0:00

Hi there and welcome along to this week's Sunday

0:02

Supplement podcast with me, Vicki Gomesaw, and the assistant

0:04

editor of The Mirror, Darren Lewis. Our

0:07

chief reporter, Carve Solicor, joins us today. As

0:09

we look ahead to the huge game between

0:11

Liverpool and Manchester City, we discuss how important

0:13

Klopp and Pep's rivalry has been for the

0:15

Premier League. We also reflect on

0:18

Manchester United's 2-0 victory over Everton and

0:20

ask whether it will appease the doubters.

0:22

Plus, Villa welcome Tottenham in the battle

0:24

for a Champions League place. But who

0:26

has had the better season so far,

0:28

Emery or Ange? Right, let's get

0:30

to Manchester United now and they beat Everton

0:33

2-0 at Old Trafford to make it five

0:35

wins in seven league games. Look, both goals

0:37

came from penalties, Carve. Will this

0:40

go any way to convincing any

0:42

doubters over Manchester United's performances? Look,

0:45

I mean, they got the win, but I don't think

0:47

it was a great performance. Everton

0:50

played really well, they had so many chances.

0:53

On another day, they could have taken

0:55

the chances. They gave away

0:57

two penalties they really

0:59

shouldn't have given away. But

1:02

I don't think it was that great

1:04

a performance from United, despite

1:07

the result. And I still think they've

1:09

really got their work cut out to

1:12

finish in one of the Champions League places.

1:14

They faced, Darren, over 450 shots this season.

1:18

Only Sheffield United have faced

1:21

more. 450,

1:23

yeah. It's over, it's round

1:25

about the 467 mark. Well,

1:28

Everton yesterday, the fifth side in six games,

1:30

have 20-plus shots against them and

1:32

a tenth in the Premier League so far

1:34

this season. And I've been on

1:36

here many times when you've said to me, oh my

1:38

goodness, United turning a corner. And

1:40

we've said many times, a

1:43

club of United stature, the odd win here and

1:45

there, scraping past teams in the bottom half of

1:47

the Premier League, that's not turning a corner. We've

1:49

got to see a consistency of performance as well

1:51

as a consistency

1:55

of victories. And

1:57

we're not seeing that from... But five out of seven, that's

1:59

not... bad is it you know i'm trying to put

2:01

a positive spin on things but you shouldn't have to put

2:04

a spin on it where you know we've all grown up

2:06

on a Manchester United side that know how to win know

2:08

how to dominate know how to entertain at the same time

2:11

and okay you might say in the race for

2:15

silverware in the race for a top four

2:17

place maybe top five we never know it

2:20

we'll talk about that later in terms of

2:22

the the coefficient and the possibility of a

2:24

Champions League place but winning

2:27

you could argue is all that matters right

2:29

now with some justification but the facts are

2:31

that if you look at Manchester United aside

2:34

the cutting edge aside with belief aside that's

2:36

willing to go toe to toe with them

2:39

or scare them and in some at

2:41

some points take points off them maybe even beat

2:43

them they've closed the gap to Villa

2:45

who are currently occupying that fourth place but it

2:48

could go down to five just explain for those

2:50

people that are sleepy eyed blurry eyed on a

2:52

Sunday morning not knowing why we could have five

2:54

Champions League places well there's going to be

2:57

a new format for the Champions League

2:59

next season there's four extra teams going to

3:01

play in it and two

3:04

of those places are going to

3:06

go to the countries whose teams

3:08

perform best in Europe this season

3:11

so potentially the Premier

3:13

League could get an extra place in the Champions

3:16

League next season so finishing fifth would

3:19

get you into the Champions League potentially

3:21

it all depends on how well English

3:23

clubs do in Europe this season at

3:26

the moment if

3:28

you look at the table the coefficient

3:30

table England the third okay

3:33

uh Italy and I think Germany are

3:35

above them so at the moment fifth place

3:37

won't get you a place

3:39

in the Champions League but potentially it could

3:42

but I mean what does the world come to when

3:44

we're sitting here talking about you know

3:46

Manchester United trying to finish fifth to

3:49

get into the Champions League and should decide

3:51

who finished fifth even be

3:54

in the Champions League what's the point of

3:56

a side who finished fifth being in the

3:58

Champions League apart from the fact that

4:01

they'll make lots of money

4:03

out of it. I mean that's

4:06

what modern football has become now. I

4:08

know lots of other countries in

4:10

Europe are not happy with the

4:12

fact that you're going to potentially

4:15

have five teams from the Premier

4:17

League playing in the Champions League.

4:19

So a quarter of

4:21

the teams in the Premier League could end up playing

4:23

in the so-called Champions League. No.

4:26

Let's talk about money because there's

4:28

this redevelopment of Old

4:30

Trafford and the surrounding area was

4:33

announced on Friday. Do they

4:36

need to come in line? They need

4:38

to step in line with other stadiums

4:41

around them that are being developed? Well,

4:43

I mean, very simple terms we've heard from people

4:46

who have played the game here on Sky Sports. Gary

4:48

Neville's talked often about the

4:51

state of the stadium, particularly

4:53

when you compare it to

4:55

the Tottenham Hotspur Stadium and

4:57

some of the stadium around

4:59

Europe. Old

5:01

Trafford by comparison, as we're sticking to the

5:03

Old Wembley, it's been

5:05

talked about in hallowed terms. But

5:07

actually when you went there to

5:09

cover games, cover matches, the

5:12

state of it was nowhere near. I remember

5:14

when I was a young reporter in the

5:16

last days of the Old Wembley, I remember

5:18

being, obviously you are overawed by

5:20

the grandeur and the history around the place. But

5:23

in terms of certain realities around when you

5:25

were there and you looked in some of

5:27

the facilities, you just thought to yourself, this

5:29

is nowhere near what I expected it to

5:31

be. And I think that's a reality for

5:33

a lot of people. I know when we

5:36

do the papers later, I'll talk a little

5:38

bit about where that money should come from

5:40

because I'm not so sure it should come

5:42

from the public purse when you have guys

5:44

who are worth billions in charge of the

5:46

club. But in terms of

5:48

the need for it to upgrade to

5:51

be in line with the facilities on

5:53

offer at, say, the Etihad campus, for

5:55

example, Liverpool, I

5:58

was at their training ground last month.

6:00

as I was saying, the facilities are

6:02

magnificent, the stadium's magnificent, they upgraded it

6:04

very recently, united by comparison,

6:07

it is in need of an upgrade. And

6:09

so in answer to your question, yes. Okay,

6:11

thank you. In

6:13

terms of the performances on the pitch,

6:15

though, they have got Liverpool

6:18

in the FA Cup, haven't they? That's next

6:21

weekend, I think. It would

6:23

be some statement, wouldn't it, if they rained on Joden

6:25

Klopp's parade and win that game?

6:29

I mean, it's possible.

6:32

I wouldn't discount it. You

6:35

know, I still think one off. Yes,

6:37

Manchester United potentially could

6:39

win that game. I always think

6:41

back to the sort of 80s, 70s,

6:46

when actually Liverpool had a much

6:48

better side than Manchester United.

6:50

Obviously, Liverpool in that area won lots

6:52

of title, won lots of

6:55

European Cups, but in one offs Manchester

6:58

United always used to do

7:00

very well against Liverpool, because they knew

7:02

how much that game meant to the

7:04

supporters and the club. But

7:08

do Manchester United now have the

7:10

kind of players with

7:12

the kind of characters that they had

7:15

in those days? You know, the Brian

7:17

Roxins, the Norman Whitesides, the Mark Hughes.

7:20

Do they? What?

7:24

Short answer is no, they don't. And

7:26

you were talking about Manchester United side that lost

7:29

seven nil to Liverpool. You

7:31

know, when I was growing up, it would be unthinkable

7:34

for Manchester United side to lose seven

7:36

nil to their biggest

7:38

rivals. But you know, that's what's

7:41

happened recently. So could they

7:43

beat Liverpool? Yes, I think they could.

7:45

But if I was a betting man,

7:47

obviously, I wouldn't put money on it.

7:50

Okay. Let's talk to a man who was at

7:52

Old Trafford yesterday. And that was the Times reporter,

7:55

Paul Hurst. Good morning, Paul. Are you well? Good

7:57

morning. Very well. Thank you, Vicky. Good to see you.

8:00

you. Let's reflect then on that victory

8:02

for United. They're in a good run

8:04

of results that have to be said,

8:06

but was there a positive atmosphere in

8:08

the stadium? Well,

8:10

I think the overriding emotion was

8:12

relief really. I know we've probably

8:14

said this a few times before, but I think

8:17

the feeling was there that if they lost that match, it

8:19

would have been probably been curtain for their top

8:21

four bids. I know obviously as you've been talking

8:23

about, you can get in the Champions League if

8:26

you finish the first potential of the season.

8:28

But it was a game that

8:30

United should have been winning. When you look at

8:32

the features, you think Everton at home, they

8:35

should win that. Everton

8:38

had a lot of possession. There are a lot

8:40

of chances. 23

8:43

shots in total. United

8:46

were just very open, I

8:48

thought, in midfield. Casamiro looked way

8:50

off the pace. So Everton had lots of chances,

8:52

but it was Garnaccio's trickery

8:54

that won the day for United. So I think

8:56

everyone was just relieved that they got over the

8:59

line, basically. Paul, you mentioned

9:01

Garnaccio there. Obviously, he looked

9:03

like United's best player yesterday.

9:06

Do you think this has been a real breakthrough

9:08

season for him? Yeah,

9:10

I think this has been,

9:12

Garnaccio's by far his best season,

9:15

he's seven goals, three assists, which

9:17

you maybe think he should have got more. But

9:20

it's a fairly good return that when you consider

9:22

how poor United have been this season, how

9:25

many injuries they've had, people

9:27

around him have been moving positions, he's had to

9:29

move positions as well. He's got

9:31

different players playing around him. And,

9:34

you know, Tenhogs said yesterday that he loves

9:36

him. And you go back to the start

9:38

of Tenhogs reign as United

9:40

manager, they fell out, but Garnaccio was

9:42

late for a breakfast meeting on

9:45

a pre-season tour in Bangkok. Tenhogs,

9:48

disciplined at Aryan, didn't like that, dropped him

9:50

for the rest of the tour. And

9:52

then even when he played in the first team last season, there

9:55

were Tenhogs, he got the impression that

9:57

he wasn't completely happy with him. There

9:59

was a few backhanders. compliments there and then now

10:01

and then but now he seems to have

10:03

won him over completely and he's

10:06

just such a fearless character he

10:08

just takes the ball and runs

10:10

and he just you know gets the

10:12

gets the crowd off their seats and that's what you

10:14

know if you fans love isn't it a fearless attacking

10:16

winger. We're just

10:18

talking a second ago Hurstley about the

10:21

task force has been set up to

10:23

examine the options for redeveloping old

10:25

Trafford and the area of Manchester for

10:27

the new quote National Stadium I don't

10:30

know why I did that. A full

10:32

up, don't know.

10:34

What's the aim of the task

10:36

force? Well the task

10:38

force basically is set up to to

10:40

advise to Jim Ratcliffe and an INEos

10:42

about whether it's more plausible

10:44

to refurbish old Trafford or to build a

10:46

new stadium. Option A

10:48

had cost £1 billion we think, option B

10:51

had cost £2 billion and they

10:53

want to know basically

10:55

whether that's possible how you

10:58

would fund such a venture you know public

11:00

money has been spoken about you

11:02

know public private partnership whether that'd

11:04

be possible. There's

11:06

been a lot of questions about whether that's suitable given that

11:09

Jim Ratcliffe you know

11:11

he's a multi-billionaire but Andy

11:13

Burnham the mayor was was in old

11:15

Trafford yesterday and he was saying that

11:17

that public funding will be a part

11:20

of this bid you know regardless of whether

11:22

it's a refurbishment or a

11:24

new stadium so basically Lord

11:26

Coe, Andy Burnham, Gary Neville

11:29

and a few others have been it's their

11:31

job now to report back in a few

11:33

months about which one's more plausible the new

11:35

new build or the refurb. Look

11:40

in terms of the two managers here

11:42

we've got Unai Emery and Ange Postecoglou

11:44

who's had the better season because they've

11:46

had fantastic seasons but who's been better

11:48

Carvey? Tricky question yeah

11:52

I'm going to go say both. No no no

11:54

I'm going to the

11:57

league table doesn't lie so I'm going to

11:59

say Unai Emery. They're

12:02

above Spurs. He's got

12:05

an incredible pedigree as a

12:07

manager anyway. Did

12:09

brilliant jobs at Villa Real, his

12:11

manager at PSG. I thought he

12:13

started off doing a great job

12:15

at Arsenal. I remember watching some

12:18

Arsenal games in his early days

12:20

there and I thought, wow, he's

12:23

really got them playing. But

12:25

obviously things didn't work out for him there. But

12:27

he's proving what a great manager he is at

12:30

Aston Villa. And a couple of days

12:33

ago, I think I saw a really

12:35

good interview with John McGinn, who was

12:37

going into detail about exactly what Unai

12:40

Emery does behind the scenes, tactically the

12:42

way he wants them to play. And

12:44

he did make the point that in

12:47

the early days, people

12:49

didn't necessarily buy into it straight away.

12:51

He was saying even some Aston Villa

12:54

supporters weren't sure about what Unai Emery

12:56

was trying to do. But

12:58

if you see the way they're playing now, you

13:01

realise what a great manager he is. Not

13:04

taking anything away from Anj Postekoglu as

13:06

well, because he's doing a fantastic job

13:08

at Spurs. You know,

13:10

Spurs fans are excited about going and

13:12

seeing their team play again. They're not

13:15

dreading going to Spurs

13:17

games. He's got a brilliant connection

13:20

with Spurs supporters and

13:22

the media as well. He's a pleasure to

13:24

deal with for us as well.

13:26

So two brilliant managers, two great

13:28

additions to the Premier League. But if you're

13:31

going to put me on the spot who's

13:33

had a better season, I think at the

13:35

moment, as things stand, it looks like it's

13:37

Unai Emery. I was only half joking when

13:39

I said both, because I remember

13:41

our first show this season when

13:44

Harry Kane had been sold and

13:47

everyone was predicting doom and gloom for

13:49

Spurs. And they've scored in

13:51

every game under Postekoglu so far this

13:53

season. The players have stepped up to take

13:55

responsibility. They have no right to be in

13:57

this fight for. potential

14:00

Champions League place and yet they are and

14:02

had Harry Kane been ripping it up as

14:04

he is at the moment in

14:06

Germany and Spurs not been scoring these

14:09

goals, Spurs would have been hammered,

14:11

the club would have been hammered, the people who

14:13

in charge of recruitment would have been hammered, we

14:15

know it goes, Daniel Lee would have been turned

14:17

into a pantomime villain but

14:19

instead they're having a terrific season so

14:21

I don't think one is necessarily better

14:23

than the other as you know you're

14:25

absolutely right to point out how well

14:27

Villa have done under Emery because they've

14:29

been sensational particularly at home. I

14:33

said last week that their away record was letting them down

14:35

as someone got in touch with social media and waved their

14:37

finger at me and said we got one the best away

14:41

records in the Premier League and that's true but

14:43

if you look at the teams that have lost

14:45

against teams you'd expect them to pick up points

14:47

against on the road had they

14:49

picked those points up they'd be

14:51

challenging for third place let alone

14:54

being in fourth but I think

14:56

they've both had superb seasons both

14:58

been terrifically managed, terrifically

15:00

is not a word. I

15:02

didn't want to say that, it's

15:05

early it's fine. Both of these

15:07

superbly well managed and I think both of

15:09

them the fact that they are involved in

15:11

this match is a real testament. I think

15:13

it'd be great to see Aston Villa back

15:15

in the Champions League as

15:17

well because some of us are old enough

15:20

to remember them actually winning the

15:22

European Cup so just about I think I

15:24

remember that but I mean they do have

15:26

European pedigree

15:30

and you really feel that when you go

15:33

to Villa Park as well just

15:35

the way the club is set up

15:37

and the history of the club I think it'd

15:39

be fantastic for them to get back in there

15:41

and also Ollie Watkins I have to say has

15:43

been one of the players of the season I

15:46

mean his performances have been incredible

15:49

and I would not be surprised

15:51

at all if he was the difference maker

15:53

today. Very quickly Ollie Watkins or Ivan Toni

15:55

thought that another place

15:58

alongside Harry Kane alongside but

16:00

in the squad. You know, I don't keep

16:02

putting me on the spot. For

16:05

what it's worth, I mean, who cares what I think.

16:07

But, you know, if I was

16:10

the England manager and I had to pick

16:12

one, I'd probably go for Ollie Watkins. You

16:14

have to, in some respects, you'd have to go with

16:16

Ollie Watkins. He's got all the statistics, I think.

16:19

Yeah, but, I mean, Tony,

16:22

he plays very similar to the way that Kane

16:24

plays, dropping deep. He doesn't just score goals, he's

16:26

got that aerial ability. He's good from close range,

16:28

obviously he's good from the spot as well, but

16:31

there's so much more to his game than that.

16:33

And I just think the vision that he offers

16:35

you, they're both

16:37

fantastic players. And I think- Well,

16:40

absolutely. Well, almost, but he didn't. So, you

16:42

know, I'm playing devil's advocate here, but he didn't

16:44

score, it was safe. So, you know, bottom

16:47

line is Ollie Watkins is doing it. He's got

16:49

the assists, he's got the goals, and he's probably

16:51

going to get a couple today, you'd think. Well,

16:53

let's have a look at this because you mentioned

16:55

John McGinn a second ago, and he's been in

16:58

the papers today. It's in a

17:00

Sunday mirror. And Ollie, John

17:02

McGinn's saying, and if you

17:04

look at the sub-deck there,

17:06

the star, John admits that this

17:08

is the biggest match of

17:11

our time. And it is

17:13

indeed. In their recent history,

17:16

the opportunity to go to the

17:18

next level and acquire

17:21

the status which would allow the club to

17:23

attract a higher caliber of player,

17:25

marks this down as a very,

17:27

very significant game. And some

17:30

teams, they get into Europe, Champions

17:33

League, and they're just banking on the revenue,

17:35

the money. That's not the case with Unai

17:37

Emery. When he gets into these competitions, he

17:39

takes them seriously. He gets clubs like Villa

17:41

Real, who are made

17:43

up largely of castoffs from other Premier League

17:46

teams and other European teams, but he molds

17:48

some of the parts so superbly well that

17:50

they were forced to be reckoned with at

17:52

the latter end of these European campaigns.

17:55

One last point to make. I

17:58

think this will go down to the wire. And here's why

18:00

I remember 11 years ago

18:02

this month, Andre Villas-Bois at

18:04

Spurs, he'd just beaten Arsenal.

18:07

They were seven points clear in the race

18:09

for a top four place. And

18:11

he talked about Arsenal being in a negative spiral.

18:13

I always remember his fourth of March, 2013. And

18:18

Arsenal went on to beat Spurs by

18:20

a point to a top four place.

18:22

And it just goes to show that

18:25

as you get to this age, Sir

18:27

Alex Ferguson so very famously called Squeaky

18:29

One Time, it's about holding your

18:31

nerve and coping with the pressure and the intensity of

18:33

the matches. Okay. It

18:38

has been some rivalry, hasn't it? And Joon

18:40

Klopp opened up on his relationship with Pep

18:42

Guardiola, saying that he plans to meet with

18:44

him after he leaves Anfield.

18:46

Speaking to Vinnie O'Connor, Klopp also

18:49

didn't rule out the possibility, even

18:52

though it could be slim, of returning to

18:54

the club in the future. When

18:57

it comes to a game like this, though, you've often said

18:59

if you were at home, if

19:01

you weren't involved, that you'd be watching this particular

19:03

game. So next year, when you are watching from

19:05

home, how much would you miss the involvement in

19:07

a game like this? I have no idea. I

19:10

will see it. It's been a habit for a

19:12

long time. So I was always very

19:14

often involved in these kind of games. So

19:18

maybe I'm in a stadium and I

19:21

wanted to understand, which would be cool. But,

19:24

no, I don't know. How

19:27

then would you somewhat derivory that's developed between

19:29

Liverpool and Manchester City in your time here?

19:32

It was never about, I never felt it's

19:34

about us or City. It was not about

19:36

us showing that we have better, we wanted to

19:39

beat them on the day we meet them. That

19:41

was the idea and we could do that a

19:43

couple of times. But

19:45

it is the most difficult football game

19:47

in the world. But

19:50

I didn't enjoy it anyway. So that's

19:53

all it is. As a manager, though, you've got a

19:55

winning record against Pep Gaudíneur. I

19:57

have no idea. I don't have Pep Gaudíneur. You

20:00

wore more games than him. Not

20:04

in general, just when we met, yeah, but that's I don't

20:06

know. I

20:09

can't even remember how the very first one was probably in

20:11

Germany, the Super Cup before the season. I think it was

20:13

a 4-2. Pep was only there for a few

20:15

weeks. But

20:17

the impact he has on the teams

20:20

and the clubs he's working for and

20:22

the teams he is working with is

20:24

ridiculous. And so at that time,

20:26

for sure, we had a little

20:29

advantage because I knew my team longer than he

20:31

knew his team. And since that

20:33

is then probably equal, which is, I

20:35

take as one of the

20:38

highlights of my career, and

20:42

if I write, I don't know, we could

20:44

meet in the FA Cup as well. So

20:47

it's not for harvesting given that I have

20:49

this even record. It's just,

20:51

I want to say, when we meet Man

20:53

City, and it's never about Pep and me,

20:55

but of course that's the world we are

20:58

living in, it's a bit built

21:00

up like that, that's fine. But

21:03

for me it's not to prove that

21:06

I'm better than Pep because I know I'm not.

21:09

People might not believe it or believe it or

21:11

not, but we have a lot of respect for

21:13

each other. So I really

21:15

think if you wouldn't be in charge, we would probably even

21:18

like each other. And I think if we do, I don't

21:20

know 100%. And

21:24

if he now, when I'm not be in charge

21:26

anymore of a football club and we will not

21:28

face each other, I'm pretty sure we will meet

21:31

at one point and I will

21:34

talk through all these things,

21:36

what we experience together. We understand that the owners

21:39

have looked to bring in Michael Edwards back as

21:41

well. I just wonder how important a step that

21:43

would be as well in building on what you

21:45

are going to leave behind here. I

21:49

want the club to do well, really well,

21:51

extremely well, even better than it is now.

21:57

I think we create an incredible basis. We

22:00

learned so much together. Do you think you could ever be

22:02

tempted back? Obviously, we don't know whether Michael will, but do

22:04

you think in the future that maybe you could be tempted

22:06

to come back like Kenny Dalglish? I

22:10

have really no idea. I

22:12

have no idea. And obviously, this answer is not

22:14

this question. It's not to answer without creating any

22:16

kind of headlines, which is the opposite of

22:18

what I want to do. I

22:20

said what I said, and I mean what I said. I

22:23

will now coach a different club in England. So

22:25

if I will coach again afterwards, what I don't

22:27

know in the moment. Yeah, but it's not nothing

22:30

I'm thinking about at all. I

22:34

mean, let's talk about this rivalry

22:36

because he sort of says, you know, it's not really

22:39

about us, but it always is about us because, you

22:41

know, I guess we in the media create the narrative.

22:43

But in terms of this rivalry, what

22:45

have we lost once these two, you

22:47

know, where's the next big rivalry coming

22:50

from? Do you feel? There's

22:53

always managers coming through, but

22:55

I mean, these two are the sort of big

22:58

beasts of the jungle at the moment,

23:01

you know, to probably the best managers

23:03

in the world. Well,

23:05

you could put people like Carlo Ancelotti into

23:07

the mix as well. But,

23:10

you know, modern football is so

23:13

focused on personalities and there's

23:15

so much focus on managers

23:19

now. And they

23:21

are such compelling characters, both of

23:23

them. I think the only thing

23:26

that this rivalry misses and this

23:28

game is missing is sort

23:30

of needle between the two

23:32

managers because they do they do

23:35

get on. They do like each

23:37

other. Whereas, you know, in the old days

23:39

when you had real rivalries between the big

23:41

sides, you know, there was no love

23:43

lost for a finger and

23:45

that didn't really get on. And

23:47

you know, you had sort of confrontation between managers

23:50

on the touchline. You're not going to get that

23:53

unless there's a big flashpoint this afternoon

23:55

between these two. I think I was

23:57

reading something a few days ago about

23:59

when. Liverpool won the

24:02

Champions League in Madrid,

24:04

they were in the dressing room and

24:07

Pep Guardiola had got hold

24:09

of Jurgen Klopp's phone

24:12

number or... He

24:14

had called somebody... An assistant, wasn't it? An assistant,

24:16

he'd called him to congratulate

24:18

him and he spoke to Jurgen

24:20

straight away to congratulate him on

24:22

winning the European Cup. So there

24:24

is a really good relationship between

24:27

them. But you know, Pep

24:29

Guardiola is the greatest Manchester

24:31

City manager of all time. Jurgen

24:33

Klopp, one of the greatest Liverpool

24:35

managers of all time. I know a few people are

24:38

saying he's the greatest Liverpool manager

24:40

ever. I think you need to look

24:43

at history books and look at what

24:46

Bob Paisley did. I think he won what, six

24:48

titles, three European Cups. Yeah, he did very well.

24:51

I don't think Jurgen Klopp, even if he

24:53

comes back, is ever

24:55

going to beat Bob Paisley's record. But

24:57

they are really two of the best

24:59

managers in the world and I think

25:01

we'll certainly miss them when either one

25:03

of them or both of them leave.

25:06

It feels like that, doesn't it? In terms

25:08

of this rivalry, in terms of these two

25:10

managers, where do they rank for you, Darren,

25:12

in terms of going down the years? Below

25:16

Bob Paisley. Below. But then he

25:18

wasn't in Premier League. But

25:21

I think in terms of Wenger

25:24

and Sir Alex Ferguson, Sir

25:28

Alex and Jose Mourinho, Wenger

25:30

and Jose Mourinho, we

25:33

all remember their touchline spats and

25:37

there has always been an undercurrent of

25:39

culture against money. Even though

25:41

it's us, or whenever short of money, obviously

25:44

when they were building a new stadium there

25:46

were, but they were a

25:49

club that could acquire talent to rival

25:51

that money coming out of Stamford Bridge

25:54

at the time when Jose

25:56

Mourinho went across in Rome

25:58

Dravitch at the time. time was in

26:01

charge. I think this

26:03

rivalry is up alongside any of those. I'm quite

26:05

unique in so much as I

26:08

don't mind the edge not being

26:10

there and the reason for

26:12

that is that I look at all

26:14

of the quality on show and the

26:16

way that the debate is shaped by

26:18

that quality. You know the young players

26:20

coming through at Liverpool,

26:23

the consistency of the players at

26:26

City, the young players at City,

26:28

Oscar Bob who's doing superbly well,

26:30

kind of leading that particular charge.

26:33

The understudies at Liverpool have stepped

26:35

up, Kueva Kelleher who's been outstanding

26:37

to the point that people aren't

26:40

concerned that Alisson isn't playing today.

26:43

The fact that Liverpool can win without

26:45

Marcella, the fact

26:48

that the midfield at Liverpool has been

26:50

reshaped under Jurgen Klopp and you can't

26:52

see any dipping quality. There are

26:54

so many footballing areas of this

26:56

to talk about rather than the

26:59

managers themselves. I think as you were saying Carvey,

27:03

the Premier League has become a league where a

27:05

lot of the top managers around Europe they don't

27:07

believe they see

27:09

it now somewhere that they want to come and test themselves.

27:12

Even the very best managers, they aspire to come

27:15

here with lower level clubs. So for example you

27:17

get a Pellegrini taking a job at West

27:19

Ham where he could get a job at

27:21

a high-caliber club on the continent. It's because

27:23

this is the league where it's at. This

27:26

is the league where the managers want to

27:28

be. Guardiola, we all thought he would stay

27:30

maybe for three or four years, it's now

27:32

nine years and he's talking about wanting to

27:34

continue that dynasty and you're seeing that with

27:36

the players that are coming through. You're talking

27:38

about Jurgen Klopp potentially going

27:40

back, okay he doesn't want to make

27:42

a big deal about it so I

27:45

won't talk too much about it. But

27:47

just the idea that this is

27:49

the place where most managers with

27:52

club sides want to be is

27:54

the reason why we are having these

27:57

ravers. I maybe last line think

27:59

that next big rivalry will

28:01

be either between Arteta and

28:03

Ule Emery or Arteta and

28:06

Angel Post or Google because all three

28:08

of those sides really are

28:10

coming up very strongly. Yeah

28:12

just in terms of the fact he

28:14

doesn't rule it out but he certainly doesn't want to talk

28:17

about it. He certainly wants to sort of put a line

28:19

under the fact that he will never be a

28:22

manager for any other Premier League club

28:24

ever. That's really clear for him he's never going to go

28:27

to any other club in the Premier League but

28:30

he sort of didn't shut the door on potentially

28:32

maybe coming back in an advisory role maybe you

28:34

know if he can't live without football. Should

28:37

he ever go back? Do you think you should ever

28:39

go back? I mean we had a discussion in the

28:41

break about going back that was a private discussion but

28:44

you know should he go back do you think?

28:47

I think in a funny way for a Liverpool

28:49

supporter obviously you'd think yeah it'd be great to

28:51

have him back one day but maybe

28:55

you don't want him to come back because if he

28:58

was ever to come back it would suggest that things

29:00

have gone wrong and they're turning

29:02

to you know somebody from the past

29:04

to come back and relive those glory

29:07

days and from everything I'm hearing

29:09

about what's happening at Liverpool at the moment is

29:11

you know there's going to be so much change

29:13

this summer that they are working

29:15

on having the right structure in place

29:18

to manage that change and

29:20

to plan for the future you know

29:23

we know Michael Edwards is coming back I think

29:25

Richard Hughes is going to have a

29:28

role there as well they'll be

29:31

involved I think Michael Edwards certainly in

29:34

selecting a new manager I think

29:37

you know if somebody

29:40

like Javi Alonso comes in hits

29:42

the ground running Liverpool are doing

29:44

well under him last season I

29:46

don't think people will forget about Jurgen

29:48

Klopp but people won't be talking

29:50

about Jurgen Klopp and I still

29:52

think there's a possibility that we

29:55

could have Klopp versus Guardiola again

29:58

in the future I

30:00

think maybe, say in 10 years

30:02

time, it could be Klopp managing Germany,

30:05

Guardiola managing Spain, I

30:07

think, and Jose Mourinho

30:09

managing Portugal. In 10 years

30:11

time, well, probably safer somewhere. I

30:15

think that's where we'll end up in the long term. Okay,

30:20

go on, you've got a piece in the observer, haven't you? I

30:22

do indeed, because Jonathan Lewis written

30:24

one of the best pieces of

30:26

the day, Guardiola and Klopp conclude

30:29

error-defining run, and the intro to

30:31

this is superb. I'll just pick

30:33

out a couple of lines, because

30:35

this is, in Jonathan's words,

30:37

the joy machine against a tortured genius,

30:40

the extrovert against the introvert, the baseball

30:42

cap against a designer knitwear,

30:44

the ordered chaos against a chaotic order,

30:47

4-3-3 against who on earth knows,

30:49

blood red against cool blue, the

30:52

hair transplant against the immaculate bald

30:54

guy, and for the past

30:56

eight years, this is the duel that has painted

30:58

the skies of English football and it

31:01

took it to new and unfamiliar places,

31:03

and now the end. But

31:05

it isn't just about the intro, he

31:07

talks about a slow burn of a

31:09

rivalry, didn't really take shape until 2018

31:11

when City's immaculate champions in waiting were

31:14

beaten 4-3 at Anfield in January, in

31:16

the January, and then they were blown away 3-0

31:19

in a Champions League quarter-final second leg, and

31:21

he says that their fear of

31:23

each other, a respectful sporting fear,

31:26

led to them going

31:28

down with tactical cul-de-sacs. So Jack Greenwich

31:30

has a false 9 in 2021 at Anfield

31:32

in a 1-1 draw, Joao Cancello and Phil

31:36

Fodor has winged back a year later,

31:38

and that backfired with a 1-0 defeat.

31:40

Last April, Klopp went for all-out attack

31:42

at the Etihad against

31:45

the Cityside missing the Harlan, they were smashed

31:47

up Liverpool in a 4-1 defeat. And

31:52

what Jonathan says is that what's most notable

31:55

about this era is that the way

31:58

that their consecrated principles that

32:00

were at best contested when

32:02

they arrived and we remember that press conference

32:05

about tackling that Pep

32:07

Guardiola gave and people derided him at

32:09

the time and now they realise how

32:11

wrong they were and how right he

32:14

was. There is so so much in

32:16

this piece, one of many

32:18

terrific pieces around the game today.

32:23

It may well be your last game against Jurgen Klopp and

32:26

we spoke a couple of weeks ago about how you were

32:28

talking about in a normal life on a

32:30

normal day that maybe you guys would sit down and chat.

32:33

Would he be someone you'd hang out with? Be friends

32:36

with? Well I don't know, I don't know maybe,

32:38

I don't know. So

32:40

in another world the managers who...

32:43

That's what you talk about in another world, like

32:45

a normal world. Yeah normally when we are not

32:47

there, yeah for sure. It's going to be a

32:49

problem but when

32:51

we're writing the business, you don't

32:53

have to have many many relations with

32:56

the managers, much better. So

32:58

at the end as a contender, as a guy,

33:01

they want to beat your team

33:03

and distance in

33:05

that situation is always... Finally

33:09

when you say he wants to beat you and

33:11

you want to beat him and there's that healthy

33:13

rivalry between you two, would you miss him? At

33:17

certain points yeah, because I

33:19

miss my family, I would say I miss, I

33:21

will miss my club but of

33:23

course I've been many many years, many

33:25

games, we won, we

33:27

lose and many

33:30

of that. In certain manner yeah of course

33:33

but I respect

33:35

a lot, I understand him a lot, so the decision

33:37

has been made and I just

33:39

I said personally I wish him all

33:41

the best and I said

33:44

since it happened, so sooner or later he will be

33:46

back. I think he's a world football man

33:48

and maybe he needs a break, like every

33:50

all of us sent him to an idiot

33:52

and I'm pretty sure

33:54

he will be back sooner or later because I

33:57

think he helps you know to make a football a better

33:59

place. It's a really

34:01

nice line there from Pep Guardiola saying that he

34:03

helps to make football a better place Jürgen Klopp.

34:06

I think that's the overriding feeling is that actually

34:08

we're losing quite a big element

34:10

of the Premier League when he goes this summer,

34:12

aren't we? God, there's a real

34:14

sort of bromance. Wow, yeah, it's nice.

34:16

Jürgen Klopp and

34:18

Pep Guardiola. I mean, the world's

34:20

changed. I'm used to managers hating

34:22

each other, calling each other specialists

34:24

in failure. But they're

34:27

having a real loving play.

34:30

I think he's right though. Jürgen Klopp I

34:32

think will be back. I think initially when

34:34

he announced that he was retiring, the way

34:37

he was speaking, it was almost like he'd

34:39

had enough of football. I think

34:41

there are a lot of aspects

34:44

of modern football that he doesn't like. I

34:46

think Cara Southgate has talked about this

34:48

as well. He said that

34:50

he still loves football, but

34:53

he doesn't love the football business. I

34:55

think maybe there's an element of that with

34:57

Jürgen Klopp as well. He's just burnt

34:59

out. He needs some time out. Yes, definitely the

35:01

burnt out. And I think Pep

35:03

could be right. I think he will be

35:06

back. But obviously he said, I'm not

35:08

coming back to the Premier League to manage

35:10

anyone else. So it's

35:13

probably going to be the last we see of him this

35:16

season. But I think he'll certainly be back

35:19

after a while. Although initially when he said

35:21

he was retiring. He didn't say retiring.

35:24

When he said he was leaving

35:26

Liverpool, I could be totally wrong. But

35:28

the sense I got from hearing him speak was that

35:31

he wanted to try something totally different.

35:34

He wanted to leave Liverpool. And

35:37

I thought he's talking about he sounds

35:39

like somebody who wants to go and

35:41

become a teacher or a lawyer. Can

35:43

you imagine Jürgen Klopp? You're coming as

35:45

a primary for a Jürgen Klopp teacher.

35:50

Maybe I was totally wrong, but that was

35:52

just the initial impression I've got. But I

35:54

think I was wrong. Do you

35:57

think you were right or wrong then? Wrong. Okay,

36:00

that's good to hear. Look, let's talk about Arsenal

36:02

because we didn't talk about them enough at the top

36:04

of the show, did we? They're showing real grit at

36:06

the moment. You know, they're grinding out the wins in

36:08

terms of they've had a fantastic, this fantastic run, eight

36:10

wins in a row. And some of them were emphatic,

36:13

five nales. But this one yesterday from

36:15

what we saw, you know, was at the two one at

36:17

the death victory. Arteta

36:19

called it maturity. Is that what

36:21

you're witnessing from Arsenal? It's like

36:23

a maturer team than we've seen

36:25

in previous seasons. I said they've

36:28

just become relentless. To win

36:30

the title, you need character. And one

36:32

way you show character in football games

36:35

is by never giving up, playing

36:37

until the final whistle. And I just get the

36:40

sense now, whenever I'm watching Arsenal or I check

36:42

their scores, if it's

36:45

a draw and there's a few minutes to go,

36:47

I always think Arsenal are going to score. I'm

36:50

never surprised when they score a late goal.

36:53

Brentford last night, I just

36:55

thought it was inevitable that Arsenal were going

36:57

to score. And they've got that character now.

36:59

We've seen it in the past. You remember

37:02

Manchester United under Sir Alex Ferguson, the

37:04

late goals at home against Sheffield

37:06

Wednesday, Sir Alex Ferguson celebrating on

37:08

the pitch with Brian Kidd. You

37:11

know, you need that kind of

37:13

character. And for a long time,

37:15

Arsenal have not had that character.

37:17

People accuse them of being too

37:19

flaky, you know, not

37:22

having that mentality.

37:24

And Michael Arteta has changed all

37:26

that. And

37:29

I think they're going to go very, very close.

37:31

I would not be surprised at all if they

37:33

won the title. I'm not a betting man. I

37:35

used to be. If

37:38

I was studying the form, I would

37:40

be looking at the form thinking, hey, Arsenal have

37:42

scored more goals than anyone else. They've

37:44

conceded fewer goals than anyone else. And

37:46

their third favourite says three to one. Three to one.

37:49

That is a good bet. Although

37:51

I'm not advocating anyone having a bet on a

37:54

thumbnail. No, look, in terms

37:56

of what happened yesterday, Aaron Ramsdale had

37:58

a moment to forget. You'd have to

38:00

say but he made up for it actually what I

38:02

really liked about it Is the end of the game

38:04

you saw a magical moment from Flecken who I have

38:06

to say that is One of

38:08

my favorites so far this season in terms of

38:10

what he does on the pitch as a goalkeeper

38:12

But he showed a real moment of class going

38:14

up to Ramsdale and it felt they might have

38:17

been discussing all sorts of things But it looked

38:19

like he was saying congratulations for sort of coming

38:21

back from that era and actually keeping Arsenal in

38:23

the game at time yeah,

38:25

I mean the response to the era

38:28

was first-class and We

38:30

talk about Liverpool having a really capable number two in Queer Then

38:34

Arsenal have a high class number two in

38:36

Ramsdale That's a terrific save from Ivan Tony

38:38

we're talking about that earlier his head could have

38:40

dropped and he could have felt sorry for

38:42

himself And started to think here we go

38:44

again That's me done, but

38:47

instead he stepped up and pulled off

38:49

a number of first-class saves including that

38:51

one This is another one we're about

38:53

to see now as well

38:55

And I just think he's very very very

38:58

unfortunate because I was

39:00

shocked when Ray came in I felt

39:02

that he was in position to continue

39:04

the upward trajectory But the numbers all

39:07

pointed to Raya being the

39:09

superior keeper on crosses in

39:12

set-piece situations And as

39:14

Carve has been saying the numbers all

39:16

point to Arsenal at the moment being

39:19

in the driving seat the leadership the

39:21

man management Kai Havart I've got to

39:23

say again Kai Havart scoring yesterday and

39:25

being on the run that he's on it's

39:28

a triumph for man management because Arteta

39:31

didn't listen to the noise when everybody said

39:33

no he's not good enough What have you

39:35

done you've wasted this money the same people

39:37

now are saying what a wonderful player is

39:39

and He's on a

39:41

run off for goals and to assist this

39:44

last couple of games But it's going in

39:46

his last four Premier League games Isn't

39:49

just a number it isn't just defensive attack

39:51

for Arsenal It's the headed goals have

39:53

scored down 16 in the Premier League more than any

39:55

other team in the Premier League Set pieces

39:57

as well Nicholas Yov is doing a superb job They've

40:01

now scored from 19 goals

40:03

from set pieces, again more than any other

40:05

team in the league and also they've scored

40:07

10 goals in the last five minutes of

40:09

games, more than any other team in the

40:12

league. The mentality at Arsenal is so strong.

40:14

It says a lot about this race that

40:17

you've got two teams playing today

40:19

that everyone thinks will occupy slots

40:21

one and two and in Arsenal

40:23

everything points to them and

40:26

their consistency as being the winners

40:28

who in plain sight are ripping

40:30

it up. And they're doing

40:33

it all without an out and out

40:35

striker and it feels like if they

40:37

get somebody in that position it's going

40:39

to upset the apple cart because everyone's scoring

40:41

for that team at the moment. I

40:44

think everybody was talking about the fact that

40:46

they need to sign a striker but I

40:48

think Haverts is playing so well at

40:51

the moment. I'm not sure they need to go

40:54

out and break the bank to sign

40:56

someone this summer because as

40:58

Darren just said they've scored more goals

41:00

than anyone else this season. They're outscoring

41:03

Manchester City, they're outscoring Liverpool so I

41:05

don't think it's absolute desperation for them

41:07

to have to go out and

41:10

buy a striker this summer. I

41:12

think if somebody's available that

41:14

fits the profile of Haverts they're looking for and the

41:16

price is right, yes go ahead and do that deal

41:19

but I don't think it's something that has to be

41:21

done at all costs. No I would agree with that.

41:27

Right we're going to chat all

41:29

things Bundesliga now. I focus on

41:31

Harry Kane, Jadon Sancho and Jabbi

41:33

Alonso. So look Carve another three

41:35

goals, another hat-trick for

41:37

Harry Kane, best striker in the world at the moment.

41:40

Well I mean according to the numbers he is. His

41:43

record at Bayern is incredible this season.

41:45

I think he scored 38 goals in...

41:50

30 league in 25 games. And I

41:52

think overall he's 38 for club and

41:54

country this season. This was

41:56

his fourth hat-trick of the season

41:59

for Bayern. I think he's

42:01

the first player, first new player

42:03

in the Bundesliga to score that many hat tricks.

42:05

He's just breaking records left, right and centre. So

42:07

the simple answer to your question is, yes, he

42:09

is the best striker in the world at the

42:11

moment. Well done. On form. Yeah,

42:15

I mean, as an England fan

42:18

and supporter, it's crazy to watch something like that

42:20

that just goes out there. My

42:22

question, I guess, about Harry Kane is why

42:24

couldn't this happen at Spurs? Why wasn't this

42:26

happening at Spurs? Well, that's

42:29

a weaker league than the Premier League. Defensively,

42:33

Spurs were an ageing side.

42:36

The investment. Had Harry Kane

42:38

been playing in this Spurs, he probably

42:40

would have scored even more goals. Because remember, they finished

42:43

eighth and he scored 30 goals. So

42:45

I don't think we're seeing a different Harry Kane

42:48

to this season, to the one

42:50

we ever saw at Spurs. I think we're

42:52

just seeing somebody who is

42:54

filling his boots in a league

42:56

that really, the competitions

42:58

between themselves, Dortmund and and

43:00

Leavacousin. Leavacousin. Leavacousin at the

43:02

very top. But I

43:05

think in terms of Premier League as a

43:07

whole new coefficient. Let's talk about

43:09

James Sandshoe because he picked up a goal

43:12

yesterday. He struggled since he's gone back first

43:14

to say to Dortmund. Look,

43:16

the door is potentially still open

43:18

at United. Do you think

43:20

he'll ever go back? I

43:23

think there's a good chance that he could go back this

43:25

summer because the Dortmund

43:27

sporting director was on record last week.

43:29

He gave an interview to a German

43:33

magazine or newspaper I think and in it he said

43:35

that look,

43:38

the finances are such that we

43:40

can't afford to buy

43:42

James Sandshoe this summer. We

43:44

just can't make it work financially. So

43:47

unless he signs another

43:49

loan deal, extends his loan from

43:51

Manchester United, I think there's

43:54

a really good possibility that he will

43:56

return to United. Obviously

43:58

everybody knows the state of Israel. relationship with

44:01

Eric Tenharg. I don't know

44:03

how that would work. I don't know whether

44:06

Ineos would get involved in trying to

44:08

sort that out, but technically he is

44:10

still a Manchester United player who happens

44:12

to be on loan back at Dortmund.

44:14

It would be interesting to see what happens

44:16

there, and whether he'd be welcomed

44:19

back with open arms from Eric Tenharg. What's

44:22

going on with Jaby Alonso at the moment? Where

44:24

do you think he might end up? Obviously, Labour

44:27

crews are on course to

44:29

win the Bundesliga. Bayern

44:31

wants him. I think they've opened discussions with him.

44:34

Liverpool wants him, I believe. Bayern

44:38

are moving very quickly. They know they have to,

44:40

because they know that what's an

44:42

offer at Liverpool is very

44:45

attractive, not just a chance to

44:47

manage the club you played for,

44:49

but also not just a chance

44:51

to manage an outstanding squad, but

44:54

also a fantastic academy.

44:56

Alex Inglethorpe is doing a fantastic job there.

45:00

We're already seeing the pathway opened up to

45:02

such an extent that players are coming into

45:04

the first team squad and equating themselves

45:07

well. When they're deployed, as we saw against

45:09

Luton, as we saw in the Carabao Cup,

45:11

they have no fear. We

45:13

expect Conor Bradley, for example, to play

45:15

today instead of Trent Alexander- Ronald. We

45:17

don't expect the occasion to overall him

45:19

at all. There's a lot that

45:22

is attractive about Liverpool and it's the reason

45:24

why Bayern are moving with such indecent haste.

45:26

I think it still again might go to

45:29

the wire because he is

45:31

such a wonderful, low-maintenance,

45:35

but high-intensity individual.

45:37

I know the two seem

45:39

a contradiction in terms, but you look at the way that

45:41

his teams play. They were too nailed

45:43

down the other day in their Europa

45:45

League tie and everyone expected that to be

45:47

the first time this season that they would

45:50

be beaten. They'd won all five of their

45:52

preceding games and yet they find a way

45:55

to rescue a point from the game

45:57

and that is a reflection of their

45:59

management. that real intensity, that real

46:01

desire, and it's what Liverpool are all about

46:03

as well. So I don't

46:06

think it's a wrap in terms of buy-in taking

46:08

him. I think Liverpool might well have a say

46:11

in it before the end of the season. I

46:13

think if he wants the Liverpool job, I think

46:15

the Liverpool job is his. I

46:18

just get the feeling that he is the

46:21

preferred candidate. He is the one that

46:23

Liverpool want and I think it will

46:25

end up being his decision. What

46:28

he feels is best for him. Whether to

46:30

go back to Liverpool or go back to

46:32

Bayern Munich. For what it's

46:34

worth, I would advise him to go

46:36

to Liverpool because I think it's a

46:39

much more stable environment. Bayern

46:41

Munich obviously one of the biggest clubs in

46:43

the world but they are FC

46:45

Hollywood. There is a lot going on and

46:48

off the pitch there in the dressing

46:50

room, in the media, the relentless focus

46:52

on the club, the churn when it

46:54

comes to managers. I think

46:56

he would have a much more

46:58

stable working environment if he was

47:01

to choose Liverpool. Let's

47:05

take a look inside the papers. What have you got

47:07

for Kaveh? I picked

47:09

out something that Martin Samuel

47:11

has written in the Sunday

47:15

Times today in his column. He

47:18

is a fantastic columnist. Obviously you don't need me to

47:20

tell you that. His columns are

47:22

very long. They normally have lots of different

47:26

little pieces in them and one of the

47:28

pieces in his column today is about the

47:31

culture secretary, about how she is

47:33

trying to get the

47:35

Premier League and the EFL to

47:38

agree a financial deal. She's basically

47:40

saying to them that if you

47:42

don't agree a financial deal, which

47:45

is effectively the Premier League having to give

47:48

more money to EFL clubs, she said that

47:50

if you don't agree to do a deal,

47:52

I'm going to make sure that this independent

47:54

football regulator that is going to be coming

47:56

in very soon is going to impose a

47:59

deal on you. and Martin

48:01

mentioned something that I heard as

48:03

well is that she didn't

48:05

make a great impression in a meeting

48:07

that she had with EFL clubs and

48:10

now all EFL clubs were invited to meet

48:12

her it was done virtually so all the

48:14

72 clubs dialed

48:17

in and apparently according to Martin

48:19

and according to what I've heard as well

48:22

she started off by

48:24

talking about the EFL's

48:27

74 clubs and

48:29

obviously you know if you know your football you

48:31

know there's 72 clubs in

48:33

the EFL Where have you got those extra two

48:36

from? I don't know but they weren't

48:38

very impressed but there is a big

48:40

Premier League meeting tomorrow where they're going

48:42

to discuss this whole issue of a

48:44

new deal for EFL clubs

48:46

I think it's complicated but at the

48:49

moment you know the Premier League is passing

48:51

on about 350 million pounds

48:53

a year to EFL clubs and

48:56

there's talk that they could come up with a

48:58

new package which means they'd be giving 500 million

49:01

pounds a year to EFL

49:04

clubs but what's interesting is Premier League

49:06

clubs haven't agreed on that package because

49:08

a lot of them are saying why

49:10

should we be giving the EFL more money?

49:13

A lot of our clubs we're losing money

49:15

look at all the accounts that have come

49:17

up recently Premier League clubs don't have that

49:19

kind of money and what's interesting is that

49:21

EFL clubs are saying you know what even

49:24

if the Premier League do offer us

49:26

a new package we

49:29

might turn that down because

49:31

a new package

49:33

would be a six-year deal so it

49:35

would tie them in for six years

49:38

and EFL clubs are thinking there's an

49:40

independent football regulator coming in so why

49:42

don't we take our chances with him

49:44

or her because we think that the

49:47

independent football regulator would impose an even

49:50

better deal on the Premier

49:52

League club so we could get more money

49:54

if we just maintain our position

49:56

and refuse to accept what the Premier

49:59

League is offering What

50:01

have you gone for? Well I'll be very

50:03

quick with this one because It could not spike

50:05

for sale No, not a very convenient point I

50:07

thought you were saying that they were going to

50:09

meet to work out where the other two clubs

50:11

had come from in the years ago This

50:15

is a good piece by Andy Dunn and it talks all about the merits

50:17

of Garnaccio yesterday and we

50:19

spoke about that earlier in the show so

50:21

I've picked out one part of this column

50:24

it's a really important part that

50:26

Andy makes about the investment in

50:28

Old Trafford and what he says is

50:32

is it really the case that we should all figure

50:34

out a daily battle with austerity and chip in

50:36

to help billionaires in America and Monaco

50:38

fancy a new football complex at Old

50:40

Trafford Andy Burnies talked

50:42

about the infrastructure and the public

50:44

benefits of an old

50:47

new old Trafford but tax exile

50:49

Jim Ratcliffe and absentee

50:51

owners the Glazers, says Andy

50:54

have unimaginable wealth if

50:56

a penny of taxpayers money is used to

50:58

redevelop or rebuild this stadium it will be

51:00

a disgrace, as simple as that and I

51:02

have a lot of sympathy with that point of view

51:06

because of the finance that those individuals

51:08

enjoy and it

51:10

is for them to invest in their club not at

51:12

a difficult time for

51:14

everybody, for the public and I would include

51:16

many Manchester United fans who for whom day

51:19

to day living is difficult, all of us,

51:21

it is difficult why should it

51:23

be us that put the bill for their ambitions