0:00

On the Doll Cast, the questions asked

0:03

if movies have women and are

0:05

all their discussions just boyfriends and husbands,

0:07

or do they have individualism the

0:10

patriarchy zef in best

0:12

start changing it with the Bedel Cast.

0:16

Hi, and welcome to the Backtel Cast. My name is Caitlin Drante,

0:18

my name is Jamie Lofton, and we are your

0:20

hosts of this podcast about the portrayal of

0:23

women in movie. You're damn right, we are. Hell

0:25

yeah, I'm coming from Chuck E Cheese. You come

0:27

from Chucky Cheese. I'm

0:29

not coming from there. That's

0:31

on you. I know it's on my bad.

0:34

Um. Sorry, it's Thursday afternoon.

0:36

Where the why am I not at Chuck

0:38

e Cheese? You're right, Well,

0:41

we have a podcast we talk

0:43

about how women are represented

0:46

and treated in a film cinema

0:49

cinema. We use

0:51

the Bechtel test as just sort of a jumping

0:53

off point yard stick, a yardstick,

0:56

if you will, And our version of

0:58

the Becktel test requires that movie

1:00

has two female characters who speak to

1:02

each other. They also have names,

1:05

and the conversation has to be about something other

1:07

than a man. It's really only a two line

1:09

exchange. That's all we need here at the Bechtel

1:12

Cast. Hey, we're not We're not putting

1:14

you out now, h Wood. Not

1:16

that difficult. Oh Hollywood, I see

1:18

Okay, I was like, h Wood, who's that? I'm

1:21

sorry, I'm coming from Chucky cheese. I'm like full

1:23

of hubris and like just have

1:26

a wild energy at this time. I

1:29

ate pancakes like an

1:31

hour ago. So I'm actually very tired. Nice.

1:33

That's like a nap food. Yeah. Well,

1:36

we've really established that we have pretty

1:38

leisurely chill lives.

1:42

That's great, good for us. Yeah. Wow.

1:44

Anyways, I'm excited for to

1:46

talk about the movie we're talking about today

1:48

because it is a polarizing

1:50

film. Yes, in every

1:53

conceivable. I was reading have you seen the Rotten

1:55

Tomatoes page for this movie? No? But I

1:57

know that it got an F on Cinema score. The

2:00

I mean the reviews between like the positive

2:02

and the negative. I mean it's like both.

2:05

Some people loved this movie,

2:07

other people like it truly made them want to

2:10

walk into the sea, which is we'll

2:12

get to it. Yeah. Well that's how I felt, and I believe

2:14

that's also how our guest felt. But I will

2:16

let her for herself. And let us

2:19

introduce her. She's an actress. You've

2:21

seen her on Comedy Central's Corporate

2:24

and she's starring in a show on YouTube Red

2:26

called Youth and Consequences and

2:28

a Conna. Hi, thanks

2:31

for being here, Thanks for having me guys. So

2:33

you brought us the movie Mother Mother

2:36

exclamation point. I hated it so

2:38

much that I was like, I want to talk about

2:40

how much I fucking hate this. That's

2:43

just like my favorite kind of episode,

2:46

just like pull out the bloodied corns and then

2:48

just whack it. Yeah, so you

2:50

did you see it in the theater? I did see it in theater.

2:52

I was also nega high, so I

2:55

do. I thought I would enjoy it from

2:57

that perspective at the very least, because I heard about the polarizing

2:59

review is before going in. So it's like, you know, go in with

3:02

really low expectations and it's still

3:04

managed to shatter those low

3:06

expectations and have a whole new

3:08

bar of just terrible movie. But

3:11

yeah, it was six in the movie felt like it was

3:13

just a close up on Jennifer Lawrence. That is

3:16

that is I I think it was very deliberately shot that

3:18

way. And then like the last half hour is straight

3:20

up biblical torture porn and

3:22

it's just God of can't like. As

3:24

the movie goes on, I hate it more and more,

3:27

like there's no I

3:29

saw this movie very high as well, higher than

3:31

I was expecting to be, and

3:33

so the first time, I'm like, I don't know if

3:35

I just really hated that movie or

3:37

if I thought I could hear

3:40

everyone's skin and that was the problem

3:43

because it was that kind of high. I'm like, oh, there's

3:45

a bald man in front of me, and I can hear his scalp.

3:49

That was like drug you want? No,

3:54

it was like I think it was like a really strong because

3:56

I don't drug that much. So

3:59

when I do, how many units of drug

4:01

did you do? A couple too

4:06

many? I don't know. But the people

4:08

I was with were better

4:10

at drugs than me, and so they were like having

4:12

a great time hating the movie, and

4:14

I was like, I can hear this man scalp, and I cannot

4:17

tell anyone, least of all him,

4:19

although I want to tell him so

4:21

bad that his skull can

4:23

speak and it's

4:25

speaking and wants to get out. But

4:29

yeah, the sound, I would for what it's

4:31

worth. The sound editing in this movie

4:33

is a lot. Well

4:36

it's there, so yeah, seeing it. Seeing

4:38

it in theaters was definitely.

4:41

I mean it's like, did you feel trapped? Yes,

4:43

yes, okay, yeah, it's like it feels

4:46

like you can leave, but I don't

4:48

know. It's I mean, it's very grating and

4:51

it's okay. It felt like it

4:53

would never end to It almost felt like the movie

4:55

was like, you think it's going to end here, because

4:58

I would have been I wouldn't have been shocked at

5:00

any runtime on that movie. It could have been an

5:02

hour, fifteen or three hours, and it

5:04

just felt like forever because

5:06

no real narrative is set

5:09

up. It's just an extended metaphor. It

5:11

will get into it, but like there's no goal

5:14

that any characters trying to achieve necessarily

5:17

that we know about, so we don't know

5:19

anything that's going to happen, Like

5:21

any event that happens, we're just like, oh

5:24

wait, what, oh this is happening

5:26

now? Okay? Like and were you

5:28

a fan of Darren Aronovski going

5:30

into it? I was. I loved Black

5:32

Swan, I loved Reccoman for a dream. Um,

5:34

I was excited to hear this, especially because I'd

5:37

read some interviews with Jennifer Lawrence, and she was like, I

5:39

thought this was a masterpiece. I loved

5:41

this script. I loved his idea, and

5:44

so I went in knowing like, okay,

5:46

well, I'm a fan of his work, Like I'm I want to be

5:48

open at least to what's going to happen. But

5:50

the moment they ate the baby, I was

5:52

just like, they really

5:56

bad, really bad. And and even

5:58

Jennifer Lawrence later turns on

6:00

this movie because when during

6:02

the I don't know like at what point it started.

6:04

But I didn't realize until after I saw the

6:06

movie the first time and was less

6:08

high and able to google things. Uh,

6:11

that she and Darren Aronovski were like hot

6:14

and heavy while this movie was being

6:16

made through when it came out, and

6:19

then from and I'm sure

6:21

it's not this simple, but they broke up

6:23

shortly after the movie came out, partially because

6:26

uh, and Jennifer Lawrence sort of said this. She was just

6:28

like, yeah, he couldn't handle how much people

6:31

hated Mother, and he wouldn't shut

6:33

up about it. So I was like, actually, I have to

6:35

be going. I thought was pretty

6:37

badass, like um, calm

6:39

down, which there was an interesting parallel

6:42

of in the movie where our Barden

6:44

is like my writing and she's

6:46

like, well what about me, Except

6:50

unlike her character Jennifer Lawrence dipped

6:52

immediately, which you've got to hand at

6:54

her that pretty Yeah, I mean, you don't offer someone your

6:56

weird glass heard at the end of

6:59

a relationship become

7:01

dusted.

7:06

Every time I see that on screen, I

7:08

want to call it the heart of the ocean

7:10

references. It doesn't deserve

7:12

it, You're right, yeah, so I don't feel

7:14

right calling it that. Yeah, the only metaphor,

7:17

like I've read like some fan conspiracy

7:19

theories after seeing it, because for those

7:21

of you who haven't seen the movie, it's so heavy

7:23

handed in biblical references

7:26

and literally just the whole message of the movie

7:28

is humans are bad, We're killing Mother Earth.

7:30

Were so self centered and God is

7:32

this like self absorbed asshole? Thank

7:34

you, Mr Aronofski. I really love

7:36

your your classic original viewpoint

7:39

take. But the one that

7:41

I did like is someone said, if you look at

7:43

this movie through the lens of being with

7:45

an abusive narcissist, it

7:47

actually is good, and so like they kind

7:50

of ran through the movie of like, you know, like your love

7:52

is never enough for somebody and they absolutely

7:54

have to have the adoration of others, and

7:56

they're going to put the family second. They

7:58

don't even care how much you're family life is

8:00

completely destroyed by your art um.

8:02

And so through that, Lens I was like, Oh, that would be

8:05

a much better metaphor

8:07

movie than this, right, which

8:10

I mean, I guess I can work on that level. I don't

8:12

think that that had anything to do with the intent,

8:14

which just speaks to how fucking

8:17

clueless Darren Aronowski must

8:19

be where that he's like, hum, your partym not

8:21

so bad, pretty

8:24

smart guy, seems cool, seems kind of hot,

8:27

has a stone right, they're

8:29

god, I mean, the one good

8:31

takeaway and then you get

8:33

into the recap. But the one

8:35

takeaway for me is you do get to see

8:38

Ed Harris and Michelle Phifer essentially

8:40

raw dogging on more

8:43

than one occasion, which you never see coming,

8:45

and there's always like a little weird It's

8:47

kind of like in the Shape of Water where they're like no ay,

8:49

or they're gonna let us watch the fish funk and then

8:52

you're like, oh, I guess they're gonna gonna let us watch the fish

8:54

fun. Like there they linger on

8:57

Ed Harris and Michelle Phip for raw dogging and

9:00

so you know, not that not worth the price

9:02

of admission, but one of the more

9:04

interesting parts of them sure to

9:06

be, and shockingly one of

9:08

the least graphic yeah right

9:11

of the movie. At least, I do enjoy the representation

9:13

of like people over fifty

9:16

canoodling very sensuously.

9:18

Yeah, but it's like, yeah,

9:20

I guess representation. I did not need to

9:22

see it. I did

9:24

not need to see and maybe this

9:27

will not age well because I'm really I'm

9:29

really giving it to bald people today. But

9:32

I didn't need to see Ed Harris's

9:34

bald head in coitas I didn't

9:37

I'll say I didn't mean it. Well, it's

9:39

I mean, this is that scene is one of many that does

9:41

not serve the story. What story?

9:43

There isn't one? Okay, well tell yeah, let

9:45

me do the recap of Mother exclamation

9:48

Point, and I feel free to interrupt anytime.

9:50

The recap is the most plant Yeah.

9:53

So Mother exclamation Point is

9:55

about a woman

9:57

who's we don't know. Jennifer Lawrence is

10:00

character's name, although I am dB lists

10:02

her as mother. She is

10:05

married. She goes I am his mother.

10:08

At that one point, you're like, all the title. That's

10:11

the name of the movie. So she

10:13

is married to a character played

10:16

by Heavier Bardem, whose name

10:18

we also don't know. I am dB lists

10:20

him as him I think,

10:22

right, mother and him Yeah,

10:24

okay, him capital h

10:27

like that Powerpuff Girl's character. I

10:30

do not know what you're referring to. Oh

10:32

wait, yeah, yeah,

10:34

the gay devil. Yeah yeah, yeah,

10:37

okay, I'm a board. Yeah.

10:40

So they are married and they live in a house,

10:42

and the entire movie takes place within this house.

10:45

At first, you don't really know what's going on, and then in

10:47

the rest of the movie you don't know what's going on. But so

10:52

Caitlin, so mother, they

10:54

live in a house. Heavier is

10:56

a poet, she is

10:59

a homemakers far as we know. She's fixing

11:01

up this house because there was a fire, and

11:03

we see a glimpse of this fire in the very beginning.

11:05

And then she wakes up and she's like, better go downstairs

11:07

and put some ship on the wall. How

11:10

did they meet? Doesn't serve the metaphor, we're not

11:12

Yeah, And then there's a

11:14

visitor at the house played by Ed Harris. He's

11:16

like, hey, can I stay here? And she's like,

11:19

you're a stranger, but Heavier is like,

11:21

yeah, stay, you're it's fine.

11:24

That puts me so much. Is like, almost immediately

11:26

the second the movie starts, people start behaving

11:29

nothing like people exactly, to the point where

11:31

it's just like, well, then what are we supposed to be

11:33

like holding onto here? Because that would never happen,

11:35

right, Only a relatable factor was Jennifer Lawrence

11:38

badly wanting a baby and Javier every time

11:40

the conversation came up, pushing it off,

11:42

and so you're like, okay, like they're

11:45

kind of this is a stereotype, but I at

11:47

least understand it. Yeah. So

11:49

Ed Harris shows up, and then his wife

11:52

played by Michelle Peiffer, shows up and

11:54

turns out they're kind of metaphors

11:56

for Adam and Eve, and then they

11:59

too, uns that show up, who may or may

12:01

not be cane and able. I will say that

12:03

it took me into the first viewing, it took

12:05

me a little while to figure out exactly what the metaphor

12:08

because I did no reading on it. And

12:10

then someone in the movie theater I was in was like,

12:12

oh, the Bible, and everyone

12:14

was like oh, like

12:17

genuinely for me was helpful, Yeah, because

12:19

I didn't get it in the first well, the moment

12:22

when the brother killed the other brother, I was like,

12:24

okay, all right now. For

12:27

me, it was the rib when Ed

12:29

Harris is getting sick and

12:32

his rib is bleeding. I was like, oh, got

12:34

it, got it, but was hoping it would

12:36

take a sci fi turn and the like, no, it's

12:38

just the Bible. Yeah, I don't

12:41

know what turn I thought it was going to take. I thought it was just

12:43

like a straight up horror movie, and like the trailers

12:45

made it seem like, oh, maybe there's going to be like a visitor

12:48

they like comes and Fox shut up

12:50

and they have to like fight off this intruder.

12:52

But think it must be so hard to have made a trailer

12:54

for it too. It was all whispering

12:56

over black. Yeah,

12:59

like what else are you gonna do? Like just get

13:01

people in with the injury, because no one's going to

13:03

want to see this, right,

13:06

So the Sun's show up and one

13:08

of the murders the other one. So then like this

13:10

is kind of when all hell breaks loose and

13:13

more people start showing up and Jennifer

13:15

Lawrence is like, hey, wait, you can't be here, this

13:17

is my house. Hey,

13:21

hey, do that I can't sit there

13:24

stop. The sink isn't brave

13:26

down from there so

13:29

much. She's like, that's

13:31

like the lowest level act of you can

13:34

possibly be. It's like she's saying it

13:36

and she knows no one's going to listen to her, but

13:38

she's like, well, hey,

13:42

so things come down because she's like get

13:44

out of here. There's like a funeral sort of

13:46

thing that happens for the day, which

13:50

one is, Oh God, I'm going to say his

13:52

name around the

13:55

cute one yeah, and then the other

13:57

Gleason plays his brother, Oh really

14:00

yeah? And you know there's more than one Gleason. There's two Gleasons.

14:02

I'm learning and is

14:04

their dad the other Gleason who

14:07

is in Paddington too. Don't even

14:09

tell me there's a third Gleason. I'll pass out,

14:11

Okay anyway, Okay,

14:14

So things calm down, and she's like,

14:17

oh, I want a baby, but

14:19

you won't even fuck me, and he's like, yeah,

14:21

I will, and then they have sex

14:24

and then we'll get to that and

14:27

then suddenly she wakes up and she's like, I'm pregnant.

14:29

I just know that I am. And then this inspires

14:32

him a k god a

14:35

testament I

14:37

get started. So he get started, and it's like this

14:39

beautiful masterpiece. And then his publisher

14:42

calls and she's like, oh my god, it's great. The

14:44

twist is it's Kristin wigg for some reason,

14:48

who is like wigging out in this movie. So

14:51

then a whole new horde of people

14:54

show up and they're like, oh my god,

14:56

God, you did such a great thing.

14:58

We love you. More. Chaos

15:01

breaks loose, and Jennifer

15:03

Lawrence says, hey, hey, you

15:06

being here up and

15:08

then all comes to a head. Gives

15:11

birth in public. She gives birth, well, she's

15:13

in a room, but then her baby

15:15

immediately gets stolen and

15:17

eaten, passed around, passed, ripped

15:20

limb from limb, and eaten by

15:22

now the fans who are in robes.

15:25

Yeah, but there's also a rave happening

15:27

in the corner. A rave. There's

15:30

like execution, people have guns.

15:33

Yeah, it's like and God's like, it's

15:36

fine that they ate our baby

15:38

like they love me. It's fine. Also,

15:42

so I think most people agree

15:45

that Jennifer Lawrence's character is a

15:47

metaphor for Mother Earth, right,

15:50

so like all these people showing

15:52

up is ruining no resper

15:54

and her mother room. Yeah,

15:57

they're breaking her sink

15:59

breaks one of my favorite

16:01

lines in that movie. Excuse me, that's

16:04

not brains, like Jeffcose

16:08

most the movie trying to fix up this house and then people

16:10

come and funk it all up. So there's

16:12

the metaphor where humans are just fucking

16:14

up Mother Earth. So at the

16:17

very very end, she goes from being

16:19

all like hey to hey,

16:21

and she like basically lights

16:24

the whole house on fire. She's all

16:26

burnt up and she's all funked up and everyone's like dead.

16:28

And then God carries her and he's like,

16:31

oh no, what have I done? And she's like

16:33

I have nothing left to give, and

16:36

then he reaches into her abdomen

16:39

and pulls out Allah

16:41

the fifth element. When Bruce Willis's

16:44

character takes some stones out of

16:46

the opera singer, you guys know what I'm talking

16:48

about, right, No? No,

16:50

he takes out the heart of the ocean, the like

16:53

this weird this like crystal from

16:56

her and then I guess it resets time.

16:58

It fixes the house, and then there's

17:00

a new woman and

17:03

baby baby.

17:06

So God, this movie is so annoying.

17:09

That's the story, if you can call it that.

17:12

Yeah, yeah, And so it's

17:14

a. It's an extended metaphor, it's allegorical.

17:17

It's the laziest screenwriting I've ever

17:19

seen. Well he wrote, so yeah, like the

17:22

best left in the ever note is my review

17:24

of this movie. Like, I was reading an

17:26

interview with their in Aronowski and he said that he wrote

17:29

the I know, did he read the

17:31

draft in like a day? He said, five days? And

17:34

it shows Yeah. I feel like

17:36

every time someone is bragging

17:38

about how quickly they wrote something and then you

17:40

see it, you're just like, yeah, maybe do

17:42

a second draft, take

17:45

a little time. Yeah, Like what

17:47

was the rush to make Mother Like?

17:49

It's not an urgent piece of anything?

17:53

Five days? Wow? Wow.

17:56

So as far as the treatment

17:58

of the female character goes, I

18:01

don't even know where to start, because this movie

18:04

is such a heavy

18:06

allegory. You could say,

18:08

well, like she's personifying

18:10

mother Earth and mother Earth

18:12

is you know, just a place she

18:15

can't be that active, But

18:17

then why bother making a movie where your main

18:19

character can't be active Because

18:22

the whole movie is her reacting to stuff.

18:24

She does not play an active role, and pretty

18:26

much anything decisions are made heavier.

18:29

Bardem is always like calling the shots, inviting

18:31

people in not running anything by

18:33

her, and then she just has to keep being like,

18:36

wait a minute, Hey, you can't do

18:39

that, you can't be here. So it's

18:41

her being completely reactionary. So

18:43

even though she's the protagonist,

18:46

she has no specific goal in the story, and

18:48

she had except to, I guess, be a mother,

18:51

and that's sort of hinted at every now and then. She

18:53

wants children, and she wants to be fixing

18:55

up this house, but it's

18:58

nothing that specific and then and she's

19:00

not active in the pursuit of any goal, so

19:02

she's just reacting to all the things that are happening,

19:04

which is one of the reasons this movie might

19:06

not be very good. Yeah, so you have a

19:08

very passive protagonist until like literally

19:11

the last five minutes in the movie, right,

19:13

and at which point her goal just changes

19:15

to like either survive

19:18

and then failing that to like, you

19:20

know, wipe everybody out. It's

19:22

just, yeah, it's not fun to watch. And it's like, there's

19:24

almost every point when we were watching this movie together,

19:27

there's no real moment

19:29

with with this character that you can't counterpoint

19:32

with like, oh, but how would the metaphor

19:34

work if that didn't? But I feel

19:36

like that just speaks to the fact that then don't

19:39

tell that story. It should have been a short

19:41

film. It would have been a beautiful short film.

19:43

But also like the running time of this movie was like

19:45

what two and a half hours.

19:47

It did not need to be that fucking long. It

19:50

was very long. I mean the

19:53

closest I think that, like the gas

19:55

lighting between Javier Burdham and Jennifer

19:57

Launce, there are parts of that that are very

20:00

interesting and and like his

20:02

avoidance is interesting, and there's

20:04

i mean a number of scenes where she's

20:07

like, hey, this is wrong and he's like, what are you talking

20:09

about? No, it's not. Everything's great anyways,

20:11

make toast goodbye, and you're

20:13

just like, okay that there's some sort of

20:16

but even that is like barely paid

20:18

off and paid off on isn't even the word.

20:20

I think my favorite scene in this movie, even

20:23

though it happens as the movie is

20:25

getting exceptionally bad, but like

20:27

the scene that worked for me was

20:30

the scene where Javier Burden steals

20:32

the baby. That was like the part

20:34

of the movie where I felt like the most like

20:36

my blood pressure was extremely

20:39

high, and that

20:41

was like, I don't know, that was like the moment

20:43

for me where Jennifer Lawrence's character felt

20:46

most motivated and

20:48

most threatened and like most able

20:50

to control the situation,

20:53

and you have such anxiety of like he's

20:55

going to take the baby. He's going to take the baby

20:57

the second she falls asleep, and then she fall asleep, and

20:59

then he takes the baby, and then things get really bad.

21:02

They eat the baby, the baby,

21:05

like the yeah, the worst

21:07

thing you can do to all fucking baby, and they're

21:09

very bad, very bad. It's

21:14

one of those weird things where I don't regret watching

21:17

the movie, but I never want to

21:19

see it again. I saw it twice

21:21

now, and it was even more painful

21:23

the second time. So okay. So there's things

21:25

about it that I'm like, Okay, Like you

21:27

said, if you sort of look at it through the lens

21:30

of it being an abusive relationship,

21:32

there's maybe some things to take away from it.

21:35

I think there's also some things to take away if you

21:37

sort of examine it from He's supposed

21:39

to be God, she is Mother

21:42

Earth. But I think you also make an argument for

21:45

her being just sort of like a metaphor

21:47

for just like womanhood in general,

21:50

Like if he's the patriarchy ish

21:52

sort of thing, like her whole

21:54

world is strictly domestic. It

21:57

is, and I guess if you

21:59

look at it like that, you could argue that the movie kind

22:01

of makes a comment on how no one takes

22:03

her seriously, no one listens to her.

22:06

She's mistreated and it's

22:09

bad, and and then she retaliates

22:11

and sort of like there's like some sort of catharsis

22:14

there. I don't know. I was thinking that

22:16

too, but then reaching maybe because

22:18

then in the end she still offers

22:20

up the very last thing she has, which is weird

22:23

crystal heart, and you're like, Okay,

22:26

she never takes something for herself. I

22:29

don't know. I I was thinking that too

22:31

before I had figured out the

22:33

Bible thing when I was seeing it the first time, and

22:35

I was like listening to this man's head. Um.

22:39

But but at the beginning, I was like, okay,

22:42

there, maybe there's some sort of gender commentary

22:44

happening. But then Michelle Peiffer's character

22:46

comes in and it's just as awful,

22:48

that's true, if not worse, to Jennifer

22:51

Lawrence's character, and I was like, Okay, so

22:53

maybe that's not what is trying to be said

22:55

here, because the second woman

22:57

we see on screen is just as

23:00

dismissive and means in

23:02

a way that feels if you

23:04

don't recognize the stupid

23:06

fucking metaphor, Like

23:09

most of what Michelle Peiffer does, especially

23:12

feels crazy, unmotivated of

23:14

just like why are you being mean?

23:17

Why are you asking this woman about

23:19

her sex life, like her home

23:22

right right? Like why are you getting

23:25

drunk? Like what I drinking

23:27

a mich Hard lemonade? Though she is drinking

23:30

a mice Hard lemonade. But it's Michelle's

23:32

Hard lemonade. It's yeah, that's true.

23:34

If

23:37

we found it up, it's

23:40

weird. I I really enjoyed Michelle Peiffer's

23:43

performance in this movie because I feel like

23:45

she was possibly one of the

23:47

only actors who knew that she was

23:49

kind of in a campy movie, because

23:51

I like she gives a kind of campy performance because

23:53

she's like always like draping herself over a piza

23:56

furniture and it's like, so tell me

23:58

everything, okay,

24:00

relax, but I don't know, like

24:02

it's and also like this movie could

24:05

have been more fun if it was if it

24:07

had a more campy tone, but

24:09

there's no fun. It takes

24:11

itself extremely seriously, yes,

24:14

and it makes it for not a fun watch,

24:16

Like it is nothing entertaining

24:18

about this movie, And I think

24:20

like the whole message of the

24:22

movie is almost so immature and

24:24

juvenile, like a thought that we all have when we're

24:27

like thirteen of like oh we're

24:29

bacteria, man, we're ruining the first

24:31

Like like so it's like, what

24:34

exactly motivated you to make something

24:36

that's saying something that everybody

24:38

has already thought and like kind of dismissed,

24:41

right, And it's like, yeah, who

24:44

who is the intended audience for this? Who's

24:46

supposed to be learning? Right? And what are we what

24:48

are we even supposed to take away

24:50

apart from the very obvious like yeah, we're

24:52

fucking up the ears, but then like because it's a

24:54

metaphor for Old Testament

24:57

and then New Testament. But then also like

25:00

Odd is married to mother Earth, Like her character

25:02

doesn't really fit into that allegory

25:04

because almost is

25:07

mother Earth because that's what they're destroying,

25:10

Like you're trying he's like doing metaphor

25:12

hats on metaphor hats. Yeah, it's

25:14

like too many layers and none of it

25:16

really works out, especially because so

25:18

many of the characters in this movie behave in ways

25:21

that people do not behave. So

25:23

fine, if you want to make a movie that's an allegory

25:25

for something, For example, Paddington

25:28

One, it's an allegory for immigration and racism,

25:30

and it's done very well. But mother

25:34

exclamation point is like

25:36

all these metaphors mashed up together

25:38

in a way that like none of it makes sense, none of

25:40

it works. Yeah, it's letters

25:42

are like doing things that no one would

25:45

do ever in behaving in ways that no one would

25:47

ever behave. It's literally like UCB

25:50

one oh one ship of like

25:52

you have to map something on something

25:54

else that makes sense,

25:57

and if it doesn't make sense, find something

25:59

different to you know, fit

26:01

it into. You can't just make something

26:04

like it's just so forced. The whole

26:06

thing is so forth And I think that he tried

26:08

to possibly I'm

26:10

curious, what do you think that Jennifer

26:12

Lawrence was a metaphor for Earth, but so

26:15

was the house and they both

26:17

sort of had a weird pulsing something

26:19

where the house had a womb in the

26:22

basement. But then also you like

26:24

you would touch the walls and then there would be like a heartbeat.

26:27

They were connected somehow. I was like, it

26:30

just didn't quite make it. I think that,

26:33

but I'm like, what is the takeaway from that? She is

26:35

the house. Also, the

26:37

movie seems to be saying that religion

26:40

destroyed Mother Earth, which like, what

26:42

was Kristen Wigs supposed to represent? I

26:45

don't know what? Was she a metaphor? For

26:47

see? I so like popular religion

26:50

or something. Maybe I've never read

26:52

the Bible brag so I

26:54

did not pick up on the Bible. I can't

26:56

stop reading the Bible. I

26:59

didn't pick up on other time I saw it. I

27:01

watched the whole thing, and I was like, what the funk? I was like,

27:03

I know there's a metaphor here, I just don't know what it

27:05

is. I started reading about it, and I

27:07

was like, oh, it's a Bible thing.

27:10

And then I was like, because I was I'm

27:12

not super familiar with the various

27:15

stories of the Bible. I didn't pick up on it. They're

27:17

not great. But I also like,

27:20

but now that I know it, I was like, oh, yes, this movie does

27:22

bash you over the head with all these metaphors. But

27:25

also, I don't know, well,

27:27

that's that's something that we were talking about. Two it was

27:29

like, it really bothers me,

27:32

and this is part of why, Like some

27:35

David Lynch movies don't do it

27:37

for me at all. Of just like I don't

27:39

like when you go into a movie and it's like,

27:41

whoever made this wants me to feel

27:44

dumb as rocks for at least part of

27:46

it, and I don't like that, Like it's

27:48

not a good feeling. It's a very pretentious

27:52

movie as well, which really it was like

27:54

it felt like I was being condescended

27:56

to the whole time, Like

27:59

the same thing happen to me when I watched like I've

28:01

watched eraser Head, and I'm just like, what

28:03

am I supposed to be getting from this? What does this mean?

28:07

I just I don't like doing stupid. It's kind

28:09

of interesting how a director and

28:11

his script can just be so condescending

28:14

and dumb at the same time

28:17

you're like, wow, this is a feat. You should getting a

28:19

word for this. His mother also reads is like

28:21

a short story that someone in ninth grade was

28:23

like a little subversive would have written. Right,

28:26

it takes

28:28

but also it's a metaphor and

28:30

they eat the baby. Yeah, this

28:33

for my life. I'm just like, oh, I'm sure my brother's

28:36

film school friends are roughing

28:38

over this. They're like oh my god, he's

28:40

a genius. It's interesting because I

28:42

feel like, you know, Aroonowski is like, whatever

28:44

this male outour ever heard

28:47

of a male tour? They

28:49

exist on this exclusively. Who

28:52

chose to have a female protagonist and

28:55

chose to do nothing with

28:57

her? That really bothers me, and I feel

28:59

like sets a fall precedent of

29:02

you know, I'm sure you know. And unless

29:04

he's more woke than I

29:06

give him credit for that, Aroonowski

29:08

would look at this and be like, female protagonist,

29:11

So I'm a feminist icon. I

29:13

did it. I did it because she's there, and

29:15

I don't photograph her like she's porn and

29:18

I did it. You see her face, I did like

29:20

And that just that bugs me so much because I

29:22

feel like that just lets future

29:24

directors get away

29:27

with a being like a man can

29:29

have a female protagonist, wh stress woman direct

29:31

all the movies. And and also it's

29:33

like that that character Jennifer

29:35

lawng as the character, that person doesn't exist. That

29:38

person is never mean, none of these characters

29:40

have ever. It's just I

29:43

mean, that bugs me. And then it's just bad

29:45

writing. As

29:47

I mentioned before, she's reacting

29:49

to things that happen. But she's not driving the story forward.

29:51

Things are happening around her, and she's reacting to them, and

29:54

she's putting up She's protesting sometimes,

29:57

but almost never in a way that it actually gets

29:59

results or or anything happens because

30:01

of a choice she makes. Like she's just reacting

30:03

to the things that are happening around her. She never alters

30:06

her approach. No, that either approaches

30:08

universally, Hey stop stop

30:11

that. Which, like again,

30:13

because she's personifying Mother Earth,

30:15

you could maybe argue, well, the

30:17

Earth doesn't fight back, but actually it

30:20

doesn't, like deliberately, the Earth is

30:22

never like making a conscious choice to be like, oh,

30:24

well you did this thing to me, I'm

30:26

gonna fucking have a hurricane. But

30:30

it's just so weird to make the choice

30:32

to personify something

30:34

like that. But also like that

30:37

character, just rendering her so passive

30:39

is like, what's the point why you even tell a story? If you want

30:41

to make a movie about people and

30:43

how they've fucked up the earth Watch

30:46

Koyana Scotsy. It's a weird

30:48

experimental movie from the early eighties,

30:51

but it does a better job getting

30:53

this message across anyway. Shout

30:55

out to all my Koyana Scots heads out

30:57

there. Wow, really, flero that

30:59

man master's degree today,

31:02

Jesus Christ. I think

31:04

the problem was a he wrote it way too quickly,

31:06

and is soul was so passionate

31:09

about it and had the resources to make a

31:11

film immediately that he

31:13

probably spent no time actually

31:16

thinking about it or putting it in the drawer

31:18

and waiting on it for a couple of months. I

31:20

mean, in a a lot of the interviews, I know you haven't read

31:22

them, but he's so fucking psyched on

31:24

this. He's like, you know, because we ruined Mother

31:26

Earth with climate change, and we we do all

31:29

these and we're drilling into her and then and then

31:31

all the an overpopulation, and you're like, oh,

31:33

wow, like you this is a little

31:35

passion project for you. You think you're being

31:37

so hashtag deep. Yeah. I think

31:39

he didn't take the time that he should have to really

31:41

evaluate this movie. Yeah, I mean,

31:44

just in general, like the more famous filmmakers

31:46

and writers get, the more they

31:48

should like make sure the people around

31:51

them are being honest with them before they

31:53

start something. Because I'm sure

31:55

that you know, most famous

31:57

people have enough yes men around them to be like, yeah,

32:00

real hack biblical metaphor

32:03

love it amazing great, But

32:05

yeah, I mean, that's that sucks if you

32:07

genuinely I mean, and it sounds like he genuinely

32:10

didn't know how like juvenile and silly

32:12

it was because perhaps no one said,

32:15

um, hi, excuse me, this

32:17

is dumb. Hey, you stop

32:19

that, Darren kiss it a race, Darren

32:23

stopped writing that scrab your dad needs

32:26

another dross. Hey

32:29

that he's like, too late, I'm print again. And

32:33

then they eat the baby. Can

32:37

we talk about the scene

32:40

where so it starts with Ed

32:42

Harris and all those people have left,

32:45

and she's like, my life didn't

32:47

turn out the way I wanted it to. You

32:49

talk about wanting to have kids, but you won't even fuck

32:52

me. And then he like lunges at her

32:54

and is like grabbing her and kissing

32:57

her, and she is very vocally

33:00

physically resisting. She's saying no

33:02

nos, and she's fighting back, She's trying to push

33:04

him off, and he keeps doing it. He continues,

33:07

and then it changes from her resisting

33:09

to her being into

33:11

it suddenly, which I think

33:14

sends a very dangerous message. And

33:16

I think this is another hint that this is a movie

33:18

with a female protagonist but directed

33:20

by a man. It sends a dangerous

33:22

message. You see this all the time, all the time.

33:25

There's a really good lade Runners, the one

33:27

I always go straight to resist,

33:29

Resist, Resist, and now she loves

33:32

you. Like it happens

33:34

in like Empire Strikes back to with Han Solo

33:36

trying to come on to lay Um. Pop

33:39

Culture Detective has a really great video essay

33:41

about this, about how a lot of movies

33:43

will paint this scene of

33:46

a man kind of aggressively coming

33:48

on to a woman. She is resisting,

33:52

but then something happens all of a sudden

33:54

because he keeps trying and then suddenly

33:56

she's into it and she thinks it's hot.

33:59

And what you or not mentioning is that

34:01

every single character that

34:03

this video, I say explores

34:06

is a Harrison Fords and Fordson

34:08

Ford You're fired your own notice,

34:12

predatory icon. He

34:14

did not write those scenes, but he

34:17

accepted every sele and check.

34:19

Yeah, yeah, I feel like it was more acceptable

34:21

back in the day, Like say anything was this

34:24

huge romantic and it's like if a fucker was

34:26

outside of your house blasting music, you would

34:28

be like, leave me alone. I'm getting a restraining on

34:31

the ya. I was thinking

34:33

of that recently because I live on the first floor, so if

34:35

someone did that to me would be extra crazy because I'd just

34:37

be like making direct eye contact.

34:42

But yeah, so many movies have done this and

34:44

continue to do this, where it's basically

34:46

what starts out as a rape scene and then

34:48

it turns into this romantic thing where

34:51

all all of a sudden, she's very hot because he

34:53

just kept persisting and suddenly she's

34:55

into it. So it obasually sends a message

34:57

is like, men, if a woman is resisting at

34:59

first, just keep trying, try

35:02

a little harder, and then she'll be into it. I mean,

35:04

granted, at this point in the movie, if any man is

35:06

watching Javier bar dem and is like, wow,

35:08

it seems like a good example to be following

35:10

they're already lost. But

35:13

but the way this scene, this movie's attitude

35:15

towards sex in general is very bizarro

35:17

of like this is this movie. This movie

35:20

seems like anti sex in a lot

35:22

of ways, because anytime that

35:25

Ed Harris and Michelle Pfeiffer going at

35:27

it there like like the movie I felt

35:29

was like,

35:31

right, that's a weird thing they're doing,

35:33

right, And then there's this weirdly violent sex

35:36

scene and then them having sex

35:39

whatever God and Earth, Like

35:46

God sucks the planet such

35:49

a bad metaphor, but so and

35:51

then when they have sex, it

35:54

results in disaster because

35:56

it results in the baby and the baby getting

35:59

fucked up. Well, it's it's

36:01

a disaster because of like

36:04

God's hubris and like wanting

36:06

to be loved by his followers,

36:08

basically sacrificing the baby because

36:11

of that. And right, this

36:15

movie is stupid. It's

36:19

just like, sometimes I have a bunch

36:21

of bullet point I'm like, do we even tackle it?

36:25

My notes are also so just. I

36:28

mean the narratives

36:31

like that was straight up distracting

36:34

of like every time she because she would show up every once in

36:36

a while, he'd be like, oh yeah, wait what and

36:38

then she magically turns into like a military

36:40

person in the basement and they're all all

36:42

at war and bombs are going off, and you're

36:44

like, what the fuck this is? Yeah,

36:47

this is a bad thesis film.

36:49

It's not great. Can we talk about I

36:51

guess the relationship between Jennifer Lawrence's

36:53

character and Michelle Peiffer a little bit, because

36:56

that's relevant to hard discussion.

36:58

I mean it does you know, well,

37:00

we'll get into does anyone have names?

37:03

And therefore can it ever pass the back? Right?

37:05

Yeah? So, but there is a there's a sequence

37:07

where gen Law and Michelle

37:11

talk, and it's usually Michelle Pfiffer like

37:13

prying about her sex life or sort

37:16

of judging her for other choices she's

37:18

making, and everything she does

37:20

is wrong, it's the thing. Yeah,

37:22

yeah, She like makes all these bad hand of remarks

37:25

like yeah, no, he probably still

37:27

loves you, like yeah, your husband, I

37:29

guess maybe likes you, and

37:31

and uh, do you want some of my Michelle's hard

37:33

lemonade family recipe? And

37:36

later on when she returns after

37:38

like the random murder that happens

37:40

in the how, like oh

37:42

yeah, which leads to feminist icon

37:44

floor vagina right when

37:47

the floor of the house just has a vagina

37:50

all of a sudden, Yeah, and it's

37:52

bleeding. It's free bleeding all over the place

37:55

floor vagina, also

37:59

feminist icon ed Harris whenever he

38:01

at one point is like, Jennifer Lawrence, do you redid

38:03

this whole house? And she's like yeah, and

38:06

he's like every detail and she's like m m

38:08

and he's like, so you're not just a pretty face

38:11

feminist icon head hair just

38:14

kidding. So the relationship. Yeah, Michelle

38:16

Phifer and Jennifer Lawrence are just

38:19

like a very bizarre situation

38:21

where no strangers would

38:24

talk like that. And I means mostly

38:26

a Michelle Fiber's part where she's just like, why

38:28

do you do your laundry so fucked up? What

38:30

is this? What is this? I'm drunk bol

38:32

and you're just like whoa, Like where what

38:34

do you want? Like it's unclear

38:37

to me outside of the metaphor

38:40

what Michelle Phifer, why

38:42

she's being so antagonistic and what kind

38:45

of reaction she's hoping to get out of

38:47

Jennifer Lawrence, Like it doesn't Well, they're all just

38:50

yeah, they're all props for the metaphor. They

38:52

literally don't make sense or don't exist outside

38:54

of it. Well, like, I mean again, I have a very limited

38:57

understanding of the Bible. But it's Eve

38:59

who takes the flight of the

39:01

Apple. That's like the original sin thing,

39:03

and that's basically the fall of man. She's

39:06

temptation, she's belligerent, she

39:08

didn't listen. It's

39:10

like the whole why

39:13

why emulate that in a fucking current movie?

39:15

Like that's not how it's

39:18

just stupid.

39:21

They're one of the things about Jennifer

39:23

Lawrence's character, and it's like this

39:26

whole time, we're like like, we're really

39:28

really reaching for things here. But the

39:31

the idea of the female

39:33

protagonists trying to be polite

39:35

and like a good hostess and respectful

39:38

to all at all costs was

39:40

something that was like, Okay, there was another moment

39:43

during Kristen Wiggs press conference,

39:46

you know, when Kristin Wick just starts having a

39:48

press conference during this terrible movie, when

39:51

there's like a mom and her son and she Jennifer

39:54

Lawrence is like trying to be like, you cannot come

39:56

in. She's like, but my son's pissing, and

39:59

she's okay, fine, you can come

40:01

in, but you have to leave. And then it turns out everyone's

40:03

pissing for some reason. I was

40:05

like paining and understank. Anyways, I thought I

40:08

had a point, but it turns out I didn't. Well,

40:10

I mean, maybe it's kind of what

40:12

I was touching on earlier, where if

40:14

this maybe this character is a metaphor

40:16

for like the way women have historically

40:19

been treated, where you know, we're

40:21

conditioned to be accommodating and we have to be

40:23

helpful and and and and

40:25

delicate and all of this stuff and

40:27

and how that's not really serving anybody,

40:30

and like that's not good and that's not how it should

40:32

be. But like, I don't think that Dannia

40:34

Rondowski was necessarily thinking

40:36

that, Like I think that's all,

40:41

but it is, like it is so infuriating to see

40:44

the only things you see Jennifer Lawrence's

40:46

character doing is either cleaning stuff

40:48

up or making breakfast or

40:51

fixing up the house or just

40:53

like endless domestic chores,

40:56

doing laundry, you know, Jennifer and cleaning

40:58

up a mess. Um. We touched

41:00

on this a little earlier, but I did want to

41:02

mention like how the

41:04

female protagonist is framed in this

41:07

movie, and that like almost every

41:09

shot is either a close up of her face

41:12

or a shot from her, like an over

41:14

the shoulder or just a straight up point of view

41:16

shot from her perspective, which

41:18

I think is I guess you could call

41:21

it interesting. It's unusual. It's not

41:23

what we usually see in

41:25

most movies, especially because most movies

41:27

are not told from a woman's point

41:29

of view, like and this this one

41:32

is yeah, literally her point

41:34

of view. It's like a point of view shot from

41:36

I mean, it's kind of I guess kind of an even split of looking

41:39

at her and looking from her point of view, right, So

41:42

I mean maybe something I can take away from

41:44

this movie is Okay, that's interesting

41:47

that that choice was made, because

41:49

often if it's a male director

41:52

framing a female character, it's

41:54

usually sexualized in some way or like,

41:56

and I never find you get to

41:58

see her share night gaw in a couple of times,

42:00

you do. I mean, they do have that scene

42:03

where all the people are attacking her on the

42:05

floor and like her boob comes out and

42:07

they're like grab which like why

42:09

what what? What is that serving? Why

42:11

is that scene? And being in a room with your

42:14

boyfriend and he's like, yeah,

42:16

yeah, hit her And

42:20

I was like, ah no, no,

42:23

how did he know that scarf? He's like, hey,

42:25

Jennifer, just um lie here on the floor

42:27

and get your face beaten.

42:29

In all of these extras for my awesome,

42:32

freaking you're gonna love

42:34

it mother, I felt

42:37

like I could see the

42:39

male gaze on Jennifer Lawrence

42:41

the whole movie, because she was completely

42:44

perfect the entire time, Like

42:46

she never got more in disarray

42:48

as the movie went on until that very very ending

42:51

section. But even then, like when she was running around. Her hair

42:53

was perfectly in place, Like all the shots were

42:55

like so close and intimate and like this

42:57

gorgeous lighting, so it didn't

43:00

were like sexualized, but it felt

43:02

like Darren's way of viewing her

43:04

almost. That's a really good point. Yeah,

43:06

I hadn't thought of it that way. It's too

43:08

bad because I I don't think this movie got

43:10

nominated for every Razzie

43:13

pretty much. I think he got the most nomination.

43:17

And it's too bad because I don't think

43:19

Jennifer Lawrence does a bad job in

43:21

this movie with what she's given, which

43:23

is not a lot. If seventy

43:26

percent of the dialogue you're given is hey,

43:28

like there's only so much you can do, and and

43:30

given the fact that the camera is focused

43:33

on her for so much of the movie, I

43:35

feel like she and like Michelle Peiffer, felt

43:38

like that at least an interesting

43:40

job with what they were given. However,

43:42

your burden, I don't know. I was like not

43:45

loving him in this movie, Kristen Wig,

43:47

what are you doing here? Ed

43:50

Harris? I'm maybe

43:52

like afraid of bald men's

43:54

time, so like I don't

43:56

have a good game fan of bald women test,

43:59

but bald women are in charge

44:02

every single time they appear on screen.

44:05

Bald men, their scalps can talk,

44:08

and they have really scary secrets to tell you.

44:11

I mean, one of the huge problems is this

44:13

movie boils down to because

44:16

the director was like, we gotta have this metaphor.

44:19

It's at the expense of characterization. So

44:21

none of these characters feel like real people

44:24

and therefore it's I mean, it's kind of hard

44:26

to talk about them. So like before we

44:28

started recording, I was like, what am I even going to say

44:31

about this movie? Like how can I even talk about

44:33

the female characters because they're like, they're

44:35

not real people. They don't resemble human

44:38

behavior at all. So it's just

44:40

like, how do you even talk about the portrayal

44:42

of women when these female characters

44:45

they're just like metaphors and allegories

44:47

and personifications of the

44:49

ship. And no one's relationship makes sense.

44:52

We don't know. There's very little

44:54

evident about like why have

44:56

your Bret m and Jennifer Lawrence would love

44:58

each other in this for relationship? What

45:01

keeps their relationship together other than her constant

45:04

service. One of the more baffling

45:06

character connections was like Ed Harris showing

45:08

up in Javier Bardim just being like I

45:10

love this guy, and that

45:13

that goes through every single time. Ed Harris

45:15

is like, I've been lying, and how your bards

45:17

like you're so fucking real like

45:20

and they're they're weirdly. I

45:22

guess it is because like, because God loved those

45:25

were his creations, so he loved

45:27

he had, he loved them, and he's like, Wow, look

45:30

what a good job I did with all this stuff. And

45:32

I guess the movie is saying, oh no, God

45:34

didn't maybe do a good job because everything

45:36

got fucked up by the end Aronowski second

45:39

draft. Come on, come on, it

45:41

have been great to see the third, fourth,

45:43

fifty second draft or

45:46

I think that that would have ended in the trash if

45:48

anyone had taken a good, long, hard look

45:50

at what this movie is like, maybe

45:53

skip it. He should have sent his script to me for

45:55

notes. I would have given him great notes. Doesn't

45:57

even have any other thoughts about

46:00

the portrayal of women in

46:06

all Right, Well, how about we talk about whether or not the movie

46:09

passes the Bechdel test. I say

46:11

no. I would say no to

46:14

because the characters aren't named. Yes,

46:17

if they had names, it would

46:19

have to pass. I'm pretty sure because

46:21

of the scenes with Jennifer Lawrence

46:23

and Michelle Peiffer, but

46:27

they don't have names, no matter whether

46:29

I AMDB Page says sometimes I AMDDB

46:32

Page says, Hey, the twist is

46:34

they did have a name, but we'd never find out

46:36

what it is. We never find out in the movie. Yeah,

46:38

and we never and it's you know, I'd be more inclined

46:40

to give it a benefit of the doubt if we knew,

46:43

like, well, at least we knew a lot about the characters,

46:45

but we didn't know anything about the characters either.

46:47

So so I'm gonna

46:49

not to come to this movie's defense at all,

46:52

but I'm gonna argue that the caveat

46:54

of the characters having to have names implies

46:57

that, oh, these characters have

46:59

to be important enough that we would know their

47:01

names. So it can't just be like a random person we

47:03

see and one scene that has one line,

47:06

and if that character talks to another woman with a name,

47:09

like, I think that's what that that caveat

47:11

of the backdo test is saying.

47:13

So it's like it has to be two main characters

47:16

speaking to each other. So these are two

47:18

main characters in the movie. So the fact that they don't

47:20

have names, I think is just like whatever,

47:22

and the artistic choice and the fact

47:24

that they don't have names is an a gender decision

47:27

because no one has names, correct. But

47:30

but test is extremely flawed

47:32

and I don't write so it doesn't.

47:36

Yeah, I mean, I'm fine with saying it doesn't

47:38

because of the name caveat, because otherwise,

47:41

I mean, let's say they do have names. And then

47:43

those two characters, Yeah, they talk about Mike's

47:45

hard lemonade. They talk about like

47:48

you suck just like sorry,

47:50

and a lot of what they talk about are like domestic

47:53

chores. And again that's a lot of what you see

47:55

Jennifer Lawrence's character doing in the

47:57

movie. But they are talking about saying they do

47:59

mention man. But there are plenty of two

48:01

line exchanges between those two characters that

48:03

would pass the test if we knew their names.

48:06

I don't want to give anyone a reason to be like, yeah, maybe

48:08

I'll give this movie a chance. Yeah I'm not. I'm not gonna.

48:11

I think I won't give it a pass just because

48:13

they don't have names in this movie sucks really bad

48:15

and it yeah,

48:17

fuck it. In conclusion,

48:21

let's write the movie on our nipple scale zero

48:23

to five. Nipples where we rate the movie

48:27

based on its portrayal of women go

48:30

negative to nipples. Uh

48:35

yeah, I'm gonna have to give it a zero just

48:37

because of how inactive the

48:39

protagonist is, how

48:42

the relationship with the one other main

48:44

female character is just like bonkers

48:46

and doesn't make any sense. But

48:49

the movie isn't like pro man either.

48:51

That's the thing. It's not like, Wow, look how good a job

48:53

men are doing. Isn't even like

48:55

it's not specifically insensitive

48:58

to women in a point a way. It's just

49:00

insensitive to filmmaking

49:02

and things that are good, a

49:05

slab in the face to anything that's ever been good.

49:07

Yeah. And then even at the end

49:09

when she sort of has her like, oh,

49:12

actually I do have a little tiny

49:14

bit of agency and I'm going to blow the whole

49:16

house up, and then she dies

49:19

and then gets reborn into this

49:21

other woman, so she doesn't even get to like have

49:24

a cathartic moment that she actually gets to

49:26

like enjoy and like reap the benefits

49:28

of, because when she just dies, and

49:30

then it's the whole thing of like, oh, well, God

49:32

gets to start over because he's God. I

49:35

give this movie zero nipples, but I give

49:37

it one floor of Va China. There's

49:41

no way around it. Great.

49:44

Um, well that'll

49:46

do it for our discussion about Mother,

49:50

and I thank you so much for being here, thanks for having

49:52

Where can people follow you online?

49:55

It's just my name Anna Ancona great

49:57

a right, Twitter, Instagram, check it out. All the stuff

50:00

you can go to our website

50:02

back tocast dot com. You can follow us on Twitter and Instagram,

50:05

and all the places you can buy our merch merch

50:08

now hot

50:10

merch or where you can. You can make

50:12

those purchases on our website.

50:15

You can subscribe to our Patreon.

50:18

It's five dollars a month to get to bonus episodes.

50:20

It helps us out, helps you out.

50:23

It's a win win, you can't lose. All

50:25

right, Well, what a rousing discussion

50:28

about Mother as we did not like this

50:30

movie, all right, well

50:32

bye bye