0:05

Hi. I am Kate Hudson and my name is

0:07

Oliver Hudson. We wanted to

0:09

do something that highlighted our relationship and

0:11

what it's like to be siblings. We

0:19

are a sibling Railvalry. No,

0:22

no, sibling val don't

0:25

do that with your mouth, sibling

0:31

Revelry. That's

0:34

good.

0:39

Hello, it's me. It's Oliver Hudson,

0:43

one of your two hosts from Sibling

0:45

Revelry. We're missing one. We're

0:48

missing the other Hudson, the Kate Hudson.

0:50

The Kate Hudson is in Greece right now

0:54

making a movie. She's working. The

0:57

bro is taking over. We're

0:59

gonna make it. We're gonna make it great.

1:02

I mean maybe,

1:04

just maybe we're gonna

1:06

get some comments that say, hey, you know what,

1:10

you just do it on your own. Probably

1:12

not, but Kate,

1:15

I love you, I miss you. You

1:17

know you're making the world a better place by

1:19

being in an action comedy. So

1:22

to replace Kate, I

1:25

have an extremely in

1:27

depth interview into our relationship

1:30

because this is this is the path that we're going

1:32

to take for this particular episode.

1:36

Is my beautiful wife, Aaron Hudson. She is

1:38

here, she is with me, she is sitting next to

1:40

me saying Hi, Hi,

1:43

Okay, So what

1:45

we're gonna do here is I'm going to

1:48

interview her. I'm going to ask her questions

1:50

about me, things that I

1:52

think I know about myself, things

1:55

I think that you know, I think that she

1:57

might think about me. Maybe she doesn't, I don't know.

2:00

And we're going to get into the depths of our

2:02

relationships starting from the beginning.

2:05

And I might have a few questions for you, and

2:08

she might have a few questions for me as

2:10

well. So let's

2:13

get started, babe. I

2:16

need your age, okay, your

2:19

weight, your height? Why?

2:23

First of all, this is what we do with all of our guests.

2:26

Okay, So

2:29

when was the first time that

2:32

you noticed me? Let's

2:39

see it first time I noticed you. It's

2:42

actually the first time I met you in

2:45

Sandy Marshall's acting class. You

2:48

were in the front row. I was in the way back.

2:50

We had it. Did have a mutual friend, Mark

2:53

Rose. I'm sure you mentioned

2:55

him before in your podcast, and

2:59

he introduced us just as

3:01

his friend. This is Oliver. I

3:05

definitely thought you were cute, but it was not my

3:09

style or vibe. I

3:11

wasn't your type. Yeah, what was

3:13

your type? I

3:16

don't know at the time, a little more like East Coast,

3:19

maybe a little like preppy

3:22

khaki's white T shirt

3:26

and what did I what did I look like? You had on

3:30

like vintage levies, like a rock

3:32

or tea and like a black leather jacket, very

3:36

rock and roll, very like kind

3:38

of long hair, very cool. But

3:42

and then I remember we had a few classes together

3:46

and I remember like smiling

3:49

at Mark, like, oh, he's kind of

3:51

cute, and Mark's like he's

3:53

dating someone, He's in a relationship

3:55

and it's serious, and I was like, okay,

3:58

cool. Yeah, But then we got

4:00

paired together to do a scene,

4:02

so we had to rehearse this scene

4:05

together. So we were meeting up every week

4:07

at someone's house and going

4:09

over this scene because we were supposed to put it up

4:12

at some sort of a showcase. So we

4:15

really kind of got to know each other. And

4:17

that's when you started to fall in love with me. I

4:24

definitely, yes, started

4:26

to shoot find

4:29

some qualities that I was attracted

4:31

to. Was there anything that you did to you

4:33

were like ugh in the beginning? Physically

4:36

no, I mean I just was, like I said, kind

4:38

of like style and you know, but

4:41

then obviously it

4:44

was you know, just our connection and

4:46

it was kind of your sense of humor, our

4:48

back and forth, like just

4:51

the energy of being around you. I

4:53

remember saying to my best friend Jackie at

4:55

the time, I was like, I don't know, this

4:57

kind of like feels weird, but I'm like nerve

5:00

to go in and see him. She

5:02

was dropping me off. Yeah,

5:04

And then that just that feeling

5:07

was kind of there where I knew and then I was kind of

5:09

like thinking about you. But I

5:12

think because you had a girlfriend, it allowed

5:14

us to kind of be

5:17

friends and know that there was no awkwardness

5:19

of like trying to you

5:21

know, get to know somebody, or when

5:23

there's the openness of like ooh, we're two

5:25

single people, it immediately creates something

5:28

different. And this was like, oh, all right, he has a girlfriend.

5:31

And she was beautiful and a

5:33

Buddhist and you know, part

5:35

of the family band she

5:38

was. She was and

5:40

you know, you were very attractive.

5:43

I mean you were hot, so hot,

5:45

and then but I was good.

5:48

But it was a very flirty friendship, very

5:51

flirty, you know, I mean that was

5:53

just our thing. I mean from the beginning,

5:55

it was playful and it was flirty,

5:57

but it was a flirty, safe because I kind of knew,

6:00

like and you were doing it. I did. I was gonna lead you on

6:02

because I knew you couldn't be with me. You

6:04

were doing your kind of charming thing

6:07

that you do, which is what is that just

6:10

wanting everybody to fall in love with you.

6:15

That's a deeper psychological issue.

6:17

Yeah, we can get to that one there. But

6:20

no, you did try to like send me up with your friend.

6:23

I did. I thought Aaron was so

6:25

beautiful and fun and all of that. I was

6:27

trying to set her up with my friends, even though I knew

6:29

that that wouldn't happen, and I didn't want that to happen

6:31

anyway, you know. And then she was she

6:33

had a little crew of girls that she would

6:36

roll around with and they'd show up at the

6:38

clubs and the bars, and they'd be wearing like

6:40

their white like tank tops, and

6:43

you know, they're like dog collar chokers.

6:46

And they had this whole little crew cruising

6:49

around all the celebrities homes after

6:51

hours. And then she had a boyfriend

6:55

and then they broke up and she

6:57

was heartbroken. And

7:01

then she comes out and hangs out

7:03

with me, and I think it's on. I'm like,

7:05

oh, my God, We're finally going to like make

7:08

it happen. And it didn't. It

7:11

didn't. She just needed consoling. But I guess

7:13

the nice part about that was you came

7:15

to me for that, for whatever reason

7:18

I did, because I had a friend. You know, we

7:20

had a friendship. We talked on the phone for like

7:22

hours at a time, and like, yeah,

7:25

there was something we were definitely friends

7:27

about a year and a half prior. Yeah,

7:29

and you knew about Simon and when I called you when

7:32

we broke up. I called you when we broke up.

7:34

Remember, I was like reading about him and Jamie Presley,

7:36

like as I was getting on an airplane. Yeah, I was

7:38

like, oh my god. Yeah,

7:41

at the same time I was reading f hm, you

7:45

were talking about joining the Mile High

7:47

Club with Simon and

7:52

your family had to read all that, Yes

7:54

they did. Let's talk about that for a second. Let's

7:57

keep moving on. No, we'll keep moving

7:59

So anyway, I experience with Simon

8:01

and her parents, who are very East

8:03

Coast, you know, a little

8:06

more conservative, had to read this

8:08

article. The interviewer got me wasted.

8:11

Just start parent's families. Number

8:13

one, they follow

8:16

everything that she does. They literally have clippings

8:18

of her Aaron was like Miss teen Massachusetts.

8:21

She was like runner up for Miss teen America

8:24

or whatever. I mean, she was a pageant girl.

8:26

And then she moved. She goes to she goes

8:28

to Miami and she models,

8:31

and she's all hot model girl

8:33

and dating bad boys. Bad boy

8:35

who's now in jail. But your parents would

8:37

clip out every little thing and then keep it up.

8:39

And then the FHM article

8:41

comes out and she literally is talking

8:44

about in explicit, sort

8:46

of graphic detail about how she

8:48

had an experience in an airplane

8:50

bathroom. I can't even imagine imagine

8:52

reading that about Rio. Imagine

8:56

that. I think I've warned them not to read

8:58

it. I don't know, you know. So oh

9:02

then

9:04

then then it all then well,

9:06

then we had a few months before we actually

9:09

got together, both being single, because in my mind,

9:11

I was like, you've been in a relationship. You

9:14

started to, like, you know, pretty much date

9:17

I hook up with every girl in LA and I was

9:19

like, I'm gonna let him kind of ride that out.

9:22

And I also didn't want to like ruin what

9:25

we had a little bit. I knew

9:27

our chemistry was going to be kind

9:29

of like an all or nothing. This wasn't going to be

9:31

like, hey, let's like first

9:34

base, second base, you

9:36

know, first date, third date. I knew that wasn't going to happen.

9:38

We had too much history, too much chemistry, and

9:40

it didn't. First night I just knew.

9:42

I also was like a grand slam. Yeah, but

9:45

I knew that if I did that too quickly,

9:47

I would I just didn't want to be like another

9:50

girl that you got or well what happened was

9:52

too with on my end of things is like, you know,

9:54

I was having a good time and

9:57

Aaron was part of the good time with other

9:59

people. I mean, not all of us together,

10:01

but you know, clarify

10:04

that please, And but

10:07

I was just starting to really like Aaron

10:09

and at some point I

10:12

had to eliminate everybody

10:14

else from the rotation.

10:16

Is that your favorite word? I don't want to say

10:18

that. Well,

10:22

the early two thousands, so now that's not appropriate,

10:24

but oh yeah,

10:26

I mean it was. But

10:29

then but I had to lay down the law. I remember,

10:31

I know, because there was an exclusivity

10:33

issue or

10:36

or a conversation. But that was after

10:38

Vegas, because

10:40

we went to Vegas. Vegas was crazy. Vegas

10:43

is where everything happened. Okay, Vegas

10:45

is where we fell in love. Now

10:49

were we chemically helped? I mean

10:51

maybe we were there for the Super Bowl.

10:53

It was three nights of just insanity.

10:57

I was cruising around Caesar's Palace and like

10:59

in like a silk Superman robe. We're

11:02

doing cartwheels in the hallway all night

11:04

long, all day long. I mean, it was really a beautiful

11:06

experience. And we were with all of our friends. We're

11:08

having the best time ever. And

11:10

we were in a hotel room and we were playing

11:13

Truth or Dare and

11:16

I asked Aaron true and we

11:18

were thirteen. Yeah,

11:21

yeah, but I asked Aaron. She said truth,

11:24

And I said, they said do you love me?

11:27

Are you in love with me? And

11:30

she looked at me, I think, and then you nodded

11:32

your head and you said yeah yeah. I also

11:34

like exstious sleep flowing for my butt body.

11:37

Like if like the you know, room

11:39

surface guy came and said it, I would have been like, I

11:41

love you too, you

11:44

love me? But but I did. It

11:46

was a year and a half of build up. It was a

11:48

year and a half of belting a friendship.

11:50

Hours on the phone, and I remember Alex,

11:52

our friend. Alex, was also like, dude,

11:55

that's fucked up that you would ask her

11:57

that question like that, I remember my what,

12:00

and the psychology for me behind that is

12:02

obviously I was way too afraid to

12:04

say it myself. You know. I wanted her to say

12:07

it first, because you know, then I wouldn't

12:09

have to be hurt if she in fact didn't

12:11

say it back to me or didn't love

12:14

me. But I don't think I said I love you back. I

12:16

don't think you did. No, I don't think it was like that.

12:20

No. So we had an incredible time in

12:22

Vegas, and then we came home and had

12:24

to and had to discover whether

12:26

or not it was real,

12:29

you know, outside of just that insanity.

12:32

Yeah, but the

12:34

insanity ensued, really, I mean even

12:36

it was just a said, it ensued.

12:39

I mean it was just a good time. It

12:41

was before like emails and real cell

12:43

phones, and it was just a

12:46

young you know, not a lot of

12:48

responsibility. We're both just kind of you

12:51

know mm hmm, going on auditions

12:53

and like going to clubs. I mean, it was a time.

12:56

It was a really fun, crazy

12:58

time. But I remember coming home home and

13:01

thinking, all right, like I

13:03

knew this would happen. We finally

13:05

like are together physically, it's

13:07

on all I'm doing is thinking about this guy.

13:10

And you know, in my mind, I think

13:13

I was like, all right,

13:15

like I don't want to just be one of those girls.

13:17

I don't want this to die out. I

13:19

don't want to like have him be like, oh

13:21

I finally got her and now I'm good.

13:24

And I've always had kind of a little you

13:28

know, saying or thought which is always

13:30

like be the one that

13:32

no one can get. My

13:35

dad always told me, and I thought it was great advice. No, I

13:37

know, and by the way, I carried with you because in La

13:39

I my friends who were like, oh,

13:41

you know, you're hanging out with Aaron

13:43

or whatever, and they're like, you know, they're

13:46

like, no, you won't be able to get

13:48

her. No one can get her. It's like she's she's

13:50

like an unattainable Yeah.

13:53

It was. It wasn't like only

13:55

like was up for the challenge. Was the challenge.

13:58

No, it was you know, you know, kind of playing

14:00

hard to get the thing is. At a certain point

14:02

I couldn't hold back anymore.

14:05

I also didn't want to lose what we had, which

14:07

was this friendship. But that I really did

14:09

value that I thought was different and amazing

14:11

to talk about the night on the phone, I remember,

14:14

and then but you know I said to you

14:16

because I said to Jackie, I was like, you

14:19

know, my best friend. And I would talk about it over and over

14:22

and I finally called and I was like, look, it's

14:26

either like we're together, just us, or

14:28

I don't really want to do this anymore. I'd rather like

14:30

put it on hold and have you kind of

14:32

do your thing and revisit

14:35

it down the road. And I felt

14:37

scared because I was like, oh my god, there was

14:39

a very good chance you could say okay,

14:43

and we hung up the phone. I was hoping

14:45

that he would be like, okay, no, I'm

14:47

all in. I'm all in, and you didn't.

14:50

You said I have to think about this. And

14:52

I remember hanging up the phone being like that

14:55

mother fucker liked Jackie and I was

14:57

like, he fucking has to think about

14:59

this. And I was spiraling and angry

15:02

well because I had, I

15:04

know, my ex girlfriend, you know what I

15:06

mean, like we were broken up, but I was like huh

15:09

and a few other people that I you know, I could nay no,

15:12

I know, but it was more about her. I remember

15:14

that. It was like, God, like I don't want to hurt

15:16

her. I don't want to is it over? Because

15:18

I was still sleeping with her kind of even though we were

15:20

broken up. Yeah, you know. But

15:22

then I called back pretty quickly, Well, you

15:25

made it sound like, you know all I

15:27

got to think about this, give me some time.

15:29

And I thought, what the fuck? And it was so

15:31

mad. I thought you made it sound like it's going to be like a couple of

15:33

days. You got to go through some stuff, and it was like

15:36

two hours later you called back and

15:38

you were like, okay, I'm in. Well

15:41

I was like, this is stupid. What am I doing? You

15:43

know? What am I afraid of? Who am I? You

15:45

know, is one of those you know, commitment

15:48

I've always been. I've always

15:50

been a girlfriend guy. I mean I've had

15:52

three girlfriends, and in

15:55

all of my life, I haven't even dated

15:58

for a week or two weeks or two or three

16:00

months or six months. It's been in love or

16:03

just having a good time, you know. So

16:07

I knew that when I was saying yes

16:09

to that, or when I was committing to that, that it was

16:12

fucking real. So

16:14

it was scary, you know, which is carried

16:16

on. I'm

16:20

always so scared. So

16:27

we've actually been using square space for

16:29

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16:31

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16:33

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16:36

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16:39

in website building, and that's why

16:41

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16:43

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16:45

went on them one time. I remember I had this

16:48

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16:51

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16:53

how you build a website, and

16:55

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16:57

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17:00

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17:04

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20:07

But then she invited me, Then Aaron invited me. This

20:10

was like almost spring ish.

20:12

And then she invited me to

20:14

go back east to her to

20:17

see her parents. And I was

20:19

like, no fucking way, because Simon was there

20:22

the summer before, and I'm like, I don't

20:24

want to just be the next dude

20:26

who's going to the Cape to like meet your

20:29

family. Yeah, just get in line.

20:34

But I was a girlfriend person too, a

20:36

relationship person. I didn't you

20:38

know. I had Steve for like

20:40

one hundred years through high school and college and

20:42

then like the worst person

20:44

on the Planet for a minute, and then

20:46

Simon that was it. And Simon and I were like

20:49

together for six months. Yeah, I

20:51

knew Simon, I think even before Aaron

20:53

and I love Simon. Simon's a good dude. So

20:56

then you came to the Cape the next

20:58

summer. Yeah yeah, yeah,

21:00

yeah, yeah yeah yeah yeah, and

21:02

it was on. Then you got your show and

21:04

went to Vancouver and once

21:07

it was on and you were you

21:09

know, yeah,

21:12

I was in So my history

21:14

a little bit is this. Okay, I had my

21:18

first high school girlfriend, and

21:21

you know, it's high school, but I was in love. I mean, there's

21:23

no doubt. And I know that now because I had I've

21:25

been in love obviously since,

21:28

and so I knew it was real. And

21:31

I was a good boyfriend up until the last

21:34

little bit. And I was a cheater and I

21:36

was bad and I did some bad

21:38

things I was in high school. But it hurt

21:41

her and it was devastating to me. And

21:44

so then with my second girlfriend, I

21:47

was so faithful, like super

21:49

super super faithful to Vanessa.

21:52

You know. Then I was getting into another relationship

21:55

and being committed and it was easy.

21:57

I mean, honestly, it was. It was easy

22:00

for me until

22:02

it wasn't until

22:05

it wasn't. I mean, honestly, three were together

22:07

for three years and

22:11

we weren't engaged. Yep,

22:14

blissful, wonderful.

22:17

We weren't engaged. So

22:19

I bought her jewelry all the time, and

22:22

I would always consult my mom because

22:25

she's good with jewelry and I'm good with jewelry as well.

22:27

But I just wanted to, you know, always throw

22:29

her things. What about this for Aaron? And it

22:32

was around Christmas time and I was getting her a Christmas

22:34

gift and I brought these rings and necklaces

22:37

and I'm like, what do you think about this? This and that? And

22:39

my Mom's like, what are you doing? You

22:41

know, why are you Why don't you just

22:44

give her a ring ring? I'm like, you mean

22:46

a fucking ring ring, like an engagement

22:49

ring. And I was scared. Marriage

22:51

scared me, honestly. And I think I

22:53

could probably speak for Aaron saying that she

22:55

you never thought that we were really going to

22:57

get married. I didn't.

22:59

I mean, I think I was the

23:02

opposite. I wanted a wedding.

23:04

I wanted my dad to walk me down the aisle. I'm

23:06

definitely more traditional, but

23:10

I also felt like I

23:12

know, you know from my parents

23:15

and you know their upbringing. My parents are high

23:17

school sweethearts, by the way. But you

23:20

know, when you find somebody, no matter

23:22

what it is, whether it kind of goes against

23:24

maybe your religious you

23:26

know, beliefs or you

23:28

know, parents or whatever it

23:31

might be, it's hard enough to find

23:33

somebody. So I was

23:35

more excited just to have a life partner.

23:37

And the and the truth is, my dad used to always

23:39

say this, you know, it isn't

23:41

about the marriage. It's about who this person

23:43

will be as a father if you have children.

23:46

So I think for me, I was like, oh,

23:49

that's going to be off the charts, like no

23:52

question. And I just let go

23:54

a little bit of the idea because I knew you weren't

23:56

into it. You had your parents,

23:59

you know that. And I said, Okay, it

24:02

isn't about like the certificate

24:04

of marriage and legally being bound, but

24:06

I did want to have some sort of like wedding

24:08

or party or fun part like yeah,

24:11

And I was just sort of not. I

24:13

saw Kurt and Mom, and I

24:15

saw that work. And then I looked

24:17

at my dad and mom who were married, and I

24:19

looked at that and I saw that didn't work. It was

24:21

pretty basic, right, So my

24:24

philosophy was, why get married, what's

24:27

the point really, Let's just be together

24:29

and be in love and have a family and all that. Yeah,

24:32

and I believed

24:34

that. I think in the beginning I did think

24:36

it was probably just a little bit of an excuse.

24:38

I was kind of like and I would

24:40

say, look, here's my parents been

24:42

married since like, you know, high

24:45

school. Sweetheart's amazing marriage,

24:47

still happy, laughing, having fun. So

24:49

that was my model, so, you

24:51

know, yeah, I believed in that, right.

24:54

And her dad is just one of the great

24:56

human beings to ever walk on this earth.

24:58

I mean, it is true, he's not in

25:01

so many different ways. And Aaron's

25:04

childhood so it was my mom

25:06

and my mom is one of the grades too,

25:09

But in her childhood

25:11

was like so idyllic. It

25:14

was fairytale esque, you

25:17

know, small town in Long Meadow, ride

25:19

your bike to school. I mean, it was out of a

25:21

movie. Parents are still

25:27

I'm just saying. I'm just talking about sort of your

25:29

expectations of man when when

25:31

one is sort of having getting

25:34

married or falling in love, and

25:36

you know, you're you're looking at your father figure

25:38

in a sense, and you have to live up to

25:40

who your who your dad is,

25:43

you know what I mean? And there's no way

25:45

I could do that, but

25:48

but you did have like if I

25:50

was thinking about, you know, my dad,

25:52

there is that, you know, kind of

25:54

light up the room. Everybody's drawn to

25:57

him, charming,

26:00

you know, the best like dad,

26:02

father figure, like you had a lot of those.

26:04

Yes, so you might not be as good of a

26:06

golfer as my dad, but yeah.

26:10

But anyway, so we're there. I got

26:12

the rings and my mom is like, what are you doing?

26:14

I say, Mom, I don't know what do you what are you nuts?

26:17

Like I'm scared, And my mom basically

26:19

said, she goes, look, this is this ring

26:21

that you were going to get her. Doesn't mean you have

26:23

to get married right away. It's a token.

26:26

It's it's it's saying something. And

26:28

she said, do you want to be with her for the rest of your life?

26:30

And I said I do, yeah,

26:32

Well, then get her something just to show her that

26:35

you can wait. And it sort

26:37

of put me at ease a little bit. So I

26:39

said, okay, fuck, here we go and

26:42

I bought her a ring and

26:45

Neil Lane I picked it out myself, and

26:48

I had whole plan. I bought my first house.

26:50

We were moving into the house. You

26:53

know, it's kind of a funny,

26:55

cute story. There's boxes everywhere, sort

26:57

of movie style, and we

27:00

it's raining, and I have this whole

27:02

plan. I've got the ring, I've

27:04

rehearsed a little bit of a speech, you

27:07

know, just

27:09

to set it a little bit. We did have this

27:11

thing that we would say to each other, our

27:13

a little comment which was like guess how much I love

27:16

you? From the children's book

27:18

with the bunnies and the whole thing. And

27:20

then you know,

27:22

it would be like, do you know how much I love you? And

27:24

I would always say coyly like no, you

27:27

know, like and then if he would tell me, it's like a cute

27:29

little thing. Sometimes.

27:31

Yeah, So I had a whole I

27:34

have to sell this bog it's so good.

27:36

So we're moving into this house. It's

27:39

so exciting. It's a cute little Spanish house

27:41

in West Hollywood. And we're

27:43

going through undoing boxes and my friend

27:46

Jackie has come over and she's there

27:48

helping, and she looks

27:50

up on the fireplace and she's like, what

27:53

is this? And up on the fireplace

27:55

Oliver has found a box of like, say,

27:57

memorabilia or whatever, it is a photos

28:00

and he's taking out like

28:02

eight pictures of me and my ex cibon

28:05

now that everybody knows, but and

28:08

put them up on the mantle. So it's like us

28:10

in Jamaica, like us cuddling, kissing,

28:13

like you know, on the beach whatever, all

28:15

up on the thing. And I come out. I'm like hysterically

28:18

laughing, and that's just like who

28:21

he is, because this is actually the night that he's going

28:23

to propose. If I don't know this yet. So

28:26

we had like a great night. You know,

28:28

Jackie was there, and you told

28:31

Jackie you were going to do it. Remember, So

28:33

I'm in another room and you're looking at Jackie

28:35

and you like show her the ring. She like burst into tears

28:38

and then she's like I have to leave because I'm not going to

28:40

be able to like see Aaron. And

28:43

he was like, oh okay, but she was so excited.

28:45

So I come out of the room and she's just smiling at me like

28:48

Hi, like a totally

28:50

awkward, like weird, like she could barely keep

28:52

it in. Of course, I had no clue what she was talking about. She's like,

28:54

I'm gonna go. I was like, okay, you know,

28:56

I love you. Anyways, we crawl

28:58

into bed. It's late planned. I

29:00

planned. I planned it, so I was gonna I

29:02

wrote her a note. I was going

29:04

to make her cry beautiful and you

29:06

know, the love letter, just saying,

29:09

you know, just I'm so happy to be moving into this

29:11

house with you, like starting starting her

29:13

life together and

29:15

how special you are to me and all the

29:18

stuff, and boom, okay, cue

29:20

the tears. Great. And then I

29:22

was going to like just hold her and look at her, and it's

29:25

going to say do you know how much I love you? And

29:27

like we do, and she's supposed to coily, acutely

29:29

say no. And then I'm supposed

29:32

to have the ring in my pillow case. I'm gonna

29:34

pull a ring out and then say well, this is how much I

29:36

love you or something like that. This is

29:38

well, this is how much you know. Boom

29:41

I had it had it was going to go to plan.

29:44

Wasn't too It wasn't too difficult. Read

29:46

the letter, crying, check, you

29:49

know, hug Great. Then I go

29:51

to the port where I'm like, do you know do

29:53

you know how much I love you? And

29:55

she goes yes, and

29:59

I'm like, because you had just written

30:01

me this love letter it's amazing. I don't

30:03

know, I'm emotional. No, it was supposed

30:05

to prompt me to say this is how much

30:07

pull the fucking ring out and then boom her off to

30:09

the races. But she

30:11

says yes, so I'm like,

30:14

oh, she were like she's donne and then I

30:16

was like, just kissing you and

30:20

yes, and I was like, oh,

30:23

I know, I love you the

30:25

fuck and I've got the ring

30:27

behind me. And then she saves

30:30

me by saying not

30:32

she doesn't, no, there's a ring, but she goes,

30:34

this is the best night ever. And

30:37

then and then I pull out

30:39

the ring and I say, well, here's something to

30:41

make it even better yep, and

30:45

then boom, amazing. So I

30:47

improved. I recovered and

30:49

scene, and so I also had a fucking

30:51

video camera recording

30:54

all of this. As filming her.

30:56

As she's looking at the ring, she goes, shut the fuck.

30:58

Oh opens it up, you know, closes it. Yeah,

31:00

Because I was so in shock because obviously

31:03

I had been prepping my family, who was like, you've

31:05

been dating this guy for three years, like, is he gonna

31:07

put a ring on your finger? And I had to

31:09

tell everybody it was like, no, he's not, and

31:11

everyone's gonna have to deal with that, Like my East Coast

31:14

traditional family is going to have to accept that,

31:16

Like we're going to be together, we're probably gonna

31:18

have kids, but like there's not going to be

31:20

a wedding. Yeah, And speaking of East Coast traditional,

31:22

one of the first questions she asked me, I'm

31:25

literally in tears so

31:27

excited, and like thirty seconds

31:29

after I realized what's going on, I'm like, oh my god,

31:31

I'm like, what did my dad say? Like crying,

31:34

all emotional. He goes straight faced, like ghost

31:37

and he's like, uh, it's

31:40

silent. I'm like, wait a minute. You didn't ask

31:42

my dad or call my dad.

31:45

And he's like no, and he's like, didn't

31:47

even cross my mind, Like it wasn't even

31:50

it wasn't even a thought in my

31:52

mind, non traditional versus tradition.

31:56

I did not. I did not, So what

31:58

did we do? She did to call

32:00

my dad on the East Coast and my mom.

32:03

It was like it was like three in the morning. Three in the morning

32:05

for them, so they're going to wake up with like a heart attack phone

32:07

call. But Oliver did set it up. He called

32:10

right. I called her dad and I said Brooks.

32:13

He pals like I got some news. I got something

32:15

to tell you, and he goes, what

32:17

is it? And I take a beat

32:20

and I'm like, Aaron's

32:22

pregnant. And

32:25

there's a long pause and said thing

32:28

and I'm like, ah, I'm just kidding. I just

32:30

proposed. She said yes, and he's

32:32

like, oh fuck, man, fuck, what

32:34

are you doing, buddy? And then yeah,

32:36

you know, it was actually smart because you

32:39

know, you hit him with the extreme

32:41

and then you pull back with the joke, and

32:43

then the fact that I didn't tell him

32:46

or ask him that goes away. Yeah,

32:48

it was like just relieve. Yeah, it's just really

32:51

And but then we did end up having

32:53

an amazing wedding. We

32:56

did. But but but even even after that, which threw

32:58

me for a loop, was the next

33:00

fucking morning, Jackie and all your

33:02

friends all of a sudden show up at like seven

33:04

point thirty with baskets

33:07

of already pre made sweatshirts,

33:09

and like missus hudds. I'm

33:11

like, when the fuck did they get

33:13

this shit done? I mean it was a few days, and yeah,

33:15

it was like crazy, like a scene out of a movie.

33:19

Honestly, I remember exactly. I

33:21

felt overwhelmed and I left

33:23

the house. I went to Dukes. I

33:25

remember, I went to Duke's and I had a chili cheese

33:27

homelet by myself. I remember,

33:30

and I remember being like, what the fuck are you guys

33:32

doing? Like what couldn't you wait till like Ollie

33:34

wasn't here to come in with like baskets

33:36

of like bride shit. And it was just

33:39

it was it was exciting. It was the girly, the

33:42

girly stuff. And then from that moment on

33:44

the panic set in and then everything was

33:46

good. We got married, went downhill,

33:49

we got married and had kids

33:51

and yeah, everything was good. Yeah,

33:54

so should we break and go to commercial folks

33:56

and come back for the good stuff? I

34:00

wish it was that easy,

34:02

but it wasn't. Well

34:04

I thought it was because I didn't

34:06

know that it wasn't.

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He interviewed John Bonjob. He told his story

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37:33

the story.

37:40

There's a lot of lessons in this story. We

37:42

won't get too detailed, but basically,

37:46

I just went I just took a downward spiral.

37:48

I mean, I don't know what it was. Three years. I

37:51

was perfectly good, and then after the

37:53

engagement, something happened and

37:55

I started to drink a little bit more and I

37:58

just became detached and

38:00

went into party mode and

38:02

of into major avoidance

38:04

of some kind. And I don't know if this was

38:07

triggered by well, it probably was

38:09

triggered by the bridle

38:12

baskets, the bridle baskets, just the

38:15

finality, I guess, of

38:17

what it means to be married,

38:21

maybe dealing with my parents

38:23

and their divorce. And I don't know, but I

38:26

just so you were a baby. Don't forget you

38:28

were like twenty twenty

38:31

eight when

38:33

we got engaged. No, yeah,

38:35

twenty seven, twenty seven or twenty

38:38

eight, I mean you know you use yeah.

38:40

I mean I had experienced a

38:42

ton of life. I had never

38:44

lived alone, I lived with a roommate or whatever.

38:46

Anyway, these are all bullshit excuses. But

38:49

I just tumbled into

38:51

darkness, and I was unfaithful,

38:54

and I was out on the

38:56

scene and partying and doing

38:58

my thing, and of

39:01

course me thinking I had,

39:03

you know, found my like night and shining

39:06

armor, whatever the saying is,

39:10

who had had unfaithful orphans in the past

39:12

and kind of put all way up on this pedestal

39:15

due to his dad and

39:17

his childhood and never wanted to do that and all that kind

39:19

of stuff. When I look

39:22

back, of course, there were red flags

39:24

and I saw it happening, but I was so of

39:27

course naive is going to be

39:30

the obvious word that comes, you

39:32

know, to mind, and

39:34

I'll take that. But I think I also

39:38

had a better belief

39:40

in you and just I

39:43

was not a jealous person. And when I say

39:45

that, like, I truly mean I was

39:47

not jealous of him going out. I

39:49

wasn't jealous of the girls throwing themselves

39:52

at him. I literally almost liked

39:55

it. I felt like it was a compliment,

39:57

right, that all these girls liked him and that he

39:59

was hot. I always felt like, well,

40:01

I know he's not going to cross the line.

40:03

He's still going to come home with me. And I fell

40:05

in love with you because you were flirt and

40:08

charming and all of that stuff. I loved about

40:10

you. I wasn't threatened

40:12

by it. I

40:15

had the confidence in me, you know, all

40:17

that kind of stuff. And you

40:19

know, looking back, of course, now there's a million

40:22

red flags that I either just didn't

40:24

choose to see or want to see or want to believe.

40:27

Yeah, but I was also ever

40:29

catch you. There was nothing that I could

40:32

no, there was no getting caught. And we'll get into that in

40:34

a second. But for me, just to talk about my personal

40:36

state of being, I was there

40:40

was a I called it like a after

40:43

therapy and going through all of this, I called it like

40:45

a lowercase addiction, like a lowercase

40:47

a addiction in a sense, because

40:50

I would come home and I would shower, and

40:52

I would cry in the shower, and I would

40:54

have shame, deep shame. But then

40:56

I'd you know, mix a drink and get

40:59

right back out there, you know what I mean. So there

41:01

was a lot that I was masking, you

41:03

know, a lot of psychology that I was

41:05

had yet to come up. I mean, I

41:08

also looked at I think a lot of it, you

41:10

know at the time was I

41:12

knew you had insecurities,

41:15

right, Like I knew that you needed

41:17

kind of your ego to be fed a little

41:19

bit. And I but I didn't mind that.

41:22

I just didn't realize how deep down

41:25

it was going and you

41:27

know, you going out and partying and staying out

41:30

late. You know, I was like, all right,

41:32

like you know, it just it just wasn't

41:34

a thought to me. But I did start to sense

41:36

like, okay, if I'm not enough,

41:38

and like, you know, you need other women

41:41

to you know, because look, we all want to go out

41:43

or be wherever we are and you know, feel

41:45

like we're attractive

41:48

or that I mean it feels

41:50

good. I mean I'm just being one hundred percent honest

41:52

and you know, humble. You still,

41:54

even if you're in a relationship, whether you're dating

41:57

or married or you still you

41:59

know, want to know that you could you

42:03

know. I guess my feeling was like, hey, if

42:05

I went out to borrow, I knew I could still get

42:08

you know, a guy, or I could go home with

42:10

someone like That's what I would have That's

42:12

where I would have drawn my line on my confidence

42:14

or my ego. It's like, all right, I still got it, and

42:17

I think yours started there, and

42:19

it just kind of went

42:21

down into a darker spiral

42:24

of needing to knowing that you

42:26

could get the girl, then knowing that you could

42:29

and you kind of want to or where it just it

42:31

just you know, yeah, no, I know,

42:33

it was just it was a bad spot. And it was

42:36

about two years of just cycling

42:38

spiraling down into this hole. And

42:41

then we got married, which

42:43

was an incredible fucking wedding. I mean,

42:45

one of the all time great weddings,

42:48

honestly. I mean it was about ninety

42:50

people, and

42:53

I was such a fucking dick. Oh my god, the dick.

42:55

But I don't know if I would have changed anything.

42:57

So Aaron has her amazing friends from college

43:00

who I love, a home and home and everything

43:02

else, right, and I've got my family, and

43:04

I wanted to make it small, like intimacy

43:07

matters to me when I'm speaking, you know,

43:09

words from my heart. I especially

43:12

like having a wedding when you didn't want to have a wedding,

43:14

so right, I didn't want anyone there who

43:16

I didn't know, So no, you

43:18

literally you said to me, I don't want to have to be introduced

43:21

to anybody at my own wedding, yes, and

43:23

with your parents and you know all this stuff.

43:26

You know, it made sense and it was, oh,

43:29

I got people are gonna hate me for this, I know, but

43:31

but but it was like, here's the thing.

43:33

What happens is, you know, if I have one friend

43:35

and the husband and then but it's a group of friends

43:37

from my right so it's a group of friends. It's

43:40

fine. It all turned out amazing. It was small

43:42

and intimate. Few people might have not been

43:45

happy, but like, right, because well, no,

43:47

I know, but I didn't tell the thing like

43:50

I was like, your girlfriends

43:52

from college, I love it, but their husbands

43:54

or boyfriends who I don't know. I didn't

43:57

know at the time. I didn't know at the time. Right now I

43:59

do didn't know. I was like, I don't really want

44:01

them to be at my wedding. Well,

44:03

we had to cut numbers, is really what was happening

44:06

because where we were and space

44:08

and so who ended up getting cut was people

44:10

that Oliver didn't know. He is a very small family.

44:13

I know everybody and his family, and

44:15

it was I had to say to my parents too, you

44:17

can't have like the bigger, wider

44:20

group of friends. We had all family,

44:22

a few close friends

44:24

that are basically like but all the friends, all

44:26

the husbands came to Cobo, but

44:28

they just didn't come to the wedding. There

44:31

were other hotels and my friends that

44:33

have you know, normal jobs, and they aren't

44:35

in the entertainment business. Was like, we're taking a fucking

44:37

vacation to come like great, like go,

44:39

I mean terrible. I apologized

44:42

all you boys out there, that's

44:44

my best friend, my friends, you know who wanted

44:46

that were single, just you know. I also said, if you're

44:48

single, do not bring a date. There were no

44:50

dates. You had to like literally

44:52

be like married and we had to know your partner. Did

44:54

that happen because I remember Tray you know. Anyway,

44:58

it was an incredible wedding, incredible

45:00

speeches. Aaron's brother like brought

45:02

the house down, My brother, why I brought the house

45:04

down? It was just beautiful. We partied

45:07

till five in the morning. It was so much fun.

45:10

It was just one of those

45:12

moments, just a really really fun wedding.

45:14

And then I will say this, So that was

45:17

June sixth, ninth,

45:21

June ninth, So from June ninth

45:23

on I will say this though too, in our in our

45:25

vows, I

45:28

didn't cry and you

45:31

were weeping and

45:33

a mess, and I think it was a lot of your guilt and shame

45:35

and just kind of like, holy shit,

45:38

I've been a fucking horrible person. Yeah,

45:41

I was an angel and perfect. And then

45:45

so we spent my birthday

45:47

in Colorado and won't get in, but we

45:49

went on our honeymoon. Honeymoon, I

45:52

mean, it was just beautiful. And by the way, you

45:54

know, I was good from that point on. Once

45:56

marriage happened, I was good. And

45:59

then my birthday comes around and

46:02

we're driving back from Vegas and

46:05

uh, basically

46:08

we're at dinner. Well you got

46:10

to call. I know

46:13

all the details. We don't have so much time, okay,

46:15

okay, anyways, long story short, Yeah,

46:17

there's so much time. We can do a

46:19

part two if in the comment section they

46:22

want to hear more and more and more. But let me just say it really

46:24

quickly. We tried to get pregnant that summer on the honeymoon.

46:26

I had gone off the pill. That was kind of our goal

46:28

right away, and it didn't happen.

46:30

And so we were driving home

46:33

from Colorado to La we stopped

46:35

in Vegas, had a great night.

46:37

We're sitting at dinner and I was like, god, I got my period

46:40

or whatever, and you know, I was I was bombed,

46:42

but I was like whatever, it's a few months. And

46:44

you were like ghost

46:46

white, really like awkward

46:49

and you know, just sad, and I'm thinking, oh

46:51

my god, like he really wants a kid. And

46:53

I was like it's not going to be okay, babe, like it's going to happen,

46:57

and you were just like weird and

46:59

distant. Is everything okay? And then

47:01

you just were like I'm not the

47:03

man you think I am. And

47:07

you started with the saying You're like I gotta go, we

47:09

gotta leave dinner. And I was like, holy

47:11

fucking shit, he's going to break up with me, like

47:14

didn't want to get married. Now he's freaking out

47:17

cold feet. It's over. And

47:19

we have this like silent, like walk

47:21

of silence back to the hotel room

47:24

that now looks like the shining hallway

47:26

in my memory. And

47:28

we go back to the hotel room and you're like, I've

47:31

been unfaithful and I don't want to bring a child

47:34

into the world like this, and I'm relieved that

47:36

you're not pregnant. Because

47:39

there's just there's too much darkness and

47:41

I need to get this off my chest. And

47:44

basically, if you will ever

47:47

forgive me, you know, well,

47:50

I mean, yeah, I didn't.

47:52

Yeah. I had to tell her. I had to tell I

47:55

had to tell her. We had started this life,

47:57

we had gotten married and

48:00

and we were gonna have kids. And I couldn't

48:02

do it. I just I

48:04

couldn't do it. I couldn't

48:07

continue on living

48:10

in this crazy world, living in

48:12

my mind, living this lie. And

48:14

so I told her. I didn't get caught.

48:17

I told her. I told her everything. And

48:21

I was a mess. Oh. I was threw

48:23

up all the wine. I was like, yeah, Aaron

48:26

is ice fucking cold, sitting

48:28

on the couch, which was worse just looking

48:30

at me, watching me just

48:33

go through it, throwing up, puking.

48:35

I've ruined everything. If

48:38

it was a movie, you know, and

48:40

we're doing a scene, that director would cut and

48:43

be like, all right, Oliver, you're way over the

48:45

top. You got to bring it down

48:47

because you were way over the time. I was out

48:49

of my mind. Well, I was in I

48:52

think a state of shock. I was also angry. My

48:54

whole thing I had always said, and I said this to every

48:57

relationship I was ever in. You

48:59

know, we're human. It's fucking

49:02

you know, not easy no matter how in love

49:04

you are, everybody makes mistakes.

49:06

Like I get it, I get attraction, I got all that

49:08

kind of shit. But I was like, if

49:11

something ever happens, just tell

49:13

me so I don't hear it from someone

49:16

else. And I would do the same because

49:18

I feel like there's something to be said. When

49:21

you come and say

49:23

to the person I've done this, it's

49:27

different than a rumor, is different than other

49:29

people knowing. It's also saying I want you

49:31

to know from me, which in my mind,

49:34

getting caught means

49:36

you weren't done doing it, and

49:40

you know then you've got to pay the consequences and you're going

49:42

to have to be done. But when you're

49:44

coming forward, you're basically saying

49:46

I'm done, I don't want to do this anymore. I want you to know.

49:49

So that was always my like golden rule, and

49:52

I just didn't think it was going to actually happen.

49:55

And it was crazy. I

49:57

mean I remember in that hotel room,

49:59

I was like I turned into a little child. Remember,

50:01

I was like, Hey, I want to call my mom my, Mommy.

50:03

I was like I need my mommy, even though I

50:06

was the one who did all the horrible things,

50:08

like I need I needed love. I needed

50:10

someone to like hold me, you know what I mean.

50:12

It was selfish, but still I was

50:14

like I was just spinning and

50:16

like, oh my god. I just remember thinking

50:19

like I got fucking played

50:21

and I had no idea so separate

50:24

from jealousy or

50:26

the questions, like right away, in my

50:28

mind, I was just like, oh my

50:31

fucking god, like you played

50:33

me like I thought, you know, you

50:36

wouldn't do this or whatever, and it was I was so angry

50:39

and I literally said to you, you're

50:41

going to call my dad and tell them why we're getting

50:43

divorced after three months of marriage. Yeah,

50:46

it was then no, but

50:48

I just in my mind, I was like, so, we

50:50

we were driving home a rental

50:52

car. I left the car in Vegas because I couldn't

50:54

drive. We get up the next morning and I get a car to

50:57

take us because I was just in no shape. And

50:59

that car ride from LA to from Vegas

51:01

to LA was really crazy, and you

51:04

know, I was just crying and it was silent,

51:06

and I was just going through it and you

51:09

know, just thinking about

51:11

how I've just destroyed one of the great things

51:13

in my life. And

51:17

and then it happened, and for me, it

51:19

was the moment that I knew that things might be okay

51:22

because Aaron took my head

51:25

and she put it on her lap, and

51:27

then she just started stroking my hair because

51:30

she knew the kind of pain that I was

51:32

in and that's the kind of woman she is,

51:35

by the way, and that and that moment,

51:37

I was like, Okay, you know, I think we might

51:40

have a we might have a chance. And

51:43

then the work started home.

51:47

I will say, just for that moment in the car,

51:49

it's like, you know, I'm

51:53

very I

51:55

don't know, I'm just realistic and

51:58

like I know that there are women that would,

52:00

you know, never look back, and I respect

52:03

that. I think for me, the

52:06

biggest thing is like, you're madly in

52:08

love with someone. We were literally

52:10

on a high of trying to make a baby and coming off

52:13

of our honeymoon, and you don't

52:15

all of a sudden fall out of

52:17

love. I mean I didn't anyway,

52:19

So I was like, I still love this person.

52:21

I am broken hearted, angry,

52:25

you know. I mean, there was just so many things swirling,

52:28

but I knew that

52:31

the reality of men

52:34

and women and monogamy. I'm

52:37

just very realistic, I guess,

52:39

and I you know, I

52:41

thought it was over. I mean, I knew in

52:43

my mind it's really really, really

52:45

hard to come back from uh,

52:49

you know, infidelity and earn

52:51

trust back. And I, you know, I was more

52:53

sad at that point. I think

52:55

I was angry and I was sad, and I just thought

52:58

we had something really fun and good and

53:00

he just couldn't he couldn't

53:02

do it, and that was like devastating,

53:06

right, But then you go, then you go deeper,

53:09

you know what I mean. And that's where you

53:11

I'll always say whenever I write you letters,

53:14

because I write her letters at least once a year,

53:16

handwritten letters. She's the most

53:18

evolved woman that I know, you

53:21

know, and this is one of the reasons why.

53:23

I mean, she's looking at things in a

53:25

bigger picture. Yes, she can be

53:27

reactionary. Why shouldn't she be, you

53:30

know. But when we got home, we

53:32

moved out, you know, we had our home,

53:34

but she moved in with a friend, Jackie. I

53:37

moved in with my parents. She didn't

53:39

want to be in that house, you know. Well,

53:41

there were so many questions when it started happening,

53:43

because it's not like that night you told

53:46

me everything that went on in those couple of years. It was like

53:48

you just were generalizing. Well, then we got

53:50

into therapy. I mean, we got in the therapy

53:52

and things came out because basically what I

53:54

thought was, you know, our

53:57

parents got involved, everyone was very

53:59

supportive around us. I knew,

54:01

you know this person,

54:04

you know, basically like you know, it came

54:06

down to this. Your mom looked at me and said, please

54:09

do not give up on him. If you can give

54:11

it a try in therapy to

54:13

work through something like this, please do it,

54:16

because he is going to

54:18

change for himself, whether

54:20

it's for you or not. And then she's

54:22

like, and then there's going to be someone else in her lives. And

54:24

I don't want anybody else in our lives.

54:27

I want you to be my daughter in law.

54:29

And I really think, well,

54:31

you know, should give it. You know, you

54:33

saw this as an act, you know, not

54:36

as a whole of you of who

54:38

I am. You know, I'm not a

54:40

bad, nefarious, disgusting, horrible

54:43

human being at the core. You know, this

54:45

was symptomatic of a lot of things

54:48

in my life. And it takes someone evolved like

54:50

you and someone like my mom who would

54:52

help you to understand that take

54:55

the journey, you know. And I think honestly

54:57

that's the problem, not just in relationships,

54:59

but not just in love relationships, but relationships

55:02

in general. We are so quick to throw

55:04

everything away now instead of really

55:06

take a thirty thousand foot view, look

55:09

at the whole person, and get

55:11

into the souls, get into the emotions,

55:13

get into a little bit of the psychology of who these

55:15

people are, and maybe understand

55:18

to then grow with or

55:20

at least give it an attempt, and then if

55:23

you can't, okay, right. But

55:25

I think also at that moment in time,

55:27

those couple weeks where I was still in shock

55:29

and you know, kind of just devastate

55:31

it was over. We didn't have kids, okay,

55:34

we didn't have a lot of years of marriage under

55:36

our belt. It was different. It was still very

55:39

fresh and very fun. And I mean,

55:42

you know, a part of it was we

55:44

were not bad, okay, so meaning

55:46

like we were still having fun together. We were

55:49

still having sex all the time. We were you

55:51

know, you had your own thing. It wasn't

55:53

like our relationship had deteriorated

55:56

or you know, we had grown

55:58

apart. I mean, those factors were

56:00

important. And then I think for me,

56:03

I said to you at that point in time, and

56:06

I guess this speaks to kind of being

56:08

evolved, And I said,

56:11

this is your opportunity to

56:13

go, because I

56:16

will love you for that decision as well,

56:18

meaning do not stay because

56:21

you feel guilty or like you should or

56:23

you don't want to lose me, like lose

56:26

me, like you

56:28

know what I'm saying. I remember sitting in Jen's office

56:30

and just saying, like I will still respect

56:32

you, Like, do not do this because you're scared to

56:34

lose me. Don't do this because like you think it's the

56:37

right thing, and your parents and my parents and everyone's

56:39

involved, Like it's okay

56:42

if you need to go, Like I understand

56:44

that, Like we're still young. You're

56:47

young, Like you know you've been so

56:49

honest and so eager to fix

56:51

this, but like, just make sure it's about fixing

56:54

you and not like saving

56:56

our relationship. And then

56:58

we had a week without each

57:00

other because it was just therapy, and I you

57:02

know, I think I really did think you

57:05

were going to do that, and I

57:08

thought maybe our story will reconnect one

57:10

day because I did believe

57:12

in us. But I knew you were young. I knew there was

57:14

so much that you still

57:16

needed to personally deal with from

57:19

your childhood and your father. I need all

57:21

of your ego and self worth and

57:23

it just it was a big undertaking.

57:26

But you were very, very adamant about doing it

57:28

together, and

57:32

so we started the journey of therapy,

57:34

which was great. Corse

57:41

Light, Baby, Corse Light, Ollie,

57:44

you're in the rockies. If

57:46

you could see me right now, I am sitting at

57:49

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57:51

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57:53

season. I know it does. When you need

57:55

to make the most of it. You just need to chill.

57:58

You got to chill. Just have a course light. You gotta

58:00

sip by the pool. You

58:02

gotta get your cooler out, fill it with cores

58:05

light, ice, cold cores light, and

58:08

just sip on those cores light while you hang out

58:10

with your friends and you laugh and

58:12

you talk shit and watch the

58:14

sun go down. Man,

58:16

I mean, does it get better than that? I don't think

58:18

so. It's a cold loggered, cold filtered,

58:21

cold package, crisp refreshing.

58:24

It's perfect for a moment

58:26

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58:29

crisp as shit. I'm

58:31

about to go play golf right now. Loading

58:34

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58:36

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58:39

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59:03

here's how fucked up I was. My

59:05

therapist didn't even know what was

59:07

going on. Like I had my therapist,

59:09

but I wouldn't even tell him through these two years

59:12

what I was going through because that's I was so ashamed

59:14

of it. I was like, I don't want to. I was just it was horrible.

59:17

But the best was when Aaron made me call her dad,

59:21

you know, because he's old school. You know.

59:23

I was like, Brooks, you know, here's what happened,

59:25

and I told her everything. He is, what do you

59:27

mean? He goes, you told her you

59:29

didn't get caught, and I'm like, no,

59:32

I told her because I couldn't live with this,

59:34

and he goes, you weren't married when

59:36

he did any this? He said no, He's

59:38

like all right, he sounds

59:41

good to me. I'm like Jesus,

59:44

I mean, yeah, it's a little exaggeration, I

59:46

mean a little bit, but he was definitely. What he

59:49

said to me was, you know,

59:51

you guys have something special. I have men,

59:53

grown men that wouldn't have enough

59:56

courage, you know, or respect to

59:58

do what he did. You were not married

1:00:01

at the time, nothing went on in your own home. These

1:00:03

were isolated incidents. It wasn't a full

1:00:05

blown love affair of you

1:00:07

know, with one person. This was he

1:00:10

really broke it down and it is generational.

1:00:12

And you know, my dad was like, I'll support you whatever

1:00:14

you do. But you know, we

1:00:16

were there at your wedding and you know,

1:00:18

if you guys are going to give it a try, we support

1:00:21

that. And you know, and

1:00:23

I had them as such a model of

1:00:26

you know, they're just the best, and they're

1:00:28

and they're opposites, they're not perfect, but they

1:00:30

work and you know, they've been together

1:00:33

for one hundred and fifty years and

1:00:35

they've seen a lot and I've seen

1:00:37

it through their eyes of relationships and anyways,

1:00:41

I went in it with a very like

1:00:44

bleak outlook. I thought, it's

1:00:47

worth it. We're married. I love this

1:00:49

person. I'm going to try, but I don't think

1:00:51

it's going to work. And

1:00:53

I just didn't have my hopes up. I think, you know, infidelity

1:00:56

is really hard. I think trust. I said to you, I go,

1:00:58

look, you're going to probably do all this amazing work.

1:01:01

You might become the most honest, you

1:01:04

know, wonderful person

1:01:06

and partner. And I said, and I will probably

1:01:08

deteriorate and become jealous and insecure.

1:01:10

I don't want to be checking your phones

1:01:12

and not trusting you. It's an ugly,

1:01:15

dark place and it is it's

1:01:17

poison. And I didn't I've had

1:01:20

that feeling before. I didn't want that, and

1:01:22

I didn't want that to be the reason

1:01:24

we broke up in a few years because

1:01:27

I couldn't handle it and I

1:01:29

became insecure and all of those ugly

1:01:31

things that it can bring out. I didn't

1:01:33

want. That's not who I am. I've

1:01:36

done, you know, and been there, and it just is

1:01:39

not a police I wanted

1:01:41

to be. And so, you

1:01:43

know, we had a lot of stuff.

1:01:45

I mean, I remember sitting with our therapist and I

1:01:48

said, you don't have to do it right

1:01:50

this second, but we're going to meet here. Whatever

1:01:52

it was a few days later and you're going to tell me

1:01:55

every single detail

1:01:57

and thing that went on, and

1:01:59

the you know, Oliver's looking at me like a fucking deer

1:02:01

in headlights, and my therapist is like, who whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa.

1:02:03

I don't think this is a good idea. And

1:02:05

I looked at my therapist and I said, it's not your relationship,

1:02:09

it's mine. And I looked at Allie and I said, if you're

1:02:11

not up for it, I understand, but if

1:02:13

we are going to move forward, that's

1:02:15

what I need to know. For me, it

1:02:17

was who knew? And all these

1:02:19

people thought that I didn't fucking know, And that was

1:02:22

my therapy that I needed to work on,

1:02:24

right because the thing

1:02:27

therapist, I was ashamed. I was like, he knew,

1:02:30

and they're walking around and then these fucking

1:02:32

horrors, you know, we're walking around like, oh,

1:02:35

she has no idea, But I was with her person.

1:02:37

I mean all of that shit. That was

1:02:39

my issue and my problem, which of course

1:02:42

is not everybody is. And but for me

1:02:44

it was like, I don't want to find something else

1:02:47

out five years down the road and we bump

1:02:49

into somebody or something comes up.

1:02:52

I was all about, if we're doing this. We're

1:02:54

a team. Now. I want to know everything. I

1:02:58

want you to call all the

1:03:00

people and let them know that I know. And

1:03:04

I'm saying all I mean, it wasn't, you know, like a list

1:03:06

of twenty, but it was definitely a handful. And

1:03:10

I had a few, you know, kind of ultimatums

1:03:13

and I was like, if you're not okay with it, I understand,

1:03:15

but moving forward, that's what I need. And then you came back a

1:03:17

week later and you were like, I'm ready, and

1:03:20

I said, okay, here we go. And he told me things

1:03:23

that I definitely would never ever

1:03:25

have found out probably for like three lifetimes.

1:03:28

And that was definitely like

1:03:30

what did I What did I do? But

1:03:34

it just it made me

1:03:36

feel like I knew. It gave me the confidence to

1:03:38

say, okay, he was willing to share this shit with me,

1:03:40

and we could put it

1:03:42

behind us. And then there were no secrets.

1:03:44

There was no me

1:03:47

wondering, you know, oh my god, am I gonna run

1:03:49

run end of one? Who's gonna

1:03:51

know? All that shit got cleared up and then we had

1:03:56

then it just kind of rebuilt and it really

1:03:58

was the free and the post of our

1:04:00

relationship. But but you know, yes,

1:04:03

And I want to be clear, like you know, the

1:04:05

Aaron is, I

1:04:08

did a lot of work. I did work for myself,

1:04:10

meaning like if I

1:04:13

don't want to be this kind of a human being with or without

1:04:15

her, that's it. But for

1:04:17

her again talking about the evolution, for

1:04:19

her to be able to

1:04:23

take me back to create this

1:04:25

life, I mean pretty

1:04:27

much, I don't know what I would be. I

1:04:30

don't know what i'd be doing. I don't even know what to be without you,

1:04:34

I really don't. I don't know what would be

1:04:36

what my life would look like. And it's all

1:04:39

We're always working, you know, we got to make I

1:04:41

want to make that clear. It doesn't just end.

1:04:43

You're always working. You know, this is

1:04:45

a major mark on our

1:04:47

relationship and it's only made it better

1:04:50

and honest. And you know, yeah,

1:04:52

I feel like we had an innocence before. Sure,

1:04:55

and then you know, but then then there's differenterations.

1:04:57

You know, down the road, boom, something else might happen,

1:04:59

nothing better, bad, But you know, you got to

1:05:01

check yourself and you were constantly

1:05:04

working, you know, not just from my standpoint,

1:05:07

but from each other's standpoint,

1:05:09

you know what I mean, Like, this is what

1:05:11

I'm feeling I don't like this, you don't

1:05:13

like that. I mean this,

1:05:15

this position, you know,

1:05:17

is by far the harder position

1:05:20

to be in. I mean I could literally

1:05:22

do my own podcast on it and

1:05:24

healing and forgiving, because for

1:05:27

years I forgave,

1:05:30

but I was still holding on to

1:05:32

so much and

1:05:34

I had this feeling of like, how

1:05:36

could you do that to me? How

1:05:39

could you? And it was those those things

1:05:41

that it took me a long time to get over. It was,

1:05:44

you know, a long time to kind of separate

1:05:46

that you could be in love with

1:05:48

me and have sex with another person

1:05:50

or whatever, because I

1:05:53

couldn't do that. So through therapy

1:05:55

you kind of realize just because it's

1:05:58

how you think or how you would work,

1:06:00

it doesn't mean that's the same for everybody

1:06:02

else. There is a difference

1:06:04

between love and sex. You know. I feel

1:06:06

like who was getting over

1:06:08

that kind of stuff? And then it was the forgiveness because I held

1:06:11

it over you for a long time too, even though

1:06:13

it was amazing I to have these like steps

1:06:15

backwards where there was anger and

1:06:17

resentment and darkness and

1:06:20

you know, and everything would be going great and then all of

1:06:22

a sudden you'd be like, oh what happened? Where did

1:06:24

you go? What? What's happening? And it was years

1:06:27

of getting through that and

1:06:29

rebuilding trust and you

1:06:31

know, it's it's definitely not

1:06:33

easy. I'm not going to say that, but and

1:06:36

every relationship is different, just I

1:06:39

mean all the details from your childhood

1:06:41

to your upbringings, to your past relationships

1:06:44

to where you are, you

1:06:46

know, all of it, your careers,

1:06:49

your things, I mean, all that kind of but

1:06:51

it was and I think I also learned

1:06:53

a lesson to understand

1:06:56

that, you know, just because the

1:06:58

fairy tale you know, worked for my

1:07:01

parents, and I felt very

1:07:03

deserving of it. You

1:07:06

know, it was this kind of all Rose's wedding

1:07:08

and we're gonna have babies and we're gonna be together forever.

1:07:11

It put a reality on the sense that like, no,

1:07:13

we're not, and you have to work at things

1:07:16

and always kind of you

1:07:19

know, show up and be

1:07:22

willing to evolve an ebb and

1:07:24

flow, and you know, you both have to

1:07:26

always want to be there. I remember this is going to sound

1:07:28

so corny, but I remember going to said,

1:07:31

you know, had some quote that her mom or dad

1:07:34

had always said to her, like you just

1:07:37

you both have to always want

1:07:39

to be there. Or work on it, or like you both

1:07:41

don't want to get divorced at the same time. That's

1:07:43

what it was. Something like that where even

1:07:46

if one of you is like ah, the

1:07:48

other one has to kind of pull for you or still

1:07:50

show you the reasons to still be there. And

1:07:55

and then I think we just got really

1:07:57

lucky with our chemistry because that's like something

1:08:00

I think is so much that. And then just you

1:08:02

know, just the constant work,

1:08:04

the constant communication, me trying

1:08:07

to come out of my shell. Well

1:08:09

we have yeah, you know, doing

1:08:11

my thing going to Hoffman, you

1:08:13

know, which I've talked about on this podcast, wanting

1:08:16

to be better, wanting to understand the root

1:08:18

of why I am the way I am and why

1:08:20

I do the things that I do. Yeah,

1:08:22

we still do, and you know, you do counseling together

1:08:25

and we did hardcore for a while. Now when

1:08:27

we need it, we'll get together and have a session. Because

1:08:30

we had about I would say ten years after

1:08:32

the wedding that was like amazing

1:08:34

and blissful. And then you know,

1:08:36

there was a moment in New orleansy

1:08:39

time that you kind of were starting to fall back

1:08:41

a little bit. There's no like

1:08:44

not even nothing close, not nothing even

1:08:46

physical close to what I was doing,

1:08:48

you know, one hundred years ago. But just you can

1:08:50

slip back, and you got to catch yourself, and you gotta

1:08:54

you know, I think here's the other thing. For me,

1:08:56

It was realizing, no matter

1:08:58

how much I love you,

1:09:00

you have to love yourself. And so I think

1:09:03

a lot of times those darker places,

1:09:05

whether it be in fidelity or drugs or

1:09:07

gambling or things or whatever,

1:09:10

these places that people go to are

1:09:13

so deeply rooted

1:09:15

and personal and have less to do with

1:09:17

the partner. And I'm

1:09:20

not saying some marriages it's like, hey, the partner could

1:09:22

suck. And a lot of people go and find

1:09:25

affection and love and you know,

1:09:27

things in other places. That's,

1:09:29

of course, you know, the classic reason

1:09:33

for it. They're finding something somewhere else. But

1:09:36

when things are good in a relationship

1:09:38

and your partner has

1:09:41

their own personal demons

1:09:43

or battles going on, it can sometimes have

1:09:46

nothing to do with you. And separating

1:09:48

that was really hard. I mean it

1:09:50

took a lot of work, and I think Elie's

1:09:52

like saved me, saved

1:09:55

our marriage. But keeping

1:09:57

that open line of communication and being vulnerable

1:10:00

it's the hardest thing to do. These days. But vulnerability,

1:10:04

it's just huge. I mean we can do a

1:10:06

whole podcast on that too. But

1:10:09

being willing to like talk about your fears and your

1:10:11

insecurities and your vulnerabilities and

1:10:14

it just is allowed, I think for a lot of growth.

1:10:18

I will say, and now we're here,

1:10:20

yeah, not perfect,

1:10:23

but perfectly together. That

1:10:27

sounds like Ellie with

1:10:30

three beautiful kids. Yep,

1:10:34

wow, so we went there. We

1:10:36

don't have to put it in. Yeah,

1:10:39

that's the where do we cut to? So

1:10:42

then we had our babies?

1:10:45

No, but you know, look there's a lot and

1:10:48

it's a lot. Maybe there's a part two

1:10:50

of this shit too where we actually talk about the

1:10:53

rest of our lives after that. I don't know.

1:10:55

You know it is our relationship

1:10:57

has never been better. We're twenty years

1:10:59

in. Sex is fucking

1:11:02

crazy. I mean, well, that's also vulnerability.

1:11:05

I think that's connection. That's like right,

1:11:07

going to places where the

1:11:10

intimacy level is

1:11:12

at places that it's never been. And it sounds

1:11:14

crazy because you hear those stories of I

1:11:17

used to think, like when people would say, oh, marriages

1:11:20

work, and I used to think, I don't want to be in a marriage

1:11:22

that's work. But you know what that

1:11:24

means like with the experience, and you

1:11:27

know, it's also just it's you

1:11:31

get to different places and there's just levels

1:11:33

of growth, I think. But you know, I

1:11:36

look at it too, and I think, you

1:11:38

know, back to people

1:11:41

or you know, I have friends or people we

1:11:43

meet and they're like, oh my god, you guys have the best

1:11:45

relationship or oh, that's I

1:11:48

want to be, you know, in a relationship like you

1:11:50

guys. And when I never shy

1:11:52

away from like pretending that it's perfect.

1:11:54

But right now it's pretty

1:11:57

fucking perfect, and it's pretty amazing

1:11:59

and so but always like we but

1:12:01

think about what I'm going through right now with my crazy

1:12:03

anxiety and shit, like I know, you know ya you

1:12:05

call it perfect, but you're having to deal with the psychopath,

1:12:08

you know what I mean, having panic attacks

1:12:11

and now I'm being disconnected and I'm trying to figure

1:12:13

out medication again. I mean, so yeah,

1:12:15

we're always trying to help out help each

1:12:17

other. Now. Aaron happens to be a fucking

1:12:19

angel sent down from heaven. She

1:12:22

doesn't have many things wrong. When

1:12:24

I say that there's I'm not being hyperbolic

1:12:27

in any way, like she might

1:12:29

have some anxiety over our kids, falling

1:12:31

down on the stairs or

1:12:34

getting hurt or whatever.

1:12:37

Motorcycles, right, those kinds of external

1:12:40

fears and stuff. But she's so

1:12:42

solidly made and

1:12:44

so solidly raised and

1:12:47

has such incredible perspective

1:12:49

on things, and that's why she's

1:12:51

so evolved, and that's why she's so loved

1:12:53

by every single human that she comes into contact

1:12:56

with. Its fucking crazy,

1:12:58

and that's why I'm so you

1:13:01

know, honestly, you know, I don't

1:13:03

know. And it was hard. It's hard.

1:13:05

It was hard for me post

1:13:08

going to Hoffmann to explain and express

1:13:11

the way that I could feel about you, because

1:13:14

again, that vulnerability would hurt, It would

1:13:16

feel like I want to crawl into a shell. It's scary,

1:13:19

but it's just the truth and not

1:13:21

saying that. You know, life will

1:13:23

never be perfect. We're always ebbing

1:13:26

and flowing, we're always hitting the bumps,

1:13:30

and it's just about taking

1:13:32

it in stride, really, you

1:13:35

know what I mean. Well, because we've also been pretty fucking

1:13:37

blessed. You know, it's like a

1:13:40

I love be healthy children.

1:13:42

You know, it's like if you can be on solid

1:13:46

ground and pretty connected

1:13:48

and in a good place for when the real stuff happens,

1:13:51

you know, like whatever it might be your anxiety

1:13:53

or you know, sickness and

1:13:55

families or whatever down the road.

1:13:57

It's like and

1:14:00

you know, I think it's with age comes, you know,

1:14:02

or experience and age all of that kind

1:14:04

of stuff. There's you just you do see

1:14:06

things differently, and it isn't just about yourself.

1:14:09

It is such a partnership, so

1:14:13

you know, and it's also about raising these kids

1:14:15

and being a team there.

1:14:18

It does. It gives you this different

1:14:20

element. We could do a whole parenting

1:14:22

podcast. Yes, okay, I

1:14:25

guess you're hungry. I

1:14:27

have a headache. Hungry

1:14:30

and a headache. How do you feel about talking

1:14:32

about all this? I mean, I guess I

1:14:34

feel fine. It's so a

1:14:36

part of us and I'm

1:14:39

sure I could be very judged. And you know, for

1:14:41

a long time I had so much to

1:14:44

be judged of me. Oh god,

1:14:46

yeah, I forgot annihilated right now.

1:14:49

No, but people are going to be like, how could you stay with him? How could

1:14:51

you do that? Da? Da da da? I mean I had so

1:14:54

much insecurity around that and people saying

1:14:56

like, oh, well of course you stayed with him, or you

1:14:58

know, oh you once a cheater,

1:15:00

always a cheater, And you know, I mean, there's so many

1:15:03

like judgments and things going around,

1:15:05

but you know, it's a part

1:15:07

of us. We were very young, it was it

1:15:09

feels like a lifetime ago, and I'm

1:15:12

happy we went through it then, and

1:15:15

you kind of wanted to face a lot of things

1:15:17

way back then. You know. I think

1:15:19

a lot of people probably carry shit around

1:15:22

and don't know why they do the things

1:15:24

that they're doing, and they don't like it. And

1:15:26

that was you and getting into

1:15:28

finding out why you were doing it when you had

1:15:30

something that you treasured and loved and everything was

1:15:32

so great, but behind closed doors

1:15:34

there was this, you know,

1:15:36

all of it. Yeah, I mean, I'm okay

1:15:39

with it, and I love I'm

1:15:41

scared you are, everyone

1:15:45

be nice. I'm

1:15:47

also just somebody when I'm always an open

1:15:50

book. Everyone knows that. But just like you know,

1:15:52

it's a big part of my life. Yeah,

1:15:54

I guess I could say I'm ashamed of but then I

1:15:57

honestly, I don't know what I would be without that, you

1:16:00

know what I mean, because it could have come out later and

1:16:03

I might not have been in a place. I just could

1:16:05

have been down the road. You could have had children general,

1:16:08

you know, But there's a

1:16:10

lot of factors play into it. I also am probably

1:16:12

one of the most least like judgmental

1:16:15

people in the world, and especially

1:16:17

after becoming a mom, you

1:16:19

know, in this day and age of social media

1:16:22

and just all of it. I'm kind of like, you

1:16:25

know, if you don't have something nice to say, don't say it.

1:16:27

And I think there should be respect

1:16:30

for everybody's path and it may not be

1:16:32

yours. You might not agree with it, and

1:16:35

that's okay, you know, and you don't

1:16:38

know other people's stories. That's the other thing.

1:16:40

You know. It's like there's so many lessons to

1:16:42

be learned, you know. We're so quick to kind

1:16:44

of you know, judge or

1:16:46

assume or you

1:16:48

know, label.

1:16:51

Oh time, and then our biggest son

1:16:53

comes in, be comes our teenager

1:16:57

part two. Okay, that was our son Wilders

1:17:00

tucked in. We're

1:17:03

still doing with the kids, all

1:17:06

right, Okay. I think that's good wrapping

1:17:09

it up. Wow, laid

1:17:11

it all out there, from

1:17:13

acting class to therapy. I

1:17:16

know. So now twenty

1:17:19

years in hope,

1:17:22

we still hope we're still together. On the podcast

1:17:24

airs, I don't know, you never know,

1:17:28

all right, I Love you. Sibling

1:17:32

Revelry is executive produced by Kate Hudson

1:17:35

and Oliver Hudson. Producer is Alison

1:17:37

President, Editor is Josh Wendish.

1:17:39

Music by Mark Hudson aka

1:17:42

Uncle Mark. If you want to show us some love, rate

1:17:45

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