0:00

This week, beware of beer

0:02

that tastes too sweet, friends

0:04

in America, the gas chamber

0:07

makes a comeback, and 3D

0:09

guns. Welcome to

0:11

Subpar Talks. Hey

0:28

everybody, welcome to Subpar Talks,

0:30

where we have conversations about everything.

0:33

I'm Jeff.

0:34

And I'm Chris.

0:35

Thank you again for joining us, and yes, of

0:37

course, here we go, our standard disclaimer,

0:40

listener discretion is advised.

0:42

We are going to curse, perhaps

0:44

a lot, and depending on the episode,

0:46

we are going to touch on some mature subject matter,

0:49

and we inject our humor into a lot of this

0:51

stuff. So if that is not your

0:53

thing, then perhaps this podcast

0:55

is not for you. But for everybody else,

0:57

settle in, get ready, because

1:00

here we go with this week's topics. Uh,

1:06

do you deal with antifreeze a lot?

1:09

I don't, I've never really

1:11

had to, I don't know. I think

1:13

I kind of take it for granted that once it's in

1:15

the car, you're good to go.

1:17

Yeah, that's kind of the way I am. Do you

1:19

like the smell of it?

1:22

No, I don't like the smell of antifreeze.

1:25

It's kind of a pungent smell.

1:27

It is.

1:27

Yeah, it's pretty strong.

1:29

And I associate it with, well,

1:31

fuck me, something's wrong with the car. Like it's,

1:34

so I have a bad association with

1:36

it. Yeah. Yeah, exactly.

1:40

The reason I ask is,

1:43

I saw this, uh, oh, I don't know,

1:45

maybe a couple of weeks ago. A

1:48

woman in North Dakota is

1:50

accused of killing her

1:52

boyfriend by poisoning him

1:55

with antifreeze.

1:57

Really? So

2:00

how does that happen?

2:02

So, OK, I was curious

2:04

about that. How do you poison somebody

2:06

with antifreeze? And

2:08

like, did she think she was going to get

2:10

away with it? I don't know. I, I have

2:13

a lot of questions anyway. Okay.

2:16

She, she poisoned. Okay.

2:18

Oh, this is all allegedly, but there's a

2:20

shit ton of evidence against her. She

2:23

allegedly poisoned her boyfriend

2:25

with antifreeze. They

2:27

had recently been to his attorney

2:30

and it was determined that he

2:32

was. Uh,

2:34

set to get a 30 million

2:37

inheritance. Whoa.

2:40

And she suspected or knew,

2:42

I don't remember, that he had planned to

2:45

end their relationship. Mm

2:47

hmm. So she is claiming

2:50

that Clock's ticking. She

2:53

is claiming that they

2:56

were, uh, in a common law marriage.

2:58

They had never been formally married, but they were a common

3:00

law marriage. After she was arrested,

3:03

she was promptly told that common law marriage

3:05

does not exist in North Dakota. You're

3:07

either formally married or you're not,

3:10

so she'd be fucked on that. Anyway,

3:13

now she's fucked her life over and she's

3:15

going to be going to prison, most likely, for the rest

3:17

of her life. Big mistake.

3:19

Yeah, big mistake indeed. So,

3:23

anyway, they,

3:25

uh, she had been out with him and

3:28

some friends, and

3:30

some friends witnessed

3:32

her giving him,

3:34

uh, sweet tea, and

3:38

when the authorities searched the house,

3:41

they also found a Coors

3:43

Light bottle that tested

3:45

positive for antifreeze. And

3:48

a Windex bottle that tested positive

3:50

for antifreeze. A

3:52

Windex? What's, how's

3:54

that gonna do anything? I

3:56

don't know. I don't know what her plan

3:58

was there. Actually, I have no idea what the fuck

4:01

her plan was anyway. Why

4:03

did she think she was gonna get

4:05

away with this? I

4:08

don't know. That's, that's what I'm

4:10

thinking. Like, first of all. How

4:12

do you drink antifreeze

4:16

in something and not know it?

4:18

I mean, you talk about the smell of it. I

4:20

would, I know it's supposed to be sweet.

4:23

Because pets can be drawn

4:25

to it, you know, that's why you

4:27

can't leave it out. But

4:31

I can't imagine that you wouldn't smell

4:33

it and go, the hell's wrong with this

4:36

beer or

4:38

whatever else you're drinking. Actually,

4:41

antifreeze might improve the taste of Coors

4:43

Light. Well, it's

4:44

true.

4:47

Yeah, I don't know. And there

4:49

is a testimony now in an affidavit

4:52

that she had made statements before

4:54

and after. About poisoning

4:57

him with antifreeze. So that

4:59

kind of makes me think she was given

5:01

a big fuck you to him. Like if

5:03

I'm not going to get any of this inheritance then.

5:06

But I don't know that conflicts with their statement says

5:08

she thought they were common law married, so I

5:10

have no idea. She might be totally

5:13

off her rocket. Well,

5:14

that's. That's just really poor planning.

5:17

I mean, I don't know, I don't know

5:19

anything about killing. Somebody. in

5:22

a non discovered

5:24

way. Like, how could you

5:27

have them die and get away

5:29

with it? But there's

5:32

gotta be better ways than that. Some

5:36

kind of drugs that are hard to detect

5:38

or

5:38

something. I can guarantee

5:41

you they're going to find her search history. And

5:44

there's going to be, because how do you

5:46

know how much antifreeze you need to kill a person?

5:49

Nobody knows that. What

5:51

do I need, like a cup? Or a teaspoon?

5:54

Nobody knows. So

5:58

it says, uh, He started

6:00

complaining of feeling ill.

6:04

Complaining that he felt drunk, although

6:06

he had not consumed any alcohol at all.

6:09

Then he reported stomach pain and he nearly

6:11

collapsed. That's when

6:13

they called the paramedics. And

6:16

he went to the ER and

6:18

then he was transferred to a hospital

6:22

and he died the next day. So

6:25

she's fucked. Yeah, she

6:27

is. I don't get

6:29

that. She's pretty stupid. We could

6:31

probably do a whole segment. Well, you probably

6:34

have a whole podcast out there on stupid criminals,

6:36

but she would Oh, absolutely. She would fit

6:39

right here. Yeah. Oh,

6:41

she said, uh, when

6:44

they started going through the house. Of

6:46

course, she's probably in panic mode by

6:48

that point, you know, the police are rifling

6:50

through the house. And she

6:52

says, uh, he

6:55

might have accidentally, tell me if

6:57

this is ever a possibility for you, he

6:59

might have accidentally ingested the antifreeze

7:02

because, quote, he was smoking a cigarette

7:04

that may have fallen into antifreeze in the garage.

7:09

Yeah, that's always a big concern

7:11

of mine. Yeah,

7:14

how stupid.

7:14

The antifreeze that I left open

7:17

and something that I'm sucking on or

7:19

eating could have fallen

7:20

into it. Yeah. I've

7:23

always said defense attorneys have the toughest job

7:26

in the world because they're the ones who have to deal

7:28

with this shit and they make

7:30

this claim and defense attorneys

7:32

have to present that straight face

7:34

to the jury and a judge and

7:37

damn, that's just absurd.

7:40

But yeah, I mean, it's their job, but still.

7:43

That would be

7:43

crazy tough to have

7:45

to defend people like that. Where,

7:48

you know 100 percent that they did

7:51

it, and

7:54

you gotta make up something to try to give

7:56

them a reasonable doubt? I

7:59

don't think so.

8:04

I thought this was interesting. Pew

8:07

Research did a study

8:09

on, it was a survey of Americans.

8:13

And they're friends. And

8:16

it was asking just general

8:18

questions, like how many close friends

8:20

do you have? And then they asked,

8:22

you know, topics of conversations that

8:25

typically come up with your friends and, and

8:27

all of that. And,

8:29

uh, Of course, I

8:31

thought about, and maybe you have, just in

8:34

the few seconds since I introduced this topic,

8:36

but Jerry, when he ditches Ramon

8:38

on the subway, says, I've

8:41

already got three friends, I really can't handle anymore.

8:44

Yep, that's about tops. OK,

8:48

so, I'll give some more information on

8:50

this survey, but let me ask you, so

8:52

Jerry, Has three

8:54

close friends, all

8:56

right, from the show. What percentage of

8:58

Americans have three close friends,

9:01

would you say?

9:03

So I'm also thinking what

9:05

percentage have them and what percentage

9:07

think they have them? Because

9:09

I've talked to some people and it's like, they

9:12

seem to have friends out the wazoo,

9:14

but then when it comes down to it, most

9:16

of those are just acquaintances.

9:19

Right. Yeah. I wonder that

9:21

too. And I guess we'd have to look at the survey. I've

9:23

only looked at the NPR article. We'd

9:25

have to look at the survey. Did they define

9:28

what a close friend is for people?

9:30

I don't know.

9:32

Because I would say, I would think

9:34

that most people don't

9:36

really have more than two or

9:38

three close

9:40

friends. That's what

9:42

I would think. Uh, according

9:44

to the survey, 18 percent of Americans

9:47

have three close friends.

9:51

8 percent have no close friends.

9:54

OK. Have

9:56

you ever read, and they mentioned this in there,

9:58

have you ever read, like there's a lot

10:01

of, of studies that have been done

10:03

on, uh,

10:05

your mental health and physical health

10:07

and how it's related to how many friends you have

10:10

and that social interaction and

10:12

all that. Right. And it kind of worries

10:15

me when I read that stuff because

10:17

Uh, I'm not gonna make it. Yeah,

10:22

I've seen, yeah, I've seen that stuff, talking

10:24

about longevity, and the people that live

10:27

the longest are the happiest, and they have

10:29

the most social interaction

10:31

and all that, and like, all

10:33

of that social interaction would kill me early

10:35

anyway. Well, I was going to say,

10:38

so what about the more introverted people?

10:41

Like, doesn't that just take

10:44

years off your life if you constantly

10:46

have to be interacting with people? Right?

10:48

You would think so. But then

10:51

what does that mean? Are there, there

10:53

are a lot of old, lonely

10:55

people

10:56

too, right? So yeah.

10:58

Yeah. So there's still those

11:01

people that are living. Yeah. They

11:03

survived. It

11:04

was just all their friends didn't make it.

11:07

They've already died off. So.

11:10

Here's the key findings according to

11:12

NPR, um, according

11:14

to Pew, 61 percent

11:17

of adults in the U. S. say that having close

11:19

friends is essential to living

11:21

a fulfilling life, that's

11:23

more than those who cited marriage, children,

11:26

or money. Wow.

11:28

61%. Yeah. That

11:30

seems really high. 53

11:32

percent said they have

11:35

between one and four close friends,

11:37

38 percent said they have five or

11:39

more, and then,

11:41

oh, I just gave this, but the 8 percent say

11:43

they have no close friends.

11:46

See what'd you say? Have five or more?

11:49

30 something? 38

11:52

percent said they have five or more, yeah.

11:54

I don't know if I

11:55

believe, see, that's where I don't know if I believe

11:57

that.

11:59

I don't, uh, yeah. That's a lot. Again,

12:01

I want to know how they define close. Yeah.

12:04

Close friend.

12:05

Like, how frequently

12:08

do you talk to these people? How frequently do you

12:10

see these people?

12:12

This last bullet point here. About

12:15

8 percent say they have no close friends. That adds

12:17

up with what some experts are describing

12:19

as an epidemic of loneliness for

12:21

some Americans. So they

12:23

have a whole article on that. But I remember the surgeon

12:25

general, uh, not

12:28

too long ago, uh,

12:30

he came out and talked about this epidemic of

12:32

loneliness and how it's dangerous for physical

12:34

and mental health. And he said,

12:37

Oh, here it is right here. He said,

12:40

The epidemic of loneliness in the United States

12:43

and lacking a connection can increase

12:45

the risk for premature death

12:47

to levels comparable to smoking

12:49

15 cigarettes a day.

12:52

Oh, shit! I know

12:54

it. So...

12:58

Maybe we need to go make some friends

13:02

or start smoking. Just

13:06

double up. We could make friends

13:08

and start smoking and we wouldn't be losing

13:11

anything. Yeah, it'd

13:11

be a wash.

13:15

That's awesome. Wow.

13:18

That's really scary. You know, they

13:20

say sitting is

13:22

the new cancer. Just being

13:25

inactive. Yeah. So

13:27

I don't know that I care for all of that. That's

13:30

like just sitting and being alone

13:32

is equivalent to smoking that much.

13:35

But, but what about the,

13:39

what, what do you say? I don't know.

13:41

I'm not the kind of person, I'm

13:44

not the person who can't

13:47

handle being in social situations.

13:49

You know, there are people like that, but

13:51

they're just like a true anxiety from

13:53

and things like that. I'm

13:56

not that, I just get

13:58

to the point that that's

14:00

enough, you know, I've

14:03

had it, I've had enough. I like

14:05

social interaction, it's

14:07

just I want it to be quality,

14:10

I'm with you, I can only

14:13

take so much small talk. Like,

14:15

it's gotta be quality, and

14:17

then it can only be so much,

14:20

and to me, that's gonna come from

14:23

those closest friends. I don't want

14:25

social interaction just for the

14:28

fact of having it, because

14:30

that is not fulfilling

14:31

to me. Yeah,

14:33

I agree. I'm the same exact way. Uh,

14:36

I can handle it for a

14:39

certain amount of time. OK,

14:41

so they have seven categories here

14:43

because one of the things they measured in the survey

14:46

is what people talk about.

14:49

And so this is the percent of saying,

14:52

percent of people saying they talk about

14:54

this stuff extremely often or

14:56

often. So you

14:58

tell me men

15:00

versus women on

15:02

all of these. Who's more

15:04

likely to talk about their work, men

15:07

or women? Men. I

15:10

would have thought so too, but

15:12

more women are likely, er,

15:14

women are likelier to talk about work

15:17

than men. Really? Yeah.

15:19

By a lot? Uh,

15:21

61 percent of women said they

15:23

do it extremely often, or often compared to

15:25

54%, 54 percent for

15:28

men. OK. So not that

15:30

much of a gap, but I would have thought men would

15:32

be higher. Yeah, I would too.

15:35

OK, how about family life,

15:39

men or women?

15:41

Well, I mean, when you put it like that,

15:43

now that you've already said that about work,

15:47

it would make me think that maybe men

15:50

talk about family

15:51

life more. Women

15:53

and it's a 20 percent gap, 67

15:56

to 47. Whoa, OK.

16:00

Current events. Watching TV,

16:03

men complain a lot about

16:05

family life. Yeah,

16:07

so you would think that

16:09

that could come

16:10

up.

16:11

Yep. Current events,

16:14

men. Yeah,

16:16

men 53 to 44.

16:20

OK. Physical

16:22

health, men or women? Hmm,

16:27

I'm going to say

16:28

men. I

16:31

think I would have answered that too, but it's actually

16:33

women, 41 to 31. Really?

16:36

Yeah. Pop culture,

16:40

like TV shows or books.

16:44

That's got to be women. It

16:46

is women, it's a pretty narrow gap, 37

16:49

to 32. This

16:52

one's easy, sports. Men.

16:55

Yeah. Huge gap, 37

16:57

to 13. And

16:59

then mental health, men

17:02

or women. That's

17:04

gotta be

17:05

women.

17:05

Yeah. 31 to 15.

17:08

Yeah. Yeah. Uh,

17:11

I'm kinda surprised on, uh,

17:13

well, at least a few of those. Yeah, I

17:16

was too. But, again. I

17:18

don't like, I

17:21

was going to say, I don't have friends. I have friends,

17:23

but I don't know what we talk about. It's like when

17:25

you and I, you know, my wife asks, what did

17:27

y'all talk about? I don't know. I do what we talked about.

17:29

I don't know.

17:30

Well, we've covered

17:32

a lot of those different things. Honestly,

17:35

it just depends on the day. True.

17:38

But it's kind of like us talking on here. There's

17:41

really nothing. That we don't

17:43

talk about. It's just the day

17:45

different things come up at different times. Oh,

17:48

they've got a little, uh, a

17:50

link to another article.

17:52

Five easy tips for making friends

17:55

as an adult. No. Okay.

17:57

Maybe we need to check that out. Do we

17:59

need to talk about

18:00

it? Uh, number one,

18:02

get the word out. OK.

18:06

No. The first part of this

18:08

line is get yourself out there. Nope.

18:10

I'm not doing that. See? I'm not getting

18:12

myself out there. Right. No.

18:16

Um, reconnect with old

18:18

friends. Nope. No.

18:20

Got rid of them for a reason.

18:24

Incorporate more routine into your

18:26

day. Uh,

18:29

setting time aside for activities, communities,

18:31

or places you love. Can help

18:33

you feel more at home. Do you go on a run

18:36

every morning? No. Try,

18:38

uh, try running at the same park for a week.

18:41

Go back to that restaurant around the block. So

18:43

this is like going to the same bar

18:45

or whatever. I can see that. Yeah.

18:48

Like cheers.

18:50

Everybody knows your name.

18:52

Yeah. So, this says,

18:54

uh, incorporate more routine into your day.

18:57

My days are pretty damn routine,

18:59

like I'm not designing what they

19:02

want. Scope out interest

19:05

groups. The hell? Group

19:07

settings like interest or identity based communities

19:09

are also helpful for meeting new people. Yeah,

19:12

like hobbies or something like that. Yeah,

19:14

you're right. Yeah. Uh, now

19:17

you can find most of them online. Food,

19:19

sports, pets, parenting, or religion

19:21

to name a few. And then focus

19:24

on the connection, not the friendship.

19:27

To help yourself be present and to not

19:29

put so much pressure on things, try to focus

19:32

on being connected in the moment as opposed

19:34

to maybe obsessing about what this might

19:36

turn into. Just

19:38

thinking about this stuff sounds exhausting

19:41

to me. It

19:42

does. And I wouldn't

19:44

be obsessed about what it would turn into,

19:46

I am thinking about the moment. Like,

19:49

am I, am I happy in this

19:51

moment, or am I exhausted by it? Like,

19:55

you know, do I, do I want

19:57

to continue talking to this

19:59

person? Yeah, sounds

20:01

like work, sounds like too much work.

20:04

And that's just it. It

20:06

shouldn't be, it should be easy,

20:08

it should be natural, it should just happen.

20:10

If it feels like work, then it's not

20:13

the right thing.

20:14

Yeah. And it's so,

20:17

it's different from when you were a kid,

20:19

I mean, think about the friends

20:21

you had when you were a kid. Why were you friends

20:23

with them? Because they either live close

20:26

to you... Or went

20:28

to the same school you did or church

20:31

or both. And it's

20:33

not like you were going here, going there, whatever.

20:35

Like you were around these people and

20:38

damn, I can understand why some people in their

20:40

job, especially during COVID and

20:43

the aftermath of all that, you're just working

20:45

alone and not really interacting with

20:48

a lot of people.

20:49

Well, when I think back, I mean, I can certainly

20:51

say this now, but I, well, you

20:54

know, I, I could have just been a weird

20:56

kid, but I thought about this when

20:58

I was a kid, is that how

21:00

many of the people that I was around

21:03

did I necessarily consider good

21:05

friends versus acquaintances?

21:07

Even though I was around them a lot

21:09

because of circumstances, like you

21:11

said, it's church, school, neighborhood,

21:13

whatever. And now?

21:16

What is it? If you don't

21:18

have those interest groups or something

21:20

like that, that they're talking about in that article,

21:23

then most of the people

21:25

that you're around are probably because of work.

21:28

The adult equivalent of school. So

21:31

it's like you're,

21:32

you're around these people and are they your friends?

21:35

Probably not. They're more like acquaintances.

21:42

All right. So way back, I can't

21:44

believe it's been this long ago. It's episode

21:47

eight. We talked

21:49

about botched

21:50

executions. Oh

21:51

yeah. OK, so

21:54

in that episode,

21:55

that was fun by the

21:56

way, it was, he had a

21:58

long list of all these executions

22:00

by state of times

22:03

that it failed. So he

22:05

came across this article of

22:08

a guy who was supposed to be executed

22:10

in Alabama and

22:13

yeah, supposed to be, there's a key

22:15

word, key phrase. It

22:18

was a, a lethal injection

22:21

that was botched, so says

22:24

the article. They called it a

22:26

botched execution. So,

22:29

not sure what happened, but it didn't

22:31

work. He is scheduled for

22:33

execution again, and get this,

22:36

he has elected.

22:38

And this just blows my mind. He

22:41

has elected to be

22:43

executed by nitrogen

22:45

gas.

22:46

Oh God. Yeah. Sounds like

22:48

the gas chamber. Yes.

22:51

Now I don't know, I mean, when

22:53

we talked about it before and you were talking

22:55

about the gas chamber, you were talking about sulfur

22:58

gas and that was where, you

23:00

know, you're supposed to watch, they drop

23:02

something in. What did they drop

23:05

it in acid or something? I don't know.

23:07

And you're supposed to watch for the gas to rise.

23:09

I think that's right. And you can see, yeah, you can see

23:12

it rise up and they tell you when you see

23:14

that to start breathing, take a deep breath.

23:16

See,

23:17

I got to start breathing right now. Just thinking

23:19

about it. I know it. Damn.

23:22

So

23:23

yeah, this is going to be nitrogen gas

23:25

and here's the thing. This

23:27

has not been done in any other state.

23:30

So

23:31

this particular type of gas?

23:33

No. So why would

23:35

you, why would you want that?

23:39

I don't know if you're going to feel like you're suffocating.

23:42

Does it put you to sleep? I

23:45

mean, that's what I would hope is

23:47

that, you know, it's like an ether

23:49

or something and you just go to sleep

23:51

and that's it. Well,

23:53

when we talked about those botched executions,

23:56

the gas chamber. Remember

23:59

they had to strap you to a chair

24:01

and they would tell you to breathe in,

24:03

but there were instances of people

24:06

shitting themselves, puking, pissing

24:09

all over the place. Yeah. So damn,

24:11

who knows what this is going to

24:13

do. And this has never been done

24:15

on a human before. Right.

24:19

So I'm certainly

24:21

his attorneys are appealing this,

24:23

but yeah. Why the fuck would he choose that?

24:26

I guess he doesn't want to go through whatever he went

24:28

through with the lethal injection.

24:31

I

24:31

guess. But see, that's like,

24:33

you know, when, when we talked about

24:35

this before. And we

24:38

were answering the question, what would you

24:40

want to have happen to you? If

24:43

you were going to be executed?

24:46

Firing squad.

24:47

That's what we said. It's like

24:50

one and done, you know? Yeah.

24:53

Just strap me to the chair. I'm going

24:55

to, you said, you're

24:57

going to stick your chest out. Like,

25:01

this is, this is where I want you to plan

25:03

it. Yeah.

25:06

Like,

25:07

yeah, damn, just

25:09

be done. So I remember

25:12

this has been, uh, maybe 15 or

25:14

20 years ago. I might've talked

25:16

about this on that episode, but. All

25:18

those botched executions with lethal

25:20

injection that they've had, there were

25:23

at least a couple in Ohio, I think,

25:25

in Oklahoma, and I don't know where else, evidently Alabama

25:27

too, but, uh,

25:29

there was a guy in Tennessee who

25:32

was going to be executed, and

25:34

Tennessee's law Was

25:37

at least at that time that

25:39

when you're sentenced to death,

25:41

you can choose how

25:44

you want to die among the methods

25:46

of execution that were available when

25:49

you were convicted of capital

25:51

murder and he didn't

25:53

want to go through all that. And

25:55

so he chose the electric chair and

26:00

I think he's the last

26:02

one or most recent one to be

26:04

executed by electric chair in the US. But

26:07

that was, yeah, I want to say that was like 2010,

26:10

maybe a little bit before that. See,

26:13

I can't imagine that either.

26:15

No, no. The pain

26:17

that you would have and it's

26:19

not instantaneous. That's the thing.

26:22

I want it to be instantaneous

26:26

and that's what I can't imagine even

26:28

though like with

26:30

a lethal injection. You

26:32

know, you're going to sleep. It's well,

26:36

I assume it's not painful.

26:38

I don't know, but I've

26:41

assumed it wouldn't be with, with

26:44

what the drugs are that you're getting and

26:46

it is putting you to sleep first

26:48

paralyzes you and so

26:50

on, I'm still thinking

26:53

about

26:53

it. I know. Yeah.

26:56

That's horrible. As

26:57

it's happening. I

26:59

mean, of course, even in front of a firing squad,

27:01

you're thinking about, Oh, when's the shot coming?

27:05

But it's like when

27:07

the shot happens, it's over as

27:09

opposed to, Oh, they've started

27:11

the drugs and I know

27:13

this. Yeah, I,

27:15

I

27:16

would, I think I would die of

27:18

a heart

27:18

attack. Well, I'm having to get

27:20

a deep breath talking about it. Damn.

27:22

I, I cannot imagine. Did

27:25

you see the movie? I saw the movie, but

27:27

I also read the book Dead Man Walking.

27:29

Yes. I think I only

27:32

saw it once. It was a long time ago,

27:34

but it was good.

27:36

Yeah. The first part of that

27:38

book, holy shit.

27:40

Cause it's going through his

27:43

like final hours. Like

27:46

he's talking to his family and

27:48

holy hell. Like it was, it

27:51

was intense going through all that

27:53

reading it and knowing like, if you're in

27:55

his shoes, you know, you're about to die. Like, I

27:57

can't, I don't know how people breathe at

27:59

that point. You know what's coming.

28:02

I don't know

28:03

either. That was a

28:04

true story, right? It was.

28:06

Yeah. Yeah, I

28:09

want to see what happens with this guy

28:11

in Alabama, what the courts are going to say

28:13

about it. Yeah,

28:15

no kidding. Wasn't,

28:17

uh, was the name of that movie, um,

28:20

The Life of David Gale? Oh,

28:23

that's a good movie. Was that one? Yeah.

28:26

I was trying to remember if that was exactly the name,

28:29

but yeah. Yeah. That was a really

28:31

good one. Very interesting

28:33

perspective on the death penalty

28:35

right there. Man,

28:37

so that had Kevin Spacey in it. I

28:39

recently watched, again, American

28:41

Beauty. You like that movie? Yeah,

28:44

it's a good movie. It's a great movie. Best

28:47

picture of that year too. Did

28:50

it win best picture? Yeah, it sure did. Well,

28:52

that makes sense because it's so good. That's

28:54

funny. It's got some heavy stuff in it, but it's

28:57

funny. It's funny,

28:58

it's weird, it's deep.

29:00

Uh, I like it a lot.

29:03

Yeah, I watched it again within the

29:05

last year or so. And,

29:08

you know, there were parts of it that I had forgotten.

29:10

I was just like, yeah, that is... That's

29:13

some quality

29:13

stuff. Sure is. So

29:17

you should watch this movie. It was good.

29:19

Um, and

29:21

it's based on a true story. American

29:25

made it's got Tom Cruise

29:27

in it. I had never even heard of

29:29

it. It's on Netflix.

29:32

So this guy. Was

29:35

an airline pilot. This is the 1970s.

29:37

He was an airline pilot for

29:40

TWA. Mm-Hmm. And

29:43

the CIA, uh,

29:45

contacts him. This guy just meets

29:48

up with him in an airport and

29:51

they want him to, um,

29:54

start. Uh,

29:56

what did he initially start doing? I don't remember.

29:58

He ended up running... Uh,

30:01

he ended up working for the CIA, and

30:04

flying planes down to

30:06

Nicaragua and Colombia,

30:08

but he ends up running

30:10

drugs and guns for

30:13

the cartel, and he like gets

30:15

in with Pablo Escobar, kinda reminds

30:18

me of Blow. Yeah, you know that

30:20

movie? Yeah. But anyway, it's

30:22

good. Yeah, you should check that out. American

30:24

Made. It's a true story? Yeah,

30:26

it is. Yeah. Wow.

30:28

And, yeah, that's all I'll say. I don't want

30:30

to spoil anything, but yeah, it's good. But

30:32

he

30:32

was doing that while he was working for the CIA?

30:35

Yep. He sure was. Oh, right. Yeah.

30:38

Cause it was during, so by the time

30:40

he was doing that it was the early 80s and

30:42

that was when, uh, Reagan

30:44

wanted us to support the contrast

30:47

fighting the, the Sandinistas, remember all

30:49

that shit and you know, the communist government

30:51

and Nicaragua. And so

30:53

he was in with all that yeah. Man.

30:56

Sometimes

30:57

I hear about things that were going on in

30:59

the seventies and. And

31:01

I was, you know, young and

31:03

not knowing or paying attention to

31:05

anything. And I go, man, you

31:07

really missed out on some good shit.

31:10

I know it. Yeah.

31:13

I

31:14

mean, what do we like, what do we

31:16

have like that going on now? I

31:18

don't know.

31:19

Maybe it is. And yeah,

31:22

I mean, it seems like

31:24

you could get away with a lot more

31:26

back then. Like there just wasn't,

31:29

wasn't the intelligence, right?

31:32

Okay. There wasn't the intelligence, you

31:34

know, that they have now. In fact, that's one thing

31:36

he ended up doing with the CIA as he was

31:38

trying to get pictures, evidence,

31:41

uh, of, uh, the cartel

31:44

using illegal drugs and, or

31:46

not their guns. And,

31:48

uh, you know, getting

31:50

people's faces, uh, on camera

31:53

and all that today,

31:55

they just fly a drone over and yeah,

32:02

well, I don't know how we got off on that. Uh,

32:06

what were we botched executions?

32:09

I don't know. Oh, uh, Kevin Spacey. Talking

32:11

about movies. Yeah. Yeah.

32:13

Kevin Spacey. And then I thought of

32:15

American beauty. Yeah. Well, that's

32:17

how our minds work. Speaking

32:20

of that, the guy, uh, with

32:23

the execution and choosing the

32:25

gas chamber, this

32:28

is, uh, this has been probably four

32:30

or five years ago, but there was a guy in Pennsylvania

32:34

who was. Convicted

32:36

of murder and he was sentenced to life

32:38

in prison. And

32:41

while in prison, he,

32:44

uh, had a heart attack or something, but

32:47

they had to rush him to the

32:49

prison hospital or infirmary or whatever

32:52

they call it. And they had to do the, the

32:55

paddles, you know, the shock thing,

32:57

whatever, to start his heart again. And

33:01

they did. And

33:03

so he contacted

33:05

his attorney and his attorney, talking

33:07

about attorneys actually having to make an argument

33:09

with a straight face, he

33:12

argued that

33:15

he was sentenced to life in prison

33:18

and his life ended so

33:20

he can now not be re imprisoned.

33:23

Oh yeah, I

33:25

remember

33:26

that. Yeah, I was going to say you

33:28

might remember it because it's one of those stories that,

33:30

you know, makes the rounds pretty easily. Uh,

33:33

but the, the judge said, nice

33:35

try, but no, still

33:37

the same life.

33:40

Okay. Well, when, when do you,

33:42

well, I guess your life has to be permanently

33:45

over, not temporarily.

33:47

I guess so. Yeah. Yeah. But

33:49

pretty, uh, novel argument, I'd

33:51

say. It is.

33:53

That's a pretty, yeah, I like that. That's a good

33:55

argument. Okay.

34:00

So I saw an article the other day.

34:02

Um, that caught my attention. It's,

34:05

it sounds kind of crazy on the face of

34:07

it, but it says hobbyists

34:10

push back against 3d

34:12

printer crackdowns. And

34:15

the basis of it is, it says

34:17

there are laws in New York and California,

34:20

or they're trying to make laws, to

34:23

make it more difficult to buy

34:25

3D printers because

34:28

people are using it to print

34:30

guns and gun parts with

34:33

those 3D printers. Yeah,

34:37

I've heard of that. I've heard of

34:39

that too, but I never thought

34:41

about them

34:44

actually cracking down on the printer itself,

34:48

and that's just kind of fascinating to me.

34:51

Do you know how

34:51

three D printers work?

34:54

I don't have a clue.

34:56

I mean, some alone.

34:59

I understand the concept a little

35:01

well. Okay. I don't know. Let's

35:03

back up a little bit. It's

35:05

hard enough to understand how a normal

35:08

printer works. It's

35:10

so true. I mean,

35:13

let's just go back to dot matrix

35:15

stuff. I am a tech person

35:18

and I don't understand when

35:21

you say print, what

35:24

makes it. Actually get the

35:26

stuff onto the paper. I

35:28

just take that for granted right there.

35:31

And that's, that's when you got something

35:33

impacting the page. Now you

35:35

want to go to like ink jets

35:38

and, and laser printers and stuff

35:40

like that. That's a whole other thing.

35:42

Yeah, it is. Uh, no, I don't

35:45

get it either. This makes me think of our

35:47

conversations before, like, if it were up to

35:49

us, we'd be shitting in a hole,

35:51

but you said, what would we dig the hole with?

35:54

Have to invent

35:54

the shovel.

35:56

Yep. So yeah, I don't

35:58

know how anything works. And you can

36:00

add 3D printers to that list,

36:02

I have no clue, I'd like to see

36:05

it, like, I guess I can YouTube it, but,

36:07

what the hell, like, how do you, what

36:09

the fuck is in the printer that is creating

36:13

whatever you're printing, a gun, like,

36:15

how does that happen?

36:16

So, so that I know, it's

36:18

a filament, and it, so

36:20

you buy it on a spool. And

36:23

it, I mean, it looks like it's

36:25

thicker than thread, but

36:28

what could I equate it to almost

36:30

like it's thinner than this, but

36:32

almost like, um, a

36:34

spool, a weed eater line, you

36:37

know, just something like that. That's

36:39

plastic and,

36:41

but thinner than that. And,

36:44

so you load that into the printer,

36:47

and however the printer gets

36:49

its instructions, it just starts building,

36:52

going back and forth to build the

36:54

thing in layers, so

36:57

that's what causes it to become

36:59

3D, like it can lay

37:01

out, you know, one

37:03

level of that filament, obviously

37:06

very quickly, but then it just

37:08

keeps laying down

37:10

the filament. And

37:13

it's melting it together, I guess,

37:15

that, that makes it mold into that

37:17

shape. But I mean, you know,

37:19

they use, they use some 3d printers.

37:22

They've printed organs with

37:26

those things. Like, I

37:29

was about to ask, what do

37:31

they use 3d printers for?

37:34

Um, it said hobbyists are pushing

37:37

back, like, what do people use this

37:39

for? Are these, is this like

37:41

everyday people who, who have this

37:43

ability, like 3D printers?

37:45

Or are these like thousands and thousands

37:48

and thousands of dollars? See, I'm just

37:50

ignorant on all

37:50

this. You can actually, so I didn't know

37:53

this until recently that there were some

37:55

this cheap. 3D

37:57

printer in the low hundreds. Oh,

38:00

wow. OK. Yeah, like two, three

38:02

hundred dollars. So

38:05

you can get started with it at

38:07

that level. So from

38:10

that, so to answer your question, I mean, hobbyists.

38:13

Yeah, I mean, it could be a hobbyist

38:15

of anything that wants

38:17

to print something. Think

38:19

about We don't even need Chinese

38:21

organ thieves. You could just

38:23

print an organ. Just print your own organ.

38:27

Yeah.

38:29

This just seems kind of, uh, I don't know

38:31

if stereotypical is the right word,

38:34

but thinking of a hobbyist, I'm thinking

38:36

like model railroading or something.

38:38

You know, that you could just OK. Print

38:40

out models of buildings,

38:42

you know, to put on your. Model

38:45

railroad and stuff, or

38:47

people, people that are, I've

38:49

seen this, people that are into,

38:51

um, home automation

38:54

stuff. They print little boxes

38:57

to hold controllers and things

38:59

like, you know, for little bitty computer

39:01

boards. And so they're printing little

39:04

plastic boxes that are just the

39:06

size they need and things

39:08

like that. I mean, back to.

39:11

Your question about who's doing

39:13

this, people

39:15

have printed like toys

39:17

and things, you know, printing off

39:19

plastic toys for key

39:22

chains and things like that, or

39:24

people sell that kind of stuff on Etsy.

39:28

I

39:28

wonder if these bills are going to pass,

39:30

will they actually become law? I

39:32

don't know, it seems, it seems

39:34

strange, like you're just going to

39:37

ban 3D printers, like the whole

39:39

thing, when so

39:41

far only one thing

39:43

that they've printed is the problem.

39:46

Right. I, that's what I

39:48

thought. I, I get it. And

39:51

yes, it's a concern, but

39:55

what about people who are good at metalworking

39:58

and welding and forging?

40:00

Like, again, I know nothing

40:02

about that stuff. People

40:05

could make guns that way.

40:08

Yeah. Like they've always made guns. Yeah.

40:12

Did you see the movie in the line of fire?

40:15

Yeah. Oh yeah. He had that

40:18

plastic.

40:19

I think it was wooden, wooden area. It

40:21

was, it was not metal. I thought it was wooden

40:24

or plastic or both. He

40:26

made a gun so he could get it in there to try

40:28

to kill the president. Yeah. And

40:31

would that even work? Could you make

40:33

a wooden gun? I

40:36

guess so. Why does it have to be metal?

40:38

Well, it doesn't really. I

40:41

mean, if you think about, and

40:43

I don't know if there was anything, cause

40:45

now that I'm thinking about it, like, what

40:47

did that shoot? Cause

40:49

if it's a, a metal bullet, then

40:52

that would, should still get caught by

40:55

a metal

40:55

detector. But so

40:58

now that you asked that, I remember he

41:00

put a bullet in a,

41:02

uh, a key

41:04

chain, a rabbit's foot key

41:06

chain. So he unscrewed it and

41:09

put the bullet in there and then screwed it back.

41:11

So when he goes through the metal detector, he just puts

41:13

his keys on the thing and. Yeah.

41:15

Nice. Okay. Yeah. Pretty

41:20

creative, right? That is. That

41:23

was a good one. I didn't remember that part of it. That

41:25

was a really good movie. I didn't remember that

41:27

part of it. Okay. Well, there you go.

41:29

Because I mean, in

41:31

order to get a bullet to fire, all

41:34

you need is something to hit the back of

41:36

it hard enough. To ignite

41:38

it. So if

41:40

you've got, and that's what he had, he had

41:42

something that was spring loaded that just

41:44

hit the back of it with the wood.

41:48

Yeah. I just, I don't know what to think about

41:50

that again. I get the idea,

41:52

I get the concern, but that's

41:55

just, that's casting a really

41:57

wide net. Yeah. To

41:59

think that you're going to ban the whole

42:01

printer just because of that.

42:04

Yeah, I agree. We'll see.

42:07

There

42:07

you go. Yeah. It's a little news

42:09

story we'll have to watch.

42:14

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43:20

Covered a lot today. More botched

43:22

executions.

43:23

Yeah. And 3d guns.

43:26

Yeah. And how to

43:28

sneak a bullet in,

43:31

put it in your key chain. Yeah. We're

43:33

very helpful. We're very how to on this

43:36

podcast. Come back next week. Alright,

43:41

that is an episode wrap, and we will be back

43:43

next week. Until then, so

43:45

long.