0:02

Fred: You know, i think there's a lot of vanity and other foibles that come to my attention frequently, both my own and other people's, but I also think that it's beautiful that people do it, because it's not easy.

0:14

Announcer: Welcome to Story and Craft. Announcer: Now here's your host, Marc Preston.

0:18

Marc: Hey, how's it going? Marc: I'm Marc Preston back, another episode of Story and Craft And I know, i know, i know it's been a few weeks.

0:27

Marc: You're going, Marc, where have you been? Marc: I've been working on some very cool, fun projects but also very time consuming projects, so it's been a moment, but we're back.

0:38

Marc: I've been jazzed, i've been looking forward to it because I know I've got like really cool guests coming up.

0:44

Marc: Kind of like today, actor Fred Melamed Little sit down to talk story with one of the most recognizable character actors out there Men in films, kind of like in a world Hale Caesar, the Coen Brothers movie, the Spy Who Dumped Me.

1:01

Marc: Also TV Brooklyn Nine-Nine The Morning Show, Barry WandaVision, his new show on Hulu, super Crazy, funny.

1:09

Marc: It is called Reboot. Marc: Got Paul Reiser in that one.

1:13

Marc: Johnny Knoxville Cast is awesome, super funny.

1:17

Marc: Again, reboot the show. Marc: We'll be talking about it.

1:20

Marc: And don't forget the website, storyandcraftpod.com.

1:24

Marc: Once again, storyandcraftpod.com.

1:28

Marc: Everything you want to learn about the show, what's going on, past episodes, just head there.

1:33

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1:47

Marc: If you're loving what you're hearing, that would be super cool, all right, so let's get after it.

1:52

Marc: Today is Fred Melamed Day, right here on Story and Craft.

1:59

Marc: Thank you so much for taking time out to meet with me today.

2:03

Marc: I so appreciate it. Marc: It's my pleasure. Marc: Where are you?

2:06

Marc: where are you joining me from? Fred: today I'm in Valley Village, California, which is in the Valley part of the northern suburb of Los Angeles.

2:15

Marc: I know you're a New York kid, but are you?

2:17

Marc: is LA your home base now? Fred: It is.

2:21

Fred: I've lived in LA for about just under 10 years, but you're right that I was born and spent most of my life in New York.

2:27

Marc: For a New York guy. Marc: You had all those great delis. Marc: Just a personal question what's it like getting in LA?

2:31

Marc: Where do you like to frequent to grab? Marc: is it like Cantors, or is there anywhere else you like to go?

2:38

Fred: You know Nate Nals was the kind of standard answer I do like Cantors.

2:44

Fred: I'm not a huge deli eater actually, but it's funny.

2:50

Fred: People often ask me do I miss New York?

2:54

Fred: And the truth is that New York has changed so vastly from the time that I lived there and from the time that I remember growing up there that there's precious little of it left to miss anymore.

3:04

Fred: All the neighborhoods that I was attached to when I was a kid are gone.

3:10

Fred: New York has become in many ways like any other city.

3:13

Fred: It's just a big homogenous kind of mass.

3:17

Fred: Also, new York was always expensive, even when I was a kid, but it was possible for actors, artists, poets, weirdos of different stripes to kind of eke out a living there.

3:30

Fred: Although it was difficult, they could do it And that added to the intellectual sort of muscle of the city and also a lot of its vitality.

3:42

Fred: But that's really changed. Marc: I was surprised that you're hearing about people on Broadway.

3:46

Marc: I think the perception is, if you're on Broadway, you're doing great.

3:50

Marc: I was speaking with Melissa O'Neill. Marc: She's on the show the rookie.

3:53

Marc: I was just talking, she was on Broadway. Marc: She's like yeah, she's barely eking it out And so maybe it's kind of a misnomer that Broadway means you've made it financially, you've made it professionally, yeah.

4:07

Fred: I think it's more of a Marc of recognition than it is actually unless you're kind of a name star than an indication of your wealth.

4:21

Fred: It's funny I remember I have a good friend, a woman director, writer, actress named Lake Bell, and some years back she was offered the chance to do a show on Broadway And she was wondering whether she should do that or take a movie that was coming her way.

4:41

Fred: And I made the point that even as a relatively humble star of movies and television, you can work pretty much when you want to on Broadway.

4:55

Fred: The reverse is not true. Fred: The power of media is so vast that if people know you from television or from movies, it's a much easier jump for you to do a show on Broadway than it is if you're a Broadway regular trying to go the other way.

5:13

Marc: Speaking with someone. Marc: The other day and I have always wanted to have an opportunity to sit down with Sam Rockwell, always just enjoyed his work.

5:20

Marc: I'd spoken with two people and they both said, yeah, we're going to go see him.

5:23

Marc: He's on Broadway. Marc: It seems like there is a lot of support from the theater folks or the folks that are in film or whatever that came from theater to kind of support their friends who are in performances and will travel to come see that.

5:35

Marc: So, going back real quick, you mentioned Lake Bell.

5:38

Marc: I got to tell you Sam Soto is a voiceover guy, one of my favorite characters ever in the film.

5:47

Marc: It was so thank you. Marc: That was so fun, i guess for people that did, i know you do.

5:54

Marc: Vo is part of your ecosystem, without a doubt, but I love the fact Lake Bell took on the side and showcased the characters and voiceover and that whole idea of the thing, or it's back, the idea that voiceover folks are vastly anonymous but we hear them all the time.

6:17

Marc: How did that role come together for you? Marc: You just knew her and you're like, hey, we need my dad in this film.

6:20

Marc: How did that come to be? Fred: No, i didn't know her.

6:23

Fred: I didn't know her at all. Fred: It was an interesting thing.

6:26

Fred: I had done a film in 2008.

6:29

Fred: I made a film with the Coen brothers called A Serious Man, which kind of put me back For many years.

6:35

Fred: I won't bore you with the whole trajectory of my work as an actor, but for about over 20 years all I did was voice work.

6:43

Fred: That was all From the early 80s really, almost until 2000,.

6:51

Fred: That was practically all I did. Fred: I would do an occasional movie, but I had a very, very bad experience on Broadway doing the original medical production of Amadeus Horrible, crippling, stage fright, absolutely awful.

7:07

Fred: I thought, well, i've made this horrible mistake. Fred: I went to Yale Drama School, i'll be an actor, but people said it's so hard and I said I'll show you.

7:14

Fred: And then I found I really didn't like acting on stage.

7:17

Fred: I felt very humiliated because I had trained to do that.

7:20

Fred: About what year is this? Fred: roughly, i got out of Drama School in 1981.

7:24

Fred: This realization is 1983.

7:28

Fred: End of 1983, and I finished the run of Amadeus.

7:31

Fred: End of 83, beginning of 84. Fred: Anyway, i had an agent, harry Abrams, who was a prominent in the voiceover world.

7:43

Fred: So I said I'd like to do voiceovers And this was when the voiceover world was very different than it is today.

7:49

Fred: Oh my God, yeah, it was almost 40 years ago.

7:54

Fred: There weren't the throngs of people overpowering the gates.

8:03

Fred: It was a very small coterie of people who did 90% of the work.

8:07

Fred: There were about 150 people who did 90% of the work And everybody knew everybody.

8:11

Marc: back then Nobody knew who was doing the work.

8:14

Fred: Well, there were no home studios. Fred: So therefore you'd see people either at ad agencies or movie studios or recording studios.

8:22

Fred: You'd see there was a social element to it because there was no such thing as internet-based recording in those days.

8:30

Fred: Anyway, for about 20 years of my life, that was all I did, and occasionally I would do a movie.

8:39

Fred: Like there were a couple of casting directors who liked me And they would offer me stuff.

8:46

Fred: I wouldn't audition, i would get very spoiled And I made a great deal of money as a young single guy without responsibilities in the voiceover world.

8:56

Fred: I was the voice of MCI, mercedes-benz, sony, consumer Products, burger King, lots and lots of advertising and then lots of promos, as well USA Network as the voice of CBS Sports.

9:10

Fred: For many years, anyway, that was all I did.

9:14

Fred: And then later I got married, i had children And when I started having responsibilities there was a big kind of sea change in the voiceover world And they started wanting people with real-sounding voices rather than dramatic James Earl Jonesy voices.

9:31

Fred: And all of a sudden I found myself kind of non-grata after many years of being quite prominent in the voiceover world, and by then it was rough because I had a family and all that stuff.

9:46

Fred: So my agent called me one day.

9:52

Fred: This is after. Fred: A serious man came out and said do you know who Lake Bell is?

9:55

Fred: And I said well, i know her name, but I don't really know who she is.

9:59

Fred: He said well, she's an actress and she's left a script here for you.

10:02

Fred: Now this is when I was living in New York. Fred: Lake was already living out in California, but she had come to New York.

10:07

Fred: My agent said she's left the script with a note for you.

10:11

Fred: So I went to my agent's office and picked up the script and read the note And it was a lovely handwritten letter saying you know, my name is Lake Bell.

10:18

Fred: I don't know if you're familiar with me or not, but I've written this script and I just have a feeling that you'd be really good in this role.

10:24

Fred: Please read it and tell me what you think. Fred: And she didn't know at the time that I had spent so many years telling those feels, but she thought that it was plausible that I would be a voiceover guy.

10:36

Fred: So I read it and I really liked it. Fred: I really liked the script and I did it.

10:43

Fred: I came out to California to do it. Fred: This is before I lived in California, but I wasn't aware at the time that there was this enormous groundswell of people yearning to be voice actors.

10:55

Fred: You know, this was a shock to me And in fact when we made the movie the movie was kind of more about the family, this family that happens to work in this particular you know kind of small area.

11:13

Fred: It's funny. Fred: I always thought the voiceover world was kind of this people acted like they were in the movie business, who were in it, but it was really this adjunct, separate thing.

11:23

Fred: It was a separate movie business but still, you know, they drove Maserati's big ones and they read the box office, you know doings of movies and so on.

11:34

Fred: But it was kind of a separate, the separate little world.

11:38

Fred: But it was a great, enjoyable experience for me because the people in it were great And it was a great character because he was so obviously so vain and so full of himself and he at the same time, in his own screwy way, he actually did love his daughters.

11:55

Marc: Oh, i love that There is a piece in there where you're trying to say basically and I know it's her words that she wrote but you're basically trying to say there is a reality, this is not the easiest business, this is you're trying to protect her from herself.

12:08

Marc: I think a lot of people who work in the entertainment industry, if their kids are enthusiastic about it, they're like pump your brakes for a moment.

12:16

Marc: You know you really want to get into this. Marc: I love the relationship and just there was that kind of tension there, but you could feel the love.

12:24

Marc: I just love the character. Marc: It's, without doubt, my favorite one of the film and actually seeing, like a friend of my, joe Sipriano and the great late, great Marc Elliott.

12:31

Fred: Oh sure. Marc: Marc Elliott, another one of those guys from back in the day, and Marc Grau, who I'm sure you've been in the studio at least a couple of times.

12:40

Fred: Those guys all became my fast friends Joe Sipriano, Marc Grau.

12:46

Fred: We got to know each other well doing that movie and I've continued to be friends with them for these many years, which I'm very happy about.

12:53

Marc: Now I think that one of the things that's funny is you put, you touched on that.

12:57

Marc: I've been God, i've been doing this like 30, 31 years and coaching talent for about 20.

13:03

Marc: And I've noticed people would come like actors. Marc: You know, hey, man, i want to.

13:05

Marc: You know, i got the skills. Marc: I want to kind of transfer that to VO and I'm like great, i think.

13:11

Marc: When you got in, i think what a lot of people don't understand movie business.

13:15

Marc: You always needed the agent, you know, And now with VO was like that.

13:20

Marc: But now people, internet, home studio, they can carve out a career.

13:26

Marc: So it is interesting to see how many people just I think a lot of people view it like a side hustle, you know, and they're quickly educated.

13:34

Fred: Yeah, it's an utterly different business, utterly different, i mean it's.

13:39

Fred: There's no point in belaboring how the world has changed.

13:44

Fred: It makes you older than you already are. Fred: But you know, when I was doing a lot of voiceover work and enjoyed it, it was entirely different.

13:55

Fred: First of all, it was all union. Fred: True, there was nobody working on union, which made an enormous difference I mean, i was a millionaire when I was in my 30s from doing it.

14:07

Fred: Nowadays there's a lot more work, but it's divided up among many, many, many more people and the rates are dramatically less.

14:17

Fred: And there's thousands of people auditioning for so many jobs And people, because there are no union standards, there's always people fighting to do jobs for less and less and less, and that, you know, that hasn't, from my perspective, that hasn't been good for the business at all.

14:32

Fred: But you know, time marches on and that's kind of the way it is.

14:36

Fred: Also, it's also true that I think what they're looking for has changed and tastes have changed.

14:46

Fred: So to me to be worth using, i've always asked to have some qualities that are identifiable and that are compelling.

14:59

Fred: An awful lot of what I hear on television anyway seems to not distinguish itself.

15:09

Fred: It seems like everybody sounds like everybody else.

15:12

Fred: Look, obviously, some people of whom that isn't true, but an awful lot of, it seems very, very, very homogenized and not as interesting to me.

15:23

Marc: You know it's funny you say that because I think that a lot of people do chase after that the homogenized sound, of which there's a pendulum that swings between the big voices to the unpolished sound, and it's funny.

15:34

Marc: I was speaking with the director, ariel Vroman, and he said on film that's one of the first things he pays attention to is the voice, the sound of the character.

15:42

Marc: He said I don't care how beautiful they are if the way they sound doesn't fit the character, he doesn't really think they're going to fit.

15:50

Marc: But I'm curious though you did mention, to kind of hit rewind on the origin stories you mentioned, you went to Yale.

15:56

Marc: You had a pretty substantial stage bit of stage training.

16:00

Marc: Am I accurate in saying that? Fred: You are absolutely.

16:04

Fred: I'm not sure how much good it did, but I was trained in the theater as people In fact, when I went to Yale.

16:10

Fred: I went to Yale, which is a graduate program, drama program from 1978 to 1981, so I got out in 81, there was absolutely no training offered whatsoever for television or movies as part of your training.

16:26

Fred: The presumption probably arrogant and incorrect presumption was that if you were a competent stage actor you would have no problem transitioning over to other media.

16:35

Fred: But I don't really think that's true. Marc: Now you mentioned the stage fright thing, though How did?

16:42

Marc: it seems almost exceptionally ironic that you would have this training from a great school.

16:52

Marc: What kind of fire that up? Marc: Or in 83, you said gosh, this is just not my thing.

16:56

Marc: you know the stage. Fred: My own neuroses, my own inner conflicts.

17:00

Fred: I think, like many people, i had chosen the profession that I chose with some partially unhealthy pretty unhealthy reasons, and I think that it became clear to me.

17:17

Fred: Well, i'll explain it a little more personally.

17:22

Fred: So I think there are some people who feel innately lovable They have the good fortune of feeling innately lovable And there are other people and I count myself among the secondary camp of people who feel at some level that it always must be earned that they must in some respect be extremely beautiful, extremely intelligent, extremely articulate, extremely talented, extremely charming, extremely compelling in some way.

17:52

Fred: Otherwise they're more or less indispensable.

17:55

Fred: I think that was a kind of a dynamic of my upbringing And I think I chose to be an actor because of that to some measure.

18:11

Fred: I was very close to my father growing up. Fred: My father was a lovely guy.

18:14

Fred: He was a producer, early television producer, very sweet, nice man.

18:19

Fred: But there was a quality of depression about him always And I kind of thought that it was my life's work to make life seem like a winnable proposition for him.

18:29

Fred: I thought that's what I'm here on earth for.

18:33

Marc: You think the depression, the feeling that he had, the way you interpreted it, do you think that was because of the success with work, wasn't enough?

18:40

Marc: It was just this generalized sense. Marc: That's what you're saying.

18:43

Fred: Yeah, i don't think you.

18:45

Fred: I think people who have not accomplished what they want work-wise tend to assign that threshold as being the thing.

18:55

Fred: There's always a thing that you're going to get, that's going to make you happy, that's going to complete you.

18:59

Fred: I'm going to finally get married, i'm going to finally become a millionaire, i'm going to finally get on Broadway, i'm going to finally admit that I'm gay, i'm going to finally do this or that And then, finally, i will be happy.

19:11

Fred: Well, the truth is that there is no signal point like that.

19:15

Fred: Whatever you achieve, the sense of emptiness that people have most people have doesn't derive from a lack of accomplishment and therefore accomplishing things doesn't actually ameliorate it.

19:28

Fred: It has to do with other things Early psychodynamic forces on you as a child usually, and how they bounce off the way what you're born with.

19:39

Fred: So I don't think his depression, the depressed sort of outlook that he had, derived from the fact that he wasn't successful enough.

19:48

Fred: I think it had to do with deeper things in his upbringing that I can only guess at.

19:55

Marc: Well, he's from that generation where he probably didn't discuss that stuff too much.

20:00

Marc: He didn't really discuss, And he in particular, yeah, Yeah, I'll talk with my kids and I'll say listen, I'm doing this for you, with you, because this is what happened when I was a kid and I was like that's not going to work really well.

20:13

Marc: So when I have kids, I'm not going to do that. Marc: So I try to explain to them some of the you know they're mature, they're a couple of them are college kids now, But back then your father probably I'm assuming the generation probably just didn't discuss those internal things too much.

20:29

Fred: Well, especially. Fred: I mean I think you're right that in general, in his generation you know he was World War II generation such things were not openly discussed, and I think he was particularly elusive, secretive about some of his internal life.

20:46

Fred: I think that was just his nature, anyway, to bring this back around.

20:57

Fred: So I think I took a lot of that into my acting and I thought it's the actor's job to be kind of superhuman.

21:05

Fred: And I remember going to the theater and feeling this great weight that I had this responsibility, and I began to resent the audience, which is something you sure don't want to do, right?

21:19

Fred: And I felt horrible because I thought you know here, you know I've trained to do this and I said it's what I want to do and people are paying a lot of money for these tickets and it's a great work, it's a great play, and yet all my effort is going to just getting myself through this play instead of being great at it, because it's so hard for me to just do it.

21:38

Fred: And when I finished the run of it, i finished the show and then I thought, well, i don't want to set foot on stage again, i really don't.

21:48

Fred: And I felt extremely defeated by it and very upset by it.

21:52

Fred: But I needed to make a living and so I got lucky in the voice of a world.

21:57

Fred: I got a couple of big accounts. Fred: I got Conoco Oil right out of the chute, which at the time was a big oil company, and then I got MCI, which nobody remembers, which was a phone company.

22:06

Marc: My first big national actually was GTE with Patrick Stewart back in 93.

22:12

Marc: I say GTE as I could try to explain to my kids. Marc: You had to actually get your own separate long distance service and they're like what's long distance?

22:20

Marc: But yeah, that was a big deal back then to have that kind of an account.

22:24

Fred: Yeah, no, it was great. Fred: I was very lucky and I did very well, especially for a person with no response.

22:30

Fred: I was a single guy, a Dinemini, major financial responsibilities, so it was from that point of view it was great.

22:39

Fred: It was artistically, i was writing and doing some other things which kind of satisfied some of my needs.

22:45

Fred: But I was more concerned that I was making a living and that I was, within that small world, kind of a big player.

22:54

Fred: But then around the early 2000s that suddenly ceased to be.

23:00

Fred: There was this massive change. Fred: But to go back to what we were saying, talking about Lake and that movie, i really didn't understand when that movie was made quite how much the ranks were swollen with people trying to get in.

23:18

Fred: So I started to do it. Fred: Every two or three years there'd be an article in TV Guide that said the millionaire voices you never see, and then for maybe a month there'd be people trying to get into it and then it would quiet down.

23:32

Fred: But it's become this kind of entirely different thing now.

23:37

Fred: I often wonder why people are so attracted to it.

23:40

Fred: I think part of it is because there are people who are intimidated by the way that they look.

23:45

Fred: They don't feel very confident about how they look, but they know that they can do different things with their voices And some people, including me, feel freer orally than they do AU orally than they do physically.

24:00

Fred: I think that's also part of it. Fred: Also, i think people like the idea this kind of probably incorrect idea that it's not so hard.

24:10

Fred: You know you can be your own boss and wear pajamas and stuff like that.

24:14

Fred: I think any career where you're responsible for being hired by yourself is a lot of work You wind up having to do.

24:24

Fred: You know the job becomes about getting jobs.

24:26

Marc: Well, what I tell my students and the people that approach me on occasion I say, listen, there was an.

24:31

Marc: I even wrote a little article about it once and I said you know, the equipment is so much less to buy it The ability to get on the internet and find out people to hire you.

24:40

Marc: You can actually carve a career out without having one of the big agents, and I think it's just a creative thing that I think people perceive as it being within reach.

24:54

Marc: You know, especially like you mentioned, the nature of the voices that people want, and advertising, or in promos or in different genres, is different.

25:03

Marc: But I don't know where it came from.

25:06

Marc: And I tell folks, unless you're really willing to commit yourself emotionally, artistically and everything and really put in the time, sell baskets on Etsy or something.

25:15

Marc: You know this is not a side hustle.

25:18

Marc: You know you're going to be very discouraged very quickly. Marc: And then there are people out there like yourself or Joseph Riano and those guys we mentioned, that they're around for decades because they adapt and they're.

25:29

Marc: You know they got that a special sauce.

25:32

Marc: You know if you will. Fred: And most of those guys actually are now doing a lot of teaching because even they, even their diet of work, has been much reduced because the work has been so spread out And there are major companies now big major companies that don't want to pay union rates.

25:50

Fred: So therefore they're hiring people, you know, who are working out of a garage somewhere.

25:56

Fred: You know, i don't begrudge people's desire to make a living, however they want to do it, but for me, you know, somebody says, well, i'm a professional voiceover artist.

26:08

Fred: Well, they're telling the truth. Fred: But that's like saying I'm a professional musician and I play in a band every night and we play bar mitzvahs or weddings, or, you know, maybe once a while we play in a bar.

26:19

Fred: Well, that guy's a professional musician and he can even be a very good musician, but that's a slogging life that I wouldn't want.

26:29

Fred: So, you know, is it better to work in a dentist's office, you know, and make $50,000 a year, $60,000 a year?

26:37

Fred: or is it better to be a voiceover artist and do that?

26:40

Fred: I don't know. Fred: It's, you know, but for me, i always I don't think I would feel satisfied unless I had the larger stage to work on.

26:52

Marc: Yeah, yeah, it was funny. Marc: I think I started in voiceover roughly about $92, $93, somewhere in there, and my mentor, a gentleman at Dallas University at the time, was a voice of American Airlines.

27:02

Marc: Back then you could just do regional work or even in a big metropolitan area you can carve out an amazing career.

27:09

Marc: He I remember he was just talking about how in the 80s it was money hand over fist And we're talking about early 90s, which was still going pretty well back then.

27:20

Marc: But that's really interesting to have a chance to speak with someone who did have a chance to enjoy a career early on doing just voiceover.

27:29

Marc: But you're to say it's a success story.

27:32

Marc: It's a grotesque understatement, but you've had equal success, i feel, on camera.

27:37

Marc: I mean, anytime you show up. Marc: This is not meant to stroke you at all, but anytime you show up in something, i'm like, oh, okay, it's going to get good.

27:45

Marc: Just in some way, one division. Marc: I had no idea you were on the show, my son, he's getting me all schooled up on the Marvel universe And I was like, wait, there's Fred right.

27:53

Marc: I was like, okay, this is going to get good, this is going to get interesting, you know, or you know you're, oh gosh, the spy who dumped me.

27:59

Marc: You being a bad guy is like, yes, okay, more of this, it's, it's.

28:03

Marc: I do adore seeing you show up, because there's always going to be a leveling up in that moment, i think And again, i'm not trying to stroke you, i'm just, like always, happy to see you arrive on screen.

28:12

Fred: Well, i appreciate you saying that. Fred: I mean, my whole thing is I want people, i want, i want to be, i want people to be entertained by what I do.

28:24

Fred: I want I want it to be enjoyable. Fred: Now, what constitutes entertainment is, you know, different for different people.

28:32

Fred: I'm on a show now called Barry I'm, i'm, we just started working this week on the second, my second season, therefore, season, but my second season on it, and that's a show It's on HBO or HBO Max, for those people that have streaming where it veers wildly between funny and harrowing.

28:53

Fred: Yes, it's, you know, but but, but Bill Hader, the guy who is the lead and also the writer, director of it, is able to walk that line with, to me, unbelievable skill.

29:07

Fred: So I always, you know, i to me, i, i, i, it's important to to that I be entertained when I watch something.

29:15

Fred: So I'm always, i'm always, i'm always hoping to sort of haunt the audience.

29:20

Fred: That's, you know, when something's really good, when I see a movie or a TV show or play or even read a book even read a book, that's really good.

29:29

Fred: It keeps replaying through my head, i keep thinking about it.

29:32

Fred: That's how I know that it's good. Fred: Yeah. Marc: I'm the exact same way.

29:35

Marc: If I see a movie that affects me some way, the whole next day it just pops into my mind.

29:38

Marc: There's something about it, a performance or a line or something like that.

29:41

Marc: That's funny. Marc: I'm the same way as you, Yeah.

29:43

Fred: And for me characters are the whole, are really the most interesting thing For me.

29:50

Fred: The characters are what really distinguishes something Like you know I've seen The Godfather God A Zillion Times.

29:58

Fred: You know I that's one of those movies where, even if it just happens to come on television, you know I'll just watch it.

30:03

Fred: I'll just stop whatever I'm doing and just watch it, even though I've seen it so many times.

30:08

Fred: But if you ask me to tell you the plot of The Godfather, i could only give you kind of a very general idea of the plot, of what actually happens.

30:16

Fred: But there are so many things, moments of characters, things that happen that I remember so vividly, and that's the characters.

30:26

Fred: So for me the story, the plot is kind of like this clothesline on which the characters are hung, But it's the characters that make that bring me back to things.

30:37

Fred: You know. Fred: It's the kind of human element of things.

30:40

Marc: Yeah, It's being a character. Marc: I mean I, I have only gotten through one season of Barry so far, but Henry Winkler, it is so nice to see him be an unpleasant person for once.

30:50

Fred: It's so interesting, isn't it? Marc: Yeah, it's.

30:53

Marc: It's like wait, that's not, that's not the Henry Winkler.

30:55

Marc: But you know it's almost for him to pull that off and everybody knows he's a mens.

30:59

Marc: You know is, is is a trick, but that's, that's a great show.

31:03

Fred: Yeah, i play his agent Did you come in at season three or, yes, this past season, the season.

31:09

Fred: That's the latest season and we just started the next season, just began it.

31:14

Fred: I knew Henry from before because we had done a show together called Children's Hospital.

31:18

Fred: And there was another man, alec Berg, that was one of the creators of Barry.

31:24

Fred: That I also knew because I had worked with him on Caribbean enthusiasm and some of the Sacha Baronan con films.

31:30

Fred: So it was very wonderful for me because I already knew a bunch of the people and it was great.

31:36

Fred: You're right that Henry is known you know aptly for being one of the sweetest, nicest people you'll ever encounter anywhere.

31:47

Fred: But it is great to see him play this kind of demi-jerk acting teacher with all of his selfishness and all that.

31:53

Fred: And I don't want to ruin it for people that may not have seen it.

31:56

Fred: But some other people who start off very nice or you might think they're very nice, notably Sally.

32:05

Fred: The character of Sally has a big.

32:08

Fred: As you go on she changes and one of the things that the writers of that show love to do is to confound the audience's expectations, but in a ways that actually makes sense.

32:20

Fred: So I have high praise for that show. Fred: I really love that show.

32:22

Marc: You always seem to get on really interesting ensembles.

32:25

Marc: I mean part of the story of your career that I enjoy so much is where you find you know you've had a chance to work with Woody Allen more than once, the Coen Brothers Do you make decisions on projects based upon What do you?

32:38

Marc: what is your criteria when you're looking to take a role?

32:42

Marc: What are the criteria you look at before you say yes? Fred: Well, there are a few different criteria.

32:48

Fred: One thing that's important to me is the people that I'm working with, so it was an opportunity to work with the Coens again, or somebody like Bill Hader or Paul Thomas Anderson, for example, who I love Now his father was a big VO guy.

33:07

Marc: He was indeed. Marc: Ernie Anderson has a great for people that haven't had chance to listen.

33:12

Marc: The Outtake Real Ernie Anderson's Outtake Real is so satisfying to listen to, especially her voice over the talent.

33:20

Marc: It's just like oh, yes, yes, you know that anyway, ernie Anderson was.

33:24

Marc: But yeah, i didn't mean to wrap you, i'm sorry, but you said Paul Thomas Anderson.

33:27

Marc: I'm thinking you know what a, what a nice dad I'd like to grow up with Ernie.

33:31

Marc: So your decision is who you get to work with.

33:34

Fred: That's one thing. Fred: Then there is the character, and in characters I'm always interested in people that are.

33:42

Fred: I'm interested in the opposites within people. Fred: I'm interested in people who are, who have contradictory things within them.

33:50

Fred: To give you an example the guy that you mentioned, sam Soto like Bill's character's father in In a World, is obviously, you know, vain and kind of narcissistic, but his feet are so clearly made of clay, he's so threatened that he can't even compete with his own daughter and he loves his daughter.

34:10

Fred: So it's interesting to me when people have inconsistencies, that's always a great thing to play a character that like that.

34:16

Fred: And then there's money to be considered. Fred: Now I have two no longer teenage 20 year old boys, twins and college and all that is going on, and I just got divorced about a year ago.

34:29

Fred: So money is not to be sneered at either.

34:33

Marc: Sorry, i don't mean to laugh. Marc: I'm kind of like the been there done that thing Yeah.

34:37

Fred: Yeah. Fred: So there's different piles and most actors have a pile of stuff that they do because they want to do it, because there's somebody they want to work with or it's a great script, and they have a pile of things that they do because they need to make some money And, if you're really lucky, you get a kind of a confluence between them and there's some projects that cover more than one base.

34:58

Fred: But I think most people are not aware of the fact that in movies, for example, you do a lot of a lot of people do a lot of movies for very little money, even very big stars, because the movies just can't afford.

35:12

Fred: I'm not talking about, you know, marvel movies, but I'm talking about movies that appeal to a more kind of artsy side of those artists.

35:25

Fred: They do them because they want to do them and they can't support big salaries.

35:29

Fred: And then they do other movies on which they get a big payday. Fred: But even really big, famous actors do a lot of stuff for very little.

35:34

Fred: Also, you're speaking of those life changes.

35:38

Marc: That's got to be an interesting time in your life right now. Marc: And I've got two kids at Loyola in New Orleans and she's 19.

35:44

Marc: My son's turning 18 shortly I'm going God, they're going to be 20.

35:47

Marc: And my youngest is still 16, so I still got a little bit of time.

35:52

Marc: And of course, i have a divorce and I know that's not where you are.

35:54

Marc: That's not easy. Fred: Now, when you say, of course I have a divorce, why do you say of course you have a divorce?

35:58

Fred: I mean, of course you have a divorce, you have to be divorced. Marc: Of course, with your divorce added into the equation.

36:04

Fred: My divorce. Fred: Oh yeah, yeah, I thought you were saying your divorce?

36:06

Marc: Oh yeah, that too, but but no, i know that it's of course that's never easy.

36:10

Marc: I'm sorry I probably did not enunciate properly, but the thing is you have all these life changes, so that's kind of a probably in a growth spot for you a little bit.

36:18

Marc: You know things are a little different. Marc: Are you looking at anything differently now?

36:22

Marc: Is it what kind of projects or experiences you want to be having right now in your career or personally?

36:27

Marc: Sure? Fred: I'm looking at several things different.

36:31

Fred: I'm looking at women differently, certainly Now that I'm unattached ogling might be the right, wrong word, but certainly a different.

36:42

Fred: Yeah, and I have a. Fred: You know I have some interest in particular.

36:47

Fred: you know one, but I won't bore the audience with that.

36:53

Fred: Yes, so that has changed. Fred: Of course divorces change things, financially certainly, and emotionally, there's no doubt about it.

37:00

Fred: You know I I'm a person who had certain problems, deficits in my early relationships with my parents, some problems in there, and I kind of thought when I'd have my own family I would strive, do my best to remedy those things and not, you know, and I felt like for a while I was successful at that and I was very gratified by it, and then it fell apart.

37:34

Fred: So it's a big adjustment to, you know, have to deal with it. Fred: I mean, obviously my children are still my children, my ex-wife is still around, but we were a happy family for a long time and it's quite an adjustment to have to have to have that, see that kind of fall away.

37:51

Fred: And you know we're still a family of sorts but we're much more dislocated than we were.

37:56

Fred: And you know I'm 66 years old and you know I didn't the idea of dragging my 66 year old ass out into the cold winds of the dating world did not particularly welcome me.

38:07

Marc: No laughing, believe me, i am, i'm here, with you speaking with a good friend who was going through the exact same thing And I said it's like getting back to a place you've never been And it's ironic because you're still a family of sorts.

38:19

Marc: You're single. Marc: You've been single before you've, but now you have kids, you have life experiences, so there's no, like I say, you can never go home.

38:25

Marc: I think that the concept of being single does change.

38:30

Marc: I was reading an article yesterday about people doing online dating and how that's changed the paradigm, and they said that there are more single guys now because more relationship, more people are seeking healthier relationships and they're a longer term or something to that effect.

38:45

Marc: You know you just it's Carpe Diem. Fred: You still have to enjoy the day in some shape, former fashion and well, certainly, but I do think that I think that the challenges of the last few years have not been good for the marriage Marcet.

38:58

Fred: When I had to at the end of the beginning of 2021, i had to find a divorce attorney, so I got myself a very good woman divorce attorney And when I first decided to hire her, she said just so, you know, you're our last case.

39:15

Fred: We have books full for like five years ahead.

39:17

Fred: There have been so many divorces since the lock the COVID lockdown that we literally can't take any more people.

39:24

Marc: That is, you know, but I feel for you, you know, much love too, because I know that, no matter how you carve it up, it's, it's an odyssey, but you know you come.

39:31

Marc: you always come out on the back end learning more about yourself, and I think that's that's the way I've tried to look at things.

39:37

Marc: you know, you know that's actually a question.

39:39

Marc: you were, you know you had a family, i believe.

39:43

Marc: if I read something, or maybe you heard you at one point in time, your sons, they were on the spectrum.

39:48

Marc: Am I, am I correct in saying that? Marc: And you've been a big advocate for that?

39:50

Fred: Yes, Yes, that's a that was a big, big part of of my life and our lives together.

39:57

Fred: I have twin sons that are will be 20 this year, one of whom has quite severe autism.

40:03

Fred: The other was was diagnosed with autism when he was younger, when he was quite young, but functionally it hardly affects him at all in any discernible way anymore And he's very, very high achiever and also very personable, very smart.

40:18

Fred: You know he really is doing great. Fred: So we had both ends of the spectrum in our in our family.

40:25

Fred: So that's, you know, that was a major factor in my, in me and my wife's life and decisions about where to live and all that stuff, and so we.

40:35

Marc: so you were living somewhere where you had great resources for the, for the, for your, son?

40:40

Fred: No, as a matter of no, we did not. Fred: What happened was we were living in Manhattan, in New York city, and we had a country house.

40:47

Fred: This is in the in the glory days of my my glory days of voiceover business, when I was the voice of CBS Sports.

40:53

Fred: I was the person who said the NFL on CBS, that guy.

40:57

Fred: So I had that job, that unbelievably good job, for about seven years I think, and I bought a house, a really nice house, out in Montauk, in the Hamptons, in the east end of on the east end of Long Island, and we had that as a country house and we had our, our, our apartment in Manhattan.

41:14

Fred: We'd go back and forth And I built a little. Fred: By this time people were building home studios, so I built a little studio into the house.

41:20

Fred: I had a studio both in New York and in the house in in Hamptons, and when our kids were diagnosed which was 2000, the beginning of 2004, there was such an avalanche of cases of autism in New York city that even though we were entitled to be able to get services for them, you couldn't get them.

41:42

Marc: Really. Fred: Um, there were just not enough people, Yeah, So, uh, we couldn't.

41:48

Fred: we were told to get one particular form of therapy called ABA therapy, a behaviorally oriented therapy.

41:53

Fred: that was the only one that was shown to really have, you know, significant positive effects.

42:00

Fred: But there weren't therapists available because in New York there were so many cases of autism.

42:05

Marc: I'd be so frustrating where you're, you're, you know you're sitting there.

42:07

Marc: You know I'm an actor. Marc: What am I? Marc: you know you're? Marc: you want somebody's professional to be able to guide you on what to do.

42:13

Fred: Right, and also for them to have a certain number of hours of therapy.

42:16

Fred: because we were told, you must get this and it's absolutely of of of prime importance that you get it quickly.

42:22

Fred: So we had this other house out on Long Island and there, in that county, which was a different county, suffolk County uh, the services were available.

42:31

Fred: So we moved full time out to that other house and raised our children there, uh, for the first 10 years of their lives.

42:40

Fred: um, precisely because we found a school out there that was great for both of them, uh, it, it served both kids that had developmental disabilities and also kids that were on the sort of genius scale.

42:51

Fred: So both of our, both of our ends, were covered by that school and they did wonderfully well there, but it only went, uh, as far as fifth grade, so, which prompted our move to California.

43:02

Marc: I had a good friend who, who? Marc: or I have a good friend whose uh son of guy's son's almost 30 now, uh, but when he was younger, one of the things that I remember her telling me that they wanted uh the people in the know had her do was have him watch older, uh, sit family, sit comp family.

43:18

Marc: I don't know where you could see families modeling behavior.

43:21

Marc: So that was a big thing for the, for the children, for him, for him to see is what are kind of a traditional family.

43:27

Marc: You know it's uh, it's it's different challenges, but you know it's um, you know I know different people.

43:33

Marc: As they say it's it's a spectrum. Marc: So people like even in your own home you had a spectrum of experiences, most certainly is, but are some of it?

43:41

Marc: you said they're doing the college thing or are they going for advanced education right now?

43:44

Fred: Well, one of them, uh, goes to Chapman University here in California and he's studying psychology, uh and and acting both.

43:51

Fred: He's been in a couple of movies. Fred: He's quite a good actor, but he decided he wants to be a psychologist.

43:55

Marc: He'll be working with some actors. Fred: I think he wanted to work with mentally ill people because it was a healthier population.

44:11

Fred: He's doing great and my other son the one who has autism is you know as much more serious goes to a special school strictly four people with autism and he graduated high school but now he's in kind of like post high school kind of vocational training, although he doesn't actually get too much vocation job preparation because I don't, he probably will not be able to handle a regular job, but he gets schooling in life skills, self-help, that kind of stuff, and he can continue there, i think, until he's 22.

44:41

Marc: You have a family member who went through something like that.

44:46

Marc: They've learned, you know the skills just interpersonal skills and like things like that and I know those programs really can work wonders because she feels great satisfaction with what she does.

44:57

Marc: Just a real quick question. Marc: One last question about kind of the origin stories.

45:00

Marc: So now you grew up, is your family more on the?

45:02

Marc: were they more orthodox maybe to the reform side of things?

45:05

Marc: growing up in New? Fred: York City. Fred: They completely made fun of it.

45:09

Fred: They thought it was a lot of hooey. Fred: My parents were old enough to have grown up in the Depression and they were, you know, lefties from the Depression era and then grownups in World War II.

45:26

Fred: So they were quite skeptical about religion.

45:31

Fred: Maybe I'm overstating it, but I mean I had no religious training.

45:35

Fred: I was at the age of 11, which is when you have to start Hebrew school if you're going to get Bar Mitzvah.

45:40

Fred: Usually I was asked do I want to have another day of school a week?

45:46

Fred: and Jesus five was more than I could handle anyway.

45:50

Fred: So I said no, i didn't. Fred: So I was never Bar Mitzvah, never had any religious education at all.

45:56

Fred: And I remember once asking my mother is God real?

46:03

Fred: And she said if you think God is real, then God is real.

46:07

Fred: If you don't think God is real, then God is not real.

46:09

Fred: At the time I think I misunderstood.

46:12

Fred: I think I thought I thought what she meant then was that God is just something in people's heads.

46:18

Fred: But what I later came to feel about it was what she was saying was it doesn't matter if God actually is real, if there is a kind of God, if you don't think there is a kind of God, then God's existence won't matter anyway.

46:32

Marc: Yeah, it's so funny. Marc: I look at it as more of a cultural thing for my family.

46:36

Marc: Even my great-grandfather came over from Odessa, ukraine.

46:40

Marc: A lot of the people there were very learned, very intelligent.

46:42

Marc: They were not skeptical. Marc: They knew the Torah backwards and forwards and everything, but they looked at it as it's their culture.

46:50

Marc: That's why they're learning it. Marc: It's not that they're taking you to some you have to do this thing, but they were very.

46:57

Marc: A lot of them were more surprisingly, more even than the agnostic realm, if you will.

47:02

Marc: But the culture, of course, it was there.

47:04

Marc: The food. Fred: The culture. Fred: I was well-uncoocated with The culture.

47:08

Fred: I don't mean the religious elements of the culture, but Yiddishism's in my behavior, a kind of Jewish.

47:15

Fred: I was once asked what to you is Jewish?

47:20

Fred: The way I answered that was that to me, not being able to be quiet about everything in life that's ridiculous or unfair is Jewish.

47:33

Fred: Not being able to keep your mouth shut is what I think of as Jewish.

47:36

Fred: And having to react to all that is unfair, difficult, painful in life vociferously, that seems Jewish to me.

47:44

Marc: Yeah, one thing I miss about being my age is all the.

47:47

Marc: I mean, most of the elder folks are passing on or have passed on and I used to love as a kid being at a bar mitzvah or a wedding or something and some of the old guys be sitting around just chewing the fat with each other and just listening to, like my people, my grandfather's age that anything that lacked common sense drove them nuts.

48:06

Marc: They kind of tore into each other. Marc: I remember one thing my grandfather liked the real close shave and I remember his friends, somebody in famous like Harry.

48:14

Marc: But how long does a close shave last? Marc: Why are you so worried about a close shave at last?

48:18

Marc: Because the arguments these older Jewish guys would have warmed my heart.

48:22

Marc: That's all I'm saying In tech. Marc: My family immigrated through Galveston, texas.

48:26

Marc: A lot of people did. Marc: They come along the coast. Marc: Galveston, new Orleans, you know, so you run up in New York had to be readily available bagels.

48:35

Marc: It had to have been really nice, you know.

48:37

Fred: Yes, there was all that stuff There was.

48:40

Fred: I grew up thinking most people must be Jewish, because most people that I knew were Jewish, so I assumed that was the case.

48:48

Fred: I went to a special school. Fred: I went to a sort of genius school called Hunter College Elementary School a model school for gifted children, and two-thirds of the people there were Jewish.

48:58

Fred: So I said, well, most people must be Jewish.

49:03

Fred: I learned, i think, in my second year of college, that no, it didn't take me that long that most people were not Jewish.

49:12

Fred: But I, you know, strong feelings is what I think about Judaism.

49:16

Fred: That's my real association with it. Marc: That's a wonderful articulation.

49:19

Marc: I think that's perfect. Fred: Yeah, Who was it? Fred: Oh God, what's her name?

49:25

Fred: She was a famous wit from the Algonquin Roundtable.

49:29

Fred: I can't think of her name. Fred: One of your listeners will know, Oh God.

49:33

Fred: Anyway, she was half Jewish And this was in the 20s, when the Jews were a relatively smaller part of the Jewish community, The makeup of the New York intelligentsia.

49:46

Fred: And she was asked what are Jews actually like?

49:50

Fred: And she said Jews are just like everybody else, only more so.

49:57

Marc: That's exactly the truth. Marc: You know, whenever that phrase people use now the kids use a lot, now going oh, she's a lot.

50:03

Marc: You know that phrase is like what I was like yeah, that's my phrase, or extra.

50:06

Announcer: She's extra. Marc: That's what it is. Marc: That's my family right there.

50:09

Marc: There's a whole lot of extra. Marc: There is a recovery time I need after any kind of family get together, But that you know to go back.

50:17

Marc: You're mentioning something in the way you grew up, Do you think?

50:21

Marc: I think we maybe had similarities in the way we grew up And I think it kind of breeds a people pleaser muscle.

50:27

Marc: It gets, start, starts building in you, And I find that all the actors I know, the ones I speak with, the ones I chat with here I think that a lot of people go into entertainment have that people pleaser muscle pretty well developed And I don't know what came first chicken or the egg, I don't know But there are a lot of people in this business that do put, sometimes inordinately so, a lot of stock in what other people think.

50:52

Marc: Do you notice that as well, or do you concur? Fred: Yes, I do think that's endemic to our profession.

50:57

Fred: I mean, think about it. Fred: You have to have people, strangers make you feel that you're okay.

51:01

Fred: Right, they're all strangers in the audience. Fred: I mean, i don't think everybody has that, but I do think it's a common trait among people that are drawn to this profession.

51:10

Fred: I also think that it's a noble profession. Fred: I think examining life in an artistic milieu is a worthwhile pursuit and it's not easy as well, you know.

51:23

Fred: So I think both, in some ways it's very silly, and I think there's a lot of vanity and other foibles that come to my attention frequently, both my own and other people's.

51:35

Fred: But I also think that it's beautiful that people do it, because it's not easy and it's.

51:39

Fred: You know, when you see a great work of art of any kind, you go yeah, that's so true about something or other in life.

51:53

Fred: To me there's a test, a three-prong test, to establish whether there's greatness in a work of art.

52:01

Fred: Thing one is that it has to be true. Fred: You have to look at it and go, oh, that's really true.

52:06

Fred: Thing two is it has to be surprising.

52:09

Fred: Even though it's true, it has to be something that you haven't really thought of or seen in that way before.

52:15

Fred: And thing three is that even though it surprises you, it has to have its own internal logic.

52:20

Fred: It can't be quirky for the sake of being quirky.

52:23

Fred: It has to have. Fred: There has to be something innately right about it, even though it has surprised you.

52:29

Fred: So any great work to me has those kind of three simultaneous qualities.

52:35

Fred: I love that. Marc: That kind of leads to why something may stick with you when you watch a great performance.

52:40

Marc: And my daughter and I were watching. Marc: Going back to Sam Rockwell, there was a film he was in Steve Carell was in it as well The Way, Way Back, And basically it's really about a kid whose mother is dating Steve Carell.

52:53

Marc: It's kind of a coming of age kind of a thing And I looked at it as like and one thing I loved is any kid that grows up and things are a little tumultuous at that age.

53:00

Marc: You're kind of looking for a mentor or someone that is quirky and off-center, as they happen to be.

53:07

Marc: They kind of give you kind of a beacon or a north star to follow, And he was this really great character.

53:15

Marc: It kind of invigorated this kid, got the kid come out of his shell.

53:18

Marc: I'm going that's the character he played.

53:20

Marc: I was like that's when I was that age who I wish I would have met somebody with that.

53:24

Marc: So the truth in that, I think that's the other side.

53:29

Marc: I think great performance It resonates with different people in different ways, But they all love it for a different thing.

53:35

Marc: Like you said, the Godfather, Some people are just like the aesthetic of it or just the way you feel watching it, And some people are really into the dialogue, but they all you know, you all appreciate it.

53:46

Marc: Talking about the quirkiness of the people in our industry and going, excuse me, into reboot.

53:51

Marc: I know the general premise of it, but could you explain what is reboot exactly?

53:58

Marc: Because this has a great cast and I kind of want to know what we're going to expect and checking it out.

54:03

Fred: The idea is that there was a show that was popular in the early aughts kind of a la friends kind of show that you know, a show with a large cast And it's successful for quite a long time and then it goes off the air And then Hulu tries to get all these people back together to relaunch the show And of course, many years have elapsed and some of them had affairs with each other, some of them can't stand each other.

54:34

Fred: You know there's all these different forces at work with these people that have known each other for this length of time.

54:39

Fred: So they try and remount the show. Fred: That's what that show is all about.

54:44

Fred: It has a wonderful cast.

54:47

Fred: Paul Reiser is in it, judy Greer, rachel Bloom, keegan-michael Key lots of really good people, rose Abdu many, many friends of mine.

54:59

Marc: And Paul Reiser, by the way. Marc: what a great guy to see showing up more and more.

55:04

Marc: God, he was on something I think it was called Red.

55:07

Marc: it was an, i think an Amazon show Red Oaks or something.

55:10

Marc: Oh God, i should have looked this up, but Oh, i know what you mean.

55:13

Fred: Oh, gosh, jennifer Gray was on it.

55:16

Marc: I can't remember the name of it, but I know. Fred: Yes, i know the show you're talking about.

55:19

Fred: I can't remember the name of it, but yes, he does a lot of stuff.

55:21

Fred: Now I've known him for a while. Fred: He's a great guy.

55:24

Fred: I really enjoy him. Fred: He plays on the show.

55:27

Fred: One of the conceits of the show is that they hire two generations of writers.

55:33

Fred: There's an older generation, and I'm one of those older generation of writers And then there's a younger generation.

55:39

Fred: They hire three very young writers, kind of just out of school writers, and we don't.

55:44

Fred: We come from entirely different realities and kind of don't understand each other at all.

55:49

Fred: But the network wants to keep the show current, even though it features a somewhat older cast.

55:56

Fred: So Paul Reiser plays the sort of head of the older writers And so I get to do a lot with him.

56:05

Fred: So you know, for me that was I've known him for a while Very enjoyable for me to work with him.

56:10

Marc: I mean the cast, i mean it looks like so much fun to watch.

56:13

Marc: And I know again WandaVision for my son.

56:16

Marc: We had such One thing I loved about that show.

56:19

Marc: It was I don't have any real background with the Marvel thing.

56:23

Marc: I had zero idea where that show was going, none whatsoever.

56:26

Marc: So having It was kind of nice to see, almost in a Kind of like you know, i love Lucy-ish kind of that era of TV And have you show up black and white.

56:37

Marc: It's like this is I just want to keep watching. Marc: This is so cool, you know.

56:41

Marc: And then the show evolved into what it was. Marc: But it's, i know that whole Marvel Universe thing is a.

56:47

Marc: You know, you've now got your stripes. Marc: You're officially in the Marvel Universe.

56:50

Fred: Yes, And I have to say I admire Kevin Feige.

56:55

Fred: You know that was a risky. Fred: You know Marvel has its own very loyal fan base And to do something kind of that kind of way out, so risky for that fan base, i admire him doing that And I think My impression was that he succeeded at it.

57:13

Fred: You know, i think he did a really good job with it And you know I'm proud of that show and I like that show.

57:19

Marc: Again, i really appreciate you spending time with me here.

57:22

Marc: I always wrap up all interviews. Marc: I call my seven questions Just a quick seven.

57:26

Marc: Kind of It's a little fun to get to know you, kind of in addition to what we've been doing.

57:30

Marc: But I always ask the first question in. Marc: I'm a food guy so I always ask it is what is your favorite comfort food?

57:37

Marc: That thing that just You maybe had a bad day or an amazing day.

57:40

Marc: You've got to sit down and have some of it. Fred: I'll tell you the truth.

57:42

Fred: You know I have a. Fred: I've been eating too much and had a problem controlling my weight for many, many years, and for the last two and a half years or so, i've been doing not keto but something close to it.

57:53

Fred: So I don't eat bread, potatoes, pasta.

57:58

Fred: I haven't eaten sugar in 17 years, so a lot of the things that I would say are my real comfort favorite foods I have no longer eat.

58:06

Fred: But yeah, but in a perfect world, in a world where I didn't have to worry Meaning I didn't have to worry about how fat I was.

58:18

Fred: I like crap. Announcer: I like to eat.

58:21

Fred: Doritos with dip. Fred: No, i like you know some people like real food, i like junk.

58:27

Fred: I like to eat Doritos with dip. Fred: I love brownies.

58:32

Fred: I love Rocky Road ice cream. Fred: I'd say my most delightful thing that I could eat, that I can imagine eating, is Rocky Road ice cream with bananas and hot fudge in it.

58:44

Marc: Oh my God that does sound good.

58:46

Marc: Now I'm curious what's your favorite deli item, though? Marc: Because I got to ask because you know Well, do you mean strictly deli?

58:52

Marc: Oh like, if you're going to go into deli, let's say you're only going to Katz's in New York, at Cantor's on Fairfax, what are you ordering there?

58:59

Marc: Let's say that somebody's given you a pass, a massive cheat day.

59:01

Fred: What would you get? Fred: Well, because, okay, that's important, because I can't eat rye bread anymore.

59:07

Marc: So without rye bread, delis, are you know? Marc: Yeah, I feel for you on that.

59:11

Fred: So let's say that I don't know.

59:15

Fred: There's an asteroid heading for planet Earth. Marc: You would dark on that but okay, if I get your deli, then we're going to do that, yeah.

59:24

Fred: So in that case, not only are we all going to die, but I could probably get what I wanted in the deli for free.

59:29

Fred: Okay, so I would order a sandwich that is part pastrami, part corned beef, with coleslaw on it, grilled Grilled, failing that, something that's not so deli, but I love grilled cheese with bacon.

59:55

Fred: Also not whole foods food, but I really like grilled cheese with bacon.

59:57

Marc: Yeah, i'd say I've. Marc: I'm just like I need My daughters my youngest is just like me We're not.

1:00:04

Marc: Pasta shows up on our menu occasionally but it's like, yeah, pastas, breads, trying to get away from all that.

1:00:09

Marc: But when I am at Cantor's I'm always.

1:00:11

Marc: They got that mishmash, matzbal soup, krapeluch and all that kind of stuff.

1:00:15

Marc: Oh, yes, and I always get the. Marc: Nobody ever gets The harder salami sandwich, the lobster On rye.

1:00:23

Fred: I'm sorry. Fred: Oh yes, that's good, That's very good.

1:00:26

Fred: I think I see nobody ever orders the lobster at Cantor's. Marc: They have lobster.

1:00:28

Marc: Yes, that's. Fred: Dead at the end of the menu.

1:00:33

Fred: Nobody orders it. Marc: Same lobsters in there for 20 years from the tank.

1:00:36

Marc: It's got great hair now, yeah, But yeah, that's now.

1:00:40

Marc: I'm hungry Now, if you're going to sit down, next question Oh, let me.

1:00:44

Fred: No, i'm sorry to make my answers so long. Fred: So, given my current thing, the way they actually do eat.

1:00:49

Fred: My favorite food to eat is Greek salad. Marc: I love Greek salad Yeah, i like that too.

1:00:52

Marc: We do a. Marc: Well, you can't do it. Marc: We do something with like a orzo pasta.

1:00:56

Marc: We make a Greek salad like that, but yeah, again, it's pasta, so you can't do that.

1:01:01

Marc: Now, if you are going to, let's say, go to your favorite coffee place, you're going to sit down with three people, living or not, and you're going to talk story for a few hours.

1:01:08

Marc: Who would you like to sit down with? Marc: Three people?

1:01:11

Marc: just for great conversation. Marc: Now, when you say talk story.

1:01:13

Fred: Are we living in our conversation to strictly things about story?

1:01:17

Marc: Oh, no, no, no, no. Marc: I mean kind of like you're just talking about life.

1:01:20

Marc: You're talking about what? Marc: Anybody I could meet Yeah anybody you could sit down with.

1:01:23

Marc: You feel like it would be just a great conversation.

1:01:26

Marc: Three people maybe there's the chemistry of those everybody being together you think would be educational and fun.

1:01:32

Fred: Well can they be If they can be disparate.

1:01:35

Fred: entirely different people. Marc: Oh yeah.

1:01:37

Fred: I would say from the modern world, my three favorite people that are the most interesting and have affected my life the most.

1:01:45

Fred: One is an author called Patrick O'Brien.

1:01:49

Fred: Wrote a series of books about the Napoleonic Wars, my favorite author of all time, my favorite artist of any kind of all time.

1:01:55

Fred: Patrick O'Brien was one. Fred: The other would be Donald Fagan, who I've actually met, of Steely Dan, my favorite producer and composer and producer of music.

1:02:06

Fred: And the third would probably be Steve Jobs, who fascinates me as an individual and because of his accomplishments.

1:02:12

Fred: Now, none of these people. Fred: These are all sticky individuals that are not warm and fuzzy or fun to be with for a lot of people, but they're all fascinating to me.

1:02:22

Fred: If we're allowed to go back further, einstein fascinates me, although I don't know.

1:02:32

Fred: I wouldn't be able to understand him. Fred: Let's see Aristotle, einstein and I don't know who the third one would be.

1:02:47

Fred: I have to think about it more. Marc: I like that. Marc: Aristotle, a Warner Earhart from Est.

1:02:51

Marc: There we go. Marc: Who again? Marc: I'm sorry. Fred: Warner Earhart, the guy who invented Est.

1:02:56

Marc: Okay, yeah, you know it's funny. Marc: When you said Aristotle, i started thinking I was talking with my daughter.

1:03:01

Marc: We were in line getting a coffee and I said something about a nickname that somebody used to call me, marcus Aurelius kind of joking, because she thought it'd be funny if I was at the drive-through at the coffee place.

1:03:13

Marc: That said Marco, and then she said maybe they'll say Polo.

1:03:17

Marc: And I was like what's your name, should we put on the coffee? Marc: And I'm like I said let me tell you the nicknames, we're just talking about it.

1:03:22

Marc: And she said who's Marcus Aurelius? Marc: I said you've taken philosophy at the college level and you don't know who that is.

1:03:28

Marc: And she said you know, i'm not a coffee maker, you can't be, so I'm just giving her a hard time. Marc: So it's like my college kids are going to be smarter, that like more educated than me very shortly.

1:03:34

Marc: So it's like I'm like, oh, i know something they don't Just to backtrack for a second.

1:03:38

Fred: So when I go to the coffee place they ask for your name. Fred: You know you go to the famous coffee place which I won't mention.

1:03:45

Fred: So I always say my name is Hansen and they go, hansen, and everybody turns around.

1:03:50

Marc: I'm going to do that Because my youngest she it's like this battle, like I don't try to humiliate her ever, but I try to be like you know, do something goofy where she just rolls her eyes.

1:04:01

Marc: If she rolls her eyes, it's like a mission accomplished for me.

1:04:04

Announcer: You win. Fred: Exactly. Marc: Now, if now let's go back when you were younger, who was your first celebrity crush?

1:04:10

Marc: You know someone. Marc: You just were like Haley.

1:04:12

Fred: Mills No Love Haley Mills.

1:04:17

Marc: She's on a top three next to Olivia Newton-John, who just my heart breaks, and I tell my daughters.

1:04:22

Marc: I said Haley and Olivia were on the list for girls' names.

1:04:25

Marc: I went with Lily and Emma, but Haley Mills oh my God.

1:04:29

Fred: Haley Mills and Haley Mills and Maureen Maureen O'Sullivan from the early Tarzan movies.

1:04:36

Fred: I used to watch Tarzan. Marc: She played Jane No but what was your favorite?

1:04:39

Fred: Haley Mills movie though. Marc: I think that's kind of like what phase was she like a parent trap, or was it a parent trap?

1:04:46

Marc: I got you. Marc: I've never heard somebody say yay, you're my mishpocha, i like that.

1:04:51

Marc: So now, if you're going to be going on an exotic island for a year, it's somewhere you're going to enjoy being.

1:04:57

Marc: But you're there for a year no streaming, no ability to watch anything but you can bring a DVD of a movie, cd of an album, and some people I speak with they don't really watch movies that much, ironically, but they read a lot.

1:05:11

Marc: So if you'd prefer a book, go for it, but basically an album and a movie or a book that you would like to bring with you.

1:05:19

Fred: Well, i would bring I'm cheating, but I would bring the collected works of Patrick O'Brien, which is 21 novels which I have been reading and listening to.

1:05:28

Fred: I've listened to the recorded versions of them since 1990.

1:05:31

Fred: So what is that now? Fred: Whatever that is, since 19, that's 32 years.

1:05:36

Fred: I've listened to them all and read them all at least a dozen times each one.

1:05:39

Fred: but they're so rich, they're so full of great stuff that I never tire of them.

1:05:44

Fred: So that would be my literary pick for music.

1:05:50

Fred: I would pick either. Fred: I would probably pick.

1:05:57

Fred: It's tough. Fred: I would either say Blue by Joni Mitchell, which to me is probably one of the greatest albums I've ever recorded, or I guess Asia by Steely Dan.

1:06:09

Marc: I was gonna say Steely Dan has to be in there somewhere, like you mentioned.

1:06:12

Fred: My favorite movie of all time is an obscure movie to most people.

1:06:17

Fred: It's a movie called Great Expectations, made by David Lean in 1946.

1:06:21

Fred: Absolutely the greatest movie I've ever made to me, really. Marc: I love when people answer these questions because it gives me things to go watch and stream or things to cook.

1:06:29

Marc: Also, sometimes people would be able to favorite comfort food is that thing?

1:06:33

Marc: speaking with someone the other day that it was a thing when they were a poor actor off-Broadway, and it was that thing that they made with very little money, but they still love eating, i was like I need to make that, so I get educated here as well.

1:06:45

Marc: You get some ramen and you put some ketchup in it. Marc: Oh, he was like exotic.

1:06:50

Marc: It was cheap though, but he threw beans in it and it turned into just something that my inner college kid was down with it.

1:06:59

Marc: Now next question if you're gonna be From the time you get up to the time you get to bed, if you're gonna say this is a perfect day, what component parts of that day would you like to see occur?

1:07:09

Marc: What's part of a perfect day for you? Fred: Well, first of all, it can't be summertime.

1:07:15

Marc: I hate the summer it's too hot Really, even where you live, where it's not.

1:07:18

Fred: Really. Marc: No, okay, okay, Where I live is a hot hell.

1:07:22

Fred: I live in the San Fernando Valley. Fred: It's 104 years away.

1:07:27

Fred: 104 is awful. Fred: Okay, get up, have a wonderful breakfast, not too heavy though lightish breakfast.

1:07:42

Fred: Do my 10 miles on my bike, which I do most days.

1:07:47

Fred: I don't exercise bike, i do 10 miles. Marc: Well, a stationary bike, or you actually get up right around the neighborhood.

1:07:53

Fred: I do not get out when it's 104. Fred: Okay, yeah, true, true, i'm going a little stationary bike in my and looking at movies or television shows.

1:08:01

Fred: I do that exercising. Fred: Then, if it were perfect day, I would be with my kids and I would drive them to a.

1:08:10

Fred: I would drive them to where there's water. Fred: Either there's a beautiful lake by where we live, or maybe we go to the beach somewhere.

1:08:16

Fred: We'd like to go to Malibu, if it's not hot, hang out there.

1:08:21

Fred: Or sometimes we go to museums.

1:08:24

Fred: I love to go to museums too. Fred: Part of my family is English the cousin who's a countess, who lives in England, and we love to visit her also.

1:08:34

Fred: So maybe we would spend a day in England with her.

1:08:40

Fred: I love to be in nature for part of the time.

1:08:44

Fred: And then what would we do?

1:08:47

Fred: We would come back, we would have a sumptuous dinner with good wine, and then I would play some video games with my kids, which I enjoy tremendously, and then we'd end off watching a great movie, maybe the movie that I mentioned to you, and then my kids would go off to sleep and I would retire to the bedroom with my beautiful and accommodating girlfriend.

1:09:19

Fred: That sounds absolutely. Fred: That sounds more than delightful.

1:09:23

Marc: I'm very much the same way. Marc: Now the last question I got.

1:09:26

Marc: Let's say you've got a DeLorean, you can go back in time 16-year-old you, you're gonna go back for a few minutes and have a little chat with 16-year-old What piece of advice or wisdom or knowledge or guidance would you give yourself at 16?

1:09:41

Fred: Gosh, i think I would say the same thing that everybody else says, or most other people say, which is have faith in yourself, you're gonna be okay.

1:09:52

Fred: You're headed for good things.

1:09:58

Fred: Trust your own instincts about things And try and be kind.

1:10:07

Fred: Try and be kind. Fred: The world is full of people striving with all kinds of problems.

1:10:15

Fred: And be kind to yourself and be kind to other people Might get your business to be kind.

1:10:19

Fred: That's what I would tell myself. Fred: And you're gonna be okay.

1:10:22

Fred: That's wonderful. Fred: I've heard many people say that.

1:10:25

Marc: Another thing I love is people say don't wait, do it.

1:10:29

Marc: You know you're gonna be okay, do it That thing you wanna do.

1:10:33

Marc: But kindness is something I've really tried to instill in my kids.

1:10:36

Marc: You really just don't know, and I think that, being a little older and you speak to those people in high school, they thought, oh, they had a perfect life, everything was great, Everything was on paper.

1:10:48

Fred: You go to high school. Fred: You're just a net. Fred: The people, yeah, The guys who go to high school.

1:10:53

Fred: You're just a guy that owns a dodge dealership in town, All the people you think are gonna be the big successes.

1:10:59

Fred: and never, it's never that way. Marc: It's a strange peculiarity of life.

1:11:03

Marc: Again, i sincerely appreciate you, such a mensch, by sharing your time with me.

1:11:07

Marc: I've wanted to chat for some time and I'm so glad you have a new project coming out I can talk about.

1:11:12

Marc: Have really a wonderful weekend And I look forward to hopefully catching up down the line with you, me too, and thanks for all your kind words.

1:11:21

Marc: Well, there you go, fred Melamed. Marc: What a great chat.

1:11:24

Marc: Really enjoyed the opportunity to connect with a real mensch, as my people say, a mensch.

1:11:29

Marc: Besides being a mensch, he's also a very talented actor.

1:11:32

Marc: You can check him out Again on Reboot it is on Hulu right now.

1:11:37

Marc: Really funny show, really enjoyed it. Marc: And tell you, don't forget, everything's story and craft is at storyandcraftpod.com.

1:11:45

Marc: All right, pop on over, find out whatever you want to find out about the show.

1:11:49

Marc: Past episodes, learn a little bit more about me if you want to do that, and don't forget.

1:11:55

Marc: Next week, another great episode, the next few weeks I mean, i know who's coming.

1:11:59

Marc: You're really going to enjoy it. Marc: All right, that's it for me. Marc: I'm going to go run, as always, to go grab a bite to eat, because you know with me it's always some shape, form or fashion about food.

1:12:09

Marc: All right, there you go. Marc: I want you to have a killer rest of your week or weekend or whenever you're listening.

1:12:15

Marc: Be safe, please. Marc: I want to see you next go around for another episode of Story and Craft.

1:12:21

Announcer: That's it for this episode of Story and Craft. Announcer: Join Marc next week for more conversation right here on Story and Craft.

1:12:28

Announcer: Story and Craft is a presentation of Marc Preston Productions LLC.

1:12:33

Announcer: Executive producer is Marc Preston.

1:12:36

Announcer: Associate producer is Zachary Holden.

1:12:39

Announcer: Please rate and review Story and Craft on Apple Podcasts.

1:12:42

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1:12:49

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1:12:53

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1:12:57

Announcer: I'm Emma Dylan. Announcer: See you next time And remember, keep telling your story.