When did the reality-based community start losing to reality show celebrity? Why are "alternative facts" and fake news suddenly ubiquitous features of the landscape? The spread of American magical thinking isn't, in fact, sudden, argues Kurt Andersen in the September 2017 Atlantic. It was rooted in the very origins of the nation, and started to blossom in the '60s. Andersen explores how these forces made their way to the White House in conversation with our Radio Atlantic cohosts, Jeffrey Goldberg, Alex Wagner, and Matt Thompson. For links and other show notes, go here. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices