0:00

They say you learn from your mistakes. And the other day, I learned

0:04

firsthand how one simple elevator button can open

0:08

up a door to a world full of surprises. Oh, you did, did

0:11

you? I did. I was heading to a meeting the other day in this office

0:15

building in Toronto, and I jumped on this packed elevator and I hit

0:18

the wrong button. Stupid me. I hit the 45th floor, not the

0:22

46th, and obviously I didn't notice. So we get to the

0:26

45th floor, and the elevator dings, and everyone looks at me

0:29

like, this is your floor, dude. You're the only one who pushed this button. You're

0:33

the loser. I am the loser. So instead of admitting I'm a dumbass.

0:37

No. I confidently walk out of this elevator thinking once the

0:40

door is closed, I'm gonna push the button and I'll catch the next one. Right.

0:44

Except it didn't work out that way. My guess is the same elevator reopened.

0:48

No, thank goodness. Actually, maybe that would have been better.

0:52

No, this office building. The elevator doors open right into the

0:56

reception area. Yeah, yeah, I've seen that before. Yeah. And as soon as

1:00

I walk out, I'm greeted by this very kind receptionist who immediately

1:03

says, hello, how can I help you? So I look at the sign on the

1:07

wall. And it says, sperm donor clinic. If it had

1:10

been, maybe I might have stayed a bit. No, the company

1:14

was a therapy center for addictions. Nice. So,

1:18

like, I kind of laughed it off and said, no, no, no. I

1:22

accidentally got off on the wrong floor. And her voice goes into

1:25

the soft, caring mode and she's like, sure you did. You're in

1:29

a safe place here. So I

1:33

tried to explain that I pushed the wrong button, but by

1:37

now she has me by the arm, leading me to sit down into one of

1:40

these comfy chairs. And she's like, no, you pushed the right

1:44

button. That would have been funny. I

1:47

guess. Anyway, my next appointment's Thursday.

1:51

This is Taming the Hustle or something of the sorts.

1:54

Yeah,

2:20

so I made a new friend with the receptionist. She does

2:24

not believe me. She thinks I have a bad addiction to something that I'm not

2:27

willing to admit. I have an addiction to

2:30

secretaries. No, if she was like a

2:34

math or a french teacher, then we're in. Yeah. Oh, yeah. That's right. That's right.

2:38

I forgot. Hey, what are we talking about today? Something so, so,

2:41

so interesting you're gonna just freak

2:45

out. Hold on, hold on. Should I put it on a seatbelt? Yeah. We're gonna

2:48

talk about taxes today. Oh, taxes. Some reason my ass just

2:51

puckered up. Yeah. What I find

2:55

very, very common with people that we chat with is

2:59

that the tax system in Canada is largely

3:03

misunderstood. No kidding. You know, even people that do their own taxes

3:06

on turbotax or whatever software they might buy online

3:10

is, they just don't understand. You just punch in numbers and, you know, squeeze

3:14

tafe fest and hope for the best. I know people like that. And it's not

3:17

that complicated, but it is, I guess. Yeah. But I want to kind

3:21

of demystify a few things. I know we've kind of talked about this a couple

3:24

of times in different episodes and just kind of in passing, but there's a few

3:28

things that I want to talk about for people to understand, you know?

3:32

So, first of all, in Canada, and please note that it's going to change

3:36

slightly from province to province. So I'm going to talk about the province of Ontario

3:40

only because Ontario is the largest province in Canada. But all provinces,

3:43

of course, except Quebec, is very similar. So Quebec has a different set of

3:47

rules. So when you're filing your tax return, it's actually a combined tax return. It's

3:51

federal and provincial, and you're filing both at once. Whereas in Quebec, you physically

3:55

have to file two separate tax returns, you have to file the federal one, and

3:58

then you have to file the Quebec tax return. Beautiful province of

4:01

Quebec, very european, lovely culture. But they

4:05

make it a commitment to be different and difficult. Two stamps.

4:09

Two stamps, yeah, that's right. Well, hopefully you're e filing and getting

4:13

things done a little more quickly and killing list trees. So let's use the

4:16

province of Ontario. So, first of all, your personal exemption amount. So

4:20

that's federal as well. So the amounts vary slightly from province to

4:24

province. But in 2024, as an example, your

4:28

personal exemption amount is $15,705. So that means that

4:31

you get to earn almost $16,000. Let's use $16,000 just

4:35

for simplicity. Yeah. So you get to earn the first

4:39

16,000 of income tax free. Okay. Okay. And then you move to the first

4:42

tax bracket. So the first tax bracket after the 16,000 to about $52,000 in

4:46

income is 20% tax. So you're paying 20% tax on

4:50

that first tax rate. Yeah. So if we pause there for a second, the first

4:54

thing I wanna bring up is the eligible dependent. Everyone seems to think

4:57

that, you know, they have five kids, they can have five dependents and have

5:01

whole bunch of income tax free and all of that stuff. It doesn't work that

5:04

way. If you have a spouse that earns no income, and I've mentioned this before,

5:08

if there was a year that Erin, let's say she was laid off and her

5:11

EI ran out and she had income for a particular year, well, then you can

5:15

use her personal exemption amount of $16,000. So then essentially the first $32,000 that

5:18

you earn is tax free. Oh,

5:22

I see. Okay. So when you're declaring an eligible dependent, it

5:26

means that you're declaring your spouse as an eligible dependent and you're using her

5:29

personal exemption amount as well. Oh, she's a dependent alright. Yeah, she's a pain, not

5:36

a dependent. Oh, yeah. Yeah. So if your spouse is earning

5:40

income, however, you no longer have the ability to use an eligible dependent

5:44

deduction. Gotcha. But let's say you're divorced. Okay. And

5:47

you're single, like legit single. Not living with a woman who has

5:51

a kid, and you have a life together, and you decide to cheat the system

5:54

if you're legit single. So like, single single? Like single single. Hold on. Let

5:58

me. Let me close my eyes and think about that for a second.

6:02

No kids, no wife. Your eyes are really closed. That's

6:06

dreamy. Here's where it gets real, though. You still have kids. Oh,

6:09

okay. Fml. So then if you're legit single and you have

6:16

dependent children, so you have a child that you're caring for and lives with you,

6:20

you can use that child as your eligible dependent and claim their

6:24

personal exemption amount. Gotcha. So now you can still earn the first

6:27

$32,000 of earned income before you pay any tax. Makes

6:30

sense. But if you have a spouse that's earning income, you can't try to play

6:34

the system and try to claim a child as an eligible dependent because now

6:37

both spouses are working. Yeah, understood. I get it. Okay. So now that's the eligible dependent deduction. Then once you reach the $52,000, you start slowly moving. And

6:44

I'm not going to go through every tax bracket like verbal diarrhea

6:48

all the way up to the highest marginal tax rate. But just keep

6:52

in mind that there's different rates where you get increments of taxes

6:55

that you're paying at a higher level. Gotcha. Then the second thing that I

6:59

find is very misunderstood is let's say you're moving to the next tax bracket. That's

7:03

kind of significant. So let's say $56,000. So your tax bracket from $56,000 to

7:06

90 is 30%, 29.65, to be precise. So people

7:10

that are earning $55,000 will say well, I don't want

7:14

to earn more than the 56 because then I'm going to

7:18

be subject to a 30% tax bracket on all my income.

7:22

Just because you're bumped to the next tax bracket, it doesn't mean you're

7:25

going to pay 30% tax on all of your income. It's just income above $56,000.

7:32

Gotcha. So you're paying that tax bracket in different increments. So then moving all the way up where you have, say, $175,000 in income, then you're bumped

7:37

up to 48% tax bracket. And

7:41

furthermore, if you're earning more than $247,000, your highest marginal tax

7:44

bracket in Ontario, which is federal and provincial combined, is 53.53.

7:56

Gotcha. So you're essentially getting to keep 46% of your income, but

8:00

that's only anything above $247,000. Okay, so

8:03

again, to demystify is that just because you're earning $275,000, it

8:07

doesn't mean you're paying 54% tax on

8:10

all of your income for the first dollar. The first $16,000 is tax free,

8:14

your personal exemption amount. And then you're paying 20% tax, and then

8:18

you bump up. Gotcha. Until you get to $247k. And then at $247k, you pay

8:21

54% tax. Gotcha. So then the

8:25

next thing that I hear all the time, dude, is, oh, I'm not gonna work

8:28

any overtime. I'm just gonna give it all to the government. Yeah. So you mean to tell me you're going in for an overtime shift and you're already making $150,000 a year

8:35

and you're gonna do it for free? Like, come on, man, give

8:39

your fucking head a shake. I've seen

8:42

people literally pull out a calculator when being offered a

8:46

raise, understanding that they are going to jump up the next tax bracket. They hit

8:50

equal and they're like, well, it makes no sense for you to give me that

8:53

raise unless you're giving me it to me at a higher level. So stupid.

8:57

I'm paying. I'm going to give it all to the government. Stupid. So stupid.

9:00

Like, I'd love to make $10 million a year because I rather

9:04

keep 46% of something than 100% nothing.

9:08

Exactly. Right? So, like, I tell people that all the time, do you want to

9:11

keep 46% of something or 100% of nothing? And you're not

9:15

making 248,000 a year. And if you were, I'd be like, fucking,

9:19

hey, dude, man, that's awesome. Exactly. Keep working because you're still keeping

9:23

46% of it. Yeah. So let's demystify all of this stuff and do a quick

9:26

recap is understanding the graduated tax system in Canada. It's

9:30

the same for all provinces, and the income levels vary slightly,

9:33

but all very similar is that you have your personal exemption amount. You

9:37

get to declare your spouse's personal exemption amount if he or she

9:41

has no income. If you are single and have dependent children, you can use their

9:44

personal exemption amount. And your graduated tax rate doesn't

9:48

mean that if you get bumped into, say, a 44% tax

9:52

bracket, that all of your income is going to be taxed at

9:55

44. It's only, say, at $112,000 above, you're going to be paying that

9:59

rate. So there's no disadvantage of making less money. Like, the idea

10:03

of I'm not going to work more because it's all going to

10:06

taxes is bullshit. And I would

10:10

love to change people's mindset on that because I hear it so

10:14

regularly, is I won't take that overtime shift because it's all going to taxes.

10:17

Yeah, I'll take it. I'll take your overtime shift.

10:21

Just show me what to do. Exactly. I've seen it with people who

10:25

are, you know, an employee salary, like I said, refusing to raise

10:28

because they're worried about being put in the next tax bracket. I've seen it

10:32

with small business owners where they try to work the system and they're

10:36

like, yeah, you know what? I stop opening up on Sundays

10:39

because it puts me in the next tax bracket. Yeah. Isn't that

10:43

insane? It is insane. I'm like, as your marketer, open your

10:46

fucking doors on Sunday. Yeah, no kidding. And

10:50

stay late. Yeah. Jesus. So then finally, the

10:54

last thing, because I know it's a bit of a short topic, but, dude, it's

10:57

so important to understand this stuff. Yeah, yeah. Like, if anyone's interested

11:00

in seeing these numbers, like, we can share cheat sheets that we've created

11:04

with you guys. It's. It's not that complicated. But the last

11:08

piece that I want to talk about is your tax refund. So

11:12

we do about 700 tax returns a year. God, you guys are lazy.

11:16

Yeah. Only 700?

11:19

Well, actually, this is just, like an added service for the people

11:23

we work with, essentially. Yeah. And we do some for the public, but for the

11:26

most part, this is just a value added. Yeah, for sure. But anyway, what I

11:30

hear from people when they have a balance owing is they feel like they got

11:33

screwed. Okay. Like, it's mind

11:37

boggling. Okay. You have a certain level of income, which means you owe a

11:41

certain amount of taxes. And if you didn't pay it through

11:44

payroll, deduction, for example, or if you don't have deductions on your CPP

11:48

or your teacher's pension, you're going to have to pay it at the end of

11:51

the year. Yeah. People genuinely feel, Darryl, that they

11:55

are winning the lottery like it's newfound money when they're getting a

11:59

refund. The truth is you've paid too much

12:02

fucking taxes throughout the year. And the most educated and intelligent

12:06

people feel this way. I don't know what the psychology is behind

12:09

it, but people that have, like, a $5,000 refund are

12:13

just jumping for joy. But all they did was fucking pay

12:17

this in advance to Justin Trudeau, and Justin Trudeau worked with their money

12:21

all year and made. Made money off of their money. And

12:25

then on the flip side, somebody gets a bill for taxes

12:28

owing, and they're like, oh, my God, I owe five grand. I can't fucking

12:32

believe it. And they feel like they're getting screwed by the

12:36

government. No, it's because you did not have enough taxes

12:39

deducted at source whether you have investment income, which there's never

12:43

taxes deducted on a T3, a T5, or a capital gain. Yeah,

12:47

yeah. And you have to decide when you apply for your Canada

12:51

pension and your old age security if you're going to have the government deduct any

12:54

taxes at source, it's right on the application. That's funny. And it's

12:58

not that you're getting screwed. I actually prefer having

13:02

to owe money at the end of the year, which means I got to keep

13:04

my money, or I should apologize. I got to keep the

13:08

government's money for twelve months and then just give it at the end rather

13:12

than giving it to them in advance. So I got to work with that working

13:15

capital for twelve months instead of having to fork it up to

13:19

Trudeau and Doug Ford. And then finally on that topic

13:23

is that tax installments becomes an issue. So the rules on

13:27

tax installments is if you owe more than $3,000

13:30

in two of the last three consecutive years, okay,

13:34

they're going to ask you to pay installments. So actually, for a retired

13:37

canadian, the sweet spot would be to owe just under

13:41

$3,000 a year so that you kind of avoid having to forfeit

13:45

paying your quarterly installments, but that you're keeping as much money in your

13:48

pocket as possible and having that tax bill at the end of the year. Gotcha.

13:52

So getting a refund is a negative for me. Like, that is.

13:56

Yeah, yeah. I'm like, why would you give your money to the government in

13:59

advance? For them to do whatever the fuck they want with it. Exactly. Keep it

14:03

in your pocket and then fork it up at the end of the year, knowing

14:06

you've kept it all year. Even if you throw it in a, like, Canada life

14:09

and Manulife have, like, 4.55 and 4.6 daily interest

14:13

accounts right now because interest rates are so high. Yeah. Manulife bank,

14:16

just. Their bank account is 2.85. So if you owe five or ten

14:20

grand and you've put it in a 4.6% interest account, you grew some of

14:24

that money. Yeah. Like, if it's 10,000, you get to keep

14:27

$460. You know, that's a couple really nice bottles of wine. Or

14:31

that's half your car insurance for the year or whatever. Exactly. Yeah. Right. If you

14:34

look at it like that. I often tell clients, you know what? This amount of

14:38

interest, by just letting it sit there, will pay your car insurance for the year.

14:41

So instead of, you know, wanting this tax refund and feeling like you

14:45

won the lottery because it's already your money. Yeah. Why don't you

14:49

keep your money before you have to fork it out to the government and

14:53

put it in a high interest savings account? And that interest alone will pay for

14:56

your car insurance for the year. So if you take my advice, you no longer

15:00

have to pay car insurance. Essentially, yeah. So when you start looking at it like

15:03

that, it becomes pretty impactful. No kidding. But it's really hard to change

15:07

someone's mindset. And like I said, the most knowledgeable, the most

15:10

educated, intelligent people will be like, oh, fucking

15:14

government. They get you every way. They get you

15:17

every time. No, your financial advisor did a great job for you because

15:21

you got to keep that money all year. Now you just have to cough it

15:25

up and you have the money to pay it. You're not getting screwed.

15:28

Exactly. I find this funny. You've taught me this a long time

15:32

ago. And because I am not a certified financial planner, I have

15:36

these conversations with other friends, and it's like

15:39

talking in circles. They are wearing tinfoil

15:43

hats because they do not believe what I'm saying. It fucking

15:47

riles me up because people just don't want to get

15:50

it. Oh, fuck. I got screwed.

15:54

Just can't change that mindset, though. I try really hard. I get through a few

15:57

people. But

16:04

you

16:10

know

16:19

what. It is what it is. I guess it's just. It feels like newfound money. It's like forced savings, maybe at 0% interest. I don't know. It would be nice if they just changed those two words. Amount, owing and refund. If they could change them. To make it sound just a little. More taxes you didn't pay last year. Yeah, exactly. Or taxes you overpaid for last year. Yeah, write that shit and that gets people excited. It's like, oh, I overpaid? Fucking

16:24

right. Give me that money back. We should say something like,

16:28

by having a $7,000 refund. Justin Trudeau earned

16:31

$500 in interest last year. Exactly. He says, thank

16:34

you.. And write it in crayon. Yeah, purple crayon.

16:40

With spilt milk on the paper.

16:43

That's right. Then everyone would get it. Oh, my God. It's

16:47

funny, but it's not. I mean, we have an obligation as Canadians to pay

16:51

taxes. We live in a wonderful country. We have great

16:54

infrastructure. As much as we bitch about our healthcare, we have amazing health

16:58

care compared to other developed countries. Yeah. It's

17:02

a wonderful place to live. Is our canadian tax dollars spent

17:05

properly? I don't think they are. I'm with you guys. Exactly. You know,

17:09

there's a lot of wasted money with politics and politicians, but it's. It's.

17:13

It's the same everywhere. It is. It's bullshit. Whatever. But

17:16

anyway, our job is to help you pay the least amount of taxes. And you

17:19

having this big refund is not helping you. And you having a balance owing

17:23

is not fucking you over. So, hopefully you've learned a couple of things on

17:27

my rant today, because this gets me real riled up. Well, I don't

17:31

call it a rant. I call it a hot take. Oh! There you go. We'll

17:34

be right back. Passion Chat So I know you called that a rant. I call it a hot take. What

17:55

I'm going to talk about today, I don't want you to think I'm ranting, because

17:58

I'm not. No, it's going to be a hot take. It's going to be a

18:01

hot take. Listen, I want to

18:05

dive deep into it. I'm listening. Yeah, I know. I always tell you to listen.

18:08

I feel like maybe you don't listen. I talk too much. So I always remind

18:11

you to listen to me when I think it's an important thing. Yeah, see, now

18:15

you're rambling. I want to dive into a topic that's

18:18

both pertinent and often overlooked with business.

18:22

And that's the value of professional services in marketing and

18:26

advertising. And I'm using that because that is my field. But I

18:30

say this with every professional service that you use, I see

18:33

this from both sides of the spectrum, from the business owners and

18:37

the creative professionals. So you own a business and you want

18:41

to grow, but you're reluctant to invest in a professional. And

18:44

I get it. I'm a grower, not a shower. That's right.

18:48

And here's the thing. I could end this topic right here by

18:51

simply saying you get what you pay for, end of story. Yeah, but I think

18:55

it's a little more important to know about the why. So let's start with

18:59

quality over quantity. Yeah. In my opinion, you can piss

19:02

away marketing budgets, but if you have the right help,

19:06

100%, you've been a game changer in our business.

19:10

Right. You don't have to break the bank to have good quality. However,

19:13

you do have to pay for it. So when it comes to creative

19:17

services like graphic design, photography, videography, web design,

19:21

whatever it is, quality should always take precedent over

19:24

quantity when it comes to your business. Sure, there are plenty of

19:28

platforms or apps out there offering cheap or even free

19:31

alternatives, but you need to consider the long term impact on your brand's

19:35

image. And you and I have talked about this many times. You know, someone starts

19:38

a business and they're broke or close to it, and they

19:42

use these free and cheap platforms to kind of get started, which is great. And

19:45

I talked about this a few episodes ago about being good at what you do.

19:48

So you're an expert car mechanic, or you're a dentist, or you're a baker,

19:52

which means you're not an expert at marketing or advertising or whatever

19:56

creative service you need. Right? So investing in a professional not only

20:00

ensures that you have aesthetically pleasing content,

20:03

but the expertise crafting those visuals that resonates with your

20:07

audience and conveys your brand's messaging effectively really

20:10

is so important because here's the thing, a professional looks at

20:14

everything. So when you design on canva and you put it out there, you're like,

20:18

oh, you know, I'm going to put a picture of my product, I'm going to

20:20

put our logo and I'm going to put our phone number. Great. It's out there.

20:23

But a professional will look at it and when they do it, they see how

20:27

much written content should there be? There's an actual percentage that people stop

20:30

looking at your ad. If there's too much text, the psychological effects

20:34

of color in your industry, what makes people buy, you know, for your

20:38

industry? People like blues and yellows, but they don't like that for a

20:41

dentist. They don't like blue for dentists. I don't know why there is. There's

20:45

people. And we deal with professionals all the time with the psychological aspects

20:49

of things. We get these trends. We get these things so we know. You know,

20:52

for example, like font choice, that could change things huge. You

20:56

don't know all the fonts. Image placement. Oh, fuck. This one drives me

21:00

crazy. Yeah. You see? Okay, you got this nice, fancy

21:03

ad. You got a model, and his hands are cut off at the bottom of

21:06

the ad, and you're like, you know, I know his hands are cut off, but

21:09

it looks okay. But guess what your customer sees? They see that model playing with

21:13

his balls. That's what they see, because they can't see it, right? You're not

21:16

a professional. Stupid little stuff. So Ryan and I

21:20

cracked open a really nice bottle of bourbon that a client brought

21:24

to us. Oh, nice. At the end of a really busy tax day. Yeah.

21:28

And the client had brought it to us because we had kind of gone above

21:31

and beyond, you know, what we were doing for their taxes and their tax credits

21:35

and whatever. So we cracked the bottle open, and Ryan wanted to send the client

21:38

a nice photo of the bottle. And the two little shot glass that we were

21:41

sipping on takes a picture of it. It's fucking blurry. They're

21:45

shadowing, and half the bottle is fucking missing. I said, Ryan, get. Get the

21:49

fuck out of here. I took the picture for

21:52

him, but the photo speaks a million words,

21:56

right. And if you don't do it right, you shit the bed and you're wasting

21:59

your time. Exactly. That's why I say this is what professionals do.

22:03

Right? We look at all these aspects. My next point here is understanding the

22:07

true cost, and that's where this whole conversation comes

22:11

from. And it's crucial to grasp the real cost behind a professional service.

22:15

Right. Like, a business owner will bark about the cost of the professional,

22:18

and then on the flip side, the professional is told that they cost too much.

22:22

So that bitching goes back and forth. Well, the initial sticker

22:26

shock might deter someone hiring a professional. It's essential

22:30

to recognize that you're not just paying for that final product, just like I

22:33

mentioned a minute ago. It's the expertise, it's the time,

22:37

it's the resources invested by these professionals. Like Photoshop, for

22:40

example. It's a hefty annual subscription to own Photoshop.

22:44

Those stock videos, stock photos. Although they can be

22:48

cheapish, the quality ones come at a price. Right. But

22:51

lowballing or seeking discounts often undervalues

22:55

the skills and efforts of these professionals, which really, it potentially

22:59

compromises the quality of work. Right? So if you charge $100 for your

23:02

service and someone came to you and said, how's 50? And you decide you're

23:06

gonna take that job, are you gonna give your best effort? No, I was gonna

23:09

say that it's such a deterrent. And when you're trying to lowball that

23:13

professional, like, we're gonna use marketing. For example, if you try to lowball

23:16

your marketing consultant, the marketing consultant is going to be less interested in going the

23:20

extra mile for you because obviously you're demonstrating to them that you're not

23:24

seeing value in their services. More than ever before this

23:28

year for non clients that we're doing tax preparation

23:32

for the non client will come off the street and say, well, do you have

23:35

senior discounts? Like, well, no, we don't. But I look at their tax

23:39

slips and their fucking pensioned income as a senior is more

23:42

than most taxpayers that are in the workplace. So just because you're a

23:46

senior, you want to pay less because you're not seeing in our services.

23:50

It makes me just say, you know what? Like, they're obviously not seeing the value

23:53

in the services we provide. And I feel for you, because what's happening in

23:57

industry with mainstream social media and access to

24:01

these cheap apps, everyone thinks they could do it themselves. It's like getting a good

24:05

contractor to build a deck. Or you try to do it yourself and you do

24:08

it half ass and it fucking falls apart. It's like marketing has

24:12

been a game changer for our business. I would not have been able

24:16

to do it myself, and I wouldn't be where I am today if it wasn't

24:19

for a good marketing consultant like yourself. And I'm not just saying that because you're

24:22

my bud. You fucking revolutionize what we've done with the development

24:25

and the creation of #callRene, having proper social

24:29

media, and like you say, like, proper placement, not just the photo, but when

24:33

to post the photo and what to say and what font to use and who

24:36

are you talking to? And then you figure out how to post the right message,

24:39

right? It's like no business owner on the fucking planet,

24:43

Darryl, has time to figure all that out when you're doing that

24:46

fucking day in and day out. Exactly. It's impossible. Well, and that's the thing.

24:50

It's like when you're negotiating someone's rate, you're negotiating their

24:54

value. Here's what I want everyone to do for a moment. I want you to

24:57

think about how much you charge for your service, your product, whatever it is, what

25:01

your salary is, I don't care. Now you have that number in your head. I

25:04

want you to cut it in half. Okay? So now that number you have is

25:07

half the value. Would you work for that same fucking number every day and be

25:11

happy about it? No, you wouldn't. So why, when a graphic designer or

25:15

photographer or whatever it is, when they give you a price and you

25:18

ask them, can you work for half that cost? Why is it that a business

25:22

owner is offended when they say no? It boggles my mind.

25:26

Photography is another one. I've got clients that are

25:29

photographers and they try, like people try to undercut them all the time.

25:33

Like they can just negotiate the value of their services. Exactly.

25:36

Understand how much fucking work. It's not just taking a picture. Yeah.

25:40

Thousands of, and thousands of dollars of equipment. Right.

25:44

And then hours and hours of editing. I mean, you understand more

25:47

than anybody. Yeah. My last point I want to talk about here is the

25:51

mutual respect you need to have for these people's boundaries and their

25:55

expertise. Right? So for example, as a creative professional, you know

25:59

your business better than we do. So as the creative professional, we're going to ask

26:02

a fuckload of questions to get it right. But on the flip side, when you,

26:06

the owner, requesting things like endless revisions or

26:10

expecting favors for free, it not only undermines the professionals time and

26:13

effort, but it reflects poorly on your understanding of the craft. Like,

26:17

we've had clients who, and I'm going to give you an example because this one

26:20

still, we talk about this around the office. We had a client where we

26:24

wrote a script for an ad and they approved it. We showed them storyboards for

26:28

the ad before shooting, and they approved it. We showed them the actor we're going

26:31

to use. They approved them. They hear the voiceover artists. They approved it. I

26:35

know where this is going. So we go out, we shoot everything, we

26:39

record the voiceover, we put it all together, and then we show the client and

26:42

their response is. I think we should change the script. I don't like the messaging.

26:46

And, you know, while we're doing that, can we find another actor so nice and

26:49

calmly, I let them know that they approved all this

26:53

prior to it. They didn't disagree with, they said, no, no, we know. And then

26:56

I said, okay, great. So just so you know, like, changing all

27:00

this is pretty much starting from scratch. So the cost of everything is pretty much

27:04

starting from the beginning. It's going to be double. Yeah. And then they lose their

27:07

shit, and they're like, I'm the client. We agreed on a price, and now you're

27:10

not delivering on your promise, blah, blah, blah. And we sit there and we're

27:13

like, we literally asked you for approval all

27:17

along, but now it's like, now it's on us. We are the bad

27:20

guy. We're not doing you the favor because you want endless

27:24

revisions. So instead, always establish that clear

27:27

communication, positive, constructive feedback. And I. I can't stress

27:31

this enough. We've had clients, and it happens in every industry

27:34

where they make shit up just to be part of the creative process. Could

27:38

you change that font? It's like, actually, this is the leading font in your industry

27:42

right now. This actually gets lots of views. Yeah, I think we should go. Can

27:46

you use this font, which is pretty much almost the same, but

27:49

slightly different, or, you know, we don't like that green. Can you bring it down

27:53

a shade by 4%? Right. Yeah. And it's not to say

27:57

that the client can't have any say on what his vision, view of his

28:00

brand is going to be, but you also, if you're hiring someone that you trust,

28:04

you have to trust that they're bringing their a game and that they're advising for

28:07

a reason. Right. And what I think is funny, Daryl, is that like, if you

28:11

were a lawyer. Yeah. And every change that you had to make, the client would

28:14

pay. Yeah. 100%. And no one questions it. Nope. So it's almost like it's different

28:18

for one industry to another. Yeah, 100%. Because if you write as a

28:22

lawyer, if you write a letter or an email, you spend any time at all,

28:25

for the most part, it's billed. Right. And if it's 0.25 of an hour or

28:29

whatever. But if you get into any professional, creative business, like you

28:33

say, marketing, photography, any of those types of services, web design,

28:36

everyone seems to think that you just got endless amount of time and resources,

28:40

and it's just like, like, have. You ever went to the dentist with a

28:44

cavity and said, can you do this for half the price? No. The

28:48

fucking dentist would slap you in the face with his rubber glove. He'd bitch slap

28:51

you and still charge you. That's true. I'm not

28:55

dissing a dentist. It'd be nice if the creative industry would be a little

28:59

bit more aligned with those values where it'd be like, you know what? You don't

29:02

want my services. You obviously don't appreciate them and you don't see value.

29:05

Exactly. And I get it. The journey of marketing and advertising for small

29:09

business, or really businesses of any size, is challenging. It's not cheap, but it's

29:13

necessary. This is why I have this podcast, is. Yes, I'm giving you tips on

29:16

how to do it yourself, but this is so you can grow to get better.

29:20

Right? It's an opportunity to leverage expertise of professionals who can

29:23

elevate your brand to new heights. So my takeaway here is helping you

29:27

understand the value of those professional services, like respect

29:31

the boundaries and expertise of these creatives and prioritize

29:34

quality over shortcuts. You're not only investing your brand

29:38

success, but it creates a culture of mutual respect within the industry. Do you

29:41

want to be known as the brand who cheaps out or is difficult? No.

29:45

So remember the world of marketing. You truly get what you

29:49

pay for. So invest wisely and I guarantee you'll have success.

29:53

Like I said, it's not unique to marketing for sure.

29:57

The ones that resonate the most for me is. Is the creative industry.

30:01

Yeah. So you, photographers, for example.

30:04

Website designers. Website designers. And then. And then the

30:07

construction and renovation industry. Yeah, for sure. Fucking insane for that.

30:11

I've got tons of clients in that industry and they just try to get low

30:14

balled all the time. Yeah. Or they don't get paid for a service because they

30:18

charge them for, like, the agreement is. Okay, you're gonna be $60 an hour

30:22

or $65 an hour. But when you get build the hours, you're like, oh,

30:26

that's too much. no, no, fuck! It's too bad.

30:29

You had me change that wall three times. Exactly.

30:34

Holy what a rant of an episode. We've never had one

30:38

of these before. This is crazy. Let's not make it a habit. Let's

30:41

pick happier topics. They were hot takes. Hot

30:44

takes. Yeah Hot takes. We'll be right

30:48

back. I'm not sure if you saw this or not, but a few weeks ago, a

31:08

lawsuit was launched by four school boards in

31:11

Ontario and they are suing Facebook, Instagram,

31:15

Snapchat and TikTok over those apps being harmful to student

31:19

learning. But is it a lawsuit? I think they're going to win. No, but

31:22

do I think it could help shed light on the bigger problem. Fuck, yeah. Like,

31:26

back in the day. And here's my old man coming out. Back in the day.

31:30

Sonny. Yeah, When I was a kid When we were bored, we went

31:34

outside. And I know we've said this, other people have said this. It's

31:37

like you hear it, summer, winter, whatever. It's true.

31:41

But now it's always, here's the iPad, or play on

31:45

the phone. You know how many kids I see with devices in their hands these

31:48

days? We, as parents, are 100% responsible. It's

31:52

not the kids. Exactly. Parents take the easy way out. You're at

31:56

dinner. Oh, my God, I hate going to a restaurant. I was just gonna say

31:59

that. When the fucking kid is on the parents phone. Yeah! You know what, put

32:02

your phones away. Teach your kid to have some social skills, some, you know, some

32:06

manners, and to be able to interact with a family setting at a restaurant

32:10

without losing his fucking marbles. Yeah, well, and that's the thing. We

32:14

need to create these boundaries, right. And not give in. If you

32:18

communicate with your children about the importance of bouncing screen time with other

32:21

activities, it's an easier conversation. And the reason for this

32:25

lawsuit, which, and kind of the reason I'm bringing this up right now,

32:29

is coming from the marketer, there is actual science and data

32:33

behind how dangerous social media is to kids.

32:37

Yeah, see, and I disagree with you with having this conversation with your kids, of

32:40

explaining to them. Cause they don't give a fuck. They're addicts. Oh, they are addicts.

32:44

They just don't give it to them. That's my thought. Here's the thing, and I

32:47

want to reveal a big secret about social media is that,

32:50

yes, they are all tech giants with a lot of money because they built

32:54

these social media platforms. And everything that they do,

32:58

whether it's your content or somebody else's content, the

33:01

reason you are seeing it is because that is going to make

33:05

them money. So the TikToker who does makeup, the

33:09

reason you're seeing it is because it's going to make TikTok some money.

33:12

René, you're going to post a video later today of you sipping your

33:16

coffee, which is boring as shit. And the reason I'm not seen is because it's

33:20

not going to make anybody money. Yeah. I still think it's 100% the parents

33:23

fault for sure. I don't care how good social media is. I don't care how

33:27

good Facebook is. The parents have to take that shit away from the kids. I

33:30

was on the road by myself for work. And I stopped in and had some

33:34

lunch at a restaurant, and it was either parents with their kids or grandparents

33:38

with their kids. And every fucking one of them was either on a phone

33:41

or an iPad or had a headset on and was playing video

33:45

games or whatever. Because it's not just social media. No. Right. It's

33:49

like you said at the beginning, it's technology. How is technology

33:53

affecting the way our kids are being raised? Technology is super important

33:56

and has taken huge leaps and bounds in how we do things. Ah, in a

34:00

short amount of time. In a short amount of time. But parents have

34:04

totally shit the bed. So there was a couple there. There was no technology

34:07

in sight. The kid was sitting in a kid chair. The kid got a bit

34:11

restless at one point, so the mom had her on her lap for a little

34:14

bit, and then she put her back down and the kid was eating normal. She

34:17

was not having a tantrum. I bought them lunch and

34:21

I wrote on a note and I said, keep doing a great job raising your

34:24

child. Good job. And it's amazing. The waitress came back.

34:29

She said. They couldn't believe it. They couldn't believe it. But as a parent, you

34:32

have the responsibility to raise human beings. You're not raising little

34:36

fucking morons that are robots sitting on their phones. Exactly. And that's

34:40

what's so fucked up about society now. Holy. This is another

34:43

rant. What's with you and

34:47

the topics today? They're hot takes! Hot takes! Or is it just in the

34:51

air? Well, that's the thing. With our

34:55

kids, we used to get, people come up to us all the time and say,

34:58

if we were in a restaurant, how are your kids so well behaved? And I

35:02

get this question all the time. And I'm like, because we taught them to sit

35:05

down and eat dinner as a family and have conversations, I have to tell you,

35:09

you have really, really well behaved children. Thank you. Very

35:12

polite. They have great social skills. I don't want you

35:16

to toot your own horns. Halt, too. No, I was just going to say I

35:19

don't want to build them up too high because in a private setting, boy, are

35:22

they pains in the ass. Sometimes, especially when I go over for a visit. But here's the thing. Here's what

35:30

I find ridiculous about the whole situation of tech,

35:34

whether it's social media, video games, whatever, is that okay?

35:37

If someone said to you, I want to take your

35:41

child for seven to eight hours a day and I'm going

35:45

to put them in a sweatshop to make shoes, or I'm gonna,

35:48

I'm gonna go even darker here. I'm gonna traffic them. Where are you going with

35:52

this, Darryl? Oh, hold on. Whatever the case may be. And this person said, I'm

35:56

gonna do it to make money for me. There is no way you would let

35:59

your child go. You'd be like, child labor? Forget it. Trafficking? Forget it. No

36:03

way. Are you insane? I'm not gonna put my kid in harm's way just so

36:07

you can make a dollar. Guess what those video games do? Guess what social media

36:10

does? They take your kids for seven or eight hours a day and

36:14

they make money off them with harmful things that we know are harmful. With

36:18

the video games, we talk to eye doctors and we know that screen

36:22

time really affects your vision, especially as you get older. Kids are getting into

36:25

glasses more because of screen time. Their brain function

36:29

has lowered simply because of so much screen time. So

36:33

we're not okay with those types of things, of let's use our

36:36

kids to help other people make money. But with this, we're like, yeah, go ahead,

36:40

take them for seven, eight hours a day. That's fine. Oh, you're making billions off

36:44

of them. Moral of the story is it's less dangerous to make Nike shoes for

36:47

free. That's right. That's. But the most important

36:51

point here that I think is important for parents, and you said it, you're like,

36:55

take it away. But the other important thing is lead by

36:59

example. There is so many times where I see families. We've went to a

37:02

dinner party before where the dad could not get off his phone

37:06

and the kids do the same thing. They grab the phone and I'm like, are

37:10

we not here? Like, what the fuck am I doing at your house? Why'd you

37:13

invite me over if you're going to be on your phone? I only do that

37:16

when we go to a dinner party. I'll text my wife and be like,

37:20

can we get the fuck out of here? But

37:23

seriously, adults lead by example. Put your fucking phone down for 2

37:27

seconds. It's not something we need. We've proven as a

37:31

society from the dawn of time until these phones and screens

37:35

came to be that we can actually function without them. Yeah, we're not experts in

37:38

this, man. But there's got to be a tipping point at some point. Like in

37:41

terms of civilization on its own. Like there's for sure there's just lack

37:45

of human connection now. And it's really like

37:48

expedited with the pandemic, even in adults now. Oh, I know where

37:52

people are socializing less. There's less house parties, there's less you know,

37:55

organized functions. There's less people in gatherings. People are just

37:59

comfortable staying at home and living vicariously through social media

38:03

and having. I don't know, it's weird. I actually know adults, who will

38:06

say, I have a friend who. And they tell me a story, and I'm like,

38:10

oh, who's that? I've never met them. They're like, oh, it's this guy following on

38:13

instagram. Yeah, he doesn't know you.

38:18

Oh, my God. But it's true. It sounds so stupid, but it's

38:21

true. Listen, today wasn't about rants.

38:25

I called them hot takes for a reason, because they are important topics that

38:29

sometimes we need to talk about. They're not comfortable conversations, but they're

38:32

important. I had to take my sweater off. I was sweating bullets in this

38:36

chat. That's crazy. Thanks for joining

38:39

us. We'll see you guys next time. Bye.