0:00

It's always that I'm bringing on

0:02

social media managers, and this is a huge problem

0:04

because they can never do it the same way

0:06

I would. And maybe that's

0:08

true. In fact, it probably is. I think it's

0:10

very difficult to hire a social media manager. But

0:12

maybe the answer is not hiring the social media

0:14

manager. Maybe the answer is hiring people for these

0:17

other pieces in the business. And you actually stay

0:19

focused on your social content. So it's also in

0:21

the strategy of how you're bringing a team and

0:23

what you're focused on versus what they're focused on.

0:35

Hello, and welcome back to the Boss Babe

0:37

podcast. Okay, we've got a slightly different one

0:39

coming your way this week. So

0:41

you might remember a couple of months ago,

0:43

we had our brand new COO, Lindsay,

0:46

come onto the podcast and we talked all about

0:48

what her role looks like and what the process

0:50

was like of her actually getting the job at

0:53

Boss Babe. And I mentioned on there, at some

0:55

point, we would have our previous COO come on

0:58

and talk about what she did at the

1:00

company and all of the tips

1:02

that she has because she's phenomenal. So the day

1:04

is today. I invited Marisa

1:06

Lison, who is our previous

1:08

COO. And she is a

1:11

powerhouse businesswoman, now turned entrepreneur

1:13

to come on. We first talk about why

1:15

she left Boss Babe. We talk about how

1:18

she helped me to really navigate the transition

1:20

when Danielle was transitioning out with the team

1:22

and making sure that our culture was

1:24

great and our team felt included and stable

1:26

and secure in a lot of turmoil. We

1:29

just get really real, you guys, you know

1:31

that I don't hold anything back here. We

1:33

talk about that. We talk about what you

1:36

might want to look for if you're hiring

1:38

your right hand, some red

1:40

flags, some phrases you might want

1:42

to look for on their CVs. And

1:44

then generally, if you're thinking about scaling a

1:46

business, some of the things that might be

1:49

holding you back from scale, we really go

1:51

there, we get into all of it. I'm

1:53

really excited to be able to have this

1:55

conversation and introduce you to her because she's

1:57

incredible and I really want to support what's.

2:00

next in her journey. I am the biggest

2:02

supporter and champion of women, especially women that

2:04

have helped me in part build my dream

2:06

as well. I want to help them build

2:08

theirs. So I hope you enjoy the first

2:10

part. Where

2:16

is it? So good to talk to you again.

2:18

Welcome back to Vosbe. Thank you. It's so good

2:20

to see you again. So

2:22

I want to start by really talking about

2:25

what you were doing when you were with

2:27

us at Vosbe. So do you want to

2:29

tell everyone a little bit about when you

2:31

joined and then what your role was within

2:34

the company? Yeah, sure. So I joined it

2:36

was about two years ago. And while my

2:38

role, it was largely a Swiss army knife,

2:40

to be honest, but I came in as

2:43

chief operator. And operations can

2:45

really cover a gamut of things. And

2:47

that's exactly what I was doing at

2:49

Vosbe. I think the things I wasn't

2:52

doing was more marketing and the audience

2:54

growth in the marketing side of it.

2:56

But team systems,

2:59

legal finance, all the sort of back end

3:01

pieces of the business, that's where really I

3:03

was focused. And one

3:05

thing about you is and you said it

3:07

yourself too, you're like a steady sail in

3:09

the wind. When you joined, I feel like

3:12

it was a whole lot of

3:14

wind and a lot of transitions,

3:16

as everyone knows. Have

3:19

you always been like that? Or is

3:21

it something you've developed over time in

3:23

your career? I'm sure I've honed the

3:25

skill over time in my career, I

3:27

think it's probably part of my DNA

3:29

to be more the calm,

3:31

let's figure out what we're going to do,

3:33

don't stress, like, we'll solve this type of

3:35

person. But over the course of my

3:37

career, I've worked in so many

3:39

different types of environments, everything from tech startup, where

3:41

it's like literally me and the founder to giant

3:44

corporate environments and everything in between, spending

3:47

a lot of time actually in growth

3:49

stage businesses, which was the in between.

3:52

What I find in growth stage businesses is there's just

3:55

not in a bad way necessarily, but there's a lot of

3:57

problems to solve. And in fact, that's

3:59

actually kind of why I like it. I think it's

4:01

more interesting and there's always a challenge,

4:03

which I love a challenge, but

4:06

I think spending over

4:08

a decade in those types of businesses, I

4:10

just hone the skill of, okay, something's happening.

4:13

It could be stressful. We could lean into the

4:15

stress or we could lean into solving the issue

4:17

and figuring out a way to do it while

4:20

keeping our energy high. So

4:22

that's always kind of now where I lean is how

4:24

do we solve this in a calm way and not

4:27

let the stress carry us away. I

4:29

love that and definitely that's something you brought

4:32

to the company. I feel like everyone in

4:34

Boston was very grateful for that when there

4:36

was so much, let's call it turbulence going

4:38

on. What would you say when

4:40

you were with us with some of your

4:42

biggest learnings, whether in your

4:45

career about business, just on

4:47

a high level, what did being there

4:49

really teach you? Yeah. One

4:52

of the number one things I took away from

4:54

that experience is just the

4:58

learning from you and seeing

5:00

how you can take action quickly

5:02

and make something happen

5:05

quickly. It's almost a mindset

5:07

to be honest. Even

5:09

though I've worked in smaller environments for many years

5:11

where you are moving quickly, there was a different

5:13

flavor of that at Boss Babe where it was

5:16

like, we have an idea and we

5:18

think it's a good one. Let's go. Let's

5:20

try it. Being in

5:22

that environment actually taught me a lot from

5:24

my own mindset about not to over plan,

5:26

not to think things through too much and

5:29

just start testing and start seeing what works.

5:32

That was a big learning for me. Also,

5:35

even our launch strategies,

5:37

how we would look

5:39

at an offer ladder and how we

5:41

would look at who our end

5:43

customer is and what's going to serve them

5:45

best. The ways that Boss Babe does that,

5:48

that's business. Of course, you're doing that in any

5:50

business, but the ways that Boss Babe did it,

5:53

I just learned a lot of strategies from how

5:55

we were reaching our members and reaching our

5:58

end users of our courses. I

6:00

love that. And so the question, I'm

6:02

sure everyone's like waiting to hear the answer to what

6:04

is it that made you decide you want to leave

6:06

Boss Babe? Well, it honestly

6:08

was less about wanting to leave Boss

6:10

Babe, more about wanting to carry on

6:13

a journey that I've been wanting to

6:15

be on now for a very

6:17

long time. So prior to Boss

6:19

Babe, I was in an advertising

6:21

agency environment for 10 years.

6:24

I mean, it was easily over a decade and

6:27

Boss Babe was sort of my first move into,

6:29

okay, I know I want something different. I actually

6:31

do feel like I want to be on my

6:33

own, but in some ways at

6:36

that time, maybe I wasn't quite ready for that.

6:38

So I felt like, okay, I've followed Boss Babe

6:40

for a long time. It felt like a dream

6:43

move for me. And I also felt like I would

6:45

learn so much about this type of environment, which I

6:47

did. And it was kind of a

6:49

stepping stone into where I am now. So I

6:52

got to a point where at Boss

6:54

Babe, I saw that, okay, we had streamlined

6:56

the business quite a bit and

6:59

you have a really good handle

7:01

on how things are running behind

7:04

the scenes because it is

7:06

so much more streamlined now. There is a smaller team. And

7:09

I feel like this was the perfect time then for

7:11

me to have the confidence.

7:13

I had the desire. I said that the

7:15

team was going to be okay. I said that you were going

7:18

to be okay. And it was like, okay, I think this is

7:20

the right time. It just kind of energetically felt like it was

7:22

time, but it was less about leaving Boss Babe, more about just

7:24

carrying on the journey that I always wanted to be on. Yeah.

7:28

I'm so excited for you. And how has it been now?

7:30

You've been on this journey for a

7:32

few months. How are you finding it?

7:35

How is entrepreneurship life treating you? Yeah,

7:37

honestly, it's really, really good. I

7:39

feel like I've been, I mean,

7:42

I've been paired up with CEOs for so long

7:44

now that it doesn't feel super

7:46

unnatural now for me to be doing this on

7:48

my own because I'm just simply doing something I've

7:50

been doing in many ways, but

7:52

just now helping more CEOs through

7:55

coaching. And I don't

7:57

know, I'm loving it. And I'm finding that just.

8:00

having the opportunity to just

8:02

reach new people, help new people. Honestly, what I want to

8:04

do is help people. I mean, in the end, that's what

8:06

I want to do. So the fact

8:08

that I already have clients, I'm already able

8:10

to do that. And I see the opportunity

8:12

in so many different ways I can be

8:14

doing that through memberships and masterminds

8:17

and things like that. It's just exciting to be

8:19

honest. I'm so excited for

8:21

you. And yeah, it was definitely feeling like

8:23

you'd had so much change. And

8:26

definitely your identity and everything was shifting. It felt

8:28

like the perfect time that you were like, you

8:30

know what, I'm going to go jump and do

8:32

this on my own. And I love how you

8:34

did it as well. You didn't try and straddle

8:37

working with boss babe and doing your own thing

8:39

and diluting your focus. You really made that decision

8:41

of I'm going to work with boss babe till

8:43

I complete my handover. And you were so generous

8:45

with the time you give us there. And then

8:47

you said, okay, I'm now I'm going to draw

8:50

the line in the sand and I'm going to go

8:52

all in with my business. And I actually think that was

8:54

an amazing way of doing it. I know that's not open

8:57

and accessible to everyone because everyone

8:59

has different financial circumstances. But

9:01

the way you did it, I feel like it's probably

9:03

saved you really well to have that solid focus, right?

9:06

No, it definitely has. I mean, it

9:08

did. So earlier I said maybe I

9:10

didn't plan everything, but I definitely did plan

9:12

something. So to the finance piece of

9:15

it, yes, you're right. I was able to plan

9:17

for a scenario where I would have a runway

9:19

to make something work. So

9:22

that certainly helped my cause quite a bit. But

9:24

this was never about I want

9:26

to leave boss babe. This was never about, you

9:29

know, being unhappy or anything like that. This

9:31

was about, okay, like I'm ready for my

9:33

new journey. And I didn't

9:35

necessarily feel like, Oh, I

9:37

just, I just want to leave. Like

9:39

I actually did want to, you know, make sure that

9:42

you guys were in a really good spot. And I

9:44

know with Lindsay coming on, it was like perfect. Like

9:46

I felt so good once I knew Lindsay was going

9:48

to be the one I'm like, Oh, okay. Now I

9:50

feel actually relieved by that, but I

9:52

love you. I love the team. It was bittersweet to

9:55

be honest. I mean, I was excited about my journey,

9:57

but it wasn't an easy decision either. But you know,

9:59

I, I feel like I'm not the

10:01

person that will ever leave somebody high and dry on

10:03

anything. Like, of course, I want to leave my

10:05

legacy to be a good one and leave you in a

10:08

good spot. And I don't know, and keep

10:10

the relationship alive, too. Totally. And

10:12

I think for anyone listening to that is

10:14

thinking about hiring an executive, hiring a right

10:16

hand, I think what incredible quality

10:19

to look for. I know it's not the kind

10:21

of thing you can ask someone in a job

10:23

interview and get a correct answer, but I felt

10:25

like from the beginning of our relationship when we

10:27

were first talking about you joining the team, just

10:30

based on your experience and the way in which

10:32

you left your previous company, it was very evident

10:34

to me that you were that kind of person

10:36

who actually really cares about people, who

10:38

cares about the work that you do in the

10:40

world, who cares about their teams. Like, you'll

10:42

tell people now you're still in touch with

10:44

teams from your older companies, too. And

10:47

I think that when you're looking to hire

10:49

an executive is a really great thing to

10:51

look for, because you want some everyone transitions.

10:53

And I think that's the beautiful thing about

10:56

being a founder is you get to be

10:58

part of someone's career for

11:00

a certain length of time. And you always know, eventually

11:03

they are going to transition out and it's going to

11:05

be bittersweet, but what a gift that you get to

11:07

be part of it for a certain

11:09

amount of time. And so you want to work

11:11

with someone that you can trust when they are

11:13

making that transition. And I feel like ours

11:16

was so seamless. Of course, it

11:19

was bittersweet, but it was so seamless in

11:21

the way that it was done. So that

11:23

is my hiring tip for finding an executive

11:26

really looking for someone who does care about

11:28

the work that they're doing. But

11:30

going into that and going deeper on this.

11:32

So one of the conversations I

11:34

had with another team member, she said,

11:36

Natalie, you know, I really want to give you some

11:38

feedback on the business. I'm like, I'm all ears. And

11:40

she said, you know, the time that

11:43

this business has run its best is

11:45

when we've had really great COOs and

11:47

operators in place. And when we haven't,

11:50

it hasn't been as much of a fun place to

11:53

work, but when we have, it's palpable and it's noticeable.

11:55

And she was really referring to you. You were still

11:57

in place at the time. She was referring to just.

12:00

how incredible you've been, especially in

12:02

terms of team and culture and

12:04

management. So I want to talk

12:06

a little bit about that because a lot

12:09

of people listening to this podcast

12:11

are entrepreneurs, and a lot of

12:13

entrepreneurs aren't typically great managers. Like,

12:15

I'm the first to say, listen, I

12:17

love leading. Management is

12:20

a skill that I'm continually having to

12:22

learn and figure out because it doesn't

12:24

come naturally to me. So

12:27

when it comes to someone that really wants to hone

12:29

in their skills with management, I'd love to talk to

12:31

you a little bit about it. I mean, let's start

12:33

granular and as simple as how

12:35

often should you be checking in with

12:38

team members? And is there a specific

12:40

way that that communication should look?

12:42

Like, you know, for

12:45

some people, they're like, do I just hop on a call

12:47

and say, like, how are you doing and hope that they

12:49

tell me the truth and then they've got some stuff they're

12:51

working on? And then we call it

12:53

a day. Or is that a method to checking

12:55

in with team? Yeah, well, I personally I feel

12:57

there is a method. But

13:00

overarching, one big takeaway for managing

13:02

team, whether that's a contractor, whether

13:04

that's your core team is

13:07

these are human beings that are working for

13:10

your business. Right. I think I see a

13:12

lot of times business

13:14

owners look at team in

13:16

terms of performance only. And of course, they're

13:18

there to do a job. And of course,

13:21

you want performance, but they almost forget about

13:23

the emotional element of a person. Right. And

13:25

the stresses that they're going through day to

13:28

day and the energy that they're

13:30

putting towards your business. So just as an

13:32

umbrella kind of overarching guideline, just think about

13:34

them as humans, not just as this rule

13:36

that they're playing. But that being said, yes,

13:39

I do think there's a method. What

13:41

I like to do is have biweekly

13:43

check in unless there's maybe something more going

13:46

on than I would go to weekly. But on a

13:48

normal kind of cadence, biweekly, I think it's good. And

13:51

I like to do what's working, what's not

13:53

type of format, because with that format, you're

13:55

going to get there. I

13:58

mean, hopefully if they feel safe with you and that's the. that's

14:00

the environment that you want to cultivate. When you

14:02

ask what's not working, you're going to get a

14:04

mix of what's not working in the business that

14:06

maybe you didn't realize even, what's not working with

14:08

other team members perhaps, which also you might not

14:10

be seeing. And also what's not working

14:13

for them in their life. And that could be

14:15

impacting something that they're doing in the business as

14:17

well. And then what's working, sometimes honestly

14:19

that's the harder answer to get from people. So

14:21

you might need to prompt it a little bit,

14:23

but then it's kind of cultivating, bringing up like,

14:25

what are the successes we can be celebrating together?

14:27

What are the ways that they can be feeling

14:29

good about what they're doing? And

14:31

if you're working through the issues, but also

14:33

spending time and gratitude and spending time thinking

14:35

about and talking about what they are doing

14:38

well, that makes a good formula for

14:40

an ongoing relationship. And

14:42

so do you share with them what's working, what's

14:44

not working, or you ask them to do that?

14:46

That's yeah, good clarification. So I do it on

14:48

both sides. So I asked them, and then I

14:51

also share from my end. What's nice

14:53

about that is it starts a feedback loop that

14:55

becomes very comfortable to talk about what's not working.

14:58

Because another thing I see very commonly

15:00

is that managers and business owners both

15:03

have a hard time giving constructive

15:05

or critical feedback. People just aren't comfortable

15:07

with it. Naturally, some people are

15:09

better at it than others, but it

15:11

creates this environment of it's expected to

15:13

talk about what's not working, and it

15:15

becomes less scary and just something that

15:17

is part of the routine. So it just

15:20

becomes easier and easier to talk about those. And

15:23

so do you prep them ahead of time, say ahead

15:25

of their first meeting, we're gonna

15:27

talk about what's working, what's not working? Do you

15:29

tell them on their first call? And then do

15:31

you tell them, okay, now in every meeting, moving

15:33

forward, this is what we're gonna do? I

15:36

do, I think people knowing what to

15:38

expect is you're always gonna get a

15:40

better response when they have a sense

15:42

for what they're walking into. You also

15:44

have to think about and remember that

15:46

team members are sometimes a little scared of you.

15:48

Even if you're not a scary person or you

15:50

don't see yourself that way, they see you as

15:53

somebody that has control over their job, over their

15:55

security. And there's just this, whether

15:57

or not they're even aware of it, there's this

15:59

natural kind of. dynamic there where they are

16:01

a little scared. So I like to try

16:03

to create the safest environment I can for

16:05

them so that even when I do have

16:08

to give critical feedback, they're hearing it in

16:10

a way where they're not fearing, they're hearing

16:12

something that they can actually work on. So

16:14

another thing I like to do in

16:16

the very beginning of a relationship is just explain to

16:18

them, like I'm somebody that's here to help you, I

16:21

wanna foster your growth, I wanna see you succeed,

16:23

when you succeed, I succeed as well. So this

16:25

is a relationship that we're in together and I

16:27

really try to make them feel like I'm

16:30

there for them. And then when they

16:32

hear my advice and my critical feedback, they take it in

16:34

a way that is productive

16:36

and not, I don't

16:38

know, fear-based or even counterproductive. Let's

16:41

talk about that critical feedback because I definitely

16:43

know this is a struggle for a lot

16:45

of people, myself included. It's such

16:47

a skill you have to learn. I don't think it

16:49

comes naturally to a lot of people to be able

16:51

to give critical feedback in

16:53

a way that's clear, but like you

16:55

say, doesn't have the adverse effect. So

16:58

do you have a formula, a way that you would give

17:00

it, let's say a grounded example of someone,

17:03

they just keep making mistakes, like they

17:05

keep submitting work and it's constantly got

17:07

mistakes in it, they're not spending that

17:09

time with the attentional detail, they're

17:11

not reviewing their work and you had to give

17:13

them the feedback, how would you go about giving

17:15

that? Yeah, so first I

17:17

like to just open it up

17:19

for some questions. I ask

17:22

them questions, so I'll say I've noticed X

17:24

and Y and Z and

17:26

let's talk about it. I want to get

17:28

to a point where we're doing better together

17:30

as a team and where we're seeing different

17:32

performance from you, but let's talk

17:34

about why these things are maybe happening and

17:36

I let them talk about it a bit.

17:38

Because it could be that they

17:41

didn't actually know, they didn't understand the direction, but

17:43

they were scared to say that. So they

17:45

just went down a road that was the wrong

17:47

road, or it could

17:49

be that something's going on at home and

17:51

they haven't mentioned that, but they're incredibly stressed

17:54

out, with their child or something else

17:56

and it's impacting their performance. So

17:58

I like to ask them questions. ask why,

18:00

like what's going on? And

18:02

again, in a safe way so that they can

18:04

actually be honest with me so I really know

18:07

what I'm dealing with. Once they explain why, then

18:09

I troubleshoot that with them. Because once I have

18:11

more clarity, then it's like, okay, well here, let's

18:13

talk about solutions. And I guide them and mentor

18:15

them on here's, here's what better looks like, or

18:18

here's what success looks like. So they understand what

18:20

I'm expecting. And I work with them

18:22

on an action plan to get there. So

18:24

I think it's some, in a nutshell,

18:26

a combination of asking why this

18:28

is even going on and then working with

18:30

them and mentoring them on how to get better. Yeah,

18:33

and too, I think also your demeanor

18:36

going into it and the way you have

18:38

the conversation, one thing about

18:40

you, it's great, is you go and come and

18:42

you're prepped, you know what you're gonna say and

18:44

you're not just like reacting.

18:47

And I think there's something to be said

18:49

for that. Yes, I don't ever really

18:52

see an upside when you're managing

18:54

a team to being

18:56

reactive, showing your stress. I mean, of course

18:58

I'm a human too. So of course I'm

19:00

getting stressed sometimes too, but I try to

19:02

like offer that for the team as much

19:04

as I can. Like I'm not gonna get on a call

19:06

and be like, oh my God, like I can't believe X,

19:09

Y, and Z, you know, I might be thinking that, but

19:11

I'm not gonna say that to the team, you know, I'm

19:13

gonna come on and be like, okay, like clear the energy,

19:15

like let's get on, like I'm their rock, you know? So

19:17

I'm gonna get on in that manner. But yeah, I agree.

19:20

Your energy is definitely going

19:22

to impact your team. So

19:24

the more that you can lead with the energy that

19:26

you actually want back from them, the

19:29

better and I think as you get more mature, as

19:31

a person and more mature in your career, you learn

19:33

how to like manage your own energy so that those

19:35

stress moments aren't showing through to the people that are

19:37

actually trying to learn from you and be

19:40

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19:44

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23:11

I feel like this is a perfect segue into

23:13

culture. And I feel like your

23:15

time at BossFabe was like a crash course in

23:18

how to make sure the culture remains when there

23:20

is so much, let's

23:22

call it chaos, going on in the background.

23:25

The transition of going from two

23:28

founders to one founder in

23:30

any business, no matter how much you both

23:32

care about the team and really want it

23:35

to go well, it's going to have an

23:37

impact, especially given

23:39

we've talked really publicly about the transition. I

23:41

was initially gonna leave and then I decided

23:44

I wasn't because that just didn't work out.

23:46

So then I was the one that's staying

23:48

and Danielle was the one that was leaving.

23:50

And as much as we both are on

23:52

the same page about that,

23:54

Danielle and I truly care about our team and we are

23:56

on the same page, that is felt across the entire team.

24:00

of us were there since the absolute beginning of the

24:02

business. And that's what the team had always known.

24:04

So to make such a big change, that

24:06

is very challenging for a business and

24:08

culture. And one thing you

24:11

really supported me with was being able to keep

24:13

that culture in a positive place when all of

24:15

this was going on. I think we did a

24:17

good job at, you know, keeping the stress

24:19

behind the scenes, but it would have been felt in

24:22

the business. Like it absolutely would have. What

24:24

were some things that you think really helped

24:26

and how would you suggest someone else

24:28

could think about navigating that, you know, maybe

24:31

it's not like co-founder leaving, but maybe they've

24:34

had a rough patch in revenue or,

24:36

and you know, the team's wondering, are

24:38

my jobs safe? Or there's just a

24:40

lot going on and they're

24:43

wanting to keep that culture feeling really

24:45

positive. Yeah. So this goes

24:47

back actually to what I was saying about

24:49

the overarching theme of your

24:52

team are human beings. So these are

24:54

relationships, just like any other relationship. And

24:57

that means communication is

24:59

absolutely critical to the success of that

25:01

relationship. And during

25:03

a high stress time, of course, we had

25:05

a very unique situation happening. In that case,

25:08

I was checking in with the team very

25:10

frequently and they are individuals,

25:12

they are different. And I knew that.

25:14

So I would, you know, approach the

25:16

conversations with each individual in a way

25:18

that I felt they would probably receive

25:20

the best and I would give them

25:22

an open forum for asking me questions and I

25:24

would give them a safe space and let them know

25:26

that you can literally ask me anything and I'm just

25:29

going to give you answers and, you know, I want

25:31

you to feel okay during this. And

25:33

that worked actually really well. And I think

25:35

it also helped, you know, for

25:37

you and Danielle as well, because you had dynamics

25:39

that you were working through as well, and in

25:42

some ways that protected you too. So you didn't

25:44

have to think about that because I was handling

25:46

that. And not to say you weren't caring and

25:48

thinking about the team, of course you were, but, you

25:50

know, there was so much going on that we were able

25:52

to kind of divide and conquer and make sure that all

25:55

the things were okay. But yeah, if it's a

25:57

revenue dip, if it's any other kind of stressful issue happening

25:59

in a company. I need, like I'm a

26:01

huge proponent of honesty. Like let's just be

26:03

honest. Let's talk about these things. Let's be transparent.

26:05

Let's, you know, let me hear how

26:07

you're feeling. And when I would hear how they're feeling,

26:10

it's like, okay, well, I can probably reassure you on

26:12

this because X, Y, and Z. And if I can't

26:14

reassure them, then I can say, well, you know, I'm

26:16

an open line for you anytime. So

26:18

anytime you're feeling this way, come talk to me.

26:20

But it's honestly mostly about communication. Yeah.

26:23

And one thing you said there too, was

26:25

the dividing and conquering. And I think having

26:28

someone in your team that you can trust

26:30

with that is a huge deal. And there's

26:32

probably people listening thinking, oh my goodness, I

26:35

couldn't imagine being able to trust someone

26:37

on my team like that. Maybe I don't have that kind

26:39

of person. Where would you

26:41

suggest if they are going to start, where

26:44

would you suggest they start looking for a person

26:46

like that? And what kind of questions might be

26:48

helpful to ask in an interview? Or what might

26:50

you want to see on their resume? Because

26:53

I feel like I've, I got really lucky with

26:55

that. I have had, you

26:57

know, you in the business and

26:59

Lindsay in the business, who I do really trust

27:01

like that. And I don't know if

27:03

that is normal or if it's quite rare. I think it's

27:05

quite rare because, you know, entrepreneurs feel

27:07

like their business is their baby and they care

27:10

deeply about their team. And so to have a

27:12

bust out between them and their team sometimes, especially

27:14

during stressful times, you really need to find someone

27:16

you can trust. Yeah. So, OK, so I'm going

27:18

to tackle that in a couple of different ways.

27:20

For starters, I just want to clarify because, you

27:23

know, my title was chief operating

27:25

officer. And that

27:27

title is like a super nebulous title. That can mean

27:29

very different things and very different businesses, to be honest.

27:32

And yes, I was overseeing finance and

27:34

legal in those parts of the business.

27:37

That is like classical operations. But I'd say

27:39

the most important thing that you're looking for

27:41

when you are now starting to get that

27:43

right hand person in your business is

27:45

you're actually looking for somebody that can manage

27:48

the team and manage

27:50

the culture and manage the

27:52

moving parts. Because you can still outsource finance and

27:54

legal. I just happen to also do those things

27:57

too, of course, with our consults as well. Anyway,

28:00

I just want to kind of make it

28:02

clear that when you are bringing in a

28:04

right hand, the thing you should more be

28:06

looking for is somebody that is loyal, trustworthy,

28:09

they have a record of managing team. They

28:11

know how to do that. They know how

28:13

to create a good culture. So that being

28:15

said, I think in many ways it's a

28:18

gut hire. Of course there's questions

28:20

that you'll ask and I'll come up with

28:22

some good examples for that, but there's an

28:24

energy exchange that has to be right between

28:27

the CEO slash founder and this

28:29

role that we're talking about, whether it's an integrator,

28:31

chief operating officer, or chief of

28:33

staff or anything like that. You really

28:35

need to lean into your intuition, your gut, when

28:38

you're meeting with this person and feeling who they

28:40

are as a person, what you're looking for on

28:42

a resume. I mean, that's a little tougher to

28:44

be honest, because like take me, for example, I

28:47

came from, I had big corporate experience. I had

28:49

startup experience. I had agency experience. It was different

28:51

than, you know, what we were doing at Bosby,

28:53

but I had like the fundamental pieces though, of

28:55

what it means to run a backend of a

28:58

business. So that's more what you're looking

29:00

for. Less about, did they, did they work

29:02

in this exact type of business before? It's

29:04

no, have they done these types of roles

29:06

before? How long did they stay

29:08

there? I'm not saying you have to be

29:10

somebody that stays somewhere five years and, you

29:12

know, never moves around, but if they're somewhere

29:14

for a year and they move, you know,

29:17

and that's consistent throughout their resume, that's probably

29:19

a red flag, I probably wouldn't hire that

29:21

person. And then ask

29:23

them about their team. How do they talk about their

29:25

team? How do they talk about managing a team? Especially

29:27

if that's what you're interviewing for in this moment and

29:30

listen to how they talk about that. Do they

29:32

talk about performance and KPIs and that's it. And

29:34

that's kind of where their head goes. Or do

29:36

they talk about the growth of their team and

29:39

do they talk about culture? Do they bring that

29:41

up without you even having to bring it up

29:43

first? It's more about like, what

29:46

are the things that they bring to the table

29:48

when you ask these questions without you even having

29:50

to prompt? Yeah. That's

29:52

a big one. And I agree on the red flag

29:54

of like, if they're just hopping around company to company

29:57

to company, that's probably not the person you want as

29:59

your right hand. because you want someone that

30:01

you know could be in it for

30:03

the long term with you. Yeah. I

30:05

mean, exactly because you know, A, it

30:07

takes time to build trust anyway, even

30:09

if you feel and your intuition is

30:11

telling you they're a trustworthy person. You

30:14

still need to build that. You need some time

30:16

to build that. The team needs stability. And

30:18

so if you have somebody that is only

30:21

there in a year or within a year's time,

30:23

like that's, that's not enough time to build

30:25

trust with you and also build, you

30:27

know, the trust with the team as well. So yeah, time

30:29

is a big one. Okay. And there's

30:31

one thing that you had on your CV

30:33

that was just like a full good

30:36

instinct that you were right for the team. And

30:38

you said, I come with batteries included.

30:42

I remember seeing that and just

30:44

thinking, yep, she is our

30:47

woman because it's surprising how

30:49

few people don't like not in a,

30:51

in a rude way, but a

30:53

lot of, what we mean by that is like

30:56

a lot of people don't often think things

30:58

through. And they don't come with solutions.

31:00

They don't take initiative. You have to,

31:03

if you want them to do something, you have to

31:05

give them instruction A through Z. They can't go and

31:07

figure it out. So to have like, I remember working

31:09

with you, it was very much like, here's what I

31:11

want to do and you're like, cool, got it. You

31:13

come back and it's done even better than I could

31:15

have imagined. But some people you're like, here's what

31:17

I want to do. And they're like, cool.

31:19

And they just wait for more and more and

31:21

more instruction. And I feel like when you're working with

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33:56

is such a call out. Okay so

33:58

that is a huge thing. to be

34:00

looking for also when you're interviewing for this role.

34:03

And right hand needs to be somebody that's

34:05

creating direction, not asking for direction, right? I

34:07

mean, of course, there's going to be some

34:09

level of exchange there where I'm trying to

34:11

understand your vision. And as soon as

34:13

I understand that I need to be able to execute on that.

34:15

But if I'm asking you constantly, well, do

34:17

you want it this way or do you want it this way or do

34:19

you want it this way? I mean, it's going to drive you insane, right?

34:22

Like that's not what this role is for. This role is to create direction

34:24

within the company so that you can focus where you need to focus. So

34:27

I'd say something to think about and

34:29

look out for in the interview

34:31

process is how do they

34:33

respond to your questions? Do they just kind of

34:35

exude a natural leadership or they almost like take

34:37

your question, make it their own, and then keep

34:40

going with it? Or do they simply answer your

34:42

question at, or ask you like, are they kind

34:44

of putting it back on you or are they

34:46

taking the interview and actually somewhat leading it themselves?

34:48

Cause that's a good indicator of their

34:51

leadership qualities as well. Yeah,

34:53

totally. And I'll call this out

34:55

too, cause I just want to set people up for

34:57

success if they do hire an executive. But one thing

35:00

that I love that you did was you went and

35:02

outsourced coaching. You had your own place that you would

35:04

go for coaching and support. And

35:06

that really showed because

35:08

you were someone that just would

35:11

run with direction and created your own direction.

35:13

And you would never came to me being

35:15

like, what, what did you mean

35:17

by this? And how do we, like, it

35:19

was never like, I never felt like our

35:21

calls were just like questions, question, question, question.

35:23

It was, here's what I've done in this

35:25

realm. How do you feel about this? Or

35:27

what do we think about it was very

35:29

collaborative and it felt really freeing and supportive,

35:31

whereas when you're working with someone who's perhaps

35:33

earlier in their career and is still honing

35:35

those skills, it's a different conversation and you're,

35:37

you maybe have a conversation with them and

35:39

say, you know, this didn't really hit the mark. Oh,

35:42

well I didn't really know what we were

35:44

doing with XIZ. So I missed it out.

35:47

And it's like, there was, there's no leadership

35:49

and creative direction. I'm like, that is another

35:51

good call out. So it's not, yes. Okay.

35:53

So it's also testing For how do they

35:55

take ownership over their mistakes? I Mean, every single

35:57

person in their career. going to make mistakes so

36:00

that's just a get an Mri that's gonna happen.

36:02

But how do they own I do. They say

36:04

well I don't have cleared of direction from you

36:06

or do they say you know what you're right

36:08

that's on me. I should have done X, y

36:10

or z are you know it? Next time I'm

36:12

you actually be And how do they react to

36:14

their own mistakes and that's something. When you're interviewing

36:16

you can ask them what's the big mistake he

36:18

made in your career and and how did you

36:20

handle it and see what they say Like if

36:23

they talk about while they didn't get good briefing,

36:25

a good direction and and this happened and it

36:27

was on it or the victim mindset about it

36:29

or are they. Like yeah, here's what happened.

36:31

It's my war story. Learned from it, I

36:33

guess you know. So it's It's how they

36:35

talk about their mistakes as well. Yeah.

36:38

That's a really good call cause you do know

36:40

is thought with. People. At

36:42

different stages of that korea early stages of

36:44

their korea often they wouldn't call out a

36:47

mistake, they kind of just hope no one

36:49

no est and if it does get cold

36:51

out are like oh yeah well she is

36:53

why it happens and then like a different

36:56

mindset whereas feel like someone. Fedora.

36:58

Had to make Oriental Gemini come to be

37:00

like hey just so you know I totally

37:02

messed us up United fact that it's like

37:04

it's not a big deal everyone knows that

37:06

mistake the happening but at quite forthcoming about

37:08

it except maybe to the level of confidence

37:11

their of like I know these mistakes on

37:13

defining mean I know I can solve them

37:15

but I want to be forthcoming with it.

37:17

yeah I agree and there's also something that

37:19

you can infuse into the culture to it's

37:21

a culture where me at you're not encouraging

37:23

mistakes by you are encouraging transparency on mistakes

37:26

and they know they can say these things.

37:28

And it's gonna be okay largely. And yeah,

37:30

I agree. Like I mean the victim mindset.

37:32

I think it's one of the worst thing

37:35

for a culture. I agree. I

37:37

think it's top down to like if the

37:39

founder is consistently having that kind of victim

37:41

mindset. everything else is everyone elses fault or

37:44

the economy's followed like a lot of blame.

37:46

it's just passing by down. I think it's

37:48

so much of it. Starts with how. You

37:50

show up. Agreed. So.

37:53

let's talk about your new direction then and

37:55

then what is it that you're excited about

37:57

that you're creating next like what is your

37:59

next chapter look Like I know you're going

38:01

out on your own and I know,

38:03

but I'm curious what it's looking like.

38:05

Yeah. So as a starting point, I'm

38:07

going out into coaching, but that's taking

38:09

a number of different forms right now.

38:11

I'm doing one-on-one containers, but I'm also

38:13

moving into a mastermind the spring that

38:15

I'm creating. And I'd like to do

38:17

a little bit more group and membership

38:19

type programs, but all of it is

38:22

under the umbrella of scaling. I'm super

38:24

passionate about helping growth stage entrepreneurs scale

38:26

their businesses. And when I say

38:28

scale, I don't mean grow. You

38:30

know, I think a lot of people hear

38:33

the word scale. Not everyone understands completely

38:35

what that means. It's all about how

38:37

can you build more and grow? Yes,

38:39

but with by doing less or by

38:41

streamlining. And so what that

38:44

looks like for me is I focus on

38:46

strategies. I mean, strategy is a big part of

38:48

it and your business and product strategies, but also

38:50

your systems and what do you have in place

38:52

to make things more streamlined, smoother, easier, faster for

38:54

you behind the scenes. You're not having to spend

38:56

a lot of time on things

38:59

that aren't, you know, the growth side of the business as

39:01

well as team, as we've been talking. I'm

39:03

super passionate about team and for a lot

39:06

of entrepreneurs, especially in maybe the mid to

39:08

high six, low seven figures, that

39:10

is probably a very small team, it might

39:12

even be some contractors, but even then there's

39:14

dynamics that you can be encouraging

39:17

that are going to help you grow and help you

39:19

spend less time in the management piece of it and

39:21

just have a more productive and

39:23

happier team as well. So these are all

39:25

the pieces that I'm really focused on helping

39:27

business owners with, and I'm pretty much focused

39:30

on that kind of mid six to eight

39:32

figure entrepreneur. What do you

39:34

think from in your experience limits

39:36

people from scaling? Like if someone is in

39:39

that mid six figure mark and they're just

39:41

on this hamster wheel, like I'm not, I'm

39:43

just not reaching business. I'm blocking myself. I

39:45

don't understand why. What are the common

39:47

things that you see that causes that? Well,

39:50

a big one could be the business

39:52

and product strategy that they have. If

39:55

they've not found a good

39:57

way to really scale their

39:59

offering. more, maybe they're still trading

40:01

their time for money, or maybe

40:04

they are not thinking about the

40:06

revenue model the right way so that they

40:08

can actually hit a higher number

40:10

without having to put as much effort into it

40:13

like that hamster really you're talking about. I mean,

40:15

usually I'll start with business strategy because that's a

40:18

big part of it, business slash revenue strategy. And

40:21

honestly, it's interesting too, and maybe this is

40:23

a strength I have on the revenue side

40:25

because I am so in tune

40:28

with that and in tune with the finances of

40:30

the business, but I find that a lot of

40:33

people aren't thinking that way too. And sometimes it's

40:35

just a shift in how they think about

40:37

the revenue model and that can make or

40:39

break their hamster royal situation. So it's

40:41

that, but it's also, you know, maybe there's

40:43

a lack of sophistication and they're behind the scenes

40:45

set up. And so they're having to spend a

40:47

lot of time and effort and energy on things

40:50

that if they were to automate that

40:52

or bring in even a VA, like that could solve

40:54

that problem to them and they could focus elsewhere. So

40:56

a lot of it is on systems and they're back on setup.

40:59

And then honestly, the right team. So I

41:01

find almost like the number one thing I

41:03

hear is I have a such a hard

41:05

time hiring or I'm terrible at hiring or

41:07

I can't get performance out of

41:09

team or I can't trust them to do

41:12

it the way I would. And there's a

41:14

lot of team ink. So it's also helping

41:16

people hire the right people and what to

41:18

be thinking about what roles you actually need

41:20

and streamlining the team that way. What

41:22

do you say then in that situation? Let's say a

41:25

common thing I hear all the time is, you

41:27

know, one does it the way I do. No one does it as good as

41:29

I do. Or I just can't get

41:32

performance. Maybe they're churning through team

41:34

members. Like where would you start with that? So

41:36

I would first start by looking at what

41:38

are, what's the track record? What's

41:40

the history? What are the team members you've been bringing

41:43

on and what have they been doing? What hasn't been

41:45

working so we can do a bit

41:47

of an audit and figure out what's history telling us

41:49

here. And usually you can glean

41:51

some insight from okay, so it's always that

41:54

I'm bringing on social media managers and this is

41:56

a huge problem because they can never do it

41:58

the same way I would. And

42:00

maybe that's true. In fact, it probably is, I

42:02

think it's very difficult to hire a social media

42:05

manager, but maybe the answer is not hiring the

42:07

social media manager. Maybe the answer is hiring people

42:09

for these other pieces in the business and you

42:11

actually stay focused on your social content. So it's

42:13

also in the strategy of how you're bringing a

42:15

team and what you're focused on versus what they're

42:18

focused on. Yeah, I just had

42:20

that conversation this morning actually with an agency

42:22

owner and he was saying, how do you

42:24

think about content? How do you get your

42:26

content going viral and feeling like you're

42:28

proud of what goes out? And one thing I said

42:30

to him was, well, I realized my content is better

42:33

when I have a heavy hand in it. So it's

42:35

less of like, how am I outsourcing all of that?

42:37

But how am I delegating the stuff that I know

42:39

I can delegate out so that I can focus on

42:41

where I'm good at? I think every

42:44

single founder should know the places

42:46

that they excel and where their time should

42:48

be spent. I don't think there's like

42:50

a one size fits all to some business owner. It

42:52

would make no sense for them to do social media

42:55

management. It might be like on the lower rungs of

42:57

what their times were but for

42:59

another founder that might be like the highest

43:01

leverage activity. I think there's a misconception that

43:03

there's high leverage and low leverage activities that

43:06

are the same for every founder. It's so

43:08

different. And the minute I

43:10

learned that and I probably accepted that

43:12

as a founder, things changed for me

43:14

because you're no longer resisting it. You're

43:16

going with it and able

43:18

to craft the role around what actually

43:21

makes sense for you. That is a

43:23

thousand percent true. And I think what

43:26

happens is, you know there's

43:28

so much information out there about

43:30

how you should be running your

43:32

business. And I know there's

43:34

also like people know stay in your lane, stay

43:36

in your lane, but it's hard because you are

43:38

comparing yourself. And that's so common.

43:40

And I think people hear, oh, well I need to

43:42

be hiring this or I should be outsourcing this or

43:44

delegating X, Y or Z. They're just trying to figure

43:46

it out because they also don't know. They've not done

43:48

this before. And it's trial

43:50

and error, but they're following formulas that

43:52

actually aren't right for them. And

43:55

so that's a huge, huge piece of it. What are you really good

43:57

at? And what's going to drive the business and move the needle? that

44:00

is your unique abilities to stay there and

44:02

delegate the other things, even if it's like

44:04

not a traditional thing to delegate. And

44:06

that's okay. Yeah. I think that's

44:08

an absolute game changer. And then even when you're, if

44:10

you're listening to this and you're looking for your right

44:12

hand or thinking about having a right hand in business,

44:15

I think knowing I

44:17

call it the elevate and delegate because it's from

44:19

traction. And knowing that, knowing

44:21

what your superpower is and where your blind

44:24

spots are, I think is the exercise you

44:26

should do before you go and start hiring.

44:28

Because you really want to attract someone that

44:30

has different skills to you. Otherwise,

44:33

if you have two people with the exact

44:35

same skills, you're probably be terrible team. Yeah.

44:37

Oh my gosh. You have to compliment each other. It

44:39

should be like the yin and yang, right? Especially with

44:42

your right hand. And for some people,

44:44

that means they're coming in, but you're a strong

44:46

marketer. You needed somebody that was going to be

44:48

strong with the team and the systems and behind

44:50

the scenes. But there could be another business owner

44:53

who's actually really good on the operation side and

44:55

some are, but marketing is where

44:57

they need help. So they should be bringing in more of

44:59

a CMO type. So, I mean, it really, yes, it really

45:01

depends on what your unique abilities are. Okay.

45:04

I'm going to put you on the spot a little bit here. Cause I

45:06

feel like everyone listening is probably going to want to know the answer to

45:08

this question. Is that like some

45:10

tea you can give on boss babe? Like what is

45:12

it really like behind the scenes or what is Natalie

45:14

really like? What is something people might not know about

45:16

me? Like, is there anything that comes to mind? Cause

45:18

I feel like if I don't ask this, I'm

45:21

just doing my audience to serve. It's like, I'm going to

45:23

be listening to being like, that's what I really wanted to

45:25

know. Oh my gosh. Okay. Wow. Let me think. I

45:28

mean, when it comes to you, Natalie, like honestly,

45:31

I feel like you are the person that before

45:33

I started working at boss babe, that I

45:35

saw on Instagram and on the podcast and

45:37

I don't know, you're not a

45:39

different person behind the scenes. And I know some

45:42

people are to be honest. Okay. That's good. But

45:44

you're not, you're not at all. What would be

45:46

surprising though? Let's see. I don't know if I'm

45:48

surprised by this per se, but something I definitely

45:51

noticed is you're somebody

45:53

that you don't need

45:55

to see all the details of how the

45:57

sausage gets made, you're like, here's my vision.

45:59

Right. get a painting that because you'll bring up your

46:01

decks, you're like, I got to share, you know, you're

46:03

all like, Yeah, you got to share. And then it

46:05

was like, Okay, that's it. So we'll launch in like

46:07

a few weeks. And then I was like, Okay, so

46:09

but that's, that's just, you know, all right, so

46:12

we'll figure it out. And you really weren't super concerned

46:14

with the how a lot of times, it

46:16

was more just like, this is it. And this is what it's going to be.

46:18

And then that's kind of what would happen because

46:20

then we just rally around that we're like, Okay, we'll do

46:22

it. And then of course, you're like, reviewing things here and

46:24

there. But I don't know. So that was

46:26

maybe the thing that I like, think about

46:28

when I think about working with you is how you're like,

46:30

Okay, here's the vision. Okay, bye. See you soon. That's

46:33

such a good call. Because I feel like that's one

46:35

of those things too, that you kind of got to

46:37

know that about yourself. If you're that kind of person,

46:40

and you're looking to hire right hand, like,

46:42

they've got to be interested in figuring out

46:44

the how they've got to be willing to

46:46

go and figure out the how I'm so

46:48

not that person. I'm always like, I trust

46:50

as a way. So let there be a

46:52

way. And honestly, you did like,

46:54

so that was another thing I guess I'll

46:56

call out is that you really do move

46:58

with intuition. That's something I've definitely noticed

47:01

more so than anyone else I've worked

47:03

with. And you just trust. And

47:06

it does work out. So

47:08

there's something like definition of a trustful.

47:10

I'm like, Yeah, I'll jump. Like, I'm almost

47:13

positive as power to attach my back. Let's

47:15

try. I mean, it means

47:17

so far, it's work. So that

47:20

is Yeah, that is a really good call. But again, I

47:22

do think that's something that people need to know. I remember

47:24

when I learned this about myself in university,

47:26

which I feel very, very lucky about because

47:28

we were doing like personality testing. And

47:31

I learned about myself, I'm not a finisher, I'm really

47:33

good at getting things started. I'm not great at getting

47:35

things over the line and like dotting the I's and

47:37

crossing the T's. And learning about

47:39

that myself, I just did a simple personality

47:41

test was so powerful in figuring

47:43

out who my co founders should be or who

47:45

my partner should be who my employees should be.

47:47

Because I knew okay, I need to

47:50

look for someone with a skill to like, they might not

47:52

like getting stuff off the ground in the beginning, but

47:54

they're really good at finishing things. And

47:56

I think those personality tests, I think although

47:59

the Redimer doesn't that. often very, very helpful.

48:01

Yeah. And even for us, we would

48:03

always ask in interviews, their

48:05

personality testing and would start to see

48:07

how they might mesh with the team

48:10

or match with us. I

48:12

think that is a real great hiring

48:14

tip. I agree. And the

48:16

other thing too, I mean, this is

48:18

a little different, but what I

48:21

found really interesting that we did as a team was

48:23

we did our human design together. And

48:25

we reviewed together, we had a facilitator and

48:27

we reviewed together. Everyone's different human design and

48:30

strengths and where they're inclined and what's going

48:32

to drive them crazy and all these things.

48:34

So even, you know, once you're in the

48:36

team or actually in the hiring process too,

48:38

that could be useful. I found

48:40

it to be pretty insightful. Actually, there were

48:42

moments where we were like, Oh my gosh, that's so you,

48:45

like, you know, we were having those moments, but then it

48:47

was also learning moments also, like one thing

48:49

I took away from our relationship working together. Having

48:51

done that exercise was I

48:53

learned that you, it drives

48:56

you crazy to get asked an open-ended

48:58

question versus if I were to

49:00

say, Hey, here's the question. Here's option one, here's

49:03

option two. And you're actually reacting to something like

49:05

that's a much better place for you to be,

49:07

you know, giving your response in that way. So

49:09

just little things like that too, of like the

49:11

working dynamics. I think it really helps to have

49:13

that insight on people. Yeah. Really

49:16

good call. And same what I learned

49:18

about you is you often

49:20

like to sleep on things. You don't love to

49:22

just make really fast decisions. And

49:24

it's so good to know if someone works like

49:26

that because you don't go into a conversation, expecting

49:29

a decision or expecting like their thoughts on something,

49:31

you can pitch something and just because they don't

49:33

give you your thoughts right away, doesn't mean it's

49:35

a bad idea. It means they digest

49:37

information very, very differently. Yeah. Well, and

49:39

that's actually another call out that I

49:42

didn't think of earlier until you said

49:44

this is another observation I

49:46

had in working with you and working

49:48

together is how fast you

49:51

make decisions. Like you make decisions really fast.

49:54

Sometimes I'm like, okay, I'm going to give her something. She's going to

49:56

sleep on this. Like, I don't know. It's a big deal. And then

49:58

you're like, okay, this, we got it. Moving on. But

50:03

that's moving with your gut too, of course, you know, I'm

50:06

like, next. What's next? Yeah, exactly. Yep. Like,

50:09

are you? Well, I'm busy. So

50:14

I want to talk about

50:16

what you're doing next. And also,

50:18

you know, just talk really kind of about whether you

50:20

think anyone listening to the podcast might be a fit

50:22

for what you're doing. Tell me a

50:24

little bit about who your ideal client would

50:26

look like and what you are helping women

50:28

and entrepreneurs with right now, and let's

50:31

see if anyone in the audience is actually looking

50:33

for your support because I mean,

50:35

you supported our business so

50:37

much. I am eternally grateful, especially for the season

50:39

you helped me get through, but just everything you

50:41

did in my business. And you

50:43

also have since consulted with

50:45

one of my closest friends and you and

50:48

I have both seen the message. She said

50:50

you changed her entire business and give her

50:52

faith in hiring and scaling in

50:54

a way that she had never had before.

50:57

I know how magic you are. She knows how magic you

50:59

are. I won't say her name just in case you want

51:01

to keep private. I don't know, but I want

51:03

other people to experience your magic. So tell us a

51:05

little bit about what an

51:07

ideal candidate for working with you might

51:09

look like. Yeah. So, okay. For me,

51:12

it is an entrepreneur and I am

51:14

focused on women. It's a business owner

51:16

that is seeing traction in their business.

51:18

So maybe they are at least

51:20

at that mid six figure mark, if we're going

51:22

to put out numbers, but they're seeing traction in

51:24

their business. They're feeling like they see a

51:27

path. They're seeing success, but they're

51:29

stressed out. Maybe they're overwhelmed. Maybe

51:31

they're feeling like they could

51:34

be scaling more efficiently or smarter. And

51:36

they would like to see more time back

51:39

in their lives, more mental space and mental

51:41

capacity back in their lives. And

51:43

so now they're looking for support in,

51:45

it could be a number of things. They

51:47

might not know. They don't have to know. They can come to me and

51:49

be like, I don't know. I'm overwhelmed or I don't have the time I want

51:51

to have. I don't have the peace of mind. I want to have. I'm

51:54

seeing good sales or, you know, but here's my

51:56

issue. And then I can look at that and

51:58

say, okay, well, here's what I see. Usually,

52:00

I'm pretty good at seeing this pretty quickly.

52:02

And it's usually some combination of their

52:05

behind the scenes setup. Should

52:07

they be bringing on team or how dialed in

52:09

is their team if they have one? And

52:11

what is their business and revenue strategy? And

52:13

are there just shifts that they could be

52:16

making in the revenue strategy that would actually

52:18

allow them to scale faster? So

52:20

that's pretty much my ideal. And those

52:22

women are generally, for me, I think

52:25

the best businesses I can be serving

52:27

right now are either course creator businesses,

52:29

memberships, coaching businesses, people that are in

52:32

a really good position to scale. And

52:35

they're able to sell usually some form

52:37

of knowledge or energetics. Okay.

52:40

And what's the best process if someone

52:42

is thinking that's them? Yeah. So

52:44

I have a website, marisalizan.com. And

52:47

we can put it in the shout outs. And actually, I am

52:50

offering our Boss Babe listeners an

52:52

opportunity to have a free session with

52:54

me. And in that session, what

52:56

I will do is facilitate you through some

52:59

questions that I have an understanding of what's

53:01

going on in the business and maybe what

53:03

the pain points are. And then in the

53:05

session, I'll do some coaching and mentoring and

53:08

walk you out with a plan that could be a

53:10

good action plan for immediately starting to see relief

53:12

on the symptoms that you're feeling. So

53:15

that is something I'm offering

53:17

this particular audience exclusively. And

53:20

what I'll do there is choose

53:22

five listeners that I'll do a strategy

53:24

session with. So what you can do

53:26

to apply for that is just simply

53:28

go to marisalizan.com backslash boss babe, and

53:31

go ahead and fill in your name and email. And I'll

53:33

be in touch and take the rest from there. But

53:36

otherwise on the site, I also have a

53:38

booking of a session, just more of

53:40

a discovery understanding type session. It's

53:43

not quite a strategy session, but it's more for me to

53:45

understand your business and see if there's something that we can

53:47

work together on. I'm also going to

53:49

be launching a mastermind in the spring. And

53:51

that is all for exactly

53:53

this type of woman that I talked about, somebody

53:55

that's seeing traction in their business and wants to

53:58

scale further. And that mastermind. it's gonna

54:00

be all about scaling. I mean, that

54:02

is a no-brainer, you guys. Go and apply for that

54:04

coaching session. That is an absolute no-brainer.

54:06

I also know the power of what you can

54:08

do in an hour. The amount of times I

54:10

have brought things to you that feel so catastrophic

54:12

and you're like, we got this. So that is

54:15

amazing. I'm so excited for

54:17

you, Marisa. And I also, I

54:19

wanna show people too that you

54:21

can be in a career

54:23

and transition out and it can feel really

54:25

good and you can still both support each

54:27

other. Like, you know, that gets

54:29

to be more evidence

54:31

of this, especially with women out in the

54:33

world. And I just really want others to

54:35

see this. And maybe if you are working

54:37

in a company right now and you desire

54:40

to leave, maybe this will instill some confidence

54:42

in you that you can do it in

54:44

a really great way. Yes, yes. I

54:46

mean, cause really it's also mindset

54:48

too. And working together, I

54:51

gained a lot of mindset confidence

54:53

around going out on my own.

54:55

I guess that's a byproduct of working at Boss Babe. But

54:58

really it's all about what are the things you're

55:00

good at helping people with and how can you

55:02

repackage that in different ways? And it could be

55:04

at a full-time job, it could be on your

55:06

own, but it's intrinsically the same things and it's

55:08

just thinking about it in different ways. So I

55:10

appreciate your support. It's been amazing that I could

55:12

just come to you and I knew I could

55:15

and be honest and just explain

55:17

where I'm at in my journey and you

55:19

were super supportive about it. And here we

55:21

are and I'm just eternally grateful. So

55:23

thank you. I'm so excited for you

55:25

and I'm excited for everyone that gets to work

55:27

with you and experience your magic

55:29

firsthand. So marisaleason.com/Boss Babe will put the link

55:32

in the show notes as well so that

55:34

you can click. I think it's a no-brainer

55:36

for everyone to apply for this. It's a

55:38

game changer. And then beyond that, where can

55:41

everyone find you and just follow your journey

55:43

and see what this unfolds? Yeah, so my

55:45

Instagram is at marisaleason. So similar to my

55:47

website and yeah, I'm on there most days.

55:50

So happy to have you follow. Amazing,

55:52

thank you for doing this. Yeah, thank you, Natalie.

55:56

For joining us, we've moved on to

55:58

a great packed full of Thank

56:03

you.