Episode Transcript
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mintmobile.com. Hey
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Mchale, Sam is Yardley, How
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are you guys? I hope
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you're all well and thriving.
2:09
Welcome to season for seed
2:11
biscuits! Yes! so I was
2:13
thinking as I was listening
2:15
to the editor. This episode
2:17
or down and Days has
2:19
said time and time again
2:21
that the police are largely
2:24
react is not pro death
2:26
because it's not illegal to
2:28
say I wish you were
2:30
did. It may be cruel.
2:32
But. It's not a crime, so
2:34
until. You actually kill someone
2:36
or try to the police
2:38
can't. Do anything the
2:41
case. That new guess we can
2:43
ensure and brings us today illustrates
2:45
this very dilemma when he gets
2:47
called out to a murder and
2:49
during his investigation finds a trove
2:52
of evidence that surely seems to
2:54
indicate the suspect was planning. A
2:56
killing spree. Throughout. The gonna
2:58
hear about to very brave witnesses
3:00
who could have kept themselves to
3:02
themselves and not spoken up but
3:04
one called nine one one and
3:06
the other approach Lieutenant John in
3:08
the field to say i'm. Is.
3:11
This related to that. It made me
3:13
think is the age we're living in
3:15
these days. Where there's so little
3:18
privacy. Thanks to cell phones and the
3:20
internet and yet people are more reluctant
3:22
that every to come to the aid
3:24
of a stranger. So. Thank God the
3:26
to Syria's neighbors. In this case came forward
3:29
and said said then. We'll never
3:31
know how many lives they
3:33
saved. Here is signs of
3:35
a serial. Hi
3:40
There I'm Yardley on damn on
3:42
days and I both. Have
3:45
decks. Favorite identical twins and
3:47
retard Small town us and I'm
3:50
a veteran. Soldiers of us just
3:52
go to secure his revolutionary Dna
3:54
tool. Between the three of us,
3:57
we've investigated thousands of crimes from
3:59
petty. The Sexual Assault Child
4:01
Abuse to murder. Each case recover is
4:03
told by the detective who investigated it,
4:05
offering a rare personal account of how
4:07
they solve a crime. Name's places and
4:10
certain details have been changed to protect
4:12
the privacy of victims and their families.
4:14
And although we're aware that some of
4:16
our listeners may be familiar with these
4:18
cases, we ask you to please join
4:20
us. continuing to protect the true identities
4:22
of those involved out of respect From
4:24
with Edmunds, Thank you. To
4:33
die on small town decks
4:35
we have for fears or
4:38
suspects. We add that to
4:40
damn. Hello everyone. I
4:43
yell play Detective
4:45
day. I am here
4:47
as well. As so glad
4:49
you're here. We don't always have
4:51
the A team. Today is your
4:53
lucky day My friends and we
4:56
have the one and only hall
4:58
holes. Tape. Of
5:01
certain sleep today, right? To the
5:03
point is that Yardley. Gallaudet and
5:05
smart and Sam I know you
5:08
guys don't know this because you
5:10
don't actually only see how the
5:12
sausage is made That We've been
5:14
trying to get this guy on
5:17
the podcast for our seas alleged
5:19
adults and he has a very
5:21
special connection to one of our
5:24
hosts. It is Homicide Lieutenant John.
5:26
Hello everybody. Hello John And
5:29
before we get started John, I
5:31
want you to tell our listeners
5:33
how we have the great pleasure
5:35
to have you with us today
5:37
and who got you here? Well.
5:40
I have a. Along. And
5:42
interesting relationship with Paul. We
5:45
worked a lot of homicide
5:47
cases, just in general and
5:49
for whatever reason of Cobb
5:51
County I think has more
5:54
than it's fair share of
5:56
high profile cases and Paul
5:58
has certainly been. The. In.
6:00
Anything that I was ever involved in.
6:03
My go to guy and we met
6:05
when he was a lowly criminalist in.
6:07
I was in homicide at the police
6:09
department and be in the cop that
6:11
I am. I recognized quickly. When you
6:14
see a resource and it's a great
6:16
resource, you grab onto it and so
6:18
my partner and I have the time
6:20
said boy that Paul Holes is top
6:22
notch. We gotta make sure he gets
6:25
on our cases anytime we need you
6:27
know? Lab assistance and that just blossomed.
6:29
We worked a lot. Of cases together,
6:31
Months? What? and And the reality? As
6:33
you know, it's a two way street.
6:35
Cause you know When John and I
6:38
first met and we were working the
6:40
The Sun's All series of cases of
6:42
women that were being killed, you know
6:44
I recognize right away a top notch
6:46
investigator. Him and his partner were true
6:48
partners, but also having this broad exposure
6:50
that I had from the Sheriff's lab
6:52
or I'm working with everybody in the
6:55
county, I recognized talent. I recognize experience
6:57
and expertise and so as an instant
6:59
bond. And then we just continue. To
7:01
have That bond. Yeah, we still have that bond
7:03
today. Eleven Ah, and
7:05
with that shines. Tell
7:09
us how the case we're gonna talk
7:11
about how these days games. Yeah. It's
7:13
kind of an unusual circumstance. It
7:16
was late in the afternoon I
7:18
was in my office hours looked
7:20
around. think I'm not pride to
7:23
get outta here and be Chief
7:25
investigator showed up in my doorway.
7:28
great guy and he said are
7:30
you busy right now. And
7:32
I said. Cheap are not just
7:34
get ready to get outta here in he
7:36
says i need a favor and I city
7:38
nancy by think I've told you several times
7:40
when that sees ask for a favor that's
7:42
called in order. To
7:45
feel like it that way but I
7:47
do is your help in. So he
7:49
had been in his office listen to
7:51
the main dispatched channel for the sheriff's
7:53
office which a lot of agencies were
7:55
tied into and he said that he
7:57
thought that a locally to see smaller
7:59
agency. Had caught a case where
8:01
they had found a body of a
8:04
child and he says i think guy
8:06
you know you need to grab somebody
8:08
and get out there and may be
8:10
given some advice or you know we
8:13
see what's going on because ultimately is
8:15
take was in. It was rightfully so
8:17
that all that was com in our
8:20
direction at some point and so he
8:22
wanted to get in front of any
8:24
potential problems. So my partner at that
8:26
moment was out office tied up on
8:29
something else and. So I went over
8:31
there on my way. I phoned
8:33
into the dispatch center and found
8:35
out that it was not a
8:37
child and that was actually some
8:39
kind of seen that was at
8:41
a home. So I went there
8:43
and when I got there it
8:45
was. I'm a very interesting. Situation.
8:49
Time. While is here
8:51
it's monitoring pass pass
8:53
for other agencies. And some
8:55
use it as it all that
8:58
go have a let let let
9:00
me just as so. John at
9:02
this time is working for the
9:04
Da's office and so he says
9:06
assigned to the homicide unit within
9:08
the Da's office which the investigators
9:10
at that point often are after
9:12
the case after somebody is arrested
9:14
in in the prosecutor decides to
9:16
charges then the Da investigators kind
9:18
of. so the case ups. But
9:20
the unusual thing particularly the Chief
9:23
of investigations that are Da's office.
9:25
Had as we were very active
9:27
on the front end and helping
9:29
agency's out with brand new homicides.
9:31
And in part it's because we
9:33
had somebody like John available who
9:36
had a lot more expertise said
9:38
many of the investigators elsewhere in
9:40
the county saudi have a small
9:42
agency like the one in this
9:44
case who's investigators were relatively inexperienced
9:46
and they catch a major homicide
9:49
seen the best people to roll
9:51
out, or John and his partner
9:53
or six percent that. Ball So when
9:55
I got on seen this was at a home
9:57
in there was no be I owe their. Nobody
10:00
to contact, there was no real command staff
10:02
presents and I could go and talk do
10:04
and as figure out who was gonna run
10:06
in the show. Song with the
10:09
pl. Up Bob Public Information officer. It.
10:11
Was a very chaotic scene. There was a
10:13
lot of personnel, lot of. Other
10:15
assisting agencies present: The sheriff's office was
10:18
there, the highway patrol was there. It
10:20
was that big of a scene in
10:22
that kind of unusual situation. And that's
10:24
also kind of indicative of how small
10:27
the agency was. This had caught. This
10:29
was very unfortunate for them because going
10:31
to eat up resources really quickly. So.
10:35
When I got there, I recognize one
10:37
of the detectors from the agency that
10:39
had jurisdiction. As said somebody said it's
10:41
had some to do with a kid.
10:43
this is not. Looks like maybe some
10:45
kind a home invasion And then he
10:48
added i think we may have somebody
10:50
detained. They may be taken somebody into
10:52
custody block over from where I was.
10:55
As. It can. You give me a
10:57
rundown on the case and he said
10:59
jaegers. This is what we know so
11:01
far. so this is a very quiet
11:04
bedroom community. Most of the people who
11:06
live in this area commute to San
11:08
Francisco other jobs during the day it
11:10
must. The houses are and dear sometimes
11:13
if there's you know a stay at
11:15
home, mom or dad there's one adult
11:17
home and so. In the late
11:19
afternoon probably an hour and a half
11:21
earlier than some time I got there
11:23
are there was a neighbor who was
11:25
home. And. He actually called Nine
11:28
One One and what he said to
11:30
the Nine One One operator was that
11:32
he had been home and one of
11:34
his windows was open. Any heard the
11:36
best the he could describe was a
11:38
commotion nearby so he went to the
11:40
window and he kind of listened and
11:42
to continue to hear this commotion there
11:44
were male voices but he really couldn't
11:47
understand was being said but it's he
11:49
said. The tenor of it was that
11:51
there was some kind of confrontation going
11:53
on so see went outside and he
11:55
actually went out. Around the corner of
11:57
his house and peaked into this court that
11:59
was near his home and he saw his
12:02
neighbor Leroy, who he knew very well. What's.
12:04
This witnesses mon. San And
12:07
so Leroy was on his own
12:09
driveway and there was another male.
12:11
A black male standing over him
12:13
straddling him. Samsung Leroy was on
12:16
a slumped against the tire of
12:18
his truck. The blackmail was standing
12:20
straddling the front of them. There
12:22
was no confrontation going on when
12:25
Sam saw them but he he
12:27
said he just looked odd So
12:29
he shouted at both of I'm
12:31
and said hey what's going on
12:34
over there. Leroy.
12:36
Didn't respond which he said was very
12:38
unusual because he did know each other
12:40
and he said the second male. Looked.
12:43
Over at him. And. Said
12:45
hey, we're just work and now we're gonna go
12:47
and work out. And. Sam
12:50
knew that that was not the
12:52
case so he actually said he got
12:54
scared in so he retreated into his
12:56
own home and called Nine One
12:58
One and said. This. Is exactly
13:00
what I see. I think I need
13:03
the police. Sam's a good witness. That
13:05
he didn't just leave him alone is
13:07
like out, hey, that doesn't seem right.
13:10
I'm calling the police. They can handle
13:12
this. Yep, and he actually is instrumental
13:14
in solving this case. So Sam runs
13:16
back inside. Dolls the phone. Relates.
13:19
To the dispatcher in the first
13:21
to patrol units get on seen
13:23
now. They. Pull up the Sam's
13:25
house which is within two hundred
13:27
fifty feet of the house where
13:29
Leroy lives and they get out
13:31
of their cars. A talk quickly
13:34
to Sam Sam reiterate what he's
13:36
already told. Dispatch said officers walk
13:38
across the street. When. They
13:40
get to the front of the
13:42
house where this incident occur were
13:44
Sam sees Leroy sitting on the
13:46
driveway with this unidentified male standing
13:48
over how silly right wrestling Leroy
13:50
his late fifties So they get
13:52
over to that house to be
13:54
Rice house and one of the
13:56
exams it was the garage door
13:58
had been a. When they
14:01
get under the driveway they see
14:03
that the garage doors now down
14:05
and it's quiet and so they
14:08
look on to the ground. There's
14:10
a pool of blood next to
14:12
where Leroy was supposed to have
14:14
been sitting and is a smear
14:17
mark that disappears under the now
14:19
closed garage door. So.
14:38
Again, it's a small agency so they
14:40
call for some assistance to make entry
14:43
into the Rice House. And so they
14:45
moved to the side of a house
14:47
where the front door as and now
14:49
they see what appears to be a
14:52
handgun laying on the walkway and the
14:54
front door is standing open to the
14:56
house and it's all quiet. They.
14:59
Run some plates license plates on some
15:01
vehicles the authors do and there is
15:03
a car parked in front of the
15:05
house that comes back to a female
15:08
name and they're actually able to ask
15:10
Sam. Do. You know this name
15:12
and he says yes, that's Leroy, his
15:14
girlfriend the girlfriend's name is Sue. So.
15:18
Suis also late fifties and Sue and
15:20
Leroy essentially live in this house together.
15:22
She has wrong place, but she's back
15:24
and forth quite a bit so the
15:27
establish who lives there, there's no one
15:29
around, there's absolutely no indication that there's
15:31
anybody in the house or at home.
15:34
Takes a little while for the assistance
15:36
get there, but they get enough extra
15:38
assistance and they make entry into the
15:40
house. one of the lucky faces. They
15:43
have fire and ambulance standby stage right
15:45
up the street, so Fire and Ambulance
15:47
has. Staged a very short distance
15:49
away they make entry into the
15:51
house and this is what they
15:53
see. They make the first corner
15:56
and of hallway and they see
15:58
a female laying on the. Or
16:00
she is bound with zip
16:02
ties hands behind her back
16:05
she has a plastic bag
16:07
around her face and see
16:09
appears to be deceased. So.
16:13
They call the metics up and they move
16:15
pastor and going to clear the rest of
16:17
the house. Rest of the house is empty.
16:20
They go into the garage and
16:22
in the garage they find Leroy.
16:24
Leroy. As a substantial head
16:27
wound that's bleeding and he also
16:29
has his hands behind. behind his
16:31
back was zip ties and he
16:33
has a plastic bag over his
16:35
head. So. They get
16:37
resources in medical aid comes in.
16:40
They. Actually cut the bag
16:42
off of Sue? And
16:45
see spontaneously starts to bury. So.
16:48
She was obviously moving some air
16:50
past the plastic bag. Leroy.
16:52
Was not as lucky and Leroy was
16:54
pronounced deceased at the scene. So.
16:58
They start getting some neighborhood chances
17:00
are starting to work there. Seem
17:02
like anybody woods. They transport Sue
17:04
to the hospital. Initially, she was
17:07
not expected to survive. Miraculously she
17:09
does survive. So they're working this
17:11
scene. They're trying to find some
17:13
witnesses. They have the area cordoned
17:16
and in that court and happens
17:18
to be a sheriff's deputy. The
17:20
deputy is a field training officer
17:22
and he has a trainee with
17:25
him and so they are on
17:27
a particular post. Blocking the street.
17:29
Now one of the things that
17:31
the deputy had noticed was against
17:33
Leroy House. The side sense to
17:35
Leroy House was a bicycle in.
17:37
the bicycle was parked in the
17:39
bushes and a leaning against the
17:41
fence. Not all that unusual in
17:43
that neighborhood of the everything's that
17:45
pristine there. But he notices that
17:47
bicycle in. He makes a note
17:49
to himself that he's gonna let
17:51
detectives now. When he debriefs the
17:53
investigators that come out there, he's
17:56
gonna know to them. Hey the.
17:58
Bike is there and or of as easy do it. If
18:00
we could have nothing to do with it, For the
18:02
deputy. Decides. He's gonna tell
18:04
everybody he should take notice that bicycle.
18:07
Correct. So as
18:09
the deputy is sitting there and he's
18:11
writing some notes and he's probably review
18:13
in some reports because he has now
18:15
turned a responsibility to this. He just
18:18
came there as assistance for meeting in
18:20
the crime scene see Sears initially and
18:22
then sees his trainee talking to someone
18:24
and he looks up any second was
18:26
good talking to and so a deputy
18:29
season talk and he realizes it's a
18:31
black male. Now the only description they
18:33
had of anybody involved in this was
18:35
just a very generalized description of a
18:37
black. Male and so the deputy gets
18:40
out of his car and he walks
18:42
up because he's responsible for the trainee.
18:44
He walks up to the trainee and
18:46
they individually talking to. And
18:49
he says what's going on And so
18:51
the trainee. May. Be doesn't
18:53
really understand the significance of what's
18:55
being said any says this guy
18:57
right here. Mark Marks as he
19:00
was up here earlier riding his
19:02
bike and he crashed his bike.
19:04
that's why he's got some blood
19:06
on his pants in his hands
19:08
and see. Left his bike to
19:10
go look for some water out,
19:12
washed the blood off and he
19:14
just wants permission to grab his
19:16
bicycle. And so the
19:19
asks yells at. Me: Hang
19:21
on a second here, I'm on the sorry
19:23
yeah no problem man we we get that
19:25
bike for your butts. Can you hang on
19:27
one sec? We had little incident here stolen
19:29
and make sure it's okay. Did you know?
19:31
Let that by Go. How. Far
19:33
away as a deputy and. Recruit
19:36
Friendly Right House. Probably. Two
19:38
hundred feet. Ah, Okay, Said
19:40
block away their one street over kind of max
19:43
but you can see the bicycle any as
19:45
his patrol car park the of yo crime scene
19:47
tape up, he's got the overheads on his police
19:49
guard or nice to control my foot traffic
19:51
vehicle traffic into the area. So. The
19:53
sheriff's deputy. He's aware that there
19:55
was a witness, so he grabs
19:57
one of the other officers. It's.
20:00
There and said hey, can we find
20:02
this witness Let's get him out here
20:04
and do or infield show up and
20:06
see if he recognizes this individual. So
20:08
they do. On the Retina Farm
20:10
who called Nine One One. The.
20:13
They. Go back and they find Sam and
20:15
Sam comes walking out of his house
20:17
with a detective. The detective has given
20:20
him an infield, show up, admonishment meetings
20:22
tells him hey, this could be nothing
20:24
Just tell us if you recognize this
20:26
guy. Just by the fact that haven't
20:28
stopped does not mean that we think
20:30
he has any involvement in us. So
20:32
Sam comes out with the detectives and
20:35
I don't think Sam.all the way down
20:37
to the end of a walkway before
20:39
Sam looked up the street and said.
20:41
That's. The guy. That's the guy that
20:44
was stand and over Leroy in the
20:46
driveway. A far as I
20:48
can unsealed shell out this it
20:50
that riskier than asking the witness
20:52
to identify sign from a photo
20:54
lineup last. Ride and you have to
20:56
be cautious with those just because when a
20:59
police officer standing there with somebody even of
21:01
the you know and and in this particular
21:03
case they weren't handcuffed him in, Mark was
21:05
not. Handcuffed. It
21:08
can be very suggestive. Yeah to be very careful
21:10
because been detained by the police might lead a
21:12
witness to go. Yeah, I think that's the guy
21:14
must be does the cops him stocks. Plenty.
21:17
Of ideas have been thrown out
21:19
because of improperly performing these field
21:21
so ups or line those types
21:23
of things. John's exactly right. There's
21:25
a lot riding on these show
21:27
ops and you don't wanna screw
21:30
them up. We had rules against
21:32
bringing a suspect to a victim.
21:34
You going to bring the victim
21:36
to the suspect. That way you're
21:38
not showing that. Years transporting someone
21:40
in handcuffs and a police car
21:42
like. there's all kinds of rules
21:45
about this right is so. Inherently
21:47
suggestive sell because it's cheaper
21:49
My know that there was
21:51
probably plenty of probable cause,
21:53
resume suspicion to detain markets
21:55
even take him into custody.
21:57
At that point, she has.
22:00
Lot on has blood on his hands
22:02
as blood on his pants and there
22:04
don't seem to be any corresponding injuries.
22:06
He says he fell off his bicycle
22:08
but there's no injury that would lead
22:10
any be believe that's where the blood
22:13
originates from so it's a pretty unusual
22:15
circumstance have happened and that idea pretty
22:17
good too because. Sam. Your
22:19
witness here. He's not
22:21
even basically face to face with market
22:23
this point, he takes a few steps
22:25
down the block and says, that's him.
22:28
I mean that's pretty compelling identification right
22:30
there. right? John: How old
22:32
is Mark? Twenty Seven. Ah
22:34
so he's much younger than
22:36
me. Ryan Sale Yeah so
22:38
I'm curious as Mark has
22:41
blood on his clothes but
22:43
he has no visible injuries
22:45
himself as bike is right
22:47
outside the house where and
22:49
murder and attempted murder have
22:51
occurred. What's his explanation for
22:53
the as details? So there
22:56
was some blood on his shoes as
22:58
well. I'm in. Mark talked about how
23:00
he had walked across some lawns and
23:02
that potentially the blood my have been
23:05
in the lawn and he just got
23:07
it on his shoes and clothing and
23:09
then the other one was. If Dna
23:12
ended up being on his person that
23:14
somebody had planted the Dna on his
23:16
person, he was getting pretty far ahead.
23:19
You know he was anticipating this could
23:21
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Okay, there's a lot of
28:19
moving pieces here, so let
28:21
me just recap. our suspect
28:23
Mark is covered in blood
28:25
and a block away from
28:27
the scene of the crime
28:29
where he's left his bicycle.
28:32
There are two witnesses in
28:34
the next. We have Leroy,
28:36
the neighbors Sam who saw
28:38
Mark standing over Leroy slumped
28:40
over in the driveway, and
28:42
there's Sioux who was left
28:45
for dead by her attacker
28:47
but miraculously survived. Speaking as
28:49
good to have any permanent
28:51
physical injuries. So. Sue
28:54
has no daughter is A as
28:56
a result of what happened
28:58
to her. Other than obviously she's
29:01
traumatized by loss for boyfriends, but
29:03
she has no memory of
29:05
the incident she was hypoxic. Which
29:07
is a lack of oxygen. Correct, Yeah,
29:09
and it robbed her of that
29:11
short term memory of what happened.
29:13
But it appears that when we
29:15
talked to see she does have
29:18
memory of what she was doing
29:20
that day and when investigators talk
29:22
to her she said she was
29:24
home with Leroy. Leroy went to
29:26
the grocery store. last thing she
29:28
remembers was she was making a
29:30
decision to go outside work in
29:32
the yard and she was gonna
29:34
do some mob gardening and Ned
29:36
flower bed right next to the
29:38
front door. The. House or what
29:40
it appears happened is. We.
29:42
Have evidence to suggest that marked as
29:44
I took the bus from his home
29:47
in a nearby town with his bicycle,
29:49
took it to Leroy town and and
29:51
started riding through the hills. It's a
29:54
hilly terrain, it's you know, Obviously it's
29:56
a residential area, but he was riding
29:58
all around those neighbors. Is there was
30:00
a witness it was located later on
30:03
who said that she'd gotten home with
30:05
her grandchildren she'd pick them up from
30:07
school and she was home alone with
30:09
his little kids and she noticed Mark
30:11
parked across the street at the curbs.
30:14
Watching her and said made her feel
30:16
very uneasy and she went the house
30:18
and nothing further happened but I'm sure
30:20
he was probably sizing her up in.
30:24
Was encounter the same type situation?
30:26
She was home by herself. Mark
30:28
probably moved on from where. He
30:30
saw the grandmother and then
30:32
found this second location where
30:35
he saw Sue. In.
30:37
The front yard actually working and
30:39
he appears that he blitz creatures
30:41
that gun sued Talked about Enron
30:43
she said you know my boyfriend
30:45
doesn't have a handgun in in
30:48
in that be an airsoft pistol
30:50
and the gun was dropped potentially
30:52
when Mark fled the house to
30:54
go engage Leroy so he was
30:56
probably in the house was sui
30:58
takes her into the house. Gets.
31:00
Are under control. She's very slight
31:03
woman, very small in stature see
31:05
zip ties her, puts the plastic
31:07
over her head and then. What's.
31:10
Also found is a condom.
31:12
Open. But unused. so there
31:15
was maybe potential there that he
31:17
was playing a sexual assault. So
31:19
marks there with Sue inside the
31:21
house, just inside the front door,
31:23
in the entry hall way she
31:25
has no memory of. it's the
31:27
when he engages her. He probably
31:29
has the airsoft pistol and I
31:31
think. Mirror. I came home
31:33
from the grocery store and opened
31:35
the bras to work to come
31:37
inside pot the garage door with
31:39
the garage door opener i think
31:41
Mark Sears that garage door open
31:43
and thanks o. Somebody. Common
31:46
and Leroy coming home is this
31:48
unexpected dynamic aspect that Mark couldn't
31:50
account for. So he's a good.
31:52
He's home with the female victim,
31:55
Sue, and is going to take
31:57
his time with her. Looks like
31:59
that. The sexual for component and then
32:01
Leroy comes home and now all of
32:03
sudden the sit as hit the fan
32:05
for Mark and he asked a think
32:08
on the fly. Yes, so Mark abandoned
32:10
Sue. She's under control. She's zip tied
32:12
in immobile. she may be unconscious. Step
32:14
point. Mark. Goes out the front
32:16
door ab he thought this airsoft because
32:18
those not going to work against this
32:20
grown man that's in the driveway, I'm
32:23
gonna need something more than that. Drop
32:25
the gun. Picks up a
32:27
rock. And engages Leroy in
32:29
the driveway and smashes his head
32:31
with that rock. Much. Seems
32:33
far as I on older women
32:35
like this grandmother is that the
32:37
after her brain So then a
32:39
movie season see years older women
32:41
won't site hard. Possibly.
32:44
I'm definitely not the psychiatrists psychologists
32:46
by Mark was raised by his
32:48
grandmother. We find out later on
32:50
and she had since passed away.
32:52
We always had some questions about
32:54
what the nature of that death
32:56
was, but deaths we have the
32:58
bandwidth to get into. That was
33:00
several years earlier. So the injuries
33:02
that Sue sustained was it just
33:04
she was starved of oxygen or
33:06
did he receive any stab wounds
33:08
are strangulation. Know strangulation and know
33:10
stab wounds and nothing would even
33:12
be. A you know ultimately will
33:14
be cancer, a traumatic injury. Him it was
33:17
visible but it was or traumatic injury I
33:19
think enough to get are under control. What
33:21
she was suffering from a hospital as hypoxia.
33:24
So. Now he has as
33:26
Sheriff's Deputy editor said recruit having
33:28
encountered Mark on the sidewalk mark
33:31
once he gets his bike back
33:33
but he also has blood all
33:35
over and. says.
33:37
That is you probable cause to
33:40
detain him and what happens after
33:42
that had a you start to
33:44
gather your evidence. So I have
33:46
to be cautious in these situations because I don't
33:48
want to be that guy. I don't want to
33:51
be the guy the comes in and takes over.
33:56
But i i have a certain way that
33:58
at attack that scene and just. Prioritize
34:00
things that need to get done and certainly
34:02
the physical evidence on Mark. He needs to
34:04
be arrested. Skis already talking about ways to
34:07
excuse the presence of the blood so I
34:09
think we're past the hey, would you mind
34:11
coming out of the station answering some questions?
34:13
Although that would be my ideal situation. you
34:15
know? Hey Mark, this is a weird situation.
34:18
We have your say, we can figure this
34:20
out. We just get you down to the
34:22
station and see if he's willing to do
34:24
that. Is much better to have him go
34:26
voluntarily. But by the time I got there
34:29
he already been arrested. I think when
34:31
Sam comes outside says that's the guy
34:33
I think that next sound you hear
34:35
is the clicking of handcuffs. They put
34:37
handcuffs on him pretty quick. Unmarked on
34:39
March Yes. So doctors that were there
34:42
the a miscarriage that were there with
34:44
Mark. They did great job of she's
34:46
in handcuffs. They bagged his hands to
34:48
preserve the blood that was on his
34:50
hands size clothing. so skinny, pretty tough
34:52
for him to do much about that's
34:55
and they transported him down to the
34:57
local police department. A chance to
34:59
to be clear. Landmarks.
35:01
Is taking banking station? Nobody knows.
35:04
Yeah, that seems awfully gonna. Surmounts
35:06
correct. Yeah, so we potentially have
35:08
a double homicide here. The. Information
35:11
the get. Initially it changes so much
35:13
because you're get little bits and pieces
35:15
and people mischaracterize what's going on. Major
35:17
seems like that can be kind of
35:19
chaotic. My priority at that point was
35:21
make sure that the scene was secure
35:23
in a looked like they were doing
35:25
a pretty good job of that. So
35:27
I said i want to go where
35:29
Marquess So. Went. Down to the
35:31
police station and talk to the lead investigator
35:34
and I said you know we probably need
35:36
to get a game plan together here and
35:38
find out a little bit about who this
35:41
guy is This guy Mark Yes Mark, we
35:43
need to find out where he comes from,
35:45
Worse, his house, where to see live in.
35:47
Make sure that this wasn't the culmination of
35:50
you know, him killing everybody at his house
35:52
Billie investigate says was gonna take a while
35:54
to write out a warrants for and I
35:57
said we're we're not going awry in a
35:59
war. we're gonna go break the door down
36:01
and make sure there's no prisoners and then
36:04
we'll back out and will write out a
36:06
search warrant to go back in. but we
36:08
have an exit see right now to see
36:10
what this is all about. So we figured
36:13
out who's Mark was relatively quickly figured out
36:15
where he was living. At my
36:17
say, I live with somebody, at
36:19
least have that much information. He
36:21
was less than forthcoming about what's
36:24
his situation was he did for
36:26
as an address and we are
36:28
able to confirm that that address
36:30
was his current address based on
36:33
police databases. So. The
36:35
next step was to go to
36:37
Marks House and they're our was
36:39
going on there. A
36:53
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Town that Simpli safe.com/small Town There's
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no safe like. A
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cast powers the world's best parts
39:05
See the show that we were
39:07
excellent. Hey
39:10
all and an. Editor at
39:12
large of The Nightly News and a dental
39:14
assistant the last twenty years working hard to
39:16
tell the truth. I'm also a black
39:18
woman born and raised in the South. South.
39:20
Seen how. Often journalist it stories wrong.
39:23
That's why I decided to start the A
39:25
Minute A weekly podcast were as I the
39:27
felt so unique perspective to try to get it
39:29
the truth Bad the biggest stories of our
39:31
day with that means that into Wesley Morris
39:33
about the politics behind the Oscars. I do
39:35
spend a lotta. Time thinking about like one
39:37
of the this would have gone if anatomy
39:40
before was about a black woman jail. Or
39:43
Nicole. Hannah Jones about the sake of our
39:45
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40:16
John when you go to Marks neighborhood? What's
40:18
it like? It was housing
40:20
that was not only for people who
40:22
had a tough time affording housing, but
40:24
also for people who may be had
40:26
developmental disabilities. So was kind of a
40:29
mixture. This house where Mark sad I
40:31
would describe it as a large apartment
40:33
complex, right? Yeah, that's exactly what was.
40:36
Oh are you are there to. I
40:38
don't even remember how I got involved in
40:40
this case. All I know is is either
40:42
John called me up where the prosecutor called
40:44
me a i was speed dialing you when
40:46
I was driving to Marks Home where. Can.
40:48
I ask you one more question of
40:51
that this exigency about getting into Max
40:53
House Sheriff cell east and lying to
40:55
guys he doesn't indicate he lives with
40:57
anyone who do have one dead body
40:59
and see you are not sure she's
41:01
gonna survive as. Just.
41:04
Sort as as allay percent legally. That's
41:07
enough for you to say I don't
41:09
need a search warrant right out of
41:11
the gate. I can get into Marks
41:13
House because it's very possible other people
41:15
are in danger. Is. Interesting the
41:18
you ask that because there are so many
41:20
layers to that but you're absolutely right. So
41:22
we would go there and we wouldn't break
41:24
the door down out the gate. What we
41:27
would do is knock first and see if
41:29
anybody was home and then explained as gonna
41:31
but we are Ultimately we're going in to
41:33
make sure that there's no one in there
41:36
and distress. But also one of the things
41:38
as the insisting we the courts look at
41:40
this as if you believe there's and exit
41:42
as he there and you can articulate and
41:45
I think we easily can is a violent
41:47
crime scene you know the possibility or really
41:49
endless about what could be going on back
41:52
as Marx apartments and so we if we
41:54
go there and we believe there's an agency
41:56
we actually have to act on that in
41:58
a timely manner. If we
42:00
don't act on it a timely manner, The.
42:03
Exit She actually evaporate. Scrupulous. A wolf.
42:05
It was that importance And we agree
42:07
that looked like it was that important
42:09
that you could go in there without
42:11
a search warrant. And that's a big
42:13
deal. I mean you're you're violating the
42:15
sanctity of somebodies home without of magistrates
42:18
authorization, but you need some act on
42:20
it in a timely manner because if
42:22
you don't act on it, think it's
42:24
worth your own argument saying if it's
42:26
that important, why didn't you go there
42:28
right away. Yardley. The The important
42:30
thing here is you are going in looking
42:32
for victims. You're not going and looking for
42:34
evidence. There's quite a difference. So once you
42:37
clear that apartment, when she clear Marks apartment
42:39
and you don't find any other victims, then
42:41
you back out. and now you're at a
42:43
search warrant or you try to get a
42:45
written consent form from Mark. Cyclists
42:48
in the desert great Really appreciate
42:50
that. Okay, so.
42:53
John. Now your Marks Apartment
42:55
and I'm assuming he's gotten
42:57
inside. Yes, Nobody was
42:59
home so we're forcing entry when in
43:01
and cleared. It is relatively small place,
43:04
so easily cleared quickly and again I
43:06
was a great point or not in
43:08
their opening drawers and doing those kinds
43:10
of things because you know you can
43:13
find victims in the doors. but whatever
43:15
you see while you're in there, you
43:17
can also use. To. Further, the
43:19
probable cause statement later, right? A warrant
43:21
to go in there and now do
43:23
a thorough search of itself. You see
43:25
a handgun and drugs or whatever on
43:27
the counter and there is always you
43:29
didn't find it my opening doors and
43:32
gone places where you wouldn't typically expect
43:34
to find a victim. That's all. Part
43:36
and parcel of interstate. More probable cause
43:39
to further your argument to the magistrate
43:41
that's want to go inside. As.
43:43
A Sergeant, Especially patrol sergeant. You get
43:45
exposure to these types of exigent calls
43:48
where you you have to make a
43:50
decision on whether or not were taken
43:52
in the store or not. Send it
43:55
to be for a welfare check, you
43:57
know, a suicidal subject, whatever it is,
43:59
but. I've been on a few of
44:01
those where he he has to kind
44:03
of train your folks who haven't been
44:05
on a lot of those because when
44:07
they go in and they start pulling
44:09
open drawers and you're like no, no,
44:12
no, don't fuck this up for all
44:14
the other cops on the planet we
44:16
are in here, you have to start
44:18
sinking in the realm of where can
44:20
I hide a body and that's the
44:22
container. You can get into anything that
44:24
you couldn't hide a body and you
44:26
can't get into that container to or
44:28
whatever. Fridge? maybe, but probably not. The
44:30
freezer. you know I'm talking about
44:32
the icebox and copier for it's
44:34
not the freezer and the case
44:36
we cover caught and below where
44:39
we had to dead bodies and
44:41
a big chest freezer. But really
44:43
you have to be very very
44:45
responsible with. Those. Types
44:47
of forced entry that we're going in
44:49
we're looking for People were not looking
44:52
for evidence but everything in plain view
44:54
is fair game. but I don't want
44:56
you digging around his house to be
44:58
above board or else we lose this
45:00
the courts taken away. I think
45:02
that's really good. Distinction is that
45:05
you guys made because certainly sitting
45:07
on the science a table I
45:09
don't see that which has in
45:11
fact as nuances south. Appreciate
45:13
that. Sir. John when you're
45:15
in the apartments Steve signed any evidence
45:18
to the neighbors come over and go
45:20
hey what do you guys doing Year
45:22
marks not home but during his place.
45:24
Why remember distinctly it going fall Because
45:27
I remember talking to him as we
45:29
walked in. Once we made entry in
45:31
nature there were no victims their I
45:34
stood for a minute, looked around and
45:36
then we backed out and I said
45:38
if you were writing a story about
45:40
you know some kind of serial murderer
45:43
and what you might find his home.
45:45
What I saw in there would at
45:47
least scratches the surface and be the
45:50
kinds of things I would expect to
45:52
see and a Hollywood movie. There are.
45:54
Tinfoil hats and why years there
45:57
are geared to be like stolen?
45:59
This. Tv network and Ten is
46:01
inside the apartment pointing up at the
46:04
sky. and ah, there was definitely some
46:06
bizarro world stuff inside the apartment. You
46:08
know, God knows what we're going. Actually
46:10
fine. We get in there and start
46:13
looking around. So I'm actually I'm sitting
46:15
in my car and a phone that
46:17
seats your. He's been texting me, going
46:19
any status, Any status I haven't talked
46:22
to him say still thinks it's something
46:24
about a kid and apart and I'm
46:26
talking to the chief bringing him up
46:29
to speed. And a complex obviously
46:31
either. was a pretty good size police presence
46:33
there and as I'm sitting there this guy
46:35
walks up to my open window. you can
46:37
see his comment like standing there waiting is
46:39
a he wants to talk and I said
46:42
you know chief give me a few minutes
46:44
and I'll call you back as their lot
46:46
of people around here so I have the
46:48
phone issues' I hope I go Hayek I
46:50
help yes and he walks up and he
46:52
goes yang as I just curious you know
46:54
course the Stand or what's going on in
46:57
In I so we're investigating sometimes it's happened
46:59
earlier Tonight uses. Doesn't have anything to do
47:01
with that thing happens the other adjoining
47:03
town. it's on the news. he's. Referring
47:05
to Iran says attack. Yes
47:07
and I see yeah my, we don't really
47:10
know right now and so he said okay
47:12
in ios will damn sorted by the Us
47:14
and on. Upon the turns around and it
47:16
was like it was scripted. he turns around
47:19
and he takes about three steps away and
47:21
then he stops and he turns around. He
47:23
says i don't know if this is important
47:25
but is this anything to do with the
47:28
lady who died in there three days ago?
47:30
She's pointing at a door that has nothing
47:32
to do with where we are. Oh.
47:34
My. God. Else
47:42
was not handsome. there's a lot smarter
47:44
com server gonna put upon on out
47:47
and kill not fratto when. Will be
47:49
back Quick Part Q and A conclusion
47:51
as signs as a serial killer Here's
47:53
a preview of West. Antarctic,
47:58
he chose to live there, particularly. They
48:00
are ya intentionally for victims but
48:02
I think other people there with
48:04
problems I think Mark recognize that
48:06
there were some victims of were
48:08
more vulnerable than our. Market
48:11
probably slipping in and out of
48:13
this access door that he had
48:15
made in the ports and as
48:18
prowling as Marcus trying to formulate
48:20
is methodology is to commit more
48:22
crimes. And telling
48:24
you Not have Sam? That's just the tip
48:26
of the proverbial iceberg when it comes to
48:28
what's in. Store for part kill.
48:31
Bill authorizes notifications will
48:33
see. A Nice France. Small.
48:43
Some decks with created by is
48:46
dan. A
48:48
pot is produced. And
48:51
mean. Yardley Snacks or senior
48:53
editor is or invasion and
48:55
our editors are Christine of
48:57
Rak A. My parents are
48:59
associate producers Are the real
49:01
Next Arizona? Is
49:04
our executive producer. And. Pops
49:10
Ronald ah well on
49:12
our social media. Most of
49:14
the money. He would
49:17
make our days. He became a
49:19
member of our small farm farm
49:21
by following us on Facebook, Instagram,
49:23
And you tube off.
49:25
Ah smoked weed. Love
49:27
hearing from you. Are
49:31
growing. With composed hygiene.
49:35
Is easy to support the making as
49:37
is Hop on our. Dot
49:40
Com/small. Town despite. Their
49:43
first subscription. See you
49:45
find excuses and he he
49:48
he gave. It.
49:52
To speak. Stuff and they can
49:55
be found on our website
49:57
mymindas.com. Wonderful
50:00
server Marchand it is an
50:02
Audio Ninety Nine production. Small
50:05
town, same. Thanks for. Listening
50:07
Method and.
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