0:03

Welcome to the Raising Boys and Girls podcast.

0:05

I'm Sissy Goff.

0:06

I'm David Thomas.

0:08

And I'm Melissa Travathan. And

0:10

we're so glad you've set us out a few minutes

0:12

to spend with us today. In each

0:14

episode of this podcast, we'll share some of

0:16

what we're learning and the work we do with kids

0:18

and families on a daily basis at

0:20

daystar counseling in Nashville, Tennessee. Our

0:23

goal is to help you care for the kids in your

0:25

life with little more understanding a

0:27

little more practical help and a whole lot

0:29

of hope. So pull up a chair and join us

0:31

on this journey from our little yellow house

0:33

to yours. Cissy,

0:39

does this sound familiar to you?

0:41

You know the importance of eating

0:44

healthy, but you don't always have the

0:46

time or the will power

0:47

to cook with all the colors of the rainbow.

0:50

Yes. That totally sounds like

0:52

me. I've had some colorful tacos, but

0:54

they definitely didn't include the nutrition

0:56

in Organifi Superfood blends.

0:59

Me too, sometimes it

1:01

can feel so overwhelming to eat healthy that

1:03

I get stuck. I'm always

1:05

looking for simple ways to add nutrition

1:07

in my daily diet. which is why

1:09

I'm excited about Organifi. Organifi's

1:13

super food blends make it easy

1:15

and enjoyable to add more variety and

1:17

nutrition to your

1:19

Yes. We need all the nutrition hacks

1:21

we can get and organifi's delicious

1:23

organic powders are definitely a

1:25

simple hack. You simply stir it into water

1:28

or add it to a smoothie and enjoy any

1:30

time for more energy, nutrition, hormone

1:32

balance, and peace of mind.

1:34

Organifi super food blends

1:36

are a great way to jump start your

1:38

morning, energize your afternoon,

1:40

or nourish your evening. So at the end of

1:42

the day, you can feel great about

1:44

doing something good for your well-being.

1:47

We have a special offer for our listeners.

1:49

Go to organifi dot com

1:51

slash RBG and use code

1:54

RBG for twenty percent off your

1:56

order. That's 0RGANIFI

1:59

dot

2:01

com slash RBG and

2:03

use code RBG for twenty

2:05

percent off any item.

2:12

Okay. We gotta tell the truth. You started

2:14

this episode by doing what?

2:16

did start with a little more eye carey.

2:18

Yes. Yes. I know

2:20

I was thinking, could I even hit that high note

2:22

about it? I

2:22

don't think you got me feeling a

2:25

much more. yeah, I don't think I can pull

2:27

it off. But that's

2:27

what we're talking about this week, emotions

2:30

and kids. And I don't

2:32

think you'd let me get away with it, but I'd like to spend

2:34

the whole podcast episode

2:36

interviewing you about this amazing book,

2:39

you guys, if you do not yet have, which I

2:41

think you do because they cannot keep it in stock,

2:43

but if you don't have raising emotionally

2:46

strong boys yet by

2:48

my dear friend David Thomas grab

2:50

your copy Now, it's

2:52

so good. I'm so grateful for

2:54

it already. And there's an accompanying

2:57

workbook for the little guys in your

2:59

life ages what?

2:59

David, Six to twelve.

3:01

Six to twelve called strong and

3:03

smart.

3:04

Although I did have a mom tell me this week

3:06

that she bought it for her seven year old

3:08

son, She said, but I'm using a lot

3:10

of it with my thirty seven year old husband. So

3:12

it could be applied to other ages. I'm learning

3:15

too.

3:15

Oh, that's so good. Yes. I

3:17

just am so great. full because I

3:19

don't even know how many times I've heard you say.

3:22

Speaking about boys at a certain

3:24

age, channel all of their emotion,

3:26

we say what and

3:27

it's what you say. Somewhere around nine to ten,

3:30

boys begin to channel all primary

3:32

emotions, fear, sadness, confusion,

3:34

disappointment, into

3:36

anger -- Mhmm. -- which is something I talk about

3:38

in my office every day, all

3:41

day with boys of all ages, toddlers,

3:43

the teenagers. Just a lot comes

3:45

out to the filter of anger. Mhmm.

3:46

And for those of us who are females

3:49

listening to you say that, and we don't get that

3:51

to the same degree. I mean, I'm

3:53

a one, so I have some latent anger going on a

3:55

lot inside of me. But I think

3:57

it is so foreign, which is again

3:59

why I think especially now that I have

4:01

these little two nephews in my life, every

4:04

time I hear you talk, I just soak it up, everything

4:06

you say about boys. So I'm just so grateful for

4:08

this for your work in the world and for your voice

4:10

in this book and that we get to spend a

4:12

good portion of this season talking

4:15

about exactly what raising emotionally strong

4:17

boys mean and how we can do it. so. Thank you.

4:18

Well, you're kind. I'm just so excited.

4:21

We're in season five. We're in season five. We're

4:24

in our fifth season of this podcasts.

4:26

And that we get to be with the amazing TSF

4:28

network.

4:29

Oh, wow. Some amazing

4:31

folks over there. keep happening. Yes.

4:34

Me. We started this whole thing.

4:36

I don't know that we ever imagined we'd still

4:38

be five seasons later talking about

4:40

kids in this fun way. I

4:41

don't think so either. It was really fun.

4:43

Really grateful. Yes.

4:45

So we wanted to talk specifically

4:48

again about emotions and kids and

4:50

it looks so different. and the conversations

4:52

we have in our offices typically

4:54

are really different, which is why we wanted to

4:56

drill down and talk about some specific

4:59

things of what we're seeing and then

5:01

like we always do, we wanna give you three practical

5:03

things to think of, and then we're gonna have Melissa come

5:05

in and just throw some wisdom at us.

5:07

So thinking

5:10

about boys

5:12

and what you said, you know, it's interesting to

5:14

have a lot of conversations with parents

5:16

of younger girls about Anchor. my

5:18

immediate question is, tell me when you're seeing more

5:20

of it, which think is always important to watch the

5:23

patterns, watch the themes, what's

5:25

triggering her with her anger, and it's often

5:27

times of unpredictability and transition. But

5:30

what I have started saying to parents in the last

5:32

six months because I see this across the

5:35

board is that anger

5:37

in those years is so important because

5:39

what girls do is they take that

5:41

anger at a certain age. may

5:43

be around the same age that you mentioned

5:45

or as they're getting a little bit older and the anger

5:48

turns inward. And so

5:50

all of a sudden that fury that's coming

5:52

at you is directed at themselves. And

5:54

when that's happening, we often don't know.

5:56

There's not as much evidence of it, and we can't

5:58

help her work through it. And so to

6:01

be aware in our early places

6:03

when we can with kids to process that is

6:05

so important. And then to be aware

6:07

of what we talk about all the time, that

6:09

when

6:09

something goes wrong in his world, he

6:11

blames. Other people often

6:14

his mother.

6:14

Yes. And when something goes wrong in

6:16

her world, she blames herself. And so

6:18

To understand, emotionally, that's really

6:20

undergirding a lot of what we're talking about

6:23

seems

6:23

really important. It's

6:24

such a picture of what I was saying with Ainer,

6:26

like, what's underneath that blame -- Mhmm.

6:28

-- what's underneath that finger pointing is

6:31

oftentimes I'm embarrassed, I'm

6:33

mad at myself, whatever it may be that's

6:35

only gonna present in those ways

6:38

of blame.

6:39

Yes. And

6:40

your acronym? Blame,

6:42

avoidance, and denial, which means for

6:44

bad. boys are strong

6:46

and all three of those unless we're

6:48

teaching something different. Yes. And

6:50

if it's not blame avoidance

6:53

and denial, the swing that I talk a

6:55

lot about in this new book that I see boys do

6:57

over and over is swinging between blame

6:59

and shame. So it's either it's your fault

7:01

or I'm such an idiot. And I talk

7:03

about how I think blame

7:05

is just discharge pain, and I think

7:07

shame is just self contempt, and neither

7:10

of those things are helpful, neither of them are

7:12

healthy. So if boys are just swinging

7:14

between discharge pain and

7:16

self contempt, like that's not a healthy way

7:18

to live emotionally and it's certainly not a healthy

7:20

way to live or relationally. So we're

7:22

gonna have to be working hard,

7:25

laboring long to move them toward that healthy

7:27

space of ownership. and

7:28

girls can certainly do the same. We should probably

7:30

say, this is kind of a continuum that

7:32

we definitely see girls who alternate

7:34

between blame and shame, but I feel like they

7:36

typically land more in the shame

7:39

and self hatred piece of it. So, okay,

7:41

I'm gonna pick out some things from the

7:43

book that I loved especially not

7:45

from the whole book. There's so many I can't pick them out

7:47

but from the first section where you're talking about

7:49

strength of emotion and the

7:51

first thing that I loved that you

7:54

talk about because, oh, I think about this so

7:56

much with girls is the whole idea

7:58

of being stuck versus

7:59

unstuck.

7:59

and we have a

8:02

lot of stuck kids. We have stuck

8:04

parents, sometimes who come into, but

8:06

stuck parents

8:07

often have the internal motivation to work

8:09

through it. Step kids don't yet have the internal

8:12

motivation, and so we have to put

8:14

external motivation in place until they

8:16

can get there in internally. And so will

8:18

you talk about what stuck boys look like? And

8:20

then we can talk about girls and the differences.

8:22

I'd love to and, you know, I would first

8:24

say I use that word a lot in my office.

8:26

I don't know if you do, but I love the word stuck

8:29

because it's not a permanent state.

8:31

Like any of us can get stuck, And

8:33

the good news is any of us can get unstuck.

8:36

But what I would say to that is that

8:39

sometimes we can get unstuck by ourselves

8:41

and sometimes we need help. and I talk a lot

8:43

in the beginning of this book and the strength of emotion

8:45

how boys lean

8:47

toward suppression in self

8:49

reliance like they don't wanna

8:51

talk about how they're feeling and they don't wanna ask for

8:53

help. So I think boys can stay stuck for long

8:55

periods of time because they see asking

8:57

for help or getting help. as

8:59

weakness. Mhmm. And so I think that's one

9:01

stuck place I would name. It's just asking

9:03

for help in how think we're gonna have to

9:05

move against that, how we're gonna have to model

9:07

all the benefits of getting help. When we talk

9:09

with friends, I encourage parents to talk about

9:12

when you meet with your counselor and how helpful it is, when

9:14

you go on walks with your friends, when you take trips with

9:16

your friends. So I would say that's one

9:18

place. Secondly, I would say the

9:20

blame to shame swing is place where I see a lot

9:22

of boys get stuck as we mentioned. But, you know,

9:25

I would say, thirdly, I think

9:27

a lot of boys get stuck in what

9:29

I call the emotional lazy

9:31

response of I don't know. Mhmm. How do you

9:33

feel? I don't know. how that feels to you.

9:35

I don't know. I was at a dime for every time a child

9:37

send it to my accounts. Yes.

9:40

And and what it looks like to push

9:42

in to that, I don't know, to help

9:44

them build as we talk about so often

9:46

on this podcast, and we will continue to talk

9:48

about just an expansive emotional

9:51

vocabulary so that they can connect with

9:53

what they feel and name what they feel.

9:55

You know, Sissy, it's interesting I

9:57

think if we as parents were to think

9:59

back on those

10:01

early pediatric well visits from

10:03

pediatricians like it twelve, eighteen, twenty

10:05

four minds are asking parents,

10:08

you know, how many words is she saying? How many words

10:10

is he saying? What we know is that girls

10:12

are saying two to three times the number of words

10:14

that boys are most often. And so

10:17

if her general vocabulary is

10:19

bigger, of course, her emotional vocabulary

10:22

would likely be bigger. So we're gonna have to

10:24

labor longer to help

10:26

boys find more words to describe

10:28

their experience. So if that's happening

10:30

on the front side and then as you and I talked

10:33

about this nine to ten process is

10:35

happening little later on when I'm funneling everything

10:37

toward anger, you can see

10:39

already. We've got two significant ingredients

10:41

in the mix that make it harder for boys.

10:44

And then I would say what I think happens

10:46

a little farther down the road is culturally, then

10:48

I think boys start getting bombarded with

10:50

these messages. Like, it's

10:52

okay for girls to be sad. It's not okay for boys

10:54

to be sad. It's okay for girls to be scared. It's not

10:56

okay for voice to be scared. So

10:58

I think in the beginning, fewer words

11:00

down the road channeling everything toward anger

11:03

and then a little farther down the road bombarded

11:05

by messages that simply

11:07

mean, you know, it's part of why I wanted to

11:09

write this book. We're just gonna have to work harder

11:11

in that space because boys can get stuck

11:14

in any of those places. what about girls

11:16

where you see them get stuck in the

11:17

Well, I was thinking when you said girls vocabulary

11:20

gets bigger, I was thinking and

11:22

their emotions get bigger too. But

11:25

in terms of stuckness for girls,

11:27

one sentence I will never forget is

11:30

a girl who said to me I

11:32

don't wanna grow. I just wanna be understood.

11:34

Mhmm. And my immediate thought was,

11:36

well, you got the wrong counselor. That

11:38

is As in any agree one, that is

11:40

not where I'll land. And I

11:42

do see that with especially

11:45

certain personalities of

11:47

girls who We use this analogy,

11:49

I think, and our my kids on track, that there

11:51

are certain girls who come up against a roadblock

11:54

and wanna sit down in the dirt and draw pictures

11:56

in the sand while they're there and aren't really

11:58

interested and figuring out a way around it

12:00

because what happens is they feel

12:02

like their emotions are invalidated. And

12:04

I had a parent this week who talked to me about

12:07

how Her daughter just

12:09

cannot get to a place where she can be positive.

12:11

Even though things are better in her life, she cannot

12:13

say, purely that they're better.

12:15

And I said, for some kids.

12:18

If they only acknowledge the positive, they're

12:21

dismissing the negative. And they feel

12:23

like those feelings aren't valid, they're not

12:25

being heard. And so for certain

12:27

kids, there is always a mix. And we

12:29

wanna be aware of that with them. And

12:31

you talked about this in a recent episode

12:33

about parent who were timing their kids. Parents

12:35

who time themselves when they struggle

12:38

to really listen. Yes. Yes. Yes.

12:40

because they've been too much toward challenge and

12:43

not support?

12:43

Yes. With some of these kids, y'all, I am

12:45

totally telling them myself as a therapist, but

12:48

I have a clock that I can look at where hopefully

12:50

the person can't really tell them looking. And with

12:52

those kids, I will make myself sit

12:55

and listen for maybe thirty minutes,

12:57

maybe a little bit longer even

13:00

though I wanna intervene and I wanna intervene and

13:02

I wanna intervene because I know those kids

13:04

need to be heard longer. And if

13:06

they don't feel heard, they're gonna get stuck on purpose.

13:09

And so that's one place that

13:11

I feel like girls get stuck. And another

13:13

is I have never thought

13:15

about this until a session I had last week

13:17

with this amazing girl who is

13:20

really intuitive and she

13:22

second guesses herself and is in

13:24

her head a lot about herself as I think

13:26

so many girls are, especially as they move

13:28

towards adolescence. And I

13:30

finally realized as she was talking about

13:32

feeling like this friend was mad at her and this person

13:35

was upset with her and something was wrong in this

13:37

place, and she was failing in

13:39

all these different spaces. And I

13:41

have worked with her for a long

13:43

time. I think we're on about two years

13:45

to where she's finally seeing the things that are

13:47

in her head out loud. And

13:49

what I realized is that

13:51

she takes things in by

13:53

intuition. She has a superpower

13:56

of intuition. And so she senses something

13:58

is off with someone or the teacher's upset

14:00

or something didn't go the way it was supposed to go.

14:03

But she doesn't trust her intuition.

14:05

She trusts her feelings more than her intuition.

14:08

And so she immediately decides she did

14:10

it. she did something wrong. She made the

14:12

mistake. The teacher's upset with her and the friend's

14:14

upset with her. Rather than

14:16

your gut is so important

14:19

the older I get, the longer I counsel, the

14:21

more I feel like we need to help girls connect

14:23

to their gut. But feelings take priority

14:25

over our gut, and so she can't get to a place of

14:27

truth, and so she gets stuck in the shame

14:30

and in the self hatred of I did something

14:32

wrong rather than something feels

14:34

off, it's probably not about me.

14:36

So let me think through what it might be. And

14:39

that's something I've noticed more and more with girls

14:41

lately in terms of that stat versus unstuck.

14:43

That's good stuff.

14:48

David, you know I love reading bible

14:50

stories with Henry. It's so fun to

14:52

see him get excited about flooring God's

14:54

story.

14:55

Unatic, reading the bible with

14:57

kids is one of the best ways to make

14:59

all the tools we talk about more effective.

15:01

Yes. God made kids so incredibly

15:04

amazing. And the more they get to know God,

15:06

the more they will understand how he made them.

15:08

which is why I'm so excited about the new Explorer

15:11

Bible for kids coming out October fifteenth.

15:13

I cannot wait to read

15:14

it with Henry. This Bible looks incredible.

15:17

The team that created it likes to say,

15:19

the Explorer Bible for kids helps

15:22

place God's word in the middle of

15:24

God's world for kids. I love that.

15:26

This full text bible uses

15:28

the simple language of the Christian standard

15:30

bible, which is a great translation for kids.

15:33

It all also has engaging full

15:35

color designs, so kids of all ages can

15:37

explore and understand the bible for themselves.

15:39

It includes fun facts, time lines, photography,

15:42

and more. I can't wait for

15:44

Henry to explore this truly engaging

15:46

Bible.

15:47

To learn more about this great new Bible,

15:49

go to explore bible for

15:51

kids

15:51

dot com. grab your copy

15:54

of the Explorer Bible for kids today

15:56

from lifeway dot com and get

15:58

fifty percent off using code

16:00

RBG.

16:05

Okay. You also have three r's.

16:08

I love the three r's. Will you talk about that?

16:10

because I think there's a plated girls too.

16:12

I do too. And I love teaching

16:14

on the three r's because I think it

16:17

is a skill set that

16:19

I would really love all kids, boys and girls

16:21

to have on the front side and one we're using

16:23

or should be using as adults

16:26

every day in our lives together. So

16:28

I'll name them first and then talk for a quick

16:30

minute about what they are. The three Rs

16:33

are recognized regulate

16:35

and repair. And recognize is

16:38

just paying attention to

16:40

the signals my body is giving

16:42

me when I'm having an emotional response. And

16:44

I think that's how Lulu does. I

16:46

need to do that too. I'm still learning.

16:48

Absolutely. We all are, and I think it's

16:50

different for every person and like I know some people

16:52

who would say, I start to feel

16:54

hot inside my body. I can feel my neck

16:56

and face getting red or my No.

16:58

Don't talk about that around me. Let's

17:01

say some people have it that way. Other

17:03

people might feel tension in their back

17:05

and neck. Some people clench their

17:07

fist and grit their teeth. some

17:09

people when they feel nervous, their heart starts

17:11

to race, you know, they're all kinds of signs

17:13

and signals. And the way I actually

17:16

teach it in the workbook for boys is it's

17:18

kinda like the dashboard on a car.

17:20

The dashboard is gonna signal us

17:23

if the tire is low or if

17:25

the all needs changing or if

17:27

We need to put gas in the tank or

17:29

maybe a bigger problem like a check engine

17:31

light. And as long as we're paying attention

17:34

to those signals, and responding accordingly,

17:37

the car keeps working. But if

17:39

I get a signal that my tire's low and I

17:41

ignore it, I'm gonna end up with a flat or

17:43

if I don't put gas in the car. I'm gonna end

17:45

up on the side of the road, and our bodies

17:47

are really the same. Like, if we don't pay attention

17:49

to those signs and signals, if I don't learn how

17:51

to name and navigate those

17:53

emotions. Like, I could do some real damage

17:56

to my body, to my heart, to

17:58

my relationships. all the different things.

18:00

And so that's the recognize. And then

18:03

regulate is just employing

18:06

helpful, healthy coping

18:08

strategies when our

18:10

nervous system goes into heightened state of arousal.

18:12

And so it's really kind of the what to

18:14

do part of the equation. And in

18:17

the book, I walk families

18:19

through kind of a blueprint of how to help

18:21

kids make connections in these places. season.

18:24

We talked just a little bit and are my kids

18:26

on track season about creating

18:28

a space. I go way more into that in

18:30

this book and how to do that and what

18:32

it can look like for kids of different ages.

18:35

And then coming up with what I call a top

18:37

five list, which are just those healthy strategies.

18:39

Because don't know if you'd say this

18:41

is true, Sissy, for girls, but I have a lot of

18:43

boys who have a lot of strategies in play,

18:46

but they're not helpful. They're mostly

18:48

numbing strategies like screens

18:50

and substances, but they're not healthy, helpful

18:52

things, like breathing and movement. And so

18:55

that's what's key. And, you know, even the numbing

18:57

with screens, like, that's feeding the

18:59

avoidance piece we talked about a little bit on the

19:01

front side. So that's the regulate

19:04

and then repair is taking

19:06

ownership and doing any needed

19:08

relational work, which is hopefully interrupting

19:11

that blame to shame swing that I talked about seeing

19:13

a lot of with boys. what I say

19:15

in the book and what I would always wanna be saying

19:17

to parents listening is that I

19:19

think the longer we teach the

19:21

first two hours recognize and regulate The

19:24

hope is we don't need that third r quite as

19:26

much. We're needing the repair

19:29

less of the time because we're doing

19:31

the work of recognize and regulate on

19:33

ready, and therefore, I'm not

19:35

finding myself walking back into those

19:37

same stuck places over and over again.

19:40

So Thanks for letting me talk about the three yards.

19:41

So good. That's so convicting for me.

19:44

The same is true for us

19:45

as adults.

19:46

Oh my goodness. I was practicing the three

19:48

yards in the airport. three days

19:50

ago. Like, this is just good

19:52

human work. Yes. Something we

19:54

all need. Yeah.

19:56

Well, another thing I love. I mean, we

19:58

could talk about so many things. But another thing I left

20:00

is that you had a definition for

20:03

what emotionally strong boys look like.

20:05

And I don't think I've ever seen you spell it

20:07

out that way. Will you say the

20:09

four things?

20:10

Yeah. The acronym is rare. Rare

20:12

is Oh, I didn't know you had acronym. I didn't

20:14

notice that. Which is something I hope changes

20:16

over time that not so rare to find boys

20:18

who are emotionally strong because we're helping boys

20:21

and kids in general just develop in these

20:23

spaces, but it's resourceful

20:26

It's aware, resilient, and

20:28

empathetic. That's so good. And

20:30

if you were putting four words to girls, what would

20:32

you say? Well,

20:33

I need to come up with an acronym. I just kinda

20:35

did this on the fly. I need some time to really think

20:38

about the four words that came to my mind

20:40

first, and some of this is because we had

20:42

a parent consult. with this amazing

20:44

mom recently. And as I

20:47

sat with her and was thinking about her as

20:49

a parent intuitive and intentional. kept

20:51

coming to my mind over and over and

20:53

over and I want girls to

20:56

learn to trust their intuition because I do

20:58

think that is a super powerful girls.

21:00

And it's one of the things she needs

21:02

really to navigate her life. She needs to

21:04

learn to trust her intuition. So intuition

21:07

and then not getting

21:09

stuck in the intuition. So being intentional

21:11

is taking what's happening

21:13

inside of our and moving outward with it

21:16

rather than the action going

21:18

against herself, which is what so often

21:20

happens with girls. So intuition intentionally

21:23

moving outward, capable

21:25

I'm seeing more and more girls, which

21:27

I think it's fascinating more in this age of

21:29

talking about empowering girls and women so much.

21:31

And I'm seeing less of the trickle down than

21:34

I've ever seen. And I think anxiety

21:37

strips girls of believing that they're capable.

21:39

And with girl's leading the statistics on anxiety,

21:41

and so I think an emotionally strong

21:43

girl is gonna believe that she's

21:45

intuitive. She can be intentional. I think

21:48

she's gonna believe that she's capable. And

21:50

out of that, she's gonna have confidence. And

21:53

not an arrogant confidence by any

21:55

means, but trusting

21:57

that god has given her some gifts and

21:59

she

21:59

can step into them

22:01

so many years ago. I sat with a mom and

22:03

I was

22:03

talking to her. She had a daughter who was

22:05

anxious and I said, want you to start

22:07

reminding her that she's brave and she

22:09

said, I

22:10

think that's gonna be pressure. Mhmm. And

22:13

I said, you're not telling her something

22:15

she has to rise into, you're reminding

22:17

her of something God has already placed inside of

22:19

her.

22:20

And that

22:21

feels so important as we think about

22:23

helping kids who are insecure, who feel

22:26

incapable who feel anxious reminding

22:28

them of who God's already made

22:30

them to be. Mhmm. And that's what they get

22:32

to step into. And so I love

22:34

thinking about emotionally strong girls and

22:36

boys. And and there's so much

22:38

we can do even practically to equip them

22:40

to move into that space. So Let's do that. Let's

22:43

do our three practicals. Love that. Will you start us

22:45

off? I will. I would start with

22:47

even where we started in this conversation

22:49

of We wanna begin with an expanse

22:51

of emotional vocabulary. When I was doing

22:54

the research for this book, there was

22:56

a psychologist who described it in a great

22:58

way. He said, you know, how kids start with that

23:00

small box of crayons in the beginning. And,

23:02

you know, think about that's their emotional vocabulary in

23:04

the beginning kinda mad, sad, scared. And then we

23:06

wanna give them that next box of crayons that's

23:09

bigger with more color options and we're gonna

23:11

expand even farther than that and hopefully

23:13

moving all kids to that really thick

23:15

big box of crayons and whatever

23:17

the colors are don't even know what they are. I know.

23:19

And I love that analogy of thinking

23:22

about that over the long haul, but we don't begin

23:24

with that big box of brands. We're just gonna start

23:26

with a smaller box and work toward that.

23:28

And what we're doing within that,

23:31

I talk a little bit in the new book. I love

23:33

the work of Dr. Susan David,

23:35

who wrote a great book called emotional agility,

23:37

and she talks about helping

23:39

kids develop what she calls emotional granularity

23:42

where they can drill down which we talk so

23:44

much about too of what's underneath

23:47

the anger. Yes. You know, you talk so

23:49

much about how often tobleraged

23:51

girls will show up as angry and rigid

23:53

and inflexible and there's some worry underneath

23:56

there. How can we get to what's underneath? And so

23:58

I love thinking about that. What practical

24:00

idea would you add to the list? You're just

24:02

ringing my bell over and over. And I hope

24:04

as we're moving towards the beginning

24:06

of this season. It's making me so

24:08

excited because it feels like there's so much that's

24:10

applicable to us as grown ups too.

24:12

That's certainly our hope as y'all are listening.

24:14

So My second would be

24:16

thinking with girls on

24:19

not only do they have big emotions, often

24:21

the big emotions turn inward. and

24:24

that they can get stuck in those big emotions

24:26

that go all the different directions. I

24:29

always feel like it's important to help

24:31

girls, but I think you do boys to go back

24:33

to place of truth and to have some

24:35

foundational truths. I was trying to think about

24:37

even, like, you know, we love code words

24:39

with your family. Can you come up with like,

24:42

what's your net? Or something that

24:44

as they're falling, that can catch

24:46

them, or just what's

24:48

the truth that you know? So and that's one

24:50

of things when I'm watching my clock for those

24:52

kids who feel so sick and I'm making myself

24:54

sit in it even though I feel comfortable, That's

24:57

what my last fifteen minutes is. It's

25:00

hard because with the big feelers again,

25:02

if they don't feel like we're hearing them,

25:04

they're gonna get bigger. And so

25:06

to always start with, I can tell you're

25:08

so frustrated or, gosh, that's gotta

25:10

be hard or can't even imagine what that's

25:13

like for you that we're reflecting back

25:15

but then to say,

25:18

what

25:18

do you know to be true? I think it

25:20

would help to get to a place of truth right now.

25:22

And if she's you know, mad at all the things

25:24

about herself to say, what else

25:26

do you know might be true? Do you

25:28

think your frame could have gotten in an argument

25:31

with her mom and the car and the way school. Could there be

25:33

more to the story? Let's go back to a

25:35

place of truth. think that's always important and

25:37

for me too. Absolutely.

25:39

I'd end with a third idea that

25:41

I talk about in the book of just encouraging

25:44

parents to narrate their

25:46

experience. with kids

25:48

so that they get to see all

25:50

of what we're talking about today on the

25:52

grown ups they trust in us in this world.

25:54

So If you are leaving

25:57

in the morning to take kids to school and you're

25:59

running late and at the first stop sign, you start

26:01

to do that first star and recognize you feel

26:03

tension in your body, what would it

26:05

look like to narrate and model

26:07

that for kids to say, you know what? I

26:09

feel worried right now about being late.

26:12

My body is telling me that I feel worried right

26:14

now. And at the next stoplight, I'm gonna

26:16

turn on some worship music and kind of let that

26:18

just wash over me or at the next Stop

26:21

sign. I'm gonna do some deep breathing for twenty

26:23

seconds. Let's do that together so that

26:25

kids get to see this in action.

26:27

And I'll tell you, Sissy,

26:29

when you were talking little bit about intuition,

26:31

in fact, all four of those things with girls. I

26:34

had a beautiful picture of that this in

26:36

my office with a family I did an assessment with

26:38

and the dad was narrating

26:40

his experience driving to school

26:42

and he has a lot of pressure he owns some

26:44

business and is worried, I think, is a

26:47

lot of people in the world are about the supply

26:49

chain hurdles that exist still. And

26:51

his daughter had that week

26:54

come home and learned a song at

26:56

church about worry, and she taught it to her parents

26:58

at the dinner table. And he said, I was driving

27:00

school and started thinking about it. And he said, hey, sweetheart,

27:02

teach me that song again about worry because

27:04

I feel like I need that today. And

27:07

his very intuitive daughter, it's everything

27:09

you're telling said, what are you

27:11

worried about that? And he

27:13

answered in a really great age appropriate

27:15

way and said, I have some hurdles at work, and I'm worried

27:17

people aren't gonna get the things they need, and I'm worried

27:19

about my employees. She taught him the

27:21

song and he dropped her off and

27:24

rolled down his window and said, I love you and

27:26

she walked back toward the window and said, dad,

27:28

I'm gonna pray for you today and about

27:30

your worry. And don't forget to sing that

27:33

song back to yourself too. I love you too.

27:35

And I thought, gosh, that's a beautiful picture

27:37

of pulling so many things we're

27:39

talking about in and how when he narrated

27:42

his experience it opened up opportunities.

27:44

You talked about to really affirm

27:46

her intuition and even

27:48

the capability piece. Like, she's capable

27:50

of encouraging her dad and offering some

27:53

great things to him in this moment.

27:54

I am picturing a mom with

27:57

a teenage son. Trying to

27:59

do that in a stuff like, or a

28:01

girl who says, mom, stop it. I

28:03

don't wanna hear you talk about that again. Now with

28:05

adolescents, we would probably

28:07

add modeling. that narrating

28:10

maybe a smidge because they only wanna listen

28:12

if it's about you for about five seconds. But

28:14

modeling it is equally.

28:15

Absolutely. It

28:17

is. Yeah. And don't dismiss the opportunity.

28:20

We talk so much all the time on this podcast

28:22

about kids learn more from observation than

28:24

information. So they're watching, they're

28:26

learning. And

28:27

we need to be doing it too. Yeah. Yeah.

28:29

Just

28:30

having this conversation makes me excited

28:32

about all of where we're headed in

28:34

season five.

28:35

I'm excited about the season two.

28:37

So many good

28:37

things, so many good conversations.

28:39

can't wait to be with you all

28:41

more.

28:46

all the Psalms are so much

28:49

about expressing the emotions that

28:51

we all have. Psalm forty

28:53

two is one that I love and that speaks

28:55

to the thirst as the deer pants for

28:57

streams of water. So my

29:00

so pants for you, my god.

29:02

My so thirst for the living god

29:04

when can I go and meet with God?

29:07

My tears have been my food day and night

29:09

while people say to me all day long.

29:11

Where is your God? the accusations that

29:13

are there. These things I remember, because

29:16

I pull out my soul. But in verse

29:18

five, I love it in the message. Why

29:20

are you down the dumps? You're so? Why are

29:22

you crying the

29:23

blues? And

29:24

then his hope is a reminder

29:27

of truth. fix my

29:29

eyes on God soon I'll be

29:31

praising again. He puts a smile on my

29:33

face. Oh, he's my God.

29:36

David talked so much about the

29:38

three r's, and I love that,

29:40

of acknowledging those emotions. And

29:43

being able to speak of where you are and that's

29:45

what the psalmist does continually.

29:48

Then he brings us back to truth. And

29:50

to me, this is a picture of what

29:53

David and Sissy are talking about in a practical

29:55

way that there is a freedom to

29:57

go into the depths of our heart

29:59

and express

29:59

our thirst, our

30:02

longing, our hunger, our

30:04

theaters.

30:06

I'll throw in a couple of hours to hear myself.

30:09

One is relationship. And so it

30:11

is, in the context of relationship, a

30:13

sense of safety that we can have in

30:16

relationship as we have such fear

30:19

of being rejected, of being attacked.

30:21

But our hope and our

30:23

longing is for people

30:25

to know us to understand

30:28

us, which is really so

30:30

much of what love is. All

30:32

we desire and the depths of

30:34

us is

30:35

to be loved.

30:37

I reminded that this

30:39

was illustrated in the experience

30:41

of high school camp, which is

30:44

where we've been most of the summer.

30:46

one particular night, they

30:48

begin one by one to

30:51

voice their feelings, their

30:53

fears. You could hear

30:56

words like I'm not enough.

30:58

I'm exhausting.

31:00

I need to be everything.

31:03

I run everything. I'm too

31:05

much. When we hear words

31:08

like that, so often we want to give them

31:10

a truth or say no, you're not,

31:12

or to give them a compliment. But

31:14

this is the moment after

31:16

those emotions, those fears, Those

31:19

feelings have been expressed that truth

31:21

can go deep. And this is

31:23

when the kids begin to

31:26

say one sentence. back to them.

31:29

It was simple. One said,

31:31

what you say matters? Another

31:34

said, it's okay to make mistakes. Another

31:37

said, I like that you care so much.

31:40

Another said, you make a

31:42

difference in my life.

31:44

And

31:44

this is when my second

31:46

r would be received. What

31:49

does it mean to receive truth? How

31:51

do we receive truth?

31:53

Well, I think it's when we're feeling

31:55

a sense of helplessness and frustration. And

31:58

this is what happened

31:59

next.

32:01

the truth went deeper to the promises

32:04

that God has given us.

32:06

They began to

32:07

look in their bibles, and

32:10

offer a verse. But

32:12

it was not from a mountaintop

32:15

shouting down to someone in

32:17

despair. it was not from

32:19

a place of I'm

32:21

superior, and I've been through

32:23

that, and I know what you're feeling. It

32:26

was more of I really

32:28

hear you. The relationship was

32:30

one of you. I'm

32:32

not gonna reject you. I'm not gonna

32:34

attack you. and so the depth

32:36

of the promises that god has

32:39

made went deeper.

32:41

It's not just truth bouncing

32:44

off of our protective scores,

32:46

but

32:47

it is truth that goes deeper

32:49

and that truth is from the word

32:51

of god, the written word of god, the

32:54

living word of god, and those

32:56

promises that can go so

32:58

deep inside of us when

33:00

we have had the courage,

33:03

the bravery that says he talked about.

33:05

to say, I'm not enough, and

33:08

that they may be left with

33:10

even just a phrase that John Eldridge

33:12

talks about in his book on resilience.

33:15

I can be a phrase as simple as

33:18

I want you to remember. You're loved,

33:21

chosen, you're safe. in the arms

33:23

of Jesus, and that they

33:25

may leave saying to themselves,

33:28

I'm loved. I might not feel

33:30

it. I'm loved. I'm chosen.

33:32

I'm safe in the arms of Jesus.

33:35

Those words, your words

33:37

go deep. When

33:39

we've allowed them to sit

33:41

with us and be safe,

33:44

we tend to so much want to control

33:47

their emotions and their feelings and

33:49

their frustrations. And yet it's

33:51

only when they've been able

33:53

to feel safe enough with

33:56

you. to voice those fears,

33:59

to voice those emotions

34:01

that they

34:02

can move toward us and experience

34:05

love. for us

34:07

to share and move toward them with

34:09

love, lead to, need to experience

34:13

and receive the truth.

34:15

the promises of god. And

34:17

only when we as the psalmist

34:20

cry out, oh, why am

34:22

I so down in the dumps? Why

34:25

am I crying the blues? It

34:27

is only when we can express that

34:29

and express our feelings that

34:31

we begin. to say with

34:33

confidence. Oh, I fixed my eyes on

34:36

God. Soon I'll be praising again.

34:39

So the two hours It

34:41

is through relationship, through

34:44

you being a safe person

34:46

that will not move against

34:48

them or away from them. but

34:51

toward them in love that

34:53

they are able to receive

34:56

the truth of the promises

34:59

of god that he will never leave them.

35:01

He'll never forsake them and that

35:03

they are loved and chosen and

35:06

safe in the arms of Jesus.

35:14

Hi. I'm Eric Goss, Dad of

35:16

Three and CEO of Meadow, a

35:18

streaming platform for Christian families. We

35:21

can put so much pressure on ourselves as parents.

35:23

Are we raising healthy kids? Are we

35:26

spending enough time with them? Are we

35:28

doing the right things to help nurture their emotional

35:30

intelligence, their faith, and their physical well-being?

35:33

Are we guiding them well? The questions

35:35

and the pressures are endless. But

35:37

what if instead of trying to do it all our

35:39

own way, We ask god what is

35:41

he doing in the lives of our children and

35:43

then come alongside his work. A

35:45

few questions we can ask him in prayer. God,

35:48

what are you doing or wanting to do in my

35:50

child's life right now? And

35:52

how can I join you in what you're doing?

35:55

God, can you help me understand where they are

35:57

and what they need? Then

35:59

we listen

35:59

and actively wait for the Holy Spirit

36:02

to show us what God is doing and how

36:04

we can best support how he's working in our kids'

36:06

lives.

36:07

The pressure is not on us for our children

36:09

to know and love the lord, We're working in

36:11

partnership with the holy spirit. What

36:13

a relief.

36:14

Peroning is one of life's greatest and

36:16

most humbling journeys. Thank the Lord, we

36:19

don't travel long.

36:22

It's our joy to bring the experience

36:24

and insight we

36:25

gain through our work beyond the walls of

36:27

the Desjardins house. If you enjoyed

36:30

this conversation, please

36:32

share it with your friends and don't forget

36:34

to click the follow button in your favorite

36:36

podcast app so you never miss an

36:38

episode. To learn more

36:40

about our parenting resources or

36:43

to see if we're coming to a city near you,

36:45

our website at raisingboysand Girls

36:48

dot com.

36:49

Join us next time for more help and

36:51

hope as you continue your journey of

36:54

raising boys and girls.