0:00

What are, like, the normal problems you deal

0:02

with when you're dealing with coaching high school

0:04

students? Did you say normal problems?

0:07

You don't have enough time. You

0:09

do not have enough time.

0:15

For about thirty years, Howard

0:17

Langley dealt with all kinds of issues

0:19

as a high school football and track coach

0:21

in New York

0:22

City. Some small things he could laugh

0:24

off like equipment malfunction. The

0:27

the gamut, clothes, no

0:30

pleats. Because the kid busted

0:32

out issues and there was nothing else.

0:34

But sometimes, it got a little

0:36

more complicated. Like the night

0:38

he walked in on his players at a football

0:41

camp.

0:42

And I see two guys with boxing

0:44

gloves, squaring up, and I'm like, what

0:46

the hell? I thought my best

0:48

kids were my best kids, and

0:51

then I realized, no, they'd like everybody

0:53

else. They're gonna do silly stuff. But

0:56

it made me even more alert as

0:58

to what can happen if I'm not

1:00

necessarily in their space.

1:05

Langley has always been confident

1:08

in his ability to manage his team.

1:10

But still, he

1:12

worried about what could happen in the locker room when

1:14

he wasn't around, like hazy.

1:17

I mean, he saw other coaches get

1:19

blamed for hazing scandals on their teams.

1:22

So it wasn't out of the question.

1:24

And that thought, it kept him up

1:26

at night because I

1:28

knew that while we were away, I never had full control

1:30

of the students. You

1:32

know, moving towards the end of my career, I'm like,

1:35

I would hate for us to have had this

1:37

very excellent run and

1:40

one incident to blow it all up because that's

1:42

what people remember. So that

1:45

is basically the reason

1:47

why I stopped coaching. The

1:49

coach can't be everywhere, you

1:51

know, and he he he actually can't

1:53

monitor everything. His

1:57

fears aren't unreasonable. I

2:00

found several hazing cases where coaches

2:02

have been fired, suspended, sued.

2:06

Sometimes it's because coaches knew about their

2:08

teams hazing traditions and did nothing

2:10

to stop them. And sometimes,

2:13

it's just because they're supposed to be

2:15

the one in charge. The

2:17

easiest thing is to fire the coach.

2:20

That's Rob Miller. He's never

2:22

been caught up in a hazel scandal. But

2:24

he used to coach multiple sports at both

2:26

the high school and college level. Today,

2:29

he coaches coaches on how to be

2:32

good leaders.

2:33

The need your reaction shouldn't

2:35

be fired at the coast. The reaction should

2:37

be what went wrong. Let's figure

2:39

it out and let's solve it. Now,

2:41

is there situations where the coach should be fired

2:44

probably? Because they didn't do the oversight,

2:46

they didn't do what they should have been, and it

2:48

came down to that

2:54

For Rodney Kim Junior's family,

2:56

what happened in the Davidson locker room?

2:58

Was very much one of those latter

3:00

situations. At

3:03

this time, the regular meeting of

3:05

the board school commissioners will come

3:07

to order. Okay. Citizens

3:10

requested this time we have Rodney

3:12

Kim junior two

3:14

months after getting heezed. Rodney

3:17

stood in front of the mobile county school board.

3:20

His arm still in a

3:21

cast. Rodney had one thing

3:23

to say. And he got to the point

3:25

quickly. Good

3:27

evening. Good

3:28

evening. To the school board members, my

3:30

name is Ratin Kim Junior. And I've come

3:32

to you today asking for the removal of

3:34

Coast Freight Riley.

3:38

Now remember, Rodney

3:40

got jumped on school property after football

3:42

practice. Riley and the other

3:44

four coaches were there that day, and

3:46

all of them denied witnessing the attack.

3:49

But the Kim family felt the man

3:51

in charge, head coach Fred

3:54

Riley should be held responsible. So

3:57

one by one, family members, friends,

3:59

and supporters came before the

4:01

school board and echoed what Rodney

4:04

had to

4:04

say. Fire the

4:06

coach. I just asked

4:08

for the removal of coach, Fred Riley. I

4:10

am here in support of

4:12

the And I am here for the support of the removal,

4:15

Fred. I even neglected his duty

4:17

when he didn't take care of this child.

4:19

Any adult that was stand by

4:22

while children are being abused

4:24

and do

4:25

nothing. They do not deserve

4:27

to work in the system. Friedrich, to

4:30

me did not do the job he was supposed

4:32

to do.

4:37

A coach's job is to develop players,

4:40

teach the game, and tally up some wins,

4:43

But we also trust them to mentor

4:45

and be a role model and keep these kids

4:47

under their watch

4:48

safe. But how much

4:50

oversight is reasonable to expect?

4:53

And how much do parents have a legal right to

4:55

expect from coaches or any school

4:57

officials? In this episode,

5:00

we'll try to answer some of those questions.

5:02

By looking at Fred Riley's record both

5:04

on and off the field, What

5:08

did he know about his team's hazing traditions?

5:10

What sort of culture did develop on his teams?

5:13

And could he as head coach

5:16

have prevented what happened to Rodney.

5:19

Amigimonda from religion of

5:21

sports and PRX. This

5:23

is rough out. Stay

5:26

with us.

5:37

Hey

5:37

there. My name is Jody African, and I'm

5:39

the host of a new podcast from Ted

5:41

called GoodSport. I've learned

5:43

a ton of life lessons from playing sports,

5:46

from watching sports, and from covering sports

5:48

in my career as a journalist. During our

5:50

first season of good sport will look at

5:52

hotbeds of talent, how a new sport

5:54

like f one can break through, how to

5:56

deal with aging out of playing sports

5:58

at the highest level and lots more.

6:01

Check out GoodSport on Spotify, Amazon

6:04

Music, or wherever you listen.

6:10

I wanted to know more about the man

6:12

the Kim family blames for what happened

6:15

to their son. What's his background?

6:18

What's he like as a coach? I've

6:20

tried to get Fred Riley on the phone many

6:22

times, left a ton of messages, sent

6:24

him emails, called his attorney,

6:27

but I've yet to get any kind of response.

6:30

So I got to digging.

6:33

Riley was born in Birmingham in nineteen

6:35

sixty. And grew up in the football

6:37

loving state of Alabama. But

6:40

his love for coaching was born on a baseball

6:42

time. Riley's father was

6:44

a cold miner, who coached Little League.

6:47

And he would stay after every practice

6:49

and teach this neighborhood kid, Bobby

6:51

Brown, had a play catch. Here's

6:54

Riley on the local news in twenty eighteen.

6:57

By that, he was sitting there while he played

6:59

catch Bobby Brown. I watched

7:01

my dad and raised that child. You could

7:03

tell a difference he was making in his life.

7:05

And I and I sat through an eight year old and said, that's

7:07

what happened. And that's right about it. I'm

7:09

gonna be a coach.

7:14

Following his days as a college quarterback,

7:17

Riley spent the next two decades

7:19

hopping back and forth between college

7:21

and high school coaching gigs, rising

7:23

in the ranks from graduate assistant to

7:25

coordinator. And eventually head coach.

7:28

His win ROS record was

7:31

spotty. Until he

7:33

got to

7:33

Davidson. Riley won one hundred

7:35

ten games and lost just fifty in fourteen

7:37

years leading the Warriors.

7:40

No Davis and Coach ever won more football

7:42

games than Fred Riley. No

7:44

one even came close. Co

7:46

trial in the Davidson football coaches,

7:49

their heroes in Mobile County. There's there's

7:51

some of the best.

7:53

But he always said that to him, the

7:55

job was about much more

7:57

than just

7:58

sports. Here he is

8:00

at Mobile's twenty eighteen football

8:02

media day. Well, our golden

8:04

day since two thousand and four all the way now has

8:06

always been to to develop young people

8:09

come good men, good husbands, good fathers,

8:11

come back in the community and make the world

8:13

a better place because they are

8:14

there. Our job is not to

8:17

you have many, you know, range we built on containers.

8:20

You would tell you'd like a you

8:22

only got ten games in a year, so take advantage

8:25

of that and then after that ten games, like, life

8:27

goes on. Jaden Jordan

8:29

was a sophomore quarterback when Rodney was on

8:31

the team, but he wasn't in the

8:33

locker room when Rodney got hurt. He

8:36

remembers Riley as a

8:37

mentor.

8:38

So he would see just like life lessons. He would give us

8:40

light live talks. Defensive

8:42

back camera and Stuart. Who was a

8:44

senior and no longer on the team when

8:46

Rodney was

8:47

hazed, remembers Riley as a

8:49

mentor and competitor.

8:51

I don't care if it's raining. I

8:53

don't care if it's snowing. My god. We're

8:55

gonna practice. My

8:57

god. We're gonna get it done. When he said

8:59

that, everybody knew, like, it's

9:01

gonna get done. But he was always

9:03

trying to teach her something or he was like

9:05

a guru in a

9:06

way. I just always viewed him as like,

9:08

not a father figure with somebody just that I

9:10

could trust I could talk to, but

9:12

not everybody who played for Riley

9:15

felt that way.

9:21

If our team was a healthy body,

9:23

he would be more of a virus.

9:26

He comes in, the stores, everything he

9:28

can, and get up. That's

9:33

former arena football star Michael

9:35

Danzby. He played under coach

9:37

Riley at Enzley High School in Birmingham before

9:40

Riley came to Davidson. Riley

9:42

was named head coach there in two thousand

9:45

during Danesby senior year. He

9:48

came in. I mean, really just,

9:50

dunk it all low. Danzvi

9:53

says Riley was quick to criticize. He'd

9:55

tell his players that they weren't as

9:57

good as some of the other teams they lined up

9:59

against.

10:01

You can't hang with these guys. What

10:03

coast would say to everybody, I

10:05

don't care who you are. Human nature.

10:07

Everybody needed that reinsurance. And

10:10

he was never gave you that. He was never

10:12

saying good

10:13

job. He was always finding some

10:15

type of negative toys Danzvi

10:19

says Riley never connected with the team

10:22

that he just wasn't a good cultural

10:24

fit. See, Enzley

10:27

was a majority black school with a

10:29

largely black team. Riley

10:32

was the only white head football coach

10:34

in all of Birmingham's nine high schools

10:36

at the

10:36

time. And Danzby felt

10:39

that there was always racial tension

10:41

in the air. I've had other

10:43

white coats. Really, really took

10:45

me out of their way. They ROS some good guys.

10:47

But I'm just saying, like, he pointed those ass,

10:49

like, we were thugs and

10:51

we wasn't trouble making us. He wasn't

10:54

anything but

10:54

yeah. He would pretty much

10:57

belittle you. When

10:59

Dean's be graduated, he thought he

11:01

was done thinking about co trialing.

11:04

He

11:04

went to college at Jackson State University, continued

11:07

playing ball, and got on with

11:09

his life.

11:10

But then one day, Danzby

11:12

ran into a college recruiter from the University

11:15

of Louisville. He actually was

11:17

my name. When I told him, he was like, we

11:19

were recruited you last year, and I'm like, I

11:21

never got nothing from y'all. And he

11:23

told me, yeah, the coach told me you was un coachable.

11:26

That's why we kinda stopped. And I was like,

11:28

what?

11:31

Uncoachable. That

11:33

word came up another time in my

11:36

reporting. I learned that

11:38

Riley had lost his head coaching job at

11:40

Enzley after one season. And

11:42

so I called the principal at the school, to

11:44

find out what happened. She

11:47

didn't wanna be recorded, but

11:49

she also told me that Riley

11:51

had used the exact same word.

11:54

Uncoachable to describe players.

11:57

To her, that was a problem, a

12:00

big one. And it was representative

12:02

of a philosophy that didn't align

12:04

with hers. She

12:06

told me, quote, it

12:08

takes a lot of love and support.

12:11

And when people don't have that, I

12:13

just don't think they're the right choice

12:16

to work with the kids that I work with.

12:19

The Birmingham School Board transferred Riley

12:21

to another school, but it was

12:23

a demotion. He would be someone

12:26

else's assistant coach. So

12:28

instead, he resigned. And

12:31

then he sued, claiming that

12:33

he was being racially discriminated

12:35

against. Some

12:37

players and community members rallied behind

12:40

Riley, but that didn't sway the

12:42

principal or the school board. And

12:44

a couple of years later, the court

12:46

ruled that Riley had no real evidence

12:48

for his claims of reverse

12:50

racism. By

12:53

that time, Riley had already

12:55

been hired as the head coach at Davidson

12:57

High School. I

13:03

can't tell you whether or not Michael Danzvi

13:05

was uncoachable,

13:07

though he did go on to win multiple awards

13:09

in professional arena football. And

13:12

he isn't the only player who claims

13:14

Riley deliberately hurt his prospects.

13:17

I heard stories of stacks of college

13:20

letters found in the trash in Raleigh's office.

13:22

And kids having the break into a classroom

13:24

to get film tape that had been kept from

13:26

them. And the people who told me

13:29

these things, they played for Riley

13:31

at different times. They didn't

13:33

know each other. They never even

13:35

met. All of this paints

13:38

a picture of a coach who may

13:40

not have always advocated or looked

13:42

out for all of his players equally. But

13:45

does that really mean that he would allow

13:48

violence in the locker room as the

13:50

Kim family alleges? Some

13:52

of his former players told me that they never

13:54

saw or experienced any haacing

13:56

while playing for Riley. Danzvi,

13:58

for example, said that the closest they

14:00

ever got was putting shaving cream in

14:03

someone's helmet. And when the news

14:05

of Rodney's beating first broke in twenty

14:07

eighteen, the allegations around

14:09

Riley were met with suspicion,

14:12

both from local media, was

14:15

it actually a hazing that the

14:18

coaching staff would turn a blind eye to

14:20

understanding that it was going to happen? I

14:23

find that hard to

14:23

believe. I find it very hard to believe. And

14:25

you can say, and alumni.

14:27

I'm gonna call total BS on all of

14:30

that. I know every single

14:32

quote on that stuff. And I know for a fact

14:34

that that's not something that they're very allowed to

14:36

happen. As long as he's been with Davidson,

14:39

hazing has never been an issue. Nothing

14:41

like this has never

14:42

happened. But then, I

14:44

talked to Juan Poe. When

14:47

I saw the video, I wasn't shocked at

14:49

all. The first thing I said was, oh, they

14:51

still do that type of stuff.

14:57

Post started playing for the Davidson Warriors

14:59

in twenty thirteen. Five

15:02

years before Rodney's incident. He

15:04

says that that kind of roughhousing that

15:06

he saw in Rodney's video was common

15:09

when he played. And post

15:11

says coach Fred Riley was a hundred

15:13

percent aware of

15:14

it. I remember one fight ahead that

15:16

got kicked me in the mouth, and my mouth was leaking.

15:19

I had blood running down with out. And then,

15:21

actually, when I sat down, coach Riley

15:23

said, man, he must got you pretty good. And

15:25

he started laughing at stuff. And I just looked

15:27

back I was like, this guy, and

15:30

I went and rinsed on my mouth and all that

15:32

man. Can't bet the weights like it's a normal day

15:34

because Dave was saying that was

15:36

a culture. That

15:40

was the culture. One

15:42

that Pope claims the coaching staff witnessed

15:45

all the time.

15:46

So how the lock room is set up, the

15:49

coach is actually watching you in a lock room.

15:51

They're actually upstairs and they can

15:53

look above the rear and see the entire outline.

15:56

Poe is actually describing the assistant coaches

15:58

here. The head coach's office

16:00

is on the ground floor just around a

16:02

corner.

16:03

So there's no way they don't hear

16:05

you fighting. Here's somebody getting beat up.

16:07

Here's somebody getting slammed on the

16:09

ground. Here are people fighting. There's

16:11

this absolutely no way that they don't see it

16:13

right here.

16:14

They weren't, like, in an office, they weren't

16:16

outside, they weren't walk into locker

16:19

room, They were

16:20

looking at us fight with watch the fight

16:22

and then say, okay, it's time to live. You

16:24

guys cut it out. But

16:30

Poe believed there was more to it.

16:33

He felt that the fighting was tolerated

16:35

in part because of his and his teammates

16:37

ROS. When you watch

16:40

two men fight each other and

16:42

you let that happen, your value of their

16:44

life isn't high.

16:46

Still, he never complained

16:48

about the locker room culture to Riley

16:51

or any other adults. Who are you

16:53

gonna tell? People don't really understand how

16:55

much power these coaches have? So

16:57

what what are you gonna go to your high school coaches say,

16:59

hey, man, the big guys were hitting on me. What do you

17:01

look like? To him, to

17:03

that coach, he was a gladiator, man.

17:06

Football is a gladiator sport.

17:08

Your coach teacher life is a gladiator. And

17:10

everyone prays you for being a

17:12

gladiator.

17:17

But they aren't gladiators. Their

17:19

kids in high school. Kids

17:22

who mess around and kids

17:24

who are coached to be tough, to be able

17:26

to take a hit. And win some games.

17:30

So when hazing does happen, this

17:33

is where it gets tricky. Because

17:35

sometimes coaches say these incidents

17:38

happen out of their view. Maybe

17:40

at a player's home or in the back

17:42

of a school bus. What

17:44

do we make of that? How

17:51

much responsibility do coaches

17:53

have when it comes to hazing.

17:55

They can't control people's actions,

17:58

but what they need to do is educate them.

18:01

That's Rob Millerigan. The former

18:03

coach who today coaches coaches

18:05

and helps schools build better athletic

18:08

programs. The way he sees

18:10

it, the coach has a responsibility to

18:12

build a culture of accountability, of

18:15

respect. One that strikes

18:17

at hazing before it happens.

18:20

Hazing never has built a team. You can't

18:22

tell me hazing builds teams, it destroys

18:24

teams. So we have to educate our players

18:26

from the forefront. We have to create standards

18:29

that say, this is wrong. It's not what we

18:31

do as a team. Our culture does not allow

18:33

that as a team. We have to help build

18:35

positive traditions, not traditions

18:37

that tear down demeanor and various other people

18:39

on our team. For example,

18:42

one coach told me that he would have

18:44

a team breakfast every year where

18:47

the freshman would have to bring bagels and

18:49

orange juice for the upperclassmen and they

18:51

would introduce themselves simple

18:54

and nutritious. But

18:57

if hazing does occur, Miller

19:00

says that it's important that the coach acts

19:02

quickly and decisively to

19:05

send a clear message to the kids. We

19:07

have to jump on it right away. And too

19:09

many people close their eyes in that situation

19:11

and say, well, it just happened. Boys

19:14

will be boys. This will happen. No.

19:16

How are we gonna take care of?

19:17

This. I heard a similar

19:19

sentiment from coach Langley. I

19:21

always try to nip any kind of

19:23

hierarchy as soon as I

19:26

I found out because no matter

19:28

how much you might like them, they're kids and

19:31

they're not to be trusted.

19:35

Joanne Poe saw this kind of approach

19:37

in action. He

19:39

ended up transferring out of Davidson his

19:41

sophomore year in search of better recruitment

19:43

opportunities.

19:45

At the next school he played for, a

19:47

freshman on the team was being picked up.

19:49

We

19:49

really wouldn't even hesitate and they were just kinda

19:52

messing with him.

19:54

His new coach was

19:56

furious. Coach shut it

19:58

down just like just like that. We

20:00

hadn't mean that next practice is that

20:02

no one will deal with the freshness. Don't talk to

20:05

don't even don't bother the freshness. He's

20:07

like, we do not tolerate that

20:09

year. And he was very adamant

20:11

about that. And I was like, whoa. This

20:13

guy serious

20:14

never happened again. And

20:16

that's what he's come to expect from a

20:18

coach older man is supposed

20:21

to give wise counsel to these young man.

20:23

That's what a coach is. Coach is supposed

20:25

to give that rest.

20:27

Miller agreed If we're not providing

20:29

an environment where our young people can step

20:31

up and reach potential as players and

20:33

as people, we haven't done our job.

20:36

Championships are great. I wanna win.

20:38

I'm all about getting after being the best we

20:40

can be by reaching potential. But

20:42

if that's your only reason for coaching, then

20:44

you miss what we're doing in profession. If

20:47

you're all about performance and not about

20:49

culture, your team's in trouble.

20:54

So talk into former players

20:56

and other coaches. It's

20:58

clear that the head coach has

21:00

the power to set the tone to

21:02

create the rules that govern the team culture.

21:06

Several players say Riley's rules

21:09

didn't prohibit violence or as he called

21:11

it a rough housing from going on in the locker

21:13

Other guys say that isn't true. Either

21:16

way though, even if he did

21:18

allow violence or hazy. Would

21:21

that be a crime? Could

21:24

he be held responsible for what happened to

21:26

Rodney? That's

21:29

after the break.

21:41

Charles Bonner grew up in Selma, Alabama

21:43

during the nineteen sixties. When

21:45

he was a teenager, he dedicated

21:48

his life to the civil rights movement.

21:50

Frequently going to

21:51

jail, practice spent more time in jail

21:53

than I did in the classroom,

21:55

Today, he fights his battles

21:57

in the courtroom. When a lawyer,

22:00

like me, and civil rights lawyer, these cases

22:02

are very personal. They're not about

22:04

money. They're not about glory.

22:07

They're about empathy. It's about

22:09

standing in the shoes of these victims

22:11

and feeling what they are feeling

22:14

and then trying to deliver

22:16

them to the other side of

22:18

this quiet mind of pain.

22:20

So when the Kims called, Bonner

22:22

took up their case immediately.

22:27

I have never seen anything like

22:29

this in my time as a turning where

22:32

a school just allowed this

22:34

kind of rampant fight

22:36

club to go on. Rodney

22:39

Kim Junior, this fourteen year old boy who

22:41

had a dream of becoming a quarterback

22:44

they stole that dream from him

22:46

when they allowed this hazing to occur.

22:49

And then I think when I was fourteen

22:51

years old,

22:52

how my life was, what

22:54

my dreams were, and it becomes

22:57

very personal. Remember,

23:01

The Kim's first met with school leadership

23:03

and Fred Riley three days

23:05

after Rodney's beating. They

23:07

say Riley dismissed what happened to Rodney

23:09

as just, quote, roughhousing. And

23:12

they didn't feel like anyone was taking it

23:14

seriously. They wanted

23:16

the school board to make sure this didn't

23:18

happen again. To punish

23:20

not just the kids, but also

23:22

the adults they felt were responsible. They

23:25

wanted accountability. But

23:28

instead, they waited and

23:30

grew frustrated.

23:32

No one would answer me. No

23:35

one. Lawson didn't

23:37

run across my mind. But the

23:39

longer it took for me to get

23:41

answers from an adult? It was

23:43

the only way.

23:45

Charles Bonner felt that they had a strong

23:47

case So he filed

23:49

a federal lawsuit on the Kim's behalf

23:51

that went after the Mobile Board of Education,

23:54

the superintendent, the principal, school

23:56

board members coaches, and specifically,

23:59

Fred Riley. The lawsuit

24:02

had many demands. Among

24:04

them, that Davidson would forfeit its

24:06

twenty eighteen season and that the

24:08

whole coaching staff be fired. And

24:10

at the beginning of August, a little

24:13

more than three months after the incident.

24:15

Bonner filed additional

24:17

lawsuits for three more families. Those

24:20

parents claimed that their kids were also

24:23

either hazed or beaten by

24:25

football players at Davidson, and

24:27

that nothing was done to stop the behavior.

24:30

They even had more video proof of violence

24:32

from the football team on school grounds.

24:35

How could they allow these children to

24:37

beat each other up year after year year after

24:40

year and nothing was done

24:42

about it. It was like another

24:44

form of oppression. Bonner

24:47

and the families thought Riley should have faced

24:49

consequences. They decided

24:52

to confront mobile district attorney Ashley

24:54

Rich at her

24:54

office. They asked her to file criminal

24:57

charges against the coach.

24:59

And I said, well, listen, you know, why don't

25:01

you punish these coaches bring charges

25:03

against him under the Hazen law. And she said,

25:06

what hazing law? I

25:09

mean, she looked at me like

25:11

a mirror looking at a street car like,

25:13

what hazing law are you talking about? And that's

25:16

what you have your Alabama code right

25:18

there behind you. You're back. And she said, yes,

25:20

we'll pull it down. And she reached back and pull it

25:22

down. And I looked up this particular

25:24

statue, and gave her the statue. And

25:26

she opened it up and she looked at

25:28

it

25:29

like, wow. I

25:31

didn't know about this. At

25:33

the time, Alabama was

25:35

one of forty four states that had

25:37

an anti hazing

25:38

law. And Alabama law

25:41

clearly says, anyone

25:43

who encourages the best

25:45

aids that conduct is guilt

25:47

of a misdemeanor. And if you fail

25:49

to report it, the law says you're

25:51

just as culpable.

25:53

So Riley should have been prosecuted for misdemeanor,

25:55

and all of those coaches should have been prosecuted

25:57

for misdemeanor. But the district

26:00

attorney declined the press charges against

26:02

Riley or the coaching staff. From

26:04

what I can tell, Alabama's

26:06

hazing law has been on the books since at least

26:08

nineteen eighty one. But has never

26:11

actually been used to file criminal charges.

26:14

She prosecuted all

26:16

of the boys, but those

26:18

boys were only doing what the adults

26:21

allowed them to do, and the

26:23

adults have not been punched. So

26:25

she hasn't done anything to stop the

26:27

conduct.

26:32

One of Rodney's attackers. Who was expelled

26:35

and sent the juvenile detention, said

26:37

the same in an anonymous interview with the

26:39

local TV

26:40

station. The people who

26:42

was locked up with me,

26:44

they feel the same way. They just wanted

26:46

just to coach rather than tell the truth

26:49

so I just can just stop happening

26:51

so we can go back to our normalizing play

26:54

football.

26:55

The truth, this family says coach

26:57

Riley knew there was hazing going on

26:59

among David since football players, even

27:01

witnessing some of it himself.

27:10

I don't know the district attorney's reasons for

27:12

not pressing charges. I wish

27:14

I could ask her. But she hasn't returned

27:16

any of my calls or emails. The

27:20

school finally placed Riley on administrative

27:23

leave on August eighth twenty eighteen.

27:26

More than three months after Rodney

27:28

was hased, and a couple days after

27:30

new videos emerged of kids in the

27:32

fieldhouse fighting one on one of

27:35

players throwing students into trash cans

27:37

and bushes, and one kid

27:39

even getting glassed with his own belt. Riley

27:43

retired from the school system a month later.

27:46

He now is the owner and head coach of

27:48

a semi pro football team in Fairhold,

27:50

Alabama. His

27:52

Davidson legacy remains complicated.

27:55

Even for the anonymous player who

27:57

lost his high school and for poker.

28:00

Despite all that has happened and wanting

28:02

him to come forward and speak up for his players,

28:05

This former Davidson player says he still

28:07

admires coach Riley. He

28:10

said because he was a good coach.

28:12

So

28:13

you still look up to him? Yes, ma'am.

28:23

The families filed the lawsuit because they

28:25

wanted accountability. But

28:28

that's not what caught people's attention. The

28:30

four families asked for twelve

28:33

million dollars each in damages.

28:35

That number rubbed

28:38

a lot of people in mobile the wrong

28:40

way, including former Davidson

28:42

players, like Jaden Jordan and Cameron

28:44

Stewart. And the lawsuit

28:46

came. It was just like a jaw dropper. Told

28:48

me no. That's a pretty big number.

28:50

Of course, he got his arm broke. Like, people should

28:52

be held accountable. You know,

28:54

but that is a lot of money for that.

28:57

And I kinda get

28:59

that. That's a

29:02

lot of money. From

29:04

what I can tell, there's never

29:07

been a judgment that high in any

29:09

high school hazing case. But

29:11

Charles Bonner says he is on a mission.

29:14

One that's bigger than Davidson, bigger

29:17

than Fred Riley.

29:20

I hope to bring to

29:23

this country's attention the

29:26

danger of hazing. Their

29:29

threat to our children's safety

29:32

and health and their future by this

29:34

kind of conduct going on, so

29:36

that must be stopped. I mean, just

29:39

think about it. Everest species first

29:41

protects their young. No

29:44

matter what species, We've betrayed

29:47

them by allowing violence to

29:49

become pervasive all over. The

29:51

school system from the school shootings days

29:57

Bonner is currently representing the victims

29:59

of the twenty twenty two Yuvali School

30:01

shooting, which took the lives

30:04

of nineteen children and two adults.

30:07

He filed a twenty seven billion

30:09

dollar class action lawsuit, against

30:12

anyone who might bear any responsibility

30:14

in that case, from law enforcement

30:17

to gun manufacturers. And

30:19

if that number got your attention, That's

30:22

Bonner's whole point. He

30:24

says, this is America.

30:27

If you wanna get a point

30:29

across, aim for

30:31

the wallet. Justice

30:33

in this culture equals money. Money

30:35

is the only way to modify a

30:37

behavior of conduct that is dangerous.

30:39

We have to make it too expensive for

30:42

them to ignore the health and safety and

30:44

welfare of our children.

30:53

This approach has worked for Bonner and others

30:55

in the past. But when it

30:57

comes to hazy, can a

31:00

court decision really drive the

31:02

kind of change he and the Kims

31:04

are looking for? Next

31:10

time, to try to answer that question,

31:12

we're gonna leave mobile in the Kims.

31:15

And look at another Hazen case involving

31:17

a high school dance team in suburban Oregon.

31:21

In this one, the case is over.

31:23

The family did get

31:25

justice, but it came at

31:27

an extremely high price. It

31:30

was just really unreal

31:32

to me that a ton of adults would

31:34

rather kick a child out

31:37

than try to work to protect them and

31:39

others in the future. That's

31:44

next time on rough house.

31:49

This episode was written and reported by

31:51

me, Biggie Mondo. Jessica

31:54

Popovac is our senior producer. Our

31:56

lead producer is Nina Earnest. Cianna

31:59

Petros and Carly Prutio are our associate

32:01

producers with support from Meghan coil.

32:04

Michael Groffalo is our editor. Tommy

32:07

Bazarian from PRX productions is our

32:09

engineer. Fact checking

32:11

done by Jane Ackerman and Kim Frieda.

32:13

Our executive producers are Gautam Chopra,

32:16

Amit Shankaran, and Adam

32:18

Schlossman. Special

32:20

thanks to Jocnor and Joanne

32:22

Pope. Ruffhousing is production

32:25

of religion of sports and PRX. If

32:27

you like the show, first, thank you.

32:30

We love you. I hope you keep listening. And

32:32

second, Please leave us a

32:34

review on Apple Podcasts or wherever

32:36

you listen to your stories.

32:47

From PRX.