0:00

Hi folks, how are you? To

0:02

be honest, I'm quite surprised as

0:04

to how much my voice is

0:06

intact after attending the BAFTAs yesterday

0:08

and getting very overexcited by some of

0:11

the winners. Great to see Purrthings pick

0:13

up some awards, great to see Oppenheimer

0:16

pick up an award. Mia McKenna-Bruce

0:18

as well, the EE Wisingstar. Anyway,

0:21

it was a wonderful night, great celebrations and great

0:23

after parties as well, I have to add. But

0:26

listen, our latest guest on sound tracking is

0:29

composer Laura Cartman who joined

0:31

me to discuss her Oscar

0:33

nominated score for American Fiction.

0:36

Written and directed by first timer Cord

0:38

Jefferson, who picked up a BAFTA last

0:40

night, it follows a

0:43

frustrated novelist professor who

0:45

writes an outlandish satire

0:47

of stereotypical black books,

0:49

only for it to be mistaken by

0:51

the liberal elite for series literature. Laura's

0:54

score draws heavily on brilliant jazz themes

0:56

and will begin with her cue Winner.

1:24

Laura's score is Hey

2:08

Laura, how are you? I'm great thanks,

2:10

how are you? I'm great, I'm great.

2:12

Thank you so much for your time.

2:14

Oh I'm so glad to be here,

2:16

are you kidding? I mean there was

2:18

so much to talk to you about

2:21

in terms of when it comes to

2:23

film and music and can I just

2:25

really cued us to you for setting

2:28

up the Alliance for Women Film Composers

2:30

as well. In terms of something

2:32

I really try and do as much

2:34

as I can on this podcast is

2:37

give the female composers a voice

2:39

and a platform and we've been lucky

2:41

that we've done some live events where

2:43

we've recorded things at the BFI and

2:46

things so it's been great. So yeah,

2:48

it's wonderful when you hear of great things

2:50

that people are doing like yourself. You

2:52

know it's funny because I've been thinking about this a

2:54

little bit today. I think that people

2:57

don't think of composers looking like

2:59

this. Every part of

3:02

what this is, I think that there

3:04

is kind of a vision or has

3:06

been. It's the same thing like my

3:08

wife's mother teaches the course in science.

3:10

She's a professor, very high level professor.

3:13

First day of an undergraduate class, she asked

3:15

them to draw what they think a scientist

3:17

looks like and they all draw Einstein. The

3:20

women too like what you're

3:22

doing in terms of getting a diverse

3:25

group out there and people to

3:27

see and hear what

3:29

we are, what we do is really,

3:31

really important because we've just got to

3:33

broaden that perspective and continue to do so.

3:36

Absolutely and congratulations on

3:38

your Oscar nomination as

3:40

well. I know. I

3:43

know. I know. Like

3:45

literally, Nora and I looked at each

3:47

other this weekend, my wife and I and it was just

3:49

like, oh my God, we've been

3:51

running around doing things like shopping figure out

3:53

what I'm going to wear, all that kind

3:56

of stuff and then like this

3:58

weekend was the first weekend where we kind

4:00

of like, it's big.

4:02

It's so deserved. And

4:04

it's, you know, what's wonderful as well. I mean,

4:06

I really want to hear about your kind

4:08

of journey with Cord in the film. And it's

4:11

such a big part of the experience

4:13

of watching the film. It's

4:15

so important to the way that

4:17

the film makes you feel and the way

4:20

that you travel through the film and the

4:22

emotions that you feel throughout the film. It's

4:24

such an important character in

4:26

the film. So congratulations. Thanks

4:28

so much. I mean, you know, this

4:31

journey that I've been

4:33

on with composing for film has

4:35

always been fascinating, mostly

4:37

because of this bond that you

4:39

have with the audience where the

4:42

audience kind of, for some

4:44

reason, and I never figured out

4:46

why, expects music, right? It's like

4:48

when music starts in the back

4:50

of a conversation or in a

4:52

scene or whatever, it's not like,

4:54

oh my god, what's that? It's

4:56

something that's expected as part of

4:58

the vernacular of filmmaking. And it's

5:00

so cool to be able to

5:02

not so cool. It's a life's

5:05

work to figure out how

5:07

to really support the

5:09

emotional resonance of a film with

5:11

music. It continues to

5:14

interest me very much. How

5:16

did American fiction come to be

5:19

presented to you? And what were the first

5:21

conversations you had about what they were looking for? What

5:23

Caud was looking for? Was he very specific? Talk

5:25

to me a little bit about that.

5:27

Well, it all started out in the

5:29

way that many, many unsuccessful

5:33

attempts to get a movie started

5:35

out and that my agents said, will you

5:37

make a reel up? Meaning, will you

5:39

put together music that seems appropriate for

5:41

a quote unquote jazzy movie? So I

5:44

put the reel and I put

5:46

like, I put jazz on there, right? Just like

5:48

some really cool stuff that I'd done that was

5:50

really straight off jazz. He said, no, not jazz,

5:52

jazzy. And so, okay, okay. So

5:54

kind of film, scoring jazz, you know, so

5:57

that I did that and then they liked it, you

5:59

know. So but I think

6:01

also what happened that I think was maybe

6:03

more powerful than all of that is I

6:06

have been scoring the Marvels for director

6:08

Nia Da Costa and Nia and Cord

6:10

were friends and I think Cord reached

6:12

Nia and Nia said she's great. And

6:15

so that's the funny thing, it's like

6:17

a twist and turn. You never know

6:19

how something is going to come to you or how you're going

6:21

to get involved and working on

6:24

the Marvels which on the surface seems like

6:26

such different kind of content. You know, it's

6:28

a huge movie, it's big budget, big orchestra

6:30

and then this is a little gem. So

6:33

it happened that way and I met

6:36

with Cord and the team Ben

6:39

Leclerc and Hilda Retslow who's

6:41

the editor and you

6:44

know, we just started talking about what the

6:46

possibilities were for the music in this and

6:48

of course jazz was I don't

6:51

want to say the mandate but was the obvious thing.

6:54

I mean the lead character's name is

6:56

Thelonious Ellison, his nickname is Monk and

6:58

of course that takes you right to

7:01

Thelonious Monk, one of the

7:03

great composers and jazz pianist and

7:05

so then you really start to think about

7:07

okay, do we do Monk? Is there a

7:09

departure from Monk? How can

7:11

we capture the essence

7:14

of Monk? Do we want to capture the

7:16

essence of Monk? And so those are all

7:18

the conversations that started happening. Thank

7:47

you. Did

8:32

you ever have a conversation about what

8:34

it was about what you'd originally sent

8:36

over that he connected with and stuff

8:38

as well? Because it is interesting, isn't

8:41

that whole idea of like people's interpretation

8:43

of a story or a

8:45

character or a narrative or themes,

8:47

you know, it's kind of everybody's

8:50

perspective initially is different.

8:52

So but you had one specific

8:55

idea and connection that was

8:58

the kind of opening of the door to then go and

9:00

to be part of this whole project. When

9:02

I first screened the film and I did so alone

9:04

before I had the job, they had put

9:06

one of my pieces in as temp and

9:09

I thought, oh, okay, well, that's a good

9:11

sign. That means something worked

9:13

for them. But really,

9:16

it's a very interesting project

9:18

to score because it's not as

9:21

obvious as it might seem. It's

9:23

actually pretty hard. Basically,

9:25

the temporary score was all classic

9:27

jazz. And when you hear

9:29

those songs, they

9:31

feel great. You know, there are things

9:34

that I'm so familiar with their their

9:36

beloved beloved pieces of music. The

9:38

problem is, of course, they're not, you

9:40

know, specifically crafted for the film and

9:43

the film changes emotions very

9:45

quickly. So you have to be really

9:47

musically gymnastic, right? You've got to

9:49

be able to go from like

9:52

a tragedy to neutral to comedy

9:54

very, very, very, very, very fast, you

9:56

know, within a like, you know, there's

9:58

there's one scene in the film. where there's a very

10:02

sad moment. You know what, I'm just going

10:04

to spoil it because everybody needs to go see

10:06

the movie. There's a funeral and you're in this

10:08

kind of funeral scene and then this guy walks

10:11

across in a and

10:13

is a pest and immediately

10:15

you have to change course and

10:17

score. You've got to go from something that's very sad

10:19

to something that is kind of comedic. So

10:22

it needed to have a score. So then

10:24

the question is, well, how can you do

10:26

a score and how can it feel like

10:28

jazz but also be able to do all

10:30

the things that a film score has to

10:32

do? Absolutely. Because I feel

10:34

like almost that kind of free

10:36

form nature of a lot of

10:39

it is really replicates the kind

10:41

of almost free form emotion that

10:43

comes with all the different storylines that are

10:45

going on in a way. You know, in terms of when

10:48

you have Sterling's character kind

10:50

of Clifford pop up or the kind

10:52

of Tracy's character and then she's gone

10:54

and all, you know, it's kind of like it's so,

10:57

the whole thing is so unique and kind of,

10:59

and I didn't know much about the film before

11:02

I watched it about a month ago now. It's

11:04

so stayed with me and kind of the

11:06

rhythm of it and the kind of just the

11:09

unique nature of it as well. And I think

11:11

so much of that is down to the fact

11:13

that the music is there and it's not kind

11:16

of low in the mix. It's

11:18

kind of, it's like I'm here and I'm

11:20

here for a reason kind of thing. I'm

11:22

here for you fans. I'm here for you.

11:25

The key to the whole thing was

11:27

two major themes which is the monk

11:29

theme which is the bio,

11:31

which is

11:33

kind of craggy, which is a

11:36

five four meter, an odd meter and

11:38

it's got the humor and it's

11:40

got the quirkiness of monk in

11:43

this particular context. It also goes

11:45

to someplace kind of

11:47

beautiful so that when

11:49

we get to his romantic life with Coraline,

11:52

it can transform into

11:55

that. Transcription

12:01

by Brendan

14:00

structurally near almost any way. Thank

14:30

you. You

15:13

have such a beautiful, varied collection of work that you've worked

15:15

on. Not just film but all the other things you have

15:17

done up to this point in your career. Jazz

15:21

is very much at the heart of a lot of that. So

15:25

is this a kind of dream scenario

15:27

in a way in terms of being

15:30

able to bring all that to this particular

15:32

medium? Yeah, I think it really was. We

15:36

have a joke around here in LA

15:38

which is don't let the jazz

15:40

police come out and get you. It's

15:42

like for those of us

15:44

who've kind of grown up and trained in

15:47

jazz, sometimes you need to mitigate that

15:49

a little bit or at least cover

15:51

it up so people don't know. But

15:53

on this one I could be loud, proud

15:55

and out loud about jazz. And

16:00

it's funny because we were talking about the Marvels. One

16:02

of the major characters in the Marvels is

16:05

the villain. And for the villain, I really

16:07

wrote a jazzy thing. But

16:09

I don't think anybody perceives it that way.

16:11

But in the end credit, I had

16:14

Elena Penderhues, who was the flute player

16:16

in American fiction, literally jammed

16:18

over this da, dee, da, da, ba, ba,

16:20

ba, da, da, da, da, da. She's like

16:22

playing all over the place. It's

16:24

wacky. And I remember when we got through the playback

16:26

of the film and Kevin Feige, of course, was in

16:29

the room. He said, oh, it's so great to hear

16:31

that theme in its full-blown thing. And I thought, oh

16:33

my god. I got

16:35

all this way without him noticing

16:37

that there's like big time jazz

16:39

and the secretly hidden in the

16:42

context of scary

16:44

music. But yeah, it sneaks

16:46

in a lot of places. But in this

16:48

place, I could be really very

16:51

on the surface about it. I also loved

16:53

the W.S. series

16:55

as well. I've

16:58

got two boys. We were kind of obsessed

17:01

with that. It's such a great concept. It's

17:03

such a great idea because it kind

17:05

of gives your brain the opportunity

17:08

to kind of go places with

17:10

all these characters and

17:12

worlds and planets and universities that we

17:14

know is so clever. But

17:17

it's the same thing. You know, like everybody

17:20

thinks that, I mean, not everybody thinks, but

17:22

there's this whole concept that you're doing an independent

17:24

film and then you're doing this for Marvel and

17:26

it's so different. No, it's not. I

17:29

mean, what if there's thematic too?

17:31

You know, you've got Peggy Carter

17:33

and how she relates to Captain

17:35

America, you know. And so what's

17:38

the musical thematic material that's associated

17:40

with that? It's much the same

17:42

journey that we take with

17:44

the Ellison's in American fiction.

17:47

I mean, Marvel is also a family and

17:49

it's very dysfunctional way at

17:51

times, I suppose, you know, if you talk

17:53

about people like killing each other, whatever, but

17:55

we digress. I love the MCU

17:58

as well. It's

19:00

wonderful that you're able to kind

19:02

of straddle so many worlds in terms of what

19:04

you create for whether it

19:07

be a big Marvel production

19:09

or whether it be video games or

19:11

whether it be kind of stuff for

19:13

like BBC Studios or

19:15

Microsoft and all that kind of stuff. It's

19:17

great that you can kind of navigate all

19:19

these different worlds. Never a dull moment I

19:21

imagine. I'll tell you there's actually a reason

19:24

for that and this will be the first

19:26

time that I've said this in any

19:28

of the many interviews that I've done this fall. For

19:32

a lot of women composers and a lot

19:34

of underrepresented composers too not

19:37

just women, the walls are

19:39

tall and they've been very, very

19:41

hard, impossible to break down. You

19:43

can't break down the wall but

19:45

there is something you can do

19:48

as that is you can walk

19:50

around it. And so basically my

19:52

life has been as a music

19:54

maker a series of pivots and

19:57

I've been fortunate enough to be able to be

19:59

sort of open. minded and

20:01

to be capable of

20:03

navigating the pivots that

20:05

I've had to make. Now, I love

20:08

writing music for video games. We're doing

20:10

two games right now. It's super fun

20:12

and it's got different technical challenges. You

20:15

know, video games came out of a

20:17

pivot that I made, you know, some

20:19

20 years ago when I was

20:22

working on television movies and they kind of went

20:24

away. And so you've got to figure out how

20:26

to do the next thing. And so it's not

20:28

like a building block, it's

20:31

not like a step up, step, step, step.

20:33

It's like, will you do this? And it's

20:35

like, okay, let's do that. Let's go around

20:37

this. Okay, let's do that. And

20:39

so I think that I've been, you

20:41

know, now it's culminating and really a kind

20:44

of an excellent year of doing a lot

20:47

of different things. And then because they've been

20:49

high visibility projects, people have noticed. But this

20:51

is something that I've been doing for a

20:53

long time and a lot of my colleagues

20:56

also from other underrepresented groups have been

20:58

doing as well. As a performer as well,

21:00

you know, performing your music, you know, do

21:03

you get enough opportunity to do that? I

21:05

mean, one of my favorite things is, you

21:07

know, is going to live

21:09

playback sometimes of when you get the opportunity

21:12

to be in a theater and you know,

21:14

you've got an orchestra there playing the score.

21:17

Occasionally I get the chance to go down to Abbey

21:19

Road or Air Studios to watch

21:21

the orchestra being recorded. And then sometimes,

21:24

just now and again, the film

21:26

companies will, you know, pay out for an

21:28

experience for people to come and watch

21:31

a few suites be performed and things

21:33

like that. And any of those opportunities

21:35

are just joyous. But for you,

21:37

do you get the opportunity to, I mean, outside

21:39

of this kind of, you know, the

21:41

moving image world as well of performing?

21:44

How important is that for you? You

21:46

know, it's a really, really funny question,

21:49

another question that I haven't been asked. So, you

21:51

know, we had the privilege of recording at Abbey

21:53

Road this year and it was absolutely divine, the

21:55

best musicians in the world. I've

21:57

always been sort of uncomfortable.

22:00

with performing, but

22:02

have always secretly wanted to do

22:04

it. And I

22:06

remember when I was

22:09

a student at Fontainebleau and I was in

22:11

France and I was studying with Nadi Boulanger

22:13

at that point before, right before she died

22:15

and I met a guy and

22:17

you know, he was a pianist and he

22:19

said, well come to Paris and you know and

22:22

so I took the train with him and we went to

22:24

the left bank and I went

22:27

to, we first went to a little tiny club and

22:29

I started singing and then he said,

22:31

let's go someplace else and then we went to this

22:33

huge club and there were all these people

22:35

like, like it was like, it felt like there were 2,000

22:38

people of the audience. Maybe there were like

22:40

300 people and I started scat singing

22:42

and I couldn't remember any of the words, you know

22:45

and it was like, it was just amazing. It's one of

22:47

the best memories of my whole life. You know, I was

22:49

19 years old. It was great. And a week

22:52

ago Thursday, we

22:55

performed some of the

22:57

music from American Fiction and I took

22:59

the mic and sang along with it

23:01

just for fun. Just to

23:03

see what it would be like and it was

23:05

really fun. And this project has

23:07

been very, very special for me because I

23:09

have done a lot of playing and performing

23:12

in it. Almost not on

23:14

purpose because Cord was a

23:16

first-time director. It was really important

23:18

to me that all the demos

23:20

sounded good because he hadn't had

23:23

that experience of listening to kind of stuff

23:25

where you say, oh, don't worry, we'll record

23:27

it later and you know, we'll do all

23:29

that stuff. It's like everything, I wanted everything

23:31

to sound good off the bat so then

23:33

he could decide whether it worked

23:35

for him with picture or not. It wasn't like, oh,

23:37

this will really work later, you know, that kind

23:40

of thing. So we just started recording a lot

23:42

and because the piano is right there and because

23:44

I have fingers, you know, I sat

23:46

down and I played a lot of stuff

23:48

and then it became kind of a thing.

23:50

And for the stuff that I really didn't

23:53

like my own playing on, I brought in

23:55

Patrice Rushen, who's just an amazing, amazing player.

23:57

And then I had this band of people

23:59

I've worked with. for a while plus Elena

24:01

Penderhues but we've been outperforming it a little

24:03

bit. I'm going to do more of it

24:05

and it's fun. It's really

24:08

fun. It's like I have

24:10

a mixed relationship with it because I'm so used to

24:12

kind of being on my

24:14

own and quiet at home and then you

24:16

go out there but I think I like

24:18

it. You've got like an entire wall of

24:20

instruments behind you that you need to play.

24:22

Yes, I do. I

24:24

do. I think maybe I

24:26

won't play any of those in front of people like

24:29

there's a saxophone in there.

24:31

I think probably should not be touched but the

24:33

piano and a little bit of singing here and

24:35

there, maybe I'll do that. It's crazy when

24:37

you say about this film being Kord's first

24:40

feature film that is

24:42

insane. The achievement of it is just

24:45

extraordinary really. He's super smart.

24:47

It wasn't like working

24:49

with someone who didn't know what they were doing.

24:51

I mean he knew what he was doing. Yes,

24:53

it's so accomplished just in terms of all

24:55

three just you can feel the kind of

24:58

the freedom that the cast have been given as

25:00

well to kind of really flesh

25:03

out those. Not that they

25:05

needed it because the script I imagine was brilliant

25:07

but just kind of that's part of bringing in

25:10

great talent into roles is

25:12

because you know they're going

25:14

to bring something to that.

25:16

It's so fantastic to watch it really

25:18

is. So true. And I think

25:20

the thing that Kord did, he

25:23

surrounded himself by really good people. He

25:26

let those people do what they do well

25:29

and then he would shape it

25:31

and that's what any great

25:33

director, executive producer and television

25:35

you know what good

25:38

makers of film do. They

25:41

bring in the right people, let them do

25:43

their thing really and then decide whether

25:45

it works for them or not. I

25:48

mean Jeffrey's one of those beautiful talents.

25:50

He's so captivating to watch and it's

25:52

just wonderful to see

25:54

him in this kind of lead you

25:57

know and him kind of just oh it's great.

26:00

He's wonderful and screen. That's what I

26:02

love about his performances is he's

26:05

just commanding and he really, and

26:07

every one of his gestures, everything

26:10

he does means something.

26:12

You know, and as a

26:14

composer, that's really, really powerful because

26:16

if he raises an eyebrow, if

26:19

he moves his mouth or tilts his head, he's

26:22

a physical actor but his motions are

26:24

small. So it's kind of like how

26:27

it gives you something to dance with and to

26:29

play with. When you were

26:31

working on those kind of final pieces in music,

26:33

were you very much right into

26:35

performance then as well? Yeah,

26:38

really we were because there's

26:41

a lot of dialogue in the movie

26:43

and I started to think about especially

26:45

Erica Alexandra plays Coraline and Jeffrey, I

26:47

mean they sound like saxophones. Erica's got

26:49

this kind of edge to her voice,

26:52

almost a break in it that sounds

26:54

like the way Coltrane would play, you

26:56

know, and Jeffrey of course has

26:58

a resident baritone. So you

27:01

know, oftentimes you

27:04

would have like an alternation between

27:06

the sax or the flute and

27:08

then the rhythm section would back,

27:10

you know, Jeffrey or Erica and

27:12

then we would come back into

27:14

the band. So I did think of

27:17

them as being a part of our

27:19

group. Thank

27:55

you. That's

28:00

so great. I love that. You need to

28:03

name some instruments after them. That's the

28:05

next thing. I will. I will. You

28:08

said you're working on a couple

28:10

of games as well. What about in

28:12

terms of other projects, in terms of filming

28:15

TV, have you got some other stuff potentially

28:18

on the go? Yeah, we do. We've got

28:20

the two video games. I've got another film

28:22

that's going to be coming up quite soon.

28:25

And then I'm also

28:27

working really excited about this

28:30

on a musical that basically

28:33

we have licensed the rights to a

28:35

film called Dance Girl Dance. It

28:37

was directed by Dorothy Arzner. You probably

28:39

don't know who she was, but

28:42

she was the only woman directing

28:44

in Hollywood during the Golden Age.

28:46

And in this film is Lucille

28:48

Ball and Maureen O'Hara. I see

28:50

you looking her up. Yeah, she's

28:52

massive and she's been totally, she

28:54

is totally unknown. So we've

28:56

gotten the rights to this fantastic movie.

28:59

We're going to musicalize it. And then

29:01

we've heard story as a woman

29:03

working in Hollywood in the 40s and an

29:05

out lesbian at the

29:07

same time, living her life and

29:11

being one of the go-to directors

29:13

in Hollywood. Fantastic. I

29:15

love the films that kind of unearth those

29:17

things. I mean, I really enjoyed

29:19

Babylon, Damien Chiselle's film. I love that kind

29:21

of. And he's another one who loves this

29:23

jazz. I mean, whiplash for me. That's the

29:25

thing is like I find with certain films,

29:28

you know, the world of jazz is one

29:30

that I don't know enough about. But I

29:32

love filming when film kind of like welcomes

29:34

me into that world in a way. It's

29:36

just, you know, whether it was Birdman

29:38

or whiplash and now your film as well. It's

29:41

just kind of like, oh, I want to know

29:43

more. I want to be part of this gang

29:45

because this is great. It makes me feel awesome.

29:48

So it's so great when film can kind of

29:50

really give you a kind of

29:52

an insight or a kind of connection or

29:54

hold it an arm to you, pull you

29:56

back into that world. It's lovely. I think

29:59

there's so much. of the history of

30:01

jazz with film. I mean, so

30:03

many of the composers in the 60s, you

30:06

know, Lalo Shiffrin, Michelle Legrand,

30:09

you know, John Williams, John Williams at

30:11

that time, were really writing a

30:13

jazz, you know, Henry Mancini, how could

30:16

I forget him? You know, that this

30:18

was kind of the essence of what

30:20

so many scores really played with this

30:22

idea of jazz and film and film

30:24

music. So it's not a new concept,

30:26

you know, it just is one that

30:28

we haven't heard a lot out of

30:30

in the past few years. I mean,

30:32

with the exception of your right, Dave

30:34

Manciselle's stuff. Laura, it's so great to

30:37

chat to you. And I'm so excited

30:39

to see what's next. I hope you

30:41

bring your performing self

30:43

to London and give us a little bit

30:45

of insight into this for sure. Oh, thank

30:47

you. Get to Roni Scott's on there in

30:49

Soho and do a little performance for us.

30:52

That would be amazing. Wouldn't that be fun?

30:54

Yeah, and I really appreciate your time. And

30:56

I wish you all the best of luck

30:58

and huge congratulations. Thank you

31:00

so much. It's a wonderful project. It really

31:02

is quite fantastic. Edith, thank you so much

31:04

for having me on. I'm going to chat

31:06

to you. You too, Roni. Thank

31:27

you. Thank

31:57

you. From

32:08

the score to American Fiction that's Love All Of

32:10

You, rounding off your first sound tracking

32:12

of the week with Laura Kirtman. A

32:16

huge thanks to Laura for taking the time to

32:18

talk to me, American Fiction is in cinemas

32:20

now and you should definitely go and seek

32:22

it out, it's brilliant. If you want to

32:25

hear my chats with Damien Chazelle and Justin

32:27

Hurwitz about the scores for their collaborations together,

32:29

head to Edith bowman.com or wherever you get

32:31

your pods. Please do leave

32:33

us a rating and review us whilst

32:36

you're there. Follow us on our socials

32:38

we're at Sound Tracking UK and please

32:40

don't forget our YouTube channel for loads

32:42

of extra video content. Now you

32:44

won't have to wait too long for more of us

32:46

as we have a bonus episode of Sound Tracking coming

32:48

very soon with Fernando Marielas

32:50

and Ed Cortes to celebrate

32:53

the 21st anniversary release of

32:55

City of God, insanity

32:57

code, the treasure of the day.

33:26

Thank you.

34:00

Thank you.