on the work bank, watching

30:06

the game, and I looked down. And

30:09

it was a pigeon, but it had been

30:11

decapitated next time. You

30:18

don't get that at the Emirates. Every

30:21

time we played there, there was always a

30:23

woman in the tunnel. She always

30:25

used to say, as I was coming out, and

30:29

I wouldn't look. Every time

30:31

I look, she say, Every

30:36

time we played there, same

30:38

bloody woman. Even if

30:41

I glanced in a direction, you're a wanker. I

30:44

don't know who she was, but she didn't like

30:46

me. I

30:51

want to ask a bit more about the vetch, because

30:53

it's such an iconic ground. I've read that, Chris, you

30:55

described the daubies between Cardiff and

30:57

Swansea. You said once that you could

30:59

smell the hatred at the vetch. Before

31:03

those Swansea-Cardiff daubies, you couldn't sleep. What was

31:05

the atmosphere like at the vetch on days

31:07

like that? I remember playing

31:09

one game, right? It's me and Andy Mabelle, he used to

31:11

pick me up. He lived about a

31:14

mile away from me mouth. I lived in May,

31:16

he lived in town, and he used to pick me up. We

31:18

were on the way, we were playing Cardiff. Driving

31:21

along the front, there was the Cardiff, Bad Boys

31:23

in Swansea, Bad Boys, and they were running into

31:25

the sea, trying to get away

31:27

from each other. There were people fighting

31:29

over cars, there were cars overturned. And

31:32

it was 11.30 kick off in the morning. And

31:34

I said, this is about nine o'clock in the morning. I

31:37

remember thinking, what? Jesus. I

31:39

remember thinking, the mouth, he said, look, keep

31:41

your head down, because we couldn't park outside.

31:44

There was no car park outside. And you

31:46

remember the players' entrance was between

31:48

two houses. It's still there, actually. Yeah. Yeah. We

31:50

had the park away, and then walk, and me

31:52

and Mabelle were trying to keep our head down,

31:54

because we thought, if we bump into any of

31:56

the bluebirds there, we're not even going to make

31:58

it to the game. Oh my God.

32:01

Glad he hated each other. Hated each other.

32:03

The atmosphere of the Vetch and when we used

32:05

to play at Ninium was, it was an amazing

32:08

atmosphere. It really was. I played all around the

32:10

world. But because if you throw

32:12

them onto your Cardiff and

32:14

then you sample that and you know how much it

32:16

means to both, those games, unbelievable.

32:19

I suppose some players

32:22

would shrink in those circumstances, wouldn't they? I

32:24

know there's puffed their chests out. Yeah, I've

32:26

seen it, Elles. Yeah, I never blamed them

32:28

because it's not easy. Other

32:31

players, you thrive in that. In

32:34

every moment in that game, you are

32:36

right on the edge. You can't make

32:38

a mistake. You've got to get everything

32:40

right. You've got to be at least

32:42

winning as many 50-50 challenges as your

32:44

opponent. And that sounds like

32:47

me being a dinosaur because our football is

32:49

a bit different now. But in those games,

32:51

it's still all about that. Sleeves rolled up.

32:53

It's you against him, whoever he may be.

32:55

And you can't then get on top of

32:57

you in those games. You can't get anything

33:00

wrong. So it is a lot

33:02

of pressure, but the atmosphere is just incredible.

33:04

So when we played Belgium, for instance, because

33:06

we played them in qualification for Euro 2016

33:08

and then played them at the tournament

33:10

itself, we seem to

33:13

be drawn against Belgium all the time. We

33:15

haven't played France in a competitive game ever. I've only

33:17

ever played them in friendlies. But Belgium,

33:20

we play every certain days or so.

33:22

And after, for as long as I've

33:24

been alive, Kevin De Bruyne has said

33:26

quite recently, I'm just bored of playing

33:28

Wales. We play them all the time.

33:30

He's bored of losing against Wales. That's

33:32

what he said. Yeah. So the one

33:34

near where Gareth scored in Cardiff in

33:36

qualification for 2016, then obviously

33:38

in the quarterfinal, we beat them 3-1. Those

33:41

games, because it's 2016, but

33:43

it's quite a football's different. Is it

33:46

just technical stuff you're telling the players? Or

33:49

does a little bit of Chris Coleman, who played in

33:51

those Derby games in the late 80s, come

33:53

back and say, right then, you need to

33:55

smash into play, Neil. I couldn't

33:57

even hide that. If I tried it, I just... comes

34:00

up, comes to the forefront, and it doesn't

34:02

matter how good you are technically. We can

34:04

be as technically and look at some of

34:06

the plays we had, outstanding players, world-class players.

34:10

They still had to do the other side of it. They still have to

34:12

have that passion and they still have to, we still

34:14

have to get on top of the opponents. We have to do

34:16

the nasty dirty stuff. My big thing

34:19

when I talk about wheels, I say we're

34:21

a nice team but we're not streetwise. Yes,

34:23

we play against Serbia or Bulgaria or Croatia

34:26

and winning 1-0 for them, they

34:28

would do anything they possibly could to hold

34:31

on to that 1-0. They didn't

34:33

care what they did and we just weren't like

34:35

that, mentally weren't on that in that

34:37

same vibration and we had to get to that vibration

34:39

and in the end we were, we didn't

34:41

care how we did it. We didn't always play

34:43

great football. Sometimes we're a little bit ugly, hard

34:46

to beat. We did a job against

34:48

Northern Ireland, we didn't play great but we did what

34:50

we needed to do to take it over the line.

34:52

So there's plenty of games where, yeah, it was sleeves

34:55

rolled up and we were

34:57

on the verge of in terms of

34:59

pushing the rules, overstepping the

35:01

mark at times. Yeah, we did that gamesmanship, yeah, we

35:03

did that but we had to do that because first

35:05

we had to catch up to the teams who

35:08

were doing better than us and when we arrived there, when

35:10

we qualified, it was what we're going to do now to

35:12

stay here. So pretty much we

35:14

needed to do what we needed to do and

35:17

that was the message. People look at all

35:19

the clips would be of Bailor Scoring or Ramsey

35:21

or some beautiful football. There

35:24

was another side to our game that we were good

35:26

at and that was winning ugly when we needed to

35:28

and that was everybody defending,

35:30

Bailor also, in

35:32

our own arc, everybody scrapping, fighting.

35:35

We had to do that because all the

35:37

top teams do that. Why shouldn't we do that? So

35:40

you're saying that Bobby Gould didn't add

35:42

that to the Welsh national philosophy in

35:44

his diamond charge. I'm going

35:47

to pass on that question. I'll

35:51

tell you this, I'll tell you this for Bobby,

35:54

when he came to Wales, he got successful Wimbledon

35:56

in Portland. I think

35:58

maybe he underestimated international. football a

36:00

little bit because it's not like domestic football. He

36:03

tried his best. He did try his best. And

36:06

sometimes the results, they don't come. And sometimes you

36:08

have a clash of personalities. This happened to

36:10

me and this happened to most managers. And of

36:12

course, there's some great stories about Goldie. Now,

36:16

because I'm a manager myself, I look back and I

36:18

think maybe in one or two of those moments, I

36:20

would have tried to help him a bit more than

36:22

I did. And I'm sure some of the other lads

36:25

who have gone on to be coaches or managers would

36:28

say the same as me. Sometimes he

36:30

didn't help himself, but there was a certain situation

36:32

where we heard them more. But he used to

36:34

sing the Addams family theme when he walked into

36:36

the room. Is that true? He

36:39

had an eyebrow, didn't he? The man who did. So

36:42

we used to call him the wolf. But he

36:44

heard me and Giggsy at the back of the bus

36:46

once calling him a wolf. And

36:48

he pulled us before we

36:50

went training. He said, no, you too. I hear

36:52

you calling me a wolf. And

36:55

we're both standing there like Indians. And he said, and

36:57

I know you call me a wolf because I'm very

36:59

cunning. And we were like, yeah, that's what

37:02

we call you a wolf. Nothing to

37:04

do with that eyebrow in front of me. But

37:07

that was Bobby. He had good things as well. He had good

37:09

things as well. He had a good art. But

37:11

you know, managing myself, it hasn't always worked. And sometimes

37:13

that's the way it goes. But unfortunately

37:15

at the end, we were

37:18

playing a way to Italy and we lost 4-1 heavily.

37:20

It was the last game for him. And he came

37:22

in and he said, right, guys, I'm

37:24

going to finish up taking you as far as I

37:26

can. And

37:29

we were doing something the same fucking right you have.

37:31

We were 30th and you arrived and now we're under

37:33

20th. We can't go fucking further. I

37:37

just want to look back after you. Sorry for him. A

37:39

very young Craig Bellamy scored the winner in

37:42

Denmark. We beat them two and away and

37:44

he scored with the winner later on. And

37:47

then we beat Belarus, our homie won back

37:49

to back. Yeah. But everyone is crowding around

37:51

Bellamy to congratulate him. I think it might

37:53

be in Craig's book. Apparently James

37:55

Hunter said to him, you fucking

37:57

prick. You've kept him in a job for another.

38:00

six months ago. Probably,

38:04

yeah. No one

38:06

did know. Yeah. You probably come out with

38:09

something like that. But listen, Dino, like

38:11

when Dino played for Wales and every game

38:13

he was Dino was balls out every game.

38:15

Oh, yeah. He loved playing for West Dino.

38:17

And he played for Bobby, ran his socks

38:20

off for Bobby also. But sometimes it's a

38:22

clash and it doesn't work. But I do

38:24

remember those games where Bella scored away the

38:26

Denmark and then we beat Bella Ussahum. And

38:29

all of a sudden the campaign was because normally what

38:31

we used to do was come good

38:33

late and it was too late. We win the

38:35

last couple of games and everybody get excited. But

38:37

that was pretty early on when people are getting

38:39

excited. But I think we went and we lost

38:41

the way to Switzerland and we

38:43

lost somewhere to somewhere else. And then it went south.

38:45

But that whole experience, talking about

38:47

Dino as like I

38:49

mentioned earlier about the whole terriotta when

38:52

he was in charge, that's what I

38:54

think. So there's the heartbeat of it

38:57

all. He was like such a funny

38:59

lad, you know what I mean? And he was always telling

39:01

stories. He'd always be coming

39:03

and telling stories about it. There was a

39:05

player called Billy Whitehurst, who's a legendary player.

39:07

Are you very hard sort of player? Yeah,

39:09

yeah, very hard lad, Billy. And so Dino

39:11

would be telling the stories and we'd all

39:13

be crowding around. Dean and he was the

39:15

heart of it. And even when Bobby came,

39:18

that never changed, you know, because Dino loved

39:20

playing for Wales. I know there's

39:22

stories about some of the things Dino said in

39:24

those moments with Bobby. Yeah, I'm not

39:26

going to deny that some of them

39:28

things didn't happen, but he still gave his best because

39:30

it was for Wales, you know, he playing for Wales

39:33

at the end of the game. And Russian Hughes had

39:35

retired by that point. So he was kind

39:37

of carrying the team, really. Dean O'Hare.

39:39

Him and Ryan when Ryan was available.

39:42

That's right. Ryan dispersed on the scene as well.

39:44

Yeah. And I think John Arson was just coming

39:46

through. Yes. But Bobby didn't like John Arson. We

39:48

should have played him far more and I never

39:50

understood why that was. Yeah, I don't know why.

39:52

I remember John as when he was playing for

39:54

Luthen and then he went to Arson, John was

39:56

outstanding. John was so much more than what

39:59

people look at. a big target man and a

40:01

very tough lad, but he was much

40:03

better than that. He was that plus

40:05

he was a very, very good player, you know.

40:07

And yeah, John should have played a lot more

40:09

than he did in the early days. Were you there

40:12

when Gould and Hudson

40:14

had the wrestle? I was going

40:16

to ask about that. Yeah,

40:18

and we decided to sort Bobbie out a

40:20

bit. Because I know ours. I was playing

40:23

centre back with Eric Young and we were

40:25

playing against Luton and like Eric wasn't shy, you

40:28

know, through a physical team palace. But we

40:30

knew not to push it with arts because he had that

40:32

switch. And so when Bobbie

40:35

said, right, get a circle around to all the players,

40:37

we were like, right, what's he doing here? What's going

40:39

on here? He said, but form a circle. And

40:42

he was standing in the middle of the circle, Bobbie.

40:44

So we all formed a circle and he said, wow,

40:46

come on, called John. And John said, Bobbie, I'm not

40:48

in the mood for this. He did say I'm not

40:50

in the mood for this. Bobbie's like,

40:52

come on, Cocker, let's get this out of the way. And

40:55

I was thinking, oh, gee, I remember you're thinking,

40:57

where's the doc? What's the medical

40:59

team? Because in about 30

41:01

seconds, we may be having to like revive

41:04

Bobbie because I have to just lose in a

41:06

second. To be

41:08

fair to John, he didn't. He went rigid John and

41:10

like Bobbie was playing with him. But John caught him,

41:13

caught him in his nose and it was a bit of blood. Bobby's

41:16

nose. And as soon as that

41:18

happened, Bobby just went, all right, let's get back

41:20

to the five to side. A week later, we

41:22

were playing against Italy. So, you know, those are

41:24

the preparations for the Italian game. The

41:27

manager and the striker were having a

41:29

straight nap. Amazing.

41:34

In John's book, he says I started

41:36

wrestling with him a bit. And even though he was

41:38

in his fifties, I could tell he was still strong

41:40

and the whole thing was just really dignified. I

41:44

remember John trying to restrain

41:46

himself. He didn't want to like, and Bobby

41:48

was getting into him. But John was like,

41:50

but John did catch him. He knows. Wow.

41:54

Blood on his nose. Because I remember we

41:56

all went, whoa. It was

41:58

like a second from. and really bad,

42:01

but then it all started laughing, thank

42:03

God. That's how me and Chris sort

42:05

of misunderstand the soundings on this podcast.

42:07

We meet up in a central London

42:09

location and have a rest. The

42:11

legacy of Gauls continues to this day. I want

42:14

to ask about Steve Coppol, who went to Palace

42:16

91. Steve Coppol,

42:18

just when you joined, he'd just finished third.

42:20

They'd won the full members cup, which was the Zenith

42:22

Data Systems. Palace were riding such a big high at

42:25

the time. What was it like to walk into that

42:27

dressing room with the likes of Ian Wright and Mark

42:29

Brighton? Yeah, I was nervous because you just

42:31

mentioned two names, Wrighty and Brighty, who were like

42:33

synonymous with Crystal Palace success. They were, you know,

42:36

the partnership those two guys had, they were excellent.

42:38

You know, in the days, everybody played 4-4-2 mainly.

42:42

And Palace were excellent 4-4-2 team there. Like

42:45

two centre backs was Andy

42:47

Thorne, who was an excellent centre back. With

42:49

Eric Young, two midfielders was

42:52

Jeff Thomas and Andy Gray, who

42:54

were incredible energy. Both played

42:56

for England. And then the two

42:58

strikers were Wright and Bright. And England was

43:00

Nigel Martin, who was an excellent player. Yeah,

43:03

the whole spine of the Palace team was

43:05

just super. And the front two, that's incredible,

43:07

isn't it? Wright and Bright. Ah, they were

43:09

excellent. Yeah, they were. And the two wingers,

43:11

Eddie Magoldrick, John Salarco, were excellent players. Two

43:14

full backs was Richard Shaw and John Humphrey. So

43:17

it was a really good Palace team. And

43:19

I remember arriving, I was in the reserves,

43:22

Galaselski was in the reserves, Stan Collemore was

43:24

in the reserves. He'd

43:26

really assembled a good team, Stevie Copley. And his

43:28

number two was Alan Smith. And they were a

43:30

great partnership. They were together 10 years. But

43:33

Palace at the time was a very, very good team.

43:36

I can't remember if it was Richard Shaw,

43:38

John Salarco. One of them was eligible for

43:40

Wales and said no. I don't

43:42

know. I don't think it was Shaw's, huh? Because I'm still

43:44

friends with Richard. Maybe it's Alarco. Because he

43:46

came to Swansea on Long John. Yes,

43:48

he did. Yes, I'd forgotten about that. He was an

43:51

excellent player. And then he had a bad knee injury.

43:54

And After this knee injury, he never quite...

43:56

He's still a good player, but he never

43:58

quite got back to... Maybe

44:00

would have if he hadn't about because it

44:02

was a cruciate ligament. in them days it

44:04

was still is but in them days it

44:06

was touch and go where they play again

44:08

be built back but before it was our

44:10

flight was outstanding player Savile assessing their the

44:13

softest injuries that now you will definitely recover

44:15

from but back then and now yeah six

44:17

to eight months for the be now in

44:19

them days as he was out for over

44:21

a year with a teacher ligament and then

44:23

if you remember the not long after gathered

44:25

it is in the yeah weaponry yeah acts

44:27

as a result for year the think so

44:29

they. Were really bad injuries in them days. Sometimes

44:31

the guys in get back with don't go back.

44:35

Prior to that injury was. I

44:37

think to play that ten times for England

44:39

John he was outstanding Use absolutely outstanding. Plenty

44:42

quick when know we're here we're left with

44:44

right foot dynamic gags me good plan. Is

44:47

interesting the in that Palisades cook our

44:49

South Guy featuring the match any self

44:51

you to Wales manager type bop unsullied

44:53

is a cell has pa about that.

44:55

yeah and if you seen as back

44:57

in them days chris. You. A

44:59

lot to handle for some the said you to me

45:01

going on about us because he was more sensible. Them

45:03

a d saw Gareth could make a feature. managed to

45:06

do you think about that Led gotta is only one

45:08

be the only one. I have all of us and

45:10

even when I was in the was. Dressing

45:12

on my son room The Speeds and I

45:14

didn't think Speeds would be a court building.

45:17

I would be a court because when you

45:19

young any what you think you're gonna play

45:21

forever you never think so. Came and plenty

45:23

of ten or fifteen years when you twenty

45:25

and even retired a thirty five delegates. that's

45:27

another lifetime of you. don't even think. And

45:30

you never luckily tell him think that he could

45:33

be a potential quarter manager because he so busy

45:35

drain and every day and up in the time

45:37

of you like specific or what I did enjoy

45:39

you don't think about of the one I look

45:41

back. I think either.

45:43

Southgate was always a sensible boy, was

45:45

an intelligent boy that was kind himself

45:48

that he worked for. Professional. So.

45:50

Yeah, you gotta probably had the tools

45:52

to go on to become a manager.

45:56

Speeds. Be a possibly more

45:58

than me he was more sense. Then

46:00

I was but it is difficult to

46:02

tell but status than any. an amazing

46:04

job with England. This is funny as

46:06

well. When I was when we came

46:08

back from France I think he just

46:10

got the England job on. I bumped

46:12

into him up Bbc awards. Remember

46:14

saying to him because Roy and just

46:17

been the manager and in gallons taken

46:19

or than what we know rosa for

46:21

for to mammal four four four one

46:23

one call it what you want. But.

46:25

I sent a gallon. You want to

46:27

start can actually in the Batman on it

46:29

was lying because we will place in the

46:32

back and and is a started lazy the

46:34

backseat got it from yeah it's illegal to

46:36

been forty two I sports psychologists with a

46:38

handful to exists. Within

46:41

successfully send me a message on

46:43

my sincere Bobby birthday as. Thanks

46:47

for the tip. See that an amazing job season

46:49

and maybe Jack? If

46:51

you're getting ready to do your holiday

46:53

shopping at places like Walmart, Macys, or

46:55

even Expedia Mates are you had to

46:58

ratchet And first Rocket Unhappy says build

47:00

an whatever you're fine for the holidays,

47:02

getting gifts for friends and family, get

47:05

some cash back for yourself. With Rockets

47:07

on you can hang pass back on

47:09

top of the biggest sales of the

47:11

season. see that the most savings place

47:14

Sea lions asked if home decor, party

47:16

outfits and a trip to see or

47:18

fam artists years. Just start your shopping

47:21

online. Or into the Racket an app

47:23

and you'll get your costs back payments

47:25

through Pay Pal or check. Partnering with

47:27

over three thousand seven hundred stores, wrap

47:30

it in, gets paid for sending them

47:32

south birth and then shares the money

47:34

with you. Now that's our Ha you

47:37

T and doing for free at Rocket

47:39

in.com Or get The Racket an app.

47:42

Hey, it's Ryan Reynolds, owner and user of

47:44

Mint Mobile, with a special holiday message. If

47:46

you sign up now for three months, you

47:48

get three months free on every one of

47:50

our plans, even unlimited. Now, I realize this

47:52

is more of a holiday offer than it

47:55

is a holiday message, but if you read

47:57

between the lines, you can see a message

47:59

in there. It says, we love you. Visit

48:01

mintmobile.com/switch for the offer. Limited time new

48:03

customer offer. Activate within 45 days. Additional taxes,

48:05

fees, and restrictions apply. Unlimited customers using more than

48:07

40 gigabytes per month will experience lower speeds. Video

48:09

streams at 480p. See mintmobile.com for

48:11

details. The. Holiday Start sheer a

48:14

croaker with a variety of options to

48:16

celebrate traditions old and new. You could

48:18

do a classic herb roasted turkey or

48:20

spice it up to make turkey tacos.

48:22

Serve. Up a go to shrimp cocktails

48:25

or use simple Truth Wild caught shrimp

48:27

for your first cage. and result of

48:29

make creamy mac and cheese or a

48:31

spinach artichoke. Fondue from our selection of

48:34

Murray sees no matter how you shop,

48:36

Progress has all the freshest ingredients. To

48:38

embrace all your holiday traditions. Kroger

48:40

fresh for every one. Great

48:43

marriages in your career is off the policy.

48:45

The Palace in December Ninety five to go

48:47

to brought but we're reigning champions at the

48:49

time. Kenny Dalglish yeah, that was addressing the

48:52

me littered with quantity plays again him and

48:54

organ to address and it was like baby

48:56

birds and she woods or than cheetah. Was.

48:59

Just on another level the sun was

49:01

a very good player, can slow was

49:03

yeah he's great player service a measly

49:06

admission and plays the which is such

49:08

a good team you know Stewart rib

49:10

lead. To. Some will concede to

49:13

the bestselling is. At the

49:15

time they were amazing. Colin interested in that

49:17

scene Corridor Energy is Colin Registry is a

49:19

black Boom what he did his any said

49:21

the back. In. The premier league's

49:23

of stand for to see his use. Amazing

49:26

He really was and we had a be

49:28

young play in peace. Were an

49:30

injury pc otherwise he would have ended a

49:32

boon to Man united or someone that is

49:34

excellent. The and psp like six or five

49:37

fast but in the egg with new the

49:39

ball and in the at an injury funny

49:41

little bit warmer jones lot of sometimes please

49:43

come back and we struggled to find that

49:46

on a Pc when on on a but

49:48

the really played west bound by saying the

49:50

muslim still good player we was a twenty

49:52

twenty one is outstanding. Had two years at

49:54

Blackburn with Colon and really with amazing Mm

49:57

organ in that dressing and really my thoughts

49:59

while the. The this includes a synthetic

50:01

rubber timid last five mil the week

50:03

before you join tried to commentary. Well.

50:06

Of the funny thing was caused by I

50:08

was in a room with learn Atkinson and

50:10

I was either going to go to commentary

50:12

was in water Blackburn and in two days

50:14

before proven to be black when anonymous and

50:17

the me a thorn little boy Blackburn crisis

50:19

He said lot of good player in place

50:21

for me every week He said blackmun's going

50:23

amazing squad he will play speed may not

50:25

play every week. He said want to come

50:28

the Coventry but it was his transport museum.

50:30

Good rail links yes this is less and

50:32

lives up. There was a photo editor but

50:34

I am going to black. Been. Signed,

50:37

Sealed. And an ama

50:40

missing in ah, right. Yeah

50:43

bladder was a great club he was a great

50:45

club the people up that it doesn't in the

50:47

northwest for about three years in that he would

50:49

where people really good people. He was

50:52

chancellor who rejected advances, some at the

50:54

Esa dabbling with our laws it yeah

50:56

and I was one of those Palace

50:58

players. That must mean early doors. Yeah

51:00

yeah cause I think you missed a

51:02

little for Nigeria's well but the into

51:04

the playing for England Friday was setting.

51:06

The jury approached him. As. Always

51:08

been a little bit in the buckle. am I gonna players

51:10

He was a voice for you. Yes,

51:13

I would have left to play for

51:15

his. Stay out

51:17

there you must have learnt and

51:19

or flow from Kenny Dalglish the.

51:22

In. A lot I learned from can he was

51:24

less is more. In a lot

51:26

of situations where. When. They

51:28

get booted. Him raise his voice to you can he. Rarely.

51:31

Known all use but when he spoke

51:33

he couldn't a pin drop and. Didn't.

51:36

Matter what was going on in the dressing

51:38

room with the when can he spoke and

51:40

we need to setup and I see it

51:42

was reoffered. Who'd. Taken the manager's job

51:45

and can he was late above Ray in

51:47

the offices but. You still have

51:49

a big part in can use to be

51:51

entertained in every day and everything. And like

51:53

Ryaguzov fantastic coach been a fantastic I read

51:56

but. It was as well run club

51:58

the unabomber canyon the train and said. The

52:00

news know. He must have

52:02

been forty five that Kenny. These

52:04

found space in the a time

52:06

when the ball where you think

52:09

most players don't have uses. His

52:11

intelligence on the game was incredible

52:13

but he's good guy can because

52:15

is amazing video. Of

52:17

Glenn Hoddle signed to coach John

52:19

Moncur Csp. Have you seen this?

52:21

Yes, I'll have a month and

52:23

Hoddle obviously water naturally gifted for

52:26

Pillar he was on. So Mancha

52:28

was a really good professional but.

52:31

Glenn. Hoddle Is Glenn Hoddle. Is.

52:33

Showing Tomoko to do is a multi

52:35

keeps me said and influenza. Us: Okay,

52:37

so thought this was my below. This

52:40

and then he does it first time

52:42

and then John Size and Mrs that

52:44

that's Us Auto Mana item on the

52:46

Satanic least a ten page on Mrs

52:48

against Us Auto Mana you have an

52:51

adult less. Oh and that he does

52:53

it again perfectly. Every single type of

52:55

his assaulted modern. I said so. when

52:57

Kenny Guy Vulcan I was talking to

52:59

people at The Swans and Michael Laudrup

53:02

used to get involved in training. On

53:04

people a Wayne Routledge really good players would say

53:07

to make go why in the plane for a

53:09

split? I know you're forty a boy and and

53:11

men's club. Is

53:13

if you're the best player. We heard

53:16

that was it like Quinn seen him

53:18

with that suit. Genius like can eat

53:20

at is. it's demoralizing. Yeah,

53:22

spent approximately athletes know and I

53:25

was like twenty five of the

53:27

says assailant and I can get

53:29

any the middle. And. Then you

53:31

end up I'm in manifold going. I'm going

53:33

to take a moment that half. Weeks

53:36

all allowed the law for you know he

53:38

didn't have made in you and he's like

53:41

East Anglia the wrong way, mean and of

53:43

member thing and I'm when I'm like top

53:45

him and money selling me it's anything can

53:47

do that kind of your shiny twenty five

53:49

years older than him but. He. Was

53:51

back goods but also was also

53:53

gonna french midfield like him to

53:55

follow as a cold yes he

53:57

used to join in the train

53:59

him. You. Either.

54:02

One skill ball away if a dollar

54:04

run and nice to win all the

54:07

run. And he was a member of

54:09

Speaking with Glee Club an anti melville

54:11

again consignments room. What the fuck? Seeking

54:13

a piss? we're gonna get him drug

54:16

tested Is Norway's he doing that without

54:18

any announcements? are you like Forty Five

54:20

was unbelievable. He was unbelievable player and

54:23

again never raise his voice. really com.

54:26

But. Then we respected him so much because he we

54:28

knew it is a great play for france but then

54:30

when you to join in a training sessions any was

54:32

the best player. And. Coach any

54:34

that buddies enough to say so much because

54:37

use instant instant respect for more. The place.

54:40

I. Love with the I love that they

54:42

so got it. I saw a clip do

54:44

The Day of Romario play in his second

54:46

must as game of Sick Society Something. He

54:49

is taking the piss out of every

54:51

single player on the pitch and will

54:53

jacket nearly and my back at that.

54:56

Among black Me questions bows is

54:58

what See are the biggest see

55:00

you had before you were coming

55:02

up against a player. A tough

55:04

player on clearance whenever you believe

55:06

is. Didn't scare me so

55:08

much and nobody wants to get in those

55:11

brogan nobody likes of and nothing but he

55:13

was in them days is inevitable but I

55:15

was way way more. See a. Thing.

55:18

Against he and Rush will arrange exhorting Saunders

55:20

or Monkeys or on the Cold those plays

55:22

Allen She that he and Eight that was

55:24

when the see it can be as they

55:26

were so that could embarrass. You know that's

55:28

where the see it was some me Pentagon's

55:31

plated Jacqueline in the Blazing Be Super Mario.

55:33

I've mentioned the Gone and Canada. Might

55:36

allowed on guys think is operate on

55:38

a completely different frequency. Yeah the rest

55:40

of us and that's what I had.

55:42

my fear. Is

55:45

calling every erectus because in like a minister

55:47

back to the a good than bad as

55:49

you so much to bear. always remember the

55:51

norm in a zone rather send used to

55:53

play for for this the winner. He.

55:56

was i think an assistant knowledge

55:58

and at leicester more of He

56:00

was by the way. Yeah, an amazing player. And

56:03

I was talking to one Roberts and it once

56:05

said he'd very rarely got involved. But

56:07

he did this one time and he's wearing a suit

56:09

and he's wearing like brogues, like the kind of shoes

56:11

he'd wear to a wedding. And he tucked his suit

56:13

trousers into his socks. And on

56:15

the pitch, they're all in boots. He said they couldn't

56:17

get near him. Just

56:20

amazing. Yeah, I remember watching him.

56:23

And then I remember speaking with Martin O'Neill

56:25

about John Robertson. He's a great

56:27

guy. He's a great guy. I remember

56:29

speaking with Martin O'Neill about him and he said probably

56:32

the best player he's played was definitely one

56:35

or nobody again. And he's one of those.

56:37

He had that look where he looked like

56:39

he wasn't involved in the game. He looked

56:41

a bit lazy. But if you actually study

56:43

him, he was a heartwater player, an amazing

56:45

player. So who's the best player you played

56:47

against? I think the

56:49

best player not directly against, but in

56:51

terms of just

56:53

incredible ability was the Brazilian

56:56

boy, Rivaldo. Oh, yeah.

56:58

The longest 90 minutes I ever

57:00

had was against Alexander

57:02

Del Piero. That last of

57:04

the month that came to me. It

57:06

was our game. He was the toughest

57:08

opponent in terms of physicality. It

57:10

would either be Billy White or still

57:13

Mick Harvard. No one's a pleasant experience

57:15

either. The wee players who played

57:17

it against Billy White just talk about him. Oh, I

57:19

was 18. I played

57:21

for Swansea against, I think it was Oxford

57:23

in a pre-season friendly. Some

57:26

other times in my career where I

57:28

was really hurt, like real, real pain.

57:30

Like a count on one hand, you get knocks

57:32

and bumps and bruises, but like real pain. And

57:35

one was against Billy. He came in to me

57:37

from the side and I remember

57:39

landing on my neck and I

57:41

didn't even know where the pain was coming from. It was

57:43

everywhere. He was standing over me. I was only 18.

57:46

He was standing over me with a grin on

57:48

his face and I was petrified. I thought, Jesus

57:51

Christ. Luckily for me,

57:53

the next time he was playing

57:55

for Stoke, I was playing for Palace. I

57:57

remember speaking with Eddie Young and me and Young, he was saying, what did

57:59

you do? He's just cry for me, he's a

58:01

nutty, he's lunatic. And I

58:04

said to Al, don't anger him, like don't jump into

58:06

it. He killed a pair of us. And

58:09

the next day, the team sheet come in. And

58:12

what had happened was he hadn't signed in time

58:14

for Stoke. But it was

58:16

transfer. The transfer deadline was different then. And he wasn't

58:18

in the squad. Me and Eric

58:20

Young, it was like we scored a goal. You

58:22

should have celebrated in the dressing room. We hadn't

58:24

even kicked the ball yet. He was like, thank

58:26

Christ for that. Because he was a weird and

58:29

lunatic Billy. And Mick Hartford

58:32

was a lunatic, but he was

58:34

a really good player. I mean, play for England,

58:36

Mick. But Mick was, see,

58:38

Billy was a fighter on the pitch and in

58:40

the sleep. Billy was like used to our bare

58:42

knuckle fights and all sorts of Billy. Yeah, the

58:44

way players talk about him, it's like they were

58:46

playing against George Foreman or something. He sounds like

58:49

an absolute maniac. Another level. But Mick, like Mick

58:51

on the pitch was hard as nails. I

58:53

don't think Mick was a fighter off the pitch.

58:55

Everybody talks about Mick Hartford, about his physicality. But

58:57

he was a very, very good player also. You've

59:00

mentioned Eric Young a few times. I

59:02

must have watched pretty much every home game he played

59:04

for Wales, Eric Young. Obviously, you

59:06

play alongside him for Palace as well. Did

59:09

you ever say to him, Eric, please,

59:12

can you just change that headband

59:14

once? Because it's

59:17

absolutely disgusting. You know the

59:19

reason for it? No. He's eyebrows

59:21

there. He had like a load

59:24

of scar tissue. Cut. And like even

59:26

if the ball hit him, they would

59:28

open up. Oh, right. What? So he

59:30

used to cover his eyebrows in Vaseline and then

59:32

he'd have his headband on. Nowadays, that would be

59:34

a nice headband and it would be being paid

59:36

for it. But it just looked like an old

59:39

bit of towel that he's so strapped to. It's

59:41

disgusting. Oh, and it stung. Yeah,

59:44

I used to roam with

59:46

him as well, youngies sometimes. And

59:48

the more you save him, come on out, he'd

59:50

do it on purpose. You like wave it in

59:52

front of your face because he knew he was

59:55

disgusting. But he's a good player, Eric, really good

59:57

defender. Yeah. characters

1:00:00

through your career towards the tail end you sign

1:00:02

for Fulham you actually after Blackbun you drop down

1:00:04

a couple of divisions. Mohammed Al Fayed he's taken

1:00:06

over Fulham he's got this vision to get them

1:00:08

back into the Premier League. What

1:00:11

was the first time you met Mohammed Al Fayed? What

1:00:13

was he like? Well Mohammed was I

1:00:15

think because of who he is or

1:00:17

who he was some stories I

1:00:20

couldn't tell you I'd be looking over

1:00:22

the shoulder for the rest of my life. Other

1:00:24

stories yeah he was a very colorful

1:00:26

character very generous but he was one

1:00:28

of them where of course he

1:00:30

was a very successful man and you see why when

1:00:32

you meet him and you talk to him because he

1:00:35

was at a vision and a goal and

1:00:37

like we arrived at Fulham he said we'll be in

1:00:39

the Premier League in five years and everybody said yeah

1:00:41

right okay of course you know and even if

1:00:43

you've got lots of money it's still hard to do it but he did it

1:00:46

but sometimes he you know I'd have conversations with

1:00:48

him and I'd have to tell him I'd be

1:00:51

lying to him to his face I'd have to

1:00:53

tell bare face lies because he'd tell me something

1:00:55

a week ago and I couldn't do it and

1:00:58

it wouldn't work and then a week later we'd have

1:01:00

the meeting and he say what what the hell did

1:01:02

you gonna be like you fucking told me to do

1:01:04

it in my head that was thought that and I'd

1:01:07

have to make a lie up and say he was

1:01:09

this that and the other but this thing that he'd

1:01:11

tell me to do that I did that didn't work

1:01:14

then he blamed me I'd accept the blame

1:01:16

because I couldn't tell him it was your

1:01:18

idea so it was lots of that going

1:01:20

on lots of mind games but what he

1:01:22

was good at he didn't what we

1:01:24

know you know that he didn't care about what

1:01:28

outside people thought of whatever situation he was in he

1:01:30

just do what he wanted to do and if he

1:01:32

wants something to say he'd say it he knew where

1:01:35

you were with him he let

1:01:37

you work he give you the reins

1:01:39

I was only 32 and he gave me the

1:01:41

job because he was basically sticking

1:01:43

his fingers up to everybody else the establishment he was

1:01:45

doing what he wanted to do I was just in

1:01:47

the right place at the right time super lucky to

1:01:49

get the job he did it because I was young

1:01:52

and no one else was giving the 32 year old

1:01:54

a Premier League job he was

1:01:56

that kind of that but then he backed me and he let

1:01:58

me work he was brilliant But

1:02:01

there was more boundaries with Muhammad in

1:02:03

terms of, I couldn't say, please

1:02:05

chairman, don't come in the dressing room today

1:02:08

because of whatever. Yeah. He

1:02:10

was coming in and he was walking in with

1:02:12

Michael Jackson. He was walking in

1:02:14

with Tony Curtis, the famous actor. Well,

1:02:18

before you played in Charlton. Yeah. And

1:02:20

we walked in with Michael Jackson, right? It was after the

1:02:22

game, we were all standing in our towers, ready to go

1:02:24

in the shower. Kevin Keegan's assistant,

1:02:26

always at Frank Sibley, came in and said, could he

1:02:28

call me could he tell the boys don't go

1:02:30

in the shower yet? Chairman's

1:02:33

coming with a guest and we'd like, oh, here we

1:02:35

go. Here we go. You walk somewhere

1:02:37

Michael Jackson, right? I remember looking going,

1:02:39

is that Michael Jackson? I

1:02:42

thought that's not Michael Jackson. It's just like someone

1:02:45

dressed like anybody was Michael Jackson. A couple of

1:02:47

the lads took the towels off, put the towels

1:02:49

back on. And then

1:02:51

Michael was walking on the dressing

1:02:53

room, shaking hands with everybody in

1:02:55

his glove, which was a bit weird.

1:02:57

It was weird. It

1:03:01

was really weird. It

1:03:05

was one of those days where we all

1:03:07

still say, did that, did that actually happen

1:03:10

to us? In Miami,

1:03:12

I'd actually say that just

1:03:14

before we went in and everybody says, yeah, we

1:03:16

all remember him saying that. And

1:03:18

it's just bizarre. I tell you one thing, though,

1:03:21

the tiled floors of a changing room at

1:03:23

a football ground, perfect environment for a

1:03:26

moonwalk. All the lads were

1:03:28

taking a piss when they were all doing the moonwalk in

1:03:30

the shower and all that. And Michael

1:03:32

was standing there, like, because of how the

1:03:34

full impression was then the shower was on

1:03:36

the right. As you're walking

1:03:38

out, the shower was on the right. I can

1:03:40

see Michael standing in the doorway with Mohammed, but

1:03:42

some of the lads in the shower doing a

1:03:44

robot and doing the moonwalk. It

1:03:46

was a shamblot, honestly. Jesus Christ.

1:03:49

That's some respect for Tracy. He's the biggest

1:03:51

pop star in the world. I

1:03:53

mean, what was he like? Because obviously

1:03:56

he's not a norm for being a massive

1:03:58

football fan. No, but he had many. You

1:04:00

know what that trinity

1:04:02

does when he leans forward like that?

1:04:05

Yeah. Well, you know, one day it

1:04:07

works for him, he's 20, he's a stupid motherfucker. Oh, God.

1:04:10

Yeah. Oh, man. It

1:04:17

was a bit strange, it was all a bit strange.

1:04:20

Yeah. Chris, we've got a

1:04:22

few subscriber questions. The first question we've got actually

1:04:24

is from Jack Bean. He's like, have you got

1:04:26

any great stories about Muhammad al-Fayed? I mean, you've

1:04:29

just told us about two. Is there anything left

1:04:31

in the set list? I've

1:04:33

got one or two more, but like I said

1:04:35

earlier, Chris, I don't think I can put that

1:04:37

in the public domain of those things. What

1:04:40

were you there when the Michael Jackson statue

1:04:43

was built? I'd just gone a

1:04:45

couple of years after that he built the

1:04:47

statue. Yeah. Did you ever see the

1:04:49

statue? Oh, terrible. Yeah. It didn't

1:04:51

look like him. It was getting in like him.

1:04:53

It had been colored in with coloring pens or

1:04:55

something. Oh, it was a shocker, yeah. And somebody

1:04:57

bought it afterwards. I think somebody actually bought it.

1:05:00

She's not there now, thank God. Is it a

1:05:02

museum someone told me? Oh, is it? Yeah,

1:05:04

it's in the museum somewhere. A museum of what? Yeah,

1:05:06

it was exactly. Yeah. That's

1:05:08

it. Yeah. One

1:05:12

question from Sal Tariq, you mentioned there that he

1:05:14

was the Fulham assistant, called you Cookie. Where

1:05:16

did the nickname Cookie come from? Obviously,

1:05:19

Wikipedia suggests it was from your early

1:05:21

days. Yeah. Cookie

1:05:23

Monster. Yeah, my mates used to

1:05:25

call me because I used to like, I mean, like I love

1:05:27

chocolate, but in my early days, I used to eat a lot

1:05:29

of cakes and chocolate. I was a big boy.

1:05:31

So they used to call me the Cookie Monster. But then what

1:05:34

I did was when I was about 20,

1:05:36

I think it was 20. Yeah. Me

1:05:39

and another player, his name was David Dowd,

1:05:41

I came up with us again. He's

1:05:44

a good little player, David. He was playing for Swansea. Yeah,

1:05:47

we were about 20. And we'd had a

1:05:50

few beers and we got tiny little tattoos.

1:05:53

And I got cookie tattooed at the top

1:05:55

of my leg. So of course, everybody wanted a

1:05:57

picture of a cookie or the word cookie. Fucking,

1:06:00

do you want to go like a biscuit drawn on the

1:06:02

top of your thigh? No, I haven't,

1:06:04

no. That's next. That's coming up. No, you've

1:06:06

just given me an idea there. Put

1:06:09

a big biscuit on your back. Listen,

1:06:12

the size of my thigh is now a bit

1:06:14

off your back in the biscuit. So that's a

1:06:16

good excuse to be honest. How do

1:06:18

you go into a tattoo park and ask for

1:06:20

a pack of your biscuit? That's

1:06:23

so cookie-stuck then every club I went to, that's

1:06:25

always stuck. One more from Lee Sanders. He wants

1:06:27

to know, would you prefer to qualify for an

1:06:30

international tournament with Wales as a player

1:06:32

than as a manager? That's

1:06:34

a good question. Oh, it's a great question. Nobody's

1:06:36

ever asked me that. So

1:06:39

the best days of your playing days, the

1:06:41

best days of the playing days. I

1:06:44

had lots of disappointments with Wales, but I remember

1:06:46

when we won a few games and the feeling

1:06:48

of that, the feeling of standing

1:06:50

there, singing the national anthem. We always say

1:06:53

that story where you feel like just

1:06:55

on that one day, you are the best

1:06:57

in your position for your country. And that

1:06:59

feeling is the pride involved in that is

1:07:01

incredible. So I

1:07:04

think to do it as a player would have just it would

1:07:07

have been indescribable. As a

1:07:09

manager, I can't describe to you the

1:07:11

fulfillment that gives me. And for

1:07:14

us, we're a small country. Whereas there's only three and

1:07:16

a half million of us. But when

1:07:18

we get it right, then we have that feeling of

1:07:20

together. And that's just incredible to experience that. But to

1:07:23

take it when it went. It's

1:07:25

really hard for me to say I preferred it

1:07:27

as a player, even though I preferred my

1:07:30

playing days to my manager's days. Managers

1:07:32

are processing, but being involved with it

1:07:34

and having so much of the

1:07:37

responsibility of it, I think it'd

1:07:39

be difficult for me to say I would prefer it as

1:07:41

a player, because when I was a manager, I had a

1:07:43

lot to do with it, obviously, and a lot of decisions

1:07:45

to make. So I felt a lot

1:07:47

of that responsibility. Really, when it goes wrong, you

1:07:49

have that responsibility. But when it goes right and

1:07:51

it goes Wales, probably wouldn't change

1:07:53

that. I don't think I'd change that. Also,

1:07:56

the USA 94 qualification, the

1:07:58

Paul Bowden penalty. if

1:08:00

we're qualifying 94, does it kind of reset

1:08:02

the timeline of Welsh football a little bit,

1:08:04

that magnificent European tournament that you have, does

1:08:06

that all kind of shift forward kind of

1:08:08

18 years or whatever? I think any qualification

1:08:10

you have to treat it in isolation. And

1:08:12

I think I remember when we qualified, remember

1:08:14

saying afterwards, we won't qualify every campaign because

1:08:17

we just don't have a big enough pool

1:08:19

of players. And if we have a bit

1:08:21

of bad lack or injuries, we're going to

1:08:23

be affected. But as long as

1:08:25

we're maybe qualifying three and five, three

1:08:28

and six, and that is a

1:08:30

job for Welsh football, they won't qualify every

1:08:32

campaign because it's too much for us, I

1:08:34

think, to the size of our country. But

1:08:36

as long as we're competitive and we're there or

1:08:39

there about, we can never be like another

1:08:41

30, 40 years where we're nowhere near

1:08:44

or now and again, we promise we

1:08:46

don't deliver. We've got to be there

1:08:48

or there a bunch. We're going to have a campaign where

1:08:50

we're not so good. But then as long as we bounce

1:08:52

back and start well in the next campaign, everybody

1:08:55

that plays for Wales, that's what the job is

1:08:57

for them. They carry the torch, not

1:09:00

from the lads from 2016, but they carry the

1:09:03

torch for Wales and they've got to make sure

1:09:05

that's the responsibility. We're there or we're there about.

1:09:08

As a kid, I never thought I'd

1:09:10

see a better player than Ian Rush. I'm

1:09:13

never as well. And obviously Ryan

1:09:15

came along and I thought,

1:09:17

OK, that's it. I'm not going to see a better

1:09:19

player than Ryan Giggs. That's the level. You can't beat

1:09:21

that. And obviously, Gareth Bale

1:09:23

came along and he

1:09:26

is once in a piece of

1:09:28

grace ever. But you're just

1:09:30

hoping, and it is true for

1:09:32

all countries to an extent, like it's

1:09:34

Rooney and then it's Kane and there

1:09:36

was Bellingham. You look at Bellingham, you

1:09:38

think, Christ, I mean, this guy is

1:09:41

unreal. So you're just hoping

1:09:43

that there's just

1:09:45

some boy in the camp or

1:09:47

the carnival, the carnival, whatever. Young lad

1:09:50

on the white bank. Yeah,

1:09:52

just kicking a board against the

1:09:54

garage door who's going to be the next Gareth Bale. And

1:09:56

he's going to be the one we're all going to get

1:09:59

excited about. Yeah, they will be there

1:10:01

for sure because one thing we have done, even

1:10:04

though we're a small nation, is

1:10:06

you've mentioned those players, Ian Rash, and

1:10:08

then like before Rash E, who had probably

1:10:11

a little bit before then, he would do John Charles,

1:10:13

who I never saw enough of John. I saw some

1:10:15

clips and he looked awesome. My father's an Irishman, my

1:10:17

father's a Dublin. He said, Doug, my dad, but he

1:10:20

loved his football and he talked about John Charles.

1:10:22

He said he was an amazing player. Yeah,

1:10:24

and Chris Jones was Tottenham and Ivar Ochs.

1:10:27

Chris Jones, yeah. Ivar

1:10:29

Ochs, my father said Ivar Ochs was on

1:10:31

another level. So what we have done is

1:10:33

a small country's continuously churned

1:10:35

out amazing players. Well Cliff is in his late

1:10:37

80s and he still looks like he could play.

1:10:39

Have you seen him? On social media. I haven't

1:10:42

seen Cliff before in a while, no, I haven't,

1:10:44

no. In lockdown, he was doing exercise

1:10:46

videos. Oh, was he? Because he'd

1:10:48

won the double with Tottenham and then he had to, because there was

1:10:50

no money in football in those days, he had to become a PE

1:10:53

teacher. So he was in lockdown, he was

1:10:55

25, doing star jumps and pushups

1:10:58

and bicep curls and both. He's

1:11:00

all sorts. Amazing. He's a legend.

1:11:02

Yeah. Well, you

1:11:04

always end this podcast on one final question, which

1:11:06

is this. I'm going to give you the option

1:11:08

to go back to when Terry Yourath brings you

1:11:10

to Swansea City and you can

1:11:12

relive your whole career from that point onwards

1:11:14

all over again. Would you take

1:11:16

that opportunity? Yeah,

1:11:19

yeah. I changed my car crash because I

1:11:21

didn't did my career, but that was my

1:11:23

own fault. But other than that, you know

1:11:25

what? I was the luckiest man in the

1:11:27

world to have a career in professional football

1:11:30

at any level, let

1:11:32

alone I was lucky to play the top level

1:11:34

with some of the best players and played

1:11:37

against the best players. And I wouldn't

1:11:39

know when I look back on my career,

1:11:41

I don't have any feeling of, oh, I

1:11:43

think I missed out there. I could have

1:11:45

done that. I had the

1:11:47

best time, best experiences, I worked

1:11:49

with the best people. I'd

1:11:52

like to actually sit down with Terry because I haven't seen

1:11:54

him for a long time. Buy

1:11:56

me a bed, dinner and a glass

1:11:58

of whiskey. I know he likes a glass of whiskey. I

1:12:00

just like to spend a bit of time with him just to say

1:12:02

thank you to him personally because he

1:12:05

really did set me on a path and

1:12:07

what came after came after but I wouldn't

1:12:10

change anything about my career. I wouldn't. Not

1:12:12

even a quick word in the year of Paul Bodin on the

1:12:14

17th November 1993. Paul

1:12:17

Bodin, Paul Bodin. Listen,

1:12:20

people miss penalties but he took one for swimming the

1:12:22

weekend after that and scored and he said, I think

1:12:25

he said, I hope that makes up for the one-nighters

1:12:27

and I was like that's never going to make up

1:12:29

for the one-nighters. He's a good lad

1:12:31

Bod. He's

1:12:34

a good coach as well Bod. He's

1:12:36

been with the young boys. He

1:12:39

stepped up. I think people remember

1:12:41

them saying to Dino, why didn't you

1:12:43

take the penalty? But Bod always

1:12:45

took the penalties and he always scored. Yeah, he'd

1:12:47

replace Dino actually because Dino had missed a couple.

1:12:49

He had a great left foot, Paul Bodin, super

1:12:51

left foot and he never missed but unfortunately he

1:12:53

missed that thing. Oh,

1:12:56

Chris, thank you so much for your time.

1:12:58

It's been such a pleasure to rattle through

1:13:00

it. This has been an absolute joy. Thank

1:13:02

you so much mate. I really enjoyed this.

1:13:04

Pleasure, Alex. Good to talk to you, Chris.

1:13:06

Pleasure. There

1:13:16

you go. Oh man. With

1:13:18

his glove, that

1:13:20

phrase will be meaningful to me for the rest

1:13:23

of my life. I'll never forget that. That's

1:13:26

now what I think of when

1:13:28

I think of Michael Jackson. With

1:13:30

his glove. He

1:13:33

was great because like a lot of 90s players,

1:13:36

he's a bit of a character and he's got great stories. But

1:13:39

also because he's remained relevant because

1:13:41

he's managed and he was managing

1:13:44

to relatively recently. He

1:13:46

kind of straddles both camps really. So you

1:13:48

can talk to him about modern football and

1:13:50

he'll be very knowledgeable. But also, he

1:13:52

comes from a time where football was so different,

1:13:55

it's really, really interesting. So he was a great

1:13:57

guest. I certainly enjoyed it. Yeah. way

1:14:00

more of a lad than I was expecting. A

1:14:02

kind of guy you could have go over pint

1:14:04

with. I wasn't necessarily expecting that. Oh yeah, definitely.

1:14:06

I didn't see that coming. Also very handsome. Oh,

1:14:08

so handsome. I've got a, I didn't say

1:14:10

this cause I thought it'd be weird, but I've got a picture

1:14:12

of him sipping from a

1:14:15

cup of coffee during

1:14:17

a press conference. And he's- Brin

1:14:19

to talk to a massive camera so I can find a

1:14:22

place. But he's wearing a very moddy button-up

1:14:25

top. And because he's holding, obviously

1:14:27

the mods used to drinking coffee houses.

1:14:30

He just looks like he signed

1:14:32

an R&B band in about 1964. And

1:14:36

he looks so cool. It was my screensaver for

1:14:38

a long time. And I've got kids. It

1:14:41

should have been them. I

1:14:44

was chatting to, I was with James Collins, the ginger pillow

1:14:46

who was part of that Wales 2016 team. And

1:14:49

he said, I said, he's a good looking man. And

1:14:51

he's much more of a lad. And he said, there

1:14:53

were so many good looking lads in that Wales team.

1:14:55

Like when he was playing, he had obviously Ryan

1:14:57

Giggs. But also the likes of

1:14:59

Gary Speed was good looking. Gary Speed's very handsome.

1:15:01

Yeah, yeah. There's lots of handsome blokes. Yeah,

1:15:04

I think Joanne is handsome. I think Aaron

1:15:06

Ramsey's very handsome. There

1:15:09

you go. I mean, if you want

1:15:11

a podcast on handsome footballs, I'm

1:15:14

straight. I just admire attractive

1:15:16

people. There

1:15:19

you go. Chris Coleman, if you want even more

1:15:21

from that interview, you can join the Quickly Kevin

1:15:23

Family Club, sign up at another slice.com/Quickly Kevin. And

1:15:25

on your Apple podcast app. And if you've enjoyed

1:15:27

this podcast and are looking for a

1:15:29

new one, do feel free to check

1:15:32

out Mine and Ellis' new history podcast,

1:15:34

Oh What a Time, also featuring Quickly

1:15:36

Kevin alumni, Tom Crane, in which we

1:15:39

take a sideways comedic look at history

1:15:41

and also ask questions like, could you

1:15:43

go it in a time machine, take

1:15:46

Pep Guardiola's tactics and apply them in

1:15:48

the 1940s and win everything? That's the

1:15:50

kind of show it is. It's called Oh What a

1:15:52

Time. Do feel free to check it out. Now we'll

1:15:55

see you next week. And this week's

1:15:57

outro comes courtesy of Charlie Partington who says.

1:16:00

Cheerio, Stefano Iranio. See you

1:16:02

next week.