0:02

I'm going to do this show today is, oh, Sorry.

0:04

Tonight, Today. We'll we're going to have You started the last one.

0:11

I was going to start this one. Okay. We're just doing an intro, so it doesn't matter.

0:17

Oh, I thought, Oh, let me just do it. Let me just do it.

0:19

The listener here is smart.

0:24

Okay.

0:43

Listen. I think it's been three weeks since we've, we've done this since I've seen you, since I've talked to you and I have to say I've had some long drives in the last three weeks, so I've gone ahead and done some quality control.

0:57

Looking, listening to our podcast.

0:59

I'm not great at it. Cause I'm listening to them after they've already breached the, Are

1:03

you picking up some long holler miles deliveries?

1:07

Yeah. I've got some five-hour energy cases I'm trying to get through.

1:10

So it's really been nice listening to you fellows.

1:14

You've you're both very talented and very funny on the podcast.

1:17

I'd really like to be more of a part of it, but I, so I was very excited to part of it.

1:23

I was very excited to see you guys today, but then this morning, this morning, morning, a real dark cloud floated over our family here and smart, like, Okay.

1:35

Is it possible to say, is it possible for a dark cloud to then give you a gut punch?

1:39

Is that possible? Sure.

1:41

What happened? Yeah.

1:42

Well, why don't you take it From here? Well, Jason read something that I read.

1:46

We all know, Oh God, well I read it.

1:48

I read it after you sent it to me, actually, you know what?

1:51

Sean sent it.

1:51

I sent it before I read it.

1:54

I don't think So. Sean sent an article to Jason and me in, in the, in the thread that we're in With

2:00

some faint exclamation points.

2:02

Like This

2:04

is great for us. And by the way, I'm going to put it out there.

2:07

If anybody thinks they're worthy of being in the text thread, let us know.

2:09

And maybe we'll add you on the edge of the thread and Sean's has congrats for us.

2:15

Yay for us. And it's a click to the Hollywood reporter.

2:17

Smartlist nominated great nominated for a bunch of podcast awards or whatever, Which

2:23

is kind of neat. Cause this is, you know, this is an embarrassing A

2:25

mom and pop operation. Yeah. We're

2:27

vulnerable. We apologize. Yeah. The fact that we're getting any traction whatsoever, let alone nominations just thank you to Thank

2:35

you. And also it's embarrassing. Jason dreaded is kind of embarrassing.

2:38

So, so then as you, if you read further down in the story, they're nominated best podcasts, blah, blah, blah.

2:43

And Sean Hayes nominated for best host, Which

2:47

is the worst, which is the kiss of death. Because now it was like, well, he's not really that great.

2:51

So I don't think they're saying it out of the side of their mouth either.

2:54

I think it comes straight out the center.

2:57

And here's my thing today.

2:58

I can't wait to see you host Post.

3:04

This is going to be the worst experience.

3:06

Yeah. Well the voters are now listening, right?

3:08

Because the nominations are out now. They really have to decide Who

3:12

is hosting. My questions are still going to be like, Hey,

3:14

where are you from? Yeah, no, don't worry.

3:17

We Know that resonates with the, with the jury over There.

3:20

I, heart media people have made a bunch of mistakes When

3:23

Sean said w when shown said, what's your favorite color?

3:25

I mean, Nominate

3:28

that jackass.

3:30

Yeah, here we go. Jesus. I'm not going to be able to come up for air for a while.

3:34

And we're thrilled for you, Sean. Yeah. We're really thrilled.

3:37

And listen to show. I said to Sean, by the way, I did say congrats man.

3:40

And he was like, oh, thank you. And I responded, I didn't mean it.

3:43

What do you, What

3:46

are you doing? I asked you, I responded with, I didn't, I didn't read the, I truly didn't know.

3:50

I didn't read the article. I just read the headline. Like most people.

3:53

Sure. It is true. I think Sean might be the kindest man I've ever known.

3:56

I, no one deserves it more around you too.

4:00

All right. Zip it up.

4:02

We got, we've got, we've got an, we've got an interesting guest today.

4:07

He's

4:07

he's

4:07

known

4:07

primarily

4:07

in

4:07

New

4:07

Zealand

4:07

and

4:07

South

4:07

Africa

4:07

due

4:07

to

4:07

his

4:07

success

4:07

in

4:14

rugby. Okay.

4:15

Florida then came to love him when he pivoted his talents towards highlight and dog racing.

4:21

And then when he was in California, it was attempting to be the first to successfully men, the San Andreas fault.

4:27

He tried his hand at acting and while fame and fortune, there has been scarce at best.

4:33

Some call it a wipe out. Sure.

4:35

The critics have given him a few hugs.

4:38

So he has received a couple of academy awards and seven Emmy awards.

4:43

What he's gotten himself, a Tony nomination, even a life who has academy.

4:49

He turned it around. He got a lifetime achievement award from AFI BAFTA gave him something.

4:55

The golden Globes gave him the Cecil B DeMille award.

4:59

The Kennedy center honored this, this highlight player.

5:03

And Barack Obama gave him the presidential medal of freedom.

5:07

So I say, chin up.

5:09

I say, chin up to this fellow.

5:11

No idea Is the Mo the most highly decorated guest We've

5:15

ever had. I would say so.

5:17

Yeah. He's famous and fortunate in our book.

5:19

Okay. Please welcome the forever struggling, but always diligent.

5:22

America's own. And Hollywood's best Mr.

5:25

Tom Lamar Hanks.

5:28

Oh yeah. Had I known that Sean was the host of this pond?

5:32

I

5:32

would

5:32

have

5:35

bailed. I said, guys, I'd like to, but you know, I don't like to work.

5:40

Apparently you're working with one of the brightest hosts in the business.

5:43

Is there a name for this award? Is it visit named after somebody?

5:46

Is it a, It's called the, the aorta.

5:48

Cause it's from my heart media.

5:50

Oh, oh, oh.

5:52

Oh. That's not true.

5:55

One of my hard hitting nominee questions is where are you right now?

5:59

I don't record I'm I'm in a tiny little cubby hole that is here in my vast compound, somewhere in the tri-state area.

6:07

I Telling you dog racing really pays.

6:10

Guys. You got to Look into it. It's within a single day's drive from Lakewood, Ohio home of the great lakes.

6:16

Shakespeare festival. Wait, you didn't.

6:18

Is it true? No, no. We already get To

6:20

play. We already plugging a festival.

6:23

It was long time ago.

6:26

Wait, did you really do dog race?

6:30

No dumb ass. Why? You're not going to win.

6:34

Jason was demonstrating his quote comedy chops.

6:37

Yeah. Can I write or what?

6:40

Huh? Wait, hang on. I think Tom's onto something.

6:42

Let's get into Jason's comedy child.

6:46

You know, I told, I told some friends last night that I was doing this podcast and first of all, I had to re-explain who we were and Sean who?

6:56

Jason, what will, huh?

6:58

What is the name of it? I kept calling it a helpless based on the Neil young songs.

7:03

But now I realize no, no, no.

7:05

It's, it's smart lists, smart lists.

7:08

We really are helpless. And the question came up about you will, which is, which was this question is, has he started using a different voice professionally?

7:17

That in your early days you were kind of like squeaky, you sorta sounded like Jay north in those old Dennis, the ministry runs and you were hilarious, but then you went off and voiced Batman.

7:28

And it's as though you're walking around with your own self-imposed E Q on your voice now, true or false.

7:35

Well, here I listen to like any good politician.

7:38

I can't just give you a straight true or false.

7:39

I will say that I constantly have a monitor in my year and I'm, and I'm adjusting my levels, my input levels.

7:44

Right. And so then I can, I can model no, you know what?

7:48

It's funny. I recently, you know, I often watch a lot of my old stuff cause I like to be entertained And

7:54

he has trouble sleeping. Yeah, no, but I, my voice has gotten it has, but if you listen to Howard's because Of

8:00

abuse, I guess. Are you, do you still smoke?

8:02

Well, Who's listening.

8:04

I'm just learning.

8:06

I'm just learning. We had Sean Penn on the podcast.

8:09

He he's, he went through a, a full pack of darts.

8:12

Didn't he? He Did go through a pack of doors, The

8:14

arts that's colloquial for cigarettes, as opposed to say coffin nail or, Or

8:21

a nail, a nail or bullet Tashi.

8:23

Tom. This brings me to an actual question about the nail.

8:26

I noticed recently I was reading the 10th book in the, in the Gunter.

8:31

What's his name series by Phillip Kern.

8:34

I noticed your name on the back of all of the, I you, you gave a little a blurb for the back of the jacket of Prussian blue, which I'm almost finished with.

8:42

Oh, that's a great One. It's a great one.

8:44

Right? Gunther Helped me.

8:46

Bernard Bernard Bernie Gunther series.

8:49

He plays a non okay.

8:52

Be

8:52

merciful

8:52

on

8:52

me

8:52

on

8:56

this. Okay. He plays a non Nazi private investigator from 1928 Berlin through well, after the war.

9:08

Yes. Right? It's a fabulous series by Phillip Kirk, the late Philip Kerr.

9:13

He passed away too early. Yeah. And I read them all am just, well, I'm, I'm not a big, I'm not a big like detective genre fiction writer.

9:21

I mean either, but this had that added bonus of very accurate sort of historical detail to it that, that I really It's

9:29

a tremendous historical fiction.

9:31

And you're absolutely right. And I'm with you, Tom.

9:33

I, and, and I read, I read mostly nonfiction in somebody recommended.

9:36

They said, you love all this European history. I think you'd like, this I'm fully, like I said, I just started at the beginning of the summer and I'm on book 10 oppression.

9:43

And, but he always refers to cigarettes as nails.

9:46

And he gets beaten up by these Nazis.

9:48

And then they look down and he's spitting up blood and they say, what do you want?

9:51

He looks up. And he says, can I get a nail?

9:54

And you know what, when he smokes one, he looks really cool.

9:57

It's really, Really cool.

9:59

What I like about those books is it fills in the blanks of his war years because some of them take place well before world war II, some of them take place after world war II.

10:09

And in the course of it, you see what he, what he went through.

10:12

Thanks guys for firing us out of the gate here at the start of the interview, our listeners love literature, go, Sean, you're the host.

10:18

Let's do it. Yeah.

10:20

Come on. By the way, Shawna had my hand on my buzzer hand is right on my bus.

10:24

Right, right. Correct. That's

10:27

good. I want to know what your fascination with, with war is because your name is so synonymous.

10:33

I've never asked you this in my entire life.

10:35

Why are you so passionate?

10:36

You're the war guy. The history of he loves a good Site

10:40

highlight, I think, right.

10:43

That dog racing. You know, first of all, I, we do a lot of them because none of the projects have to have cell phones or laptops.

10:52

So

10:52

that

10:52

alone

10:52

makes

10:52

the

10:52

writing

10:52

of

10:52

them

10:52

so

10:52

much

10:57

easier. And there's much less special effects of having to put in those screens.

11:00

But I have, I get this question asked to me quite often, and the answer always comes down to when, in those formative years of say seven through, you know, when you're a little kid.

11:15

Yup. Every single caregiver, every single adult in my life would make references to the six, two words, three letters, each the war.

11:26

And they talked about it as this great dividing line in their lives.

11:30

There was before the war, there was during the war and there was just after the war.

11:37

And they talked about it as though it's almost like, well, that was when the black plague was walking among us, you know, for, for a big chunk of their lives.

11:45

They had no idea where they were going to be in another six months.

11:49

They had no idea how long the war was going to last.

11:52

That's, that's one big aspect of it.

11:54

The other part of it too, is is that the bad guys lost at the end of that day.

12:01

We just, yeah. We were able to somehow unfortunately, necessarily kick the stuffing out of them.

12:07

And when bad guys lose something, it's that a, what is that power of myth of a visit bill Moyers?

12:14

You know, you wrote the world was on a quest to defeat people that were undeniably evil, the governments of those places, and many of the many of the populace.

12:25

So I keep getting drawn back to that.

12:28

And again, I will say that from a storytelling perspective, our person day is just, so there is no shame left anymore.

12:36

Truth seems to be a, a malleable viscous kind of like a, It's

12:43

a distant memory truth. It seems like.

12:45

And actually, you know what, Sean, actually, within the last six months, I don't know if you remember, we were talking about all the moves you've done at the war movies.

12:52

And Tom said, do you think he'll ever make a movie about Tik TOK and you know, something that he thinks about for Sean and Scotty there's before tick-tock afterwards?

13:04

Well, you know, if I did, it would only be about 45 seconds long.

13:07

How long, how long is your average SQL

13:12

Tom? I know that, I know that you would, you'd never compare your experience, shooting, saver, private, private Ryan, to those who actually fought, you know, in all of that and during all that.

13:22

But w w was there ever a moment I'm sure.

13:25

I bet there was a few moments while you were shooting that, where you got close to the feeling maybe of what it might have been like.

13:32

I mean, certainly the product, the result of that film took me there, or as close as I, I think I could get, but I would imagine there were a few moments there where it just based on the quality of the production, they managed to create some environments for you there and your own process of trying to get into the character and the realism of it, where you, you were kind of struck a bit by what these guys must have gone through.

13:59

Well, Yeah,

14:00

but at the same, it was all fake.

14:02

You know what I mean?

14:04

You got to take that into account, but when we were on the beach there in county Wexford in Ireland, which is where we shot the Omaha beach sequences.

14:12

Oh, so it wasn't, it wasn't right there.

14:14

Well, it was actually, it was one of the places where they rehearsed some of it.

14:18

So that's one aspect of Base

14:20

camp from the beach.

14:22

It was way, well, I was gonna, I was going to incorporate that into the, into this shot, just to light up another nail will take that pause.

14:33

We're

14:33

there

14:33

with

14:33

500

14:33

members

14:33

of

14:33

the

14:33

Irish,

14:33

actual

14:33

members

14:33

of

14:33

the

14:33

Irish

14:33

army,

14:33

there

14:33

is

14:33

a

14:33

landing

14:33

craft

14:33

everywhere,

14:33

and

14:33

we're

14:33

all

14:33

storming,

14:33

storming

14:33

the

14:44

beaches. And the special effects crew had laid out these tiny little flags on the beach where they had set up air mortars and squibs, a little explosive devices, things to avoid.

14:57

Yeah. And they actually said, you know, I be carefully Ron.

15:02

Cause you know, this is going to become, this is like a projectile it'll come out of the ground very fast.

15:08

So if you can try to avoid where the flags off, I, you know, I think I got that.

15:15

Then they removed all the flags and we couldn't see anything of aware.

15:20

So we were just stumbling all wandery boy.

15:23

So there's all of that. And it's dressed the way it is.

15:25

And when you, they were always four or five cameras going and once the shot began and you're wet and you're cold and you're coming up and out of one corner of one eye, you see a guy catch on fire.

15:40

And

15:40

the

15:40

corner

15:40

of

15:40

the

15:40

other

15:40

eye,

15:40

you

15:40

see

15:40

a

15:40

guy

15:40

blown

15:40

40

15:40

feet

15:40

into

15:40

the

15:40

air

15:40

and

15:40

he

15:40

loses

15:40

a

15:40

leg

15:40

in

15:40

the

15:50

process. Literally we had, you know, amputees, stunt people, oh my God, they were amputated before you show amputated, just to clarify, even though there's harnesses and there's wires or whatnot, machine guns are going off all around, you and explosions are happening like crazy.

16:06

And it goes on for the better part of, you know, two or three or four minutes.

16:11

And there was a, there was a degree of sort of like odd, fake, and yet at the same time terror that was going on.

16:20

Yeah. So we were shooting down there all morning along.

16:23

I'm going to say about on the baby, the second day of shooting.

16:26

Cause the first day of shooting was spent in the boats themselves.

16:29

Wow. And I climbed up the steps to the bluff.

16:33

They had put in these wooden steps. So we could get up to the base camp.

16:36

Well, that's where catering and craft services would not far as the Crow flies, but it was awfully high.

16:43

It was probably about six, 700 feet up the Bluffs.

16:45

And I went back and I found the other guys in the unit who I would be meeting when we got up to the shale, which was, you know, the, the deaf delayed that was at the top of the beach.

16:57

That's where I would come across Barry pepper and Eddie burns and then diesel to the other guys.

17:02

And they were still hanging around, you know, outside the trailers the way actors do.

17:07

Sure. And I was wet and I was Sandy and I was near death from the amount of noise that had gone on.

17:14

And I, I taught all the guys said, you guys better hold onto your hats.

17:19

Cause it's really wild down there.

17:21

You are not going. I mean, when you see a guy catch on fire out of the corner of your eyes, you're cut.

17:27

And no one said, you know, no one has said, there's going to be a guy caught on fire on this side.

17:34

And it's all your, it was, it was an interesting kind of, kind of panic.

17:40

And this is kind of folding back to what you were saying earlier. One of the reasons that, what I love about that movie and I love that movie and I'm not embarrassed to say I love it so much.

17:48

And I've seen a lot of times. And one of the things I really love about, and you kind of touched on this whole idea of, I can't wait for the musical version of No

17:56

97, by the way, 1997, It's

18:00

insane. Came out. Wow. It seems like two years ago.

18:03

But you had that moment where your character is a school teacher, I think, is that right or school, but the idea that it doesn't matter what he is, he's just a regular, this is what, the thing of this, particularly this war, there was the great war, which they referred to world war one as, but then there was the war, this war, world war two.

18:22

And he was a guy who was called to do something extraordinary.

18:25

He wasn't a guy who was born to me, a military officer.

18:28

He wasn't a guy who was born to be a killer.

18:30

He was a guy who had to go because that's what he had to do.

18:33

And people came in, in, in this moment when the entire world was at war and did extraordinary things.

18:38

And I always loved that about it.

18:41

And I think that for me, it really captured what it is that that sort of makes me have such is weird to have, say, have reverence for the war, but you have reverence for the bravery and what people did that were extraordinary things.

18:54

Yeah. Yeah. You'll actually want to make an anti-war movie at the same time that you're making a war movie.

19:00

Right. Let me tell you a story. I was, I was nine, 18 years old, I think.

19:04

And I was a bellman at the Royal hotel in Oakland, California.

19:08

And we had a, a guy who read his own dry cleaning service would come and collect the clothes and take them away and then deliver the clean clothes.

19:18

And it was always coming with, you know, dozens and dozens of shirts and pants that have been dry cleaned.

19:23

And I was working there when summer, and he was gone for two weeks.

19:28

It was, I'm going to say his name was Mike.

19:30

I can't remember what his name was, but Mike was gone for two weeks and somebody else came in every day.

19:34

And then didn't after two weeks, it was in June.

19:36

After two weeks, he came back from his vacation.

19:39

I said, oh, Hey Mike, why, why are these lasts?

19:42

Oh no, I I'd take a vacation. Every, every, every June I said, oh, oh, do you, do you go camping?

19:48

No, no, no. I, I get together with, with some of my old buddies.

19:52

I said, oh, oh, where did you go?

19:55

Where did you go? Well, this, this year we, we went back to this place that we had visited back when we were kids.

20:01

I said, oh no.

20:03

We're where was that? He said, it's in, it's in the north of France.

20:07

He was a paratrooper.

20:09

He was in the 82nd airborne.

20:11

Wow. This guy is now this 1974.

20:13

So

20:13

go

20:13

back

20:13

40

20:17

years. So he's, he's in his fifties.

20:19

And what he's telling me is that when he was in his twenties, he jumped into, he jumped into Normandy on D-Day and he was a paratrooper.

20:27

And now he's a guide delivering his dry cleaning for the hotel.

20:31

I felt, I felt stupid and small, but also that was, he was an example of that adult, that caregiver, that was part of daily life that you know, that he didn't know if he was gonna make it back.

20:46

And he went, oh, he said, and we go back.

20:48

He said this.

20:49

He said, we go back to, to visit the buddies that didn't make it home.

20:54

So they're visiting the visiting, the, the cemeteries that are in.

20:59

So look, that's a generation.

21:00

It was, it was a time that was loaded with all sorts of problems.

21:05

That, of course we're still dealing with right now, but you can't take away the fact that these were young guys who were asked to go off and liberate the world from really, really bad people.

21:16

And they did it. So yeah, My

21:18

grandfather, I just I'll leave it at this.

21:20

My, my grandfather who passed almost almost 12 years ago, whereas really close with and loved dearly.

21:28

He, I remember him telling me he, he worked with, he was in the Canadian army, but he was attached to the Royal air force and he planned bombing sorties.

21:36

And they were stationed at various air airfields as they would move across as they, you know, after June 44.

21:45

Yeah. And he said, one morning we wake up and there was constantly planes taking off and landing and stuff and they were right.

21:49

And he said, one morning, his tent, the guy who he shared a tent with woke up, came out of the tent and walked into a propeller of a plane in the dark.

21:57

And I said, and he told me, he didn't tell me this until I was about 18.

22:01

Of course. And I said, well, what did you do?

22:03

And he said, and he wasn't joking.

22:05

He said, well, I got a new tent mate.

22:07

And I was like, wow.

22:09

And he was just like, that's the way it went.

22:13

We had to keep going. There was, what can you do?

22:17

I don't want to go into the place. I was that's too much of a bummer of a story.

22:21

Sad Story. True. So anyway, I think Perfect

22:23

segue would be happy days, right?

22:26

In

22:26

order

22:26

to

22:26

make

22:26

saving

22:26

private

22:26

Ryan

22:26

happened

22:26

or

22:26

any

22:26

of

22:26

the

22:26

other

22:26

incredible

22:26

movies

22:26

that

22:26

you

22:26

have

22:37

M D B reading son. No, no, no, no.

22:39

How dare You? This is pure Wikipedia

22:42

Wikipedia. So, so had you not book that episode on happy days, Hey, would you have not met Ron Howard and things?

22:52

We would not have been gifted the highest Ron

22:56

Howard on happy days, Ron had left the series by then.

22:59

What I, the guys I met were lo Gans and Bob Lou Mendell, who were the staff writers on happy days who wrote the, the part who wrote splash, the screenplay of splash and Brian was directing.

23:14

And they said, Hey mate, Hey, take a look at that guy who got fired from bosom buddies.

23:19

You know, it wasn't buddies was canceled something that Sean is going to experience one of these days.

23:23

Yeah, No worries. Sean's canceled two programs I've been on.

23:27

So, And

23:29

we will be right back.

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Can

27:53

you

27:53

spell

27:53

keeps

27:53

forest

27:53

one

27:53

last

27:57

time? E P S a boy.

28:00

We had some will leakage there. Hey, sorry.

28:02

I just wanted to jump in. Yeah.

28:03

And now back to the show, Tom, would you agree that the, the, the routine of a sitcom actor is the best job in show business?

28:13

Do you miss it still to this day?

28:14

Well, it is. It is kind of escape.

28:16

It's a great hang. I'll tell you that, because look, if you either shoot, you rehearse Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, camera block Thursday, shoot Friday, right?

28:26

Or you rehearse Thursday, Friday, Monday, camera block Tuesday, shoot Wednesday.

28:33

Isn't it. Is that kinda like the Idea

28:35

that, that second one shoots Tuesday?

28:37

Yes. You'd start on Wednesday. What, what you're saying is five days of the week.

28:40

Yeah. Yeah. Unless you're working with Jimmy burrows and then you can take the first day off of rehearsal and really becomes a four-day workweek and it's only three weeks a month.

28:47

So it's 12 working days a week, Really

28:49

top secret things, man, you should never let the civilians And

28:54

it's six hours a day. Everybody's going to want to be in showbiz.

28:58

Well, there's there's craft service climate gets a lot of breaks.

29:02

You know, it is, it is an awfully, awfully fun day when we did bosom buddies, Peter Scolari and I, my dear old pal of the great shows, we actually shot that show on video, not on the film cameras, film cameras in those days, that was pretty much a Bundt camera.

29:18

Camera blocking day was just kind of like your standard did it, but we had four video cameras and we had to do the entire camera blocking day ourselves on camera.

29:27

Cause they did a line cut, you know, camera three and tighten up on four and four.

29:31

Let's come back. Let's coming back to two and two.

29:34

You had to be there for that. So you did, you worked a long day and you did every line of the, that week script over and over again.

29:43

And he and I just started goofing around so much that that's, that's where we first got.

29:48

We got gelled at a couple of times, you know, the, the, the director up in the booth, you know, he'd come in over that top was we can't get the lawn cut in.

30:04

We're trying to check the Collie lights on camera three, Tom wood that comes on that, you know, you speak and we didn't care.

30:11

We were just goofing around so much So

30:13

excited. Were you, when you got, when you got that show, what was that moment?

30:15

So young Tom Hanks and you get bosom buddies, you booked it.

30:19

It's your job. What was that?

30:21

Well, I couldn't believe it. Yeah.

30:23

I was going to be on TV, you know, and I was going to be able to, up to that point as a Shakespearian actor, I'd made a, I made less than 10, $10,000 in a year for an entire year and I was married and I had a kid and jeez, I made almost, I made that in two weeks on, on bosom buddies.

30:44

So the financial reprieve was huge.

30:47

Yeah. When was the last time you did Shakespeare?

30:48

I did Shakespeare two years ago here in Los Angeles.

30:52

I played Falstaff with the Shakespeare center, Los Angeles, Tom,

30:57

tell that story. It was a, it was a video that I saw of your doing it.

31:00

I can't remember. It was so funny. You pulled some guy out of the audience or something.

31:04

What was that? What happened was we had an, we had a medical emergency, a guy, a gentleman had a, a heart thing happened to him.

31:12

And all of a sudden the paramedics had to be called.

31:15

We were doing it at the VA center in the Japanese garden, amongst the eucalyptus trees here in west Los Angeles.

31:22

And you know, a guy had some sort of seizure and we had to call the IMTS and then we had to take a break and the house, not the house lights, the lights all came up and it was going into, it ended up being about a 30 minute hold while they took care of the, this gentleman.

31:39

And we were all backstage saying, should we do something?

31:44

And then when I saw that people were leaving, oh no, no, no, no, no, no.

31:51

I mean, it was going to, it was a long, it was about close to three hours show anyway.

31:53

But when I saw people, I saw a lady pick up her purse and move toward the exit.

31:59

And I came running out trying to scream and get back here, take the seat or something.

32:07

Yeah, it was so funny. But what was amazing was you were improvising and Shakespearean talk.

32:12

That was that's what my mind.

32:14

And it was super funny.

32:16

It was so good. It ended up, it ended up being worthwhile and it got enough people to stay.

32:20

And I think I ridiculed enough people that made some lady cry, you know, but it was out of laughter tears.

32:29

W what was the, you know, I a splash by the way, for your birthday, years and years ago, I sent you a poster and I superimposed my face over Daryl Hannah's and I said, notes said, you and I would have made a bigger splash, but Tom doesn't remember that.

32:43

But anyway, and we only been the trailblazers, But,

32:46

but you know, what was that like?

32:49

What was that feeling? Because as a kid, I was like, oh my God, every actor wanted to be Tom Hanks, everybody, every actor, wonderful to be you, because you were an, all of the string of these massive comedy hits.

33:01

Right. And big and splash and just, I

33:03

don't know what I was doing. They asked me to, they asked me to be in a movie.

33:06

So I said, yeah, But

33:08

did you know when you started doing all those other Mo you started, you did big and you did all these things and they were just getting, did you know where you were going?

33:16

No. No. You have no idea.

33:18

They just said, When you were playing the lead and you were incredibly charismatic and you were, you were, you were compelling on screen.

33:25

Like you are carrying things right out of the gate.

33:28

Had you always had the confidence and the sort of the leadership qualities growing up?

33:36

Oh, I was just trying to remember the words I was trying to speak loud enough to be heard.

33:40

I'll

33:40

tell

33:40

you,

33:40

I'll

33:40

tell

33:40

you

33:40

the

33:40

biggest,

33:40

the

33:40

biggest

33:40

lesson

33:40

that

33:40

I

33:40

learned,

33:40

and

33:40

this

33:40

was

33:40

when

33:40

I

33:40

was

33:40

at

33:40

the

33:40

great

33:40

lake

33:40

Shakespeare

33:40

festival,

33:40

just

33:40

a

33:40

day's

33:40

drive

33:40

from

33:40

where

33:40

I

33:40

am

33:40

right

33:40

now

33:40

in

33:40

Lakewood,

33:40

Ohio,

33:40

and

33:40

which

33:40

Dan

33:59

Sullivan. He's who directed the, the, the fall, the Henry, the fifth, excuse me, Henry.

34:03

The fourth that I did as Falstaff, he directed that in 1977, we were in rotating rep and I was carrying a spear and I was doing everything that I was told to do.

34:17

And we had done, we had just opened a production of Hamlet the night before it was in rotating rep.

34:25

So you open the shows about every two weeks, and then you ran a different show every night.

34:30

That's what repertory means.

34:31

And so we had opened up Hamlet and we all had a rehearsal the next day for a taming of the Shrew, which I played.

34:39

I played Grumio in taming of the Shrew and all of the equity company that professionals were hung over exhausted.

34:49

Cause they had all been out partying the night before because they had just opened Hamlet.

34:52

So everybody was like, showing up at 10 o'clock and no one really knew their lines yet.

34:59

And everybody was kind of like shuffling around.

35:01

And Dan Sullivan yelled at everybody.

35:04

He yelled at everybody.

35:05

He said, Hey, Hey, Hey, Hey, Hey, we've got three weeks to get the show up on its feet.

35:11

And you, people are not even trying for crying out loud.

35:16

I can't do my job. If you guys don't do your jobs, you guys have got to show up on time.

35:20

You got to know your lines and you've got to have an idea.

35:24

I can't provide everything here.

35:26

So let's take a break, mainline some coffee, chew it.

35:31

If you have to a right out of the jar, but come back here with some frigging Energy.

35:38

Fuck. I would cast you in the Dan Sullivan movie right now, by the way, sorry, just for what it's worth.

35:44

I remember you. Okay. So you, you look, we're all, we're all like 19 18, 20.

35:48

I was 20 years old then. And that lesson really super stuck to me.

35:52

If you have professional actors who have 20 years in the biz, as they often said, 20 years in the bids, I've never been yelled at like that, that was, that was an important lesson.

36:02

So all through all of these gigs that I had the hits.

36:06

Thank you. The misses let's forget those.

36:08

And I always, I, that was always the thing that I thought the most important thing to do was show up on time, know your lines and have an idea in your pocket for sure.

36:19

Bring it. That's that's all I did through all of those.

36:21

I didn't know anything.

36:23

So Tom, when you went, when you were doing all those strings at the string of comedies back then, and you, do you remember what it felt like?

36:31

Or do you remember that pivot moment? When all of a sudden, maybe you got offered a script or you had to kind of dialogue with your agent or what happened, where you switched over to more, let's say important films or more dramatic films.

36:44

What a question is so great.

36:46

Oh, I, I, that was the era of, you can make a movie for about $15 million.

36:52

And if you just said it was a comedy, it seemed to do some brand of business, whether it was actually funny or not, it didn't matter.

37:01

Yeah. That was it. It was all, you know, anybody who had said action and cut was trusted to direct a comedy movie, whether they were funny or not.

37:11

And I'm, I made a, I made a ton of those in which everybody came at all, the dailies were fantastic.

37:16

I think the audience is going to be standing on their feet at the end.

37:21

So Tracy dailies are the thing you watch.

37:24

As you're filming the movie, they get local to the Russians The

37:27

day before stuff. And it doesn't matter if the movie was called monkeys, make the sun go down.

37:31

Everybody was in, this is, this is the funniest of all the cows of tumble town.

37:38

This is going to be a magnificent comedy because the good comedies that were made, you know, at the time they all had, they were all with former second city people, you know, and Saturday night live people.

37:51

And, but there was this, this, you could take a setting.

37:54

This movie takes place on a ski slope.

37:58

This movie takes place on a school bus.

38:01

This movie takes place at a bachelor party and it will be a comedy.

38:06

And I made a, I made a billion of those like that because we're just kind of like doing imitations of other.

38:13

People's funny. Yeah. But here's the thing.

38:15

And I've said this about it. There are a few people out there who have this and you are one of them, which is, it doesn't matter what the movie was.

38:22

You are always good.

38:24

You're always even, even doing, I joked about doing the Dan Sullivan, no matter what it is, you're committed and, and that always kind of shines through.

38:33

So I, I know that you about those, those misses.

38:35

I mean, look, if it wasn't for bad movies, I wouldn't make any at all Would

38:39

be sitting in your dad's library.

38:41

It wouldn't be my dad's living back at my folks' house in Florida, but, but you know, but it's true.

38:49

And you always, you always deliver in that way because I always get the impression watching you that like you don't care what the thing is.

38:58

You're just doing your, I mean, you're part of it and you're in the thing and who gives a shit what's I

39:03

don't want to, I don't want to discount some of the great stuff.

39:06

I met great people. And we did, we made, we actually did some really funny stuff that, that, that really did work.

39:11

And that's always, always fun classics.

39:14

It was, I, you know, it's funny, you know, they, I don't think we ever had a movie splash was well-reviewed and I don't think I had another decent review for about, I don't know, six or seven films, but now you read about them and they're they're they're cult classics, you know, they're called classic.

39:36

No, it didn't didn't happen back in the day, but once Philadelphia, Yeah,

39:41

it happened. I would imagine some of the scripts that were coming to you started to confuse things for you and your team course.

39:48

I got older, you know that that's the other thing too.

39:51

I, you know, there's, there's a type of movie you can make in your late twenties.

39:54

I turned, here's a story.

39:55

I turned 27.

39:57

The day of we wrapped the motion picture splash.

40:02

It was the last day of shooting.

40:04

We were in The Bahamas. We had a cake that was actually for the rap.

40:10

Hey, let's celebrate the last day of shooting with a cake and someone, I think with a tube of toothpaste added in icing on the cake, happy birthday, Tom, because they found out it was my birthday.

40:21

So that was, you know, there's a movie that you make when you're 27 and in your early thirties and went to have it in, you know, I made, I made an, a number of them and which, but you have to get older, you know, you can't.

40:33

And I was able to it age into Gary Marshall gave me a great role with Jackie Gleason and a movie called nothing in common.

40:42

And then David seltzer wrote and directed with Sally field punchline, and then big came along.

40:50

Right? Yeah. But you get older and so, and you start singing.

40:52

I, I will tell you, I look, I'm not big on this kind of stuff, but there was one time I was sitting around with my crack show, biz expert who works for CAA.

41:04

And he said to me, what do you want to do?

41:07

And I, and I said, you know, I play like, Richard, love it, beautiful.

41:13

What do you want to do?

41:15

And I said, I said, I want to play grownups.

41:18

I, I wanna, I want to play people.

41:20

Who've been through bitter compromise because that was, I was in my mid thirties.

41:24

By that point, Jason, is that a thing that people do when you hear the other person's side and then you go, okay, I'm willing to shift my position a little bit and whatever, we'll talk about it later when he's going, Wait

41:35

time, you know what I was wanting to ask you, and this is going to be the dumbest question in the world, but guaranteed, but in cosplay, in Castaway, right?

41:45

You, the volleyball is named Wilson.

41:50

Now you're married to the wonderful Rita Wilson who I love.

41:54

I adore. We all do as is, was that by design because it could have been called Spalding.

41:59

It could have been, it was written by bill Broyles.

42:02

And that man, that movie took about six years to figure out bill Broyles.

42:09

And I started talking about it and we didn't, we weren't shooting it until six years later.

42:13

And he came up with the idea of, of a volleyball and he named it Wilson in honor of my beautiful bride.

42:21

We've been married to, it will be 34 years in next.

42:24

Oh no.

42:25

For applause for you.

42:27

So it could have been anything.

42:29

Thank

42:32

you. Jesus Christ. That is a whole new level.

42:36

Wow.

42:38

This is Now, you know, but that brings me to Finch.

42:41

Finch seems like it's got some qualities.

42:44

It's. I mean, if I was a hack studio executive, I'd say it's, it's cast away.

42:48

Martian, all movies are like that.

42:50

Now all movies are like that now aren't they all, essentially you take a post on the waterfront meets pal, Joey, by, by way of a pop patrol, they're all movies are all kind pop.

43:04

But what you need is a, is a relatable.

43:06

Every man that is empathetic sympathetic can alpha and beta inside a page.

43:13

I mean, you, you are the man that could service all things.

43:18

I came up through that era of which every genre movie was about somebody who could not be killed or defeated, you know, the cop that could not be filled, that the fighter who could knew who never lost the, and so I would, you know, a geeky guy with a big, but a big nose and a squeaky voice.

43:36

I took all the jobs away from Wil, By

43:42

the way, I do have a big, I have what's called a pro Dumper.

43:45

Well, you can't drive a spike with a tack hammer as I have.

43:50

Well, I just have a really quick Castaway story that we might cut out of this.

43:53

But, and Tom, I think I told you this, but I was working on will and grace with, with someone who worked on this show.

43:59

And we went after to his house after a taping one night and we got super, super, super stoned.

44:06

And we'll know that this won't be cut.

44:08

We had super, super, super stoned. And he, he said, look, I got a copy of Castaway.

44:12

I got the DVD. Let's fast forward it to the plane crash because the effects are so crazy.

44:17

Let's get totally high and watch like, how do they do that?

44:21

Right? And so we, so he just moved in this house.

44:24

It was as brand new equipment.

44:25

And we're w and I'm sitting in the back of his screening room and he's up front.

44:29

He just moved into this crazy house is gorgeous.

44:32

And he had no idea how his own equipment worked.

44:34

And so you see him in the backseat and he can't get the DVD to play.

44:37

And I said, oh no, that's that is Sony totally high out of my mind.

44:41

I goes, that is Sony. He goes, yeah, I go, oh, they're voice activated.

44:45

Those are the new ones. You don't even know what you have.

44:47

You have to speak the name of the movie into the machine after you put it in.

44:51

And he goes, what are you talking about? I go, just listen to me.

44:53

You have to say the name of the movie.

44:55

As you put it into the DVD player, he was like, are you serious?

44:58

I go a hundred percent. I just read about these.

45:00

So he turns back to the machine with his back to me, and he goes cast away and it didn't play and he'd waited a beat and they did it again.

45:09

He goes cast away and I turned behind me.

45:14

I was, I couldn't breathe.

45:16

I was laughing. So

45:18

on

45:22

that. He knows he never cuts to the outside of the plane.

45:25

That's one of the reasons why that, that plane crashes is good.

45:28

It's just from the perspective of inside the plane.

45:31

No, no, let God kind of stuff.

45:33

That's Bob, Tom,

45:36

with all of your incredible set experience, was that what drew you, was it part of what drew you to the director's chair to just, just, just the, the effort to sort of streamline things, because you knew probably more than a lot of the directors you may have been working with.

45:52

No, I think directing in that becomes sort of a bit of an ego thing because you, you become convinced that you know, more than you do, but seriously, But

46:03

then you try it and you're like, oh my God, this is Hard.

46:05

I believe every actor should direct.

46:07

I think every director should have to act.

46:10

I think we should all be writing and producing because you find out how hard it is to do that other job from an actor's perspective.

46:21

It's like, you know, you got somebody saying, ah, that was pretty good.

46:24

Try it again. And you want to say to him, do you realize I'm on a horse weeping because my dog died.

46:32

And on, I'm trying to remember six pages of dialogue at the same.

46:37

You do. You realize it's a little harder than it is of man.

46:40

Let's try it again. That, along with the same thing of an actress saying, Hey, we're going to shoot this.

46:45

What are we shooting for? What you have to realize that everybody has 9 million things going on inside their head.

46:52

And then also we'll look, we're all story tellers.

46:55

At some point, we can have a sense of what might fit into our mouse a little bit better, and maybe some options.

47:02

It goes back to the thing Dan Sullivan always said, which have an idea in your pocket, you know, have something that you can come out and say, this isn't on the page, but let me, let me show you something else.

47:13

So since you have directed, when you do come to the set as an actor with an idea in your pocket, are you sensitive to that?

47:19

There might actually be a plan in place that that director and that crew has been working on for weeks and that your idea might, might disassemble the house of Cards.

47:28

There might not be room for it.

47:30

So then you try it once and they say, don't do that.

47:32

And so, and then You don't do it, right. You know, it's pretty, pretty re relatively easy stuff.

47:37

Is that desire to direct still, still, still burning in you, or I

47:43

can't say that I have the instinctive powers of being a director as an actor.

47:48

I think I know what I want to do read it.

47:50

And I think, oh, I know what direction I'll go do, directing as a director of acquires of fidelity and a patience and an ability to communicate that after I've done it for the I've directed two feature films, I've directed a number of episodes of the mini series that we've done.

48:09

And I liked those because I wrote them more wrote on them at the same time.

48:15

But I think, I think directors more so than, than, than myself somatically, they're, they're born into it.

48:23

You know, you have to think it's the greatest job in the world.

48:24

And oftentimes it's not.

48:27

Yeah. Do you enjoy the producing part of it all with, with what, what you guys don't really produce?

48:31

Well, but you guys churn out it's really a, you shouldn't slough over The

48:36

alliances that I make with other people that really do All

48:38

the work, but the amount of you're you incredibly prolific as, as a producer, you and Gary had to play Tonya.

48:46

I mean, it's, it's, you've employed an incredible amount of people.

48:49

You've put a lot of product out there.

48:51

That's not easy. And that's incredibly admirable.

48:57

I'm very lucky because we have extremely good people.

49:00

And we, we do this, you know, we have a kind of like a clubhouse office where we lean in each other's doorway and say, you know, is this really a feature film guys?

49:08

I'm not so sure it's a feature film.

49:10

Should it be like a 12 point many series instead?

49:14

So we can really examine the theme.

49:16

And then, then you make nothing but a ton of alliances, but here's, I'm not a producer because this is what producers do every day.

49:23

They get on the phone and they try to convince somebody to do something they do not want to do.

49:30

Or they tell somebody on the phone that there's no way that they are going to do what that person on the phone really wants.

49:38

That's pretty much it's that it's that dichotomy.

49:41

I always just say, sure, no matter what, no matter what they're saying, right, We'll

49:47

be right back.

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Thanks to liquid Ivy for their support In my daily routine, will I, I do sweat and I lose fluids specifically electrolytes.

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Sure. Yes. Please. Let me get it a little bit of that.

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They, of course they have that. Are you kidding?

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52:14

It's a quiz. Yeah, I know.

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52:17

Nobody you you're you're you're throwing that at me.

52:20

Well, cause it's fun. It's the only quiz I've passed in many years.

52:23

Oh, So sweet.

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52:47

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52:48

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52:50

He loves that's all he talks about. I know, which is good for us because it means that he, you know, he really likes this, this product.

52:58

Yeah. But, but also like give it a rest, get it.

53:01

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54:01

This episode of Smartlist is brought to you by McDonald's probably serving communities since 1965.

54:05

So one of my favorite things is those days when I go to pick up my kids early from school, because they've got like a doctor's appointment or an eye appointment, or they've got to do something that means that they get out of school and it feels like we're kind of playing hooky together, which is really fun.

54:23

Right. And invariably, on those days when I pick them up and then I'll say, where do you want to go for lunch?

54:28

My boys will always first off go, can we go to McDonald's?

54:32

And my answer is always yes, because you know that experience.

54:36

And I remember having that experience when I was a kid of like going with my dad or my mom, like going to McDonald's on that kind of free borrowed time in the middle of the week And nine times out of 10.

54:49

When you bring your kids to those McDonald's you're sitting inside Sean Hayes.

54:54

Yeah. That's exactly right. Sean Hayes is in there with a program of hand and a chicken McNugget in the other.

54:59

Well then generally in your mouth, they're not really in your hand much.

55:02

It's true. It's true. They don't spend a lot of time in your hand.

55:04

Let's be honest. And McDonald's you, you like It, right?

55:06

No, Sean, let me be really clear about this.

55:10

Yeah. When it comes to McDonald's yeah.

55:12

I'm loving it.

55:22

And now back to the show, Let me ask you how, how what's your feeling about this, this transition that we're all in into a bit more of a streaming element, married with a, you know, box office, you know, theatrical, you know, going to the theater pan and paying some money for a ticket versus having it at home.

55:40

Do you w what is your opinion on that as somebody in the business, and then also as somebody who is a, who is a viewer?

55:48

Is it it, do you like the fact that there is less pressure now, maybe with not having to open on the weekend because it's streaming, do you think, Well,

55:58

that's, that's a pressure that doesn't come upon the actor, because look, the movies are always binary.

56:03

They're either double zero or zero one.

56:05

They either work or they do not work.

56:07

And if they don't work, there's no amount of marketing or interviews that you can do right on podcasts in order to, in order to change the Zeit Geist, the, the pressure remains absolute.

56:22

The pressure is the speed of light in order to make a great story.

56:27

The audience, I think if I can pontificate just a little bit here, it doesn't care where they see it.

56:35

The business does the marketing, the producers, and the studios and the, the grand entertainment, industrial complex, you know, they would, you know, they would like things to be exactly as they were, but we have a business that is forever changing, you know, back in 1980, when you guys were still in junior high school.

56:51

And the concept of home video was just beginning.

56:57

Here's a story that goes back a long way when we were the first year that Peter and I were in bosom buddies, a VHS tape machine player at home cost about $4,000.

57:12

Wow. And the only people that had them were incredibly wealthy, rich people in the three quarter inch or two.

57:20

Well, wasn't that, by that time, VHS was just beginning and in an, in, in a neighborhood may be a guy named Doug would open up Doug's video rental shop S H O P P E

57:35

On

57:35

one

57:35

side

57:35

of

57:35

it,

57:35

one

57:35

side

57:35

of

57:35

the

57:35

rental

57:35

space

57:35

would

57:35

be

57:35

VHS

57:42

tapes. And on the other side would be a smaller collection of beta Sony, beta max, and eventually beta went away and it was all just VHS.

57:49

And by the time I think the next year VHS machines were only like $1,800.

57:55

And

57:55

then

57:55

everybody

57:55

was

57:58

renting. And the concept that you could, it was great, of course, to be able to record shows after you went through this arcane kind of like process of on-off recording timing.

58:07

But the bigger thing was is that if you had kids and you had a video VHS of Dumbo, you know, they would get up in the morning on their own and put in, put in Dumbo and you didn't have to get up.

58:21

This was huge. And the, here we are in 2021, and the industry is going through something akin to that change.

58:30

Because guess what?

58:31

As Gary Gatesman, my partner had played on, said, you know, sitting at home and watching something on your TV is not that bad.

58:42

Right. Right, right, right, Tom, you said to me, years ago, you said, you know what, Sean, the business is always changing and you have to adapt and change with it.

58:51

Not as an actor or the craft of creating things.

58:54

Just, you have to keep an open mind and go with the flow of it, otherwise, why?

58:58

And if you fight it, you're just dead in the way you take that advice.

59:02

Yeah. What's happened there, Sean, because now you're reduced to hosting heartless podcast.

59:06

Is it heartless? It's heartless, Heartless.

59:08

You're known as Dumbo. The host of very lucky.

59:12

We were very lucky to play tone because we are one of our first deals was at HBO and this was old school.

59:18

HBO, you know, no commercials.

59:20

You could say anything you wanted to look.

59:23

There was no language. And there was no, there was no.

59:25

And at that point, HBO doing so doing a series or a movie or a mini series on HBO, that was the gold standard.

59:32

It seemed as though you had all the freedom in the world.

59:35

And now you have even more of that, all the freedom in the world, but it still comes down to this very basic requirement.

59:41

You've got to be putting out a, an awfully good product.

59:45

Otherwise it will disappear into the mist, like many of my early films.

59:49

Thanks guys. Oh,

59:51

no, no, no, no. But how have you not?

59:53

I'm surprised. Cause they, it seems like they've tried to gobble up everybody.

59:56

How have you not, when did Marvel call you and say, we need you to play, you know, Dr.

1:00:04

Universe and you know, we need you to do 12 films and you have to play Dr.

1:00:11

Universe. Did that ever happen? Because here's the problem.

1:00:14

I, first of all, they've never called me once.

1:00:16

I can't believe that. No, no, never.

1:00:19

And I think that if one of these days they will and they'll say, is there any way you would consider playing the secretary of defense, got a guy who comes and says, please help us all for men.

1:00:33

We can't, we can't survive. I'll be one of those guys.

1:00:36

I don't know. I don't get to play the punk gun fluids.

1:00:39

God bless you. Because you still make the kinds of films.

1:00:42

You have continued in an era where we're most features are.

1:00:46

You know, the feature film market is dominated by these Huge.

1:00:49

Some of those are great.

1:00:53

No I'm saying they're great. And I have a lot of friends who do them, But

1:00:57

some of them are real. I Said,

1:00:58

I said some, but some of them are okay, are good.

1:01:01

And we all have friends who we adore and who are super talented, who make those.

1:01:05

I'm not saying that, but there is, it seems like a shrinking market for films that stand on their own because it's a great story and has a great cast.

1:01:15

And you seem to be one of those people, you're in a very unique position that you are still making those films, which I think is awesome.

1:01:23

We chastised, we chastised JJ Abrams.

1:01:26

We were like, go and make some comedies, JJ.

1:01:29

You know, we were giving him shit And

1:01:32

he wants to, but you know, it's because Tom, because you, cause Tom, you are us and you have maintained being us, you as, for as famous and as successful.

1:01:40

If you, as you have become for as long as you have been, you have still stayed very grounded.

1:01:47

It seems and normal. And I would imagine that that is just something you're stuck with from when you were a little kid and you probably got a couple of parents to thank for that.

1:01:55

I would imagine My

1:01:58

parents divorced when I was five years old guy, Just

1:02:01

fucking go. This is why I'm not getting the nominations.

1:02:03

This is where Sean really does his research.

1:02:07

He would know that. Yeah, Tom, I don't know this.

1:02:09

What are you, what did your, what did your folks think about you getting into a, the business tree as I call it, I

1:02:16

started doing it for fun in high school, because I can't couldn't believe that you could go and do plays in high school and get credit for it.

1:02:24

You know, this is school that's. I remember specifically thinking that the first time I walked into a drama class and I did it because some friends of mine from junior high had been in the plays.

1:02:35

And I just said, what?

1:02:36

I can come to school and do this.

1:02:39

Well, this is screwing around goofing off.

1:02:45

And right. Yes. I felt the exact same way.

1:02:48

I was like, oh my God, everybody's just laughing.

1:02:50

This is great. My both my, my dad who, and eventually my mom, cause we lived in different places.

1:02:57

When my mom came and saw me and stuff, they just, they just thought, well, this is just wonderful.

1:03:03

You know, this look what Tommy found, Sean,

1:03:07

you've talked about that. You did. You just said you had that same thing right.

1:03:11

Where you were like, this is amazing. This is so much fun.

1:03:13

And I can't believe I get to do this at 5, 6, 7, 8, and Then

1:03:18

I hit it shot. Hey, now Sean, when you did, you did promises promises on And it was a, and it was a big hit.

1:03:29

And you said something to me because Sean and I see each other, you know, Not

1:03:35

just on this Podcast. So after you had done promises, promises, and it was huge because he played the piano on stage and you did all this stuff.

1:03:43

It was a big Broadway hit, right?

1:03:45

A few, a number of years ago.

1:03:47

And I said, are you going to do it again?

1:03:49

Do you have the desire to get up and do another Broadway show?

1:03:53

And you said something that was, I scored him.

1:03:57

I swear to God, the only person I heard make the same sort of reference.

1:04:02

Are you ready for this? I read it as a quote from Lawrence Olivier.

1:04:06

You said, I'm not sure I have the fire in the belly in order to get up and do eight performances or something to that.

1:04:14

I remember when Lawrence Olivier was older and he was always asked, well, will you ever get up?

1:04:22

And at the national again, what happened? He says no, because it requires a stronger heart.

1:04:28

And he wasn't talking about medically.

1:04:30

He was talking about all the effort that goes in the fire in the belly.

1:04:33

Well, We could do the eight shows a week.

1:04:36

I remember you talking about, you we've talked a lot about promises promises, but you said some of the same that you were like, I do it.

1:04:42

You did it for nine months or a year.

1:04:44

How long did you do it for a year?

1:04:46

A year? Were you saying you similar thing that you said to Tom, you said the same thing I said, would you do it again?

1:04:51

And you said, I don't know if I have it in me.

1:04:56

Yeah. 5, 6, 7, 8.

1:04:58

And then you just went with No,

1:05:01

no, it's true, Tom. You know, because, and I relayed that to you about, about the constant work ethic.

1:05:09

You have to jump from movie to movie, to movie, to movie over these decades and, and they're all great.

1:05:15

And they're, and, and your work, like Jason said, it's always, always fantastic.

1:05:19

You always committed. You're always in it.

1:05:22

And I switched that, that question back to you about filmmaking is do you still have the fire in the belly to travel and get up at five and stay in this hotel and that hotel and, and, and you said, yeah, because it's what, it's what I love to do.

1:05:38

And yeah, I do.

1:05:40

Yeah. There's no other way of putting it. There is theirs is look, it's more fun than fun.

1:05:44

That was something that I learned a long time ago before I got my job at the great lakes, Shakespeare fit, working in the theater is more fun than fun.

1:05:51

And I thought, well, yeah, this is a, this is a great way to, to, to spend your day.

1:05:56

It's not just a lifestyle or a, you know, a life's work.

1:05:59

It's a, it's a life. I love that.

1:06:01

And now listen, out of all of the, your entire repertoire, all of your credits.

1:06:06

Is there one ask You? What is your favorite Movie?

1:06:09

Jesus. No, no, no. Is there one movie or experience that was extra special to you that will always stick in your brain?

1:06:16

You know, I will say look, yes.

1:06:18

The, they all are in so many ways.

1:06:21

I look, I've never had a rotten time making a movie.

1:06:23

I've always come away from a movie saying, I can't believe they pay me to do this.

1:06:27

That was, that was fantastic. Despite their discomforts and the five in the morning, a little harder at the age of 65, I guess, but the, the experience of making the, the movie, that thing you do, I cast it with a bunch of friends.

1:06:42

We had a great time. It was the beginning of a beginning of the company that, that I've formed.

1:06:49

So great. I love that movie with Gary Gatesman and everybody else down at Plato's.

1:06:52

I, I could do that again and again and again, that was really the first film he directed.

1:06:56

That was the first, not the first directing gig I had, it was the first feature film.

1:07:01

Yeah. And it was a, it had music in it.

1:07:04

And it was very, it was very personal because it was set in 1964.

1:07:07

So it was, but you know, every, every gig is a magnificent, the, the ones that don't then maybe disappointed a little bit, it was the ones where you don't get to spend enough time doing it.

1:07:20

Like I was just, I just did two weeks with Wes Anderson in Spain with a Wes Anderson repertory company.

1:07:28

And that was fantastic. And I was bummed out.

1:07:31

He said, oh, we got to leave. We've shot out my role.

1:07:33

I gotta, I gotta go. Now I'd like to like to linger for a little bit.

1:07:37

I just got to do a couple of days with our buddy Taika YTT and it was just the greatest experience.

1:07:42

And then it was just, we did a show for HBO and then I just did his movie and I was like, these were the, it was like the greatest, most fun month.

1:07:49

And then I'm like, oh, and it's over.

1:07:51

And that was, I just want to go and play well with that gang Don't

1:07:56

we don't. We get to have that 90 day experience here, off somewhere, you know, founding something out and getting up and 11.

1:08:02

Well, you've got You given us not 90 days, but a solid hour of your very, very Valuable

1:08:09

time. Thank you so much. Thank you. On behalf Of,

1:08:11

of, of these two fellow Smartlist folks, as well as everyone in America and the world for providing us all these little worlds that you have created, that we all get to live in, and they've all been, It

1:08:25

has to award for second bananas or third bananas that you Jason and I

1:08:31

will, and I battle for that one.

1:08:33

You have to ask questions like What's your favorite Movie?

1:08:35

Yeah, No,

1:08:37

you got to you, you got a monopoly on that.

1:08:40

You got it all In

1:08:42

Canada. This is known as will.

1:08:44

Our nets smartless.

1:08:45

That's true. It's true.

1:08:47

Number one podcast in Canada, I

1:08:52

just got voted. Canada's favorite son. I'm not sure, but I'm putting it out there in case anybody wants to latch on to that and start making that a thing I'm happy to.

1:08:59

Well, it's A delight talking to you guys To

1:09:01

Tom delight Is

1:09:03

ours, Tom. I just words don't express how I feel.

1:09:07

I'm such a And

1:09:10

listen. Good luck on the, is there a name for this award yet?

1:09:14

The iHeartRadio awards. So it's the ma might be called the aorta who he up Against.

1:09:19

That would be a big question there.

1:09:21

Oh, that's a great question. Hardcore History

1:09:22

may be up against hardcore here.

1:09:26

Fingers crossed so great to see. Thanks Tom.

1:09:28

Very much. It's good to see you guys hope that well, we'll hang it.

1:09:32

All those places that people like us end up at, for sure.

1:09:36

All right. Take care guys.

1:09:38

All right, buddy. Bye-bye bye Tom.

1:09:40

I think he's gonna, I think he's going to make it that guy's got some charisma.

1:09:45

Jason, let me just say this. You've been complaining for a couple of years.

1:09:47

Hey man. Great. Cassie, you guy. And then you just to say, you pulled out at one of these.

1:09:50

What I know now referred to is, cause I don't use this word.

1:09:53

You as the, the topper card.

1:09:56

I'm a now call it the topper card.

1:09:58

He's he's he's that? He's a, he's a blue chip.

1:10:00

That one right there. What a delight.

1:10:02

I mean, he's just like, He

1:10:05

does have that thing and I kept trying to figure out a way to ask him this without him deflecting, as he does so well, so humbly and I just kind of bailed on it.

1:10:14

Cause I knew he would just wouldn't like, he's just got that he's he is us.

1:10:20

He is completely personable and authentic.

1:10:23

He is he's every bit of leader that you'd want him to be, but he doesn't seem like he's too arrogant or cocky too.

1:10:31

Like, I don't know. How does he mean us as a, as an audience?

1:10:34

Not that's three.

1:10:36

Yes. Like he's just like, he's the guy you want to follow and are never annoyed.

1:10:41

D you know, watching him or I don't know.

1:10:45

It's it's, it's been so consistent to See

1:10:48

myself as an every man. Oh No,

1:10:50

you're definitely Not. No, I'm special.

1:10:53

Yeah. Well

1:10:57

I'm like the boss of the every minute, you know?

1:10:59

So when I'm there, when I see Tom come in and I'm like, it's great spending time with one of my employees.

1:11:06

I hope he keeps staying as prolific as he is.

1:11:09

I mean, what is doing? Like what at least a film a Year,

1:11:11

same, same here. That's what I meant about the movies he makes.

1:11:13

I love that he keeps making movies that are like, it just seems like not a lot of other people are making and his new movie, which we talked to him.

1:11:21

What is the, the, Yeah.

1:11:23

Finn? No, not the Finch.

1:11:24

It's

1:11:24

a

1:11:26

bird. Yeah. Finch. It's on apple and it's basically, When

1:11:29

is it on apple? When is it? It's not on now.

1:11:31

First Week of November, November 5th, first week of November 5th, November

1:11:36

5th. So yeah. So he's doing this movie Finch and the SQL is going to be the Finch I heard.

1:11:41

Yeah, I know it's called Fincher. It's called Fincher directing it.

1:11:46

Yeah. David right now, Are you kidding?

1:11:48

Showbiz is incredible.

1:11:50

I Know it's, it's, everything's aligned, but it's about it's him and a dog and a robot.

1:11:56

And this is not the start of a joke, but like it could anybody pull off a high wire act like that?

1:12:02

Walk into a bar. There's one bar, a new bar, be fair.

1:12:05

In fairness, they walk. But I saw the trailer to two with my almost 13 year old and we watched it and looked at each other.

1:12:11

We're like, yeah. Yeah.

1:12:12

And don't you feel like he's kind of like our ambassador, not just for the business and not just for Hollywood, not just philosophers, but like America too.

1:12:22

Absolutely quintessentially American.

1:12:25

And like, he's one of the people we can all, both sides if you will, can agree on.

1:12:31

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Wait, what's the other side I just met like both like nevermind.

1:12:36

Everybody in America can agree.

1:12:38

Oh, those Leshawn we are not political.

1:12:42

Sorry. Yeah. What are you trying to do?

1:12:44

Are you trying to, where's your award, you trying to Wade me into deep water and then you're going to take me down like a crocodile and to keep me under her Fucking bail out like that, you just get really yourself out.

1:12:59

Yeah. You can't be saved by your own bell.

1:13:01

We've used Every word that you could do with by no, not at all.

1:13:07

No, but also you were just trying to bail yourself out of a sinking ship and you can't use buy as, as a, as a, as some kind of instrument to bail out your sinking shit.

1:13:17

Why not? I just did it.

1:13:19

I guess you can, sorry. There is no rule in that.

1:13:21

You're right. You can.

1:13:23

But do you think that when he first moved?

1:13:27

Oh no, sorry. Let's hear it.

1:13:29

Come on.

1:13:33

One of the questions I did get to here was he was 1979.

1:13:37

He made a move to New York city and trying to be an actor full time.

1:13:44

So wonder if he was just trying to take a bite out of the pool.

1:13:49

I'm

1:13:49

not

1:13:49

confident

1:13:49

with

1:13:49

this

1:14:17

Smartlist is 100% organic and artisanally handcrafted by Bennett barbacoa, Michael Grant, Terry and Rob on Jeff Less.

1:14:33

Our next episode will be out in a week wherever you listen to podcasts, or you can listen to it right now, early on Amazon music or early and add free by subscribing to one repless in apple podcasts or the one rap.

1:14:48

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1:14:53

I'm telling the story of a rugby team who small plane crashed in the Andes mountains in the fall of 1972, there stranded on the snow covered side of a mountain with no hope of rescue and have to do the unthinkable to survive.

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They battle starvation, hypothermia, blizzards, and avalanches.

1:15:13

For more than two months before finally finding the strength to try and save themselves.

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And two young men's attempt to hike to civilization and get them all out.

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1:15:33

I'm gonna do that. So today is Oh, sorry. Today? Yeah. Go ahead. Today, we're going to have it going nice. I I was Sean. No, sir. was just the last time you started the last one, I was gonna start this one. Okay. We're just doing an intro. So it doesn't matter to start. Oh, this one. So today, I've got Oh, I thought, oh, let me just do it. Let me just do it. A listener. Here is smart list. But I Okay. Listen, I think it's been three weeks since we've we've done this. Since I've seen you, since I've talked to you. Yeah. And I I have to say I've had some long drives in the last three weeks, so I've gone ahead and and done some quality control, looking listening to our podcast. I'm not great at it it. Cause I'm listening to them after they've already breached the, I'm listening to them after they've already reached the public. So Are you picking up some long hauler miles? Some deliveries. What's going on? I am. I've got some five hour energy cases I'm trying to get through. Okay. Sure. So it's really been nice. Listening to you fellas, you're you're both very talented and very funny on the podcast. I I'd really like to be more of a a part of it But so I was very excited to part of it. I I was very excited to see you guys today. But then this morning, This morning. I apologize. This morning, a real dark cloud floated over our family here at Thank you very much. Jason, can I go ahead is is it possible to say, like, is it possible for a dark cloud to then give you a gut punch? Is that possible? Sure. What happened? Yeah. Well, why don't you take it from here? Well, Jason read something that I read. We already. Oh, god. Well, I read it it. I read it after you sent it to me, actually, you know I read it after you sent it to me. Sure. Actually, you know what? Sean sent Sean sent it. That's strange. I sent it before I read it. I don't think so. Sean sent an article to Jason and me in the in the thread that we're in. With some famed x clamation points. Like -- Yeah. -- like, this is this is great for us. And by the way, I'm gonna put it out there. If anybody thinks they're worthy of being in the next thread, let us know. And we'll add you or put you on the yeah. We'll add you the thread. And Sean says, congrats for us. Yay, for us. In a way, it's a click to Hollywood reporter. Smart list nominated. Great nominated for a bunch of podcast awards or whatever. Which is kinda neat because this is, you know, this is an embarrassing mom and pop operation. Yeah. We're up. We apologize. Yeah. The fact that we're getting any traction whatsoever, let alone nominations -- Yeah. -- just thank you to believe that. Yeah. It's pretty great. Thank And also, it's embarrassing. I think Jason Dred. It is kind embarrassing. So so then as you if you read further down in the story, they're nominated best podcast, blah blah blah. And Sean Hayes nominated for best host, Which is the worst, which is the kiss of is the worst which is the kiss of death because now it was like, well, he's not really that great. Well, you're so I don't think they're saying it out the side of their mouth either. I think it comes straight out the center. And here's my thing my thing. Today, I can't wait to see you host. Yeah. Yeah. Let's see what you saw. This is gonna be the worst experience for me. Well, the voters are now listening. Right? Because the nominations are now. They really have to decide they really have to decide. Pay attention to his host. My questions are still gonna be, like, hey, where are you from? Yeah. No. Don't worry. We we know that. That obviously resonates with the with the jury over there. The iHeartMedia people have made a bunch of When Sean said when Sean said, what's your favorite color? I mean, well, how how how how how do you let's nominate that jacket. Yeah. Here we go. Jeez. I'm not gonna be able to come up for air for a while, and we're thrilled for you, Sean. Yeah. We're really I'm thrilled for everybody. Unless I said to Sean, I said to Sean, by the way, I did say congrats man, and he was like, oh, thank you. And I responded, I didn't mean it. What do you mean? What What are you you doing? How dare you say that? I responded with I didn't I didn't read the I truly didn't know. I didn't read the article. I just read the headline. Like most people. Sure. It is true. I think Sean might be the kindest man I've ever known. Yeah. Well, III That's all. No one deserves it more. Not around you too. Alright. Zip it up. We got we've got a we've got an we've got an interesting guest today. Uh-huh. He's he's known primarily in New Zealand and in South Africa due to his success in rugby. Okay. Florida then came to love him when he pivoted his talents towards high line and dog racing. And then when he was in California, It was attempting to be the first to successfully mend the San Andreas fault. He tried his hand at acting. Mhmm. And and while fame and fortune there has been scarce, at best, some call it a wipeout. Sure. The critics have given him a few hugs. So he has received a couple of academy awards and seven Emmy Awards. What? Oh, he's gotten himself a Tony nomination. He was AFI life who has a cat. He has a cat. He will turn it around. He got a life time achievement award from AFI, BAFTA gave him something. The Golden Globes gave him the CECL beat the mill award. The Kennedy center honored this, this highlight The Kennedy Center honored this this highlight player, and Barack Obama gave him the presidential medal of freedom. Wait. So I say chin up. I say chin up to this fella. No. I This is the most highly decorated guest we've ever had. I would say so, Yeah. He's famous and fortunate in our famous and fortunate in our book. Okay? Please welcome the forever struggling but always diligent America's own. And Hollywood's best and Hollywood's best. Mr. Tom Lamar Tom Lamar Hanks. No. No. Yeah. And I know that Sean was the host of this pie. Yeah. I would have bailed. I said, guys, I'd like to, but, you know, I don't like to work from home. Apparently, you're working with one of the brightest hosts in the business. Yeah. Is there a name for this award? Is it is it named after somebody? Is it It's called the, the It's called the the aorta because it's from my heart media. 0I0, okay. Uh-huh. Uh-huh. That's not true, but I that's my pitch. One of my hard hitting nominee questions is where are you right now? I don't recognize that room. I'm a I'm in a tiny little cubby hole that is here in my vast compound. Yeah. Somewhere in the tri state area. I'm Telling you dog racing really you. Dog racing really pays, guys. You gotta look into it. It's within a single days drive from Lakewood, Ohio, home of the Great Lakes Shakespeare Festival. Wait. You didn't. Is it Is it true? No. No. We already get a we already plugging a festival. I mean, this It was long time is a long time to go. Long time to go. Wait. Did you really do dog racing? No dumbass. This is why you're not gonna win. You're the worst host. The occasion was demonstrating his, quote, comedy chops. Like, guys, can I write or what? Huh? Hang on. I think Tom's onto something. Let's get into Jason's comedy chop. You know, I told, I told some friends last night that I was doing this podcast and first of all, I had to re-explain who we were and Sean know, I told I told some friends last night that I was doing this podcast. And first of all, I had to reexplain You know who we were. Yeah. Sure. And Sean, who, Jason, what? Will. What is the name of it? Yeah. I kept calling it helpless based on the new young song. So but now I realize no. No. No. No. It's it's smart list. Smart list. We really are helpless. And the question came up about you, Will -- Oh. -- which is which was this question is, has he started using a different voice professionally? Mhmm. That in your early days, you were kinda like squeaky. You sorta sounded like Jay North in those old Dennis, the Minas Rio runs. And you were hilarious. But then you went off and voiced Batman, and it's though you're walking around with your own self imposed EQ on your voice mail. You know? True or false will. Here, I listen, like, any good politician. I can't just give you a straight true or I can't just give you a straight true false. I will say that I constantly have a monitor in my ear, and I'm and I'm adjusting my levels, my input levels. Right. And so then I can I can mod No? You know what? It's funny. I recently, you know, I often watch a lot of my old stuff because I like to be entertained and and he has trouble sleeping. Yeah. No. But I my voice has gotten it has but if you listen to Howard's If it's because of abuse, I guess, are you do you still smoke? Who's listening? I'm I'm just learning. I'm just learning. We had Sean Penn on the podcast. He he's he went through AAAA full pack of darts. Didn't he? He did go through a pack of darts. That's colloquial for cigarettes. No. As Canadian is supposed to say, coffin nail or Or a nail, a nail or bullet a nail a nail or a bullet. Actually, Tom, this brings me to an actual question about the nail I noticed recently, I was reading the tenth book in the in the Gunther, what's his name series by Philip Curran, I noticed your name on the back of the Oh, the And I you you gave a little blurb for the back of for the jacket of Prussian Blue, which I'm almost finished with. Oh, that's a great one. It's a great one. Right? Gunther help me. Bernard Gunther. Bernard Bernie Gunther series, he plays a non okay. Yeah. Hugely. Go. Go. Be merciful on me on this. Okay. And he plays a non Nazi private investigator from nineteen twenty eight Berlin through well after the war. That's right. It's a fabulous series by Philip Curr. Philip Curr. The late Philip Curr, he passed away too early. Yeah. And I read them all. I'm just well, I'm I'm not a big I'm not a big, like, detective genre, fiction writer. I mean, either But this had that added bonus of very accurate sort of historical detail to it that that I really love. It's it's a tremendous historical fiction, and you're you're absolutely right. And I'm with you, And I'm with you, Tom, and and I read I read mostly non fiction some of you recommend they said, you love all this European history. I think you'd like this. I'm fully like I said, I just started the beginning of this summer, and I'm on book ten, Prashinando. Right. And but he always refers to cigarettes as nails. And he gets beaten up by these Nazis and then they look down and he's spinning up loud and they say, what do you want? He looks up and he says, can I get a nail? Yeah. And, you know, what what he smokes one? He looks really cool. He looks really really cool. He looks really What I like about those books is it fills in the blanks of his war years because some of them take place well before world war II, some of them take place after world war I like about those books is It fills in the blanks of his war years because some of them take place well before World War two, some of them take place after World War two. And in the course of it, you see what he what he went Thanks guys for firing us out of the gate here at the start of the interview. I mean, our love his love literature. Go, Sean. You're the host. Let's do it. Yeah. Thank you so much. Come on. By the way, Sean, I have my hand on my buzzer. Hand is right on my buzzer. Okay. Great answer. The correct answer. Good. I wanna know what your fascination with with war is because your name is so synonymous. I've never asked you this in my entire life. Why are you so passionate? Yeah. You're the war guy. The history of He loves a good fight. It started the highlight, I think. Right? Uh-huh. That dog racing, you know. First of all, I we do a lot of them because none of the projects have to have cell phones or laptops. Sure. So that alone makes the writing of them so much easier and there's much less special effects of having to put in those screens. But it I had I get this question asked to me quite often, and the answer always comes down to when In those formative years of say seven through, you know, when you're a little kid, you know, every single caregiver, every single adult in my life would make references to the six two words, three letters each, the war. Yeah. And they talked about it as as this great dividing line in their lives. There was before the war, there was during the war, and there was just after the war. And they talked about it as though it's almost like, well, that was when the black plague was walking among us, you know, or For a big chunk of their lives, they had no idea where they were going to be in another six months. Mhmm. They had no idea how long the war was going to last. That's that's one big aspect of it. The other part of it too, is is that the bad guys lost at the end of that The other part of it too is, is that the bad guys lost Yeah. At the end of the day. Yeah. Just yeah. We were able to somehow, unfortunately, necessarily, kick the stuffing out of And when bad guys lose something, it's that what is that power of myth of Mhmm. Is it Bill Meyers? You know? You will the world was on a quest to defeat people that were undeniably evil. The governments of those places and many of the many of the populace. So I I keep getting drawn back to that. And again, I will say that from a storytelling perspective, Our present day is just so there is no shame left anymore. No. Truth seems to be a a malleable, viscous kind of like It's distant memory truth. It seems And, actually, you know what, Tom? Sean, actually, within last six months, I don't know if you remember we were talking about all the movies you've done the war moves. And Tom said, do you think he'll ever make a movie about TikTok? And, you know, because something that he thinks about to get rid of now. For Sean and Scott, either it was before TikTok and after TikTok. Well, you know, if I did, it would only be about forty five seconds long. How long how long is your age? Tom, won't be I and then I won't be able to wait for the sequel. Tom, I I know that I I know that you would you'd you'd never compare your experience shooting Save Your Private private Ryan to those who actually fought, you know, in all of that and during all that. But was there ever a moment I'm I I bet there was a few moments while you were shooting that were that you got close to the feeling maybe of what it might have been like. I mean, certainly, the product, the result of that film, took me there or as close as III think I could get. But I would imagine there were a few moments there where it it just based on the quality of the production, they managed to create some environments for you there and and your own process of trying to get into the character and the realism of it where you you were kinda struck a bit by what these guys must have gone through? Well, yeah. But at the same, it was all fake, you know. Sure. But, I mean, You gotta take that into account. But when we were on the beach there in county Oxford in Ireland, which is where we shot the Omaha Beach sequences. Oh, so it wasn't it wasn't right there? Well, it was actually, it was one of the places where they rehearsed some of it. So that's that's one aspect of it. How far was base camp from the beach? It was way, well, I was gonna, I was going to incorporate that into the, into this shot, just to light up another nail will take that was way Well, I was gonna I was gonna incorporate that into the into the You serious joke. Sorry. So shut. Just light up another nail, Will, and take that pause. We're there with five hundred members of the Irish members of the Irish Army. There is landing craft everywhere and we're all storming, storming the beaches. And the special effects crew had laid out these tiny little flags on the beach where they had set up air mortars and squibs little explosive devices, things to avoid. Yeah. And they actually said, you know, I be careful. Right? Because, you know, this is gonna become this is like a projectile. It'll come out of the ground very fast. So if you can, try to avoid where the flags are. I said, you know, I think I got that. Then they removed all the flags. And we couldn't see anything on my quest of where so we were just stumbling all wonder why. So there's all of that, and it's dressed the way it is. And when you there were always four or five cameras going and once the shot began and you're wet and you're cold and you're coming up, And out of what corner of one eye, you see a guy catch on fire. And at the corner of the other eye, you see a guy blown forty feet into the air. Uh-huh. And he loses a leg in the process. Literally we had, you know, amputee stunt people. Oh my god. Then But then that they were that they were amputated before you. They were amputated. Thank God. Just to clarify. But even though there's harnesses and there's wires and whatnot, the machine guns are going off all around you and explosions are happening like crazy. And it goes on for the better part of, you know, two or three or four minutes. And there was a there was a degree of sort of, like, odd fake and yet at the same time, terror that that was going on. Yeah. So we we were shooting them there all morning long, I'm gonna say about on the maybe the second day of shooting because the first day of shooting was spent in the boats themselves. Wow. Wow. And I climbed up the steps to the And I climbed up the steps to the bluff. They had put in these wooden steps so we could get up to the base camp. Will? Mhmm. Sure. That's for catering and craft services. It would not far as the crow flies, but it was awfully high. Was probably about six, seven hundred feet up the bluffs. And I went back and I found the other guys in the unit who I would be meeting when we got up to the shale, which was, you know, the the deficit that was at the top of the beach. That's where I would come across berry pepper and Eddie Burns and then Diesel and the other guys. And they were still hanging around, you know, outside the trailers, the way actors do. Sure. And I was wet, and I was sandy, and I was near death from the amount of noise that had gone on. And IIII told the guy said, you guys better hold on to your hats because it's really wild down there. You are not going to I mean, when you see a guy catch on fire out of the corner of your eyes, cut. And no one said, you know, no one has said, there's going to be a guy caught on fire on this no one said, you know Right. No one's prepped you. No one has said there's gonna be a guy caught on fire on this side. And it said, all all you were it was it was an interesting kind of kind of pen. You know what's interesting? And this is kind of folding back to what you saying earlier. One of the reasons that what I love about that movie and I love that movie. So I'm gonna I'm not embarrassed to say, I love it so much. And I've seen a lot of I've seen it a lot of times. And one of the things I really love about, and you kind of touched on this whole idea of Can't wait for the musical version? Or No. Ninety seven, by the way. Nineteen ninety seven. Which is insane. That's when it came out. Wow. It seems like two years ago. But you had that moment where you your character is a schoolteacher, I think, is that right? Or Yeah. Yeah. We Yeah. He's a schoolteacher. But the idea that doesn't matter what he is. He's just a regular this is what the thing of this particularly this war. There was the great war which they referred to World War one as, but then there was the war. WORD WAR II. AND HE WAS A GUY WHO WAS CALLED TO DO SOMETHING EXTRAORDINARY. HE WAS BORN TO BE A MILITARY OFFICER. HE WAS BORN TO BE killer. He was a guy who had to go because that's what he had to do. And people came in in in this moment when the entire world was at war and did extraordinary things. And I always loved that about it. And I think that for me, it really captured what it is that that sort of makes me have such I it's weird to have, say, have reverence for the war, but you have reverence for the bravery and what people did that were extraordinary things. Yeah. Yeah. You'll actually want to make an anti-war movie at the same time that you're making a war you actually, you wanna make an anti war movie at the same time -- Right. -- that you're making a war movie? Right. Let me tell you a story. I was I was nine eighteen years old, I think. And I was a bellman at the Royal hotel in Oakland, and I was a bellman at the Royal Hotel in Oakland, California. And we had a guy who read his own dry cleaning service would come and collect the clothes and take them away and then deliver the clean clothes. And he was always coming with you know, dozens and dozens of shirts and pants that have been dry cleaned. And I was working there one summer and he was gone for two weeks I'm gonna say his name was Mike. I can't remember what his name was. But Mike was gone for two weeks and somebody else came in every day. And then then after two weeks, it was in June. After two weeks, he came back from his vacation. I said, oh, hey, Mike. Where were these last two? Oh, no. I I take vacation every every every June. I said, oh, oh, Do you do you go camping? He said, no. no. I, I get together with, with some of my old No. I I get together with with some of my old buddies. He said, oh, no. Where did you go? Well, this this year, we we went back to this place that we had visited back when we were kids. He said, oh, no. Where where was that? He said, It's in the it's in the north of France. Mhmm. He was a paratrooper. He was in the eighty second airborne. Wow. This guy is this nineteen seventy four. So go back four years, so he's he's in his fifties. And what he's telling me is that when he was in his twenties, He jumped into he jumped into Normandy on d day, and he was a paratrooper. And now he's a guy delivering his dry cleaning dry cleaning for the whole tell. Yeah. Yeah. I felt I felt stupid and small. But also, that was he was an example of that adult that caregator that was part of daily life that, you know, that he didn't know if he was gonna make it back. And he went oh, he said, and we go back. He said this. He said, we go back to to visit the buddies that didn't make it home. Mhmm. So they're visiting the they're visiting the the the cemeteries that are in. So look, that's a generation. It was a It was a time that was loaded with all sorts of problems. That, of course we're still dealing with right now, but you can't take away the fact that these were young guys who were asked to go off and liberate the world from really, really bad of course, we're still dealing with right now. But you can't take away the fact that these were young guys who were asked to go off and liberate the world from really, really bad people and they did it. Yeah. My grandfather, I just I'll leave it at grandfather I just I'll leave it at this my my grandfather who passed almost almost twelve years ago, was really close with and loved dearly. He I remember him telling me He worked with he was in the Canadian Army, but he was attached to the Royal Air Force, and he planned bombing sorties. And they were stationed at various air airfields as they would move across as they, you know, after June forty four. Yeah. And he said, one morning, we wake up, and there was constantly planes taking off and landing and stuff. And they were right And he said, one morning, his tent the guy who he shared tent with woke up, came out of the tent and walked into propeller of a plane in the dark. And I said, and he told me he didn't tell me this until I was about eighteen, of course. And I said, well, what did you do? And he said, and he wasn't joking. He said, well, I got a new tenant mate. And it was like, wow. And he was just like, that's the way it went. We had to keep going. There was What can you do? I don't want to go into the don't wanna go into a place. I was that's too much of a bummer of a story. Sad story, True. So anyway, I think It's very sad. Anyway, I think a perfect segue would be happy days. Yes, sir. Let's go talk about it. Let's go in a few days. In order to make saving private, Ryan happen or any of the other credible movies that you have for IMDB reading sun No. No. No. You? This is pure This is pure with the video. There you come. With the video. So So had you not booked that episode on Happy Days? Hey. Would you have not met Ron Howard and things that we would not have been gifted highlighted by Ron Howard on Happy Days. Ron had left the series by then. What I the guys I met were Lowell Gantz and Babilou Mandel, who were the staff riders on happy days who wrote the the part who wrote splash, this new play of splash. And Bahram was directing and they said, hey, you may wanna Hey, take look at that guy who got fired from bosom buddies, you know, bosom buddies. Was canceled. Something that Sean is going to experience one of these days. Yeah. Yeah. Don't worry. Sean's canceled two programs I've been on, South Dakota. And we will be right back. Thanks to fight camp for supporting the to Fight Camp for supporting this show. Now look, Sean, the holidays are coming. Yeah. fast. Yeah. What's the most stressful time of the year, but we know the perfect gift to give everyone some much needed the most stressful time of the year? But we know the perfect gift to give everyone some much needed stress relief I cannot talk about this enough. You know what I'm going to say, You know what I'm gonna say. Right? Guess what? I like this product. I wanna be a better part of this product. White camp brings the best workout of the world into your home and it makes it fun. And you learn to box or Kickbox from home with access to world-class programming, elite trainers, premium equipment and smart technology that turns your workout into an interactive You learn to box or kick box from home with access to world class programming leak trainers, premium equipment, and smart technology that turns your workout into an interactive experience Guys. I signed up for fight camp before they had anything to do with our I signed up for bike camp before they had anything to do with our show. Okay. First you know who got me onto You know who got me onto it? Guests take one guest who said my guest? Take one guest who said Mike Tyson? That's a different That's a different note. It was a friend of ours who doesn't have any was a friend of ours who doesn't have any sleeves. I'll just say that, Justin I'll just say that. Justin, Thoroks. Thoroks. Yeah. He's like, you got to do He's like, you gotta do this. So I send away for it So I send a way for it. 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That's KWPS dot com slash smartless to get your first month free. Keeps dot com slash smart list. Can you spell keeps force one last time? E P S a boy. We had some will leakage had some will leakage there. Hey, sorry, I just wanted to jump in. Yeah. And now, back to the show. Tom, would you agree that the the the the routine of a sitcom actor is the best job in show business? Do you miss it still to this day? Well, it is It is kind of is kind of a skate. It's a great hang. I'll tell you that. Because look, if you you either shoot, you rehearse Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, camera block Thursday shoot Friday -- Right. -- or you rehearse Thursday, Friday, Monday, camera block Tuesday shoot Wednesday. Isn't Is that kinda like the Yeah. That that that second one shoots Tuesday. Yes. You'd start on Wednesday. What what you're saying is five days of the week. Yeah. Yeah. Unless you're working with Jimmy Burrows, and then you can take the first day off of rehearsal and really becomes a four day workweek. And it's only three weeks a month, so it's twelve working days month. These are really top secret things, man. You should never let the stability. What do you do? Where are you blowing up? And it's six hours a day. Now everybody's gonna wanna be in showbiz. There's no way you load. There's there's there's there's craft service, climate change. A lot of breaks, you know, it is it is an awfully awful, fun day event. When we did bosom buddies, Peter Skalari and I, my dear old pal of the great shows. We actually shot that show on video not on the film cameras. Film cameras in those days, that was pretty much a bun. Camera camera blocking day was just kinda like your stand and did it, but on but we had four video cameras, and we had to do the entire camera blocking day ourselves on camera because they did a line cut, you know, camera three. And tighten up on four and four. Let's come back. Let's coming back to two and two. You had to be there for that. So you you did you worked a long day and you did every line of the that week's script over and over again. And he and I just started goofing around so much that that's that's where we first got we got yelled at a couple of times. You know, the the the director up in the booth. Yeah. You know, he'd come in over that Tom, Voice of God. Hey, God. Listen. We're we're working really hard on him. Can you guys just kinda stick to the lines? Otherwise, we didn't get the line cut in. We're trying kept the tally lights on camera three, Tom. Would that come on, you know, you speak? And we didn't care. We were just goofing around. So much. How excited were you when you got when you got that show? What was that moment? So, young Tom Hanks and you get bosom buddies, you booked it? It's your job. What was that? Well, I couldn't believe it. Yeah. Yeah. I was gonna be on TV, you know. Right. And I was gonna be up to that point as a Shakespearean actor I'd made I made less than ten thousand dollars in year for an entire year. And I was married and had a kid. And, jeez, I I made almost I made that in two weeks on on Bose and Buddy. So the financial reprieve was huge. Yeah. When was the last time you did was the last time you did Shakespeare? I did Shakespeare two years ago here in Los Angeles. I played false staff -- Yes. -- with the Shakespeare Center in Los Angeles. Tom, tell that tell that story. It was a it was a video that I saw of you doing. I can't remember. It was so funny. You pulled some guy out of the audience or something. What was that? What happened was had a we had a medical emergency. A guy, a gentleman had a a heart thing happened to And all of a sudden, the paramedics had to be called, we were doing it at the VA center in the Japanese garden amongst the eucalyptus trees here. And right? West Los Angeles. And you know, a guy had some sort of seizure and we had to call the IMTS and then we had to take a break and the house, not the house lights, the lights all came up and it was going into, it ended up being about a 30 minute hold while they took care of the, this you know, the a guy had some sort of seizure, and we had to call the AMTs, and then we had to take a break in the house, not the house light. The lights all came up. And it was going into it ended up being about a thirty minute hold while they took care of the the something. Right. And we were all backstage saying, should we do something? And then when I saw that people were leaving Oh, no. No. No. No. No. No. mean, it was gonna it was long. It was about close to three hour show anyway. But when I saw people I saw a lady pick up her purse and move toward the exit. And I came running out trying to scream and get back here. Take take the thy seat or something. Yeah. There was so many but but but what was amazing was you were improvising in Shakespeare in talk. That was that's what was in my mind. And it was super funny. God. It was so great. It ended up it ended up being worthwhile. And it got enough people to stay. And I think I ridiculed enough people that made some lady cry, you know. But out of laughter, Sure. Sure. Sure. Sure. What was the, you know, a a splash, by the way, for your birthday years and years ago, I sent you a post and I superimposed my face over Daryl Hanna's, and I said the note said you and I would have made bigger splash. But Tom doesn't remember that. But anyway, and we only been the trailblazers, We had we only been to railblazer. But but, you know, what was that like what was that feeling? Because as a kid, I was like, oh my god. Every actor wanted to be Tom. Hank everybody every actor wanted to see you. Yeah. You're in all of the string of these massive comedy hits. Right? And big and splash and just I don't know what I was doing. They asked me to they asked me to be in a movie. So I said, yeah. But did you But did you know when you started doing all those other Mo you started, you did big and you did all these things and they were just getting, did you know where you were did you know when you started doing all those other movie that you did Bing and you did all these things and they were just getting, did you know where you were going or what? No. No. We have no idea. They just said when you were playing the lead and you were incredibly charismatic and you were you were you were compelling on like, you were carrying things right out of the gate. Had you always had the confidence and the sort of the the the leadership qualities or all growing up? Or or I would just trying to remember the words. I was trying to speak loud enough to be heard. Where are we? You are you are you are so sorry to leave. What's up? I'll tell you I'll tell you the biggest the biggest lesson that I learned. This was when I was at the Great Lakes Shakespeare Festival, just a days drive from where I am right now in Lakewood, Ohio. In which Dan Sullivan, who directed the the the fault the Henry the fifth excuse me, Henry the fourth that I did. false belief. He directed that. In nineteen seventy seven, we were in rotating rep and I was carrying a spear and I was doing everything that I was told to do. And we had done we had just opened a production of Hamlet the night before, it was in rotating rep, so you open the shows about every two weeks and then you ran a different show every night. That's what repitory means. Sean. And so we had opened up Hamlet, and we all had to rehearsal the next day for Timing of the Shrew, which I played I played Groomio. In Timing of the True. And all of the equity company, the professionals, were hungover exhausted, because they had all been out partying the night before because they just opened Hamlet. So everybody was like an ambulistic and showing up at ten o'clock. And no one really knew their lines yet. And everybody was kind of like shuffling everybody was kind of like shuffling around and Dan Sullivan yelled at everybody. Heeled everybody, said, hey. Hey. Hey. Hey. We've got three weeks to get this show up on its feet. And you people are not even trying. For crying out loud, I can't do my job if you guys don't do your jobs. You guys have gotta show up on time You gotta know your lines and you've gotta have an idea. I can't provide everything here. So let's take a break, mainline some coffee, Shoot if you have to. A ride out of the jar, but come back here with some friggin energy. Fuck I would cast you in the Dan Sullivan movie right now, by the way. Sorry. Just just for what it's worth. That was incredible. You're going I remember remember you. okay. So you you look We're all we're all like nineteen, eighteen, twenty. I was twenty years old then. And that lesson really super stuck to me. If professional actors who have twenty years in the biz, as they often said, twenty years in the biz, I've never been yelled at like that. That was that was an important message. All through all of these gigs that I had, they hits. Thank you. Then this is let's forget those. I always I that was always the thing that I thought the most important thing to do was show up on time, know your lines, and have an idea in your pocket. Sure. But I think that's that's all I did through all of those. didn't know anything. So, Tom, when you went when you were doing all the strings the string of comedies, back then. And do you remember what it felt like or do you remember that pivot moment when all of a sudden maybe you got offered a script or you had that kind of dialogue with your agent or what happened where you switched over to more, let's say, important films or more dramatic films. What a What a question is so a question? It's so great. Thank you. Where you 0II That was the era of you can make a movie for about fifteen million dollars. And if you just said it was a comedy, it seemed to do some brand of business. Whether it was actually funny or not, didn't matter. Yeah. That was the it. It was all, you know, anybody who had said action and cut was trusted to direct a comedy movie, whether they were funny or was all, you know, anybody who had said action and cut was trusted to direct a comedy movie whether they were funny or not. And I'm I made a I made ton of those. In which everybody came back. Oh, the dailies were fantastic. I think the audience is gonna be standing on their feet at the end of this. So, Tracy, dailies are are the thing you watch as you're filming the movie. They get lost by the the day before stuff. And it doesn't matter if the movie was called monkeys make the sun go down. Everybody was saying, this is this is the funniest of all the movements. The cows of tumbletown, this is going to be a magnificent company. Because the good comedies that were made, you know, at the time, they all had they were all with former second city people, you know, and Saturday night live people. And but there was this this, you could take a setting. This movie takes place on a ski slope. This movie takes place on a school bus. This movie takes place at a bachelor party and it will be a comedy. And I made a I made a billion of those like because we're just kinda like doing imitations of other people's funny movies. Yeah. But here's the thing. And I've said this about a there are a few people out there who have this, and you are one of them, which is it doesn't matter what the movie was. You are always good. Mhmm. You're all even even doing I I joked about doing the Dan Sullivan. No matter what it is, you're committed, and and that always kinda shines through. So I I know that you talk about those those misses. I mean, look, if it wasn't for bad movies, I wouldn't make any at all. You wouldn't be sitting in your dad's library. No. I wouldn't be my dad's living back at my folk's house in Toronto. But but but, you know, but it's true. And you always you always deliver in that way because I always get the impression watching you that, like, you don't care what the thing is. You're just doing I mean, you're part of it, and you're in the thing, and who gives us shit? What's that? I don't wanna I don't wanna discount some of the great stuffed. I met great people. And we did we made we actually did some really funny stuff that that that really did work. And that's always Yes. That's always always fun. Also known as classics. It was well done. You know, it's funny. You know, they I don't think I we ever had a movie. Splash was well reviewed. And I don't think I had another decent review for about, I don't know, six or seven films, but now you read about them. And they're they're they're called classics, you know. Why? They're called classic. No. Right. Right. Right. It didn't didn't happen back in the day But once Philadelphia Yeah, it happened, I would imagine some of the scripts that were coming to you started to confuse things for you and your team about course. I got older, you know that that's the other thing got older. You know, that that's the other thing too. And, you know, there's there's a type of movie you can make in your late twenties. I turned Here's a story. I turned twenty seven the day of we wrapped the motion picture splash. It was the last day of shooting. We were in the Bahamas. Bahamas. We had a cake that was actually for the We had a cake that was actually for the wrap. Hey, let's celebrate the last day of shooting with the cake. And someone, I think, with a two, but toothpaste, added in icing on the cake. Happy birthday, Tom, because I found out it was my birthday. So that was, you know, there's a movie that you make when you're twenty seven and in your early thirties and what happened. You know, I I made I made a number of them, and which but you have to get older, you know. You can't -- Yeah. -- and I was able to Agent two, Gary Marshall, gave me a great role with Jackie Gleeson in a movie called Nothing In Common, and then David Seltzer wrote and directed with Sally Field punchline, and then big came along. Right? Yeah. But you get older and so, and you start But you get older. And so and you start singing, III will tell you, I look, I'm not big on this kind of stuff, but there was one time I was sitting around with my crack show biz expert. Who works for CIA. And he said to me, what do you wanna do? And I and I said, you know Exactly. Like, Richard. That's okay. Great in person. Love it. There you go. Beautiful. What do you wanna what do you wanna do? And I said I said I wanna play grown up. So I I wanna wanna play people who've got been through bitter compromise because I was I was in my mid thirties by that point. Compromised Jason is thing that people do when I hear the other person's side, and then you go, okay, I'm willing to shift my position a little bit. And whatever, we'll talk about it later when somebody's gone. Sorry, Tom. Wait time. You know what I always wanted to ask you, and this is gonna be the dumbest question in the world. But -- Guaranteed. -- but but it is the host, please. That's right. In cast away. Right? Yeah. You that the volleyball is named Wilson. Now you're married to the wonderful Rita Wells and who I love, I adore, we all do. Is is was that by design because it could have been called spaldives? Jesus. Could have been it was written by Bill Broils. And that, man, that movie took about six years to figure out. Bill Broils and I started talking about it. And we didn't we weren't shooting it until six years later. And he came up with the idea of of a volleyball. And he named it Wilson in honor of my beautiful bride. We've been married there. It'll be thirty four years in in next Old for plus. Know for applause. Yeah. That's for you. So, no, it could have been and think we wanted to There you go. Yeah. Thank you. Well, Jesus Christ, that is a whole new level. I'm like -- Wow. -- I'm like, Fred. I'm like, Fred. Okay. This is is now, you know, but that brings me to Finch. Finch seems like it's got some qualities. It's. I mean, if I was a hack studio executive, I'd say it's, it's cast It's I I mean, if I was a hack studio executive, I'd say, it's it's cast away meets Martian. All movies are like that now. All movies are like that now. Yeah. Aren't they all? CenturyLink, you take a it's I suppose. On the waterfront meets Pal Joey, by by way of PAW Patrol. Like, there won't a movies are almost on PAW Patrol. But what you need is is a relatable every man that is empathetic, sympathetic, can alpha and beta inside a page? I mean, you you are the man that could service all things. I came up through that era of which every genre movie was about somebody who could not be killed or defeated, you know, the cop that could not be filled, that the fighter who could knew who never lost the, and so I would, you know, a geeky guy with a big, but a big nose and a squeaky I came up through that era of which every genre movie was about somebody who could not be killed. Or defeated, you know, the cop that could not be filled up. I'm with I'm with you. The fighter who could who never lost the And so I would you know, a a geeky guy with a big butt, a big nose, and a squeaky voice. Mhmm. III took all the jobs away from will. By the way, I do have a I have what what's called the pro jumper? Yeah. Well, you can't drive a spike with a tac hammer as I am. Heard. Wait. I just have a really quick castaway story that we might cut out of this, but -- Oh. -- and Tom, I think I told you this. But I was working on Will and Grace with with somebody who worked on show, And we went after to his house after a taping one night, and we got super, super, super stoned, and will know No. This won't be cut. Yeah. So we had super super super stone. And he he said, look, I got a copy of Castaway. I got the DVD. Let's fast forward it to the plane crash because the effects are so crazy. Let's get totally high and watch, like, how do they do that? Right? And so we so he just moved in this house. It was this brand new equipment. And we're and I'm sitting in the back of his screening room, and he's up front. He just moved into this crazy houses, gorgeous, and he had no idea how his own equipment work. And so he seemed to the backseat and he can't get the DVD to play. And I said, oh, no. That's is that a Sony? It's totally high out of mind. I goes, is that a Sony? Because yeah. I go, oh, they're voice activated. Those are the new ones. You don't even know what have. You have to speak the name of the movie into the machine after you put it You have to speak the name of the movie into the machine after you put it in. Because what are you talking about? I go just listen to me. You have to say the name of the movie as you put it into the DVD player. He's like, are you serious? I go a hundred percent I just read about these. So he turns back to the machine with his back to me, and he goes cast away. And it didn't play, and he waited to beat, and he did it again. He goes, cast away. And I you turned behind me. I was I couldn't breathe. I was laughing. So I don't wanna wait. It's gonna wait. Bob Demekais on that. He he he he never cuts to the outside of the plane. That's one of the reasons why that that plane crashes as good. It's just from the perspective of inside the plane. Yeah. No. I like God kind of stuff there. That's Bob. Now, Tom, with all of your incredible set experience, was that what drew you? Was it part of what drew you to the director's chair to just just the the effort to sort of streamline things because you knew probably more than a lot of the directors you may have been working with. No. I think directing in that becomes sort of a bit of an ego thing because you you become convinced that you know more than you. Action we do. But, Jason, seriously. Jim, then you try it and you're like, oh my god. This is hard. I believe every actor should direct. I think every director should have to act. think we should all be writing and producing because you find out how hard it is to do that other job. Yeah. Sure. From an actors perspective, it's like, you know, you got somebody saying, that was pretty good. Tried again. And you want to say to him, do you realize I'm on a horse weeping because my dog you you wanna say to him, do you realize I'm on a horse, weeping because my dog died and and I'm trying to remember six pages of dialogue at the same. You do. You realize it's a little harder than it is of realize it's little harder than it is. Let's try it again. That along with the same thing of an actor saying, hey, we're gonna shoot this or what? Are we shooting or what? Right. You you have to realize that everybody has nine million things going on inside their head. And then also we'll look, we're all story then and also, well, look, we're all story tellers. At some point, we we can have a sense of what might fit into our mouths a little bit better and maybe some options. It goes back to the thing Dan Sullivan always said, which have an idea in your pocket, you know, have something that you can come out and say, this isn't on the page, but let me let me show you something else. Let's So since you have directed, when you do come to the set as an actor with an idea in your pocket, are you sensitive to that there might actually be a a plan in place that that director and that crew has been working on for weeks and that your idea might might might disassemble the house of my son. There might not be room for it. So then you try it once and they say don't do that. And so and then you don't do it. Right. I know it's pretty pretty rep relatively easy stuff. Is is that desire to direct still still burning in you? Or I can't say that I have the instinctive powers of being a director as an can't say that I have the instinctive powers of being a director as an actor. I think I know what I wanna do. Yeah. Read it. And I think, 0II know what direction I'll go to directing Isaiah Director who acquires a fidelity and a patience and an ability to communicate that after I've done it, for the I've directed two feature films. I've directed a number of episodes of the mini series that we've done, and I like those. Because I I wrote them more I wrote on them at the same time. But I I think I think directors more so then then then myself's inaccurate. They're they're born into it. You know, you have to think it's the greatest job in the world. Yeah. And oftentimes, it's not. Yeah. Do you enjoy the producing part of it all with with what what you guys don't really produce? Well, but you guys churn out. It's really you shouldn't fluff over the It's the alliances that I make with other people that really do all the work. But the amount of your you incredibly prolific as as a producer, you and and Gary and Great to know. California. I mean, it's it's you've employed an incredible amount of people. You've put a lot of product out there. That's not easy and that's incredibly admirable. Well, I'm very lucky because we have extremely good people. And we we do this, you know, we have a kind of like a clubhouse office where we lean in each other's doorway and say, you know, Is this really a feature film, guys? I'm not so sure. It's a feature film. Should it be like a twelve point many series and dead so we can really examine the theme and then then you make nothing but a ton of alliances. But here's I'm not a producer because this is what producers do every day. They get on the phone, and they try to convince somebody to do something they do not want to do. Right? Or they tell somebody on the phone that there's no way that they are going to do what that person on the phone really wants. That's pretty much that. Alright. It's that it's that daikon. Right? You know, always just say, sure. No matter no matter what they're saying. Right. We'll be right be right back. Thanks to liquid Ivy for their support In my daily routine, will I, I do sweat and I lose fluids specifically to liquid IV for their support. In my daily routine, Will, I I do sweat. And I lose fluids -- Mhmm. -- specifically electrolytes. And I believe liquid I V can help me with that is that I can't believe that we're in this And I believe liquid IV can help me with that. Is that correct? I can't believe that we're in this area. 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This This episode of Smartlist is brought to you by McDonald's probably serving communities since episode of Smart List is brought to you by McDonald's proudly serving communities since nineteen sixty five. So one of my favorite things is those days when I go to pick up my kids early from school because they've got like a doctor's appointment or an eye appointment or they've got to do something that means that they get out school, and it feels like we're kind of playing hooky together, which is really fun. Right. And invariably on those days when I pick them up, and then I'll where do you wanna go lunch? My boys will always first off go, can we go to My boys will always first off go, can we go McDonald's? And my answer is always yes, because you know that And my answer is always yes because you know that experience and I remember having that experience when I was a kid of like going with my dad or my mom, like, going to McDonald's on that kind of free borrowed time in the middle of the week. And nine times out of ten 10. When you bring your kids to those McDonald's you're sitting inside Sean you bring your kids to those McDonald's who's sitting inside. Hayes. Yeah. That's exactly exactly right. Sean Hayes is in there with a program of hand and a chicken McNugget in the Sure this is in there. Well, you can burger my hand in a chicken mcnugget in the other. Yeah. Well, they're generally in your mouth. They're not really in your hand much. It's true. true. They don't spend a lot of time in your They don't spend a lot of time in your hand. Let's be Let's honest. And McDonald's you, you like It, McDonald's, you you like it. Right? No. No. Sean, let me be really clear about this. Yeah. When it comes to McDonald's it comes to McDonald's -- yeah. I'm loving loving it. And now back to the show. Let me ask you how how what is what's your feeling about this this transition that we're all in to a bit more of a streaming element, married with, you know, box office, you know, theatrical, you know, going to the theater, paying, paying some money for a ticket versus having it home. Do you what is your opinion on that as somebody in the business and then also as somebody who is a who is a viewer. Is it it do you like the fact that there is less pressure now, maybe with not having to open on the weekend because it's streaming. Do you think about that? That's a pressure that doesn't come upon the actor because look, the movies are always binary. They're either double zero or zero one. They either work or they do not work. Mhmm. And if they don't work, there's no amount of marketing or interviews that you can do. Right. On podcasts. In order to in order to change the zeitgeist, The the pressure remains absolute. The pressure is the speed of light in order to make a great story. The audience, I think, if I can pontificate just a little bit here -- Please do. -- doesn't care where they see it. The business does, the marketing, the producers, and the studios, and the the grand entertainment industrial complex, you know. They would like things to be exactly as they were, but we have a business that is forever changing. Back in nineteen eighty, when you guys were still in junior high school, and the concept of home video was just beginning. Here's a story that goes back a long way. When we were the the first year that Peter and I were in Bush and Buddies, a VHS tape machine, a player at home, cost about four thousand dollars. Yeah. Wow. And the only people that had them were incredibly wealthy rich people in the Three quarter inch for two hundred. Well, wasn't that by that time, VHS was just beginning. And in neighborhood, maybe a guy named, Doug would open up Doug's video rental shop SH0PPE. Right. And and and on one side of one side of the rental space would be HS, tapes, and on the other side would be a smaller collection of beta, Sony beta max. And eventually, beta went away, and it was all just VHS. And by the time, I think the next year VHS machines were only like eighteen hundred dollars and then everybody was renting. And the concept that you could it was great, of course, to be able to record shows after you went through this arcane kind of like process of on off recording timing up. But the bigger thing was, is that if you had kids and you had a VHS of Dumbo, you know, they would get up in the morning on their own and put in put in dumbo and you you didn't have to get up. This this was huge. And the here we are in two thousand twenty one, and the industry is going through something akin to that change because guess what? As Gary Gotsman, my partner at Playtone said, you know, sitting at home and watching something on your TV, is not that bad. Right. Right. Right. Right. You know, Tom, you said to me years ago, you said, you know what, Sean, the business is always changing and you have to adapt and change with it. Not as an actor or the craft of of creating things. Just you have to keep an open mind and go with the flow of it. Otherwise, what? And if you fight it, you're just And why didn't you take that advice? Why didn't you do it? Yeah. What's happened there, Sean, because now you're reduced to hosting heartless Yeah. Why didn't you you're shy because now you're reduced to host What did you start with podcast? Is it heartless? It's heartless. Heartless. You're known as known as dumbo, the host of weirdness. What do you Very lucky We were very lucky at Playtone because one our one of our first deals was at HBO, and this was old school HBO. You know, no commercials. You could say anything you wanted to. Well, there was no language. There was no there was no and at that point, HBO doing so doing a series or a movie or many series on HBO. That was the gold standard. Yeah. You've had seemed to so you've had all the freedom in the world. And now you have even more about all the freedom in the world, but it still comes down to this very basic requirement. You've got to be putting out a an awfully good product. Otherwise, it will disappear into the mist. Like many of my early films. Thanks, guys. Oh, no, no, no, No. No. No. No. But how have you not I'm surprised because they it seems like they've tried to gobble up everybody. How have you not as when did Marvel call you and say, Tom, we need you to to play, you know, doctor universe And, you know, we need you to do twelve films and you have to play Doctor Universe. Did that ever happen? Because here's the problem. I first of all, they've never called me once. I can't believe that. No. No. Never. And I think that if one of these days, they will, And they'll say, is there any way you would consider playing the secretary of defense? Yeah. mean, you're at the fifty five. A guy who comes and says, please, help us all for man. We can't we can't survive. I'll be one of those guys. Right. Right. I don't get to play the punk songs. But God God bless you because you still make the kinds of films. You have continued in an era where where most features are, you know, the feature film market is dominated by these huge Some of those are great. When we did it in a blood? No. I'm saying they're great, and I have a lot of friends who do them in the middle. Great, but some of them I said some I said some, but some of them are good, and I we all have friends who we adore and who are super talented who make those. I'm not saying that. But there is it seems like a shrinking market for films that stand on their own because it's a great story and has a great cast of and you seem to be one of those people, you're in a very unique position that you're still making those films, which I think is Awesome. We we chastise we chastised j j Abrams. We were like, go and make some comedies, We were like, go and make some comedies. J j, you know, we were giving him because he wants to. But, you know, it's because Tom, because you because Tom, you are us and you have maintained being us. You as first famous and is successful if you as you have become for as long as you have been. You have still stayed very grounded, it seems a normal, and I would imagine that that is just something you're stuck with from when you were a little kid, and you probably got a couple of parents to thank for that, I would imagine. My parents divorced when I was five years old guy, parents divorced when I was five years old guys. Where'd I go, Jason? Where'd I fucking go? This is why I'm not getting the nominations. This is where Sean really does his research. He he would know that. Yeah. Tom, I don't know this. What are you what did your what did your folks think about you getting into the business tree, as I call it? You know, I started doing it for fun in high school because I can't couldn't believe that you could go and do plays in high school and get credit for it. This is school. That's I remember specifically thinking that in the first time I walked into a drama class. And I did it because some friends of mine from junior high had been in the plays. And I just said, what? Mhmm. I can come to school and do this Mhmm. Well, this is screwing around. Man, this is this is this is goofing off in a mess. I felt the exact same way. I was like, oh my god. Everybody's just laughing. This is great. My both my, my dad who, and eventually my mom, cause we lived in different both my my dad who and and eventually my mom because we lived in different places. When my mom came and saw me and stuff, they just they just thought, well, this is just wonderful. You know, listen. Look what Tommy found. Right? No. No. Sean, you've talked about that. You did. You just said you had that same thing you just said you had that same thing, right, where you were like, this is amazing. This is so much fun, and I can't believe we get to do this at 5678, and Then I hit it hit it, Sean. Hey. Now Sean, Yes. When you did you did promises, promises on Thank you everybody. Pause We're never brought it up. It's weird. We never made it to And it was a and it was a big hit. And you said something to me because Sean and I see each other -- Oh. -- socially. You know, not just on this podcast. So after you had done promises, promises, And it was huge because you played the piano on stage and you did all this stuff. It was a it was a big Broadway hit. Right? A few a number of musicians And I said, are you going to do it again? Do you have the desire to get up and do another Broadway show? And you said something that was I I swear him. I swear to God, the only person I heard make the same sort of I swear to god, the only person I heard make the same sort of a reference, are you ready for this? Mhmm. I read it as a quote from Lawrence Okay. You said I'm not sure I have the fire in the belly. Yes. In order to get up and do aid performances or something. And I remember when Laurence Olivier was older, And he was always asked, well, will you ever get up on at the national? Again, what happened? He says here. No, because it requires a stronger heart. And he wasn't talking about medically. He was talking about all the effort that goes in the fire in the belly. Well, Sean, We could do the eight shows a you would do the eight shows a week. Remember you talked you've we've talked a lot about promises, promises. But you said something the same that you were like, I do it you did it for nine months or a year. How long did you do it for? A year. A year. A year? Were you saying you similar thing that you said to Tom? You said the same thing. I said, would you do it again? And you said, I don't know if I have it in me -- Yeah. -- five, six -- Seven, eight. -- and then you just I No. No. It's true, Tom. You know, because and I relayed that to you about about the constant work ethic you have to jump from movie to movie to movie to movie over these decades. And and they're all great and their and your work like Jason said, it's always always fantastic. You always You always committed. You're always in it. And and I I switched that that question back to you about filmmaking. Is do you still have the fire in the belly to travel and get up at five and stay in this hotel and that hotel? And and and you said, yeah, because it's what it's what I love to do. And Yeah. I do. Yeah. There's no other way of putting it. There is there is look, it's more fun than fun. That was something that I learned a long time to go I got my job at the Great Lakes Shakespeare Festival. Work in the theater is more fun than fun. And I thought, well, yeah, this is a this is a great way to to to spend your day. It's not just a lifestyle or, you know, life's work. It's a it's a life. I love I love that. And now listen, out of all of the your entire repertoire -- Yeah. -- all of your credits. Is there one aspect of what is your favorite movie? Jesus. Right? No. No. No. Is there one movie or experience that was extra special to you that will always stick in your brain? You know, I will say, look, yes, They they all are in so many way. Look, I've never had a rotten time making movie. I've always come away from a movie saying, I can't believe they pay me to do this. That was that was fed. Despite the discomfort in the five in the morning, a little harder at the age of sixty five, I guess. But the the experience of making that the movie, that thing you do. Mhmm. I casted with a bunch of friends. We had a great time. It was the beginning of beginning of the company that I've formed. Oh, great. I love that movie. With Gary Gutman and everybody else down at Playtone. I I could do that again and again. Again, that was Was that the first film you directed? That was the first not the first directing gig I had. It was the first feature film. Yeah. And it was it had music in it, and it was very it was very personal because it was set in nineteen sixty four. So it was But you know, every every gig is magnificent. The the ones that don't and maybe disappoint a little bit. Or is the ones where you don't get to spend enough time doing it? Like, I was just I just did two weeks with Wes Anderson in Spain, with a Wes Anderson Repertory Company, and that was fantastic. And I was bummed out. We gotta leave. We've we've shot out my role. I gotta I gotta go now. I'd like to like to link her for a little bit. I just got to do a couple days with her buddy, Tycho, YTT, and it was just the greatest experience. And then it was just, we did a show for HBO and then I just did his movie and I was like, these were the, it was like the greatest, most fun And then it was just I we did a show for HBO, and then I just did his movie. And I was, like, these were the it was, like, the greatest most fun month And then I'm like, oh, that's over. Yeah. And and that was I just wanna go and play with that game. I can't don't we don't we get to have that ninety day experience here somewhere, you know, you're sounding something out and getting up in eleven? Well, you've given us not ninety days, but a solid hour of your very, very valuable time. Yes. Thank you so much. Thank you. On behalf you on behalf of of of these two fellow smartless folks as well as everyone in America and the world for -- Mhmm. -- providing us all these little worlds that that you have created that we all to live in, and they've also a podcast award for second bananas or third bananas that you, Jason, and I will be will. Yeah. For I will and I will go battle for that one. You have to ask questions like, what's your favorite movie? Yeah. You know, you've gotta you you got a monopoly on that. You got it all, but would that say that in Canada, this is known as Will Arnott's SmartGlass. That's true. It's true. Wait. Why? Number one podcast in Canada. I think I just got voted candidate's favorite son. I'm not but I'm putting it out there. In case anybody wants to latch onto that and start making that a thing, I'm happy to. Well, it's a delight talking to you guys. You too, Tom. Thank you. I'm saying yes. As light as far as Tom, I just and words don't express how I feel. I'm such a very kind. Very guys. And you'd listen. Good luck on the is there a name for this award yet? It's The iHeartRadio the iHeartRadio award. It's the or it might be called the aorta. Whoa, up against? That would be a big question there. Oh, that's a great that's a great question. Hardcore history may be up against hardcore history. Mhmm. Fingers crossed. It's so great to see you. Thanks, Tom. Thanks so much. It's good to see you guys. Hope that we'll we'll hang at all those places that people like us end up. Bad. Yeah. For sure. Alright. Take care, guys. Alright. Thank you so much. Love to you. Bye bye. Bye, Tom. I think he's gonna think he's gonna make it. That guy's got some charisma. Jason, let me just say this. You've been complaining, for example, you've been saying, man, great guess, you guys. And then you just decided you pulled out one of these What I've now now referred to is because I don't use this word. You is the the topper card. I'm a now call it the topper card. He's he's he's that. He's he's a blue chip, that one. Right? Oh, man. What a delight. mean, he's just like he does have that thing, and I I kept trying to figure out a way to ask him this without him deflecting as he does so well, so humbly. And and I just kinda bailed on it because I knew he would just wouldn't like, he's just got that he's he is us. He is completely personable and authentic. He is he's every bit a leader that you'd want him to be, but he doesn't seem like he's too arrogant or cocky too. Like, I don't I I don't know how does he You mean us as a as an audience? Not that's three. Yes. Like, he's just, like, he's the guy you wanna follow and are never annoyed you know, even watching him or I don't know. It's it's it's it's been so consistent. Yeah. I don't See myself as an every see myself as an every man. Oh, yeah. Not. No, I'm No. No. I see my I'm special. Yeah. Well -- Yeah. -- you see something like that. Yeah. I'm like the boss of the every man. You know? So when I'm there, when I see time coming in, I'm like, it's great spending time with one of my employees. I hope he keeps staying as prolific as he hope he keeps staying as prolific as he is. I mean, what he's doing, like, what, at least a film a year? Same same here. That's what I meant about the movies he makes. I love that he keeps making movies that are like It just seems like not a lot of other people are making in -- Got it. -- his new movie, which we talked on, what is the the Finch? Yeah. Finn? No, not the No. Not the fin. Just finch. Fitch. The bird. Yeah. Fitch, it's on Apple, and it's basically When is it on Apple? When is it? It's not on it it's not on now? First week of November. November fifth. First week November fifth. November fifth? Yeah. So yeah. So he's doing this movie, Finch. And the sequel is gonna be the Finch I heard. Yeah. No. It's called fincher. It's called fincher. Oh, it's called fincher. And Dave Mortcher's directing it. Yeah. David Finks right now. Yeah. Are you kidding Dude, this is Showbiz is incredible. I know. It's it's everything is aligned. Mhmm. But it's about it's him and a dog and a robot. I mean, this is not the start of a joke. But, like, could anybody pull off a high wire act like that? But they do walk into bar. There is one bar. Walk into a bar. Be fair. In fairness, they walk But I saw the trailer two two with my almost thirteen year old, and we watched it and looked at each other. We're like, We're like, yeah, we watched it. Yeah. And don't you feel like he's kind of, like, our ambassador, not just for the business and not just for Hollywood, not just for Los Angeles, but, like, America too. Absolutely. So, like, Quintessentially American and -- Yeah. -- like, he's one of the few people we can on both sides, if you will, can agree on. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Wait. What's the other side? I just met, like, both like, I would never mind everybody in America can agree. Oh, those both sides. Yeah. Like, Lishan, we are not political. Sorry. Yeah. Please. What are you trying what are you trying do? Was your award to you're trying to wade me into deep water and then you're gonna take me down like a crocodile and keep me under or I'll tell you. Bye. Can't fucking bail out, like, you can't roll it yourself out. Yeah. You can't be saved by your own bail. We've used every word that you could do with Bye. No. Not at all. No. No. No. No. See, you were just trying to bail yourself out of a secret weapon. Yeah. But you said, You can't use by as as a as a as some kind of, you know, instrument to bail out your sinking ship. Why not? I just did. Yeah. I guess you can. Sorry. There is no rule on that. You're right. You can. But do you think that when he first moved oh, boy. Oh, no. Sorry. Josh, let's hear it. Come on. One of the questions I did get to here was he was nineteen seventy nine. He made a move to New York city. Right. And you were trying to be an actor full time. So I wonder if he was just trying to take a bite out of the apple. Bye bye. I'm not complimented with this. Bye. I'm not the least if there were why we were happening. I'm gonna I'm gonna Bye. Bye. Smartless is one hundred percent organic and artisanally handcrafted by Bennett Barbourco. Michael Brandt Terry, and Rob Unger. Smart, glass, Our next episode will be out in a week wherever you listen to podcasts or you can listen to it right now early on Amazon Music or early and add free subscribing to wonder plus in Apple Podcasts or the wonder app. Hey. I'm Cassie de Peckel. The host of Wonderry show against the odds. In our next season, I'm telling the story of a rugby team whose small plane crash in the Andes Mountains in the fall of nineteen seventy two. They're stranded on the snow covered side of a mountain with no hope of rescue, and have to do the unthinkable to survive. They battle starvation, hypothermia, blizzards, and avalanches for more than two months before finally finding the strength to try and save themselves. It's an incredible story of survival in the elements. And two young men's attempt to hike to civilization and get them all out. Follow against the odds on Apple podcasts, Amazon Music, or wherever you're listening now.