0:00

This is Brandon Kelly, the host of

0:02

Blue Wires new podcast, Golden

0:04

Goals. From

0:08

Lionel Messi to Marta to

0:10

Pelee, our show takes

0:12

a deep dive into soccer superstars.

0:17

Want a welcome for Megan

0:19

Rapino from Zlatan Ibrahimovich's

0:22

brash confidence with the play to back

0:24

it up two Megan Rapinos,

0:26

heroic outspokenness, and World Cup

0:28

Flare. Each episode

0:30

examines a personality of the world's

0:33

game. Will dig into Maradona's

0:35

Hand of God performance and subsequent

0:37

downfall, the teenage

0:39

trio at Dorton that signaled the next

0:41

generation of superstars and

0:44

that infamous headbut that slungs

0:46

in the deansa Dan from Glory,

0:49

Golden Gold soccer Stars

0:52

and the moments that made them premiering

0:54

this summer on Blue Wire, Blue

1:03

Lion, Look

1:05

at that little color, James.

1:10

It's over. It's over. Cleveland

1:12

is a city of champions once again. The

1:14

Cleveland Cavaliers selected Colin

1:17

Sexton, Darius Carland, CaCu,

1:20

Sex ribbons

1:25

don't wear. Do you know what the Cavs fans

1:27

are calling me? Darius Garland,

1:29

Colin Sexton, Backcourt, sex

1:32

Land. Oh that's good. Welcome

1:38

to the Chase Doown podcast, part of the Blue Wire Network.

1:40

I'm your host, Justin Rowan, and with me today

1:42

is my co host Carter Rodriguez. Carter, how's

1:44

it going, buddy? Doing well? Uh? You

1:47

know, I just got just got back from a brisk

1:49

walk. Uh the my

1:51

wife had the baby strapped to her chest. We didn't

1:53

use the stroller. And UM, I

1:56

gotta say I probably taxed Kylie

1:58

with the pace I was at to

2:00

get back in time. So you know that one's on

2:03

me. Um. I misjudged the time

2:05

here, but we made it. We're relatively

2:07

on time. And and for the chasetownd podcast,

2:10

we call that on time. That's pretty good. I

2:12

mean I can relate to Guilie. I I know how

2:14

it feels to be taxed by you. But joining

2:16

us today, we are very excited to welcome back

2:18

friend of the podcast, Kelsey Ruth So from

2:20

the Athletic. How you doing today, Kelsey? I'm

2:23

good. How are you guys? Great?

2:25

It's nice. It's nice. You know, it

2:28

feels like uh, just yesterday

2:30

that you're you became a friend of the pod when

2:33

you uh, when you when you joined us

2:35

the first time very shortly after the week I feel

2:37

we can just jump into it justin because I

2:39

was we were sitting talking about what we want to talk about

2:41

today, and I was like, you know, the last time you joined

2:44

us, I think you were like six days into your

2:46

tenure with the team, and

2:48

now you've got a season on your belt. What's what's

2:51

kind of the thing that you've learned

2:53

or that surprised you. What's been your biggest takeaway after

2:55

when year covering this team? Yeah, Um,

2:58

I think the biggest takeaway is like

3:01

to never expect anything because

3:03

so much happened this year, and

3:05

like that's not a bad thing, just like to never

3:08

like there's so much unexpected things that can happen,

3:10

and like things changed so fast,

3:13

So just kind of being able to adjust on

3:15

the fly and being able to just kind

3:17

of roll with whatever happens. Ums.

3:20

It was definitely the biggest takeaway because there was multiple

3:22

times where I was like, I don't know

3:24

what's happening, Like my head spinning, there's

3:26

so many things going on. Um, But

3:29

like just being able to roll with it and just

3:31

kind of work through it, I think was the biggest

3:33

thing that I figured out of Like that's just kind

3:36

of how these beats work and you just gotta beats.

3:43

It was funny because I was catching up

3:45

just as a refresher. I listened to bits

3:47

of the podcast and we basically said, well,

3:50

you know, the Cows historically at least

3:52

are always interesting. They might not always

3:54

be good, but they are interesting and that

3:57

is certainly the case. That was definitely

3:59

the case this path season. And um,

4:01

I one thing I want to get

4:03

into when it comes to the Calves is we

4:06

we've heard recently that they are pushing

4:09

um one of the teams pushing

4:11

for kind of a delete a bubble.

4:13

Have you got any sense from the team

4:16

kind of what they are hoping to get

4:18

out of that experience if they

4:20

do in fact play some games before next season.

4:23

Yeah, I feel like the biggest thing for

4:26

them is like just being able to work with

4:28

the young guys, because like, especially

4:30

with like how much happened this year, it sort

4:32

of took away from the developmental

4:35

factor for guys like Darius and

4:37

Colin and Kevin Porter, and

4:39

so like being able to get back in the gym

4:42

with them in the sense of that like they can run scrimmages,

4:44

or they can run drills with multiple guys, they

4:47

can play games. You know against

4:49

other teams in this kind of second bubble

4:52

is the best thing for the youth um

4:54

and I think that's kind of where their mindset is out of like

4:57

they that's where they need to see the biggest

4:59

growth, and I think they're aware of, like going

5:02

into next season, that's their main focuses

5:04

of working with the young guys. So being

5:06

able to be back in that scenario, even

5:08

if it's for a short time, kind of gives that opportunity

5:12

to get back in the gym a little bit with them, work

5:14

with them, work on some different little things they're

5:16

focusing on, like individually,

5:19

and then kind of collectively, and then

5:22

you know, just kind of keep progressing because

5:24

like going eight months, I mean for any

5:26

of them obviously is going to be really hard, but especially

5:28

I feel like for like Darius and

5:30

Kevin Porter Jr. And like even Colin and

5:33

Dylan Windler, like to a extent

5:36

of just like you're so young in the league, like

5:38

you kind of need as much time as you possibly

5:41

can. Yeah, I remember, well,

5:43

I'm stupid. So when I first heard

5:45

about the lead eight bubble proposal,

5:48

my first instinct was like most stupid

5:51

people's, which was, you know why the hell

5:53

do they need a bubble for these teams?

5:55

That sucked. And it really doesn't take long

5:57

till you get to the idea that you know, playing

6:00

time for these young teams is the number one path

6:03

to development. And uh you

6:05

know, I I justin uh KPJ

6:08

uh got aroused

6:10

our attention, among other things, with

6:12

a post on Instagram reasonably a little mixtape

6:15

and uh like I feel like, uh

6:18

yeah, and you tweeted something along the lines of like, we're

6:20

feeling like robbed of the fact that we didn't

6:23

get late season KPJ. And I think

6:25

that's really the biggest thing. Just eight months is just too long,

6:28

Yeah, especially from a player development

6:31

standpoint, Like, and it

6:33

causes me to go crazy and get

6:35

excited about open gym videos. And I'm

6:38

like, as much as I will allow myself

6:40

to get excited about that stuff, I also recognize

6:42

that I'm a crazy person when I get overly

6:45

excited about that. One thing I've

6:47

kind of thought about when thinking about

6:50

either let's say, delete a bubble

6:52

or if they're able to have a mini camp,

6:54

because I think those are kind of the two things

6:57

those teams that are outside of the bubble have

6:59

pushed or one of them has

7:01

been that you would give the Calves

7:03

an opportunity to look at the young players,

7:06

um how they progress after

7:09

what is effectively an off season before

7:11

they even draft. Has that been something

7:13

that you you've heard it all from the organization

7:15

where it might have like, let's

7:18

say, after all this time off Garland

7:21

for junior Sexton all kind of have

7:24

their own levels of growth. Do do you think that that's

7:26

something that they would factor into the draft

7:28

process. Has that been something that they've brought

7:30

up at all? I personally

7:32

I have not heard that, But that's a really good

7:35

point. I mean, you know, they talk about

7:37

growth and you want to see growth, and especially

7:40

with you know, this year's draft, with it being

7:42

so guard heavy, you know they see

7:45

that growth that they're looking for it. I

7:47

mean, I wouldn't be surprised if it did.

7:49

You know. It's kind of those things of like, yeah,

7:52

if you're if they're at a certain point, you're like, okay,

7:54

well maybe then they just kind of like how they're

7:56

approaching the draft. Yeah,

7:58

that's a really good good point. I hadn't

8:00

third of so I'm not I'm not sure, but

8:03

it feels like it feels like the only silver

8:05

lining with with this whole situation, Like

8:07

it's basically, as far as I know, it's an

8:10

unprecedented situation where you get to

8:12

see what your guys look like after an

8:14

off season before you even draft someone, especially

8:17

too with you know, like Darius being out so much

8:19

last offseason after they drafted him, you know, like

8:21

being able to get back in the gym with him and see how

8:24

he's progressed. You know, like all right, you know,

8:26

then now you can kind of continue to make

8:28

some decisions on what to

8:30

do with your young guys, where to go with the draft,

8:33

you know, kind of just how it might affect just kind

8:35

of everything down the line. So I wouldn't that

8:37

that wouldn't be shocking to me to hear that, you know, just

8:40

but I haven't personally heard it. That makes sense, I

8:43

don't. I don't remember when is the draft lottery

8:45

again? Okay,

8:50

so they'll know, and then the draft isn't until

8:53

like October, I think like October

8:56

eighteenth or something, let's call mid October. So

8:58

so conceivably, if the bub well if the de leade

9:00

a bubble does happen, they should be able to get

9:03

their hands on some of these guys. Um and

9:05

actually watch see how they've developed. I

9:08

don't know, it's it's a really interesting. Um

9:10

it's a really interesting state for the team to

9:12

be in. And I have you gotten

9:15

any sense of kind of where

9:17

how they're feeling internally about these prospects

9:20

right now and whether they are

9:22

willing to kind of go

9:24

outside, you know, go draft for fit

9:26

as opposed to best player because they

9:29

they like a KPJ or a Garland

9:31

or a Sexton. Yeah, I think

9:33

there's like it's still not

9:36

really early, but a little bit early where there's still

9:38

there's still a lot of evaluating, and especially

9:40

because like some of those big opportunities

9:42

where they would have gotten to see you

9:44

know, draft prospects aren't there, but

9:47

they this time has been really useful

9:49

to kind of involve everybody and be able to talk about

9:52

you know, guys and evaluate. Like um

9:55

j B said back in June, you

9:57

know that he's been involved a little bit more. It's

10:00

still obviously left up a lot to the front office,

10:02

but he's still kind of involved. Like his voice

10:04

is in there. You know, they're there. I'm sure they're all talking everything.

10:07

And my feel like, especially

10:10

with where this team is at, you

10:12

still kind of have to draft best

10:14

player available just because

10:17

of where they are in the rebuild. You know, it's

10:20

the draft is sometimes I feel like for them especially

10:22

is more of like um just kind of

10:24

like acquiring assets, like acquiring

10:27

talent and kind of going from there versus

10:29

then like you know, free agency, even

10:31

though they don't have much cap space and they don't

10:33

have it like a lot of room, um you

10:36

would, that's kind of where you go a little bit more positional

10:39

fit. But there's also the opportunity,

10:41

depending on you know, where they end up in the draft lottery,

10:44

you kind of could sort of get best of both.

10:47

It's just sort of depends. But I think from

10:50

like it just seems like they're they'll probably still

10:52

go best player available. But again,

10:54

you know, it's like one of those things that things could

10:56

change. You never exactly know,

10:58

but that seems to kind of be the mindset. The

11:01

thing that I always think is interesting with the draft

11:03

is like, on one hand, yeah, you can say

11:05

you're gonna go for for fit or

11:08

uh, you know, like you can

11:11

think like, Okay, we're comfortable with our guards. But

11:13

as you get closer and closer like these these people,

11:15

these uh front office people there, people

11:18

there, they fall in love with prospects and we

11:20

don't know who. Like I mean, I don't

11:22

know if if you heard anything, Kelsey, but right now,

11:25

you know, you hear some ball talk, you hear some

11:27

Wiseman talk, but we

11:29

don't really know who this draft, who

11:32

in this draft this front office has fallen in love with yet

11:34

and that kind of when that happens,

11:37

so a lot of your processes get thrown out the window,

11:39

right Yeah. Yeah, No,

11:41

I haven't personally heard like anybody specific

11:44

yet. Um, but again that's still kind

11:46

of one of the areas I'm working on, you

11:48

know this this to go back

11:50

to this kind of sucked as well for me

11:52

of like it kind of I was

11:55

like killd the relationships, you know, getting in there

11:57

with the guys and like getting to know people, and so

12:00

I was like, man, I was making some good progress

12:02

and then it's just like cut it off. And I was like, all

12:05

right, well, it's okay, We're just we're

12:07

making you we're figuring it out. But yeah,

12:09

so I'm still a little bit you know, like

12:12

figuring that out, like that side of it out

12:14

as well throughout this whole Yeah,

12:17

and it certainly doesn't help, Like the cows

12:20

typically operate there. They're a little tight lipped

12:22

when it comes to information, and then

12:24

when things get out sometimes it makes

12:26

me think, Okay, well, what's the reasoning behind that?

12:29

Like I know we've talked to UH from

12:31

the podcast having Damn we're all about kind

12:33

of some of the talk of

12:35

ball being at the top of their list, and that

12:38

maybe because other teams have them at

12:40

the top of their list and they're going to look at trade options.

12:42

Like there's so many things and ways

12:45

that this can go. It will be fascinating

12:47

to see what they do because as much as you want

12:49

to take best player available, you also want

12:51

to draft a guy that you feel confident

12:54

in your ability to bring them to their

12:56

ceiling. Now, one question,

12:59

UM, I do to ask because I'm a

13:01

crazy person and this is one of my obsessions.

13:03

UH, And I think it's important to team building.

13:06

How how tall is Kevin Porter Jr.

13:10

And I don't and let it let us

13:12

be very clear here, we are not interested

13:14

in his official listed height. Yeah, I don't

13:17

care that we were looking for a ballpark

13:19

when he's on the floor, what what what would

13:22

you get? Because because I think Tristan

13:24

said that he was six seven or six eight

13:26

at one point, and like if he is

13:28

actually small forward size, that all of a sudden

13:31

makes things make a little bit more sense

13:33

because he's listening to six four, but we really

13:35

want him to be six seven four. Okay,

13:37

we'll go he's listening to six four. You know your

13:41

reaction is encouraging to me because it makes

13:43

it seem as outlandish as it feels.

13:45

Well, this is a problem too, Like I'm also kind of short,

13:47

so they all really taller than me, like no matter

13:50

why they all are like up here and I'm

13:52

just like hello, Like down

13:54

here, I'm like I'm five six, so I'm not like

13:56

not that that's pretty tall

13:58

for again, yeah, but compared to

14:01

all of them, it's there's like a major gap

14:03

difference, like just across the board.

14:05

So so if you stand an

14:07

extra Tristan, is it like yeah,

14:13

I'm trying to think. Okay. Also though, like

14:15

his hair also makes a difference, like when he was

14:18

here and it's also been four

14:20

months, right, he's

14:22

seven three with hair exactly.

14:25

That's a great question. I don't know. I yeah,

14:28

I don't, I don't. I don't know. If I'm like, well this

14:31

is so, then so because you

14:33

have access that we don't have UM. Once

14:35

the world gets normal again, UM training

14:38

camp, heading into the delete

14:40

eight, we're gonna need a direct

14:43

report you

14:45

if you gotta get it, If you gotta go, get a

14:47

couple of yardsticks, that's

14:50

a good idea. Whatever gets us up the mountain.

14:52

He'll he'll understand. He seems like a cool guy. Yeah,

14:55

yeah, it maybe maybe just a little

14:57

bit uncomfortable as you you walk up

15:00

and you go with the marker on the door frame. Oh,

15:02

you haven't seen him out a couple of months. It's a good icebreaker,

15:05

exactly. Yeah, just just checking how tall

15:07

you are? Yeah, cur out of curiosity.

15:10

What has been the level of access you guys have

15:12

been getting, um, Because obviously Justin and I

15:14

are in the realm of unimportant

15:17

pundits, so we don't get we don't

15:19

get good access. But what kind of access

15:21

have you had to the team, um during

15:24

this during the pandemic.

15:27

Yeah, so basically

15:29

leading up like when it when it started,

15:31

and probably up to the middle of June when

15:33

they decided officially that you know, two

15:36

teams were going and like the cows were going to be left out.

15:39

Um, we were having UM some

15:41

zoom calls kind of pretty regularly

15:44

um with either JB or

15:46

players, and it kind of just um switched

15:48

off and on and like we could like

15:51

Chris fedor I could like ask you

15:53

know about talking to people. Um,

15:56

and that was really nice, like just being able to have like

15:59

it. Like I think we talked to Dr

16:01

Larry Nance, Junior, Tristan Um,

16:05

Kevin Love, Colin, and JV.

16:07

And we talked to JV a couple of times, so

16:09

they were kind of like spread out over

16:11

like like once a week sort of so

16:14

um. And then kind of from there,

16:16

like if I was working on something specific, I reached

16:18

out, you know and and requested

16:21

if I could talk to somebody and like did

16:23

some things. So um. But kind of once

16:25

they like decided like who was going

16:27

to Orlando and who wasn't, that

16:30

was like the official start of their off season, and

16:32

that's when kind of things get quieter on their end.

16:35

So there's not really anything. There's not things

16:37

like scheduled. But because I still

16:40

and like writing stuff and like working

16:42

on stories, I've been like talking

16:44

with PR about setting things up and working around

16:47

around that. So but um,

16:49

that's kind of where like it's that there's something officially

16:51

set up, so it's just kind of like if you need

16:53

it, they'll they'll work on it kind

16:55

of thing. Yeah, I'm sure, I'm

16:58

sure. It's quite the it's got to

17:00

be so different, you know. I I was

17:02

a fake journalist once. Um, and

17:05

uh, you know, like it's it's it's

17:07

got to be wildly different over a zoom call or

17:09

a phone call to like trying to get worthwhile

17:12

information. Like they can duck you pretty easy

17:15

if if they want to. Yeah, yeah, it's

17:17

funny. It's like on the zoom calls, it's like everybody

17:19

like puts in like that that they have

17:21

a question. So it's like you just kind of go, you get

17:23

called on. So it's just kind of it's very

17:25

diplomatic, you know, it's very just kind of

17:27

like in order. But it has been

17:30

really nice, Like I have been really appreciate that they've

17:32

done them, because you know, some teams weren't

17:34

doing anything, which makes it really hard to cover

17:36

a team. So it has been really nice

17:38

like to just kind of you know, because

17:40

people are curious, like what have they been doing in

17:43

quarantine, Like what's happening? You know, So

17:45

it's been cool to be able to just have those check

17:47

ins and you know, yeah, it's probably was

17:50

it like monumental stuff like oh, I'm

17:52

you know, working out or I'm stay easy,

17:54

but like being able to just still

17:57

do that and kind of remind people that

17:59

they are people to you know, their humans are

18:01

going through things. They're working through this pandemic

18:03

as well. You know, it was cool to

18:05

be able to do. Have

18:08

you got the impression that, uh, these

18:10

guys want to come back um prior

18:12

to the next season starting. I'm sure it's got to be mixed

18:15

even within the team, you know, like the young

18:17

guys, I'm sure maybe a little bit hungrier

18:19

to get out there. Like what's been the impression you've gotten

18:21

from guys that you've talked to? Yeah, I think

18:24

from definitely from the younger guys, there seems to be

18:26

more like a more want to go back.

18:28

And it's not that the vets I don't,

18:31

but there's just kind of the

18:34

less d it, right, Yeah,

18:36

and the and there's not there's not as much value

18:38

to it because you know, they're kind of set in

18:40

their careers and what they do and kind

18:42

of how they operate versus the young guys are still

18:45

learning and developing, um, but

18:47

they seem pretty I mean there seems

18:50

to be like a want to come back from like especially

18:52

the younger guys as well. I'm

18:55

very, very curious to see when the next time

18:57

we get to see this team is because I mean,

19:00

as I said, I'm absolutely starved for

19:02

content and um with sports

19:04

coming back like its just I feel

19:07

like I'm missing out on it more now that there's

19:09

actual other teams coming back is

19:11

just driving me crazy. And you know, with

19:14

sports coming back, you know what else

19:16

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I try I dry my best, so

20:02

getting back to Kevin Porter Jr. Because we we've

20:05

done our obligated height watch

20:08

segment. But it does seem like

20:11

a lot of the messaging that's come from the team

20:13

is that they view him as their highest

20:16

upside guy, which is certainly

20:18

interesting, especially like at this

20:20

point, I think you can look at what Colin Sexton

20:23

has done and it's definitely

20:25

fair to say that he has the highest floor out of anyone

20:28

like who he currently is, even if

20:30

there's just like modest improvement

20:32

from this point out. The worst case scenario

20:35

that that is kind of like an electric

20:37

sixth man coming off the bench, Like that's someone that any

20:39

team really could use. Um, what

20:42

what do you think is kind of the driving

20:44

force behind the Cavs belief in KPJ

20:47

to be kind of the the cornerstone piece.

20:51

It's a good question, Um. I think is

20:53

like, you know, this

20:56

year kind of started off a little like shaky

20:58

form, and then he kind of loaded,

21:00

you know, and he kind of really found his his

21:03

place and just how he really he fits.

21:06

And I think what's honestly going to be interesting is

21:08

like something that like JB talked about

21:11

before the season, like when on

21:14

hiatus. Um, it

21:16

was the fact that you know, they were kind of like he

21:18

wanted to use that last straits of games to kind

21:21

of experiment and like see if like

21:23

KP can like move to play

21:26

more of the two or like, you know, like just where he

21:28

fits. You know, he fits very well the three,

21:30

but like just kind of experiment because they

21:33

hadn't really done a whole lot of that and kind of why

21:35

not experiments see where the best fit,

21:37

the best combos that fit together. Um.

21:40

But I think, you know, Kevin Porter

21:43

really showed just like how versatile

21:46

he can be and like he can be explosive

21:48

on both ends, and that that he's just a really

21:50

good, like all around player and can

21:52

be a good two way player, which is like kind of something

21:54

they need of, especially because they're lacking about defense

21:57

and I think that end

21:59

of the floor to be charitable, yeah,

22:01

and like but so like him showing

22:04

that side of him, I think just

22:06

kind of increase his upside and like just kind

22:08

of show that Okay, yeah, we had

22:10

this kind of one vision for him on

22:13

the offensive end, but being being able to

22:15

do both is just kind of the

22:18

best of both worlds honestly, and so I

22:20

think for him, honestly,

22:22

the like going back and having

22:25

like a little mini camp whatever would be the best because

22:27

they can experiment, they can kind of continue

22:30

to see, you know, just his fit

22:32

and where where they want him to be and

22:34

just kind of continue to grow. Um.

22:37

But I do definitely think there is a good you know, there's

22:39

a really good feeling about him, just because of what he

22:41

was able to show, especially when like jab

22:44

took over. Yeah, I think what's

22:46

interesting with him is that ultimately he

22:48

doesn't force you to make a lot of concessions

22:51

and how you build your team and me

22:53

maybe you want someone who's a bit more of a of

22:56

a creator, um and a guy you gets

22:58

into your SATs. I mean, I think the up data bore

23:01

that out that, uh, the pairing with Darius

23:03

was a lot better than the bearing with Sexton

23:05

because both Sexton and KPJ

23:08

are more bucket getters. But defensively,

23:10

he's a little bit easier to slot in. I

23:12

am really interested by the fact that it seems

23:15

like the team has really embraced KPJ. And

23:18

you know, Darius had a tough rookie season. I think

23:20

you know by by most of the numbers. UM,

23:23

what's kind of your sense of how

23:26

how this team is viewing Darius

23:28

right now, because you know, normally, just by

23:30

the pedigree of being the fifth overall pick

23:32

as opposed to thet Darius would

23:34

be the one getting the shine. Um, But

23:37

that it feels like Kevin is really getting a lot

23:40

of flood from the organization right now. How do they feeling about

23:42

Darius. I don't think it's

23:44

changed, honestly. I think you kind of take

23:46

into consideration of like everything

23:49

that happened this year, you know, and um,

23:52

like his injury, Like you're still coming

23:54

back from an injury, you know. I think we

23:56

probably didn't notice it or it didn't

23:58

come out as much as maybe was really affecting

24:01

him. Um. But you know, you're

24:03

kind of like coming into a new organization

24:05

and then all the chaos this year, you know, you can never

24:08

really get settled. And I think, like sometimes

24:11

which I didn't realize really at first,

24:13

but kind of was talking to people like

24:15

just how much when there's chaos,

24:17

it how it it affects the season,

24:20

and so you know, you can never really find

24:22

your way. And so I think, you

24:25

know, I don't like I don't want to. I think, yes

24:27

he had, especially when you look at the numbers, he didn't

24:29

have a good rookie season. But I feel like there's

24:31

a little bit of like a of room

24:33

there to the kind of just be like, well,

24:36

like, yeah, there was a lot that happened though this year,

24:38

especially coming back from you know,

24:41

from an injury, didn't really play in Summer league,

24:43

like just kind of then that injury during

24:46

training camp, you know, the foot injury. So you're

24:48

just kind of there was just all these things that just added

24:51

up and then you know, all the turmoil and everything,

24:53

and there was just like never really a smooth transition

24:56

into an NBA season. Plus you're playing

24:59

at one of the most like arguably

25:01

the best position in the league. You know, you're facing

25:04

guys like every single night that are

25:06

just the top certainly the deepest position, right

25:09

yeah, and like you're facing guys like

25:11

every night that are just you

25:14

know, obviously have been the league for a while, and

25:16

like you're figuring it out. So I

25:19

think there's more hope that you know,

25:21

okay, like there's an off season now, there's

25:23

time to work. There's a little bit of stability

25:26

because j V is on his coach, you

25:28

know, so there's not a change there,

25:31

and there's just kind of gonna be a little bit more

25:33

consistency going into next season and

25:36

then you can kind of evaluate kind

25:38

of as it continues. Yeah. Yeah,

25:41

Justin accuses me of being too mean to Darius,

25:43

and perhaps and perhaps I am.

25:45

I don't know, but I do think like there's

25:48

a lot of mitigating factors. You're

25:51

correct, Like he didn't have a

25:54

great offseason to to get ramped

25:57

up. He had. He plays the toughest

25:59

position in the league, UM in

26:01

terms of like young guards always

26:03

always suck, and when they don't, it's a huge

26:06

surprise. UM. And the

26:08

fact that you know he did show flashes,

26:11

I mean on the stream right now, we've got highlights

26:13

from the game against the Nuggets, which I think was probably his

26:15

best game of the season. UM. And

26:18

you know, he shows the wiggle, he shows

26:20

the touch, and he adds better

26:23

vision than I think most of us thought he was

26:25

going to have UM coming into

26:27

the season. So it's funny for a guy whose

26:29

number is very rarely reflected it. I do

26:32

think there are signs there that, you

26:34

know, if if anyone feels

26:36

leap worthy. It seems like He's someone

26:38

who can do it if he just bulks up a bit,

26:40

adds a bit of strength and just kind

26:43

of who gets used to

26:46

NBA defenses and running an NBA offense

26:48

just a little bit more. Mhm, yeah,

26:51

I mean, you look at it. In the last two months

26:53

of the year, the guy was averaging over five

26:55

assists a game. I think if

26:57

he was able to sustain that, and that

26:59

was kind of a like if you saw

27:02

that post All Star break run. If they actually had

27:04

those games and he sustained that, it wouldn't

27:06

be that much of a leap for him to get

27:08

up to like six or seven the following

27:10

year. Like the other tricky thing

27:12

with Garland and I

27:16

I completely understand where people are coming

27:18

from when they talk about the Cavs team

27:20

building and people mentioned Sexton

27:22

moving to the bench when at this point

27:25

he is so much more productive than Kevin

27:27

Port Jr. Or Darius Garland. But

27:30

it's kind of funny when you're you're looking at team

27:32

building and if the team truly

27:34

views KPJ As the guy they

27:37

want to build around it, at least out of who's

27:39

currently on the roster. The difference

27:41

in effectiveness of the pairing of

27:43

Garland and Kevin Porter Jr. Compared

27:45

to Sexton. It's dramatic.

27:48

Like for the season, it was only a negative

27:50

two point to net rating when Garland and

27:52

Porter Jr. Shared the floor without Sexton,

27:55

uh, whereas Sexton and KPJ

27:57

was minus sixteen and then they were minus twenty

27:59

six when all three you were together. So

28:02

it's really I know what the team

28:05

does is going to be based on how they develop,

28:07

but the fact that the

28:09

lineup data is so dramatic. If

28:12

that continues next year, it could put the

28:14

team in a pretty awkward position. And

28:17

I think it's like one of those things of like where

28:20

when when they talked about kind of wanting

28:22

to look at combinations and kind of just look

28:25

at different lineups and different pairing

28:27

different guys together, that could have been

28:30

one of the things they were talking about, you know, and just kind

28:32

of looking at who fits well together, Like

28:34

how did they how do they be

28:36

the most successful with these guys because

28:38

like obviously they all have talent, you

28:41

know, individually, it's just kind of finding the best

28:43

pairings together. And I think that's part of it. Of

28:45

like, then there's nothing wrong

28:47

with all any like the three of them, you know,

28:49

it's just kind of figuring out who fits

28:51

well together and how you move

28:54

forward to run your offense to like

28:56

not have or like limit

28:58

the amount of defensive inefficiency.

29:01

Um, But there's just like different things I think you can

29:03

still evaluate and like, yeah, I think it's

29:05

one of those things that they could have maybe messed

29:08

with the lineups and seeing more of Darius and

29:10

keep J together or like calling

29:13

and keep J like even just like trying things

29:15

out, you know, like why not just like I don't

29:17

know, mess with things into see it's

29:19

very early in their careers. Like there's just so much

29:21

opportunity for them to work things out. And like

29:24

I've talked about a million times, but how

29:27

we discussed calling sex and changes

29:29

dramatically if he starts showing

29:31

growth on the defensive end, because he certainly has the

29:34

wingspan to do that. And I'm sure

29:36

you can speak to this, but I'm sure it's a point of

29:38

emphasis with the team because if he recognizes

29:41

his potential, all of a sudden makes it a whole

29:43

lot easier to um keep

29:45

them in the starting lineup long term, to

29:48

put him with Garland and Kevin Porter Jr.

29:50

Like that that's not something that we necessarily

29:52

should rule out at this point. Um,

29:55

it's going to be really interesting to see where

29:57

he directs his energy because the

30:00

work ethic of sex. And I don't think anyone can deny,

30:02

right, you know, yeah, it's it's it's not possible.

30:05

Like you just see, like though he puts

30:07

in so much every and he cares so much, and I think

30:09

that is everybody is aware of

30:11

that and you and like just seeing how

30:14

you know, we kind of explode it offensively, especially

30:17

when JB took over, and like, yeah,

30:19

you want to see that growth, especially as the season goes

30:21

on. But like I think that's very

30:23

telling as well. But there they

30:25

have to figure out and that's part

30:27

of growing. Like it's not nobody's perfect, but

30:29

it's like part of figuring out, Okay, now,

30:31

how do we use that speed and like

30:34

on the defensive end or find a way to kind

30:36

of combat that missing link

30:38

a little bit with like if they bring in a wing,

30:41

you know that can fill that like a little bit

30:43

with some height. You know, there's just kind of different things you can figure

30:45

out. But yeah, I there's no denying

30:48

that one. The improvement he made and just how

30:50

explosed if he was especially like

30:52

in that last stretch. Do you

30:54

feel like, I mean you you're around the

30:56

guy a lot more than we are, which

30:59

is never And do

31:02

you do you get the impression that this is someone

31:04

who if the Cavs decided to say, hey, we

31:07

looked at our lineup data Um Garland

31:10

and KPJ their lineup, they

31:12

played really really well together, we'd like to come

31:14

off the bench. Is you think that's something that the

31:16

guy like that's gonna be receptive to,

31:19

because yeah, he's a really hard worker, but he

31:21

also thinks very highly of his game. I get

31:23

the impression, do you do you feel like that that

31:25

could that's going to be a landline they're gonna

31:27

have to, you know, Dodge. Good

31:30

question. Actually, somebody asked me that when I did a Q

31:33

and A last week on the athletics site,

31:36

and I was like, I don't know, Like, I'm, um,

31:42

yeah, I'm really not sure. I mean because

31:45

like, yeah, I mean, like you said, like I talked to him all the

31:48

time, like when we're in the locker room and everything,

31:50

just like one about stories, but

31:52

also just like just chatting um

31:55

about life and everything. But I'm yeah,

31:57

I'm not positive. I'm I'm curious.

31:59

I'm mean, because part of it's like, you know, you

32:02

want the best for the team, So like

32:04

if that's what they see, like okay, obviously

32:06

it would be disappointing, but like, if

32:08

that's how they see it going, then then

32:10

the next thing you do is you just prove them wrong or

32:14

you're like, I don't know, Yeah, I'm curious,

32:16

I'm I'm not sure. It's

32:19

I mean, it's tricky, Like I find myself getting

32:22

caught on this all the time because if you like,

32:25

I feel like if Colin Sexton was doing

32:27

this in a Lakers uniform, like let's say it was

32:29

that air the five years where um

32:32

it were bad or however many years it was,

32:35

if he was putting up basically like since

32:37

Clarkson got traded, it was like four

32:39

points per game efficiently, if he was

32:42

doing that at twenty years old, like the league

32:44

would be taking notice and there would

32:46

be less of discussion about fit because at

32:48

this point the cast focus is

32:51

purely player development. So um,

32:53

when you see that, it's okay,

32:56

he's doing all these things. Yes, he's having

32:58

issues turning it into him pact, but

33:01

a player that talented normally you

33:03

kind of see a little bit of warmer

33:05

reception and kind of working

33:08

to find ways to to factor

33:10

him into the line of versus moving

33:12

him to the bench. Yeah.

33:16

No, I totally I totally agree. And I think

33:18

that's I mean part of it. You

33:20

know, they talked about, we talked about so much

33:22

about the second half the season. I've

33:24

always been like, you know, he consistently puts up twenty

33:26

points, like that can't be forgotten and

33:30

and I think that's that's a really good thing

33:32

to just kind of continually keep in mind like he is,

33:35

he was consistently putting up at least twenty

33:37

points and just kind of being

33:39

that, you know, just kind of exploding.

33:41

And so yeah, I don't know, it's

33:44

just kind of of those things of like, you know, is

33:46

it because of where the calves are? That that

33:49

that that why this is so much of the conversation

33:51

versus I don't know, like whatever

33:54

other reasons, but it's just kind of like it's just an

33:56

interesting thing to think about. I think. I

33:58

think, I think ultimately what it is is we

34:00

have a really hard time as sports

34:02

fans changing our mind about how something

34:05

is supposed to go and how

34:08

quick after he was drafted, justin

34:10

what are we saying, Yeah, but eventually he could be a six

34:12

man. Yeah that you

34:14

know, that's true. Like I'm

34:16

working on because like you

34:19

kind of have to have strong opinions when you're

34:21

doing a podcast, and like I do not know

34:23

draft the draft very well, and that's why

34:26

we typically bring on experts, and I usually

34:28

developed strong opinions based on their opinions.

34:31

Um, and feel pretty pretty

34:33

flimsy. Yeah, yeah, I mean

34:35

I'm pretty malleable. Like if

34:37

a guy starts playing well for my favorite team,

34:39

I'm going to I'm gonna be all

34:41

over because I I care more about the cast

34:44

figuring it out than I do being right

34:46

or wrong and sex and is just he's

34:48

a tough guy to project because like, coming in,

34:50

it's okay, this is a um

34:53

kind of pick and roll point guard that doesn't really

34:55

shoot well, but he played good defense at

34:57

Alabama. UM, and then he just

35:00

turned out to be a totally different player than kind

35:02

of projected. And UM, it's

35:05

just difficult to have team building conversations

35:07

because you don't know where

35:10

he's going to go, Like you don't know how

35:12

much he can grow on defense or what

35:15

the next version of Sexton is going to be. Even

35:18

months a month, they can change pretty dramatically.

35:21

Well, I think too, especially because like you know,

35:23

when you know he came in, they drafted

35:25

him to play him his point guard, and then they

35:27

drafted Darius and then they moved him over to shooting guards.

35:30

So it was like in his two years he played

35:32

two different positions, and like, yes, do they have similarities

35:35

obviously, but like you kind of have to

35:37

switch mindsets a little bit. You kind of have to like move

35:40

to be and like, Okay, I'm playing off ball. I'm

35:42

not doing the things I was doing while

35:44

running, like running the offense, And so I think

35:47

that's also part of the conversation that sometimes

35:50

you know, even I've forgotten about You're

35:52

like, oh, wait, he didn't play there last year

35:54

at the time. You know, like there's just things

35:56

about it where it's like, you

35:59

know, there's out like there's just so much development

36:01

and even from year one to year two or just

36:04

so many things that change that he

36:06

is kind of hard to projective like what, like how

36:10

what he's going to do because he

36:13

has just like he's just changed so much,

36:15

which is not a bad thing in the slightness.

36:17

It's one of those things of like right

36:21

exactly, Yeah, it's just like I don't know where he's

36:23

gonna go because I just I don't know. We

36:26

We've spent a lot of time to about the young guys, but

36:28

I think before we we let you go, I

36:30

wanted to kind of talk about the vets on that seam, um,

36:33

specifically Andre Drumman Kevin Love, two

36:36

dudes who are at least locked in for next

36:38

year. Uh. The Drummond will hit free

36:40

agency after that and uh, you

36:43

know Love just I think both will probably

36:45

be the target of trade rumors at some point or another.

36:47

Have you gotten a sense of kind of where

36:50

those guys are in their headspace? I'm sure

36:52

Love was hoping to be traded and then he wasn't,

36:54

but at least put on the public

36:57

fit, uh face of being kind

36:59

of the good soldier. Um. Kind

37:01

of where where where do you think those guys heads

37:04

are at in terms of how they're feeling about

37:06

next season and uh kind

37:09

of remaining in this organization. Yeah,

37:12

Um, we talked actually got talked to Kevin

37:15

back in June kind of as a final exit

37:17

interview, UM, and

37:20

very much like kind of a similar mindset

37:23

than some of the young guys, just kind of seeing of like he

37:26

saw what they were what they did under JB

37:28

and that last stretch and was like I saw

37:30

the momentum, saw the buildings, saw like the

37:33

just kind of that like chemistry and

37:36

just flow, you know, and and was excited

37:38

about where they were going. So it was like a bout. He

37:40

was obviously bummed that it like the season got cut

37:42

short because you know, now you don't have that

37:44

and you were building off that momentum. So you

37:47

know, they've been kind of working to do what they can to keep

37:49

it going in this offseason to

37:51

then lead into next year because like

37:54

that's such a big part of it of They're like that momentum

37:56

was getting them places. And yeah, I wouldn't

37:58

have done anything like draft stick, but like

38:00

I probably would. I want a couple more games, but it

38:02

would have continued to build that foundation.

38:06

And like having that you know, just kind of

38:08

taken out like sucks. And

38:11

you know, especially when we talked to him, a

38:14

lot of it was like, you know, it was a bummer

38:16

for the young guys kind of going back with you

38:18

know, just that development and having that time.

38:20

And so he was seeing you know, like what Colin

38:23

was doing, what what Darius was doing, what

38:25

KPJ was doing just kind of the growth

38:27

all around and was excited for where those guys

38:29

were going. Um So

38:32

I think, like, you know, I

38:35

want to say, like he talked about like getting

38:37

wanting to get obviously get back into you

38:40

know, when next season happens, just kind of being

38:42

able to pick up where they left off in

38:44

the sense of that momentum, that camaraderie

38:47

and just playing with each other, um

38:50

and those and the work they've been doing you know over

38:53

zoom calls and you know just kind of

38:56

even like what is

38:58

it called why am I blanket on the word? Um?

39:01

Oh, like the like the in person workouts,

39:04

Like, yes, their individual but like when guys have been

39:06

able to be you know, it's putting in the work when you can, and

39:08

so like continually putting the work, building

39:10

on things that you want to get better and

39:12

then just like kind of trying to manifest

39:16

team chemistry, team camaraderie

39:18

however you can you know, will help

39:20

lead into next season. Um

39:24

yeah, I think like it's kind of like there's

39:26

an anticipation of like being

39:28

able to build off of what they had because

39:30

a lot of it was just built on like how they

39:33

are with each other, laden into and they're hoping

39:35

to obviously turn that into next

39:37

season. I think, like you know,

39:39

Kevin has a really good relationship with JB. And

39:42

I think that's really helpful. Um being

39:44

able to just kind of rally around

39:47

him and understand where he's coming from

39:49

and being able to just like have a good relationship

39:52

helps a lot. Um And

39:54

just like even in when even when the team

39:57

is like the state it's in, you

39:59

know, being able to just rally around

40:01

people, I think it is really helpful. And so he has

40:03

that close relationship with them, which I think is really good.

40:06

In the Chatkin Phillips just said

40:08

on on the periscope chat, what about

40:11

the love and drum and pairing and you talk about

40:13

them from the team, do they view these guys do they

40:15

view especially in the drum and sense,

40:17

are they viewing him as like a foundational piece?

40:19

I know they kind of just took a flyer on the guy, but he

40:22

is an all star talent, so they have

40:25

yeah, and he's young, and uh so they

40:27

kind of do have to figure out just how

40:29

interested they are in him being a piece of their

40:32

future. What have you got what impressions have you

40:34

gotten from the team with regard to Andre yeah,

40:36

so this was like what it was interesting of you know, they

40:39

drafted or drafted, Oh my gosh, they treated

40:41

for him, and um, you

40:43

know, they were like hoping, like, okay, they don't have like a

40:45

two month stretch where it's kind of like an

40:48

experimental period how it fits, see

40:50

how it goes, and then hopefully

40:52

he would opt in and then they could like if they wanted to,

40:54

they could offer an extension just kind of see how he fits.

40:57

Well. Obviously, like that got cut short. So

41:00

I'm curious and I'm not I don't

41:02

have like anything yet, um,

41:05

but I'm curious, like how much if

41:08

like you know, since he did say he was going

41:10

to opt in, obviously you're still waiting for that to be official,

41:13

but like he did say he was going to opt in, and

41:16

like how much will they use next

41:18

season and or how much

41:20

of next season to make

41:22

that decision? Like and I'm not

41:24

sure, Like I don't know if they

41:27

saw enough in that little stretch and just

41:29

how he's been with the team that they've made

41:31

their decision or if they're kind of still going to rely

41:34

on next season because

41:36

there were some numbers, um, you

41:38

know, with the the big lineup actually worked

41:41

really well to have like Larry Kevin and Andrea

41:43

or Larry Kevin in Tristan, or you know, a combination

41:45

of those three on the floor together like actually

41:48

had a lot of success and

41:51

um, which was they were all really excited

41:53

about. And I think again, like that was one

41:55

of those things that like they'll probably continue

41:57

to experiment with that because they

41:59

like what they saw and then it got cut short,

42:01

so they didn't you know, they didn't get enough, so they'll

42:04

probably you know, I could see them trying

42:06

it out again, kind of seeing what how it

42:08

works, to kind of continue to build that data

42:10

even more. Um. Yeah,

42:13

I I'm curious, Like that's kind of one of the

42:15

things I'm like watching out before, especially

42:17

because I think it's gonna I

42:19

don't know, I don't know if they'll you know, if they'll

42:21

wait, if it'll just kind of be something like they'll

42:24

do right away. Uh,

42:26

there's a lot of questions that I got there. Yeah,

42:29

well it's well, it's really and I'm sorry. I was

42:31

just gonna say, like I feel like how they

42:34

handle Andre Drummond is going to be a

42:36

huge part of Kobe Altman's kind of

42:38

legacy with the team because this is such a crossroads,

42:41

and I mean there's an opportunity,

42:43

Like here's a guy that I was advocating

42:45

for them trading for prior

42:47

to it happening just because of his age, and hey,

42:49

this might be a worthwhile thing. We we have

42:52

three guards that do well in the pick and roll, and

42:54

that's a great pick and roll partner. Um.

42:56

I'd like to check the receipts on that. I don't remember

42:59

you saying Jack about Andre Oh

43:01

my god. Okay, I was saying it before

43:03

the trade deadline. And people will back me up

43:05

on this, loyal chase down. Listeners

43:07

will back me up. This

43:10

is very this is very uh, this

43:12

is very trump esque. Many people

43:14

are saying, you

43:16

know what, I'm I'm unimpressed with you right

43:18

now, Carter. I I know the facts

43:21

and this is not me just being me okay.

43:24

Um. Anyways, I

43:27

do think that they also have to weigh

43:29

the fact that he's going to be a massive

43:32

expiring contract going into a great

43:34

free agency class. And um, I

43:36

think some people are a little freaked out by

43:38

the messaging where the Cavs are saying, all right, we're

43:40

going to try to start winning next year, when

43:43

to me, at least in reality, like they

43:46

don't have a lot of ability

43:48

to make win now moves, Like they can't

43:50

go out and make a big free agencies class

43:52

because they just don't have that type of cap

43:54

space and a lot of the playmaking

43:57

and the initiating is still going to be run three young

43:59

guys. You're going to make mistakes and uh,

44:02

they're gonna have to strike a balance

44:04

here on do we

44:07

bench a guy that let's let's say

44:09

Kevin Porter Jr. Has a season similar

44:11

to what Sexton had where his numbers

44:14

are blowing up, but the team impact isn't there.

44:16

Are are they going to make win now decisions

44:19

in who they choose to play

44:21

and who to put on the bench. And the

44:24

whole Drummond situation is just it's

44:27

a really really tricky spot because this

44:29

is a talent and he can help them in

44:32

the short term, but the long term play

44:35

might still be to to move him at the deadline.

44:37

I mean let it before you even say that, I mean draft

44:40

is coming up, uh and it's

44:42

all centers and guards. Yeah. Both Wise,

44:44

minetto kong Wu are very

44:47

very legitimate prospects and Kelsey,

44:49

do you get the impression that they would avoid

44:52

a center because they have Drummond on there, because

44:54

I feel like there's still completely

44:57

I have no sense of what they're gonna do, um

45:00

right there with yeah, I got I have zero clue.

45:03

I mean, you know, I think if if

45:06

he was best player available, maybe maybe

45:08

and they that could affect then what they do

45:11

with Drummond or you know, that's

45:14

kind of one of the questions I've I like, how, like what what

45:16

will happen? Because like it's I

45:18

really think kind of depending on who

45:21

they draft, it could affect things. Just

45:23

kind of like where they go from there really anyone except

45:25

for a wing. If they take a wing, they can pressure

45:30

exactly. This this draft

45:32

is basically like a Calv's pessimist dream,

45:34

Like, no matter what, you're almost certainly going to be

45:37

able to make some sarcastic remarks because see, if they

45:39

take a guard, people will say, oh, they took another

45:41

guard after taking so many guards. They

45:43

take a big, then everyone's going to say, oh, you trade

45:45

for Andre Drummond and now you take

45:48

a big. It's basically like if

45:50

they go out and get like Denny or Vassal

45:52

or Coral, then

45:55

they reached maybe really

45:59

easy to criticize them. Well,

46:02

thank thank God for the new lottery where we can

46:04

fall back and then one be considered.

46:07

All I want is for the calves to follow

46:10

like fifth or six. So I also no

46:12

one will yell at them. Yeah that's

46:14

right. Uh,

46:19

Kelsey, you had written about some of

46:21

the options that has might have when

46:23

it comes to that exception, and

46:26

one of the guys mentioned, Derek Jones

46:28

Jr. I think Josh Jackson

46:31

was in there. Um kind of wing

46:33

help? Do you see that being kind of the direction

46:36

they go with the absence of wings in the draft

46:38

that uh, they might look to kind

46:40

of fill that void with an exception. I

46:43

feel like they almost kind of have to, like

46:45

to be honest, like that is such a position

46:48

that they're lacky that like, you

46:50

know, you have to do one or the other. It's

46:52

either in the draft or it's in free agency.

46:55

Um, and yeah, that's kind of like what my thinking

46:57

was rounded of, Like, all right, that's where you can really

47:00

go out and make a positional fit

47:02

is in free agency. But granted, you know, they only

47:04

have like their mid level exception

47:07

and so like that's how they would be able to sign

47:09

a guy and so um

47:12

and their biennial I forget about that but like the

47:14

mid mid level is kind of where they would

47:16

be dealing with with with

47:18

signing somebody, um, but

47:20

I think really that should be you know, the

47:23

focus for free agency if they move

47:25

make any moves, because it's

47:27

such a needed position, and I think, you

47:30

know, you there are some potentials

47:32

like like those those three four that I wrote

47:35

about, you know they could Yeah, they're not the biggest

47:37

names, but they're not going to go sign the big names because

47:39

they can't. And like Derrek Jones Jr.

47:41

Like to, like what I wrote about was

47:43

like he's going to have a lot of people

47:46

after him. I feel like, you know, like the calves are

47:48

gonna be thrown their hat in a very crowded

47:50

ring and so and like. So

47:53

that might not be a possibility, but it might

47:55

be one of those those things where they they

47:58

choose another guy that

48:00

is younger or and fits a little bit better in

48:03

the sense of just like the age, because if

48:05

they're going along with development, you know, then they

48:07

can continue to develop him along with their

48:09

other guys and kind of just all fits together.

48:12

But yeah, I think like if if there

48:14

they are to make any moves in free agency, I feel like it

48:16

will probably it would be focused on

48:19

wings because it's such a position, positional

48:21

need that they need. Unless

48:24

Kevin Porter Jr. Six eleven, Right,

48:27

he just like grows like seriously,

48:31

I want to, I want to. I want to see them on media

48:33

days lying over your shoulder like

48:37

measure with little little things, put them up on a

48:39

on a wall. Yeah yeah,

48:44

Well, I mean the other mystery wing here is Dylan

48:46

Windler, Like what is how

48:49

what's your sense of how the Calves feel about

48:51

him? Because I mean, as much as I love to joke

48:54

that he could be the Calves, I shouldn't

48:56

even pretend that I'm joking he could be the Calves

48:58

Duncan Robinson, he can be, uh

49:00

that kind of guy? What what? What do

49:02

you think the calv sentences? Because it's

49:05

a situation where unless

49:07

they trade out of this draft, they're adding two

49:10

first round picks to next year's

49:12

team, right Yeah. And I think,

49:14

like, I mean, everybody was very they

49:16

were very excited about him, and then you know, not

49:18

having them all last season and when he was out was

49:20

like such a bummer because they

49:23

really did see a lot of potential in him. And

49:26

so I think like the thing with him is

49:28

like he would going

49:30

back to what we talk about. Other he would also benefit

49:33

from like a delete eight scenario just

49:35

kind of like getting him back into the swing of

49:37

things and like putting him in you

49:39

know, kind of an NBA setting,

49:42

because missing a rookie season is

49:44

like that's it's that way that's very hard.

49:46

You know, not only is it hard to come in as

49:49

a rookie, but then missing that and then having to come

49:51

back in it's just kind of is going

49:53

to be a difficult situation. I'm

49:55

not saying that he can't do it, obviously, but like it's

49:58

just kind of one of those things that like it's going to less time

50:00

ideal, right, and it's going to take him some time

50:02

to get adjusted and find his

50:05

find his rhythm and find his place, and they're

50:07

kind of has to be that little leeway for that. Like

50:09

he literally missed a whole season for an injury, but

50:12

like so like give him a shot to just

50:14

kind of like get acclimated because every he's

50:17

going to need it. But I think there still

50:19

is that hope that you know, he can be that

50:21

guy and that hasn't wavered.

50:24

It's just you know, obviously was put on hold

50:26

because of his injury. But like Yeah,

50:28

I don't think like it's changed.

50:30

It's just the fact of like now you've gotta work kind

50:32

of work back from coming back from an injury. Yeah.

50:35

And the nicest thing about a delete eight bubble

50:37

is because the games don't count it when impact is Rookie

50:40

of the Year eligibily, which is crucial

50:42

right exactly that

50:48

online dot a g to see what his

50:50

Rookie of the Year odds are. I'm sure that I posted

50:52

yet that that would truly be something

50:55

that that would be an all time

50:57

ben if it actually cashed him that I I'm

51:00

somewhat skeptical that, Guarter. Do you have anything

51:02

else before I wrap this thing up? No, No,

51:05

that's it for me. Kelsey, thank you so much for

51:07

becoming a repeat guest. That's uh, it's

51:10

it's not that prestigious of company, But that

51:12

doesn't mean we don't appreciate it. No, I

51:14

I appreciate it's fun. I mean I haven't

51:16

had a lot of podcast experience, so this is

51:19

great to be able to come and chat

51:21

and figure out how to do all this. Anytime

51:24

we can go through a podcast without scaring

51:27

someone off where they're actually willing to come back

51:29

another time. I will take that as a victory.

51:31

So we really really do appreciate your

51:33

time and insight on this. I hope, I hope

51:35

you're staying safe. Hopefully that there's

51:38

some news in the near future, although

51:40

with the cals sometimes no news

51:43

is kind of nice. Um. I

51:45

I want things that I can kind of stick my

51:47

teeth into and things to get excited. But big

51:50

shakeups, I think I'm I think

51:52

I'm good with no big shakeups for a little

51:54

while. Same, Yeah, there was enough

51:56

in one year that land those Okay,

51:59

I'm good with it. They

52:01

will work their way towards normal hopefully

52:04

maybe fingers crossed. Anyways, really

52:06

appreciate your time. Want to thank all of our listeners

52:08

as well for support in the podcast. Remember the best

52:10

way to support us is by leaving a rating, leave

52:12

a review, subscribe unsubscribed, resubscribe

52:15

and help cook those books. If you want to

52:17

be part of our exclusive discord chat, you can send

52:19

a screenshot of the review to Chase Down pod

52:21

at gmail dot com. Really do appreciate

52:24

all your support. Big thanks to Kelsey, thanks

52:26

to all our listeners. Stay safe out there,

52:28

and until next time, go caps two