0:00

Hello, my name is

0:02

Natasha Nabunanga-Bamblet. I'm a proud

0:04

Yorta Yorta, Kurnai, Whelpri and O'Wagery woman

0:07

and before we get started on She's

0:09

On The Money podcast I would like

0:11

to acknowledge the traditional custodians of the

0:14

land of which this podcast is recorded

0:16

on a Wandry country, acknowledging

0:18

the elders, the ancestors and the

0:20

next generation coming through as

0:23

this podcast is about connecting, empowering,

0:26

knowledge sharing and the storytelling of you

0:28

to make a difference for today and

0:31

lasting impact for tomorrow. Let's

0:33

get into it. She's on the

0:35

money. She's on the money. Hello

0:58

and welcome to She's On The Money,

1:00

the podcast for people who want financial

1:02

freedom. My name is Bex Sied and

1:04

with me as always is Victoria Devine.

1:06

What a surprise seeing you here. Hi.

1:08

What are you doing on a Wednesday?

1:10

That's crazy. I didn't see this coming.

1:12

How are you? No, this has never

1:14

happened before. No, novel idea. Oh absolutely.

1:16

So Vi, I don't know if you

1:18

know what the topic of this episode

1:20

is today but we are talking about

1:22

how you can set up workplace boundaries.

1:24

So I guess like first things

1:27

first, how important is setting your boundaries with

1:29

your employers? So yes, I did

1:31

know what the topic of today was

1:33

because I set the topic of today.

1:35

I have had too many conversations with

1:37

friends recently who have had their boundaries

1:39

like exploited and I get

1:42

so frustrated at the idea that you

1:44

know people don't respect their team especially

1:46

as someone who runs multiple teams. I

1:48

just go, hold on, like what are

1:51

you doing? So I thought the best

1:53

way to channel my anger was into

1:55

a podcast. More passion is going

1:57

to be in this than I think.

2:00

usual and I think it is

2:02

so important that we talk about it whether

2:04

you're experiencing it or not just so that

2:06

we can advocate for ourselves but also advocate

2:08

for our friends and our family and give

2:10

them good advice and tips when they need

2:12

it. Obviously not unsolicited advice and tips because

2:14

if you've been following me on Instagram I

2:16

don't really like those. No. We're going to

2:18

be talking about the typical nine to five,

2:20

five day a week kind of vibe but

2:23

obviously different work environments have very different requirements

2:25

but we are talking about your personal boundaries.

2:27

We're going to be asking the question what

2:30

are you comfortable with, how can you define

2:32

them without feeling like you're letting your employer

2:34

down and all of those little things that

2:36

make you feel as though you really need

2:38

to say yes to your boss when you

2:40

don't actually have to because you

2:42

don't actually need to do two hours of

2:44

unpaid labour after work just because they ask

2:46

nicely. Like you really don't. I

2:49

think a lot of people are going to need this

2:51

episode today. I feel like it is going to be

2:53

really useful but why is it good to talk about

2:55

this? It's obviously good to talk about it because we

2:57

don't want to be taking advantage of it but Beck

2:59

your job takes up maybe like 80%

3:01

of your week right. If you're working five days

3:03

a week which we know quite a few people

3:05

do a four day week now which is very

3:08

nice for them and it's great if it works

3:10

but it's really important that you're not burning

3:12

yourself out and letting more important aspects of

3:14

your life go down the drain in order

3:17

for you to appease your workplace who technically

3:19

should only be getting you for that 38

3:21

hours but somehow they're getting 60, wild.

3:25

So yes work is obviously important. It is

3:27

what provides you with an income which obviously

3:29

is very important to live your life

3:31

but boundaries are also critical to focusing

3:33

on other areas like maintaining your physical

3:35

and your mental and your spiritual health

3:37

but if you really love your job

3:39

work can often be like an area

3:41

of your life where all of these

3:43

things are benefited but if you're

3:45

on the other foot and work is just you

3:47

know what you do to pay the bills and

3:50

put food on the table I think you need

3:52

to be finding time for yourself and for other

3:54

parts of your life that bring joy and to

3:56

me that is super super critical

3:58

and I think so many

4:00

times we need to actually

4:02

understand that delineation because it

4:05

is okay to have a job where you go,

4:07

it's just my job. I do it during the

4:09

day. It pays me well because I get my

4:11

nourishment outside of that. It's actually

4:13

okay as well if you're like, oh, they

4:15

like I see that you're talking about boundaries,

4:17

basically married to my job because I'm obsessed

4:19

with it. That's okay. But what we want

4:21

you to know is this is all like

4:23

about consent really and choice and

4:25

being given the choice and being able

4:28

to make it. Like so many times

4:30

when I worked, even corporately, I was

4:32

putting in so many more hours than

4:34

I should and once I

4:36

realized why, I could strip them back. But then

4:38

there were also those hours that I'd put in

4:40

because they made me feel better. So I'd be

4:42

like, all right, well, I'm

4:44

not meant to be working on a Sunday, but if I

4:47

spend an hour on a Sunday going to my calendar, going

4:49

through my emails, I'm going to have a better weekend

4:51

for me. My mental health is so much better when I

4:53

feel in control. And that was something where

4:55

a lot of people would be like, I can't believe you're

4:57

working on a Sunday. But I'd be like, well, actually, I'd

5:00

much prefer to do that hour on a Sunday so that

5:02

I'm setting myself up for the week. So we're not saying

5:04

draw these hard lines and you know, don't do

5:06

anything at all. Don't lift your finger. It's

5:08

5pm, pans in the air. Otherwise you'll be

5:10

in trouble. It's more, are you

5:12

okay with that? Because like, if you are, like

5:15

it's your choice. Like at the end of the

5:17

day, we know that Australians put way more time,

5:19

energy and effort into their roles than any other

5:21

country in the world. And I think that that

5:24

comes down to our loyalty and it comes down

5:26

to our work ethic and all of that. But

5:29

we also don't want to be taken advantage of. So

5:31

that's what this podcast is about, Bec. Yeah, I totally

5:33

agree with you. For me, I'm kind of like,

5:35

you know, I love video editing. So I love a Friday

5:37

night. I know it sounds weird where I just have like

5:39

a red wine. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

5:41

I don't think no one's going to annoy

5:43

you because like, yeah, exactly. It's so much

5:45

fun for me to just like cut up

5:48

some videos, have a red wine. But

5:50

just to clarify, I mean, I know that I

5:52

am choosing that, but basically once it hits 5

5:54

p.m., I go home and that's it. But I

5:56

guess it's not really the case with everyone, is

5:59

it? No, of course. And sadly it

6:01

isn't the case for everybody like every

6:03

year I alluded to this before the

6:05

Australian Institute Center for Future Work Releases

6:08

their report for go home on time

6:10

day and their findings I think

6:12

are kind of gross So, you know, I was

6:14

like, oh Australians putting more time energy in effort

6:16

Like it's not me being like, oh what a

6:19

flex like we all know how I feel about

6:21

that I think I've said before if you have

6:23

a full-time job and somehow you're doing like 50

6:25

hours a week Like that's not a flex like

6:28

if someone says to me. Oh my god. Yeah, it's

6:30

like I work for this, you know Standard

6:32

corporate role. I know they're meant to

6:34

be employed for 38 hours a week if I go. Yeah,

6:37

I do like 60 hours a week It's like such a

6:39

finance person you say I'll be like, oh wow, so you're

6:41

not very good at time management then Like

6:44

it's not a flex back. Like I know

6:46

all your neglecting You

6:48

know the parts of your life all

6:50

your employers taking advantage of you like

6:53

no, that's not a flex Let's reframe

6:55

that but that report back found that

6:57

the average working Australian is missing out

6:59

on $11,055

7:01

a year or $425

7:06

per fortnight due to unpaid overtime

7:09

Oh that equals around five point four

7:11

hours of unpaid work that Australians are

7:13

doing each and every single year and

7:16

Because I am the drama. Let's

7:18

make this statistic even worse This

7:20

means that Australian employees are losing

7:23

a cumulative 131

7:26

million dollars to unpaid work

7:28

every year Wow, we

7:30

need some boundaries. I could do

7:32

a lot with 131 million dollars It

7:34

wouldn't hurt to have an extra couple hundred every

7:36

fortnight, but like that's what we're doing I know

7:38

I'm doing unpaid work like why don't you just

7:41

go get a job driving? You know uber deliveries

7:43

at least you're being paid for that work if

7:45

you've got the time clearly you do And

7:48

that's obviously very entitled and privileged to say so I

7:50

just want to check that because I think some people

7:52

be like I have To like

7:54

my industry demands it. Yes,

7:56

but it shouldn't be sure that you're

7:58

taking advantage of It's not nice

8:00

to hear that, right? No one wants to hear like,

8:03

oh, you're being taken advantage of. They're like, oh, but

8:05

like, this is how we get ahead in my industry.

8:07

Yeah. But why is that the case? Exactly.

8:10

That is so bad. So yuck. Like

8:13

it is kind of bizarre that, you

8:15

know, the average Aussie is putting in the

8:17

work, but not really getting the reward out, which

8:19

is probably why this episode exists

8:22

and this is why we need

8:24

some boundaries. Yes, totally. And

8:26

I guess I have spoken about it

8:29

before. I am an employer and look, I know

8:31

there are times that you might need to log

8:33

on to do some extra man

8:35

hours and, you know, shout out to my

8:37

team. They are legends. Like sometimes I

8:39

will log on and be like, why are you

8:41

online? Like I can see that you're online, like

8:43

get off the internet and they're like, oh, I'm

8:45

just fixing up such and such. And I try

8:47

to advocate for them as much as possible. And

8:50

I'll be like, Beck, actually, I really would prefer

8:52

if you're not online. Like I know that you're

8:54

just trying to do something, but like, I don't

8:56

want to be taking advantage of you. And obviously

8:58

I always try to reiterate that, but my

9:01

team also have really flexible working hours. So

9:04

essentially they work the hours that suit them.

9:06

Yes, they have a full time job, but if one of

9:08

them goes, ah, I don't really feel like working this morning,

9:10

have no client meetings, I'm going to start at 10. You

9:12

do you, they'll have to work later. So sometimes I

9:15

have to be like, what time did you start? Like,

9:17

is this you making up time? Like, is this actually a

9:19

choice and it's actually part of your 38 hours a week?

9:22

Or is this you literally doing overtime, which

9:24

sometimes it's one or the other. But I

9:27

think it's really important, especially

9:29

as an employer to respect

9:31

your employees, like the more that

9:33

you respect them, the more that

9:35

they respect you and your business.

9:38

Like to me, it's wild that employers

9:40

just demand this level of respect because

9:42

they're the business owner. So what I

9:44

say goes and that to me is

9:46

so it's like what makes you better

9:49

than anybody else. Yeah. Like, oh,

9:51

I agree. And like we work

9:53

a busy job and there are obviously busy times of

9:55

the year. And my team gets that and I really

9:58

try to make sure that they have a. good

10:00

work life balance. Like you know, last year

10:02

during International Women's Day we had a whole

10:04

series of events and that required so much

10:06

manpower. But like there was compromise. They got

10:09

additional days off. Lots of places don't do

10:11

that and that blows my mind. And if

10:13

my team needs to go to appointments and stuff or they

10:15

want to take a longer lunch to catch up with like

10:17

some family or they might have a friend in town or

10:19

something, why wouldn't they

10:22

do that? Like my

10:24

team at Adult Spec, get this, so

10:27

I treat them like adults. That

10:29

is wild. It's an actual insane concept

10:31

for a lot of people that, oh

10:33

you're an adult. Well, you know, do you have the capacity to

10:35

take a two-hour lunch break? They might go, yeah, yeah, yeah, because

10:38

I'm going to work until 7 tonight or I'm going to do

10:40

this or I'm going to do that. I'm going to make it

10:42

great. Like you're not taking the mickey out

10:44

of me but you're still having a good work

10:46

life balance. Does that not mean that you're probably

10:48

going to like your job more? Yeah. Insane

10:51

to me. But I think it's

10:53

a give and take relationship that needs

10:55

to be had between employees and employers

10:58

and you obviously just can't take, take,

11:00

take from employees. And yeah, I

11:02

guess at the crux of it, you are

11:04

paying them to do a job but they

11:06

have lives. They need to be respected and

11:09

when you show them that, to me, it's

11:11

always come back in spades. Like my team

11:13

have always been so supportive of me, so

11:16

supportive of the business as a whole and

11:18

I think that that starts from the top.

11:20

Like it starts from giving them that respect

11:22

to begin with and going, well, actually, you know,

11:26

don't be silly. We have a recording

11:28

day that day. We can't take that

11:30

day off and that's fine but if

11:32

there's flexibility to be had and they

11:34

need it, go forth in yonder. I

11:36

completely agree. It's great for everything. Staff

11:38

morale. I just feel like you're obviously

11:40

a very good employer. My boss is

11:42

the best boss I've ever had and

11:44

so I feel like me in

11:46

general, you're one

11:48

of them. Well, I don't get back

11:50

full time. She actually loves video editing

11:52

for ARN. I've tried. It hasn't worked

11:54

yet. Well, either way, I mean

11:57

we're surrounded by really good people but there are

11:59

some people out there that actually kind of

12:01

have bosses, they don't really share that

12:03

same perspective. They maybe have like an

12:05

old school way of dealing with leading

12:07

the team and stuff like that. It's

12:09

really easy to say, let's set boundaries

12:11

when people are like us and like

12:13

my boss, but there are some

12:15

people that don't have that. How would you suggest

12:18

they set boundaries if they're in that

12:20

situation? Well, I think it's also a

12:22

two way street. So I think about

12:24

it and I have managed larger teams

12:26

than the team I have today. And

12:29

I have had some really challenging circumstances where

12:31

employees do take the Mickey and you do

12:33

have to kind of enforce boundaries and be

12:36

like, all right, well, this level of flexibility

12:38

that I've given you is, not

12:40

just being taken for granted, but being taken for an

12:42

absolute ride. You do need to turn up to work

12:44

at 8 a.m. Your hours

12:46

are 8 a.m. to 5 p.m. or

12:49

whatever it is. And I need

12:51

you to be there at that time and be

12:53

present and not take the Mickey. And you can't

12:55

just go, oh, actually, I'm just

12:57

gonna work from home today because

12:59

I've decided that I can work from home. My

13:02

boss is pretty flexible. When in your calendar is

13:04

like an all hands meeting that everybody was meant

13:06

to be there in person for, I

13:08

think there needs to be some level of like

13:11

give and take. Like you've got boundaries, I totally

13:13

understand it, but you're not the only person in

13:15

this relationship. And so back

13:17

to your question, I think there

13:20

are heaps of ways to implement different

13:22

boundaries, but let's go to a break

13:24

actually. On the flip side, I'll tell

13:26

you all about how to set them and keep them

13:28

and maintain them. Good call. Okay,

13:34

guys, we are back and V left us

13:36

on a bit of a cliffhanger. So we've

13:38

established that Aussies are putting in extra hours

13:40

of work every week. I

13:43

mean, some weeks, hopefully not every week, but well-

13:45

For a lot of people every week. Yeah, a

13:47

lot of people every week, like a surreality. And

13:49

again, sometimes it's the hustle. Like I totally get

13:51

it. Like we need to question the hustle. Absolutely.

13:54

So V, can you please tell us, what can we actually do

13:56

to protect our brains from thinking non-stuff about

13:58

work and set up? healthy boundaries.

14:01

All right, Beck, we are going to first sit

14:03

down and we're going to Marie Kondo our lives

14:05

a little bit. What's much joy for

14:07

you? Like what do you love doing? I want you

14:09

to list all of that out and have a think

14:12

about it. Is it your friends or your family? Is

14:14

it, you know, Beck, you've really gotten into the gym.

14:16

You love that. Whatever it might

14:18

be, let's figure it out and be really clear on

14:20

that. Then we're going to implement

14:22

actual physical things that you can do in

14:25

order to make sure that your boundaries are

14:27

clear to your employer so that you can

14:29

genuinely enjoy these areas of your life that

14:31

fulfill you. I think there needs to be

14:33

also a clear delineation of not being rude. Like

14:36

getting up and walking out at 5pm and being

14:38

like, well, I'm done. Like that's not going to

14:40

win you any friends, is it? So

14:42

I've got a list. We love a list. Would

14:44

you like me to take you through it? Love a list.

14:47

We love a list. I've got ADHD so I list every

14:49

thing. So first

14:51

things first, big suggestion is

14:53

muting your emails or work notifications

14:55

in general. Good one. I'm

14:58

not good at this. So like, do as I say and

15:00

do as I do. I have so many work notifications. Please

15:03

also remember, I'm the business owner.

15:05

I'm also a control freak. Like

15:08

I need to know what's coming in and out at

15:10

all times. Also if something hits the fan, I need

15:12

to be the first on it because that's my responsibility

15:14

as the owner. Turns out Beck, that's

15:16

not your responsibility. If it happens after hours,

15:18

you should be able to fix it within

15:20

business hours. If it's a genuine emergency, it

15:22

should be going to me as the owner

15:24

or the manager of that and not pestering

15:26

you. It's not your responsibility out of hours,

15:28

right? Like unless I'm paying an on-call fee

15:31

for you, like where it's like,

15:33

oh, Beck, if something hits the fan and you know, you

15:35

need to spend three hours fixing it, like don't worry, you'll

15:37

get overtime. You'd be like, say, I love money.

15:40

Like that's not the case for most employees, is that?

15:43

Totally. What my team loves is that

15:45

there are never any emergencies in marketing.

15:48

So like my team use it all the

15:50

time, especially when I'm flustered, they'll be like,

15:52

there's no such thing as an emergency in

15:54

marketing. Is that true? Yeah. Like

15:57

we use it all the time. Like there's no such thing as an emergency

15:59

in podcasting. There's no such

16:01

thing as an emergency in marketing. I do not

16:03

care what your beliefs are.

16:05

That works for us because I'm not conducting

16:07

brain surgery. That is a genuine emergency unless

16:10

you are actually a doctor and you're listening

16:12

to this and you are trying to draw

16:14

boundaries and your on call page went off

16:17

because you have to go do brain surgery.

16:19

That's actually a different story than us. If

16:22

you're off the clock, you switch off. We

16:24

can deal with it tomorrow. I

16:27

think that that has maintained really healthy

16:29

boundaries between my team and I, but

16:31

also my team and my clients. Clients

16:34

sometimes get out of hand. None of the ones we're currently

16:36

working with, don't worry. Sometimes

16:39

clients get out of hand and they'll email

16:41

you at 9pm and be like, hey, that campaign

16:43

that's going live tomorrow, we've actually decided to change

16:45

the script completely. You go, well,

16:47

actually, I'll get back to

16:49

you at 9am after it's gone live and

16:52

we can amend it then because I

16:54

am not going to have my team

16:56

working at midnight to fix the script

16:58

that you guys had already signed off

17:00

on. I'm quite clear

17:02

about that because that is not

17:04

worth the mental stress for my

17:06

team. Also, I know that we

17:08

communicate clearly. We set boundaries with

17:10

our clients. I gave them sign

17:12

off weeks prior. This is not

17:15

an emergency. In fact, there's literally

17:17

nothing more draining and consuming when

17:19

you are constantly seeing emails popping up

17:21

related to work. Let's just make sure

17:23

that there are practical ways of shutting

17:25

off while you're in your downtime because

17:28

for most jobs, it's not

17:30

an emergency. Also,

17:32

another person's sense of urgency, so whether that

17:35

is your manager or a client, does not

17:37

constitute an emergency on your behalf. Just

17:40

because someone else is flustered about it and stressed

17:42

about it doesn't mean you have to take that

17:44

on. Go, okay, cool, hold on. Let's step back.

17:46

Is this in the grand scheme of things actually

17:48

an emergency? No. I'll deal with

17:50

it tomorrow morning. Thank you so much for looping me in. It's

17:54

so hard to feel that energy and not let it

17:56

overtake you. In the moment, it's really hard, but I

17:58

think that once we start to talk... about it

18:00

and learn more and go, well actually you're

18:02

right. I get so

18:04

stressed when I see my manager's emails coming through

18:06

at 9 p.m. turn them off.

18:09

Yeah, you owe them not

18:11

anything at 9 p.m. The

18:13

next is I want you to set the boundaries

18:15

with your boss and your co-workers. So

18:17

let's say you're outside of working hours and your

18:19

boss decides to text you rather than email or

18:22

send it on Slack and you feel like you

18:24

need to address it immediately. You actually don't. So

18:26

what I would do, we're kind. We're not being

18:28

rude here. We're not setting boundaries and then yelling

18:30

at people for crossing them. Hey, no worries. Thanks

18:33

so much for looping me in. I actually get

18:35

to this first thing tomorrow morning. As

18:38

soon as you start responding to

18:40

work-related requests outside of business hours,

18:42

that kind of becomes the expectation

18:44

and employers are and do and

18:46

we'll take advantage of this. At the end of

18:48

the day, Beck, if I'm texting you at 9

18:50

p.m. and going, oh I really would love

18:52

to XYZ and you know, yeah, yeah, I'll do it

18:54

right now. Like, I'll go,

18:56

oh, Beck's fine to do that. Yeah, obviously I'm

18:58

not going to take advantage of you like that.

19:00

Don't worry. But I think you

19:02

texting being like, yeah, that sounds epic. I'll

19:05

get on to it tomorrow morning. Just

19:07

a little reminder that I'm not working right now.

19:09

I'm not in front of a laptop right now.

19:12

You could be anywhere. It's your personal time. So

19:14

it's personal information. The next

19:16

is put on your email signatures, I guess,

19:19

when you're available and when you're not. So

19:21

Jess in our team, we all know Jess,

19:23

she's on the Friday EPs. She's really good

19:25

at this. So if she's in the studio,

19:27

she puts on an email like out of

19:29

office that says, thanks for the email. I'm

19:32

actually out of office today. I'm in the

19:35

studio recording and I'll get back to

19:37

you ASAP if it's an emergency. Here's

19:39

Maddie's contact details and she can deal

19:41

with it. So I like that she

19:43

kind of sets the boundary but also communicates

19:45

it. It's not just going, well, I'm in the

19:47

studio so I'm clearly not going to get back

19:50

to my emails today. But she sets that out

19:52

of office so that, you know, if a client

19:54

does email during genuine work hours, they're like, oh,

19:56

she's actually busy with another work task or another

19:59

work thing. And to me, this

20:01

is really important because if you've communicated this,

20:03

then perfect. But the expectation is then not

20:05

on Jess to get back to them that

20:07

day. Like you set an expectation

20:09

and it kind of avoids you getting home

20:11

and feeling like you need to get back

20:13

to everybody because you miss, quote, a workday.

20:16

Jess was working all day. It's

20:18

just a different task. And she didn't have time

20:20

for it during that working period. And that is

20:22

so fine. The next spec,

20:25

do not disturb. Massive signs,

20:27

stick it on your forehead. But that's

20:30

an option on your phone as well to

20:32

turn on focus. So I

20:34

use the focus thing on my phone

20:36

all the time. And it means that

20:38

if people text you, it will like

20:40

notify them that your notifications are turned

20:42

off and therefore they won't expect action

20:44

until it's clearly at a time that

20:46

works for you. That is a

20:48

big source of my anxiety, but it's good

20:51

that they let people know that notifications are

20:53

turned off. Well, if you ever text me

20:55

after hours, it happens on my phone. So

20:57

if you text me like 9 p.m., it

21:00

will like not send a reply, but under your

21:02

messages, it'll have a little notification. It will say

21:04

the career has had notification silence. Yes, I have

21:06

seen those. That is really, really good. I mean,

21:09

it should always be built free. You can text

21:11

me, it's fine. Like, I don't know if you

21:13

guys know this, but I have ADHD. And

21:16

sometimes I get in brain dump mode

21:18

and I'm like, Farah, it would be great if Beck did.

21:20

A, B, C, D, E, F, G. And

21:22

I'm not in the mind frame of going like, oh,

21:24

it's 9 p.m., probably shouldn't be wearing Beck. I'm

21:26

just like, oh, I wanna get back to Beck so she can deal

21:29

with it tomorrow. Sure. Usually I'll just message it

21:31

to you on Slack or whatever so that it's

21:33

a work channel and you shouldn't have those notifications on

21:36

anyway. But I think it's really important to remember

21:38

that maybe they are just brain dumping. Maybe they're

21:40

just going, oh, shit, I do need to remember

21:42

to get back to do that for tomorrow. But

21:44

then I'll get the notification that says Beck has

21:46

her notification silence. And I'll be like, great, well,

21:48

at least the message was delivered, she can look

21:50

at it later. Yes. Like, that's

21:52

fine. Yeah, I kinda like that. Next thing

21:54

on my list, this is number five, begin

21:57

to be assertive and honest about

21:59

the capacity. capacity that you actually have. This

22:02

is like really attacking you personally because

22:04

how many times, Beck, and I try

22:06

not to do this to you, but

22:09

I know that if someone said, hey Beck, have you got a

22:11

minute? What do you say? Yes, definitely.

22:13

I have several of them. Yeah, but do you? No,

22:16

not always. No, you don't have a minute. You don't. It's

22:18

okay to say no. So

22:21

if you've been working an hour overtime every

22:23

day for the past week, I need you

22:25

to communicate with your manager and express that

22:27

you have plans like for 5.30 and that

22:29

you'll be knocking off work at

22:31

an appropriate time tonight. I

22:33

know that you shouldn't have to articulate that, but if

22:36

you set the expectation, we need to

22:38

reset the expectation. You've

22:40

been taking advantage of me way. Just go, oh hey,

22:43

I'll be leaving at 5.30 on time tonight. Sorry,

22:46

I've got a dinner. You can do that

22:48

whenever you want, but it might make you feel a

22:50

little bit better about having to be like,

22:52

oh, I can't do this. You've

22:54

shown up. You've done your best at work that

22:56

day, and now I need you to go and enjoy your cocktail

22:58

in pace. Like really, really important.

23:01

But also I think the whole be

23:03

honest about your capacity is really important. So

23:06

if your manager, for example, is just loading

23:08

you up and being like, oh, Beck, also

23:10

here's another thing. I think going, they just

23:12

wanted to talk about my capacity. Like so

23:14

happy to do this. That sounds like a

23:17

really fun task actually. But

23:19

I have ABCD ES. Just

23:22

looking at my week, I'm not going to be able to

23:24

deliver all of those. What are your priorities? Do you want

23:26

me to mix this in? Do you want me to make

23:28

this the top priority? What

23:30

ones are actually important? Because nine times out

23:32

of ten can almost guarantee that your manager has

23:34

forgotten what they have allocated to you this week and

23:36

you've just bitten off more than you can chew. But

23:40

also it's a clear reminder to them that you

23:42

cannot get the work done in the period of

23:44

time that has been allocated. Maybe it needs to

23:46

be reallocated. Maybe we need to stretch out some

23:48

time frames and be like, oh my God, Beck,

23:50

that is actually a lot of stuff. How about

23:52

we just make it due in two weeks instead

23:54

of one? Let's

23:56

talk about these things so that you're not putting

23:58

unnecessary pressure on yourself. I just remember

24:01

my corporate days and being so triggered because I would

24:03

have so many things put on my plate, but I'd

24:05

never say no and I'd never tell them that my

24:07

capacity was too much. And then I'd be like, but

24:09

they gave me all this work and I have to

24:11

do it this week because they said it was through

24:13

Friday. And I'd stress myself out. Why

24:16

didn't I have those conversations about like,

24:18

oh, hey, I'm actually fully booked this

24:20

week to get Project ABC done. I

24:22

know they want me to take on

24:24

Project D, but at what cost? Right.

24:27

I guess it is really good to

24:29

look through that list and see that there

24:31

are actually so many practical ways of doing

24:33

it without the anxiety of like a sit

24:35

down conversation. You can literally just like pop

24:37

your phone on, do not disturb or mute

24:39

your emails, like things like that. It doesn't

24:42

have to be aggressive. No. And

24:44

when we say be assertive, it's just more like, oh,

24:46

hey, like we're not being rude or mean or anything.

24:48

I love to do that, but I have four other

24:50

projects on the go at the moment. Like, do you

24:52

want me to prioritise this one or deprioritise it? And

24:55

sometimes if you're working in like a nine to five

24:57

job, there might be multiple people giving you multiple

24:59

different things. And like, you don't

25:01

know what I've been given by, you know, Annalisa,

25:03

our producer versus Jess or, you know, Gabby, you

25:05

have no idea what's on my plate this week.

25:07

So when you ask for something and I

25:10

go, well, Beck, how important is it? You go,

25:12

oh, well, actually, it's really important for this. I

25:14

go, OK, cool. Now I need to like reschedule

25:16

my week and I might need to go back

25:18

to Gabby and be like, hey, this other important

25:20

thing has popped up. Do you

25:22

mind if I look at this other thing next week? That's

25:26

fine. But it's about setting that

25:28

expectation, not just assuming I'll take on more, I'll

25:30

take on more, I'll take on more. And that's

25:32

where good diary management can come in. Yeah. Like

25:35

time block. If I didn't time block, I would

25:37

be absolutely cooked, Beck. Yeah, absolutely. And I think

25:39

like it's good that you mentioned that you're not

25:41

being mean or I think that a source of

25:43

anxiety for a lot of people is that they

25:45

might come across as like they're not as committed

25:47

to their work. It doesn't actually mean that at

25:49

all, does it? No, absolutely not. And I think

25:52

that that's where we need to talk,

25:54

maybe not with our manager directly about boundaries,

25:56

but even just the communication of it,

25:58

like having those like. Oh Beth,

26:00

I really want to do a good job on that, but I've

26:02

got these other things on, like which one's

26:04

priority. Because it's saying in a

26:07

way without having to say it, I'm

26:09

not going to be working until 10pm every night to get

26:12

this done. So like when is it going to get done?

26:15

And I think that that is absolutely fine. But

26:17

at the end of the day, you need to protect

26:19

your piece. And a lot of employers, not all, but

26:22

as a business owner, I know that

26:24

when my team is feeling refreshed and

26:26

respected, they are so much more likely

26:28

to perform at a higher level and

26:31

deliver amazing outcomes for the team because

26:33

they actually feel good, they feel rested,

26:35

they feel excited for work rather than

26:37

drained and overwhelmed and all consumed. And

26:39

I genuinely think that that's what employers

26:41

should be striving for because ultimately it

26:44

benefits them. Absolutely. Right? Like

26:46

you're telling me, and not all employers are going to agree

26:48

with this, one of my employees, up

26:51

all night with one of their kids, they're overwhelmed.

26:53

They are just so done. They had next to

26:55

no sleep. You're telling me that the

26:57

best thing for everyone here is that they still turn

26:59

up at 8.30 for work the next morning? I

27:03

haven't got any client meetings, so there's

27:06

no like real commitment there. You're

27:09

telling me that it's not better to have my

27:11

team member go, do you know

27:13

what? I'm going to drop the kids off to daycare, get

27:16

rid of them because that was the worst night.

27:18

I'm going to go back to bed till 10am, then I'm going

27:21

to go to work. I'll do some work later. You're

27:23

telling me that's not a better outcome?

27:25

Absolutely, would be. What are you guys

27:27

on if that's not a better outcome?

27:30

Like a well rested employee who comes

27:32

in switched on, feels like they had

27:34

that flexibility, feels like they were respected,

27:36

is going to give so much more

27:38

even if they're at work for

27:41

less period of time and they're making it

27:43

up later. Like for sure. Right? The

27:46

feeling of being an equal and

27:48

valued part of the team is

27:50

so valuable, but I also wanted

27:52

to know, this is maybe not so

27:54

relevant to me, but if there's a business owner

27:56

listening out there, what do you think

27:58

their takeaway should be? Don't be a dick. Oh,

28:01

yeah. So for business

28:03

owners, treat your employees

28:05

like the adult humans that they

28:07

are. Like you're not employing

28:10

12-year-olds because one that would be illegal if you

28:12

are, you really need to probably look at yourself

28:14

in the mirror. But also

28:16

treat your employees just like the adults. They

28:18

have lives and they have good days and

28:20

they have bad days. And yes, you need

28:23

to show up for you between nine and

28:25

five every day, but reward them when they

28:27

are working overtime. Look at them for going

28:29

above and beyond. I totally get

28:31

it. You might be a small business and you're

28:33

like, oh, babe, this is so awkward, but some

28:36

of my team work overtime and I actually really

28:38

need them too, but I can't afford to pay them. That's

28:41

not cool. You need to work that out. But at

28:44

least vocalize that you're grateful. At least I'd be like,

28:46

oh, best, honestly, thank you so much. I know you

28:48

don't have to. I

28:50

really, really appreciate it. And you again,

28:52

don't have to. I think just

28:55

feeling like your value is really

28:57

important as well. And if they

28:59

are going above and beyond, talk

29:02

to them about that and just be like, I

29:04

am so grateful. I really appreciate this. You

29:06

know what? Where possible, remunerate them. Pay

29:09

overtime if that's part of it. But at

29:11

the end of the day, they're going over

29:13

and above for your business, for you, and

29:16

that should be rewarded. Absolutely. What

29:18

are you talking about? Employees. So for

29:20

employees, communication is obviously the

29:23

key. Like setting your boundaries, it can

29:25

be hard, but from little things, big

29:27

things grow. Start with really small boundaries.

29:30

Manage expectations from the get go, though,

29:32

to protect your pace. Take

29:34

the practical steps, but also just communicate with

29:36

your employer. If they don't respect you as

29:38

a human being going through life, honestly, get

29:40

a new job. Find someone who

29:43

values you. There's lots of places out there. I

29:45

know that that is the hard reality of it

29:47

because so many people will be like, but thank

29:50

you for being here. It's such a good job and

29:52

getting such good experience. At what cost?

29:54

At what cost? Absolutely. So

29:57

I think we need to talk about that more

29:59

and... more regularly but what we need

30:01

to be doing is setting boundaries. I love that.

30:03

I think it's a really good place to leave

30:05

it for today. I do think so too so

30:07

have a good week guys we will see you

30:09

bright and early on Friday morning until then love

30:11

you bye guys The

30:19

advice shared on She's on the money

30:21

is general in nature and does not

30:24

consider your individual circumstances. She's on the

30:26

money exists purely for educational purposes and

30:28

should not be relied upon to make

30:31

an investment or financial decision. If you

30:33

do choose to buy a financial product

30:35

read the PDF, TMD and obtain appropriate

30:38

financial advice tailored towards your needs. Victoria

30:40

Divine and She's on the money are

30:42

authorized representatives of Money Sherpa PTY LTD

30:45

ABN 321 649 27708 AFSL 451 289