0:01

On the Bechdel Cast.

0:02

The questions asked if movies have women

0:04

and them, are all their discussions

0:06

just boyfriends and husbands or do they have individualism?

0:10

It's the patriarchy.

0:11

Zephy and bast start changing

0:13

it with the Bechdel Cast.

0:16

Oh hey, there, teenager on

0:18

the train that I sat next.

0:19

To who me?

0:21

Do you like ballet?

0:23

Yes?

0:23

But do you still do it?

0:25

No?

0:25

And I don't want to talk about it. Oh

0:28

okay, sorry, Ballet killed my mother.

0:30

Okay.

0:31

Oh there I said it. Ballet

0:33

and my dreams killed my mother. Okay,

0:35

are you happy?

0:36

Wow?

0:37

That's a lot of trauma that you know.

0:38

It's kind of like, did you ever watch Kruella?

0:41

I must, I know, I haven't

0:44

seen it.

0:44

It's like so funny to me because

0:47

it's like the girl Boss mentality taken

0:49

to like a fourteen, So it's

0:51

like it stops being bad and it starts getting

0:53

funny. They rewrite it so that Kruella

0:56

only hates Dalmatians because they

0:58

like killed her parents.

1:00

Oh that's right, And you're like, what,

1:03

that's basically what happens in this movie.

1:05

Ballet killed her mother and so

1:07

now she can't talk about it.

1:11

I mean fair, Yeah, anyway,

1:13

Hello, and welcome to the Bechdel Cast. My

1:15

name is Caitlin.

1:16

I feel like the Sorry, my name

1:18

is Jamie. I feel like the moral of this movie is if

1:21

you dream too big, it will

1:23

kill someone.

1:24

So dream small or have

1:27

no dreams.

1:28

If you have ambitions to go to Juilliard,

1:31

someone will get into a

1:33

car accident or there will be some kind of car

1:35

catastrophe every time you

1:38

audition, because it happens twice.

1:40

This happens a lot in movies of this era. I was

1:42

thinking, there's some.

1:43

Hilary Duff movie that is rancid unfortunately

1:46

about like raise your voice I think is

1:48

called no indeed.

1:51

Yes, oh sorry, You're

1:53

welcome now.

1:54

It's like I can't Some podcasts

1:56

Dana want you to say anything until they introduce you.

1:58

So I was silently violently nodding.

2:02

There's no rules, one thing

2:05

about me. I'm gonna bust out, calmly

2:09

say oh oh,

2:12

the epitome of white girls giving us nothing.

2:15

Oh, raise your voice is a

2:18

staple.

2:20

I love the I mean, it's like

2:22

equally ridiculous that Hilary

2:24

Duff is the voice of a generation,

2:26

that Julia Styles is the

2:28

ballet prodigy of a generation.

2:31

But she I think her brother dies. Her dreams

2:33

kill her brother.

2:34

Yes, her brother. They were going

2:36

to I watched this movie recently, So

2:41

what happened was they were on their way

2:43

to a three Days Grace concert. They came back

2:45

from it. He snuck out of the house. He got

2:48

in trouble, but he snuck out of the

2:50

house. They went because he wanted to do it for

2:52

her. And then on the way back, when they're singing, headlights

2:56

and he's dead and she can't

2:58

see flashlight, she

3:01

doesn't want to audition, but her brother secretly

3:03

send in the tape for her.

3:05

Wow.

3:05

I love the specificity of

3:07

them going to a three days Grace concert.

3:10

What an embarrassing way to die?

3:12

Are you many for? Hey?

3:15

They died singing that. That's what happened.

3:17

He died singing that.

3:19

I guess I need to watch this movie.

3:20

I've never seen it.

3:23

Is it a D com?

3:24

It sounds like it's a D com?

3:26

No, No, But it's that middle

3:28

ground place where like it's a little bit for older

3:31

Ish teens. Okay, yeah, yeah.

3:33

It's for the Degrassi crowd or something. It's

3:35

like slaighty above dcom age

3:37

And she sees his ghost like comes to the

3:40

concert or whatever, I miss, I would

3:42

have appreciated a Julia Styles mom

3:44

ghost.

3:45

Yes, sitting in the theater.

3:46

Oh yes, Casper can do it.

3:48

Save the Last Hands can do it exactly.

3:52

Okay, so we've immediately gotten deroute.

3:54

Sorry, Welcome to the Bexel Cast.

3:56

Yes, this is our show where we examine

3:58

movies through an inter sectional feminist

4:01

lens, using the Bechdel test as a jumping

4:03

off point. I just want to breeze right past

4:05

that today. Look it up or

4:08

listen to a different episode, because we show's.

4:10

Been on for forty five years.

4:12

Okay, if you don't know what the tech, we barely

4:15

talk about it.

4:16

It's the jumping off point.

4:18

For a bigger discussion about

4:21

Chilia styles.

4:22

It's called marketing. Okay. And

4:24

if you guys, I'm sorry not be attacking

4:26

your audience. I know we have a.

4:27

Brand to maintain.

4:29

God no, but today's

4:31

movie is.

4:32

Not The Hill or Duff one we were just talking about. It's

4:34

Save the Last Dance, and we have

4:36

an amazing guest we're so excited about. They

4:39

are an unseerious content

4:41

creator trying to get people to

4:43

be less mean to each other. It's

4:45

Kadija, mumbo, thank you so much

4:47

for.

4:48

Being here, Thanks for having me. Oh

4:50

gosh, we're starstruck. We're

4:52

thrilled.

4:53

We're fans, which is

4:55

wild to be because I literally I'm

4:57

listening to you. You're on Behind the Bastards,

5:00

and y'all are talking about that weird CIA sex

5:02

cult thing.

5:03

Yeah yeah, Roberts accusing

5:06

me of murder right and.

5:07

Left yep yep.

5:09

So, Kadija, what is your relationship

5:12

with Save the Last Dance?

5:15

So, actually, Save the Last Dance is the

5:17

first Okay, I grew up watching it.

5:19

One.

5:20

Of course, I

5:22

always wanted to be a dancer growing

5:24

up, but my parents wouldn't afford to put me in dance

5:26

and were also like, girl dance. We did

5:28

not come all the way from West Africa for you to come

5:30

over here and dance, Like, open

5:33

those books? What are you talking about? So?

5:35

I always secretly loved

5:37

ballerinas like that was always a thing

5:39

that I like dreamt I could do. So

5:42

I loved watching any kind of dance movie. And

5:44

then on top of that, my friend and I Chelsea

5:47

Chelsea, Hey girl, I'm giving you a shout out,

5:49

Chelsea, Chelsea, Chelsea,

5:53

She's gonna be so thrilled. We

5:56

watched it for a podcast that we did,

5:58

like back in twenty two twenty

6:00

I think, and it

6:02

was the first YouTube video that I made,

6:05

not giving like life advice or anything,

6:07

but like actually talking about like a social

6:09

issue and yeah,

6:12

the dolls were like, oh, hey girl, this

6:14

is keo and I was like, hmm,

6:16

maybe I should talk about more of this stuff because

6:18

I have half a sociology degree, so I may as

6:20

well put in use.

6:22

No, I didn't know.

6:22

It was like a part of a turning point and the

6:25

kind of content you're making that's so cool.

6:26

Yeah, because I did video essays like

6:28

once a month, but I was like, I'm going

6:30

to make life advice and then I'll do video essays once

6:33

a month. And then I was like, why don't I just like kind

6:35

of mix these too. So I just like turned my camera

6:37

on one day and was like, we gotta talk about

6:39

Save the Last Dance because I have issues with this

6:41

movie.

6:42

And then we watched that video.

6:45

Because here's what happened with us. Jamie

6:47

and I had prepped this episode to release

6:50

on our Matreon as

6:52

a part of Dance Sumber because

6:55

the first movie we did was Flash Dance and

6:57

then we were prepping to do Stay

6:59

with the Last Dance, and then we were just like, this

7:02

episode would really benefit from

7:04

a guest.

7:05

Yes, and we both we realized in

7:07

Uni said, because we had both watched your

7:09

video and had like quoted

7:12

it extensively, and we're like, we should just

7:14

invite.

7:15

Them on the show. Like, what are we

7:17

doing, We're being fools.

7:19

So we put a pause, we reached out

7:21

to you, and we were like, I wonder if the reply,

7:24

and then we covered burlesque

7:26

on the matriar.

7:28

I fucking love burlest movie.

7:32

I'm working side note, I'm working

7:34

on a pole opera recital, and

7:36

so that's a big inspiration visually

7:39

aesthetically for it, because oh

7:42

yeah, perfect watched it for the first time last

7:44

year.

7:44

What a film.

7:46

It's just no hinges.

7:48

It is so Yeah, we

7:50

were really into the whole air rights plot

7:52

twist.

7:53

Yeah, it's so movie. You

7:55

know, it's a movie that feels

7:58

like a movie. It right.

8:02

That God disappeared too quickly, let's

8:05

bring it back.

8:06

Yeah.

8:06

So anyway, so you responded, and here we all

8:08

are and we're so delighted to have you. Yeah,

8:11

Jamie, what is your relationship with

8:13

Stay of the Last.

8:14

Dance similar to Kadija. I

8:16

grew up watching this movie. I feel like it

8:18

was like a real sleepover classic.

8:22

I definitely saw it several times. I

8:25

went to like community

8:27

ballet classes where we like

8:30

didn't compete, no one was particularly

8:32

good. So the dancing

8:34

in this movie was really great because

8:36

it's not very good and

8:38

we're like, we could do that, and like, tragically

8:41

we may have been able to do it, because

8:44

it's mostly just pointing, standing

8:46

up, sitting down.

8:48

She does drop into those splits though,

8:50

the middle splits. She does that. I

8:52

was like, oh right, oh wait, okay, we weren't being

8:54

kind to her because I forgot she immediately

8:57

goes into that, and then everything else was yeah.

8:59

She trained, she trained, But

9:02

yeah, I had like a pretty limited history with this, but I

9:04

hadn't seen it in a long time

9:07

before prepping for this, and

9:10

so you know, it's very much a confronting

9:12

your nostalgia demons kind of thing.

9:15

And yeah, I forgot a lot

9:17

of what happened in this movie. And

9:19

I also forgot I think

9:21

that this was my first viewing of this movie

9:24

where I realized, I

9:26

don't know what they're preparing

9:28

for. For a lot of this movie I don't know

9:30

what the dancing, why he's

9:32

training her, what qualifies him

9:34

to train her.

9:36

Because she's white and he's black

9:38

and he's trying to give her flavor.

9:40

God, that really does seem

9:42

to be the internal logic of the movie,

9:45

because I was like, wait a second, is he a

9:47

dancer?

9:48

Like do we know this?

9:49

Not?

9:50

What are they getting ready for? They're taking it

9:52

so seriously. I love

9:54

it.

9:55

Right because it's not until like past the

9:57

midway mark that she learns

9:59

about the the next string

10:01

of Juilliard auditions. So before

10:03

that, he teaches her how to sit

10:05

in a chair.

10:07

And you, guys, I'm so

10:09

sorry I need to say this. So as

10:11

black people, dancing is really

10:14

important, right, and so because

10:16

of that, if you can't sit or

10:18

stand or move your hips with some sort

10:21

of attitude, it's

10:23

kind of like a family embarrassment. Honestly,

10:25

Like two of my siblings can't dance. And

10:27

every time I'm like, I'm kidding,

10:30

I'm don't, I'm not. Black people are on a

10:32

monolith and i am not the representation

10:34

for black folks.

10:37

I just He's like,

10:40

you're not sitting in the chair, right, and

10:42

so we have to incorporate this chair sitting

10:44

as a part of your dance training.

10:46

You're like, yeah, exactly.

10:48

Even though at steps the club there is

10:51

no point that any of them are sitting. No,

10:53

no, well, I like, unless they're talking.

10:55

Yeah, but the sitting isn't a part of the dancing.

10:57

There's like four chairs for heated

10:59

conversation there.

11:03

This movie is I remember it being incredibly

11:06

successful, and it

11:08

just feels so like peak MTV

11:11

movie of this time, where

11:13

the soundtrack is pretty

11:16

fucking awesome.

11:17

The soundtrack is bumping. I was

11:19

like, Okay, hold on, you

11:23

can do it.

11:23

Put your ass into it.

11:25

Oh

11:28

you said that so reluctantly, I know.

11:30

I was like, I was like, because some of the lyrics

11:32

are you can do it, put your back into it. And

11:34

then I was like, is that the lyric or is it both of

11:36

them?

11:36

I think it goes back and forth.

11:38

Music is amazing, Music is amazing.

11:40

It could be good, things could

11:42

be true.

11:44

You're so right.

11:45

I have a theory about this movie though,

11:47

because I looked up the date it was released January

11:49

twelve, two thousand and one. Guys,

11:52

this was a pre nine eleven America. This

11:55

was and when you think about that, it explains

11:57

this movie. I don't know how, but

12:00

I'm one of those people that were always connected back

12:02

to nine to eleven.

12:03

I don't it's pre

12:05

nine eleven and it's pre Shrek, and those are the

12:07

two oo cultural markers.

12:10

It is pre Shrek. You're right, yeah,

12:12

right, the final movie before then eleven

12:15

spiritually spiritually

12:18

before it was like two months.

12:21

I also didn't remember this in my memory.

12:23

This movie happened in New York, but I think it's because anytime

12:25

I saw a city in a movie and as

12:28

a kid, as like New York City, even

12:30

if they're constantly calling at Chicago,

12:33

it's New York City, it's beautiful.

12:36

In any case, my history with this movie is

12:39

yes, oh sorry, what is Oh my god?

12:41

Sorry, just like

12:43

no, it's fine. This

12:46

movie came out when I when I was

12:48

a freshman in high school, so

12:50

I was like the target demo,

12:53

and I don't think I saw in theaters,

12:56

but I probably saw it a few

12:58

times at different like friends sleepovers,

13:02

and we were all just like wow,

13:05

cool dancing, and

13:08

we just we thought it

13:10

was cool. And I don't think i've seen it

13:13

since. So that's what

13:15

my history is. Wow, And

13:18

I can't wait to talk more about it because

13:20

this is a wild, wild movie.

13:22

It's a rich text.

13:24

It's such a rich text.

13:25

It almost definitely would have been my introduction

13:28

to Carrie Washington as

13:30

well.

13:30

Yeah, she

13:33

was still a teacher when she was doing this movie.

13:36

Really, yes, yes.

13:38

That warms my heart. She's so

13:41

good in it.

13:41

Like she did not make enough money off

13:44

this role.

13:45

Because like citation needed,

13:47

but I'm pretty sure that was the case. I remember.

13:50

I don't know when I was looking this up because I just like

13:52

to learn about like how movies are made or like what

13:54

the tea was behind the scenes. And yeah, apparently

13:56

she was still teaching while she

13:59

was doing this movie, because you know, we

14:01

know they don't pay actors, y'all.

14:03

Come on, Nope, no,

14:05

not ones that aren't famous already.

14:07

I did look it up, and it

14:09

seems to be referenced

14:12

in a number of publications.

14:14

Ay, they're pulling a quote from her

14:17

in Today dot com

14:19

and People dot com.

14:21

Whoa, Okay, I love

14:23

that, so it's true.

14:25

But yeah, she didn't earn enough money from this role

14:27

because actors and especially black

14:29

women are severely underpaid.

14:32

So which is still I mean, that's like a conversation

14:34

that's been going on recently with.

14:39

Henson.

14:39

Yeah, crying off stage.

14:42

Y'all too famous for their sah.

14:45

It's ridiculous. Yeah, So

14:47

that conversation is ongoing.

14:50

Shall we talk about the movie?

14:52

You know, I think the

14:54

time has come.

14:55

It's time. All right, Let's take a quick

14:57

break first, and then we'll come back for the res

15:00

cap and

15:13

we're back. We're back,

15:16

all right, So here's save the last dance.

15:19

We meet Sarah played

15:21

by Julia Stiles. She's a

15:24

teenager who used to dance

15:26

ballet. We get some flashbacks

15:29

where she's hanging out with

15:31

her mom. She's preparing for

15:33

an audition to Juilliard. She's begging

15:36

her mom to come to the audition. Sarah

15:38

shows up at the audition and her

15:41

mom is rushing to get there and

15:43

is killed in a car accident along

15:46

the way, right as Sarah

15:49

is auditioning but like she's falling

15:51

in it, and.

15:52

Right as Sarah is like coming

15:55

in hot but like she's blowing

15:57

it anyways, you know, like

16:01

like if she hadn't fallen, Juilliard

16:04

has an eight percent acceptance rate, right.

16:06

And also, girl, yeah, like you I

16:08

saw her leg going up with some of those I was

16:11

like, Julia, activate those glute

16:13

muscles, girl, lift

16:16

lift that leg.

16:18

Yeah, but no, it's definitely

16:20

her mom's death that

16:23

botches the I mean, honestly

16:26

though, when I was a kid, that was like the most

16:28

engaging editing sequence I'd ever

16:31

seen in my life. Oh the

16:33

juxtaposition, I mean, come

16:35

on, it was right up there with Oh my gosh,

16:37

do you remember I forget what song is playing

16:39

in the Glee episode where

16:42

the cheerleader gives birth.

16:44

I think it's going on.

16:45

Oh Bohemian Rhapsody. Yeah, God,

16:47

it's I don't know where that was

16:49

stored in my brain.

16:50

What The fact that both of you

16:53

even are referring to this

16:55

sequence.

16:57

Also really incredible too. Thousands

17:00

era editing just just shut

17:03

up.

17:03

Okay. So the audition gets all

17:05

messed up, and Sarah is devastated

17:08

by her mother's death and she

17:10

steps away from ballet. She

17:13

arrives in the South Side of

17:15

Chicago to live with her dad.

17:17

Now their relationship

17:20

is pretty awkward. He's showing

17:22

her around his apartment she gets settled

17:24

in. I was getting Charlie

17:27

and Bella Swan vibes from this

17:29

because it's a very similar scene where Charlie

17:31

Swan's like, here's your bedroom,

17:34

hope you'll like purple. Okay bye,

17:37

very beginning of the first Twilight movie

17:39

vibes.

17:40

That is well spotted. I like

17:42

that she has jazz dead. Had

17:44

to be like, this is a character I haven't

17:46

seen before. I don't think I've ever

17:49

seen jazz dead.

17:50

So jazz Dad, they

17:54

say it's.

17:54

All been done, not so ah,

17:58

jazz dead is definitely I knew.

18:01

Okay. So then Sarah goes to her first

18:04

day at her new school, and

18:06

it's worth noting that the student body

18:08

is predominantly black and she's

18:10

one of the few white students there. This

18:13

will all become relevant later. During

18:15

her English lit class, they're

18:17

talking about Capodi and she

18:20

gets into this literary debate with

18:23

a classmate named Derek played

18:25

by Sean Patrick Thomas. Sarah

18:27

also meets a student named Shanil

18:30

that's a young Kerry Washington who

18:33

kind of takes Sarah under her wing and

18:36

introduces Sarah to her friends. We

18:38

learn that Derek is Shanil's

18:40

brother. We also learned that Derek

18:43

has aspirations to go to Georgetown

18:45

and become a doctor.

18:47

He had my number from the very beginning

18:49

because he did the thing that I love when boys

18:51

do in movies, which is quote things.

18:55

He's quoting various things, and so I

18:57

was like, yeah, I have a crush on him.

18:58

He's like if a

19:00

god can read, I'm immediately like, oh.

19:02

My god, like a teenage

19:05

boy character is canonically literate. I'm

19:07

like, ooh, okay, I'm

19:09

gonna be interested in listening.

19:12

And can we just say, real quick, we're

19:15

talking about Kerry Washington. Kerry Washington before

19:17

the lip quiver, because we all know that

19:19

lip quiver. It's like the Florence Pew frown.

19:22

And then is it Sean Patrick.

19:25

It's yeah, he has three first

19:27

names, and that's not acceptable.

19:30

Sean Patrick Thomas, child

19:32

actor, Serial Killers.

19:33

So Patrick Thomas

19:36

and his nostrils, because Sean packs

19:38

of Thomas's nostrils every time I

19:40

recognize it. I was like, good for you,

19:42

man, his nostrils are doing their own performance.

19:44

But anyway, they're flaring, and

19:47

they were.

19:47

Flaring a lot. I just couldn't stop staring

19:49

at it. As a kid, I just really remember his

19:52

nostrils.

19:52

Okay, good

19:55

nostrils. Game.

19:57

It's like the Will Palter eyebrows.

19:59

It's like, just sometimes that

20:01

reminds me Jamie, did you do you remember

20:03

that Will Poulter is in the Revenant, Yes

20:06

I do. I did not remember that.

20:08

The only reason I saw the Revenant

20:10

I was like, I'm wanting the Revenant to get horny.

20:14

I have no reference. I've never seen it.

20:15

I had only seen it one other time, but I was scrubbing

20:18

through it the other day for a little special surprise

20:20

for one of our live shows coming up. But

20:23

I was like, what Will Poulter's

20:25

in this? I wonder if Jamie knows anyway.

20:27

So back to Save the Last.

20:29

Dance, a young Will Poultz. Okay,

20:32

I don't like how I said that the same age.

20:34

That's fine, okay.

20:36

So one day in gym

20:38

class, Sarah gets on the balance

20:40

beam and she starts doing ballet

20:43

type moves and Shanil

20:45

and her friends are like, wow,

20:47

you can do ballet. In that case,

20:49

you should come with us to a hip hop

20:52

club named Steps. So

20:55

after school, Sarah,

20:57

Shaneil, Derek, and their friend Snooky

21:00

ahead of their time, they're hanging out

21:02

and they're kind of planning to go to Steps,

21:04

and they arrange to get Sarah

21:06

a fake ID so that she can get into the club.

21:09

And during this scene, Sarah is,

21:11

how do I say this serving some attitude

21:15

to Sookie and Derek and they're

21:17

like, Wow, this white girl

21:20

can hang. She's definitely

21:22

this white girl is down.

21:25

Yeah, virtually stot like her

21:27

acting style is like just not selling

21:29

this really very much.

21:32

I wanted to shout out one of my favorite lines in the movie.

21:34

I think it's Nicki at the beginning of

21:37

I don't know, there's elements of this movie where you're like, for

21:39

sure this was written by multiple

21:41

people over the age of forty, because there's

21:44

the there's the scene where

21:46

I think it's like Nikki who's like she's dancing in

21:48

the hallway and they're like, what are.

21:49

You doing and she's like, I'm just doing a little

21:52

hip.

21:52

Hop, yeah, serving

21:55

other people. And

21:57

then Shaniel's like, oh, that's just a little hip

21:59

hop.

22:00

Yeah, You're like, that's a mom

22:02

wrote that.

22:04

Yeah. The original script is whenen by some random

22:06

white dude, and then this black woman came in later

22:08

apparently and like rewrote it and stuff. But I

22:10

was like, was this how they were talking

22:12

to early two thousands or is this old head stuff?

22:15

I think the damage was done when

22:17

the first job, I'm

22:19

gonna say Cheryl Edwards innocent.

22:22

Aryl Edwards protect black women,

22:25

Daryl Edwards, Anna said anyway.

22:29

So they're like, Wow, this girl's so cool, she

22:32

should definitely hang out with us. So

22:34

then Sarah meets Shanil

22:36

at her place before they head out to

22:38

Steps. And this is when Sarah learns

22:41

that Shanil has a baby who her

22:43

I believe it's her grandmother seems

22:45

to be like the primary caregiver for and

22:48

she Kneel's like, bye, baby, I'm going

22:50

out to the club. So Chanil gives

22:52

Sarah her fake ID, she makes

22:54

some adjustments to Sarah's

22:57

outfit and then they go into

22:59

Steps. People are

23:02

dancing, people are judging Sarah

23:04

for being there. There's this girl

23:07

named Nikki who's like, what's

23:09

this white girl doing here?

23:12

That scene that line.

23:15

I know you don't want to say it, so I

23:17

will say it. It's like, who

23:19

invited the white girl to the negro function?

23:22

Julia South guest mustn't been sick

23:24

because there are any negroes here. And I was like,

23:27

Julie, I'm gonna stop rolling your neck. You

23:30

are in mixed company and you got invited here.

23:32

You are a guest in this house common

23:35

town. That's like when Adele put

23:37

those Bantuo knots in and we were like, Adele,

23:40

I love you and we always want

23:42

to invite you places, but you stepped a little

23:44

too far this a little bit.

23:46

Yeah, that scene is

23:49

baffled and you're just like she

23:52

has Sarah. The character

23:54

of Sarah, just in every situation,

23:57

displays a stunning lack

23:59

of cel phon awareness, like and

24:01

is never punished for it. This

24:03

is a world where her lack of self awareness will

24:06

never result in even

24:08

a stray look.

24:11

She never learns anything from it. It's just

24:13

like, what is the point of the movie.

24:15

Then she's living the dream. She doesn't grow

24:18

orgy.

24:20

And she gets into Juliard.

24:21

Yeah, oh my gosh, she hasn't

24:23

even become a better dancer.

24:28

Despite all of Derek's efforts.

24:31

Okay, so Nicky, she's like one

24:33

of the antagonistic forces

24:36

for Sarah, and she has a romantic

24:39

history with Derek and she wants to get

24:41

back together with him. He's not into her

24:43

anymore. But because there's this

24:45

like blossoming flirtation

24:48

between Sarah and Derek,

24:51

Nicky's like, h gross.

24:52

Yeah, every word out of Nicki's mouth is

24:54

just like a one liner insult.

24:57

About Sarah being white. Yes, And

24:59

I'm like, Nikki you listen

25:02

girl, Bianka laws in love you down, high

25:04

schooler forever. Yeah,

25:06

you a little too light to be coming

25:08

after this white girl. Not saying that you're white,

25:11

but girl, it's the light skin

25:13

privileged for me. And then I also was like,

25:15

is Derek a colorist?

25:17

I mean, it's possible.

25:20

He's really me stepping back.

25:22

It seems to be favoring light skin.

25:25

Listen, Derek, I'm just curious. Although

25:27

that is Hollywood though. They like a dark skinned

25:29

black man and a mixed

25:31

biracial black woman. That's

25:34

the ideal couple form in Hollywood

25:36

for black folks.

25:37

We've seen it time and time again. Okay,

25:40

So meanwhile, Sarah is at

25:42

the club. She's just kind of watching people dance.

25:44

She's observing, and then Derek

25:47

comes over to her and asks her to

25:49

dance. So they start dancing. He's

25:51

showing her hip hop

25:54

steps.

25:55

They're just doing a little hip hop Caitlin,

25:58

all right, She's like, what is this like,

26:00

it's just a little hip hop.

26:02

Then from now he's

26:04

a little hip hop.

26:06

She's not great at it, but she's trying her best.

26:08

And then a fight breaks out that Derek gets

26:11

caught up in the middle of because there's this

26:13

guy named Malachi who Derek

26:15

is friends with, and Malachi

26:18

is involved in I think drug

26:20

dealing is I don't know if they come

26:22

out and say it specifically, but that seems

26:25

to be the implication anyway, So there's

26:27

this like fistfight. Everyone scatters,

26:29

and so they leave the club and then Derek

26:32

walks Sarah home and

26:35

as they're saying goodnight, he's like, I

26:37

could help you with your dance moves and

26:40

she's like, okay,

26:43

a montage.

26:45

Oh say what? Say what?

26:46

Say what?

26:47

Yeah, you know that, I like

26:49

it. Baby.

26:52

Meanwhile, there's standing up and sitting down.

26:55

She has to learn how to sit in a chair.

26:57

It's so important her mom died.

26:59

Came and take it easy.

27:03

So they're hanging out a lot and he is

27:05

teaching her some steps, and

27:08

like you pointed out, Jamie, they're not preparing

27:10

for anything. She's not anticipating

27:13

another Juilliard audition yet.

27:16

My guess is just like they have

27:18

a crush on each other, so they're using this as an

27:21

excuse to hang out, but.

27:23

It's the means by which they fall

27:26

into weird love with each other.

27:30

Right, So anyway, he's teaching her all this stuff

27:33

and then she does a ballet move. He's like, whoa,

27:36

you know ballet and

27:38

she's like, yeah, but it killed my

27:41

mom.

27:41

So I don't want to talk about it attitude.

27:45

I don't want to talk about it. For what

27:48

He's like, so you said, Rondijan whatever because you

27:50

don't want to talk about it, which I appreciated that lie.

27:52

I really like that, but yeah, because I was like,

27:54

oh, they he said the thing that teen

27:56

movies never say, the thing that you're thinking.

28:00

That's nice, Okay, So she's refusing to

28:02

talk about her mom. Also, Sarah

28:05

has witnessed Malachi threatening

28:07

and assaulting a girl at school,

28:11

and rather than telling

28:13

him about that or

28:15

like doing anything to help

28:18

protect this girl, she's

28:21

just like, hey, Derek, why are you friends with Malachi?

28:24

And Derek defends him, and

28:26

then they move on. They

28:28

just move right past that conversation. Generally

28:32

speaking, though, we just get a lot of scenes

28:34

of Sarah and Derek dancing

28:36

and vibing, and then Derek discovers

28:39

that he got accepted into Georgetown,

28:42

so he and Sarah go out

28:44

to celebrate. We get a scene

28:46

where they're on the l

28:49

and a white lady is giving them disgusted

28:51

looks because she doesn't like

28:53

interracial couples. So Sarah

28:55

and Derek start heavily noodling.

28:58

They're all over each other. I don't even they they've kissed

29:00

at this point, but they're just That's.

29:01

What shocked me. Yeah, on her

29:04

neck, and I was like, has his lips even been

29:06

on your mouth? No?

29:07

Yeah, I was really Yeah, because after he

29:10

gets into Georgetown, it's

29:12

game on for some reason, Like.

29:15

Listen, the prospect of full tuition

29:18

and your future being set for you. If that doesn't

29:21

aroused you in this economy, I don't know what would.

29:23

I'm like, there has to be a missing scene where they

29:26

are like because it seems like they're together

29:28

really suddenly after like this really

29:31

slow burned flirtation, and

29:33

then yeah, in the train scene, you're.

29:34

Like, oh, I guess that they're dating because they're

29:36

on a date and they're like making

29:38

out on the train.

29:39

But they haven't even kissed on the lips yet.

29:42

It's it's really weird. But

29:44

anyway, So they go to the ballet.

29:47

She's apprehensive about going in because

29:49

of all of her ballet trauma, but they

29:52

watch the performance. It

29:54

upsets her. And this is when

29:56

she tells Derek that she feels responsible

30:00

for her mother's death because she died

30:02

on the way to Sarah's Juilliard

30:04

audition. And she's crying and

30:06

Derek's like, it's not your fault. Don't give up

30:08

on your dreams. You can still go

30:10

to Juilliard and dance ballet, and

30:12

she's like, so true, Okay,

30:15

I'll do it.

30:16

I'm also just like, if I were Derek,

30:18

I'd be like, she should stop dancing.

30:20

And go to therapy for U for at least

30:22

a few months. Seriously.

30:25

Well, also like if I was the superstitious

30:27

type, which I am, I'd be like, seems like

30:29

every time this girl auditions for Juilliard,

30:32

someone she loves die and

30:35

she wants.

30:35

Me to show up to that audition.

30:37

I'm not going.

30:39

Yeah, I'm going to Georgetown.

30:42

Yeah Yeah, I'm just like they're

30:44

gonna I guess that's just a high school couple,

30:46

but I'm like, you guys are gonna break up soon.

30:48

Unfortunately, I'm I

30:50

didn't have him go to a school in

30:53

New York Yeah, to imply that

30:55

they would like stay together.

30:57

The plot did not give them a chance, because.

30:59

Georgetown is a DC is

31:01

that yeah, okay, okay,

31:04

I guess not too far, but.

31:05

Yeah, sure, all they've been through a long distance

31:07

relationship. It just seems cruel right.

31:11

Anyway, So she is like, okay,

31:13

fine, I'll dance again, and this is

31:15

when they have their first on screen kiss.

31:18

Then she takes out her ballet

31:20

shoes and puts them on for the first

31:23

time since her mom died,

31:26

and she learns that Juilliard is holding auditions

31:28

in Chicago in one month, so

31:30

she starts prepping and getting into shape,

31:33

which includes ballet classes

31:35

and it also includes Derek continuing

31:39

to teach her hip hop dance.

31:42

Then we see them at Steps again

31:44

doing some of the choreography they practiced,

31:47

and people are watching.

31:48

Yeah, I'm like, are they rehearsing to go to

31:50

Steps? Because that's so like

31:53

if true, that is like maybe they really

31:55

did find each other, because that is like the doorkiest

31:57

thing in the world.

31:59

That's so cute and weird.

32:01

I mean, I don't know if this happens

32:04

or not, but I feel like, when you go to a dance club,

32:07

you don't do choreography

32:09

that you practiced in a random classroom.

32:12

Y'all have not gone to clubs with dancers.

32:15

Let me tell you something, the girls.

32:17

The girls will bust out the

32:19

corey yo oh, the dance circle.

32:22

Yeah. I spent a lot of time in my early twenties

32:25

going to clubs with dancers that it was always a

32:27

thing. They wouldn't bust out like choreo that they learned

32:29

in class, but they definitely would bust out stuff

32:31

where you're like, did you practices? Yeah,

32:35

this is a little bit rehearse.

32:37

Did you rehearse for a party?

32:40

Okay?

32:40

Well I stand corrected.

32:41

Then I'm

32:44

just here to be the reference

32:46

for black and dance.

32:48

You know, thank you. Okay.

32:52

So everyone's like watching

32:54

their choreography and they're like,

32:57

oh my gosh, wow, look at Sarah.

32:59

Go except Nikki,

33:02

who cuts in and starts dancing with Derek.

33:05

She's putting her butt all over him, and Sarah

33:07

gets jealous and leaves the dance floor.

33:10

I love that turnive phrase, Gaale.

33:12

I know she's putting her butt all over him.

33:15

So I was like, yeah,

33:17

yeah, I mean she is am I wrong' No,

33:20

no, you're correct, not wrong.

33:21

I just didn't acpect the words in that

33:23

order.

33:24

Yeah, exactly the way they came together poetry.

33:28

She can do it.

33:29

She puts her ass into

33:31

it.

33:32

Every time you quote the lyrics, you

33:35

do it so reluctantly. Well

33:37

that time I did that on purpose. Okay,

33:39

good, okay, okay, it was a

33:42

call back. Oh we love a callback.

33:43

You're right, you're right, you're right putting her ass

33:46

onto it.

33:48

Right, we need

33:50

a remix of the song.

33:52

You can put your ass.

33:53

All over it, all over it.

33:55

That's what he said.

33:56

Yes, okay.

33:59

So Nikki is dancing with Derek now,

34:02

Sarah is off to the side, and Malachi

34:04

approaches Sarah to be like, stay

34:06

away from Derek Whitey.

34:09

He calls her, he's oil you,

34:11

milk.

34:17

That does definitely happened.

34:19

Okay, Oh my goodness.

34:21

So then Derek comes

34:24

over and he's like, babe, but what's

34:26

the matter. We were just dancing. It's

34:28

no big deal. I would never do anything to hurt

34:30

you. And she's like, t he

34:33

okay. So then they go back to her

34:35

place and she's like, my.

34:37

Jazz dad is out jazzing

34:40

all night, out

34:43

jazzing all night with Kim Katrol.

34:47

She's there scattinga.

34:55

He looked at all the he dogs, he

34:58

looked at all the I never

35:00

knew such a hell of balloon.

35:03

Like I didn't know you had it memorized.

35:05

Is that little dog Ray had to

35:07

do one for.

35:08

Listeners who were not aware we were referring

35:10

to a video where Kim Katrol

35:13

scats with her jazz husband yes

35:16

and.

35:16

His double bass his upright yes,

35:19

and.

35:20

It's maybe the most uncomfortable thing

35:22

that one could watch.

35:24

Uh.

35:24

Anyway, So he's

35:26

out jazzing away he

35:28

is while his daughter's fucking.

35:31

Yeah, because they have

35:35

sex in the living room because

35:37

that's like where her bedroom is right now. She's sleeping

35:39

on the couch. They fuck on the couch,

35:41

presumably, and we don't

35:43

talk about that enough anyway. Okay,

35:45

Then we see a couple scenes where Derek

35:48

is hanging out with Malachi and some other guys

35:50

and they're judging him for dating a white girl.

35:53

Then they're playing basketball

35:55

and there's a drive by shooting because

35:58

Malachi is in the middle of this turn for

36:00

luckily, no one is hurt, but

36:03

Malachi is gonna have to retaliate later on.

36:06

And then this is juxtaposed. This drive

36:09

by shooting basketball scene

36:12

is juxtaposed with Sarah

36:14

and Nicki also playing basketball

36:16

in gym class, but they're getting into

36:19

a scuffle Niki is

36:21

like, I don't like white girls

36:23

like you getting in my way and taking

36:26

my men. So they

36:29

get into this fight, and later

36:32

at Steps, Malachi

36:34

is trying to get Derek involved in that

36:36

like kind of retaliation scheme.

36:39

Malachi insults Sarah

36:42

because she's standing right there, and so Derek

36:44

punches him. Then there's a

36:46

scene where Sarah goes with Shanil

36:49

and her baby to a doctor's

36:51

appointment and Shaneil is like, hey,

36:54

Sarah, I think Nicki has

36:56

a point about white women being

36:58

with black men, and Sarah

37:01

doesn't get it, she doesn't want to hear it, and she

37:03

leaves. Cut to Sarah

37:06

working with Derek on her Juilliard

37:08

audition and he's like, oh,

37:11

let's go to this couple's only night

37:13

at Steps, and she's

37:15

reluctant to go, and she's not even

37:17

sure they should be together at this point because

37:19

it seems like no one wants them to be together.

37:22

They argue and ultimately break

37:24

up, so then Derek

37:26

approaches Malachi to be like, oh,

37:29

sorry, I punched you, Let's be friends again.

37:32

Malachi is like great, I need you to show up

37:34

and help me at my turf war, and

37:36

Derek is like oh yeah, I'll be there.

37:38

I'm like, Derek Georgetown,

37:41

Derek, come on, you're kidding.

37:44

Meanwhile, Sarah keeps working

37:46

on her audition, but it's

37:48

not going well her

37:51

auditions. The following day, she

37:53

has a tender moment with her dad, who

37:56

I've mostly left out of the recap, but he

37:58

is in the movie and we can bring

38:00

him up.

38:00

He's I'm sorry I did too

38:03

much jazz and not enough Dad,

38:06

and she's like, I forgive you.

38:09

Sort of yeah, that's it.

38:11

I mean, I know that it seems like her parents were

38:13

divorced for some time, but I was sort of like,

38:16

wow, he does not care that

38:18

his child's mother is very

38:21

suddenly dead.

38:22

He's like showing no. He's like, well

38:25

sucks, his life is fair.

38:26

I was giving one night stand were

38:29

nice seed, We hooked up, she had you, and

38:31

I was like, I gotta go, jazz id

38:34

you this. I can't.

38:36

He was not even pretending to care.

38:39

He was not no good for jazz Dad anyway.

38:41

So she's like, I just miss mom

38:44

so much and I need

38:46

someone who loves me to be

38:48

at my audition, and jazz

38:51

Dad is like, well, I love

38:53

you, I could come, and she's

38:55

like really, then

38:58

we see Shaniel admitting to Derek

39:01

that she had told Sarah

39:03

that she agreed with Nikki that

39:06

black men shouldn't date white women, and

39:09

Derek realizes that's probably why

39:11

Sarah was so confused about

39:14

her relationship with Derek, so he

39:17

calls the thing off with Malachi and

39:19

rushes to Sarah's audition. The audition

39:22

is once again intercut with Malachi

39:25

and his minions.

39:28

It's true, Kevin Stewart, Bob,

39:30

everyone's there.

39:32

They're all there, so we see

39:35

them shooting at the other

39:37

people who they're in this like turf war

39:39

with. But Malachi and his

39:42

minions get caught and arrested

39:44

and also their car explodes, so

39:46

it's like, again, if you're in a car while

39:49

Sarah is auditioning for Juilliard,

39:52

there's going to.

39:52

Be a kid.

39:53

I was like, truly, like people get

39:56

into auto rex while

39:58

she's trying to achieve.

40:00

Off this you're dancing hurts people

40:04

literally.

40:05

Yeah, like be honest, like it's

40:07

not worth it and you know it, you

40:09

know it.

40:10

Yeah, you're not good enough to justify

40:13

all these people's cars.

40:14

Exploding live sir is You're not Yeah,

40:16

you're not borishna cough try

40:24

not to pass out at that really

40:26

good reference. I just dropped, Oh

40:29

too late, pass

40:32

Kay's throwing up.

40:35

Okay anyway, so Malachai

40:37

has gotten arrested. Meanwhile, at

40:40

the audition, Sarah messes

40:42

up right away and she's

40:44

like, I'm not ready. But then Derek

40:47

bursts in and he runs to the

40:49

stage. He's like, you can do it. So

40:51

she starts again, and at first it seems

40:53

like traditional ballet, but then

40:56

it becomes a blend of ballet

40:58

and hip hop, and then are

41:00

like, whoa.

41:03

What is this music?

41:06

She's doing a little hip hop?

41:08

Oh my god.

41:10

Like the judges are like, what is that.

41:12

She's like they went from shrowning to smile,

41:14

like just a little hip hop.

41:18

And then the judge who hates her is like,

41:20

welcome to Juilliard.

41:22

Oh, I can't say this on the record, welcome

41:24

to Juilliard. Which Chelsea and I when

41:26

we watched this movie, we were as musicians

41:29

who've like auditioned for Juilliard

41:31

and all these other schools like that are like known

41:34

in our community but not necessarily known

41:36

outside of it because we both trained as

41:38

classical singers. We

41:40

were like, bitch, first off,

41:42

you're not getting into the school because your audition sucked.

41:45

You had somebody burst in during

41:47

your audition. The audacity of that y.

41:50

Third, the judges are never going to look

41:52

that mean to you. They want you to succeed. They're

41:54

not frowning and looking at you. They're like,

41:57

hey, okay. They're concentrated or they're

41:59

smiling because they want you to do well

42:01

because they don't want to be seeing shitty performances.

42:03

Thirdly, no judge

42:05

ever, so she, after not seeing all the other

42:07

auditions, would say, I can't say this all the record.

42:10

Welcome to julie'sard. He's not the only

42:12

one on that panel. Oh sorry,

42:15

that just drove me nuts. That

42:17

drove me un nuts.

42:18

Real, unreal.

42:21

We just covered flash dance as well, and she also

42:24

whiffs the beginning of her audition. She's like, can I start

42:26

again? But the twist was flash dances.

42:28

We don't even know if she gets in because the movie doesn't

42:30

give a shit. They just wanted to date a forty

42:32

year old man. But this

42:34

one is interesting, yeah, because it's like I never

42:37

registered the disruption. As a kid, I'm like, well,

42:39

of course it's gonna happen, But as

42:41

an adult you're like, wow, they do not

42:44

relent, Like they're like, hey, you can't be

42:46

in here, and then she's like, no, let

42:48

him in, and then he comes.

42:49

On stage on stage.

42:51

It was Wow, they really found each

42:54

other. They're weirdos.

42:56

I wrote in my notes, you need someone

42:59

to go to the audition with you. Girl, you ain't

43:01

cut out for this business because listen. Maybe

43:04

it was a salty bitterness of me of like pursue

43:06

my dreams without my parents' permission, but like

43:09

my parents didn't even know if I had auditions

43:12

for shit. I take myself there on the bus,

43:14

did it and went back home like I

43:17

don't I'm

43:19

sorry anyway, Maybe

43:22

she's too co dependent. She's too co dependent,

43:24

and it's frustrating.

43:25

Like not for nothing.

43:26

I'd be mortified if someone I liked

43:29

or like, someone who I cared about was at

43:31

an audition. I'm like, leave me

43:33

to the wolves that you'll never never.

43:35

Watch me look at me.

43:37

You don't need to perceive this, Okay,

43:40

I'll tell you about it, and tell you about

43:42

it from my delusional fantasy where they loved me, but

43:44

like.

43:45

Me, I was robbed. I can't have anyone

43:47

know that I was not, in fact robbed.

43:52

Oh goodness, Okay, so let's take a quick break

43:54

and then we'll come back to discuss.

44:08

And we're back, and

44:10

where shall we start, Kadija,

44:13

is there anything.

44:15

You would like me this

44:17

evil which is like so

44:21

many things? Okay?

44:25

Rich text. Firstly, yes, Nikki,

44:28

I didn't believe Bianka Lawson had this

44:31

much attitude, and I didn't believe her as the character.

44:34

It almost felt like she was like do I really got to

44:36

say all this, like you coming

44:38

up in here stealing our men?

44:41

And her neck I was like, give her

44:43

something for that, because her neck kept rolling

44:46

and she kept talking about like Okay,

44:48

sorry, maybe this is a sorry, there's so

44:50

many things. Maybe the early two thousand, take

44:53

your time, thank you. Maybe

44:55

the early two thousands were a different time. But

44:58

you know, A, I personally

45:01

have never been around a group of black

45:03

dudes, at least then hearing my older brother's

45:06

friends talk about white women and later that

45:08

would be that angry about you

45:11

being with a white person. Usually

45:13

they're like, you got a white girl, look at you? Oh

45:16

you think you big money? Now, Like that's the kind

45:18

of shit. Not all of them would say, but some of

45:20

them would say, so, all of them being

45:22

like, god, white women are trouble. I mean,

45:25

maybe now that's a conversation happening because Jonathan

45:27

Major's but it's also like was the

45:29

white woman to trouble or were you anyway?

45:31

You know what? You know what, it's

45:34

a complicated topic.

45:35

It's very complicated that the movie is

45:37

not equipped to discuss meaningfully

45:40

in any way.

45:41

They shouldn't have introduced it, Like I

45:43

get maybe the one scene of

45:45

the lady, the white lady in the train

45:48

looking at them could have been a way to just do

45:50

it, and like that would have been the only instance

45:52

they really brought up of it. But of course, you know, movies

45:54

have to have conflict. Instead of the conflict

45:57

being I'm working through my trauma of my

45:59

mom dying and dance

46:01

and all of that, it's I'm

46:04

kind of working through that, but mostly I

46:06

like this guy that I've become codependent with.

46:08

But he's black and I'm white, and this is

46:11

two thousand and one and we're not supposed to be

46:13

together.

46:13

Right, so it has to And I feel like it's I hope

46:16

of phrasing this curst late, but I feel

46:18

like the movie does a lot of stuff to make

46:20

Sarah seem to be the oppressed

46:23

person like they go so far

46:26

into the revert, like they're like, well, racism

46:28

affects white girls as well,

46:30

and you're like no, And

46:34

this never like really registered for me

46:36

until I was watching it at this time. But it's like you see

46:38

a lot of black characters

46:40

judging white characters, but you don't really

46:42

see the reverse very much in the

46:44

world of this movie, and so it

46:47

comes off.

46:47

Very weird, right, Yeah, because

46:50

there's a way to me, there

46:52

is a conversation there of yeah, like

46:55

the colorism of all the joke that I made about Derek

46:57

maybe being a colorist, or like, uh,

47:00

just the idea that you're in a space.

47:02

And I'm glad that Chanil pointed out when

47:04

she was talking to Derek. She was like, you know, I was really

47:06

upset with Kenny, So I was just

47:08

really annoyed, and it was saying it from a place of anger,

47:11

less about like the actual relationship and

47:13

more so just like I was mad because my baby's

47:15

daddy's out here acting wild. And I'm glad that at

47:17

the end of it he showed up and they both

47:19

said hey to each other, and it was like a hey, we're

47:21

going to try to figure this out as opposed to a you

47:23

got a aight shit baby, daddy. All

47:26

the black girls are stuck with what does

47:28

she say, you come in take it to our men after

47:30

jail.

47:32

Jail drugs and drive

47:34

bys.

47:34

Maybe yeah, jail drugs and drive bys.

47:37

I was just like, Okay, I get

47:40

it. You know, different neighborhoods, especially

47:42

because we're talking about poor black folks,

47:44

so there's a different dynamic there too. It

47:47

was just like all black people are poor

47:49

and live in this part of Chicago,

47:51

and because of that, they

47:53

don't relate. Like even when her friend is on the phone

47:56

with her and it's like, you have white guys at your school,

47:58

that's the only time you hear a white person and be kind

48:00

of and the white lady looking at them

48:02

a work person, be kind of like what And

48:05

she doesn't say it because she's secretly embarrassed

48:07

or what. I don't know, Like does she answer her when

48:09

she asked.

48:10

Her She says because she's like, I met

48:12

someone. And her friend assumes

48:14

that the only guy that she would

48:16

date would be a white guy, and she's like, oh, I didn't

48:18

know they had white guys at your school, and she's like,

48:21

they don't, but doesn't

48:23

necessarily clarify that the guy that she

48:25

met is not white.

48:27

Yeah, I mean, and again it's like you don't even

48:29

see that character, like

48:31

none of the white characters that.

48:33

Are we don't know.

48:34

The lady on the train, she's like racism

48:36

the lady, and then they banquished racism

48:40

the lady.

48:40

And then kind of like move.

48:42

Forward where it's like such as we have like patriarchy

48:45

the guy, where it's like you just have to get rid

48:47

of this one guy and you've

48:49

solved it, which is like you know,

48:52

movie logic, But like her dad doesn't seem

48:54

to have, you know, an issue with

48:57

her dating Derek, but also he doesn't

48:59

give a shit about it, so I don't know.

49:02

Or he does it, but like when he's at the door,

49:04

she's like, now it's not a good time and he leaves.

49:06

But I'm like, is it because he's black

49:09

or because he's dating her? Or I

49:11

was like, are we going to explore this? I mean, he's a jazz

49:13

musician living in the South Side of Chicago. He probably

49:16

knows black people, I should hope, But

49:18

you know, white people stole jazz

49:20

too, so yes, so I'm

49:22

like, you know, but we don't ever explore

49:24

anything besides racism the Lady

49:27

and reverse racism Nikki

49:31

right.

49:32

I mean, there might be a world

49:34

where this could conceivably happen.

49:36

But even just Sarah, who comes from

49:39

what appears to be a predominantly white suburban

49:42

or more rural community

49:45

going to the South Side of Chicago, she.

49:47

Was in Vermont, they did that all permits here,

49:49

like what's the whitest pa.

49:52

Right, being suddenly immersed

49:54

in a predominantly black community,

49:57

and for her to just be like, yeah, I'm

49:59

so cool with this. I fit

50:02

in right away because of all the attitude

50:04

I'm giving. And it's also like, Okay, that implication's

50:07

also pretty messed up.

50:08

It's like, yeah, I'm glad that,

50:10

like the black girls are having some fun,

50:12

but it's all attitude and neck

50:14

rolling. And I'm like the

50:17

one scene at the beginning when she's with

50:19

the black nerds and they're all sitting at the

50:21

table being like we are the future, I was

50:23

like, representation matter, Oh

50:29

gosh, be like, don't let me

50:31

catch you. See to get that table again, it's like see

50:34

high school, high school.

50:36

Yeah, the clicks are there, but

50:38

yeah, I mean, ultimately this movie ends

50:41

up just being about a white girl

50:43

suddenly finding herself in this black community

50:46

and being like, oh, that's

50:49

just a little hip hop. Well I'll learn that and

50:51

then I'll all basically appropriate

50:54

everything that is near me. She

50:56

starts dressing differently. She starts like

50:58

wearing her hair in twists

51:01

and braids.

51:02

And she starts wearing tims. Yes,

51:05

yes, yeah, that was the

51:07

turning point in the movie. She put on those timberlands

51:09

and.

51:09

She was like slamming, said

51:12

slammon so much.

51:12

She said slamming a lot.

51:14

I forget if this was from your video, but like,

51:17

I also watched Kenny j

51:19

D's video about Save the Last Dance

51:21

that came out recently, which was really really

51:23

funny. But like the legacy of

51:25

like movies where that this

51:27

feels like very clearly placed in

51:29

where it's like a white character like

51:32

works through some external issue

51:34

in their lives by briefly being

51:38

in a predominantly black community.

51:40

This is a story of Taylor's oldest

51:43

time hate

51:46

and paneteer and bring it

51:48

on? Mmm? Is it the second

51:50

or third one with the launge

51:52

noles in it? When she's crumping?

51:54

Oh god, I want to I want to say

51:56

the first one, so I couldn't say.

51:59

This is basically say the last Dance but

52:02

haten paniteer, and she goes to

52:04

a predominantly black school.

52:05

Bring it on all are and nothing?

52:07

Yes, bring it on all or nothing. She goes to predominantly

52:09

black school and cheers

52:12

there, and the black girls had

52:14

roll their necks and do not like her.

52:17

And then she shows that she can do it

52:19

by doing white mediocre

52:21

dancing, which I'm gonna be honest and Canada

52:24

at least I'll see at the clubs like, we'll all

52:26

be dancing having a good time. You turn around, a

52:28

white girl does like a little booty pop and a group

52:30

of black guys are like, hey, hey, I'm like girl,

52:33

girl, it's not that special, it's

52:36

we all need to calm down. So they're

52:38

emboldened by this. But I think the thing that the

52:41

major theme that I really got from this

52:43

was I do not trust Hollywood in

52:46

general, but I do not trust Hollywood to make movies

52:48

like this, because even if they had a

52:50

white guy write it and then a black woman come in

52:52

to like sort it out, it's

52:54

still Hollywood depictions

52:57

of what they expect an audience

52:59

to want and appreciate, as opposed

53:02

to depictions informed

53:04

by real people, cause, like, I'm

53:06

not against hearing black people talk with attitude

53:09

or roll their necks or whatever. Like

53:11

Pea Valley is one of my favorite shows, and

53:14

I think it does a really good job of depicting

53:17

Southern folks that I grew up around and

53:19

heard talk black and white,

53:21

but predominantly black, and like the different

53:23

race relations in there too. I

53:25

don't know, it just feels like more grounded

53:28

in reality when I watch that

53:30

show, and the difference

53:32

of when I hear a black person

53:35

writing it and a black person of a certain age

53:37

writing for it, like insecure and

53:39

rap shit and stuff like that, versus an

53:42

older white man writing this dance movie

53:44

because dance movies were popular in the early two thousands,

53:46

and then they're like, oh, we need it to look better,

53:48

so let's have this black woman. I don't know how involved

53:50

she was in it, so I don't want to discredit

53:53

her, but it's also like, yeah,

53:55

I'm just like Hollywood, I'm giving you SIDEI

53:57

And I know the actors only have but so much can

54:00

because they're like, listen, a gig is a gig. Let me just come

54:02

for here. Sadie's damn lines, get my

54:04

money and go.

54:05

But Yeah, Yeah, there's not a lot

54:07

of information I was able to find about the production

54:10

of this movie. I was really hoping for like an oral

54:12

history kind of peace on this movie,

54:14

but it doesn't seem like one exists, which is

54:16

really frustrating because this movie,

54:18

and a lot of teen movies, feels

54:21

like studio notes within an

54:23

inch of its life, to the point where it's like incoherent

54:26

at certain parts, and it seems

54:28

like whole scenes or like storylines are kind

54:30

of dropped. But I was honestly

54:33

surprised that this movie has

54:35

a black director and a black co writer because

54:38

it just seems so all over the place. And

54:40

I wish I knew because the name

54:42

of the director, he's predominantly

54:45

a TV director before

54:47

this, named Thomas Carter. Carter

54:49

who side note, I thought it was just really

54:51

funny. He's like, when I saw Julia Styles

54:54

dance in Ten Things I Hate About You, I knew

54:56

she had to be in this.

54:57

I'm like, did you that's why she.

54:59

Danced Ten Things I Hate About You?

55:01

Yeah, there's a see where she gets up on the table

55:04

at a party and starts dancing,

55:06

And again I would say, like, not particularly

55:08

well, right.

55:09

I'm just like yeah, I'm sorry.

55:11

I'm gonna say the thing that I probably shouldn't say

55:13

in mixed company. But here we go, older black man

55:15

at a certain age. Y'all, y'all be given

55:17

to little too much? What what

55:20

is this? What you saw? Julius? I'm

55:22

sorry. There are plenty of white girls out there

55:24

that could have done a lot more and not

55:26

been like I think Julius Sous played

55:28

it well. And how stiff she was, especially

55:31

like in the beginning, you notice

55:33

little things with how she puts her feet, how she stands,

55:36

you know, the ballet training, like I think she that

55:39

was directed well and I think she really did that well.

55:41

But it was still just like, even when they're

55:43

doing the dance and they're doing the steps and whatever,

55:45

I was just like, girl, Derek

55:47

dropped to the splits, flipped back

55:50

up. He was doing be boy stuff. What was she

55:52

doing?

55:54

Yeah, it's just like it does feel

55:56

like this movie is directed by

55:59

someone much older than the

56:01

age demographic, which is true.

56:03

He is almost fifty when he directed this. Not

56:05

true to be agist with the direction, But

56:07

when you're making a movie for teenagers, you should

56:09

like talk to one, you should talk to

56:11

one well because you're also talk

56:14

to with you.

56:15

Yeah, you're bringing in the

56:17

baggage of like two generations

56:20

removed from the

56:22

target demo and the actors

56:24

in the movie, and so yeah, you're

56:26

like bringing in this kind of like generational

56:29

baggage from a bygone era. And

56:32

all of this is happening in two thousand and one,

56:34

which is like, you know, over twenty years

56:37

ago now. So like it is, despite

56:39

the movie having a black director and

56:42

having a black co writer, the

56:44

sole story by credit goes to Dwayne

56:47

Adler, who is a white man.

56:50

A black woman named Cheryl Edwards has

56:52

a co screen running credit with Dwayne

56:55

Adler, but we're not quite sure

56:57

to what extent she was involved.

56:59

When they're are like, you know, co screenplay

57:02

credits, that could mean any number of

57:04

things. It could mean that they both wrote

57:07

separate drafts. It could mean that they collaborated

57:09

together on drafts. It could mean that she

57:12

was just brought in to rewrite the dialogue,

57:15

which is honestly, I feel like probably the most

57:17

likely thing, where like, yeah, his dialogue

57:20

just didn't sound authentic at all, and so

57:22

she although I'm completely speculating,

57:24

you know, don't quote me on this.

57:26

And he goes on to make this a cottage

57:28

industry, like Duayne I.

57:31

And that's the reason why I was sideways,

57:33

because he did a lot of these fuckings.

57:35

Yeah, he found something that worked

57:38

and just relentless

57:40

save the last dance the way she

57:43

moves. Don't remember that one step up, save

57:45

the last dance too, step up to the streets,

57:48

make it happen. I don't know that is step up, three D,

57:50

step up, Revolution, step up all

57:52

in He makes like a billion step

57:54

up dollars after this because

57:56

he's like, uh, yeah, I think I.

57:58

Get kids movies

58:00

and you're like, Dwayne, I'm not sure.

58:03

I'm not sure those share Dwayne.

58:04

The kids just want to dance to a little

58:07

hip.

58:08

So yeah, I mean, despite the movie

58:11

having a few black creatives in like significant

58:13

roles, significant creative roles, as

58:16

you point out in your video, Esda Kadija, like this

58:18

movie still has kind of like the stink

58:20

of written by a white

58:22

person all over it.

58:25

It's Hollywood white gaze, not

58:28

the Hollywood white gaze. Because

58:31

I always have to clarify that.

58:33

Not Andy Cohen.

58:36

Well that's a whole other

58:38

that's a whole other conversation.

58:40

Yeah, I don't have time, but

58:43

I mean just yeah, the way that this story ends

58:45

up panning out as far as like she

58:47

ends up in this predominantly black space, she

58:50

starts just basically appropriating

58:52

the culture. Anytime anyone

58:54

calls her out for any behavior, she

58:56

doesn't learn anything from it. She takes it

58:58

as an attack, and then she's just

59:00

like, well, I'm just gonna do whatever I want to do.

59:03

And then she ends up incorporating

59:05

the things that she learned from Derek

59:09

into her like ballet audition

59:11

for Juilliard. So it's like, yeah,

59:13

me, a white woman, I'm going to introduce

59:16

hip hop to Juilliard. And then the white

59:18

judgers are like the twist, it's bad,

59:21

amazing, but they love it, and they're like, welcome

59:23

to Juilliard.

59:24

Yeah.

59:24

Well, and it's and I feel like it's also implied.

59:27

And this like reminds me of a lot of the conversations

59:29

from several years ago and still now

59:31

of how like your

59:34

Charlie d'milio's on TikTok would

59:36

take and repost dances originally

59:38

done by black users and

59:40

then become super famous and

59:42

you know, make a bajillion dollars off

59:45

of that appropriation, and it's

59:47

like, we don't get the feeling that at

59:50

the end of this movie that like Sarah

59:52

is going to continue doing hip

59:54

hop and or that she's gonna even continue

59:57

like living in a predominantly black neighborhood.

59:59

It's like she's used what she needs

1:00:01

and now she's like going to it seems

1:00:04

like cast it off and move on

1:00:06

because she's gotten what she wants.

1:00:08

A thing that I.

1:00:09

Didn't talk about in my video essay that I am

1:00:11

thinking about more now is how

1:00:14

we package desirability because

1:00:17

I think someone like a Julia Styles,

1:00:19

she's pretty popular around that time as an actor,

1:00:22

and even now with like a Charlie Dmeliar

1:00:24

or whatever like TikTok. People talk about the

1:00:26

algorithm and how it does like certain facial

1:00:29

features, certain looks, even complexions,

1:00:31

like there is bias in its algorithm,

1:00:33

skin tone bias and all that stuff. We

1:00:37

I think collectively people just like good music,

1:00:39

right, and they just like something that is a vibe,

1:00:42

and a lot of hip hop or R and

1:00:44

B and all that stuff is a vibe. It's the same thing in

1:00:46

reverse, like when you're like black

1:00:49

people, why you love Paramore so much? It's like, leave me

1:00:51

alone, Hey, Williams. Slatt, don't do me like,

1:00:53

I actually went to an emo phase. So like, I

1:00:55

know a lot of like pop punk girlies. But even

1:00:59

black people that do not listen to that type of music

1:01:01

are like no, no, no. They will sing misery business

1:01:03

top to bottom and be like the shit slaps,

1:01:05

you know. And Hailey Williams is a great singer

1:01:07

and she's a lot of uh she grew up in the South,

1:01:10

she's a lot of different inspirations. Anyway, for me,

1:01:12

the thing and this is my own bias. I'm speaking for my own perspective.

1:01:14

Black people are not a monolith. I tend to view

1:01:16

it sometimes as like when

1:01:18

I've been around other black folks and stuff, if

1:01:20

you're talented, if you're good, if you're whatever, we'll

1:01:23

recognize that. That's it. Like you just have to be

1:01:25

good. Like Renee Rapp was singing Dangerously

1:01:27

in Love with Jennifer Hudson

1:01:29

on her show If So many of the comments were like,

1:01:31

Jennifer, how are you gonna let this girl eat you up like

1:01:34

that? Jennifer ooh,

1:01:36

you know, And so it's just like, if you're

1:01:39

good, the shit's good. It doesn't matter what your skin color

1:01:41

is. But I think with white audiences

1:01:43

and This is a question I've asked a lot. It's will

1:01:46

white audiences show up to things

1:01:48

where they are not the center of attention

1:01:51

or they are not centered in it? And

1:01:54

how do we do introduce this style

1:01:56

of music? Even though hip hop was very popular

1:01:59

in the nineties and two thousand that was like the biggest

1:02:01

time. And this is the question I don't really know

1:02:03

the answer to my speculation, and

1:02:05

I speculate this a lot in videos. Is that a

1:02:07

lot of us need to work on practicing our empathy

1:02:10

muscles when it comes to putting ourselves

1:02:12

in the perspective of a character who we don't

1:02:14

look like. And for a

1:02:16

lot of darker skin folks, black and

1:02:18

brown people, especially if you grow up in this part of

1:02:20

the world, you are used to seeing

1:02:22

media that does not look like you a lot,

1:02:24

but you can still empathize with the characters.

1:02:27

Like Interteller is one of my favorite movies. There

1:02:30

are a couple of black people in it, sure, but like, it's not

1:02:32

about black people or anything like that.

1:02:34

It's just a story about love, you know, so

1:02:37

like and I fucking love it. But

1:02:40

I think not enough audience

1:02:42

members like it's particularly not enough white folks

1:02:45

will watch or invest in

1:02:47

movies and TV shows where it's

1:02:49

not for them quote unquote, or they're

1:02:52

not centered in it, which is why,

1:02:54

like we'll have a whole separate black genre

1:02:56

of movies where I'm like, if I say to

1:02:58

a black person, the my family fucked my

1:03:01

husband, they know exactly I'm talking

1:03:03

about soul food. They know, you

1:03:05

know. But like you ask a white person

1:03:07

if they see so food, and a lot of times they're like, what or

1:03:09

one of my friends to see the color purple? He's white.

1:03:12

You's see the color purple way too many times. More times I've

1:03:14

seen it, and I was always like, I'm

1:03:16

sorry, Kevin, what you see

1:03:18

the color purple? Eight? What? Like?

1:03:21

And it even surprises me because

1:03:23

I'm not used to white folks not

1:03:25

centering themselves and practicing

1:03:28

that empathy muscle of consuming media

1:03:30

that isn't necessarily cater to them, that doesn't

1:03:32

have them in mind, but it's still about people

1:03:36

totally.

1:03:36

Like And this is something that I've had

1:03:38

to contend with in my own like movie

1:03:41

watching journey, where

1:03:44

that's just so much of what's available are

1:03:46

white centered stories. So they're

1:03:48

just so ubiquitous that if

1:03:50

you go to the movies or if you want to watch

1:03:53

a movie, nearly ten out of ten

1:03:55

times it's going to be a white

1:03:57

centered story, which is

1:03:59

why white people do have

1:04:01

to almost deliberately

1:04:04

seek out or like they have to kind of put

1:04:06

in a more conscious effort, and most

1:04:08

of them simply don't.

1:04:10

Yeah, it's you don't think about it. You don't

1:04:12

know what you don't know. So from a like

1:04:14

compassionate place, yeah, you don't know what you don't know, so

1:04:16

you don't know that you're missing a whole genre.

1:04:18

But also from a girl you

1:04:20

got internet in access and saying wi fi, we

1:04:23

all do. Like if you don't, if

1:04:25

you don't want to put yourself in those positions

1:04:27

to watch those movies where you might not get all the

1:04:30

references or you might not like understand

1:04:32

certain things, then you're not going

1:04:34

to. I'm someone who loves diverse stories

1:04:36

and stuff, so I'll watch a whole bunch of shit. I

1:04:39

don't know nothing about living in Ireland back

1:04:41

during the nineties, but Dairy Girls

1:04:43

is fucking hilarious, like you

1:04:46

know, but also Irish people gangang

1:04:48

you know.

1:04:48

But

1:04:52

but yeah, it does kind of challenge

1:04:54

like when you were saying, like, well, what

1:04:56

it means when you say, like a movie is for you versus

1:04:59

it's not where like a lot of white audience members,

1:05:01

we'll look at a movie and be like, well, it's not for me because

1:05:03

I don't see myself in it, so

1:05:05

it's not for me. Where it's like the true meaning

1:05:08

of that is like I don't like that genre

1:05:10

generally, or that's like not a director I let

1:05:12

but I think that, yeah, that white audience

1:05:15

members are so default, and like I've

1:05:17

done this in the past and had to like call

1:05:20

myself in and be like, yeah,

1:05:22

just because you can't see yourself

1:05:24

in it does not mean it's not for you,

1:05:27

you fucking loser.

1:05:28

Oh it started. It started

1:05:31

kind it was like calling and there was like you fucking broken

1:05:34

book too, bitch.

1:05:35

Well that self talked fucking

1:05:37

piece of shit.

1:05:40

But no, I always try to

1:05:42

tell people in my videos, like you need to be

1:05:45

intentional about consuming different

1:05:47

things because media is not

1:05:49

a place where you go to for creativity. It's

1:05:52

not thinking outside the box. It's

1:05:54

not a vision. They're packaging and selling

1:05:56

to you what they think you want. And

1:05:58

when they find somebody else that is willing

1:06:00

to do something else and be creative and other people

1:06:03

like it, they jump on that, you know, like

1:06:05

the Barbie movie. It made all the money, so now they're

1:06:07

like, Okay, we're going to jump on stuff like that too,

1:06:09

because clearly the audience wants it. But they

1:06:12

weren't going to just make that movie. People

1:06:14

had to fight them for it to be made. It had

1:06:16

to have If they were going to have a female director,

1:06:19

it had to be someone like Greta who

1:06:21

is well known, because they're not just going to take a chance,

1:06:23

you know what I mean. It's just very like the

1:06:25

audience dictates a lot of things,

1:06:28

and we don't give ourselves enough power

1:06:30

or enough agency to say if

1:06:32

I actually want to go out of my way and purposely

1:06:34

start supporting other things and investigating

1:06:37

other things, I can do that, and

1:06:39

the media and all that stuff will follow

1:06:41

if more of us are doing that. Like I

1:06:45

purposely diversify when I was on Instagram.

1:06:47

I'm taking a bit of a break right now, but when I was on there,

1:06:50

I have made a conscious effort to follow accounts

1:06:53

of people with different body shapes, different

1:06:55

abilities, all of that, because I'm like, I need

1:06:58

to put in my face and see

1:07:00

difference and be comfortable with that.

1:07:03

It's like a lack of repeated exposure. The

1:07:05

more that I expose myself to difference,

1:07:07

the different ways that human beings can come in, the

1:07:10

more I value human life, no matter

1:07:12

what it looks like. The more I'm able to see

1:07:14

any type of story that somebody

1:07:16

tells, and I see the humanity of that

1:07:18

person in myself, no matter what they

1:07:20

And I know that there are certain things I won't be able to relate

1:07:23

to specifically because of their identity,

1:07:25

and I don't want to discount that. But I also think

1:07:27

we use that as an excuse to not

1:07:29

try to put ourselves in other people's

1:07:31

shoes because it makes us uncomfortable.

1:07:33

We don't want to step on toes. And it's like, you can

1:07:35

love people for

1:07:38

the square fact that they are people and

1:07:41

not need to step on toes and all this other

1:07:43

stuff. I don't know if that makes sense, but yeah.

1:07:45

No, totally yeah.

1:07:46

And like having it be like again, just like having

1:07:48

the prerequisite be that something needs

1:07:51

to be relatable for you to be able to connect

1:07:53

with it, which is absolutely not true.

1:07:55

Bitch, stretch out your brain muscles

1:07:58

like stop this, y'all.

1:08:00

I teach in my screenwriting

1:08:02

classes. Brag, I teach screenwriting

1:08:04

classes. Go to my website Kaitlyn Johntay

1:08:06

dot com and sign up for that centering yourself.

1:08:11

I say, one of the reasons that theme

1:08:13

is so important as a writer to be like

1:08:15

cognizant of what theme you're putting forth

1:08:17

is because, like we relate to stories, not

1:08:20

because the characters have the same exact

1:08:22

experience that we do, but because those movies

1:08:24

explore universally relatable themes

1:08:26

that can be told via any

1:08:30

person, any type of person, from any

1:08:32

background. But the thing about

1:08:34

privilege is that it tends

1:08:37

to warp your brain. And

1:08:39

the more privilege you have, and the more positions

1:08:41

of privilege that you occupy, and

1:08:44

especially if you're just not an inherently empathetic

1:08:46

person, you allow that

1:08:48

to warp you and to just

1:08:51

turn an eye to anyone

1:08:54

who doesn't share that same privilege as you. So that's

1:08:56

why I think so many white people are like,

1:08:59

well, this movie is about black people, Well, how

1:09:01

could I possibly relate? This is

1:09:03

not for me. There is no world

1:09:05

in which I could relate to any

1:09:07

of these storylines or any.

1:09:09

Of these characters, Like, I can't relate with this.

1:09:11

I'm like, you haven't seen the movie. You don't know that,

1:09:13

like you.

1:09:15

It's yeah, it's very first and then Save the

1:09:17

Last Dance is an interesting case study because

1:09:19

the cast is predominantly black, but

1:09:21

because the protagonist is

1:09:23

a white person. You know,

1:09:25

you discuss this in your video as

1:09:27

well, but it just means

1:09:30

that now it's a bunch of black characters

1:09:32

propping up a white protagonist and

1:09:35

being there to support this white narrative

1:09:37

in this white girl's you know, struggle

1:09:40

of self actualization.

1:09:43

Like and that's the thing that bothers

1:09:45

me the most. It's always this like

1:09:47

privilege will give you, like you said, it warps your brain, and

1:09:49

it gives you this navel gazing thing where everything

1:09:52

is about you and everything

1:09:54

is personal, like people calling

1:09:56

out the way the world is, which she's

1:09:59

like, open up your pretty brow and look at the world,

1:10:01

like you live in a different world

1:10:03

than me. Instead of taking that as an opportunity

1:10:06

to look inwards more, it's

1:10:08

well, I want to be with this guy, and like obviously

1:10:10

these are all teenagers, so like okay,

1:10:13

but at the same time, like privileged

1:10:15

kind of infantilizes you too suretely

1:10:18

you you really don't and difficult

1:10:20

things become way too hard to deal with because

1:10:22

I'm like Darren's mama. He

1:10:25

doesn't know where she is. They don't know. Yeah,

1:10:27

shaneil is in high school and has a baby.

1:10:30

Like, yes, you lost your mom and that is very difficult.

1:10:32

I'm not going to ever discount that because losing a parent

1:10:34

is so difficult, But they

1:10:37

also lost their parent and are dealing with other stuff

1:10:39

and are poor, like you know what I mean, I'm just like

1:10:42

girl like. But it's an expectation.

1:10:44

It's who, what bodies, what types of

1:10:46

bodies and people do we expect to be in those positions

1:10:49

versus the ones that we don't. And I think

1:10:51

this also works with like Western audiences.

1:10:54

If you live in America and Canada and you're

1:10:57

a type person that doesn't like to watch international movies

1:10:59

because you can can't relate, you could relate to

1:11:01

many international quote unquote international

1:11:04

films. It's international because you don't live in that part

1:11:06

of the world. But anyway, like I

1:11:08

think about that with the movie qtis because I always will

1:11:10

defend this movie and people will always look at me sideways

1:11:12

like talk about, oh

1:11:15

ah, please have me back for qties. I got

1:11:17

so much to say because I am gmbian

1:11:20

and the stories about a Senegalese girl Gmbhia's

1:11:22

inside of Senegal. It's a lot of similar cultures. Like I could

1:11:24

watch the movie without subtitles because I could understand

1:11:27

the language they were speaking when it wasn't French. But

1:11:29

yeah, she did a lot of work to

1:11:31

try and talk to actual girls that age,

1:11:34

interviewed a bunch of them, had a psychologist on set,

1:11:36

all this other stuff, And people in France

1:11:38

and in Senegal were like, yeah, this is a good movie,

1:11:40

like it's pretty, you know whatever. But people here

1:11:43

were like, how dare you look at what you've done

1:11:45

to the children and blah blah blah blah, freaking

1:11:47

out about this stuff and trying

1:11:49

to guise it under Well, I'm never gonna watch that

1:11:51

movie because it's just groom or behavior and blah blah

1:11:53

blah. And I'm like, y'all have adults

1:11:56

playing teenagers in TV shows

1:11:59

having sex with teacher, and you

1:12:01

use it to justify that it's okay because they're

1:12:03

adults and you don't see the problem with that, But

1:12:06

you see an issue with this. You'll use any

1:12:09

excuse to not consider other

1:12:11

perspectives when it challenges the way

1:12:13

you see the world.

1:12:15

Oh, please come back and talk about cuties.

1:12:17

Oh my gosh,

1:12:19

I yeah, I want

1:12:21

to rewatch it to.

1:12:22

The problem around that movie.

1:12:24

Lord, yeah I remember with

1:12:27

Sarah.

1:12:27

Yeah, I feel like she does have a

1:12:30

problem and like she has something to work

1:12:32

through to the extent that she's like lost her mom

1:12:34

and she's.

1:12:34

Lost a parent.

1:12:35

But like you're saying, like her

1:12:38

problem or that what she's working

1:12:40

through is just more

1:12:42

important. It's just more important

1:12:45

and the world has to bend to ushering

1:12:48

her through that problem, where

1:12:51

like Sarah is present, but

1:12:53

she doesn't take initiative to

1:12:56

help any of her friends through their problems,

1:12:58

and the movie doesn't have that ex to her.

1:13:01

Like the movie keeps being like she's the most

1:13:03

amazing girl to ever live, and you're just like

1:13:06

she's going through something, but she's like certainly.

1:13:08

Not, you know, like she's really really

1:13:10

hot.

1:13:10

And I feel like we see a lot of people in the

1:13:12

movie apologizing to her uselessly.

1:13:16

Even at the end when Shaneil apologized

1:13:18

her, like we're still cool. I'm like, Okay, maybe

1:13:20

Shanil didn't shouldn't have been that, Like you get

1:13:22

into tip with your friends, she shouldn't have especially agree

1:13:25

with Nikki is like that's the animy bitch you agree,

1:13:27

will buy op. But even

1:13:29

the way Sarah's like yeah, we're

1:13:31

cool, but still has an attitude

1:13:33

I'm like, bitch.

1:13:35

You owe her an apology as well, Like it's

1:13:37

just like it's really yeah,

1:13:39

like the world bends to solve

1:13:42

Sarah's problem and solve Sarah's life

1:13:45

while like playing into a lot of stereotypes

1:13:48

that just like the whole thing is really undercooked.

1:13:51

It feels like, yes, that's a good word.

1:13:53

And again it's a white protagonist

1:13:56

but a predominantly black cast otherwise,

1:13:58

but I think like this movie

1:14:01

was so popular and

1:14:04

like popular among my age

1:14:06

bracket, and I don't know if young people are still

1:14:08

here. We probably not, but

1:14:10

I feel like they're like, Okay, how do we make this

1:14:13

movie that has a predominantly black cast

1:14:15

palatable to a mainstream

1:14:18

white audience exactly? And

1:14:20

it feels like the movie just caters

1:14:22

to that constantly, because again, like Sarah

1:14:26

is very rarely challenged.

1:14:28

Anytime someone does challenge her, she

1:14:31

just like gets up and walks away and

1:14:33

doesn't do any introspection or

1:14:35

like again, she doesn't learn or grow

1:14:38

except when it comes to learning

1:14:41

hip hop and then she.

1:14:42

Just which arguably she does

1:14:45

what.

1:14:45

She doesn't do very well either, but like

1:14:48

the story is told in such a way where it's like, Okay,

1:14:51

this is palatable for

1:14:53

white audiences because we're

1:14:55

just watching her kind

1:14:58

of just do whatever she wants,

1:15:00

appropriate whatever she wants,

1:15:03

not learning lessons along

1:15:05

the way, even though they're like friend

1:15:07

of the show. Jordaane Cyles

1:15:09

has a piece called White

1:15:11

Girls, Better Black Women and Save the Last

1:15:13

Dance where she talks about how Shaneil

1:15:17

was like done so dirty and

1:15:19

has like good points and

1:15:21

is actually challenging Sarah

1:15:23

and saying like, look around you. You're taught

1:15:26

that there's only one world, but like black

1:15:28

people know differently. And rather

1:15:31

than like Sarah

1:15:33

being like, hmm, maybe there's something

1:15:35

to this, maybe I should, you know,

1:15:37

look at this from a different point of view, she just

1:15:40

like gets up and leaves the

1:15:42

crowded like medical facility

1:15:44

that they're in, and she's just like, well, this is making me uncomfortable,

1:15:47

so I have to leave.

1:15:48

It's like you came with me to disappointment. I'm

1:15:50

asking you for help. Also, girl open

1:15:52

and putting red eyes you over here, sitting here, word about

1:15:54

you, Jewel audition. I got a baby that I did get

1:15:56

care of. Yes, Dad is trying

1:15:58

my patience every two mins.

1:16:00

It m h.

1:16:01

It's like people will often depict black

1:16:03

women as bitter but not

1:16:06

go into why they might be

1:16:08

bitter for sure, Why am

1:16:10

I upset? Why am I angry? Because

1:16:12

I don't think being bitter or angry is a bad

1:16:14

emotion to have. I'm like, lean

1:16:16

into the anger, lean into your villain era,

1:16:19

like, feel your feelings. But why

1:16:21

is it that me feeling those feelings makes

1:16:23

you so uncomfortable to the point

1:16:26

where you have to walk away, or you step away or I

1:16:28

have to come and apologize to you. No, bitch,

1:16:30

I'm feeling something, I'm upset about it. You're

1:16:32

lucky I'm telling you and talking to you

1:16:35

about it instead of either ignoring you. But

1:16:37

she refuses to engage. And that's the thing with a lot

1:16:39

of like, Yeah, I always test

1:16:42

white folks that a, I are you to

1:16:44

my life with how I can engage with them

1:16:46

on topics about race, because I'm like, I'm

1:16:48

not going to act like races in a thing like

1:16:50

obviously I want to see people's people. I'm

1:16:52

a human ask you know, But

1:16:56

I'm also live in the real world and

1:16:58

try to think practically. And so if

1:17:00

anytime I'm talking to you about racial issues

1:17:02

or things happening to people in different parts of the world,

1:17:04

and your immediate response

1:17:07

is to disengage, to like, I can't. You're

1:17:10

showing me that you can't deal with hard things or

1:17:12

you don't want to. You choose to not deal with hard

1:17:14

things, which you're allowed to when you have a certain amount

1:17:16

of privilege, when you live even in a certain

1:17:18

part of the world, when you have a certain amount

1:17:21

of income. So then

1:17:23

I just know that you're not for me. And I could not be friends

1:17:25

with Sarah because I'd be like, girl, Uh

1:17:28

yeah, Nikki was annoying for what she said, but she

1:17:30

has a bit of a point. She's like, sorry, she does

1:17:33

she does a bro clock is right twice a day.

1:17:36

And Sarah refuses to even consider

1:17:39

that there's any truth to what NICKI

1:17:42

saying, to what Daniels saying, and just I

1:17:44

don't know. It has this like superhuman ability

1:17:46

to make the takeaway from every scene

1:17:48

be about her.

1:17:49

You know what it is? Oh my god, Okay, I had I

1:17:52

have a few biracial friends, and

1:17:54

one of them one of my best friends. She says

1:17:57

that her fear is always her mom is white and her dad's

1:17:59

black. Fear is always that her mom

1:18:01

would say some shit like I'm not racist, I have black

1:18:03

children. Like that's always

1:18:05

her deep fear. And I had never thought

1:18:07

of that before because I'm not biracial, and I remember

1:18:10

being like, oh my god, that is actually

1:18:12

because people will. Sarah

1:18:14

thinks that she is standing in resistance,

1:18:17

in solidarity and defiance because

1:18:19

she is dating a black guy.

1:18:20

Mm hmm.

1:18:21

It's given Kim Kardashian when she wrote that

1:18:24

letter about oh my god, I'm gonna

1:18:26

have black children and I can't believe that the world

1:18:28

will treat them this way. And Chris was

1:18:30

like, really proud of you, Kim, and I was like, go, your

1:18:35

children are so fucking wealthy.

1:18:38

Your kids are not

1:18:40

not to say that they might not. They're gonna deal

1:18:42

with stuff whatever, But like your kids

1:18:44

that will be able to have security get driven

1:18:46

in black tinted out window cars everywhere.

1:18:49

Those are the black kids you're worried about.

1:18:51

Yeah.

1:18:51

I managed to wipe that that statement

1:18:54

from my mind. I'm forgot.

1:18:55

Sorry, sorry, no,

1:18:58

but there's this phenomenon of you know,

1:19:00

white people being like, well, I can't be

1:19:02

racist, I have a black

1:19:05

friend, or I'm dating a black

1:19:07

guy, or like.

1:19:08

Do you know a black person or you actually

1:19:10

friends with them? Because like a lot of y'all know

1:19:12

black people, but are you actually friends?

1:19:14

What do you have out?

1:19:15

Do you go to their house? Yeah?

1:19:17

This? Yeah, I'm like, And also you need to have

1:19:19

more than like this is the other thing. You need

1:19:21

to make a conscious effort of some people. You

1:19:23

can't help where you live, right unless you have the money

1:19:25

to move places. So if you live in areas

1:19:28

where you're only seeing black people, like

1:19:30

you don't see black people that much, and the only interaction

1:19:32

you have is through the media, different

1:19:35

types of media, not just TV shows and movies, advertising,

1:19:37

whatever. When you meet a black person,

1:19:39

you're using your frame of reference. What do you know

1:19:42

about black people? Even if it's not you

1:19:44

intentionally doing it, it's like a knee jerk response.

1:19:46

We're always sussing out places, always trying

1:19:49

to suss out information. Whatever. If I had

1:19:51

never seen a white person before, and I watch

1:19:53

movies all the time white people in it, girl,

1:19:56

I'm using a stereotypes first, because I'm like, is

1:19:58

that you're gonna be able to handle this icy food? You

1:20:02

know?

1:20:02

Like shit, like that, But yeah.

1:20:04

I also have grown up in so many

1:20:06

different types of environments where I've been in predominantly

1:20:08

black spaces, predominantly Hispanic

1:20:11

schools, predominantly white schools

1:20:13

as well, So like, yeah, it's

1:20:15

interesting when you note that people have never

1:20:18

had to go out of their comfort zones in terms

1:20:20

of their physical identity and

1:20:23

how little we mix

1:20:25

or integrate.

1:20:26

Actually, I can speak

1:20:29

to the experience

1:20:31

of growing up in a

1:20:33

predominantly white community.

1:20:35

I grew up in a small rural town in

1:20:38

western Pennsylvania. There was

1:20:40

very, very very little racial

1:20:43

or ethnic diversity, and

1:20:46

of course I'm going to and I

1:20:48

did harbor racial biases

1:20:51

growing up. I didn't know any better,

1:20:53

And like you said, my frame of reference was

1:20:55

in the media I was consuming. And it wasn't

1:20:57

until I went to college and actually like

1:21:00

met and befriended people who

1:21:02

weren't white and started to

1:21:04

learn and interrogate. And I

1:21:07

had to do so much unlearning

1:21:09

of like what I had learned as far as stereotypes

1:21:12

and tropes and the idea

1:21:14

of systemic racism was something

1:21:16

I was only like peripherally understanding

1:21:19

and familiar with, and I had to do

1:21:22

so much work to learn more about it. So, yes,

1:21:24

these are real things. But the problem is

1:21:27

that most people who do have

1:21:29

this white privilege, like we

1:21:31

said, it warps them and they don't want

1:21:33

to be bothered. They don't

1:21:35

feel like it's their place to comment

1:21:38

on it or to think about it. It doesn't

1:21:40

affect them, So why would they, you know, spend

1:21:42

the time to do anything like that.

1:21:43

Yeah, I mean even conversely, I grew up

1:21:46

in a predominantly black and Hispanic

1:21:48

neighborhood and that because I feel like the way

1:21:50

that this is presented is that, like

1:21:52

Julius Diles, by being a

1:21:55

white girl in a predominantly black

1:21:57

space, that's all it takes to

1:22:00

do the work is just by like hanging

1:22:03

out.

1:22:03

For a couple of weeks. And it's like, that's absolutely

1:22:05

not true.

1:22:05

There are white people in my

1:22:08

community that are tremendously

1:22:10

racist. Like it's just feels like it's

1:22:12

this very movie presentation that

1:22:15

sets the bar it like sub zero,

1:22:18

like in the core of the earth to

1:22:20

be like to actually

1:22:23

have engaged with any

1:22:25

issue on race, which again,

1:22:27

like we were talking about, Sarah doesn't.

1:22:29

She does not engage, like she's

1:22:32

around.

1:22:33

But she combatd that white lady in the train

1:22:35

and that was it.

1:22:36

She defeated racism, the lady, and

1:22:39

you're just like, it's just I don't

1:22:41

know. I mean, I guess it does go back to your point, like

1:22:43

it's just like unbelievably Hollywood,

1:22:46

and it's like the problem

1:22:48

of racism has to be solved, and

1:22:50

it's like the stakes are the same as getting

1:22:53

into Juilliard in spite of having no

1:22:55

talent, and like these are the two

1:22:58

and they're equally important because fucking

1:23:01

who knows.

1:23:02

When you said you grew up in probably black and Hispanic neighborhood,

1:23:05

I was like, I'm always fascinated by white

1:23:07

people like that. Not because I'm like, what

1:23:09

was that like, but just because I'm like, okay,

1:23:12

so you've grown up around in

1:23:14

proximity to people, and you felt

1:23:16

what it has been like to be a minority. I think

1:23:18

more than anything, too many people

1:23:21

don't experience what it's like to be

1:23:23

a minority somewhere, and so

1:23:25

they don't ever consider again that

1:23:27

practicing the empathy muscle of oh no,

1:23:30

I get that actually, because I know what it feels like on

1:23:32

a human. As you were saying before, themes

1:23:35

right, like a universal

1:23:37

theme of feeling like a fish out of water,

1:23:39

feeling out of place somewhere, feeling like the

1:23:42

only whatever whatever somewhere. A

1:23:44

lot of people don't ever have to have that experience,

1:23:47

even when we travel to places. You know,

1:23:49

people will go to resorts and

1:23:51

whatever just so they don't have to be around the locals.

1:23:54

And like it's just kind of you know, it's very

1:23:56

like we really don't like to

1:23:58

let go of our company. People don't like to be uncomfortable,

1:24:01

and you know, but that was before

1:24:03

nine to eleven. Baby, Sorry,

1:24:05

I'm sorry.

1:24:07

Then everything ja a little bit like.

1:24:10

Sarah's like white discomfort

1:24:12

is something that we see

1:24:15

throughout the movie, and

1:24:18

it's just like, no, it was

1:24:20

actually fine for her to walk away from

1:24:23

that conversation with Shanil

1:24:25

where Shanil is making good points,

1:24:27

and but because it made Sarah the white girl

1:24:29

uncomfortable, she has to leave. And

1:24:33

then it's actually Shanil who owes Sarah

1:24:35

an apology by the end, and it's just like.

1:24:37

For making her uncomfortable.

1:24:38

This is like off topic, but like I have some

1:24:41

issues with how like self care.

1:24:43

Stuff is sort of present, like mental health.

1:24:45

I think that a lot of like mental health languages has been

1:24:47

co opted to get people out

1:24:49

of uncomfortable conversations they need

1:24:51

to be having it that they don't want on.

1:24:53

A video about therapy speak

1:24:55

Oh my god, wait

1:24:58

in my spirit.

1:25:00

It's gonna be crash landed into my algorithm.

1:25:03

It's like, I mean, it is

1:25:05

wild. I think that there is a

1:25:07

like self care lend you can apply

1:25:10

to that scene where we're saying that Julia

1:25:12

Styles's character is clearly wrong, where it's like she had

1:25:14

to protect her energy from

1:25:16

the discomfort. She doesn't need to engage

1:25:19

with that, which is just like telegraphic

1:25:21

that like she doesn't need to engage

1:25:23

with issues around race and poverty because they don't

1:25:25

affect her. And you're just like, ugh,

1:25:29

well I'm excited for that video.

1:25:30

Thank you, poor Malachi.

1:25:32

Okay, Malaki deserved more too,

1:25:34

because he was there was a lot.

1:25:37

There was masculinity, your

1:25:39

respect, a particular black

1:25:41

masculinity, and what does that do that expectation,

1:25:44

especially when you don't have, as he's saying, like the

1:25:46

smarts, like allegedly he doesn't

1:25:48

have the smarts like Derek like to

1:25:50

go to Georgetown. He's like, this is what I

1:25:53

have. I'm like, okay, that's

1:25:55

something. Oh but no,

1:25:57

no, he's just a mean,

1:26:00

he was abusive and terrible, so yeah, like.

1:26:01

You know, right, And it's like Malachi doesn't

1:26:04

really have a chance with the audit because we see him

1:26:06

being physically abusive to a

1:26:09

student, but.

1:26:10

We don't see the nice part of him. We only hear

1:26:12

though, like he was willing to go

1:26:14

to Juvie for Derek, which is an

1:26:16

admirable trait to do. Like these like

1:26:18

they threw everything at him and he said, I'm

1:26:20

not gonna snitch. Like there could

1:26:23

have been even that moment when he came to Julia

1:26:25

Styles. I forgot what had happened before

1:26:27

I watched it, so I thought he was gonna come up to her

1:26:29

and try to like talk to her

1:26:32

or like say something. I don't know, I just thought

1:26:34

that maybe there was gonna be a conversation there instead

1:26:36

of just your oil and milk. But I'm

1:26:38

also like, maybe maybe

1:26:41

all of these characters are defensive and apprehensive

1:26:43

round Julia because it don't seem like she wants

1:26:46

to listen, so they're all like, bitch.

1:26:47

Right, you white right? Could

1:26:49

be that, And on top of that, she's

1:26:52

weird and.

1:26:55

And she's not very good at dancing. Yeah,

1:26:58

what I found interesting about

1:27:00

that especially the Malachi Derek

1:27:03

friendship. Is something

1:27:05

that I observe a lot among men

1:27:08

and their friendships with each other. Is that someone

1:27:12

who has seen a different side of a person will

1:27:14

say like, Hey, that guy was really

1:27:16

shitty to me, or I saw that guy doing something

1:27:19

really awful, maybe you shouldn't

1:27:21

be friends with him, and

1:27:24

the guy's like, well, I haven't seen that. I've

1:27:26

only seen the good side of him. So I don't

1:27:28

believe you, Slash. I don't

1:27:30

think what you're saying is valid. This

1:27:33

is a thing that I mean, just speaking

1:27:35

to my experience as a comedian, there

1:27:37

will be like male comedians who are

1:27:40

singing the praises of another male

1:27:42

comedian. I'll be like, oh, that's interesting

1:27:44

because that guy like sexually harassed

1:27:46

me, and then they're like, well he was nice

1:27:49

to me.

1:27:49

So yoh, you are right. That is the point to bring

1:27:52

up too, because that's the other thing. It's like,

1:27:54

I wish that they would have explored their friendship more

1:27:56

so that at least we as the audience understand

1:27:58

why Derek has such an allegiance to this guy

1:28:00

that just seems like he hates women in

1:28:02

general, not just white women, but especially

1:28:05

white women.

1:28:05

Yeah, yeah, but the movie

1:28:08

glosses over that.

1:28:10

Yeah.

1:28:10

I feel like the way the Malachite character is

1:28:13

handled is super messy, where it's like

1:28:15

from it feels like the

1:28:17

empathy that the movie has for him changes

1:28:19

from scene to scene depending on what needs

1:28:22

to happen in the scene, and so it just

1:28:24

comes off super messy. Some of the lines he says

1:28:26

are funny, such as that the black

1:28:28

man's life madness in mayhem, and I

1:28:30

was like, what the what.

1:28:34

This is the other thing? This is where sorry,

1:28:36

go ahead, before I just put.

1:28:37

It that that was

1:28:39

the end of that particular thought.

1:28:42

It just I almost sound like an

1:28:44

angry, bitter black feminist, but like,

1:28:47

you know what, actually they deserved each other

1:28:49

because what big Black men will try to victimize

1:28:52

themselves as much as white women will sometimes,

1:28:54

And I'm just like, there, y'all go

1:28:56

ahead. Not obviously I'm not talking about

1:28:58

all black men are all all white women,

1:29:00

because I gotta say it that because y'all be like, yeah, but

1:29:04

truly must be a day ending and why when

1:29:07

a black man says that's a black man's world madness

1:29:09

and mayhem? So that's

1:29:11

why you had that girl yoked up in the bathroom.

1:29:14

Right like they're all I

1:29:17

just yeah, that friendship felt like under

1:29:20

examined. I mean, which gets

1:29:22

to something that I was feeling sort of throat

1:29:24

the movie, where it's like, the movie

1:29:27

has obviously an interest

1:29:29

in Derek and in Chanel, but

1:29:31

like not to the same extent that they're interested

1:29:33

in Sarah.

1:29:34

So there's stuff that will.

1:29:35

Be introduced to us that kind

1:29:37

of just goes away, or the movie's

1:29:39

attitude kind of flip flops, because

1:29:42

it seems like what's important to the movie is that Sarah's

1:29:45

journey is on track and consistent,

1:29:47

and so if things get a little sloppier

1:29:50

to the characters around her, no big deal.

1:29:53

I have a question for y'all, do you

1:29:55

know what the plot of say, the Last Dance to Is

1:29:57

it the same thing where it's another white girl that goes into a black.

1:30:00

I've never seen it. I have no idea.

1:30:02

So my understanding is that it's

1:30:05

a continuation of Sarah's

1:30:07

story, although it's not played by Julia Stiles,

1:30:11

so it's like, I think it's just Juilliard.

1:30:14

Okay, wait, let me, I'm on the Wikipedia thing.

1:30:16

Okay, so yes, she's a Juilliard. She's

1:30:18

now played by Isabella

1:30:20

Miko, who is in

1:30:23

Coyote Ugly apparently.

1:30:25

Okay, Coyote Ugly.

1:30:27

Now, sorry, here's a sentence that jumped

1:30:29

out at me. Oh no, I'm

1:30:32

pretty sure she just gets a different

1:30:34

black boyfriend at Juilliard.

1:30:36

During orientation.

1:30:37

On her first day at Juilliard, Sarah meets Miles

1:30:40

Sultana, who takes her for a

1:30:42

trombone player. When she what

1:30:45

what, I don't know,

1:30:48

she's air they're in not a ballet

1:30:51

dancer.

1:30:52

Yes.

1:30:53

When she tells him she is there for ballet, he questions

1:30:55

whether she is a ballerina. Sarah boldly

1:30:57

states she's already a ballerina. She is there to

1:30:59

become a came at ballerina. So she just

1:31:01

dates another guy actually.

1:31:03

By Columbus Short.

1:31:05

Yeah, yes, of course it's Columbus

1:31:07

Store. He was in all those dance

1:31:10

movies. Okay, yeah, where is it him?

1:31:12

Is he in Stumpy Ard?

1:31:13

Yes? Okay, yeah, fucking

1:31:17

love.

1:31:17

Stop the art, this

1:31:20

whole decade of dance movies. You're

1:31:23

just like, my god.

1:31:25

Let's have fun again. Bring back the dance

1:31:27

movie.

1:31:27

Yah, let's right one.

1:31:30

Let's do a dance movie, my

1:31:33

dream movie. Since you're a screenplay writer,

1:31:35

I'm going to give you this idea and like, if it ever comes

1:31:37

to fruition, I just want to be a little percentage. It's

1:31:40

like an enemy's to lovers

1:31:43

cheerleader rivalry where

1:31:45

the two captains are you know,

1:31:48

they're the femme girlies, but they're

1:31:50

enemy teams and then they both end

1:31:52

up at a gay conversion camp and have to

1:31:54

break out together and that's how they become lovers.

1:31:57

And while that's happening on the inside, on the outside

1:31:59

their team are coming together to try and like,

1:32:02

I don't know what the plot is.

1:32:03

Bring it on, but I'm a cheerleader, like

1:32:06

pallidation.

1:32:07

That's so great.

1:32:09

I'm not

1:32:11

a writer.

1:32:13

I'm big ideas, but when it comes to sitting

1:32:15

down and writing it, I'm like, girl, I don't know, this

1:32:18

is hard.

1:32:22

Oh goodness, No, that sounds like a great story.

1:32:25

But yeah, say the last dance to

1:32:28

I haven't seen it. I can't really.

1:32:30

Say save the last dance to the

1:32:32

streets Havannah Knight.

1:32:38

Now we've done them all, does

1:32:42

anyone?

1:32:42

I guess? Havanah Knights is probably another

1:32:45

example of that of like white

1:32:47

girl goes into Spanish culture

1:32:49

and learns how to dance. I haven't seen

1:32:51

it though, so I don't know.

1:32:53

I love Dirty Dance and Cavena Nights. It was

1:32:55

my introduction to Diego Luna.

1:32:57

He's the romantic lead in it,

1:33:00

and a picture them now that

1:33:02

was on heavy sleepover rotation.

1:33:05

Unfortunately, Baby

1:33:08

Diego Luna Bragg.

1:33:10

Does anyone have anything else they would like to talk

1:33:12

about?

1:33:13

Oh gosh, I feel like we could keep talking for hours

1:33:16

truly, I'm like, what is

1:33:18

this movie?

1:33:19

Yeah? I was like, are there any other lines that I

1:33:21

particularly thought were interesting?

1:33:25

I do think it's hilarious

1:33:27

that Shaneil is like she,

1:33:30

you know, dreams of going to fashion school

1:33:32

and she like designs and like puts together all these outfits.

1:33:34

But I'm like, are her outfits good?

1:33:36

Because I feel like.

1:33:37

Yeah, they should have thought more about that. Not

1:33:40

very they should have thought more about

1:33:42

that, like just the way and I know she like styled

1:33:45

her in the car and stuff and

1:33:47

like did that quick change whatever? But yeah, they don't

1:33:49

really like they give.

1:33:50

Yeah, we need more about that. We need more

1:33:53

Shaneil. In general, it was like, I don't know enough about two

1:33:55

thousand and one.

1:33:56

Well, I feel like I missed opportunity

1:33:58

that I thought because we learn about

1:34:01

Shanil and Derek's mom really

1:34:03

late in the plot, Like it's

1:34:06

presented as a twist that

1:34:08

is not a twist, and it's like, why couldn't we have

1:34:10

just learned this earlier. It's because the movie doesn't

1:34:12

care about them the same way it cares about Sarah.

1:34:14

But that felt like.

1:34:15

Because and again, this is like a

1:34:17

plot point that is like riddled with stereotypes.

1:34:20

But their mom is absent. It's

1:34:22

described that she's in jail quote

1:34:24

for drugs ellipses, for things

1:34:27

women do for drugs ellipses, And

1:34:29

you're like, okay,

1:34:32

but even if we're just taking the plot point that

1:34:35

Sarah and Shanil's mother

1:34:37

are both absent, they're not like that is

1:34:39

like a chance for an opportunity, a chance

1:34:41

to connect like something.

1:34:43

Early on, Yeah, I lost whatever.

1:34:46

But also this is the part where I was like, ah, y'all

1:34:48

should have let the black people leave because Mama Dean

1:34:50

would have come around the corner and been like, yet them

1:34:52

drugs the Reagan planet. You know.

1:35:00

Yeah, well to that point

1:35:02

as far as like I'm not even sure

1:35:05

why Shanil takes Sarah under

1:35:07

her wing, like and then

1:35:09

do Derek and Sarah

1:35:11

have anything in common,

1:35:14

aside from the fact that they've both read

1:35:16

Capodi and have opinions

1:35:19

on it that they read for class. I just

1:35:21

it feels like another like undercooked romance

1:35:24

where it's like, what do they like

1:35:26

about each other?

1:35:27

Yeah, they have common.

1:35:28

Derek toes the line of

1:35:30

being in his world, but also

1:35:33

he wants to go to Georgetown, and he knows

1:35:35

about Capodi and he's

1:35:37

a black intellectual, so like there's

1:35:40

a certain like he's classed

1:35:43

differently than the people around him

1:35:45

because of that intelligence and because

1:35:47

of the way he can talk and how he can code switch

1:35:49

and go back and forth. He doesn't really code switch

1:35:52

that much, but like, you know, just like he's

1:35:54

teeters that line I guess of

1:35:56

being black but

1:35:59

not Malachi or snooky

1:36:01

black.

1:36:02

Right, So is the movie implying that

1:36:04

because he is like quiet

1:36:06

intellectual, then he like

1:36:09

it makes sense for him to be with a

1:36:11

white person.

1:36:12

Like I don't know if much I got

1:36:14

the vibe of like less that and more like maybe

1:36:16

it's a respectability thing of like, Okay,

1:36:19

we want to show different depictions of black folks,

1:36:21

so we have the nerdy black dudes for a quick second,

1:36:23

but Derek is a black

1:36:26

man that like anyone would

1:36:28

want, not even just black women, but

1:36:30

even a white girl would want. He's smart,

1:36:32

he is driven,

1:36:35

Like that's what she Neiel's talking about. She's like, he's gonna make

1:36:37

something of his life. He's not gonna have kids and just leave

1:36:39

them, like and we don't have enough

1:36:41

of that.

1:36:42

And I'm like, oh

1:36:45

no, it's

1:36:47

bleak. I will say to

1:36:50

pay this movie a tiny little

1:36:53

compliment, even though it doesn't handle

1:36:55

anything thoughtfully that

1:36:59

at this time, the early two thousands, very

1:37:01

few movies featured

1:37:04

an interracial relationship. We

1:37:07

very rarely saw interracial kiss

1:37:10

time with Jungle Fever.

1:37:13

And that was the eighties, which.

1:37:16

Fucking fever. I

1:37:19

saw the

1:37:20

Guard.

1:37:22

Yeah, sure, there are a few exactly nineties.

1:37:25

It was rare. It was pretty rare

1:37:28