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Hey, it's Manoush. As we wrap

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up 2023, we want to offer

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you something a little special. It's

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a bonus episode featuring more from

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Dan Buettner, that's the National Geographic

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fellow and founder of the Blue

0:32

Zones Project, whom we featured

0:34

in our latest episode. We went on

0:37

a journey, he and I, into Blue

0:39

Zones across the world. But

0:42

once we were finished, our producer

0:44

Fiona Guerin stayed on with Dan

0:46

to find out more about his

0:49

daily routine, how he plans to

0:51

live to 100.

0:53

Now, listen, normally, bonus episodes

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are just for Ted Radio Hour

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Plus subscribers. It's a thank you

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if you're not yet a plus supporter, you're, sorry,

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going to have to hear some ads in just a moment.

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They help support our show too. But when

1:31

you get back, you'll get to hear Fiona

1:33

Guerin chatting with Dan Buettner. I

1:37

am really curious. You've been

1:39

doing this research about Blue Zones

1:41

for years, learning about these different

1:43

lifestyles that are keeping people active

1:45

and healthy for a really long

1:47

time into their 90s. So

1:50

I want to know how do you

1:52

incorporate these lessons into your own life?

1:55

And what does a typical day in the life look like

1:57

for you? So I live in

2:00

Miami Beach at the southern tip and

2:02

I wake up without an alarm

2:05

in a very dark room and

2:07

when my body wants to wake up and

2:09

then I walk or swim down the beach

2:12

to a place where I get my cup of coffee

2:14

every morning. Coffee by the way is a great longevity

2:16

beverage as long as you don't fill it up with

2:18

sugar and milk and all sorts

2:20

of other things. I read, I

2:24

walk back and then I work

2:26

about four to five hours a

2:29

day which seems to be optimal for the

2:31

human psyche. My first meal

2:33

happens between 1130 and

2:36

1 and I have a bowl of

2:38

minestrone. I met

2:40

the longest lived family in the world in

2:42

Sardinia and they gave me a recipe so

2:45

my first meal is midday. I like

2:48

to intermittent fast as people in the blue

2:50

zones do so I tend to

2:52

eat all my calories in about a an

2:55

eight hour window or nine hour window

2:58

and then mid-afternoon I always take a nap

3:01

about 15 minute nap it

3:03

starts out as a meditation but it ends up as

3:05

a nap and then I

3:07

usually work out again at the end of

3:09

the day that's best for my body and

3:12

when I say workout I always do something

3:14

that I enjoy and that's either playing

3:16

pickleball, riding my bicycle, stand-up

3:19

paddle surfing, sometimes I

3:22

go into the gym where I meet my friends but

3:24

I never do anything I don't want to do when

3:26

it comes to physical activity and then

3:29

because I know socializing having a

3:31

great social circle and engaging it

3:33

can add up to eight years

3:35

the life expectancy every night

3:37

I socialize with friends so I go out

3:39

every night and usually it's

3:41

around a great meal in

3:44

bed by 11 o'clock and

3:47

hit the reset button and

3:50

do that for as many days as I

3:52

can possibly string along hopefully to

3:54

a hundred. Wow that

3:56

sounds like a really lovely

3:58

day. How about... in the

4:00

afternoon, are you keeping

4:02

yourself going with a little coffee, pick me

4:05

up? No, I stopped

4:07

drinking caffeine by about 10 in

4:09

the morning. Caffeine has

4:11

about a 12-hour half-life, so the caffeine you drink

4:13

at noon, half of it's still there when you

4:15

go to bed at 11 o'clock. So

4:18

coffee early, no more caffeine after

4:21

mid-morning. Just to

4:23

go back to waking up first thing in the morning, what

4:26

would you recommend for folks who

4:28

maybe don't have that same flexibility

4:30

because they have a stricter work

4:32

schedule? What would help

4:34

them make their mornings more

4:37

aligned with the Blue Zone lifestyle?

4:41

First of all, I would think about seeing

4:43

if they can get their job to align

4:45

to their body rather than the other way

4:47

around. So maybe you can

4:49

talk to the people you work with or

4:51

for to see if you can start your

4:53

day longer. A great night's sleep

4:56

is so important. It can be worth about

4:58

six extra years of life expectancy over not

5:00

getting enough sleep. So

5:02

I would prioritize getting sleep. And by the

5:04

way, if your job won't allow

5:06

you to get the necessary sleep, I think

5:09

about getting a new job quite honestly. But

5:12

if you absolutely cannot get enough rest

5:15

or cannot wake up when your body wants you

5:17

to wake up, taking a

5:19

nap does help. You do not have to go

5:21

into deep sleep. If you

5:23

can just dip in for a few minutes in the

5:25

middle of the afternoon, the best time to take a

5:27

nap is between about one and three. And

5:30

that's what we see in Blue Zones. That

5:33

will help with a foreshortened night of rest.

5:36

Are there ever days where you don't

5:38

start your morning that way? Like, if

5:40

the weather is terrible and you can't

5:42

go out swimming, what does a compromised

5:44

day look like for you? I

5:47

just walk along the beach. Once

5:49

again, that's why your surroundings are so

5:52

important. If you live in a

5:54

soulless suburb somewhere where all you

5:57

see around you are these McMansions.

6:01

and no beautiful trees. You don't want to walk

6:03

there, but you know I've made a little bit

6:05

of an effort and stretched a little bit to

6:07

live in a place where I'm right

6:09

next to the ocean and not by a beautiful

6:11

beach and I can't wait to wake up in

6:13

the morning and go out there. It changes every

6:15

day. The sea is

6:17

sometimes turbulent and sometimes placid. The

6:20

shape of the sand changes. The

6:22

sky is different. That's all

6:24

about the environment and if there's

6:26

one thing I learned in Blue Zones is pick the

6:29

right environment if you want to live

6:31

a long and happy life. Yeah, no

6:33

that makes a lot of sense and you

6:35

can feel that same way in a forest

6:37

or in any kind of natural environment,

6:39

right? Yes. I

6:41

actually wrote a book about happiness

6:43

for National Geographic and we found two

6:45

interesting things. Number one, if you live

6:47

near water you're about 10% more

6:50

likely to be happy and secondly

6:52

if you live in a sunny locale

6:56

you're about 5% more likely to be

6:58

happy. So at the end

7:00

of the day whether it's longevity

7:02

or happiness, most of it

7:04

is a game of inches. There's no

7:07

short-term fix. There's no pill or

7:09

supplement or longevity hack that's

7:11

going to make you live longer. It's

7:14

about setting up nudges and

7:16

defaults in your life so

7:18

you unconsciously make small improvements

7:20

in your behavior all

7:22

day long unconsciously

7:25

for years or decades. That's what gets

7:27

you living to the capacity of

7:29

the human machine which is probably about 95 years.

7:34

Do you watch TV? I

7:37

think there's room for some intellectual

7:39

repose. We actually did a

7:42

survey in conjunction with National Geographic

7:44

of about 150,000 people and we found that there's sort

7:46

of a sweet spot

7:50

of about 45 minutes a

7:52

day of TV watching. Seems

7:54

to bring

7:56

a certain amount of joy actually but

7:59

after about 45 minutes, you're

8:01

using that time at the expense of

8:04

richer things like connecting with

8:06

people or pursuing a hobby

8:08

or staying physically active or

8:10

volunteering. So yeah, I watch about

8:13

a half hour a day. Usually

8:15

it's sort of the reward at the

8:17

end of the day where I kind

8:19

of put my brain to bed and

8:21

then my body follows. When

8:24

you're out with your friends, are you having a

8:26

glass of wine with dinner or is wine only

8:29

a special occasions thing or

8:32

is it never a thing? How

8:34

is alcohol play into your life? The

8:37

vast majority of the centenarians

8:39

I met during Blue Zones have

8:41

a glass or two of wine every day. So

8:44

that's the program I follow. I have a

8:46

couple glasses of wine most days. Well

8:49

you've done an amazing job curating

8:51

your life to fit what's best

8:53

for your body. But

8:56

for someone who is living

8:59

the average American life, working

9:02

to live, what is the best

9:05

first step for

9:07

someone who wants to start aligning their

9:09

life to their body's needs? Well,

9:13

the big lesson we learn in Blue Zones

9:15

is not to try to change your behaviors,

9:17

it's to change your surroundings. So

9:20

again, I would start with your job. Most

9:22

of us spend most of our waking hours at work.

9:24

So I would get that right. The

9:27

next place to look is your social circle. So

9:30

think about recurating your immediate

9:33

social circle to add

9:35

people's idea of recreation as something

9:37

active or something

9:39

intellectually stimulating. You

9:41

want friends who care about you on a

9:44

bad day with whom you can have a

9:46

meaningful conversation. And it's not a

9:48

bad idea to have a vegan or

9:50

vegetarian in your immediate social circle

9:52

because they're going to show you how to eat

9:54

delicious whole food, plant

9:57

based diets or explore them anyway.

10:00

So basically you're saying all of your

10:02

social circle has these kind of shared

10:04

values where you're spending time doing

10:07

fitness and volunteering. But

10:09

how do you get there? How do

10:12

you curate those kinds of relationships? Well,

10:15

I recently moved to Miami, so I

10:18

love being active. So I very

10:20

proactively cultivated a

10:22

group of friends who play pickleball. I

10:24

think it's the greatest social innovation America

10:27

has stumbled upon in the past half a

10:29

century. Very easy to make

10:31

friends. I have a number of

10:34

friends who when I get together,

10:36

they tend to probably drink more than

10:38

is optimal for my health. I

10:40

haven't dumped them as friends, but I don't see them

10:42

as much. And I

10:45

have all kinds of intellectual pursuits. I

10:47

love people with different

10:50

expertise. And

10:52

I very proactively have created a

10:54

social circle down here. People

10:57

who are into philanthropic innovations,

10:59

a lot of longevity experts,

11:01

people are interested in health.

11:04

And that's my social group. So it's easy

11:06

for me to stay mentally engaged and physically

11:08

active and living my purpose. I don't have

11:10

to think about it. All I have to

11:13

do is call up a friend. When

11:16

you were first getting into kind

11:18

of making your lifestyle a longevity

11:20

lifestyle, did you really

11:22

have to focus and like think

11:25

about your choices or

11:27

was it all basically

11:30

making those environmental changes?

11:33

I mean, it takes an

11:36

effort to be healthier or

11:38

happier. The mistake that most

11:41

of us make is to think that we're

11:43

going to change our behavior and really have

11:45

an impact on how long we're going to

11:47

live. And if you

11:49

look at the research of diets

11:52

or exercise programs or supplements, they

11:55

occasionally work, but only for the

11:57

short run. They never work

11:59

for the long run. at least not for critical

12:01

masses of people. So I'm

12:05

a big fan, especially around the new

12:07

year of new year, new you, but

12:09

instead of trying to change your habits

12:12

or your behavior, it's a much

12:14

better investment to change your surroundings

12:16

in ways that you'll be nudged

12:18

to move more, eat

12:20

better, socialize with the right

12:23

people. And we often don't

12:25

think of longevity in these terms. We think

12:27

about the superfood or

12:30

cross-fed or the fad diet

12:32

or some longevity hack

12:35

from some Silicon Valley billionaire.

12:38

No, that's not the way really people

12:40

achieve longevity or happiness. If you look

12:42

at populations that have achieved it, they

12:45

do it unconsciously by living in the right

12:47

environment. I really love that.

12:50

It's so great to hear that we're

12:52

taking some of the responsibility off

12:55

of just your individual willpower. Okay.

12:59

So if someone wanted

13:01

to make a new year's

13:04

resolution change to improve their environment and

13:08

make this lifestyle easier, what

13:11

do you think? Should they get a

13:13

gym buddy, sign up for a pottery

13:15

class? What kind of environmental changes actually

13:18

make a difference? Well

13:21

for a new year's resolution, instead of the

13:24

fad diet or the gym membership, I

13:26

would go through my social circle or

13:28

my contacts and I would identify one

13:31

or two of them who

13:33

are healthy and happy and reach out

13:35

to them and invite them to a

13:37

happy hour or a lunch and

13:41

proactively bring them into your

13:43

inner circle of friends. Because

13:46

at the end of the day, for it to count,

13:49

they have to be people you see with some frequency

13:51

and people with whom you're close enough that you

13:54

can have meaningful conversations. That's where you want to

13:56

get. Most of us know a handful

13:58

of people like this. We might've let them

14:01

stray or we haven't made the effort to bring

14:03

them close, but that's what I would do for

14:05

a New Year's resolution. Or,

14:07

you know, this sounds facile.

14:10

Find a pickleball court. It's

14:12

the easiest way to make new friends. And I

14:14

wouldn't say it about tennis. I wouldn't say it

14:16

about basketball. Go to

14:19

a pickleball court, show up

14:21

with the paddle. Within about a

14:23

week, you'll have some new friends. That

14:26

was Dan Butner talking to producer Fiona

14:28

Guerin. This episode was produced

14:30

by ChowTo and edited by James Delahusi.

14:33

Our team also includes Matthew

14:35

Cloutier. And for

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more bonus episodes, just like

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this, sign up for Ted

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Radio Hour Plus at plus

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dot npr.org/ Ted. You'll

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but most importantly, you're supporting

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everyone's work here at NPR.

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Thanks so much for listening. We've got an episode

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of Ted Radio Hour coming on Friday. See

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you then.