0:03

We are back with That's

0:03

Burlesque Podcast and I have a

0:05

very special January guest. As

0:05

you can see, we have the

0:09

wonderful Tito Bones and I'm so

0:09

excited to have you. How are

0:14

you? Do you want to tell? tell

0:14

people what you're wearing?

0:16

Yeah,

0:17

'Cos it's spectacular.

0:18

All right, well, I'll give

0:18

you my I'll give you my stock

0:21

intro. Hello, my name is Tito

0:21

Bone. I like Tito B ones as

0:24

well. That's quite sexy. I am

0:24

your average blind non binary

0:28

bisexual drag King. Thank you

0:28

very much. I am extremely

0:32

handsome. You should absolutely

0:32

know that for a fact that

0:35

science that's not my opinion.

0:35

I'm a slim white person. I have

0:39

brown buzzed hair. I have a very

0:39

large nose with a blue septum

0:43

ring in it. Normally I have a

0:43

glitter beard. But the glitter

0:47

beard is on the inside today.

0:47

Because this is zoom drag, and I

0:53

am wearing a I guess a dinner

0:53

jacket style kind of dress coat

0:57

that's got like shimmery blues

0:57

and purples and golds and

1:02

silvers on it and then it has a

1:02

long kind of black collar on it

1:06

and I have a purple sequined bow

1:06

tie that was made by a lovely

1:11

company called Marked and

1:11

Snatched, which if you don't

1:13

know you should just go go check

1:13

them out and buy everything they

1:15

make. And purple shirt

1:15

underneath that. And I might be

1:21

wearing trousers. I might not be

1:21

this zoom. So you will never

1:24

know.

1:26

I like I like a bit of

1:26

Mystique though. If I'm honest.

1:29

Yeah. Going in that one

1:29

wonderful introduction for

1:33

yourself. And I think you did it

1:33

much better than I could have

1:36

ever possibly have done it. And

1:36

I think that's just years of

1:38

[Inaudible) practice.

1:42

Yeah, and as you know, I

1:42

am Curly Chaos. Today I'm

1:46

wearing a nice blue shirt. With

1:46

some green trousers. You can

1:50

kind of see that I tripped over

1:50

on the other day. With some

1:53

black suspenders. I'm curly. I'm

1:53

quite kind of average build. I

1:57

got a boob happening. And and

1:57

curly hair on one side and scalp

2:02

on the other side.

2:03

Ooh,

2:04

Because we went pure zero

2:04

shave this month. Because

2:08

winter.

2:10

Yes, you'd like one side

2:10

of your head to be particularly

2:12

cold. But it's also like the

2:12

queer code, isn't it? Like you

2:16

need to have if not all of your

2:16

hair, at least some bit of

2:18

your...

2:19

Some of it. A bit of boss

2:19

underneath or a bit of

2:22

something. Yeah. I went, like,

2:22

queer me with the zero shave!

2:28

Nice.

2:31

Tito, I'm so excited to

2:31

have you and you're just what

2:35

you're one of my favourite

2:35

performers. I think all time.

2:38

Thank you.

2:39

And I I cry every time I

2:39

watch you perform, because it's

2:45

funny. And it's just

2:45

educational, and witty and just

2:53

I could keep going on but then we're just...

2:55

I love a compliment,

2:55

actually

2:58

She's like "I will speak

2:58

I will not speak for 45 minutes,

3:00

please just carry on."

3:02

Yes. About how great I am!

3:05

I mean you are great. But

3:05

one of the one of the really

3:07

great things about you is that

3:07

you have a... I want to say

3:12

business but that's not the word

3:12

I want. One of the best words

3:14

you have a wonderful organisation called Quiplash.

3:17

Yes.

3:18

Which I did one of the

3:18

courses not that long ago on

3:24

kind of disability and

3:24

accessibility. And it was

3:29

absolutely eye opening, I have

3:29

to say for one of a better

3:33

phrase there. But it was and it

3:33

was important. And I felt a

3:40

guest there. I am hard of

3:40

hearing. But I still battle with

3:45

that as being a disability. So I

3:45

felt like a guest and it was

3:50

really great. And I'd love for

3:50

you to tell us more about

3:53

Quiplash, and what you do, and

3:53

who you are and everything.

3:57

I'll tell you everything.

3:57

So Quiplash. We're not we're not

4:03

officially a business yet. We're

4:03

working on it. That's plans for

4:06

2021 depending on how much fire

4:06

the world continues to be on. If

4:11

that makes sense. Currently,

4:11

it's a... we're calling it a

4:15

project. So it's me and my wife,

4:15

Al Lander-Cavalo. And we run

4:21

this together. So I think I

4:21

often because I'm a performer as

4:26

my kind of main individual

4:26

trade, I often tend to seem like

4:30

I'm the kind of voice or

4:30

spokespersons person of it, but

4:33

it is two of us and it's really

4:33

important to give them credit

4:36

for that as well. Because

4:36

they're the organisational head

4:40

in this they are the one who

4:40

knows how to do the like proper

4:43

admin. The reason our website

4:43

looks really swanky and our

4:48

social media looks really swanky

4:48

is 1,000% them. And yeah, so

4:53

Quiplash is a project that has

4:53

kind of a couple of different

4:59

branches. All of which exist to

4:59

take space for queer disabled

5:05

people in whatever forms and

5:05

ways they identify, and whatever

5:10

sort of, I guess, part of their

5:10

journey into identifying that

5:13

way they're on. And so this

5:13

takes a few different forms. So

5:17

one is a performance forum where

5:17

we make performance projects. We

5:21

very recently did a show called

5:21

Unsightly Drag And Friends that

5:25

we went to the Bloomsbury

5:25

Festival, it was a digital event

5:28

where we had myself and Al in

5:28

their dr ag character, Ophelia

5:34

Bone. And we also had Kallum

5:34

Kirly, who I don't know if

5:38

you're aware of. They're a Dr.

5:38

King that we work with a lot

5:41

because they have a lot of

5:41

different skills as an access

5:44

worker, and a communication

5:44

support worker, which is a type

5:48

of access for sign language

5:48

users. And so and they're also

5:52

in our band, we have a drag band...

5:55

Wait. Wait. Back up. I

5:55

don't want to interrupt this

5:58

wonderful flow you're on but you

5:58

need to back up because I don't

6:01

know if I was aware of that. You

6:01

have a drag band?

6:04

It's called Drag Band.

6:04

We're very creative as you can

6:08

tell.

6:10

How long did it take you to come up with that name?

6:12

Longer than it should

6:12

have. We were trying to do like,

6:16

I don't know, Kirly Bone and

6:16

Bone or Kirly and the Bones or

6:20

something. But like it is a

6:20

very, like, we're all on a very

6:23

much a level kind of footing in

6:23

terms of how much everybody does

6:27

and we didn't want it to seem

6:27

like there was a lead singer or

6:30

anything. So we're just like,

6:30

fuck it, Drag Band, whatever.

6:34

I'm allowed to swear on this right?

6:35

Fuck yeah. Oh, yeah. Go

6:35

for broke. Just don't give a

6:40

shit.

6:41

Okay, good.

6:43

Wait, so someone sings...?

6:46

We all sing.

6:47

Okay, yeah.

6:48

So we all sing. I at the

6:48

minute am taking the

6:53

instrumental side of stuff as

6:53

well. But everybody has varying

6:57

levels of instrumental skills.

6:57

And the only reason that hasn't

7:00

come out more, and probably the

7:00

only reason you might not know

7:02

about us, the only reason, the

7:02

sole reason, because we're

7:05

great, is that we kind of just

7:05

started at the beginning of 2020

7:10

and had started to book gigs.

7:10

And then of course, gigs

7:15

disappeared. So but we're still

7:15

here. We're still kicking

7:19

around. We still have big plans

7:19

for the future. Wembley, we're

7:22

coming. Maybe. But yeah, anyway,

7:22

yeah. So we have a drag band. We

7:27

did a song, we do parody, we do

7:27

comedy, parodies daily songs,

7:33

with good tight harmonies. And

7:33

yeah, and then we also had, in

7:39

going back to Unsightly Drag and

7:39

Friends, we had a cast of

7:43

various deaf, disabled, and

7:43

neuro-diverse folks. Actually,

7:46

we didn't have any deaf performers in it this time around, but we have in the past.

7:48

And they all made digital pieces

7:53

that integrated audio

7:53

description in some way, which

7:56

audio description is access for

7:56

blind or visually impaired

7:59

people, which is kind of my

7:59

thing, as a person. And so

8:03

that's one project that we have

8:03

done. And that kind of you know,

8:08

is where we've started, we have

8:08

a lot of plans for various other

8:11

types of performance stuff, both

8:11

with and outside of drag. We

8:16

also do access consulting and

8:16

trainings. So what Curly was

8:20

saying about the course, we did

8:20

a day course on disability

8:24

awareness and audio description,

8:24

and training people to learn how

8:28

to kind of audio describe in a

8:28

queer way, so we call it "queer

8:32

audio description", again, very

8:32

creative with our names.

8:34

I see that [laughs]. I

8:34

should start a business of

8:38

naming things. Because we're

8:38

missing a trick to be honest.

8:43

Your creativity knows no bounds.

8:45

Right? Exactly. Yes. But

8:45

yeah, that's a day course on the

8:51

basics of audio description. And

8:51

then you know, if anybody's

8:54

interested in doing those, check

8:54

out our social medias, because

8:57

we will be doing more next year.

8:57

We've done those in person. And

9:01

we've also done those in a

9:01

physical space, and we've also

9:04

done them on Zoom. And yeah,

9:04

it's great fun, it's a gas,

9:10

Quiplash is great. I'm not

9:10

biassed or anything.

9:13

I mean, it is great. And

9:13

I'm, you know, I'm not biassed,

9:15

or I might be a little bit but

9:15

that's just because of the love

9:18

I have for you. But I you know,

9:18

I feel like it's great in so m

9:24

ny ways and the fact that it's

9:24

so important to have, and you

9:29

now you do it so that, you know

9:29

for want of a better work, it'

9:34

so accessible for the bu

9:34

lesque cabaret communities for t

9:38

em to be able to, to say "I w

9:38

nt / need my show to be acc

9:45

ssible and I don't know wher

9:45

to go". Quiplash. Yeah, you

9:50

now, and you know, even if it'

9:50

just I just want some more in

9:53

ormation there are courses. An

9:53

like I say the course that

9:56

I did, I met some lovely peopl

9:56

. Yeah, you know, and it was s

10:01

informative, there's a lot

10:01

f information like there's not b

10:04

at around the bush, there's a

10:04

ot, you know, because there's

10:08

egislation to look at, there's

10:08

all that kind of all that good s

10:12

uff and that and that's a lot it

10:12

s a lot of information to take i

10:14

, I had a whole like notepa

10:14

's worth of stuff, but at the

10:18

nd of the day, you know, cuz

10:18

he whole day, but trust me whe

10:21

I tell you that it's worth

10:21

t. It's just... it made me lo

10:25

k at producing shows in a diff

10:25

rent

10:28

Yay! Goal! With the

10:28

training and consulting I mean,

10:35

with all of it, but with the training and consulting in particular, we want to just sort

10:37

of like make it really... make

10:41

it a thing that your event isn't

10:41

cool unless you're making it

10:45

accessible. And obviously like,

10:45

you know, that's within people's

10:49

means and budgets and all that

10:49

kind of stuff and what they're

10:52

kind of capable of, and also to

10:52

a certain degree the audiences

10:55

that they cater for.

10:56

Sure.

10:58

But like, you know, and because we're, you know, Quiplash when we run

11:00

performances, we're very clear

11:03

that our shows are primarily for

11:03

queer, disabled people and

11:07

anybody else who wants to come

11:07

as welcome. But you're a guest

11:10

in our house, and you need to be

11:10

nice. And if you're not, we'll

11:14

just kick out.

11:19

And if none of you have

11:19

seen Quiplash in action, they do

11:21

a lot of... a lot of shows so

11:21

they... Why is it I can't do

11:28

words in 2020?

11:30

There's been a lot on your mind I bet.

11:32

I mean sure, but I was

11:32

gonna say "they give people to

11:36

sign" [laughs]. That's not what

11:36

trying to say. I'm not out here

11:41

trying to "give" people. I'm not

11:41

trying to sell people.

11:46

No, no, that's a different

11:46

thing. We don't do that.

11:49

[laughs]

11:50

No, but so if for example

11:50

if you have seen LADS, you will

11:53

have seen wonderful people doing

11:53

signing on the side of the

11:58

stage. Is that right, that

11:58

terminology signing?

12:05

So Interpreting, in

12:05

British language or a sign

12:09

language depending on which

12:09

country you're in each country

12:12

has its own version of sign

12:12

language. But yeah, an

12:15

interpreter on stage and also

12:15

like LADS was is our like O.G.

12:21

client and because I've known

12:21

Lolo for quite a while now and

12:26

like I'm a LADS alum which is

12:26

really nice.

12:30

Ooh, we love LADS.

12:32

They're such... they're

12:32

good people. They are just some

12:36

of the goodest people and like,

12:36

yeah, so Lolo took a kind of

12:44

access plan that was actually

12:44

developed by Al and myself pre

12:49

Quiplash for a show that we,

12:49

well that Al used to run in her

12:54

upstairs slash them downstairs

12:54

in Camden when that was still

12:57

kicking around. So if anybody

12:57

ever experienced Vance, the

13:01

Trans and non-binary led and

13:01

promoted show that had all the

13:07

organisers were Trans and/or

13:07

non-binary and all the

13:10

performers were Trans and/or

13:10

non-binary. And so they're the

13:14

kind of access provisions that

13:14

LADS has, stemmed from what was

13:20

developed from that show. So

13:20

LADS has an interpreter on

13:23

stage. They also have audio

13:23

describers that are usually so

13:28

this is all kind of being

13:28

shifted, because this is pre

13:31

COVID. So the way to be done was

13:31

that the describer, or a couple

13:35

of describers would sit with the

13:35

people who need the description

13:37

and kind of whisper / shout into

13:37

people's ears, but there's no

13:41

social distance and do that. So

13:41

but I know now that they are

13:45

working in venues where they

13:45

have the kind of audio

13:48

description headsets in place,

13:48

and do it that way. So yeah. But

13:55

yeah, they're and there's also

13:55

just stuff that they've done

13:57

around, kind of relaxed, where

13:57

they can relaxing, keeping the

14:04

audience kind of setting fairly

14:04

relaxed so people can do what

14:07

they need to do to interact with

14:07

the show. And yeah, they're,

14:09

they're good people. It's a

14:09

really good example of kind of

14:14

embedding access into the way an

14:14

event runs. And also like, if

14:17

you've been to more than one,

14:17

hopefully, you could see the

14:21

progression of how they get

14:21

better every single time they do

14:23

it. Yeah. I've known nothing but

14:23

good things to think about them.

14:26

Listen, I've noticed the

14:26

progression and it in LADS and

14:30

actually, it was where I figured

14:30

out Quiplash. I was like, "Who?

14:36

Where do you come from? What,

14:36

where, how is this happening?

14:41

Where do you find people?" Yeah,

14:41

I was like, Alright, it's

14:44

Quiplash. Okay, good. Because,

14:44

you know, people see that on

14:48

stage and go this, okay. Yeah,

14:48

we're missing a trick here,

14:52

everybody. Let's get this

14:52

rocking, because I think as

14:57

producers, we should always be

14:57

looking at, I want to say the

15:03

perfect show. That's not really

15:03

what I mean. But you want to be

15:06

looking to hit hit your safe

15:06

space, you want to be looking to

15:09

hit a space where you are not...

15:09

you're including everybody.

15:14

Yeah.

15:15

Look, like you say it's

15:15

not always possible all of the

15:18

time. Budgets, so on so forth.

15:18

You know, you do what you can

15:21

within your means. But I think

15:21

it's something we should all be

15:24

aiming for, as humans in

15:24

general, in society.

15:29

Yeah, I think the Quiplash

15:29

sort of tagline is that we

15:32

absolutely do not work in

15:32

absolutes. So you will never

15:36

catch a Quiplash show claiming

15:36

that it is completely

15:39

accessible. And I would say that

15:39

if you are a producer that has

15:44

used that phrasing beforehand,

15:44

or if you are somebody that

15:46

comes across it, you shall know

15:46

that the average Deaf disabled

15:51

neurodiverse person is going to

15:51

read that and immediately be

15:54

sceptical.

15:54

Sure,

15:55

Because it's a thing you

15:55

reach for, but it is a thing

15:57

that does not exist. So really,

15:57

because human beings are diverse

16:04

creatures, and you could have

16:04

every type of access that you

16:07

can think of in some that you've

16:07

never heard of before completely

16:10

embedded into your show. And it

16:10

could be down to the fact that

16:13

somebody just doesn't like the

16:13

way you did it. And they're

16:17

allowed to not like it.

16:18

Yeah, of course.

16:20

You know, there's, there's

16:20

all that kind of stuff kind of,

16:23

that's a really important thing.

16:23

And yeah, so I think that's kind

16:29

of our like, you need to you

16:29

know, embedding access is a

16:31

really important thing, is a

16:31

really cool thing. And you reach

16:34

for the pie in the sky,

16:34

everything is accessible thing

16:37

while knowing it's a journey.

16:37

You have to work on it. You have

16:40

to keep shifting. You have to

16:40

check your own privilege. All

16:43

that kind of stuff. So yeah.

16:45

Woo! Tito is out here on

16:45

the podcast, bringing you 2021

16:52

in style.

16:55

Oh,yeah, it's the New Year technically.

16:56

It will be yes. By the time this goes out, I'll be the New Year. So you're given us all

16:58

of this for 2021. Also, what I

17:02

enjoy is about 10 minutes ago,

17:02

your wonderful cat was just

17:05

behind you having a clean.

17:07

So do you want to do you

17:07

want to have a cat cam? Should

17:09

we have a cat cam?

17:10

Aww, a cat cam!

17:12

She is in her bed. So for

17:12

people who might need a little

17:16

description Noodle is... her

17:16

name is Noodle. She's a fluffy

17:19

cat. She's white with big black

17:19

patches all over her face and

17:23

body and tail. And she's in a

17:23

little, standing... we've got a

17:28

garishly gigantic cat tree

17:28

that's tan and it's got lots of

17:32

like beds and things for her to

17:32

crawl in or in and around on.

17:35

And there's like a lower bed

17:35

that she really enjoys sleeping

17:38

on. So she's in there at the

17:38

minute. We call it her pie.

17:41

Because the way she curls up in

17:41

a little noodle pie.

17:45

Also that cat house is a

17:45

castle.

17:48

It is. Yep. Yes. And our

17:48

cat is the queen and I will hear

17:51

nothing else other than that

17:52

Listen, I would never say

17:52

anything else other than that.

17:55

Cats are just general, you know,

17:55

kings, queens, you know, however

18:01

you like, but they are royalty

18:01

and we shall obey them.

18:06

And also Noodle has her

18:06

own Instagram? [laughs]

18:10

Of course she does.

18:11

If you're into it.

18:13

Share the Instagram please.

18:14

It is @nanettenoodle

18:14

because we originally, as the

18:18

good queers that we are, named

18:18

her Nanette and then realised

18:20

that's a really hard name to

18:20

kind of say to a cat repeatedly

18:23

[Laughs] Without calling

18:23

her "Nan".

18:25

Yeah. And then it devolved

18:25

into Noodle very quickly. So

18:30

it's Nanette as in the Hannah

18:30

Gatsby, Netflix special, Noodle,

18:35

all one word. She's very

18:35

beautiful. Again, the scientific

18:39

fact. So yeah. She is beautiful. And we'll put

18:41

that link in the description as

18:43

well. So not only could check

18:43

out Tito, who I know you're kind

18:46

of interested in but more

18:46

interested in Noodle, I kind of

18:49

get that. Honestly, ifyou're more

18:49

interested in Noodle I fully

18:53

support that because she's

18:53

better than everyone. So yeah.

18:57

Oh, yeah. Well, you know,

18:57

I'm also a bit protective and

19:00

biased of my own cat.

19:03

I mean, your cat is also better than everyone. So...

19:05

That is correct. Yeah.

19:05

She's also she also popped out

19:07

of a Christmas card. She's one

19:07

of those cats where you're like,

19:11

"You're not real".

19:13

Yeah, Noodle kind of looks

19:13

like that as well. She's got

19:15

really odd markings. Yeah, so

19:15

yeah, anyway. Now this is a

19:20

podcast about cats. I'm not mad.

19:24

I think unfortunately,

19:24

it'll double our listeners.

19:28

Because we're obsessed with cats

19:28

and animals.

19:32

We noticed that really

19:32

quickly with Quiplash stuff

19:35

where if we were trying to

19:35

promote something or even just

19:37

give an update, if we just

19:37

chucked a picture of our cat

19:40

onto the just, you know, like,

19:40

if anything for the algorithm

19:43

because pictures on social

19:43

media, like if you're on

19:46

Facebook, they just show up a

19:46

little bit more regularly. But

19:49

like the amount of interaction

19:49

we had with those pictures or

19:52

those posts was like double. So

19:52

anything like my face on it?

19:56

[scoffs]. Anything with Noodles

19:56

face on it? It's like

19:59

ammediately everybody's into it.

19:59

Which you know, again, I get it.

20:03

That's fair. I think this

20:03

is top tips with Tito. If you

20:08

would like to fuck with the

20:08

algorithm...

20:11

Put pictures of my cat. [laughs]

20:14

Pictures of Noodle... [laughs

20:18

Oh god.

20:19

While promoting a new

20:19

show of pictures of Noodle.

20:23

It'll work. If anything,

20:23

people will be like, "what are

20:25

you doing?" But you know...

20:28

Why is that? That's not your cat.

20:29

Yes.

20:30

Speaking of shows, do you

20:30

have anything planned for

20:33

January or 2021 in general?

20:33

Obviously Drag Band.

20:36

Yes. So drag band is kind

20:36

of... Drag Band is kind of

20:42

slowly working as a thing, it is

20:42

probably something that will be

20:47

more likely to kick back into

20:47

high gear when we can be in

20:53

physical space and safe to do

20:53

that again, which like, being

20:57

real, that seems to be differing

20:57

between different people. And

21:02

we're being very slow and very

21:02

cautious about it for a lot of

21:05

reasons. So yeah, that might be

21:05

not be for a while. But that

21:08

being said, there's a plan for

21:08

Quiplash to start putting out

21:12

some more digital content in

21:12

2021, in this year that we're in

21:16

right now.

21:20

The future!

21:21

The future! And so, you

21:21

know, stay tuned, follow our

21:27

socials because I reckon Drag

21:27

Band will have some presence in

21:33

there somewhere. Because I like

21:33

music and we like music, and

21:37

it's just a fun way to flex a

21:37

bunch of different muscles. In

21:41

terms of other stuff, I actually

21:41

have a show happening at the

21:49

Barbican. provided we are still

21:49

able to do them. Because, you

21:55

know, the reality is we're in

21:55

December, as we're recording

21:57

this we're in December. So who

21:57

knows what January shall bring?

22:02

Fun and fire?

22:03

Yes. And I don't remember

22:03

what the exact date of it is.

22:08

This shows you how attached I am

22:08

to performances and physical

22:11

spaces right now because I'm

22:11

just like, it might not happen.

22:14

Who knows. But I can send you a

22:14

link for that. Because that

22:20

should be really the whole kind

22:20

of... it's a whole week of stuff

22:24

happening. So it's me and a

22:24

bunch of other performers and

22:26

the people that are bringing in a really cool,

22:28

Okay.

22:29

And it's sort of, like, I

22:29

think the way that they're

22:31

planning to do it is they're

22:31

going to let one bubble at a

22:35

time come in. So it's really

22:35

bespoke to kind of almost one on

22:38

one shows should be really nice.

22:40

Okay.

22:41

I'll be there in drag

22:41

singing some songs for y'all. So

22:44

yeah.

22:45

Well, you will need to go

22:45

and see that if it happens,

22:48

because I want to see your

22:48

singing with, you know, drag and

22:52

singing and, you know.

22:53

So unfortunately, because

22:53

it's a family friendly event.

22:56

I'm not allowed to take my

22:56

clothes off. [laughs]

23:01

[laughs] Well that's

23:01

upsetting.

23:05

I know,

23:06

it's not at all. You

23:06

know, I mean I like titty as

23:10

much as the next human. But

23:10

talent is also a thing. Yes.

23:15

I'm just aware because

23:15

it's a Burlesque Podcast, like

23:17

I'm not stripping. I like to,

23:17

but I'm not doing that. But

23:21

yeah, it's really fun. And then

23:21

I mean, the rest of the year,

23:26

there's... who knows? Again,

23:26

Quiplash has a lot of plans in

23:30

the pipeline that we kind of, we

23:30

will announce as and when we

23:33

know that we can do them. So

23:33

just keep your eyes peeled on

23:37

Quiplash socials and on my King

23:37

Tito Bone socials because stuff

23:42

will pop up.

23:43

Yeah, all of those will

23:43

be in the description.

23:45

Obviously, we'll promote them

23:45

all over the place. How long

23:53

have you been doing drag, out of

23:53

interest?

23:56

How long have I been doing

23:56

drag? Uh, about a year and a

24:01

half?

24:02

Yeah, I didn't think it

24:02

was very long.

24:04

Yeah, so.I started my drag

24:04

career really late. I've been

24:09

performing well, compared to a

24:09

lot of drag people. I have been

24:13

performing since I was very

24:13

young. So like so in terms of I

24:18

think people think I've been

24:18

doing it for longer because I'm

24:20

very comfortable as a performer.

24:22

Yeah. Um, but I have only been really

24:22

doing it for a year and a half.

24:27

And I started it Well, okay, so

24:27

I did I experimented with drag

24:33

beforehand where I got cast in a

24:33

play where I played a drag King.

24:38

I had no say in I had a little

24:38

bit of say in like how the look

24:43

went because I knew stuff that I

24:43

wanted to try. And the the team

24:46

was really cool about, like, you

24:46

know, kind of letting me dictate

24:50

that a little bit as long as it

24:50

fit within the show. But in

24:52

terms of the actual character,

24:52

it was a script. So the name,

24:57

the way I behaved, everything

24:57

was all kind of based on The

25:00

story. Okay,

25:01

but yeah, so Tito was

25:01

created, really for unsightly

25:06

drag, which the first time we

25:06

did that was in 2019. Again,

25:11

with Bloomsbury festival. And

25:11

yeah, Tito came out of all of

25:16

that. And I , it was really it's

25:16

been really interesting because

25:21

I think as a performer who does

25:21

a lot of different stuff, and

25:24

who's done burlesque outside of

25:24

drag for quite a while, yeah. As

25:30

just myself, I guess. Well, my,

25:30

you know, Tito is myself, but

25:33

also as my like, pre Tito self.

25:33

I kind of like I made, you know,

25:40

I made up Tito going well, he

25:40

will exist for unsightly dragon,

25:45

and we'll see what happens. And,

25:45

yeah, it just kind of it kind of

25:51

all took off in a really lovely

25:51

way. And I've had a lot of just

25:56

really wonderful support. I

25:56

think, you know, it's a really,

26:00

I'm sure. You know, it's a

26:00

really close knit community,

26:04

even, especially, even in

26:04

London, where there's a lot of

26:06

us and there's more of us every

26:06

day, hopefully. You know, we got

26:12

originally a lot of support from

26:12

Atmel and Apple derrieres and

26:17

Mr. Wesley dikes, who were the

26:17

original kind of directors or we

26:21

called them dragmaturge. Yeah.

26:25

Yeah,amazing

26:27

So fancy was we put it on

26:27

our arts council application, it

26:30

went very well. making up words

26:30

in that sentence, very helpful.

26:34

And then Adam and Apple put me

26:34

into one of their toy boxes. And

26:40

then I met Romeo De la Cruz and

26:40

Jada love and lots of other

26:44

people who've just been really

26:44

good about kind of guiding,

26:49

supporting cheering on all that

26:49

kind of stuff. Also, a low brow

26:52

Lily snatch dragon and Scarlett

26:52

O'Hara, who are part of lads

26:56

have been supportive of my

26:56

independent kind of performance,

27:00

burlesque, cabaret career, pre

27:00

and throughout drag and have

27:05

been just yet like, lots of

27:05

really good people have really

27:08

done a lot to give me space. And

27:08

I'm really thankful for it.

27:12

Because part of the reason it

27:12

took me a long time to do drag

27:16

was that I found it hard to find

27:16

space.

27:20

Sure.

27:20

So you know, it was nice

27:20

that once I'd kind of like taken

27:23

the leap and just gone, I'm gonna figure it out. I'm basically built a project, so

27:25

that I could make learning how

27:28

to do drag accessible to myself.

27:28

Once that happened, you know, I

27:32

kind of and I had an idea,

27:32

people kind of let me have space

27:36

on a stage to explore that idea.

27:36

I think also like life Sander,

27:39

and Bar Wot. Not whole team.

27:39

Yeah. You know, those, those

27:44

they've been really, really

27:44

supportive of me in my stuff.

27:47

And also a Quiplash actually. So

27:47

yeah, they're another one to

27:50

kind of give a little shout out to.

27:53

yeah, we will we do we do

27:53

any kind of net any kind of name

27:56

mentioned, we link

27:59

Oh, making your job really

27:59

easy

28:01

More? I don't, I don't

28:01

have to do it. I, my partner

28:06

does it. And he has to go

28:06

through like 100 links, and he's

28:09

like, sure, fine. And then. But

28:09

then...

28:13

SORRY

28:13

no, it's fine. Because

28:13

then he'll find shows that all

28:15

the people you've mentioned in

28:15

or produce, and he'll put those

28:18

shows. He's great. Yeah.

28:23

I don't do this on my own. Like, you know, it's good to

28:27

have two of you to be able to,

28:31

to do that. That's so

28:31

heartwarming to hear as well, I

28:35

think because I do I think that

28:35

people are getting into drag a

28:41

little bit. Yeah. Yeah. I think

28:41

they're, they worry about how it

28:47

will be received. And especially

28:47

you know, if they're female

28:53

presenting they worry that it's

28:53

not something for them that

28:57

they're supposed to be a part

28:57

of, and there's just there's a

28:59

lot of stuff around it that I

28:59

think...

29:01

Yeah,

29:02

scared about so it's

29:02

really nice to hear and I think

29:05

it will be good to hear for

29:05

listeners that you were received

29:08

in such a positive way. And it

29:08

helps that you're so

29:13

entertaining. No, go Go. Go.

29:13

Yeah, I was gonna

29:18

I was just gonna add that

29:18

for a lot of like disabled and

29:20

neuro diverse people. there's a

29:20

there's a whole added element of

29:25

the way that drag works and

29:25

functions and there are certain

29:30

TV shows run by certain

29:30

prominent drag figures. They all

29:35

have these hierarchies. rhymes with

29:39

spragg brace. Anyway, um, and a

29:39

Yeah, like, you don't have to

29:45

link that one by the way, I

29:45

would prefer that you didn't and

29:47

Dont you worry.

29:49

And like so you know,

29:49

things down to makeup tutorials.

29:53

So like one of the things that I

29:53

had and still have about doing

30:00

drag was how to do makeup. So

30:00

for me, I have this kind of, and

30:04

this is not to throw shade at

30:04

anybody who wants to achieve

30:07

these types of things, but I

30:07

have the type of face where if I

30:12

get some eyeliner and just

30:12

colour in kind of my moustache,

30:15

and my eyebrows, I kind of look

30:15

like a dude. Whether or not I

30:20

mean to or not. And I realised

30:20

because I'm, I'm in the like

30:22

gender fluid part of non binary....

30:25

Sure.

30:26

So I don't want to, I

30:26

don't want to look like a dude.

30:30

And actually, this was one of the things I learned from the play that I did, they gave me a

30:32

really beautiful lace front

30:34

beard. And it was difficult

30:34

because the first sort of four

30:38

or five pages of the play, I

30:38

didn't speak and I was just on

30:41

stage, and then I'd open my

30:41

mouth. And sometimes depending

30:45

on the kind of small town we

30:45

were in at points, people would

30:49

gasp because they didn't expect

30:49

my voice to come out of my body

30:53

because I looked like a man....

30:54

right!

30:55

But I don't want to do that. This is one of the reasons why I wear a glitter beard. So

30:57

it's really clear that it's

30:59

fake. And I put I you know, I

30:59

wear I shadow I put I do lots of

31:04

quote unquote, feminine things.

31:04

But I was really scared of doing

31:08

that because I I find putting

31:08

makeup on really hard and all

31:12

the tutorials that I could find

31:12

that show you how to do this are

31:17

our visual,

31:19

yep,

31:19

like and often like time

31:19

lapsed. So like, I can't

31:22

interact with that. And I get

31:22

really frustrated with it. Yeah,

31:25

so and actually like the first

31:25

I'd say the first six months or

31:30

so that I did drag. Kallum

31:30

Kirly who I just mentioned, I

31:34

would hire them as my access

31:34

workers solely so that they

31:37

could contour my face. And I got

31:37

to the point where I could put

31:41

the eyeshadow and the glitter on. But I couldn't do the contour, I was too scared. And

31:42

then actually, just to just to

31:46

add another link for you to

31:46

throw on there. Chiyo to who's

31:50

another really prominent, who's

31:50

wonderful, who's given me a hell

31:55

of a lot of support and legs up.

31:55

And who just does a lot of

31:58

wonderful things. They did at

31:58

the beginning of lockdown, part

32:03

one, they did a makeup tutorial

32:03

where they talked in really

32:07

clear detail about how they

32:07

contour their face. And they

32:10

were you know, it's super lovely

32:10

about it as one might expect.

32:13

You know, in terms of people who

32:13

know Chiyo, like they were like,

32:15

this is how I do it. I'm not

32:15

claiming I'm an expert, but but

32:19

I think that was really helpful

32:19

to hear because I got like they

32:24

gave a technique. And then

32:24

suddenly I've like and also made

32:28

me feel like I could be brave

32:28

enough to just kind of fuck it

32:30

up a bit. If and, you know, and

32:30

like and have it maybe start off

32:35

looking a bit rough. And then

32:35

I'll get better or you know,

32:37

whatever, and that kind of

32:37

stuff. And I I needed to be in

32:42

the community to ever felt like

32:42

I needed to be in the community

32:46

to get that advice.

32:48

I see. Yeah, yeah. Okay. See, like, Yeah,

32:50

I know, I've kind of gone off on a tangent. Oh,

32:52

no, no, you tangent away.

32:52

That's fine.

32:55

the point, the point that

32:55

I'm making is that for people

32:57

who are, who have access

32:57

barriers to most spaces, to try

33:02

and get into them feels like

33:02

doubly scary. And then if you

33:06

add any other intersections of

33:06

minoritized identity, whether

33:10

that's, you know, an afab person

33:10

coming into it or person of

33:13

colour, or, you know what, like,

33:13

you know, pick your poison

33:18

somebody who's, you know, working class, somebody, like, whatever, it starts to feel

33:20

really insurmountable. And

33:24

that's what like, I was 36 when

33:24

I started doing drag and I've

33:30

been doing for a year and a half. So go ahead and do the math and figure out how old you

33:32

think I might be. It's fine.

33:34

Why would Why would you

33:34

ask me to do maths? Why? Why

33:37

would you do that? Why?

33:41

Yeah, so like, yeah,

33:41

anyway, that's, that's my kind

33:44

of TED talk on all that and also

33:44

just bigging up another

33:47

wonderful drag performer. Yeah,

33:49

Chiyo is amazing. Yeah.

33:49

Oh, I got I got caught up in

33:55

what you were saying I was so I

33:55

was so into it. That I was like,

33:57

What am I doing now? Well,

33:57

that's good. That's how I mean,

34:02

that means, you know, you can

34:02

start Drag whenever

34:06

just just do drag whenever

34:06

and do ask people for what you

34:09

need. Because and that's that's

34:09

fucking scary. And I know it's

34:15

scary. But I'm especially in

34:15

like, Alt drag Alt burlesque,

34:20

Alt cabaret spaces. They're

34:20

hungry for people who don't fit

34:24

in that kind of normative.

34:24

capital G gay Sis, white men

34:29

drag queen kind of space. And if

34:29

you are one of those people,

34:32

this is not to say that you are

34:32

bad, but it's like, the drag

34:36

world is made up for you more

34:36

than a lot of other people,

34:39

being real. And, but like, you

34:39

know, if you're in like, you

34:43

know, going to all I had to do I

34:43

it turns out, I found out you

34:47

know, to get it to start to get

34:47

into these was to go to people

34:50

like Lysander who runs bar,

34:50

whatever and go, can I have a

34:54

gig? I'm new and I'm really

34:54

scared and then you know, they

34:57

just go Yeah, we have open mic

34:57

space. for that exact reason,

35:01

which one do you want? Here are the dates that are available. And then suddenly you have to

35:03

like, you know, you've got a

35:06

fire under your ass and you actually have to make an act, which is actually a good thing.

35:08

So yeah,

35:11

we can all attest to

35:11

there's nothing like getting a

35:14

gig to make you actually do your

35:14

act.

35:18

I need that or else. So

35:18

like, I am the king of

35:22

procrastination. I Oh, my God. I

35:22

know I need a deadline.

35:26

I need a deadline. Me

35:26

too. But this is why the

35:29

pandemics been so shit. I'm

35:29

like, I've done nothing. because

35:33

nobody's given me a deadline. I

35:33

got my life together if there

35:38

was a deadline shit, yeah.

35:40

Well, the nice thing is

35:40

you can make that excuse like,

35:42

well, totally, I'd have my life

35:42

together if I'd had a deadline,

35:45

but there's a pandemic. So I

35:45

don't have a deadline. So I

35:48

don't sorry.

35:49

Did you make your mark

35:49

and snatched I think, you know,

35:53

I think they have every outfit

35:53

currently of mine, that they're

35:56

Rhinestoning. And mark messaged

35:56

me and was like, do you have a

36:01

deadline? And I was like, hey,

36:01

sure. I guess this date is fine.

36:08

Yeah, they did that for

36:08

this tie as well. And I was

36:10

like, I just want the tie. The

36:10

tie.

36:15

Get it done when you can? Yeah.

36:22

It's just great. Another

36:22

shout out for Marked and

36:25

Snatched because promo

36:27

yet really, this is to

36:27

promote my cat and market Marked

36:30

and Snatched

36:31

We've just subliminally

36:31

put it into a podcast.

36:34

Yep, not so subliminal.

36:34

subliminal. I can't say that

36:37

word.

36:39

There you go. rocked it.

36:39

That was perfect. Well, could

36:44

you did what it made me laugh a

36:44

little bit because you did it.

36:47

You put a story up Have you done

36:47

like a makeup look on yourself.

36:51

Not long ago on Instagram. And

36:51

you were like, please tell me if

36:54

this looks like shit. Because, I

36:54

cant see it and I was like, this

36:59

motherfucker has done a makeup

36:59

look that I can only wish on the

37:05

genie in Aladdin to be able to

37:05

do and this motherfucker is

37:10

like, does it look like shit?

37:10

And I responded no, no, it does

37:15

not.

37:21

In fairness. So what I

37:21

have a very, people who know

37:26

what I look like in full face.

37:26

Yeah, well know that I have a

37:29

kind of I have a system. So I

37:29

have like, I always have a

37:33

glitter like goatee. So it's

37:33

like the circle, the moustache

37:36

and the beard around the chin.

37:36

And then the sides kind of safe

37:40

because basically, I shaped the

37:40

goatee off of what my dad's

37:45

facial hair does. Because I

37:45

tried it when I read a fun fact

37:49

when I originally started to try

37:49

and do Tito, I tried to do a

37:52

full glitter beard and it just

37:52

doesn't look good on my face,

37:55

and my dad can't grow a full

37:55

beard he can grow a goatee. So

37:58

there you go, whatever. But

37:58

yeah, so I have a like a glitter

38:01

goatee and I have matching

38:01

eyebrows or various shades. And

38:05

then I'll do a kind of like

38:05

sloppy femme sort of style

38:11

makeup look on the rest. So I'll

38:11

do like masculine contouring,

38:14

but then I'll do like eye shadow

38:14

that's usually like bright pinks

38:18

and purples. And then like

38:18

bright lips of some sort. And

38:23

it's always the same. It's kind

38:23

of like the eye shadow goes in

38:25

that very like panda like as as

38:25

big around my eyeballs as

38:30

possible. And so what I was

38:30

trying to do was an autumn look

38:35

an autumn look.

38:36

That's right, that's what it was.

38:38

And I didn't know if the

38:38

colours worked. And it was this

38:41

weird thing where like, because

38:41

of the colours and the shape of

38:45

the glitter that I was using

38:45

that like panda eyeshadow didn't

38:49

really work. I also have really

38:49

deep set eyes. So trying to get

38:54

my eyelids to show lots of

38:54

different colours, within about

38:57

five minutes of blinking that

38:57

just all blends into one colour.

39:01

And I didn't know that until I

39:01

tried to do this. So it just

39:04

looked like I'd rubbed really

39:04

pretty poop all over my eyes, or

39:08

something. I didn't. It's very

39:08

unsanitary. But yeah, so like

39:13

the look in itself was fine, but

39:13

it was not an autumn look. It

39:16

was not. And I'm okay with that.

39:16

So... [laughs]

39:19

Listen, it was more of an

39:19

awesome look than I've seen on

39:22

other places, I tell you. I

39:22

thought I was gonna... I was sat

39:27

there like, this fucker looks

39:27

like an autumnal leaf.

39:31

Oh, that's very nice.

39:31

Well...

39:36

I can't because I can't I

39:36

can't do makeup for shit. I've

39:38

tried. I've been to makeup

39:38

classes. I've done drag makeup

39:43

classes where I don't understand

39:43

how any of this works. And

39:47

people are like "it's practice"

39:47

and I'm like, "Okay, I get

39:49

that". I do also think there's

39:49

some sort of brain cell that I

39:55

don't possess when it comes to

39:55

makeup. Yeah, I try to do a drag

39:59

look the other day and I'm not

39:59

sure what happened. I looked

40:02

like Uncle Fester.