0:00

You're listening to Ruthie's Table four in

0:02

partnership with Montclair over

0:15

the last few days. When I tell people we're

0:17

doing a podcast with Eric Repair, their

0:19

face is light up. At the River

0:22

Cafe, we spend our days

0:24

making ravioli with ricotta viieleenchi

0:26

anti, pannacotta with grappa. But

0:28

when we as chefs come together, we

0:31

talk about French food. The bouliebss,

0:33

the palm d'au finoise, the tartetans.

0:37

Eric Cook's French food were inspired by

0:39

Italian but maybe we're not

0:41

so different. He's been the chef

0:43

at Bernadine, his Mission and three star

0:45

Fish and Seafood restaurant for

0:47

more than thirty years. I'm ahead by

0:49

four years, having cooked at the River Cafe

0:52

since nineteen eighty seven and

0:54

a profession that is ever changing

0:56

and always challenging. Eric is an inspiration,

0:59

a mentor, and someone we look up to

1:02

today. I'm here in New York with him talking

1:04

about us living in different cities, cooking

1:06

the food of different countries. But

1:09

you know what, we're pretty much the same.

1:11

Two chefs with much to share.

1:13

Thank you, thank you so much

1:15

for being here, and thank you for this great

1:18

introduction.

1:19

No, that's true. So I

1:21

thought it would be disrespectful for the

1:23

great chef to read a recipe from the River

1:26

Cafe. So I would like you

1:28

to read it yourself of one of your

1:30

recipes, and we chose.

1:32

The few soup.

1:34

I'm going to start with a quote from

1:36

you, Eric. Yes, and

1:38

you wrote in this book, think

1:41

about your favorite dish. For many

1:43

of us, it's something we ate in childhood,

1:45

whose deliciousness lies in how uncomplicated

1:48

it is. For me, it's

1:51

a simple fish soup made by my grandmother.

1:54

This is the most rewarding way to approach

1:56

cooking, using culinary knowledge

1:59

to achieve simplicity.

2:02

Yes, I have very vivid memories

2:04

of grandma doing the fish soup youtail.

2:07

Oh, for sure, tell me about your grandma.

2:10

So I had two grandmothers, one was Italian,

2:13

one from Provence, and

2:16

they both made fish soup by the way, of course,

2:19

But my favorite memory is the one from

2:21

the Italian grandmother because

2:25

on the weekend the family would

2:27

gather together, like all the

2:29

uncles and cousins and my grandfather

2:32

and grandma and so on, and they

2:34

would go fishing and scuba diving

2:36

and catching whatever they would catch, and

2:39

then my grandmother was in charge

2:41

of the lunch. She would

2:43

make the table for twenty people, twenty

2:46

five people. She would prepare a lot

2:48

of things, salads and appetizer,

2:51

but she would prepare for the fish soup.

2:53

So whatever fish was coming back, it will

2:55

be cleaned very quickly, and

2:57

then she would make the fish soup.

3:00

They're own side and we will eat

3:02

that fish soup. I

3:04

don't know an hour later or two hours lad that

3:07

was cooked under the trees overlooking

3:10

them. Yes, no, close

3:12

to antibet between auntiebe and and can.

3:15

Okay, well, do you want to read the recipe and we can talk

3:18

more about we're going to talk about.

3:20

So for the fish soup, we use a

3:22

quark cup of extra vaginallyve

3:24

oil, one medium onion

3:27

thinly sliced, half a

3:29

bulb of fennel trimmed and thinly

3:31

slice as well, four cloves

3:34

of garlic chopped, one

3:36

teaspoon of saffron thread,

3:39

three cups of can whole tomato

3:41

with their juice, a corek cup

3:44

of perno one bay leave,

3:47

two pounds of egg chile skin

3:50

cut into chunks. Or

3:52

you can ask a fishmonger for Lian

3:55

white fish scraps

3:57

potentially find the salt and

4:00

freshly grinded black

4:02

pepper. And then

4:04

in a large, heavy bottom pot you

4:07

eat the extravaginallyve oil over

4:09

medium heat. You add the onions,

4:12

the fennel, the garlic, and you sote

4:14

for five minutes. You

4:16

steer in the saffron and cook until

4:19

the vegetables are soften and

4:21

translucent, which takes

4:23

about five minutes. Again, then

4:25

you crush the tomatoes with a fork. You

4:28

add them to the pot along with

4:30

perno and the bay leaf. Then

4:32

you season the fish with sea salt

4:35

and white paper and add it

4:37

to the pot. You add enough water

4:39

to cover the fish by about one

4:41

inch. You bring it to seamur

4:44

and you cook for twenty five minutes. Then

4:47

you remove from the heat and you let

4:49

stand for five minutes. You

4:52

remove the bay leaf, and then

4:54

you strain the broth through a colander

4:56

into a pot. You pure the fish

4:58

and vegetables badgies ah.

5:01

You put them yeah in.

5:03

A food meal and whisked

5:06

the pury back into the broth. And

5:08

then you season with sea salt and white

5:10

pepper, and then you divide into

5:13

among warm bowls. So

5:15

that's the recipe of the book inspired

5:17

by Grandma Grama was

5:19

not using egg. She was using

5:22

whatever she was she was adding.

5:24

And you said she made this every week? Did she always

5:26

make this version of it?

5:28

Was very similar to this. And

5:30

she will improvise a lot as

5:32

well, you know, I mean for

5:34

the book we had to say half a cup,

5:37

quarter of a cup. She was not measuring.

5:39

She was like, okay, give me the garlic,

5:41

let's feel it and let's drop

5:43

it. And the same thing with the onions.

5:46

It was very instinctive. She didn't have

5:48

to really follow a recipe.

5:50

Amazing, And did she inspire you to cook?

5:52

Then she was the person that made you want

5:54

to be a chef.

5:55

My two grandmothers inspired

5:58

me a lot, and my mother was an amazing, amazing

6:00

chef.

6:01

Tell me because it was interesting, always

6:03

say that in all these interviews

6:05

that we've done.

6:06

The grandmother, the Italian

6:08

one was cooking very Italian

6:11

soul food. She was cooking like

6:13

great Italian, Northern Italian food,

6:16

and I loved it. And

6:18

then my grandmother from Provence

6:20

was doing the same with proven sal food

6:23

as well, which is a little bit similar

6:25

than Northern Italian, but as

6:28

some stal differences.

6:30

I did the drive quite recently from

6:33

Santa marc Rita to Genoa

6:35

to Nice and suddenly

6:38

you were in Italy and now you're in France,

6:40

and you know, the farinata which

6:42

they do in Italy is

6:45

the Italian version of the socca,

6:48

so yeah, which is in Nice. And

6:50

what else do they cook?

6:52

Like my grandmother in Provence,

6:55

she was from the region of Avignon, so

6:58

in Avignon they're not close to the sea, they

7:00

are obviously inland, and

7:05

she would do like a baby leg of lamb

7:08

roasted. And then my grandmother,

7:10

the Italian grandmother, wouldn't do that, but she

7:13

would do She would do alsobuco,

7:16

for instance, My

7:18

grandmother in Provence would do a

7:20

cocoveraine. My grandmother in Italy

7:23

didn't know what cocoveraine was. And

7:26

those were subtle differences, but they

7:28

were important. My mother was

7:30

obsessed with the chefs

7:33

from novelle cuisine at the time, so

7:35

the Michelle Gerard, the Paul Booquz

7:38

that generation. And at

7:41

home she was cooking

7:43

lunch and dinner, those elaborate meals

7:46

with appetizer, main course

7:48

cheese which she didn't cook, and dessert

7:51

that were different from lunch to dinner,

7:53

on a different pattern of tablecloth,

7:57

different china. It was unbelievable.

8:00

Would she be cooking for She was.

8:01

Cooking for myself, stepfather

8:04

and my sister when when

8:06

she was old enough to be at the table

8:09

with us, because she's much younger

8:11

than me.

8:12

She did this every day,

8:14

every day.

8:15

She would Well, she was a business lady,

8:18

so she was in fashion industry. She was

8:20

importing the brand Courage

8:23

for Spain, Spain and underground.

8:25

Yes, and so

8:28

she was very busy with the business. But

8:30

she would wake up at five am to prepare

8:32

the meal and then she she would

8:34

finish whatever needs to be finished,

8:37

all the little details during lunchtime,

8:40

and then same thing at night. And sometimes

8:42

after the dinner she would

8:45

start to cook for the

8:47

like the desserts. Like if she was doing

8:50

I don't know a baba room, she would

8:52

start to let the baba

8:55

do you know rise

8:57

and so on. Yes, I mean it was amazing.

9:00

She would have liked to have done that as a career.

9:02

No, No, she was she wanted

9:05

She wanted to do it because for

9:07

the art of doing it, for the love of doing

9:09

it, and she wanted to feed the family.

9:11

So you had this incredible life of having

9:15

food that was cared you know, it was

9:17

a priority in her day, and your

9:19

stepfather.

9:20

And different styles too. Did you

9:22

ever cook with her with my mom later

9:25

in life, because on the beginning, they

9:27

allow me to watch and eat

9:29

anything I wanted, but they really

9:31

didn't want me to touch anything. They were like, you're

9:33

going to mess up the kitchen, don't touch it. So

9:36

I was eating, and just

9:39

before I went to culinary school, my

9:41

mom started to allow me to help

9:44

her in the kitchen.

9:45

She sounds amazing and she's still cooking.

9:47

She cooks for herself, and

9:50

she sent me pictures sometimes and I'm

9:52

like, oh my god, this is amazing. Like

9:55

the other day she did the dog comfee and

9:57

then you know, she hasked, I don't know what you call it,

10:00

those little for the for the bone,

10:03

those little white.

10:05

White things yeah, yeah, white

10:07

yeah.

10:10

So she still have those kind of details, and

10:12

I'm like, oh my god, how can you do that?

10:15

How do you look back at the food of the

10:17

nouvelle cuisine? What do you think when you when

10:19

you think of that food.

10:20

Well, as you know, nouvelle cuisine

10:22

at one point became really

10:25

a bad world, and it became a caricature.

10:27

Of big plates and food

10:30

and.

10:32

I always have this image of like three string

10:34

beans parallel to each other. But

10:36

novelle cuisine on the beginning was a revolution.

10:39

We were coming out of the era of

10:41

escoffi. It was a

10:44

different mindset where the sauce

10:47

was not hiding anymore the flavors, but

10:49

the sauce was enhancing the

10:51

star of the plate, which was whatever protein,

10:54

mostly or vegetable you decide. And

10:56

also it was the first time

10:59

that chefs were playing their

11:01

food. Until

11:03

then, the food was on platters and

11:06

the waiters were serving the food or

11:08

the clients were serving themselves

11:10

from the platter. But the

11:13

first chef to say I'm

11:15

planning my food in my plate was

11:18

the drug Row.

11:21

So you grew up in a house where food was a

11:23

priority, where your mother cooked, your grandmother's

11:26

cooked. Tell us when about

11:28

your journey to becoming a chef, from being

11:30

a child that wasn't allowed in the kitchen to

11:33

being I think a fifteen year old that

11:35

started cooking. What happened at

11:37

fifteen when you decided to be well.

11:40

At fifteen, I

11:43

cannot go to school

11:45

any longer because my grades are so bad.

11:48

So I ended up in the principal office with mom

11:51

and is explaining to her that I

11:55

have to find out what they call a vocational

11:57

school or a career.

12:01

That's nineteen eighty and

12:05

I look sad, but I'm really happy because

12:07

I want to go to culinary school. So

12:10

the principal promised to my mother that he

12:12

would do everything possible to send

12:14

me to a culinary school. And

12:16

he had a friend who was a

12:19

principal in Perpignon, and

12:23

I was accepted. I don't know how, but

12:25

I was accepted in culinary school. And

12:27

then I was a very good student

12:29

there.

12:31

So that's the thing, if you find what you love it.

12:33

I really loved everything

12:35

about the restaurant

12:37

industry. I was the first

12:40

year. We were waders and cooks.

12:43

We were learning both and we had some classes

12:45

of a knowlogy, which

12:47

is about the wine. And I was

12:49

having a blast and my

12:52

grades were excellent. In matth I was

12:54

still a bit weak, but I was putting

12:56

a lot of efforts. I

12:59

was good in Spanish because I live in Adora,

13:01

so I would I could speak

13:03

Spanish and French. I didn't speak English

13:05

at the time. And in the kitchen

13:08

I was a little bit bored because

13:10

we were learning old fashioned

13:12

recipes. From Escoffia basically,

13:15

so I was a bit bored, but I

13:18

knew I was learning the basics. So

13:20

I was very diligent about

13:23

listening to what the directions

13:25

were from the teachers, and my

13:28

grades were great on the first

13:30

year. On the second year, same thing. At

13:33

my exam, which was after two years,

13:36

I had to do a gulash

13:39

and a rice pilaf with Langostin's

13:43

in a source nin two yer and

13:46

I did a good job because

13:48

I graduated with honors. And

13:50

then I was like, this is the

13:52

beginning. I mean, I knew it

13:54

was the beginning. I

13:56

wanted to be the chef that I am today.

13:59

I wanted to be in a restaurant that

14:01

has a big kitchen with a lot

14:03

of equipment, with a lot of cooks, a

14:06

lot of waters, a lot of a great

14:08

team, beautiful china,

14:10

and a great wine cellar and everything

14:12

else. And that was my dream.

14:15

So at seventeen years

14:17

old, I write a letter to the eighteen

14:20

three star Micheline restaurant in France,

14:22

because I was eighteen at the time, and

14:24

nobody answered. Nobody.

14:27

So then at one point I go back

14:29

and I write to the two stars,

14:33

and then Maxims sent

14:35

me a letter saying we don't have a spot

14:37

for you, and that's my only letter.

14:40

And then three months later I

14:42

received a letter from Latyo darjan And

14:45

at the time they were three stars, of course,

14:47

and they were celebrating in nineteen eighty two

14:50

their four hundred year anniversary.

14:52

Anyway, I ended up at seventeen years

14:55

old in Lato dar Joon in Paris.

14:58

After reading that letter, I call them

15:00

and I said, you know Americ repair and I received

15:03

your letter and when when

15:06

do you need me? And I said, we need you tomorrow,

15:09

And well tomorrow it's going to be tough.

15:11

But three days later

15:13

I was with my suitcase in Paris.

15:15

Where did you stay?

15:18

In a tiny hotel? And

15:20

then I find finally a place. It took

15:22

a couple of months to find a place. It

15:25

was very very seventeen

15:29

in a kitchen like that.

15:30

Yeah, you know, what was the culture of the kitchen?

15:32

What was it like?

15:34

Very old fashioned? A

15:36

lot of abuse, veriable abuse, physical

15:38

abuse, And that was the culture

15:41

in those kitchens at that time. And

15:44

and also I have to say I was the youngest

15:46

in the kitchen, and I was not necessarily

15:49

the best, and they were they

15:51

were patients, but at the same time, they were very

15:53

abusive and and as you

15:56

probably know in France,

15:58

it was a philosophy behind it.

16:01

First of all, it made no sense

16:03

to me, but they wanted to break you psychologically

16:06

and rebuilt you as a champion, which

16:09

is ridiculous. I think it was more an

16:11

excuse to

16:13

let the chef be abusive and have

16:16

those tantrums and be aggressive.

16:19

And someone who's angry

16:22

is it's not someone

16:24

who's It's not a quality to be angry.

16:26

Let's put it this way. So I learned. I

16:29

learned the hard way.

16:30

Do you think you've given up?

16:32

Ever, No,

16:34

I never thought of giving up. I was obviously

16:37

at times down and not

16:40

happy, but my vision

16:43

of becoming the chef that I became was

16:45

never compromised.

16:47

The ambition kept you, kept you going.

16:49

It was, yes, but the ambition was

16:52

not about being

16:54

number one, being radied, or being

16:56

The ambition was to cook

16:59

great food and create an amazing

17:01

experience. And it has always been

17:06

my vision all my life.

17:12

Did you know the River Cafe has a shop. It's

17:15

full of our favorite foods and designs.

17:17

We have cookbooks and then in Napkins Kitchen

17:20

were chout bags with our signatures,

17:22

glasses from Venice, chocolates from

17:24

Turin. You can find us right next

17:26

door to the River Cafe in London or

17:29

online at shop the River Cafe

17:31

dot co UK

17:37

From Tour de Jean, how long did you stay there?

17:40

To Darjent, I didn't stay too

17:42

long. I stayed about a year and a half.

17:44

And then the chef called me in his

17:47

office and said I

17:49

heard that you want to move, and you because

17:51

you want to change, And he said I will

17:53

tell you when you're leaving. And

17:56

I said, yes, chef, of course. And

17:58

a month later he said, go

18:01

to this place, it's called sham Ask

18:03

for the chef. His name is Joel Robischow, and

18:08

he's waiting for you. I'm

18:11

basically like eighteen and a half nineteen

18:14

and I go there. I have no

18:16

idea where I'm going. And I met

18:18

with Joel Robbie Schan very

18:20

sweet man, very kind man, great

18:24

contacts. And then he's telling me

18:26

that I'm starting in a month

18:28

from now.

18:29

And was the culture in that kitchen

18:32

the same? Was it abusive?

18:34

And Robbie

18:36

Shaw was not violent physically or

18:39

it didn't didn't want violence in his kitchen?

18:41

Was there violence actually physical violence?

18:43

Yes? Chefs were kicking you in the

18:46

shoulders. Sometimes

18:50

it was some physical battles

18:52

in the coolers or

18:55

in a staircase or things like that. It

18:57

was definitely, but Robbie

19:00

Sewan it was very different. He didn't want

19:02

that. He was not a screamer, but it

19:04

was very, very difficult, and

19:08

it was a

19:11

painful experience with him as

19:13

well, because he was so

19:16

demanding on himself and so demanding on

19:18

the team. He was never happy and every

19:21

day was coming and every

19:23

day he had some negative comments every

19:26

day, but not necessarily

19:30

articulating what was wrong, just

19:32

like a frustration about it. And

19:35

I don't know if you ever heard

19:37

that, but he was looking at every plate

19:39

coming back in the kitchen, and when something

19:42

was left in a plate, even a tiny,

19:44

tiny bite, it was a

19:46

disaster.

19:47

How long did you stay that?

19:49

So I did a year and something and

19:51

then I went to do my military duties, so

19:54

I was of course sent to the kitchen. Were

19:57

yes, But on my first

20:00

day in the kitchen was Calamari American.

20:03

I was like, hey, this is cool. And

20:05

then the Calamaria American was

20:07

basically frozen calamari with a beshamele

20:10

ketchup and brandy

20:12

and then at night

20:15

they were doing spaghetti with something and

20:17

they managed to burn the

20:19

spaghettis in the water. The

20:23

heat was coming from underneath. They

20:26

dumped the spaghetti's the stock to

20:28

the bottom of the pot where

20:31

it was in Castel Sarazen,

20:34

which is in the south of southwest

20:36

of France, near to Lose. So

20:39

anyway, I went to see the general and

20:41

I said to him, I don't mind to do my military

20:43

duties, but please get

20:45

me out of this kitchen because I'm going to be depressed.

20:48

And he laughed at me and he said, I'm going to send you to the

20:51

commandos. You're going to learn. And

20:53

I was skinny like this, like

20:57

I was like looking at him like you

21:00

know, I can't do that, and he laughed

21:02

and he said, you want to be my waiter. I

21:05

said, yeah, I would love to be your waider. He said

21:07

okay, and I became for

21:09

the rest of my stay in the militaries

21:12

the waiters of the general. I

21:14

served the food. I didn't cook. And

21:17

then on my last day I

21:20

received a call and I thought it was a joke, and

21:23

they called me and they said, you have a call. It's

21:26

Joel Robbie Shan calling you. I'm

21:29

like, that a joke, it's not possible. And

21:32

I look and it's a number I call and it seemed

21:35

and he's like, oh, thank you for calling me back. I heard

21:39

that you've done with the military duties. I would

21:41

like for you to come back and I would

21:43

look for you to be the chef person and

21:48

Jamin and what

21:50

do you think. At the time,

21:53

I had a girlfriend, many

21:55

things were happening in my life. I was not really

21:57

excited to go back to Paris, and

21:59

I said, can I think about it? And he said, yes, of course,

22:01

you have thirty seconds.

22:02

Yes.

22:05

I was like, yes, chef. And

22:08

I went back to Paris then and I did

22:11

two something years again with

22:13

him in the fish in charge of the

22:15

fish station.

22:16

Well, let's go back to coming here. How did you

22:19

end up in So.

22:20

I went to see Joel Robischan and I said,

22:22

you know, we'd like to travel the world and

22:25

can you help me? And he sent

22:27

me to the water Reghatt Hotel in Washington, d

22:30

C. And I worked with Jean Repalladin, who

22:33

was an extremely talented chef.

22:35

And what was the culture like the culture

22:37

in the kitchen was.

22:39

In Washington, dis very

22:42

relaxed, small

22:44

team. Jean Repaaladin was

22:46

very creative. I was

22:49

happy because for me it was a different experience.

22:51

I learned very classic food at Lato

22:54

Darjean. Then I learned rigor and

22:56

techniques with Joel Robi Schan and then

22:58

with Jean Repaadin. I had a lot of inspiration

23:02

from him to be creative.

23:05

But I think with that, you know, I think with

23:07

cooking, if you have the bigger first, then

23:09

you can have the kind of maybe

23:12

relaxed after well, you know, to

23:14

not have that background.

23:15

And now you have to start.

23:16

You have to start.

23:17

You have to start with the basis and the bigger

23:20

and then you can start

23:22

to be creative. And then you have to learn how

23:24

to manage also a team people. And

23:27

that was Gilberlo cause in le Bernardin. When

23:29

I joined in nineteen ninety one,

23:32

I was twenty four

23:35

years old, and

23:37

he said to me, look, I want someone

23:40

to take care of my kitchen, and

23:43

if you respect the philosophy of le Bernardin,

23:47

which is the fish is the star of the plate, then

23:50

you can do whatever you want here and I will support

23:52

you. And I had this support until

23:54

he passed away in nineteen ninety four. Then

23:57

I became partner with my gillocouse his

23:59

sister, and the rest

24:02

is story history.

24:03

I think it would be interesting to talk about

24:05

the culture of the restaurants

24:08

that were, you know, existing, the bullying,

24:11

the anger, the tantrums,

24:13

the physical abuse, you know. I always

24:16

say that I once had a young

24:18

woman chef come to the River Cafe

24:20

and she was describing

24:22

her experience in another kitchen and she said

24:25

that the chef had stood over her

24:27

she was getting souflets out of the oven, and he

24:29

said, you know, this frying pan is in my hand, and

24:32

if those tuflets are not perfect, it'll

24:34

be on your head. And I said,

24:36

you know what you should have done is put the soufles

24:38

back in the oven, got

24:41

up, walked out and gone to the police. The

24:43

police because that kind of threat

24:46

is illegal and it should be illegal, and you cannot

24:49

do that. And I think that the

24:51

fact that that's this was probably twenty

24:54

years ago. But I think

24:56

it's very interesting how our profession, which

24:58

was based on a kind of terror of

25:01

teaching three people through fear rather

25:03

than hope, has hope

25:06

change. I mean in your restaurant, it has at my

25:08

restaurant, my friend's restaurants. You know,

25:10

in London, we don't

25:13

tolerate that. And also we have an open kitchen,

25:16

so you can't do that. We have an open kitchen

25:18

which does not allow anyone to

25:20

share.

25:21

Of course, well you can always have people

25:23

who are vicious

25:26

and find a way to do it in the back. But

25:30

in America I find a kitchens in general

25:33

very civilized. Here,

25:36

I definitely have I

25:39

do not promote any misbehavior.

25:41

I have zero tolerance. And

25:45

if you misbehave and it's not a big

25:48

mistake, we give you one more chance,

25:51

and then you're not working with us

25:53

any longer. You have to be It

25:55

doesn't matter if your genius or first

25:57

of all, it's no genius is but matter

26:00

if you are excellent or not excellent. You have

26:02

to be a team player. You have to work

26:04

with others, and you have to be polite

26:06

and kind and grateful and

26:09

motivated and hard working and

26:11

passionate, and then

26:14

you belong to the team. But

26:17

we have zero to leerents from his behavior.

26:19

Zero. It's totally unacceptable.

26:22

Well, I know that food here is

26:25

so respected and so deliciousness.

26:28

I think you're coming from you.

26:32

And I think that the interesting

26:35

thing I think is that food is in fashion. People

26:37

always say to me, you know, what do you think

26:39

is a new food trend? Or what are people going

26:41

to be cooking? And what are people eating? And

26:44

it doesn't really interest me very much. But

26:46

the fashion is a food. It's what we're all trying

26:49

to do, to work harder, to

26:52

do what we do better, and we're thinking about sustainability

26:54

all the time.

26:56

Sustainability is very important. I

26:58

mean, I don't care about trends

27:01

at all. The cooking

27:03

at Lebernarda is it's based

27:05

on personal experiences.

27:10

I travel quite a bit in my

27:12

life in many I mean

27:14

basically all the continents, and

27:18

depending where I go, I come back and I

27:20

have a lot of ideas and

27:23

I discover new flavor, new techniques,

27:25

new ingredients, and

27:27

then we integrate it into the style of Le Bernardin

27:30

And I work very closely with

27:32

the Soo chefs as well. They

27:35

also travel during the vacation and

27:38

they go to many places and

27:41

it's a collaboration in between us inspired

27:45

by what we

27:47

love and what we see, but we don't

27:49

think about trends at all.

27:51

Did you travel lot to Asia? Did you Japan?

27:54

Of Japan?

27:55

Japanese for me was

27:57

a revelation when I went there. Not

28:00

why in every aspect

28:02

of the culture of Japan, the

28:04

search for perfection knowing

28:07

that you will never achieve perfection that

28:11

is not motivated by business,

28:14

which means money. It's

28:16

very refreshing for a

28:18

restaurrator from New York that

28:23

they have respect for

28:25

the ingredients. That is incredible.

28:29

And in the nineties

28:31

I was in Peru before it became

28:33

fashionable. It was

28:36

again very influential on us

28:39

for quite some time to understand

28:41

the culture of the savic and the marine,

28:43

edit fish and so on.

28:45

You have one restaurant, so.

28:47

We have Le Bernardin and then we have another

28:49

restaurant in the Cannan Islands

28:52

called Blue Bio rec Repair, and

28:55

we work with an hotel called the Red Carleton,

28:58

which is famous. Yeah, chain

29:01

of hotels. The team comes

29:03

here gets trained by us, or we go

29:05

there and train them. I go there twice a year

29:07

and the rest of the time I have at Lebanadere.

29:09

Do you find it challenging? Fish wise?

29:11

In cam An Island, we use local fish

29:14

mostly what is it? Grouper,

29:17

snapper, spiny lobsters,

29:20

shream, mai

29:22

mahi wahu.

29:25

I mean it's a lot of species.

29:26

That's a local Oh yeah,

29:28

it's.

29:29

Like from the local fishermen. Yes.

29:35

If you like listening to Ruthy's Table

29:37

for would you please make sure

29:40

to rate and review the podcast

29:42

on the iHeartRadio app, Apple

29:44

Podcasts, Spotify, o, wherever

29:47

you get your podcasts. Thank

29:49

you.

29:54

You were saying that people now are eating

29:56

out. You can't get a reservation in a

29:58

restaurant in New York. Maybe it's post

30:00

pandemic, but I do think restaurants

30:03

have shown us how important restaurants are to

30:06

culture, to a city, to people.

30:09

I once had to go to my granddaughter's

30:11

school and I said, why do we go to restaurants?

30:14

You know, we go to restaurants. Why do we go When

30:16

child raised their hand and said, we

30:18

go to restaurants for a birthday, we go to a restaurant.

30:20

When my grandparents come to town, we go to restaurants.

30:23

When my granddaughter raised, we

30:25

go to restaurants when there's nothing at the fridge.

30:29

And I thought that was It is interesting

30:31

why people go to restaurants and why

30:34

they are important to us. Why do you

30:36

think they are?

30:37

Well? New York is a big city, like London,

30:42

it's a lot of people visiting from all

30:44

over the world. It's a lot of New

30:47

Yorkers who are going out,

30:50

and we cater to many

30:53

people who seek a different experience.

30:56

I think our mission is to deliver

30:59

the experience the clients is

31:02

seeking without necessarily

31:04

asking, but just understanding

31:07

what's happening. And it's easy to understand

31:09

what the clients want. If you see

31:11

a bunch of businessmen and they're

31:13

very intense and they're sharing paper at the

31:15

table, you know they are in business.

31:18

If you see a couple and they all tachiev

31:20

and kissing, and you know, it's

31:22

like it's not the

31:25

same experience as the businessman. And

31:27

then if you see someone taking

31:30

pictures of the food, or if I go

31:32

to the dining room looking at me, following

31:35

me, and you know it's someone very interested

31:37

by our industry and

31:40

those experience. We have to basically

31:44

adapt to the client and have

31:46

flexibility and make sure that when

31:48

they leave they're

31:50

very happy, they have a smile in their face.

31:53

Do you stand on the past? Do you see every

31:55

plate that goes out?

31:57

I do, and not only I stay on the past,

31:59

but I also work in

32:02

the kitchen and I taste

32:04

a lot that one on me but we

32:06

have testing spoons made of corn

32:08

starch that you

32:10

can use. The very inexpensive and of

32:13

course it's recyclable.

32:15

It's not like plastic, and you can taste

32:17

and throw the spoon if you wish,

32:20

because we don't want to double deep obviously, and

32:22

I don't want the cooks also to carry.

32:25

I hate that when I put that in the back.

32:28

Disgusting, and to put it in the pot with water,

32:31

it's like no. So we have those

32:33

those testing spoons, and

32:35

I taste a lot of the thing. I

32:37

have only one meal a day and the rest is

32:39

testing. You test before, before,

32:42

before service and during services.

32:45

Yeah, it's interesting, I find, you

32:47

know, I was thinking if I could. It's how you

32:49

give the feedback. I don't know about you very

32:52

much smaller restaurant. When I go to eat

32:54

there and I have something that I don't

32:57

think is up to what it should be,

33:00

it's always for me it's a conundrum because do you

33:02

tell them you know then

33:04

and there? Do you go and say, you know, they're

33:06

so expected, our chefs, you know, they want to

33:08

know what I thought, Did I enjoy it? And if

33:10

I say, well, actually, you know, the

33:13

spinach had too much salt, or the

33:15

sea bears was grilled too long. Not

33:18

the greatest thing to do at the end of the evening. If

33:20

I do it in the morning and I go and I say, that was a great

33:22

meal. Then I come in in the morning and I say, actually,

33:24

you know what, what I had last night, that's

33:27

not a good time. It's how you how

33:29

you can feedback. The best thing is when you're working

33:31

that I'm there, and so at the moment when you

33:33

taste it, you say, actually, no,

33:35

no, no, we're not doing this. So we're not doing

33:37

that. How are you? Because they care so much

33:39

our chefs, don't they They.

33:41

Nobody is happy to do about job. Now, I

33:43

don't think so. But what we do, first

33:47

of all, when we arrived, when

33:49

I say, weez the two chefs and the chefs

33:51

that they have, and then that they

33:53

are controlling the kitchen. When

33:56

we arrive, it's always before lunch,

33:58

at least half hour before for the lunch, and

34:01

we taeste all the preparations of the

34:03

kitchen, all the mission, plus all

34:05

the sauce. We have about four different, fourly

34:07

different sauce, and we test

34:10

and we commend before

34:12

we test the sauce, and we test everything in

34:14

the kitchen. We caliber

34:17

our palette. So we buy

34:19

some industrial

34:22

Swiss cheese that

34:25

is not really good, but it's

34:27

perfect in seasoning. It's neither

34:29

to salty, neither to blend.

34:32

It's like very neutral neutralizes

34:35

you.

34:36

So no, when you test it, sometimes

34:38

you may find it salty, which means

34:40

your taestbirds are very sensitive

34:43

to salt. Sometimes you may find it very

34:45

bland, and you know your

34:47

your test birds are dull. So

34:50

therefore you know more

34:52

or less where you stand. And then we test the sauce

34:55

and we give it made it feedback

34:57

to the socier, and when we test the ves balls

35:00

and everything else, we give immediate feedbacks

35:02

to them. I'm very

35:04

direct. Whatever

35:06

is right is right, whatever is wrong is wrong.

35:09

But I'm very articulating my criticism.

35:11

If I have to, I explain to them

35:14

why I believe it's not it's

35:16

not right. What does What happened

35:18

during the process. Maybe the source

35:21

was cooked too long

35:23

and then we lost the vibrancy that we're

35:25

supposed to see in that source.

35:27

And so I'm very detail oriented

35:30

in my positive or

35:32

negative criticism.

35:33

We have to be, because otherwise we're selling out.

35:35

Food that is not or we cannot

35:37

do that.

35:37

I said to them the other day. You know, my obligation

35:40

is to you to give

35:42

you a good working environment, to give you a beautiful

35:44

kitchen, to give you a view, to give

35:47

you the equipment that is working.

35:50

But also our obligation is

35:52

to the person who's eating the food, who's

35:54

coming in tonight. It may have saved

35:56

up to be able to come

35:58

here. Optionally, we're celebrating

36:00

a birthday. We're just we're just coming for

36:03

me and we want to express what we do. How

36:05

often do you change the menu.

36:07

When we have a good idea, Well,

36:11

you know, of course it's it's

36:14

very inspired by the season. But

36:16

it's true that when we we always

36:19

challenge ourselves to renew our

36:21

menu as much as we can, and we print

36:23

the menu in house, so it

36:26

gives us a lot of freedom to say,

36:28

okay, today we change it. We have we

36:31

have two good ideas, we're going to change the menu

36:33

and and we'll

36:36

see what happens in a couple

36:38

of weeks. We never have specials,

36:42

and we always make sure that

36:44

when we create new dishes, we

36:47

push the envelope and take time

36:50

before we decide it goes on the menu, because

36:52

sometimes the first impression is that is

36:54

that, oh, yeah, that's good, and then

36:56

you tell actually something

36:59

was missing and it's

37:01

work that goes into the process and it

37:04

takes time.

37:04

And with fish, because you're such a fish based

37:07

restaurant, do you you know, do they

37:09

call up and say, we have no turbot today, we have no

37:11

sea bass, or the sea bass isn't good enough

37:13

to sell you, or or is it pretty

37:16

dependable?

37:17

No.

37:18

When the weather is rough, I mean, especially in

37:21

the North East coast of America

37:24

is where we buy our fish. Mostly,

37:27

like eighty percent of the seafood

37:29

that we serve is local. When

37:32

I say local is not New York City. It's main

37:35

from Carolinas to Canada,

37:37

or even like Florida to Canada. But

37:40

when the weather is very rough, we

37:42

have to change. We cannot

37:44

buy something that is not on

37:46

a market or some old fish.

37:48

And if there's a day when you don't have what

37:51

you want or you're feeling that you might

37:53

need some comfort and you look

37:56

for the food. But what would you turn

37:58

to in terms of a food that might be view

38:00

comfort.

38:04

Well, if

38:06

I really want comfort, I

38:09

do it on the weekend, and I cook

38:11

the food

38:13

for yourself. I cook for the family

38:15

and myself. I

38:17

like to share. I don't you know. I

38:20

will never see myself having a bottle

38:22

of wine or a glass of wine

38:24

and then eating and not not being surrounded

38:27

by friends and family. And

38:29

I do that on the weekend because the

38:31

weekend for me, the weekends have sacred and

38:34

since I'm the only guy with white hair in the

38:37

kitchen, I'm allowed to take my Salurdays

38:39

and Sundays and be with the family.

38:42

And therefore I take my weekends. I

38:45

stay in New York or I have a country house, but

38:48

we go out one night to be pampered

38:50

and to have an experience, and then the

38:54

second day I'm cooking and I

38:58

have so much fun. You know. It's like

39:00

a way to completely disconnect

39:02

from the world,

39:05

from the reality that we perceive

39:08

round us. And I'm

39:12

not being a blast.

39:13

I'm so happy you are. Thank you so much.

39:15

Thank you. Lots of love dots all

39:17

love to you too.

39:18

Thank you, Thank

39:23

you for listening to Ruthie's Table four

39:26

in partnership with Montclair.

39:36

Ruthie's Table four is produced by Atamei

39:38

Studios for iHeartRadio. It's

39:40

hosted by Ruthie Rogers and it's produced

39:43

by William Lensky. This episode

39:45

was edited by Julia Johnson and mixed

39:47

by Nigel Appleton. Our executive

39:50

producers are Fai Stewart and

39:52

Zad Rogers. Our production manager

39:54

is Caitlin Paramore and our production coordinator

39:57

is Bella Selini. Thank you

39:59

to everyone at the of A Cafe for your help

40:01

in making this episode.

40:03

Mmm

40:06

mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

40:13

hmm