0:04

Welcome to tex Stuff, a production of

0:06

I Heart Radios How Stuff Works. Hey

0:12

there, and welcome to tex Stuff. I'm your

0:14

host, Jonathan Strickland. I'm an executive producer

0:16

with I Heart Radio and love all

0:18

Things Tech. And it is Friday,

0:21

so it's time for another classic

0:23

episode. This episode is How

0:26

Segways Work, and it originally published

0:28

our March two thousand.

0:32

Segways were supposed to truly

0:35

transform everything. The prediction

0:37

was that they were going to make cities

0:40

completely different. Um,

0:42

I would argue that that didn't happen, but

0:44

we probably saw them

0:47

pave the way, for lack of a better word, for

0:49

the e scooter revolution

0:52

that started around. But

0:54

let's sit back and listen to this classic

0:57

episode. Lauren, you pointed

0:59

out to me that we

1:01

actually we as in tech

1:03

stuff recorded in an episode about

1:05

Dean Cayman, who is the founder of

1:08

Segue a long long

1:10

time ago, a very long time agoack in two thousand

1:12

eight. Yeah, well, he's done a whole bunch of other

1:14

really cool stuff. Yeah. He invented

1:17

a thing called a Luke arm,

1:20

which is a robotic arm that

1:22

for people who have lost a limb. Yeah, we

1:24

talked a little bit. I bet about that in a whole

1:26

other podcast thing we're doing. Yeah, over and

1:28

Forward Thinking. It's great show, you guys.

1:30

If you haven't checked out Forward Thinking, you should definitely

1:32

check it out. It's great stuff. Uh. He

1:35

also invented a water purification

1:38

device called the sling Shot, which can

1:40

take pretty much anything that has water

1:42

content in it and purify it into

1:44

drinkable water. So you can take sewage

1:47

and put it through this thing and it would actually produce

1:49

clean, drinkable water and it's meant for

1:52

communities that have uh,

1:54

you know, have trouble accessing clean

1:56

water. Fantastic thing. He's

1:59

partnered with some pretty big companies for that. But the

2:01

segue, I think is where a lot of

2:03

people no Dean

2:05

Cayman like they they heard about it that because

2:08

of the segue, well it got. It got a great deal

2:10

of publicity, which we will talk about later in

2:12

the episode. Because it was the hype

2:14

for it is can really only be called hype.

2:16

It was very intent. It was it was like it was like if

2:19

you had heard that this rock

2:21

and roll band that had not released

2:23

an album in like ten years was

2:25

getting back together to do their first studio album.

2:28

Uh, and that you know in a decade,

2:30

and that would that would be kind of similar

2:32

to the hype build up that not only were they going

2:34

to do an album, but they were going to revolutionize

2:36

the entire music industry with this album. That's

2:38

that's the level. Yeah, that's fair. So we'll talk

2:40

about that in a bit, but

2:42

first we wanted to kind of talk about actually what

2:44

it was and how it worked. So if

2:47

you were to look at one of these things, in case you have not

2:49

seen it, it looks like a little two wheeled

2:51

scooter, but the wheels are

2:53

are side by side. They're not in

2:55

line with one another. Their side by side.

2:58

And when you would stand on a platform with the left

3:00

wheel to your left and the right wheel to your right,

3:02

there's a bar that comes straight up

3:04

vertically from the platform. Their

3:07

handlebars handle bars that you hold onto

3:09

and then when you when you lean, it

3:12

moves. When you lean forward, it starts to

3:14

move forward. When you lean backward, it stops.

3:16

If you lean back enough, it'll go backward a little

3:18

bit. But it's um and uh and

3:20

and the new models these days, when you tilt

3:22

the handlebars, that is how you steer. Yeah,

3:25

and the original one, you would twist one

3:27

of the handlebars the right handlebars, so

3:29

rapping a motorcycle style exactly. And if you if

3:31

you twisted, if you twisted one way, it would

3:34

turn left, and you twist the other way, it turns right. And

3:36

the way it turns is kind of cool. Uh.

3:39

When you lean forward, both wheels engage

3:41

and start moving forward simultaneously. Correct.

3:43

When you turn, only one wheel starts

3:46

to move in one direction and the other wheel

3:48

allows you to pivot on on

3:51

a dine right right. Yeah, it's a turning

3:53

radius of zero zero turning

3:56

radius, which is pretty amazing. And

3:58

Uh, we'll talk about what he intend did

4:00

this device to do in the second half,

4:02

I think, but first we wanted to kind of talk about the

4:04

actual technology that makes this possible.

4:07

And Dean came in. Before he had

4:09

gone into developing the Segway, had already

4:11

started to work on some pretty cool systems.

4:13

He did some work on

4:16

motorized wheelchairs that were

4:18

capable of doing things like climbing up staircases,

4:21

and that work kind of led him to the idea

4:24

of what if I created a device that

4:26

could transport people at a good

4:29

clip, uh, and make it so

4:31

that it it works on the same

4:33

principle as what it's like when

4:35

you're walking. So when you're

4:37

walk yeah, exactly,

4:40

it works in a way

4:42

that feels natural to us. Although

4:44

I will tell you the first time you get on a

4:46

segway, nothing feels natural

4:48

about it. I haven't actually been on one. You have, I

4:50

have, I've done. I've been on a segway.

4:53

I really enjoyed it. I had a great time.

4:55

But have you ever engaged

4:58

in an activity where the first

5:00

step requires you to do something

5:02

that feels totally unnatural to you, so

5:05

that there's like your body is actually resisting

5:07

what you have to do. But basically

5:10

that's me walking every day. But I mean, but for

5:12

for example, when I switched from a W A S

5:14

D keyboard uh First

5:16

Person Shooters to Xbox

5:18

controller, I was like, what is this? See?

5:21

For me, what I think of is like the first time

5:23

when I was a little kid that I ever tried

5:26

snorkeling. Because I put my face

5:28

in the water and my body is telling

5:30

me, for goodness sakes, man, whatever

5:33

you do, don't breathe. Then you're

5:35

underwater, and you know, my

5:38

my breast of my brain is saying, foolish,

5:40

scary, reptile brain, that's

5:43

not anything to worry about. You have a

5:45

tube, but to the air, which is unobstructed,

5:48

you can breathe all you like. And it

5:50

took that leaped not

5:52

literally did literally leap, but

5:55

no, yeah, I couldn't get enough traction, but

5:58

it took that mental to get to a point

6:00

where I felt comfortable. Same sort of thing on a segue,

6:03

because the way it works is that you start

6:05

to lean forward as if you're going to

6:07

take a step, because basically

6:09

what walking is is controlled falling. Right

6:12

Yeah, You're you're you're throwing the

6:15

upper part of your body forward. You're you're

6:17

essentially unbalancing yourself and then counting

6:19

on one leg or the other hypothetically

6:23

to catch it. Right, Yeah, you just you're constantly

6:25

catching yourself with your legs. You're you know, especially

6:28

if you're if you're walking at a good pace, you know, you'll

6:30

see people they're leaning into it and

6:32

uh and that weight is what's helping them

6:34

propel forward. And then they swing a leg out,

6:37

which catches them, stops them from falling, and

6:39

they use that leg to push them forward,

6:41

and then the other leg and so on and so forth.

6:43

And it's something that we once

6:45

we start to learn how to walk. It just

6:48

becomes natural to us. We don't even think about

6:50

it, right, right, Well, we've got all kinds of a really really

6:52

intricate inner ear sensory mechanisms

6:54

to tell us when we're balanced and when we're off balanced,

6:57

and how everything is going. It's a really

6:59

it's such an automatic process that when you're not

7:01

too you're not thinking about it. Yeah. And what's

7:03

also funny is that that

7:06

that same system of sensors that we have in our

7:08

brain. Well, two things are funny. One thing is

7:10

that a lot of that informed Dean Cayman

7:12

when he was designing the segue. He wanted to have

7:15

a mechanical means to sort of recreate

7:17

that. And the other thing is that these sensors

7:19

are not fails there, they're

7:22

they're not foolproof. We we

7:24

can fool ourselves. Uh. This

7:26

is partially what leads us to things like

7:28

motion sickness, where we get

7:30

one set of input from a set

7:33

of senses telling us one thing, and a different

7:35

set of input from other senses telling us another

7:37

thing, and that that conflict makes

7:39

our brain say, Okay, if

7:41

that's how you're gonna play it, we're losing lunch.

7:44

That's it. Uh, someone

7:47

who has suffered from from

7:49

car sickness, motion sickness

7:51

that way. Strangely enough, never got

7:53

sea sick, but I've been motion

7:56

sick from a car before. But anyway,

7:59

so the the they are fallible, these

8:01

systems in our our brains and in

8:03

the segway. As it turns out, So Dean

8:06

came and wanted to create the segue in such a way

8:09

that it would require

8:11

you to lean forward as if you were going

8:13

to take a step, and that would be the indicator

8:15

to move right and then and then sort of trust the

8:17

machine. I imagine that that's where you have

8:19

your initial problem, because you're you're you're leaning

8:22

forward and you're not catching yourself. Yeah,

8:24

and you know you've already been told, You've

8:26

already been told, do not take your

8:28

foot off the platform to step and catch yourself,

8:31

because then you run yourself over. So

8:34

not only do you not wearing

8:37

a helmet at the time hypothetically, yes, I

8:39

was wearing a helmet at the time. That was that was that

8:41

was a requirement. I

8:43

want to say that I was at Disney when I

8:45

did this. It was at some park and I think

8:47

it was Disney, and it was it was not

8:50

the full epp Cut tour, which we can

8:52

talk about. I've got a little factoid

8:54

on that. Uh, there is a tour

8:56

that very popular tour at Epcot

8:59

that use as segways. It wasn't

9:01

that, it was just a little like familiarize

9:03

yourself with this technology thing, and I was like, I've

9:05

always wanted to do this, and that's when I tried it. So I've

9:07

only done at the one time, and I really

9:10

would love to have more time with it because

9:12

it was an interesting experience. But yes, it

9:14

requires you to move forward

9:17

as if you were going to take a step, but not take

9:19

your weight completely off your foot, just

9:21

lean forward as if you were about to start walking,

9:24

and that makes the segway go, which

9:26

is kind of cool. Um. Now,

9:29

the way it does that is it has a complex

9:31

system of gyroscopes inside

9:34

to kind of let it know what

9:37

orientation the segue is in relative

9:39

to the ground. Right. It has five gyroscopes

9:42

in fact, and technically it's really only using three of them.

9:44

Two of them are fail safe. Yeah. Yeah,

9:46

three of them are meant to detect things like forward,

9:49

leaning forward, leaning backward, and tilt

9:51

to the left or right right. Okay, but so so a gyroscope.

9:54

Let's talk about what a gyroscope is because a little

9:56

bit integral. Yeah, so it's

9:58

basically just a spinning we will inside

10:00

a frame. Yeah, the frame itself is

10:03

stable and free. The spinning

10:05

wheel has um

10:07

well, it's rotating around

10:10

an axis, right, so you've got the access

10:12

at the center of the wheel. The wheel rotates and

10:14

then it was it resists changes

10:17

forces that would change the

10:19

alignment of that gyroscope so

10:22

well, because if you push on the on the spinning

10:24

wheel, it's just going to transfer

10:27

into it's it's called precessing.

10:30

This is a really this is an interesting

10:32

thing. It's actually it's one of those

10:34

things that's kind of difficult to explain in an audio

10:36

podcast. First of all, let me tell you that

10:39

at how stuff works dot com we

10:41

have an article on how gyroscopes work, which

10:43

includes video showing what

10:45

I'm about to talk about. So if you have trouble visualizing

10:48

what I'm about to explain, despite the fact that we're

10:50

both gesticulating wildly, yeah, really,

10:53

I mean, there's only so much I can get across and radio,

10:55

right, but you can go there and look

10:58

it up. But what the gyroscope does is the this

11:00

whole thing of precessing is Imagine

11:02

that you have a bicycle wheel

11:04

suspended from a string. Strings

11:07

tied to the ceiling somewhere. The bicycle wheels

11:09

hanging down the The

11:11

string is tied to the axis of the wheel,

11:13

so it could still spin freely. Okay, got

11:16

it. Now, if you were to align

11:18

that wheel so it's vertical relative

11:20

to the ground, so the wheel is as if

11:22

it was on a bicycle that you were riding down the street.

11:25

Okay. The string is tied to

11:27

one side of that axis, so there's

11:30

a string that's coming down on one side of the access

11:32

to the other side of the access doesn't have a string tied to it,

11:34

so there's nothing to keep it vertical. If

11:36

you were to just let go, that wheel would flop down

11:38

into the horizontal uh

11:41

formation. It would just be parallel to the ground.

11:43

Correct more or less. If you were to turn

11:45

a vertical and then start spinning the wheel, it

11:47

would remain vertically

11:49

and it would slowly begin to rotate

11:52

around the string. So that's

11:54

the precession, is that it's rotating around

11:56

a different access perpendicular to the one

11:59

of its main mos. Now, why is

12:01

it staying vertical as opposed to flopping

12:03

over. The reason for that is that if

12:06

you were to apply

12:08

a force to say, let's

12:10

say you've got the bicycle wheel spinning in

12:13

your arms. Okay, you're you're holding the you're

12:15

holding the axis in front of

12:17

you, and the wheel is vertical and

12:19

you've got spinning. You can do this. I've

12:21

seen science museums that have had this where you sit in

12:24

a swivel chair and you hold the

12:27

bicycle wheel in front of you, like you extend your

12:29

arms out so that the wheel can spin freely in front

12:31

of you. If you try and tilt

12:33

that wheel, you'll feel resistance. And the reason for

12:35

that is that imagine that,

12:38

you know, take a still image, like you're able to

12:40

freeze time. Okay, I

12:43

can so, all right, Well that's good, And

12:45

you're going to tilt the wheel so that the top

12:47

of the wheel from your perspective, would

12:49

be moving to the left and the bottom of the wheel would

12:51

be moving to the right. You're tilting it on a diagonal.

12:54

Okay. Now, as that wheel

12:56

is spinning the point where you would

12:58

be turning it to the left, that that's you're applying

13:00

a force to that section. So imagine

13:03

imagine a spot at the very top of the wheel,

13:05

at the vertical apex of that wheel.

13:08

Okay, that's where you're applying

13:10

the force to move to the left. Now the

13:12

wheel is actually spinning. So if we were to jump

13:15

ahead twenty frames, now

13:17

the point is directly in front of the wheel,

13:19

it's no longer at the top. It is rotated around

13:22

to be in the front, and uh,

13:24

it still wants to go toward the left. Go

13:27

ahead another twenty frames. Now the point is

13:29

at the bottom of the wheel. It still wants to

13:31

go to the left. But the

13:33

force you're applying is trying to make the bottom

13:35

of the wheel go to the right. So

13:38

the force you're applying is trying to push

13:40

the wheels direction in one way. But

13:43

because that reference point was at the top

13:45

at the beginning and it's still trying to go

13:47

to the left from when you were applying the force at the very

13:49

beginning, those two forces cancel

13:51

each other out. It resists the force

13:54

to make it move in a different direction,

13:57

and then you also have the precession. So if you're

13:59

singing a swivel chair you start to spin around. It's kind

14:01

of fun. Uh, this is a great cheap

14:03

way to entertain small children. Um.

14:06

Anyway, it's an interesting

14:09

just an interesting fact of physics

14:11

is that the gyroscope in this

14:14

this stable frame will react

14:16

in this way. But so, okay, So,

14:18

so the point of gyroscopes being in devices

14:21

like this is that if you measure the position

14:23

of the spinning wheel inside of its frame, you

14:25

can determine the the pitch

14:27

and the pitch rate. Yeah, exactly, You're you're looking

14:30

at like the the frame itself can

14:32

move freely within the

14:34

confines of whatever it is you're talking what you're

14:36

talking about, whether it's it could be a segue, could be

14:38

an airplane, it could be a phone, um,

14:41

and so it can move freely within

14:43

that context. And it maybe a solid state

14:46

drive, as is the case with the segue,

14:48

may not be an actual physical gyros Yeah,

14:50

and we'll we'll get into that in just a second, right. And

14:52

but if you're able to do that in such a way, then

14:55

the gyroscope and the pitch

14:57

detection will allow the

15:00

UH will give enough information so

15:02

that some sort of processor

15:05

can take that information in and know what

15:07

orientation the segue is in relative

15:09

to the ground. So by

15:12

detecting these changes and by detecting

15:14

the forces that are enacting upon these different

15:16

gyroscopes. The segue can

15:18

interpret that and say, oh,

15:21

I should engage the motor to drive

15:23

forward, or I should stop, or

15:25

I should move back backward exactly,

15:28

or I should I should probably put up a warning

15:31

because this guy is really leaning over a

15:33

bit too far right right? Um,

15:35

but so so yeah, So the kind of gyroscopes that are

15:37

that are in a segue are the solid

15:39

state angular rate sensors. Yes,

15:42

that that are basically the way that I understand.

15:44

It's a little silicon plate. Yes,

15:47

and I think I actually said that the correct way the

15:49

first time. Yes, you did silicon,

15:51

not silicone. You're exactly right, two

15:53

separate issues. Um. And so

15:55

it's a it's a silicon silicon

15:58

plate mounted on the support frame and

16:01

you run. You run an electrostatic current across

16:03

the plate and wiggles the silicon

16:05

particles around and makes the plate

16:08

as a whole vibrate in a very predictable way.

16:10

Um. And when there's a

16:13

physical change in the forces, meaning

16:16

when you've tilted in some way. Yeah, yeah, when when

16:18

you physically move the plate on its access

16:21

access Yes, talking

16:23

is great. The particles suddenly shift and the

16:25

vibration changes right, And by changing

16:28

of vibration, you know that there's a change

16:30

in the state that you are in, whether that's

16:32

a tilt or you know, whatever other

16:35

thing you might have this gyroscope, and but in the case of the

16:37

segue, we're talking about specifically the tilt

16:39

of the segue itself. Right, So if you hook

16:41

a computer up to this, that can measure the

16:43

precise change right and interpret

16:45

it exactly. So if it says like, oh, it's changed

16:48

a little bit, like the vibration has changed a

16:50

little bit, indicating that the person is starting to lean

16:52

forward, time to engage the motors. If

16:54

it's changed a lot, in mind, meaning that the person

16:56

has leaned forward pretty hard, which indicates

16:58

that you should move at a fat your pace. So

17:01

you've got these motors that will engage in order

17:03

to activate the wheels, and the wheels

17:06

begin to turn and that's where you get the motion.

17:08

So the thing that's keeping this all

17:11

going is um you know, you've

17:13

got the gyroscopic sensors that's giving the

17:15

information, But then you have two circuit boards

17:17

that have controllers on them as ten microprocessors

17:20

total in the original segue, and

17:22

those microprocessors are what's taking

17:24

in all this information and uh

17:26

and and translating it into

17:29

action. Yeah, yeah, that that first one. Um,

17:31

the microprocessors would

17:33

check the position sensors about a hundred times

17:35

per second, that's right. Yeah, So that

17:37

way it can make sure that it's giving the right information

17:40

to the motors so that you're you're moving at the right

17:42

speed compared to how you are how

17:44

you're physically manipulating

17:47

the segue right right. It's it's also got in there,

17:49

um, a couple of tilt sensors filled with electrolyte

17:51

fluid, electrolytes being of course what plants crave,

17:53

thank you, which

17:57

which is again just like your inner ear. Yeah,

17:59

yeah, it's your interear has fluid in it,

18:01

and that's what helps you determine

18:03

what your orientation is relative

18:05

to your environment. This is why

18:08

one of the reasons why when people

18:10

go up in the vomit

18:12

commet, that's why it's called that, because

18:15

when you're in the vomit commet, you're you're

18:17

the sensory information you're getting from your eyes

18:20

and from your your you know, what you're feeling

18:22

is so different from what your inner ear is trying

18:25

to make sense of. When this fluid is something.

18:27

Yeah. Yeah, it's basically, you've just got this little sensor

18:30

in your head where you've got a level of fluid, and

18:32

that is how you calibrate yourself to the ground

18:34

by based on on where the fluid

18:36

is tilting right and in a freefall motion.

18:39

That that information ends up being a little

18:41

weird and so a lot of people end

18:44

up again losing their lunch, which

18:46

is why they often refer to the

18:48

planes that take these these flights as the

18:50

vomit commet. Yeah, but it is interesting

18:53

that the segue itself has this electoral

18:55

life. Not you don't have to worry about your segue losing

18:58

its lunch. Don't worry about that part. That part

19:00

similarity has now ended. But other than that, it

19:03

is using a very similar approach to detect

19:05

tilt as the way humans do which

19:07

again kind of cool that Dean came and is taking

19:10

taking direction from

19:12

the way our bodies do stuff to help

19:14

inform him on the way he makes technology.

19:17

I blame it on his extensive medical

19:19

background. Yeah, and again the Luke arm

19:22

another example of that. Right, he's taking

19:24

that that how do humans do things

19:26

and how can we make technology that emulates

19:28

this? He was also when he was in college.

19:31

He was the first He invented the first

19:33

drug injection pump and later

19:35

the first portable insulin pump, which is part

19:37

of how he made such such much money.

19:40

And the cool thing to me

19:42

is that it's obvious that what

19:44

drives him is a desire to innovate

19:47

and to help people yea, And he talks very

19:49

passionately. There's some really really good interviews

19:51

with him will Lincome on social where

19:53

he's talking about watching people use

19:56

his inventions for the first time and and

19:58

them kind of you know, people who haven't been

20:00

able to move this way ever and

20:03

in some cases and in them and just the

20:05

amount of pride and and just awesome

20:07

that happens, and the fact that that that is what

20:09

what really uh gives them

20:11

an incentive to continue. It's

20:13

pretty interesting stuff. It's it's a really cool

20:16

story. And in fact, there's a whole section of

20:18

the Segway story that we need to get into, which

20:20

involves the whole hype issue

20:22

and a little bit more about the the original

20:25

Segue models that came out and

20:27

and some controversy that Segue has had

20:29

over the years. We'll talk about that in just a minute,

20:31

but first Before we do that, let's take a quick

20:34

moment to thank our sponsor. Let's

20:42

segue back into our episode. I

20:45

couldn't resist, and so just

20:48

a few more facts about the original segue.

20:51

Keep in mind that they've made several different

20:53

models over the course of the segways

20:56

life, but the earlier

20:58

ones they had a top speed of about

21:00

twelve and a half miles per hour, which is around

21:02

twenty kilometers per hour, right, I

21:04

think, and I think in some other countries it was maybe thirteen

21:06

and a half. But but yes, yeah, yeah,

21:09

it all depended on well, I also depend on

21:11

what which model you had, because they

21:13

did, they did do a range of them. We

21:15

have an article on our site how the Segway works,

21:18

and that one we specifically looked at the

21:20

segwe HT, which was one of the earlier models.

21:23

Um it required about six

21:25

hours of charging, It had a range of around

21:27

seventeen miles, which was about twenty eight kilometers,

21:31

and um. The current

21:33

segways are called PT, which stands for Personal

21:35

Transporter, and they have

21:37

a whole line of them that do different

21:40

things. Yeah, for for for like

21:42

ce travel versus off roads, versus

21:44

security purposes. But they've got one specifically

21:47

for golf courses. Yep, they've got somewhere.

21:49

They have like all these containers

21:52

on them so that you can carry stuff so

21:54

if you have to transport things. Granted, none

21:56

of them are going to replace the minivan,

21:58

so soccer moms are not going to be able to I

22:01

mean, I guess you could maybe tie a couple of

22:03

of a red

22:05

wagons behind and just like

22:08

like a mama duck. I was really

22:10

waiting for you to say, like small children to the

22:12

handlebars, and it was like, I don't think that I would.

22:15

I wouldn't advocate that. I wouldn't advocate

22:17

that. I wouldn't advocate the wagons

22:19

actually either. That would be a disaster. But anyway,

22:21

Um, the the motors

22:24

of those early segues had about

22:26

two horsepower worth of power and had

22:28

a two stage transmission with a four to

22:30

one gear ratio with a helical gear

22:32

assembly and it was actually a harmonic

22:35

assembly. Yeah. They engineered it

22:37

so that the sounds that the two meshes

22:39

in the gearbox would were exactly

22:41

two octaves apart, so they would harmonize.

22:44

Yeah, it's kind of interesting, some

22:46

might say crazy. Um it weighed

22:48

the original the HT, the one that we

22:50

talked about in our article. Weighed about eighty

22:52

three pounds, which is about thirty eight KOs, and

22:55

it could carry a person of up to two d sixty

22:57

pounds, which is about hundred eighteen ms

22:59

or for my friends in England eighteen

23:01

and a half stone. Uh.

23:04

It had two lithium ion batteries

23:06

to supply power recharge.

23:09

Obviously you wouldn't want to have to

23:11

PLoP out a different battery every fifteen to

23:13

seventeen miles or so um.

23:15

And it used an electronic key system with a bit

23:18

encrypted digital code, so you had this

23:20

key that would plug into It's

23:23

sort of like a little like like flash drive, except

23:26

you wouldn't have called it that then, because right

23:28

you would have called it, well, you could have called it that then

23:30

they'd had to flash at that point. But it

23:32

really wasn't. But it was a digital key that

23:34

has a hundred twenty eight bit encrypted code on it,

23:37

so that the segue will only work with that code

23:39

and you don't have to worry about someone We not

23:41

necessarily not have to worry about it. But if someone did

23:44

run off with your segue, they couldn't use it. They

23:46

would have to literally lift it up and move it away,

23:48

which kind of defeats the point, right. So

23:51

that's that's the that's the basic model

23:53

that we talked about in our in our not

23:56

our podcasts, our article. But there

23:58

are quite a few others that are out now. Like I said,

24:01

there's a the Eye two, which is your basic

24:03

normal terrain segue,

24:06

and then there's two which is the

24:08

the off road next to Adventure

24:11

next to adventure off road travel. Yeah,

24:13

and they've even got some that were you know, they worked

24:15

with DARPA to to design a

24:18

kind of segue that was used as a

24:20

platform for robotics UM.

24:22

They've worked they've created different

24:24

models like three wheeled and four wheeled

24:27

vehicles based on the Seguay technology

24:30

UM for various things. Here in

24:32

Atlanta, we have Atlanta Ambassadors.

24:35

These are people who are in downtown Atlanta

24:37

who often help out during big

24:39

events, like when when something's going on downtown

24:42

and uh, you know there's gonna be a lot

24:44

of people there. Uh. These folks are there

24:46

to kind of help give directions

24:48

and and you know someone's like, hey, I'm

24:50

looking for the Georgia Aquarium. Where do

24:52

I go from here? I was, Oh, you need to walk down this two

24:54

blocks and take a left, that kind of thing. A

24:57

lot of them have segways, so I see

24:59

them whenever i'm down town for you know, Dragon

25:01

con St. Patrick's Day Parade,

25:03

which at the time of this recording will

25:05

be in just a couple of days. Um

25:08

So, but they have them. I've seen them in airports,

25:11

a lot of airports, have I've seen, especially

25:14

airports security on movies. I've seen police

25:16

on these. Yeah. They were big

25:18

at the Beijing Olympics. In In

25:21

fact, I want to say that, um

25:24

that the most I well, I

25:27

think the most I ever saw at one point was actually

25:29

at Epcot because, like I said, Epcot

25:31

Center, uh not Epcot Center, they

25:34

used to be called Epcot Center. I was

25:36

there when it opened, because, as Lauren has pointed

25:38

out numerous times, I'm old, but

25:40

I remember going to Epcot

25:42

and seeing people on these and that was probably the first time

25:44

I saw them in person. But go back to when

25:46

it was unveiled, or even before

25:49

it was unveiled. Came in actually came up with the idea

25:51

in the late nineties, like and

25:54

he had this idea of creating devices

25:56

that could operate on pedestrian sidewalks and

25:58

paths, and in two thousand

26:00

one, the company that would become

26:02

Segue broke ground on its manufacturing

26:05

plant in New Hampshire, which is where

26:07

Dean caymans from. Yeah. They they broke

26:09

around in February and I think completed

26:12

it in November. Yep, yep, right in November

26:14

December, and they adopted the name Segue in

26:16

December two thous one. And that's actually when

26:18

they unveiled the Segue, the first

26:20

models of it on Good Morning

26:23

America, a television program that's

26:25

kind of a news oriented television

26:27

program here in the United States.

26:30

And I actually saw this. I saw

26:32

the unveiling episode. You

26:35

you stayed home, stayed home from work. You I

26:37

didn't stay home from work. I delayed leaving.

26:40

Uh Am,

26:42

I gonna get in trouble. I mean, I haven't worked for this company

26:45

in years. Two thousand one, I was not

26:47

working for How Stuff Works, I

26:49

was I was not here. I was working

26:51

for a totally different company. I did drag my feet

26:54

leaving the house that morning because I knew

26:56

that this was happening everywhere in the news.

26:58

It had been that there was going to be the incredible,

27:01

incredible device, and it had two

27:03

code names that I recall off

27:05

top my head. One was it right

27:08

all caps, it like a

27:10

very clown, and

27:12

then the other one was nice Pennywise.

27:15

The other one was Tim Curry, was the

27:17

television ad uptation Stephen

27:20

King. The second one

27:23

was Ginger Ginger, Yeah, and that

27:25

was it was. It had been codenamed Ginger based

27:27

on the fact that the wheelchair

27:30

that Decca had designed

27:32

earlier was called Fred

27:34

upstairs within the lab based

27:36

on Fred a stair because they were they

27:38

were saying that it just dances right up the stairs and there

27:40

was a wheelchair that could climb stairs Fred

27:43

and then Ginger and so and so Ginger Ginger

27:46

could do everything Fred could do backwards

27:49

in hesh. So

27:51

not that the segue necessarily did, but I it's just

27:53

one of my favorite little quotes, um um.

27:55

But but so, a journalist had started

27:58

writing this book called Code named Ginger, and

28:01

it was leaked at the beginning of two thousand

28:03

one, I think by Inside dot com.

28:06

And this is I think what really

28:08

created all of this insane hype, because

28:11

it was the book took such pains

28:13

to not talk specifically about

28:15

what this machine did, but it

28:17

was going to change the world. And you

28:19

got these quotes from people like like Steve

28:21

Jobs that were like, this is this

28:24

is going to be bigger than the PC again

28:27

without it actually revealing what it

28:29

was. Is that the people who had

28:31

found out about it said

28:34

it was going to be this phenomenal technology

28:36

that was going to fundamentally change the way

28:39

we live, and and

28:41

it was built up so much.

28:43

I mean, hype is seems like a

28:46

like a good thing hypothetically. Well, I was going

28:48

to say that hype is probably not even strong enough at

28:50

a word, considering that, you know, the deliverables

28:52

that were being promised on based on this technology

28:55

that no one outside of a very small

28:57

group of people had any knowledge

29:00

about, and people were saying that that cities were going

29:02

to be redesigned around this thing, and

29:04

that it was going to be bigger than the Internet.

29:07

Yeah, and then Good Morning America

29:09

had its unveiling and before the show,

29:12

I remember, like days before the show

29:15

aired, Uh, there were already rumors

29:17

that it was going to be some sort of motorized

29:19

scooter device. And this was based

29:21

off patents that had been filed as

29:23

well as Dean Cayman's previous work with the wheelchairs

29:26

and things of that nature. And so when

29:28

it actually happened. Like I was hoping at the time that it

29:30

wasn't going to end up being a scooter, because I was thinking,

29:32

like, if it's something totally different, that's gonna

29:34

be awesome. If it's a scooter, it still could

29:37

be awesome, but it's gonna be it's not going to be as

29:39

cool as if it were something totally out of left field.

29:41

And then I saw it and I thought, well, that's

29:43

interesting, but is it really

29:45

going to change the world? And I understood what

29:48

they were going for. They were saying that, you

29:50

know, especially in cities, particularly

29:52

in cities, which is where the majority

29:54

of people tend to live. Not that

29:56

not that there aren't plenty of people on rural area population

29:59

density, Yeah, yeah, you've got very dense populations

30:01

in cities that traffic

30:04

is a real problem. You've got people who are

30:06

getting in their cars to go relatively

30:09

short distances to do basic

30:13

stuff like here in Atlanta. Uh,

30:15

there's scree mentioned the traffic on the show about

30:17

once every other episode. And not just traffic

30:20

though I was going to say that we don't have like

30:22

our our public transportation system is not

30:24

doesn't measure up to public transportation

30:26

systems, and some other cities like

30:29

DC or New York or Chicago.

30:32

Um, now we do have one and and

30:34

you can use it, but it's just

30:36

not ideal. It's not doesn't run as frequently

30:39

as some other cities, and it doesn't doesn't go to

30:41

as many places exactly. So

30:43

that means that if you want to get around Atlanta and

30:45

you want to do it effectively, you pretty much have to have a car.

30:48

And the idea was that for cities like Atlanta

30:50

and other cities that have similar issues,

30:52

the segue could end up allowing

30:55

you to go further than you would if you were on

30:57

foot, uh, and not clog

31:00

up all the streets. So it would alleviate traffic

31:02

problems. It would start because

31:04

as an electric vehicle, it does not actually

31:06

generate any any greenhouse

31:09

gases or toxins, although

31:12

you could argue that depending on how the electricity

31:14

was generated, that's still a problem. It's just not

31:17

being created by the vehicle itself.

31:19

It's not direct. It's a couple steps, yeah, exactly.

31:22

Um, but that would also be a

31:24

thing, and that it would uh, you

31:26

know, it could. It could really be a big

31:28

benefit. But

31:30

for that to work, you have to have an

31:33

infrastructure that supports that

31:35

kind of transportation at the very least

31:37

bike lanes or or

31:39

really wide sidewalks, really wid sidewalks.

31:41

One of the big things that that Decca

31:45

and sege we're trying to do

31:47

was create legislature

31:49

that would allow the segway to to

31:51

go on sidewalks. They had huge

31:53

pushback from a lot of communities. I think that it's that

31:56

they're banned entirely on sidewalks in the UK

31:58

maybe and some as they are I know

32:00

in some cities. They definitely are very state

32:02

by state and municipality by municipality. It

32:05

probably doesn't surprise you to know that the first

32:07

state to legalize the segue

32:09

on pedestrian sidewalks was in fact New Hampshire,

32:12

where the Segue was located. It was that that

32:14

was passed into law on February two

32:17

thousand two. Uh and

32:19

uh. And it wasn't until November eighteenth, two

32:21

thousand two that segways went on sale to the public

32:23

for the first time on Amazon dot Com.

32:26

Hey guys, I want to take a break

32:28

here. I want to transition from

32:30

this episode into an ad break.

32:33

So we're going to call that a segue.

32:35

Segue two

32:44

thousand five was when Disney World was introducing

32:46

the Around the World at Epcot Segue

32:48

Tour. So for those who have not been

32:50

to Epcot, it's divided into two big

32:53

sections. You have the Future World

32:55

section, where it's all about energy

32:57

and transportation and the

33:00

things that are going to be important

33:02

to us in the years to come, and kind of the innovations

33:04

that we can expect, or maybe even stuff

33:07

that you know is really far out there, maybe

33:09

it will never happen. The

33:11

other one is the World Showcase, which

33:13

has it's almost like a permanent World's

33:15

Fair. It has a has different

33:17

pavilions that represent various countries

33:20

in the world, and they are the

33:22

Around the World Segue Tour was

33:25

a segue tour that would take you around

33:27

the World Showcase, and it was like a two hour long

33:29

tour, and it would allow you to start

33:31

to explore the World Showcase

33:33

a couple of hours before it was open to the general

33:35

public. Because the way that Epcot works,

33:38

or at least it used to I assume it still does, is

33:41

when the doors would open, meaning

33:43

that when they would let you into the park, you

33:45

could only go into the Future World part for the first

33:47

couple of hours. The World Showcase would be

33:49

held off and like like if the park opens

33:52

at eight am, then the World Showcase would open

33:54

at ten. So this tour

33:56

would allow you to go through the World Showcase at

33:58

eight am, so you don't have to worry about

34:00

running down Jimmy who isn't paying

34:02

attention because he wants a Mickey

34:04

Mousetall right. Yeah, Disney is actually

34:07

banned the use of segways other than in their

34:09

tours. Yeah, that doesn't

34:11

surprise me. Yeah. One of the problems that it's had

34:13

with all of this is that UM segways are not

34:15

technically graded for medical use.

34:18

UM they are, although they can help

34:20

people with disabilities move from one place to another

34:23

because because Decca

34:26

worked with Johnson and Johnson on some of

34:28

their UM some of the gyroscopic platform

34:30

technology, Johnson and Johnson actually

34:33

owns that copyright and

34:35

for for medical use and interesting, Yeah,

34:37

I did not know that. That didn't come up in my research.

34:40

I know that on September four, two thousand and six,

34:43

they actually issued a recall for

34:45

twenty three thousand segways

34:47

and all of them and that was that was all of them

34:49

at that at that time because there was a software

34:52

glitch and that software glitch would cause

34:54

the wheels to occasionally and spontaneously

34:57

reverse direction, which obviously

34:59

that would be bad thing. I mean if you're

35:01

writing on it and you're not strapped into this thing, which you're

35:03

not. Yeah, well, it's like the way

35:06

I explained it to people, as I imagine you're walking

35:08

down down the street and then

35:10

suddenly the ground underneath you shifts direction

35:12

to opposite the way. You know, you would end up on your back

35:14

pretty quickly. And in fact, there

35:16

were people who fell off the segway, which

35:19

you know, when when I was first introduced, that

35:21

was one of the big things that they were saying that, you know, because

35:23

of all the gyroscopes would be really not that would

35:25

be impossible, but it would be hard. People

35:27

have to be trying. But then with this software

35:30

glitch, you know, made it very

35:32

easy to fall off a segue if it happened, and in

35:34

fact, people were ended up getting some injuries, like

35:36

some broken wrists and things like that.

35:38

There was a smaller recall back in A two thousand

35:40

three because when the charge got too low, the

35:43

segway would just stop very abruptly and

35:45

they had to you start tumbling

35:47

off the same sort of thing. Um.

35:50

I know that in in two thousand nine,

35:52

Dean came and ended up selling the company, and

35:55

he sold it to Jim Hesseldon.

35:58

Last name, I'm not sure if I'm pronouncing correctly. I'm

36:00

not sure. He known as Jimmy Jimmy

36:03

in the UK, who this guy who's a

36:05

businessman and a philanthropist, really

36:07

really known for his philanthropic endeavors.

36:10

And tragically in September he

36:14

uh hesseled and died in

36:16

an accident. He actually he

36:19

was on a segway and he ended up

36:21

falling off the edge of a cliff in a wooded

36:23

area. He was in one of the off road segways and

36:26

supposedly he encountered a walker

36:28

on a path and uh and reversed

36:30

to get out of the walker's way and templed

36:33

over. Oh I did not, I didn't see that.

36:35

That's that's that's kind of unconfirmed. I think

36:37

that I read that on like on like daily mail or something.

36:40

Yeah. So anyway, it was a tragic accident.

36:43

It was a terrible thing. And uh, you

36:45

know, I cannot say for certain, but I

36:48

have a feeling that that was part of what prompted

36:50

segue to uh inserts

36:52

so if you go to visit the Segway website,

36:55

a little Segway safety pop up

36:57

will appear and tell you that, you know,

36:59

you need to review the safety

37:02

procedures of and know how

37:04

to write a segue in order for you to operate

37:07

one safely. And so there's a there's an

37:09

actual pop up that will obscure your

37:11

view of the Segue website until

37:14

you dismiss it. And

37:16

um, they even have a full video that explains

37:19

you know, how the segway works and the

37:21

best way to operate it safely so that

37:23

you don't end up injuring yourself. Um.

37:26

And on February, Segue

37:28

was acquired by Summit Strategic Investments

37:31

l C, which is the current

37:34

company that owns the brand. And

37:36

uh, yeah, that's that's kind of where we are

37:38

right now, just just a few Actually, on this

37:41

March sixth, they announced the development

37:43

of a three wheel security device planned

37:46

to be coming out in Q four, uh

37:48

this this year. Um

37:51

and yeah, I mean, you know, so it's a reading

37:54

all about this kind of broke my heart because

37:56

because Cayman was so

37:58

passionate about how this

38:00

this terrific device could really change the world

38:03

and change people's lives and change our

38:05

city escapes for the better. And

38:07

it fizzled so much. You know,

38:09

it's we we talked about how a company

38:12

debuted in two thousand two, they started

38:14

selling the things. In two thousand six,

38:16

they had only sold twenty three thousand units.

38:19

They were hoping to have been selling

38:21

forty thousand per year um

38:24

and you know, a lot of things happened. It was It's

38:27

been a tough time the past decade or so

38:29

for consumer right. Yeah,

38:31

you've had economic downturns, You've had resistance

38:33

on the part of many municipalities to allow

38:36

the segue to travel along

38:38

things like sidewalks. There's also

38:40

other just practical considerations. I

38:42

mean, obviously a segue is great

38:44

if you happen to live in a place where the climate

38:46

is nice and mild. But if you are

38:49

in a place that gets a lot of rain, says

38:51

you're not going to be covered in the rain, You're going to actually

38:53

be out there, and depending upon those

38:55

segways made, it may not operate so well in the

38:57

right after a while, or you know, like I've hung out New

39:00

Hampshire, there are many months in New Hampshire that I would

39:02

not want to be k

39:05

yeah, So there's there's lots of reasons why

39:07

the segua adoption may have been slower, and I

39:09

think the main one is just that, you

39:11

know, we were so far along in the

39:14

infrastructure that we rely on already, like

39:16

we're so dependent upon a certain way

39:18

for our cities to to work for us

39:20

to get around and comfortably that to

39:23

expect a change in that is a little

39:25

on the optimistic side. It would require

39:27

a huge amount of effort, time

39:29

and money, and and when I

39:32

say a huge amount of time, I'm talking decades

39:34

to really refit a city in such

39:36

a way. So it would be ideal for using something

39:38

like a segue, particularly if you're in a city

39:41

that has a actually a fairly healthy

39:43

pedestrian population, healthy

39:45

and is in there are a lot of people out there walking,

39:48

not necessarily that they're all in great health. Atlanta

39:51

not so great for pedestrians,

39:53

I would say, I mean pedestrians. We

39:55

have very few sidewalks outside of our

39:57

main metropolitan areas. And you know, that's the other

39:59

thing with the segways is that I think that the concept

40:02

was always for them to be secondary to a

40:04

car, to like have a car and then have the

40:06

segway in it, and you know, park the car somewhere

40:08

and then take the segway out and go about your business.

40:11

Right, or if you happen to live, like, you know,

40:13

two miles away from a market, then you can just take

40:15

for that. Sure. But you know, but when these units

40:17

cost over five grand to pop, yeah,

40:20

and they weigh almost a hundred pounds,

40:22

then you know that's it's not easy to carry them

40:24

around. Yeah, that's that's that's one

40:26

of me. So that's you know, yeah, that's

40:28

right, Like okay,

40:30

So anyway, I'm just

40:33

depressed now because I'm thinking about how much weight I need to

40:35

lose before I come close to being a segway.

40:37

Um. But anyway, yeah, there

40:40

there are a lot of There are a lot of reasons. I think that

40:42

that explained why the segue did not

40:44

become the thing of the future. It

40:47

was certainly an incredible innovation.

40:49

It was a really interesting, uh

40:51

engineering feat. I've seen similar

40:55

products come out that are based

40:57

on the same general principles as

40:59

the Segue. Some of them are things like motorized

41:02

roller skates or a motorized skateboard

41:04

kind of thing. Um, Honda

41:07

came out with a unicycle looking sort

41:09

of thing that that that works on a similar basis.

41:11

And I think that Toyota, I mean, they didn't come out

41:13

with it. It's in prototype. I've seen

41:15

him. Let's see us. I've seen a motorized Essentially,

41:18

it's a motorized unicycle that you stand

41:20

on and again, just like with the segue,

41:22

you would lean forward to indicate that you want

41:24

to move forward. And I remember hearing

41:27

that it takes about thirty to forty five minutes

41:29

to kind of acclimate yourself to it to where

41:31

you can comfortably maneuver

41:33

through an environment. Say, I don't

41:35

know, a giant conference room

41:38

that's filled with hundreds of thousands of people

41:40

like cees just high example, if I had

41:42

been on there, I would have probably mangled at

41:44

least forty or fifty people before I

41:46

Actually, no, let's be

41:48

fair, I probably would have run over myself. And

41:52

yeah, yeah, and you know hypothetically, and these

41:54

things only go twelve point five miles

41:56

an hour. Um that that is on purpose.

41:59

They have a speed limit her in them. That's

42:01

that's the issue that caused the recall back in

42:03

two thousand six. The speed limitter was

42:05

was malfunctioning. Um

42:07

yeah, so I mean it's you know, there

42:09

were definitely ideas to uh

42:11

to really uh to

42:14

really uh to to make it as useful as

42:16

possible and limit the possible malfunctions

42:19

or injuries that can happen when people start

42:21

using a technology that as a brand new mode

42:23

of transportation. I mean, obviously have to take those things into

42:25

account. I hope you guys enjoyed this classic

42:27

episode of tech Stuff. I can always

42:30

tell that they're a big hit by the amount

42:32

of eye rolling that Tari gives me as she

42:34

listens to my puns. If you

42:36

guys have any suggestions for future

42:39

topics for tech Stuff, let

42:41

me know. Let me know on Twitter

42:43

or Facebook. The handle for us at

42:45

both of those locations is text

42:47

stuff H s W and

42:50

I'll talk to you again really

42:52

soon. Tex

42:57

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42:59

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