0:00

Hey, it's Free for All Friday here on

0:02

the Council of Trent podcast. Welcome. Monday, Wednesday

0:04

as we talk apologetics and theology. Friday, whatever

0:07

I want to talk about, which sometimes does

0:09

involve apologetics and theology. Recently,

0:11

I was a guest on the

0:13

Avoiding Babylon podcast. It's

0:15

a great podcast. The hosts are a lot of

0:17

fun. Anthony is a hoot. And they

0:19

also had Joshua Charles on. He's been doing

0:21

a lot of great work with Catholic apologetics

0:24

on social media, especially on Twitter. He has

0:26

a new apostolate he's launching. So the four

0:28

of us got together, just have a really

0:30

nice chat about online Catholicism,

0:32

Gen Z, understanding

0:34

them, understanding how to reach out to online

0:36

Catholic culture. It was just a nice period

0:38

just to hang out and chat about things.

0:41

I always I love those kinds of formats,

0:43

environments. I really don't enjoy going on shows

0:45

where it's a really dry sort of interview,

0:47

where it's question, answer, question, answer, question, answer.

0:49

If I can be on a show where

0:51

it feels like I'm just having a chat.

0:54

That's why I enjoy pints. I enjoy going

0:56

on Avoiding Babylon. It's a

0:58

lot of fun. So I think you'll get a lot out of

1:00

hearing our conversation that I have with them

1:02

to share here with you today on the

1:04

podcast. So without further ado, here is my

1:06

chat on Avoiding Babylon on how to reach

1:08

out to online Catholic culture and

1:11

understand Gen Z. Well, I think all

1:13

of us are, I think we're all

1:15

like millennials around like late 30s. Yeah, yeah,

1:17

yeah. I'm on the older side. You guys

1:19

are definitely on the younger side. Yeah, not

1:21

too much. I'll be I'll be 40 in

1:24

January. So like, wow, it'll

1:26

be you know, it's, but us

1:29

the millennials, we remember coming

1:31

of age when the internet was an ancillary thing

1:34

like you and I were talking before the show,

1:36

the iPhone came out in 2007. Like

1:38

that was when I graduated college undergrad.

1:41

Like before that point, you had a life in

1:43

relation that formative time when you're late teen, early

1:45

adults, you're trying to, that's a big time, like

1:47

figure out your identity, like who am I? But

1:50

now you got people that they're doing that and they're

1:52

just plugged in 24 seven in the internet. I

1:55

really worry about what the internet's what

1:57

it does to people for their sense of self identity. Well,

2:00

this is kind of why I try

2:02

to have conversations with

2:05

people that you don't normally see having conversations

2:08

because I've noticed that

2:10

people start branching off into their corner

2:13

and then it's like it's a weird thing.

2:15

It's like who was

2:17

I just talking? I was like I was talking

2:20

to Enoch about it. He's like, you know, it's

2:22

you're going to have a conversation with Trent Horn

2:24

and that that means like Trent Horn's fans are

2:26

now allowed to watch your show. It's a weird

2:28

thing where because we're having

2:30

a conversation now people go, oh, Anthony's not

2:32

so trad, you know, it's it's such a

2:35

strange time to be Catholic. Like I'm even

2:37

looking in the comments and somebody's like Nick

2:39

Fuentes is a false Vatican to traditionalist people

2:41

really get broken up into these groups and

2:44

I just see everybody fracturing apart and just

2:46

getting spread further, further apart. And I kind

2:48

of want to draw people into

2:50

each other to keep these conversations going. Yeah.

2:53

No, I think that's great. Josh,

2:56

what's going on with eternal cursing them? Oh,

2:59

well, this is a huge topic with the young

3:01

converts. We can talk about that in a little

3:04

bit. I don't know if you would. I'm curious

3:06

what more of what Trent has seen with the

3:08

orthobros and and Anthony mentioning that some

3:10

of them don't even go to divine liturgy. Have you like

3:12

have you seen because I

3:14

have a I have a men's group. I host

3:16

weekly of just Catholic buddies of mine and it's

3:19

it's been really edifying. But you know,

3:21

I'd say probably half of them are Gen Z and the

3:23

other. I'd say maybe a smaller

3:25

bit or millennial and then we've

3:27

got two or three guys in their early and mid

3:29

fifties. And so it's a

3:32

pretty good generational spread. It's a lot

3:34

of wisdom and whatnot being transferred. But

3:37

it's very interesting talk with the Gen Z guys.

3:39

So I would like to hear more of Trent's

3:41

thoughts on that first and then maybe I can answer

3:43

my. I don't know. I

3:45

think Gen Z the ones that are committed

3:47

like I feel like Gen

3:49

Z wants to go really full blast on things when

3:52

they're into something. So I've noticed that

3:54

like people who are Gen Z that they're

3:56

especially if they're online and they identify as

3:58

Catholic Orthodox like they really and I

4:00

felt this when I when I talked to Redeem

4:02

Zumer and we were talking a bit about this

4:04

stuff including when we were I was driving him

4:06

back to his dorm about

4:10

how that they love theological

4:12

minutia and they don't want

4:14

they don't want the baby

4:16

catechism stuff. They really

4:19

love debating and talking about the

4:21

eclectic, the higher level, so

4:23

they get into the intricacies and

4:26

my concern is that they might be

4:28

so focused on the minutia that they

4:30

miss like the charisma that they miss

4:32

the most important foundational elements

4:35

and then if you spend a lot of time online, I thought

4:38

about doing an episode soon about how the internet is killing us

4:42

just all the different things it does it shortens our

4:44

attention span. It's like I feel guilty doing a podcast

4:46

and YouTube channel. I want to be harming

4:48

people but well

4:51

one of the things is like like for example

4:53

with some of these Gen Zers there's a thing

4:55

called irony poisoning like a lot of

4:57

Gen Z humor tends to be very meta

4:59

and ironic. So like for

5:01

example like Gen Z will post a

5:04

minion saying something really

5:06

cheesy and it's not the meme that

5:09

they laugh about. They laugh about the meta fact

5:11

that a boomer would just find that funny. Gen

5:15

Z humor is more about like someone

5:17

it's like that point where someone tells

5:19

a joke and it's gone on too

5:21

long where it's on the border between

5:23

being uncomfortable and funny again and so

5:25

I see I kind of like that though

5:28

it's weird yeah so all right so we

5:30

were in our telegram chat

5:32

for meaning a Catholic something came up

5:34

where Dan Burke used to

5:37

run EWTN asked he was referencing

5:39

a Father Ripperger talk where

5:42

he talks about how the Trads like

5:44

a lot of Trad priests would realize

5:46

that a lot of Trad men struggle

5:48

with pornography and he said it's something to

5:50

do with like the sin of pride right

5:53

so then he asked about uh you

5:56

know our Gen Z is the

5:58

Trad movement have a lot of pride in it. And

6:01

yeah, probably obviously right, but I think there's a

6:03

level of it where it has to do with

6:05

this Gen Z These are

6:07

people who just came into the faith and

6:10

they're discovering tradition and they're excited about it

6:12

And they have this sense of humor you're

6:14

talking about so everything is like an own

6:16

or a or show Well, that's what I

6:18

was saying about irony poisoning. So they'll share

6:21

memes like a meme that Says

6:23

something like an ironic deus vault

6:25

or a Groyper meme or something

6:28

that is offensive or absurd

6:32

Not even politically incorrect or even beyond that

6:34

like just straight-up offensive, but they'll say oh,

6:36

I'm just being ironic when I share this

6:38

and it's It's funny because you know, it's

6:40

an irony But the problem is the more

6:42

and more you share those kinds of things

6:44

that you meant it in an ironic sense

6:46

of humor That you slowly

6:48

start to actually be poisoned by it and

6:50

it changes your baseline feeling on the issue

6:53

Whereas you might think it's funny to

6:56

post something uber ridiculous trad That's nonsensical

6:58

the more and more you post it as ironic humor It

7:00

actually starts to poison you and you turn into the very

7:02

thing that you were making fun of If

7:06

I could make one Related

7:08

but hey Trent, my sister

7:11

Nancy Charles is in the stream. She

7:14

is a recent convert She came

7:16

in September 29th last year and

7:18

she adores you. Oh, yeah, and very

7:20

he had a life of and

7:24

you know and there's still struggles with

7:26

same-sex traction and Drugs

7:28

and I mean it was a it was a

7:30

work of God and Our Lady and yeah And

7:33

she just admires the heck out of you So just

7:36

and then there's guys in my men's group as well

7:38

who just adore you as well So I just I

7:40

sorry just she didn't ask me to do this, but

7:42

I wanted to like You can

7:44

say a brief. Hello to Nance. Oh,

7:47

thank you for your kind words and

7:49

praise be to God for Everything

7:52

every way he's used to draw you closer to

7:54

him. That makes me very glad to hear the

7:58

so I'm friends with this This guy,

8:01

Antonius, I think his name is, but I think he's

8:03

one of the funniest people I've ever seen on Twitter.

8:06

And he constantly goes after

8:08

Americans who become Orthodox or

8:12

even Byzantine

8:15

Catholics, and he calls them, he

8:18

calls it Byzantianity. He

8:21

goes, stop larking with

8:23

your Byzantianity. He goes,

8:25

Western Orthodox, he's like

8:28

transgenderism, but he's just being

8:30

like trying to poke the bear a little

8:32

bit and make fun of the orthobros a

8:34

little bit. But I guess

8:36

you're kind of right. Like I've been

8:38

desensitized so much that

8:40

it's almost like, I

8:43

think it can be dangerous. I think you're kind of right

8:45

about that, right? You

8:47

joke around so much that it's your

8:50

sense of, even the sacred could get dulled.

8:52

And you don't realize when you're profaning something,

8:54

I think. Well, one

8:56

comment I'll make is, I'm a

8:58

weird Catholic now and I have been for five

9:00

years. So I have one of these on my

9:02

desk. The mental worry.

9:04

Yeah. And I

9:08

kind of started going full time doing

9:10

more apologetics evangelism stuff,

9:12

particularly with church fathers on X

9:15

last June. And I

9:17

was kind of doing a testing period for myself. I wanted

9:19

to see if I could

9:21

maintain some civility. Doesn't

9:24

mean everybody agrees with me. Doesn't mean I always word

9:26

things perfectly. And

9:28

I think it's come through, but the reason I bring

9:31

it to the mental worry is since

9:33

becoming Catholic, I'll say that one of

9:35

the things I do think about a lot more is

9:37

the day of judgment. And there's

9:39

very, very sobering verse from our Lord

9:42

about we'll have to

9:44

answer for every careless word. And

9:47

Trent, I think you model

9:51

this very, very well for people. And

9:54

I'm a firm believer in being direct, very

9:56

direct. But

10:00

I think what a lot of people have

10:02

to consider is that we

10:05

will be held accountable for every word. You

10:08

know, it's funny. That's why about

10:11

like eight months ago, maybe it's been a year, I don't know,

10:13

I started scripting all of

10:15

my podcasts. Yeah, I mean, I mean, I can

10:17

speak extemporaneously. I mean, I do that in debates,

10:19

I do it in talks. And

10:21

that's fine. But I started scripting

10:23

them, because I wanted to be

10:25

one, I wanted to be judicious

10:28

and respectful of people's time. Like

10:30

I'll watch episodes of people doing a podcast, they

10:32

ramble. And like I can cover

10:34

in 20 minutes, it would take them an hour. You

10:37

know, it's just just get to the point. And

10:39

I mean, it's the same if I just spoke random, like

10:41

off top my head on something, it would take me two

10:43

or three times as long. But also

10:45

in scripting it, it reduces the temptation. A lot

10:47

of people who get into streaming and doing that

10:49

stuff, you turn on your camera and

10:51

you start talking and pontificating, you got a

10:53

lot more opportunities for those those careless words to

10:55

show up. Yeah. Well,

10:58

there is a book I read years and

11:00

years ago called Amusing Ourselves to Death. Have

11:02

you read that trend? Neil Postman. Yes.

11:06

Yeah. Amazing, amazing book. He

11:08

published it in 1985. And he,

11:10

you know, he was kind of commenting in the introduction

11:12

that they had just passed 1984,

11:15

you know, which was the eponymous

11:17

title of George Orwell's book, right?

11:20

And and, you know,

11:22

kind of everybody was celebrating, we hadn't

11:24

fallen into this dystopian hellhole and whatnot.

11:27

But he was pointing out that

11:29

electronic media had really dumbed us

11:31

down. And he was

11:33

pointing this out in religion, education and

11:35

politics. And I read this book when I was 19. So

11:38

the same year that I was talking in 1985 about just TV at this point. Oh,

11:42

yeah. Before internet, before smartphones. I

11:44

read this the year the iPhone came

11:46

out. And like Trent said earlier,

11:48

I am every day that goes by,

11:50

I am more and more thankful. I mean, I

11:54

played outside with friends. We built tree houses.

11:56

We dug for dinosaur bones, the silly that

11:58

is looking back on it. You

12:00

know, we were out and about riding bikes.

12:02

I think we were the last, I

12:04

hope not the last, but at least for now, I'd

12:07

say the most recent generation that probably had a

12:09

lot of time spent that way

12:11

as a kid. Well, you want to know

12:13

something though there. Okay. So your average young

12:16

kid does. Can I pass it to the

12:18

comment? Oh yeah. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. Go

12:20

ahead. Um, a dear mentor of mine,

12:22

my closest mentor, uh, we met

12:24

when I was 14, he was my choir teacher

12:27

and he's at the same high school. And

12:29

so he has seen, uh, the progression.

12:31

So when he says Josh, he's what he was telling

12:33

me even before COVID, he's like, Josh, I'm

12:35

telling you, there is something very, very

12:38

different about this generation. And I'm

12:40

very devil's advocate. I'm devil's advocate with

12:42

myself. Uh, you know, every time

12:44

people are challenging me with questions, like I

12:47

promised them I've challenged myself with harder questions than

12:49

they have. It's part of my going to law school,

12:51

I guess. But, um, but so

12:53

I will push him. I'll be like, are

12:55

you sure it's not just old guy complaining

12:57

about young guy symptom, and he's

12:59

a very discerning guy, very wise man, very,

13:01

very relational, he's not curmudgeonly at all. And

13:04

so he's like, no, I'm telling you it's very, my

13:06

mom has said similar things. She's at the middle school

13:09

level. He's at the high school level. And,

13:11

um, you know, he was talking, he was saying there

13:14

was a student committee at my

13:16

high school that was begging. This

13:18

was right before COVID was begging the teachers

13:20

to take away their phones because they, they

13:22

were saying we are absolutely and completely addicted

13:24

to these things to the point where, you

13:26

know, they would take their phone, put it

13:29

in some cubby at the entrance to the

13:31

classroom and class started, but even that wasn't

13:33

working because they would be constantly, you know,

13:35

looking at the cubby to see if they

13:37

could see light reflecting on the inner part

13:39

of the cubby of some, some notification had

13:41

come through. And so, uh, that was

13:43

one instance. And then I don't know the exact number,

13:45

so I'm not going to, you know, you

13:48

know, I'm not going to be like a dictionary here, but my

13:50

high school, when I was there for four years, this is

13:52

2002 to 2006. Zero

13:56

suicides, at least as far as I'm aware. And

13:58

I asked him, I was like, do you remember any suicide? There

14:01

are – let's just say there are multiple suicides

14:03

almost every year at my high school now. And

14:06

so he said kids don't hang out as much.

14:09

And I'm glad that apparently

14:11

kids aren't fornicating as much either. I'm glad

14:13

about that for sure. But

14:15

many of the reasons they're not fornicating

14:18

are probably not bad either. They're probably

14:20

fornicating with porn and whatnot. 20%

14:23

identify as LGBT. Whereas

14:26

when we went to high school, there were people

14:29

who identified that way, but it was within the

14:31

standard general survey of people. Like

14:34

1% or something like

14:36

that. Whereas now, I

14:39

don't know, I do think Anthony, the

14:41

Gen Zers, I think

14:43

what's happening now is young people always have a

14:46

rebellious streak to them. And

14:48

being a traditional Catholic or

14:50

Orthodox, that's a subversive reactionary

14:53

thing. That's a way to

14:55

rebel in the world today.

14:57

And which is good as long as your identity

14:59

is not solely in, I like rebelling this way.

15:01

I like using its own people. That's a great

15:03

point. But you even

15:05

have the young

15:08

guys who are like Pope Francis is

15:10

the most based Pope ever. Like that

15:12

crowd. There are young guys that do

15:14

that. You look

15:17

at the Orca kid

15:19

and modern Boethius, those guys were like 17, 18

15:21

years old. Are they real?

15:23

Yeah, they're young. They're that young? They're

15:26

that young. 17, 18 years old. And

15:29

look, they just learned their faith and

15:31

it's like they are just gung ho

15:33

for it. And they're like Pope Francis

15:35

is the man and we're going to take

15:37

back the world and the Catholicism. And

15:40

you know that these are

15:42

guys of goodwill, right? These

15:44

aren't progressive Catholics. These are guys who believe

15:46

the faith, want to hold to the traditions

15:48

of the church. They're just

15:51

like Francis is the Pope and I'm going

15:53

and that's a respectable position. It's just a

15:55

weird thing, like you're saying with this generation,

15:57

it's like whatever they do, they're doing it

16:00

a thousand miles. for hours. They're full blasters.

16:02

They're just going hammering down. Well, I think

16:04

part of that phenomena, like, look, we should

16:06

honor the Pope, of course. That

16:08

doesn't prevent us. I just did

16:10

a book with a colleague persecuted from within how the

16:13

saints endured crises in the church. And

16:15

we outlined some historical cases where some saints

16:17

had some extraordinarily respectful

16:19

but direct criticisms of Popes.

16:22

So it's possible. And

16:25

there are limits. But I'd say

16:27

some of that phenomena is related to a

16:29

hunger for authority, because the way

16:31

most, even our generation, I

16:33

mean, I don't know about you guys,

16:35

but most of my friends, I'd say probably 50%

16:38

of my friends have divorced, millennial

16:40

friends have divorced parents. It

16:43

may be lower amount in the general population.

16:46

But I grew up in, you know,

16:48

relatively wealthy, not our family, but

16:50

a relatively wealthy area, white suburbia.

16:53

And there's divorce all over the place.

16:55

And so the family has collapsed. Fatherly

16:57

authority has collapsed. You know, the feminism

16:59

issue, I think

17:02

we're struggling with fatherly authority in the church.

17:04

And so I think a lot of this is not just,

17:07

you know, going 1000%. I think it's coming

17:09

from this. I tweeted recently,

17:12

I think one thing many of

17:14

our bishops are misunderstanding. That's George

17:16

W. Bush's term. Sorry. That's dating

17:18

me. No,

17:23

one of the things they're underestimating is that men

17:25

especially, I think have a very, like when I

17:27

meet a bishop, I love

17:30

kneeling and kissing their ring. There's

17:32

something that comes along. They probably

17:34

recoil. I'm sorry, they probably

17:36

recoil because no, no, well, the ones

17:38

I have, but my point is, is

17:40

that if these bishops should

17:42

bravery encourage more of them, and some of

17:44

them have, but they will

17:46

find a lot of men rising up. And

17:49

it's because there actually is this natural desire

17:51

for godly authority that all of us have.

17:54

And I think when what most of, when what

17:56

many of these younger people, including myself and maybe

17:58

some of you guys, when what. we've

18:00

grown up is so often disordered authority,

18:03

we perhaps veer too strongly toward,

18:05

you know, finding

18:08

an authority figure and treating it like some

18:10

diktat, like, like, every little thing they say

18:12

becomes some sort of diktat. I'm gonna turn

18:15

my camera off really quick and fix this lighting

18:17

problem. But that's my that's my two

18:19

cents. Trent, do you have

18:21

a way to gauge what,

18:25

like, especially the younger crowd, what

18:27

their, what, what aspect

18:30

of Catholic Answers they're they're they're gravitating

18:32

towards? Like, is there a way for you to see

18:34

like, what groups are coming in? You guys have no

18:37

way of measuring that. Well, we have ways of measuring

18:39

it. I'm just still

18:41

trying to focus on

18:43

my particular content. And I'm bad at creating

18:45

it in a format that like Gen Z

18:47

prefers. I'm bringing on more people now who

18:50

are good at that. So

18:52

right now I'm bringing on that one

18:54

Catholic girl to take what I'm doing

18:56

and make, she makes tik tok

18:59

shorts for me and, and Thomas,

19:01

our social media guy Catholic Answers,

19:03

he's Gen Z and he's really hooked

19:06

into everything that's going on. So

19:08

I think what we provide is

19:11

still very relevant. I think what

19:13

they what they like seeing

19:15

are things that are packaged in a

19:17

way that's easy to

19:19

receive, especially like, hey, here's

19:22

someone being anti Catholic on tik tok, what's the

19:24

quick response to that? Like

19:26

just getting the answers we give but in

19:28

a very efficient and

19:32

memorable way that's got a little bit of an

19:34

edge to it. That's not trying too hard. That's

19:37

not cringe, I guess. So I

19:39

think I think Catholic Answers still skews like

19:41

millennial and older. Yeah, I

19:43

think well, honestly, I think it's about the medium, right? I was

19:45

gonna say, it was radio,

19:50

radio, that's that's that's a boomer thing, man. That's

19:52

a and we are we're still reaching a ton

19:54

of people that way. But it took

19:57

I mean, our YouTube presence. Like

19:59

you look at the Catholic answers YouTube page for

20:01

years It was just like a

20:04

little storage closet with a camera set up on

20:06

it until they finally a few years ago Invested

20:08

into a solid studio, but even there

20:10

we really didn't really hook

20:12

into the Gen Z crowd until We

20:15

hired Thomas to be our social media because we

20:17

had social media managers before that just they

20:19

use social media as here I'll

20:22

share it on these platforms But not in

20:24

a way that like like the guy who

20:26

runs like the Wendy's account on Twitter and

20:28

like has sick burns for people We

20:31

didn't have an idea of as Millennials, especially an

20:33

older We had no idea of social media being

20:35

used in that way and I think

20:37

for us we're using Gen Z We're learning more in

20:39

that way to reach people Yeah,

20:42

I'm trying to figure it out. Look we're

20:44

talking about like young people being addicted to

20:47

their phones, dude I'm addicted to my phone.

20:49

I have I have Twitter

20:51

brain like even before we were coming on this show

20:54

Usually you know what it is Usually before

20:57

we have a guest on it's weird because as

20:59

the shows progress It's gotten a little different like

21:01

when we first started interviewing like every interview I'd

21:03

be like, oh my god What am I gonna

21:05

say? What am I gonna say? We're gonna say

21:07

then it kind of got a little easier But

21:09

I would just try to have like an initial

21:11

idea to start with and then just kind of

21:13

go with a conversation was Tonight I found myself

21:15

like drawing a blank Like

21:18

what like what like I had absolutely no plan

21:20

for where this conversation would go and I was

21:22

just like, you know If

21:24

the four of us sat down for lunch together, we'd figure

21:26

something out to talk about right so I mean it's gotta

21:29

We'll figure it out, you know, but it's just

21:31

strange that my brain has been that effective on

21:33

my stupid phone, man I think I

21:36

need to do a social media detox. I think you'll

21:38

all agree with that Yeah,

21:40

well, I mean I took the browser off my phone,

21:42

but I still cheat and find a way to get

21:45

on the internet But

21:47

I've been working really hard to try

21:49

to like put it away when I'm at home

21:52

It's things is my job like I have to

21:54

check things on the internet and research and see

21:56

what's going to see what see what's happening with

21:58

people but Mostly I get

22:01

embarrassing. I don't want to do that around my

22:03

kids are it takes a a conscious effort. I

22:05

really don't know what's harder to quit like. Phones.

22:08

Asos a meteor Cigarettes I think they might be

22:10

more and. I. Can tell you

22:12

I quit cigarettes acting stupid for hims.

22:14

I think it's more addicting. Honestly on

22:16

your present will the woods funny as

22:18

you see people like I'll see guys

22:20

who are on twitter all day long.

22:23

Talk about how people play video games

22:25

are alike children and it's like do

22:27

you tweet every five minutes in your

22:29

it's getting the same exact dope of

22:31

mean response that somebody playing video games

22:33

getting. except they're actually interacting a little

22:35

battle play video games. but I think

22:37

it's a weird exception people makes for

22:39

themselves and their own behavior when. They're

22:41

living it like all of us are just constantly

22:44

hit with these little dopa. mean it's like as

22:46

you you actually read a lot. I have a

22:48

hard time reading. I have to do with audio

22:50

books and stuff I can't even. Sit. And

22:52

read a book anymore. It's terrible. While

22:54

part of that I may loves learn,

22:56

but as another thing I'd encourage people

22:58

to consider is dumb. I

23:01

was really thankful my parents encouraged me to

23:03

go into music and to do classical piano

23:06

at a high level. You have to be

23:08

in a room on your own for many

23:10

hours a day. I me at my. At

23:13

my height I guess you could say. I

23:15

was. I was driving to be legally insane. Of

23:18

yeah well you know, but I

23:20

also think it's a spiritual discipline.

23:25

Pascal the how to phrase some he does

23:27

active. all the world's problems will be solved.

23:29

People could sit for an hour and silenced

23:31

by themselves. Something like that. Of

23:33

course is engaging and hybrid hyperbole. but

23:35

them. But. But

23:38

yeah being able to sit in a room

23:40

quietly? yeah it's I saw my these thoughts

23:42

are very and refining so I'm thinking about

23:44

a lot but. I. Was actually I

23:47

was acts I just met Classical Theory

23:49

today. Overtax. We've been connected over. Twitter.

23:51

And I think he has a lot of helpful things to

23:53

say. I don't agree with everything he says, but. Why?

23:56

When you're flying for that caveat, bow like we do

23:58

it with everyone is like. I'm having Trenton. I don't

24:01

agree with everything. He says like why do we have to

24:03

do that nowadays? It's a weird thing. Well, I feel

24:05

like a lot of people and I I hate

24:07

when well people will do this And

24:09

I try hard to call them out

24:12

when it happens though. They'll use guilt

24:14

by association Especially if they're

24:16

online a bunch and they're kind of part of

24:18

the polemics like I'm a left cat I'm a

24:20

trag cat. I'm a this some of that and

24:23

they'll do so they'll say for example like Scott

24:26

Hahn his friends at Bishop Strickland and look look

24:28

what Strickland did or the Strickland's with this person

24:30

He did that and that means Scott Hahn is

24:32

just as bad They'll do like six degrees of

24:34

separation And it's like then then they're just as

24:37

then they're just as bad as that third person in the

24:39

chain Like how can you listen to Scott Hahn and

24:42

those same people will say that to me? I'm like

24:44

dude look at the people the father James Martin associates

24:46

with Right and

24:48

then the people they associate with but you

24:50

don't say he's as bad as that people

24:52

who openly outright reject the church's teaching on

24:54

marriage sexuality The to

24:56

me I would have more respect if they I don't

24:58

if they're gonna do guilt by association do with everybody

25:01

But it's a tool that gets used a

25:03

lot against the group of people you really

25:05

dislike and so it's like just stop it already

25:08

Yeah, no completely agree, but I

25:10

so we were talking and I was

25:12

saying that I Don't

25:14

know. I I think it's kind of reflecting

25:17

on postman and the technological revolution We've

25:19

gone through as a species the last

25:21

hundred years or so I'm

25:24

increasingly open maybe even convinced that

25:27

this state is very unnatural and

25:29

I'm not sure I'm

25:33

not sure we can be accommodated to it

25:35

without something like Transhumanism like

25:37

what Elon Musk wants to do. I

25:41

Don't think we're built by God

25:43

to be connected to virtually anybody

25:45

at virtually any time. I You

25:48

know especially with a globalized world where there

25:50

are no time zones because of that and

25:52

so I think it's very

25:55

unnatural. I think it's something we have to it's

25:57

gravely serious because you know st. Francis

26:00

to say all says in introduction to about life,

26:03

we should do absolutely everything we can to

26:06

maintain our spiritual peace. And

26:09

so if X or Facebook or

26:11

Instagram or avoiding Babylon is

26:13

causing you to lose your spiritual peace, stop.

26:17

Stop. And

26:19

guess what? We don't all have to be equally good

26:21

at everything. So anyway, I hope

26:23

all of us think about this more because

26:25

you know, I forget what it's called the

26:27

Apple device, the glasses thing, the virtual reality

26:29

thing. You know, yeah, Apple

26:31

goggles. I'm not going to do that. That's

26:34

a red line. Yeah, but Josh,

26:36

you say that's your line, right? And we're all

26:38

like, I'm not getting the chip in my head,

26:40

but we carry the stupid thing around with us

26:42

everywhere, right? I put all sorts of rules in

26:45

place for myself with my phone. So and

26:47

I need to get better at it sometimes. Absolutely. But

26:50

but so far, it's been working pretty well. And

26:53

again, I love to read. So most of my day, I

26:55

actually do spend reading, writing and researching. But

26:57

regardless of where different people are, I've got lots

26:59

of improvement to make. Regardless of where

27:01

people are, one of the

27:03

one of the points postman made was

27:06

he's not a Luddite, which is I forgetting

27:08

the first name of the guy, but an

27:10

English guy who is basically saying technological advancement

27:12

is a Ned Ludd. Yeah, okay.

27:14

Yeah. Well, we don't know if he

27:16

was a real person. He might just be an amalgamation. Fair

27:18

enough. Yeah. He's

27:20

not a Luddite, meaning he's not

27:23

saying that technological advancement is

27:25

bad per se. But he

27:27

does say we need to be aware of how

27:29

a technological advancement changes us.

27:32

And that's the thing that many people are, we

27:35

just kind of assume that

27:38

an advancement in technology is automatically good

27:40

or cool or whatever. So for me,

27:42

this Google, this goggle thing, absolute

27:44

red line. I think we as a species

27:46

are far too disconnected from reality as it

27:49

is. And I think that

27:51

that goggle thing will make it infinitely worse.

27:54

And so anyway, I just, I think we all need to

27:56

be thinking about these things and With

27:59

every technology. that comes, you

28:01

lose something too, right? Even if something as

28:03

simple as the lighter, like we

28:05

used to know how to start a fire with a stick,

28:08

you know, and then all of a sudden somebody invents the

28:10

lighter and now that knowledge of

28:12

how to do that thing is gone, right?

28:14

We used to, dude, before GPS, I

28:17

used to have the

28:19

entire five boroughs of New York City in

28:21

my head because I had to drive location

28:23

to location and I used the roadmap and

28:25

I used to have to plot my route.

28:27

Now that we have GPS, I forgot how

28:29

to get places that I've been 150 times.

28:32

It's a really strange thing. As these

28:35

new technologies are coming in, we're losing

28:37

something along the way every single time.

28:40

Which is why medieval students would remember

28:42

whole books of scripture, but

28:45

we have Google Search and the incentive structure

28:47

of, there's many wonderful things about Google Search,

28:49

but one of the things that we do

28:51

lose is retention, you know? Well,

28:54

even when I find that like I'm arguing

28:56

with somebody about scripture online, I know, I

28:58

don't know if actually know what verse and

29:00

what book, chapter, and verse it is. We

29:02

can just Google a few words of the

29:04

phrase I remember and that'll bring it up

29:06

and then I can punch it out like

29:08

that where I used to remember, it's like,

29:11

okay, if you wanna get to the obedience of

29:13

faith, it's Romans 817, like I just know that

29:15

because I just looked that one up, but like,

29:18

because I was in an argument with somebody, but I used

29:20

to know these things like well by heart,

29:23

you know? And even what you were talking

29:25

about with us in this global world like

29:27

that, it used to be where if you

29:29

were having an issue in a place, you

29:31

could take your family and move somewhere else

29:33

and that issue would go away, where

29:35

you can't even move to like the middle of

29:37

the country and escape some of

29:39

the crap that's going on now. You see

29:42

in the Midwest, in the heartland of America,

29:44

these kids are being pumped with

29:46

this ideology and you have kids that

29:48

are actually identifying on

29:50

that rainbow spectrum and they're in the Midwest

29:53

and they're, that's supposed to be like, you

29:56

know, the heartland of America where you're not near

29:58

the stuff in the cities and it's just, It's crazy

30:00

where we are right now. Yeah, other

30:02

Paul, you're right. And it may

30:04

be a while before you hear me say that again, but I'm kidding. But

30:07

I completely agree with you about the red line.

30:10

So what do you think – what are

30:12

you saying that you don't think it's possible

30:14

without some kind of integration with

30:17

technology? I

30:20

don't think we as a species can keep

30:22

up with this trend line without transhumanism. So

30:26

that's my burgeoning conviction. I'm

30:29

setting my flag there, and I'm

30:32

very much against transhumanism. I mean, I was raised

30:34

on Star Trek. We hate the Borg. They're

30:37

the worst enemy ever and

30:39

the most dehumanizing. But

30:42

yeah, I don't think it works without

30:45

– we're not meant

30:47

to be this guy. And frankly, and

30:49

I'd love to hear Trent's thoughts on

30:51

this in particular. It's led to deeply

30:53

disordered spiritualities when it comes to church

30:55

politics. Because as you and

30:57

I, we've talked about, most people wouldn't have known who

31:00

the pope was, who the cardinals were. Like

31:02

most Catholics, through most of history, wouldn't

31:05

hear about almost any of it. Well,

31:08

you can be aware of things, but

31:10

yeah. You get stuck in a rage

31:12

cycle, and I think anger

31:15

– it's an addictive emotion. I mean, anger

31:17

is a good emotion when there's an injustice.

31:19

Like anger spurs us to do something. So

31:22

it's no wonder it gives us a little

31:24

dopamine hit to encourage us to

31:26

want to do something that's difficult. But

31:28

it's just so easy for it to

31:30

become manipulated or distorted or abused. So

31:33

yeah, that's why I'm really –

31:35

yeah, I'm always

31:37

concerned. I mean, that's why I

31:39

appreciate, Josh, what you're doing with

31:41

apologetics and what you guys

31:43

are doing on avoiding Babylon. I

31:47

do think people are getting a fatigue, hopefully,

31:49

of Catholic media

31:51

being tabloid. Like, hey, here's

31:53

the latest bad thing that's

31:56

happened. I mean, I think

31:58

that got a lot of steam. That felt like a lot of stuff. it

32:00

picked up a lot. I don't

32:02

know, like 2017, 2018. It was a summer

32:04

shame. Summer shame it picked off and everybody

32:06

went crazy with it and

32:09

you know a lot of new guys jumped in

32:11

the field and it was like it really did.

32:13

Well like for a while you, I mean

32:15

we had like church militant for example for, although before

32:17

that it was it was it was real Catholic TV

32:19

then they had changed name and then

32:21

like um but

32:23

for a while it was just like you know

32:25

well I just remember I'm sure if you were

32:27

a young Catholic back in like the late 90s

32:31

for you like said of econism was just like oh

32:33

yeah I heard this I think there's a pope never

32:35

even heard of it Trent I never heard of the

32:37

society I never heard of said of econism I never

32:40

heard of the latin mass and until some

32:43

more in pontificum I think yeah but even

32:45

like in the the mid like there's the 2000s

32:47

if there were people that were talking about bad

32:49

stuff going on the church it was like okay

32:51

man whatever uh but

32:53

then through the constant repetition of

32:55

the cycle and just pushing it out there

32:58

uh it people and also through the

33:01

platform development through the change of

33:04

the democratization of media where instead

33:06

of just hey you've got three

33:08

Catholic magazines and ewtn anybody's

33:11

got a channel and if you can create

33:14

salacious content you'll get people it

33:16

creates that that kind of negative feedback loop to

33:19

to always try to push people's

33:21

dopamine receptors and their buttons but

33:23

I think also it creates

33:25

think about the incentive structure you

33:28

claim that you don't want these things to

33:30

happen in the church but everything's every time

33:32

something bad happens it's kind of good for

33:34

your channel and it's like oh

33:37

man the church is falling apart but

33:39

I'm being successful because it's a very

33:41

warped incentive structure where it's

33:43

like trying to find a balance where like

33:45

you don't harp on that stuff and just

33:48

kind of have interesting conversations is very difficult

33:50

man yeah it's part of it like I

33:52

caught a couple of people said to me

33:54

like oh they

33:56

accused me of kissing your ass when you

33:58

came on nice And I'm like if

34:01

you guys think I'm gonna have somebody on and

34:03

have like this adversarial Conversation with them like you

34:05

guys are missing what we're doing here like that's

34:07

just not I'm not gonna have somebody come on

34:09

and Try to sandbag them and he only did

34:11

that with co-sleeping come on guys Wow

34:15

the good sign that Rob's bringing up co-sleeping

34:17

it makes me feel it makes me feel

34:19

it's truly resolved But

34:24

yeah, it's this weird thing where it just

34:26

creates this in this really warped incentive structure

34:28

Like I was joking around before the

34:30

last dignitatis Infinita came

34:32

out like before it came

34:34

out. I was like, this is like the

34:37

Catholic podcasters wet dream, right? It's like you

34:39

guys are getting yourselves a little more home

34:41

in the dot They're gonna come out with

34:43

something on human dignity and everybody's getting all

34:45

excited It's like that's such a warped way

34:47

to see the church the magisterium Everything and

34:50

there is something to be said about having

34:52

a hermeneutic of suspicion I mean, you know

34:54

to use Michael Lofton's phrases There's

34:56

something warped about having that where

34:59

you don't want to be waiting for the next mistake

35:01

the church me Well, that's why what's funny is like

35:03

for myself Like what I've been focusing on in my

35:06

work Like I mean I talked

35:08

a little bit about stuff going on in the

35:10

church Like a 2018 2019

35:12

back when council term was just an audio podcast But

35:14

then eventually I settled more into I just really want to focus

35:16

on Showing the faith is true and just

35:19

really focusing on things not a lot of other people are

35:22

are doing so You

35:25

know, so when it comes to a lot of these other issues

35:27

that come up like like Trent, what are you gonna

35:29

say about? Traditionally is

35:31

custodians like I don't really

35:34

feel like saying anything And my people don't

35:36

even know my opinion or fiduciary supplicions I

35:38

was planning not to say anything about that because I'm like

35:41

look a ton of people are but then like

35:43

Ben Shapiro Like reached out to me like

35:45

hey, you want to come on the show and talk about it? I'm

35:47

like, yeah, I mean, I'd rather you know

35:49

I'd rather have someone come on who's not gonna like completely

35:51

throw Pope Francis under the bus or something like that You

35:54

know, but or like Dignitas. I was like, I'll

35:56

wait. I'll see if there's something like people I'll

35:59

wait to see if Like there's people are

36:01

banging on my door saying please say something. Yeah,

36:03

otherwise. I'm like, I don't

36:05

need to really well I've noticed like a

36:07

lot of Okay,

36:10

so I'm so to say with Mike Lewis

36:12

accusing I don't know how to pronounce his

36:14

name Sachin rose or does that

36:16

I might pronounce it? I should Joe you

36:19

mean session Joe? Okay, I'm

36:21

terrible the Indian content creator. Yes

36:24

Yeah, so Mike Lewis was like a name You've

36:26

been posting things about John Paul the second and

36:28

Benedict the 16th. You haven't said anything about Francis

36:30

Do you even think he's a valid hope anymore?

36:33

I'm like, whoa Wait a

36:35

minute. All right, like now

36:37

not saying something positive about

36:39

Francis implies that you're like

36:43

Scismatic or so. I don't it's a very

36:46

weird thing going on where even to be

36:48

silent and not be pro Francis You're gonna

36:50

get you're gonna get accusations from someone from

36:52

somewhere at some point That's that's a lot,

36:54

you know the whole point of what I

36:56

was saying Well, you create this polarization where

36:59

it's like as long as they're on my

37:01

team Then they're

37:03

great. And if you don't support the

37:05

team, it's a distorted view of the

37:07

world It's like seeing Austin Ivaray today

37:10

saying like oh we need to He

37:14

said we need to keep rutniks art up and you

37:16

can't hold the art you can't make blame the art

37:18

for the artists I'm like you're you're that's

37:21

insanity. That's even the least on

37:23

the left. They're just like that's crazy talk But

37:25

it's because he's on your team Whereas

37:27

like I know that there are other people

37:29

that if there's I'm sure Ivaray would say

37:31

that if you know if it was a

37:34

Conservative person or a you know a conservative

37:36

media thing and to say

37:38

there was scandal involved Oh take it all take it all

37:40

down The only reason you would say that is because rupniks

37:42

on the team and I'm like

37:44

that it's just mind-blowing to me Yeah,

37:47

I see that I see that in all corners too,

37:49

man It's oh, yeah, there's the right the trades will

37:51

do the same thing as long as you

37:54

know, but hey, they're trad We can't say anything bad about

37:56

him. Like that's a recipe for disaster Yeah

38:00

All right, we're gonna I want to make sure I

38:02

get a plug-in for eternal Christendom and councilor Trent So

38:04

Josh, what do you have going on? because and then

38:06

we're going over to locals and we're going to discuss

38:08

point this because I know everybody wants us to discuss

38:10

for Whether and we're gonna actually talk about the Groy

38:12

first We're gonna talk about the way because I do

38:14

have I probably have some

38:17

things that I agree a little more

38:19

a Couple of the points

38:21

Nick made in his response to you that I was like, all

38:23

right, that's a fair point So

38:25

we're gonna go we're going to go over to

38:27

locals. We're going to discuss Fuentes

38:30

Christ the King maybe Lila Rose a little bit You'll

38:32

be able to juicy stuff over there you guys got to

38:35

pay for to come and see but Josh What's going on

38:37

with eternal Christendom? Do you have anything lined up coming up

38:39

that you could promote or is just a one-pocket? Yeah, people

38:41

just want to go to eternal Christendom comm We

38:44

just announced like a month ago and we

38:47

just I just posted the first podcast. It's kind

38:49

of a prologue Just explaining the backstory but

38:52

no essentially the goal is kind

38:55

of responding to this postman reality that we're

38:57

living in of Electronic media

38:59

kind of dumbing things down and making

39:01

the most digital and visual generation in

39:03

history, you know All

39:05

this stuff is the stuff that built

39:08

our civilization It's the stuff that forms

39:10

Saints Saints the Saints sages and statesmen

39:13

and it built the civilization that

39:16

All of us in varying degrees and in various

39:18

ways love and want to preserve Unfortunately

39:20

though virtually all these books are just

39:22

text on a page Which

39:25

is fine for me I'm a nerd and I'm

39:27

sure there's some nerds on this stream and on

39:30

the in the comments But for most

39:32

people especially especially these days, it's not going to

39:34

work for

39:36

three basic reasons one hyperdigital

39:40

to hyper visual and three

39:44

Nobody today. They're cultural orphans. So there's no

39:46

context I mean I have multiple versions of

39:48

these classics where there's virtually no

39:51

context provided for anything and

39:53

it's totally unacceptable And so we

39:55

basically want to take these things And

39:58

not only make them the most beautiful. Explanatory.

40:02

Odd. Deep. Books.

40:05

Ever made. But we want to basically

40:07

use these things. To. Qr code

40:09

every chapter into a whole digital universe

40:11

where you can be. You. Know

40:13

when you're reading something a letter of

40:16

saying nature of Antioch you can be

40:18

connected to a Trent Horned video on

40:20

the Eucharist or a spot on documentary

40:22

on this or. You. Can be

40:24

watching a trailer like I want

40:26

to get filmmakers to do. Hollywood

40:29

level trailers about sending nations of

40:31

Antioch or about his martyrdom. There

40:34

so many tools many have to delve

40:36

into their sitting there like even during

40:38

the physical in the digital together to

40:40

to reach a highly digital visual generation.

40:42

Never busy the like I was saying

40:44

before like I to do audio books

40:46

and set with am so excited to

40:48

be able to drive in my car

40:50

and just click. A. Link to Leon

40:52

to something about my guess You gotta realize

40:54

people's attention spans are kind of wire towards

40:56

this is medium now, so I'm really happy

40:58

you're doing that. And yeah, well. there's people

41:00

don't know. There's almost no version of the

41:02

Church Fathers that there's no, not not, there's

41:04

almost over. There is no version. So.

41:07

Imagine if there is a version of the Church Fathers,

41:09

The first one we're going to do is say nations

41:11

have any ox letters. They. Had seven

41:13

letters. And we're going to make

41:15

a gorgeous i have a a wonderful illustrator

41:17

phrase. actually promising but the results through this

41:20

whole process has become way more hope and

41:22

to the Catholic faith has been really interesting.

41:25

But. We're gonna! We want to use out

41:27

my friend Burritos Catholic you know, Chris Louis.

41:29

We want to use him to create highly

41:31

symbolic. Cat. A Calico Art.

41:33

There So many concepts like apostolic

41:35

succession or original san vs being

41:37

a state of race that we

41:40

can use art to conceptually explain

41:42

to a visit, but it's not

41:44

being done. I'm not going

41:46

to mention other apostles on here. not trends

41:48

of course, but. But. I

41:50

think there are some apostles you are doing this.

41:53

But. I don't think they're going nearly far

41:55

enough. So massive, Yeah to version of the.

41:58

of of the of the fathers It

42:00

was basically explaining how Catholic they are and

42:02

how they point to the Catholic faith and

42:04

they tell the Catholic story I think yeah,

42:06

we don't want the slanted redeemed Zuma version

42:12

Sorry, I don't want to monopolize so I'll

42:15

just say we really need a pot in

42:17

my opinion Dialectic

42:19

can only go so far meaning logic

42:21

argument. That's extremely important. It's our highest

42:23

nature. That's what makes us human Okay,

42:26

but maybe this comes from my music side We

42:29

need pathos the emotional side of things. We need

42:31

to grip people by beauty that is what the

42:33

church has done center of center of century and

42:37

You If you

42:39

can't get people through that way, you're not

42:42

gonna get people but what is missing in

42:44

apologetics is Storytelling and

42:46

in my opinion a lot of civilizational

42:48

scope Jesus Christ came into

42:51

the world when 2% of

42:53

human beings had ever been alive and since

42:55

that time 98%

42:58

of human beings have been alive and

43:00

he came to you know When the Roman

43:02

Empire bought three continents together, he brought together

43:04

the highest of revealed religion of

43:07

reason and philosophy and Civilization and

43:09

institutions and law from Rome Israel

43:11

Greece and Rome and it created

43:13

the greatest not perfect lots of problems But

43:16

the greatest civilization that has ever existed That's

43:18

a story we need to tell and

43:20

yes, I want people to stop being Protestant. I

43:23

want it's a false religion I want people to

43:25

come to the Catholic faith, but I

43:27

don't want it. I don't want to own Protestant

43:29

I want to tell Protestants Protestants. This is your

43:31

heritage I don't know how you

43:33

can be in favor of Western civilization if

43:35

you're leaving out 1500 years plus

43:38

of it Which most Protestants tend to do

43:40

I that's kind of how I was raised

43:42

So I want an apologetics that

43:44

is using all the tools we have for

43:46

beauty in the physical and the digital realm

43:49

Bringing them together and I want an

43:51

apologetics. It's fundamentally about telling a story at

43:53

a Civilizational scale.

43:55

So that's Why

43:59

should have. Ring with asking

44:01

you about eternal prison them

44:03

because it's to this is

44:05

this is like I think

44:07

the best way to convince

44:09

people of Catholicism is actually

44:11

by seeing the church through

44:13

history, seeing how the church

44:15

spreads, and seeing how God's

44:17

spirit covers the arse. It's.

44:20

Like a clown to this pig and

44:22

world and.spirit to subdue the earth A

44:24

nice the I can see the us

44:26

where because I gotta we gotta strike

44:28

last time but these barbarians. Careful

44:31

and the barbarians who works

44:34

for me human sacrifice to

44:36

see. If subdued by God's

44:38

spirit him and get into follow says

44:40

i'm in. It's heyday just really transforms

44:43

the face of the earth and such

44:45

an awesome topic to get into and

44:47

out. As a Protestant, I was reading

44:49

the Church Fathers and I was seeing

44:52

so many incredible stories about the demonic

44:54

being battled by Catholic priests are relics

44:56

pushing back the demonic or I'm in

44:58

San Agustin is using historical apologetics all

45:01

the time designing to the Jews in

45:03

the heretic since because maddox to the

45:05

Donatists wherever guys this was. All prophesied

45:07

and the Old Testament You're seeing the

45:10

pagan alters All and the Catholic alters

45:12

go up. Oh, and by the way,

45:14

that prophecies of all you heretic since

45:16

cause metics, you're separating from the church

45:18

as well. You see it and you

45:20

learn Israel. Yeah, and he's a got

45:23

the it's It's extremely historical storytelling, apologetic,

45:25

And. That. He. Has his image.

45:27

He says basically what we've seen.

45:30

Is. The most powerful leader of the

45:32

most powerful empire in the history of

45:34

the world. He signed him up pagan

45:36

Roman emperors and they've gone from persecuting

45:39

christians the now by their laws, helping

45:41

spread the Christian faith, And the most

45:43

powerful emperor is now kneeling at the

45:45

tomb of the fishermen. And. Rare.

45:47

These are stories and images that

45:50

we need to tell people that

45:52

whether they like it or not,

45:54

This. Is the church in the face

45:56

and built the civilization they want to maintain

45:58

and unless they get. They're.

46:01

Not gonna get western civilization or

46:03

for anyway so I could go

46:05

on. But yeah so was there

46:07

was criticism. Tweet:

46:09

Cryptic tweet the other day. Jones. That.

46:12

Isn't gonna be doing work for us? How

46:14

did he. He. Tweeted something about

46:16

starting a new big project so. Ah

46:19

no, we haven't talked too much yet.

46:21

What we saw: more budget to raise

46:24

a litter of so but now what

46:26

we're gonna, Lot of people are talking

46:28

to. Have a lot

46:30

of really impressive people on the advisory board

46:32

of We just announced Eric a bar at

46:35

today. I Love Eric! Rent

46:37

on there was gonna try and you only have eyes we

46:39

want to. What? Anthony were still

46:41

have have have an eye out

46:43

for the same album. I know

46:45

I gotta remember you as know

46:48

I have added Nurses go inappropriate

46:50

because. He's breaking

46:52

the ice cream is be in here

46:54

and that reminds me threat. The.

46:56

Are naive it's hey not nights he very

46:58

nice the heat of the efficacy I forget

47:00

what I even said and I was your

47:03

video and you are talking about the now

47:05

a bag amid bay and your and you

47:07

read naive and say as diet my eats

47:09

of ethnicity She's a couple of. At

47:12

his I'll I'll have an equal to correct.

47:14

Really loves a hamstring on and we'll see

47:16

what happens. I am deeply admirers work I

47:18

every what happens or you don't want some

47:20

oh it's so much nave a day and

47:22

that that I gotta have your and. I'll.

47:25

Tell you that the the the are like

47:28

the the miss be an hour. Whole.

47:31

That whole love discourse. Like.

47:33

Obvious pros or whatever.

47:36

But. Whenever I found myself like thinking I

47:38

had something to add it would have been

47:41

something that I would have had the point

47:43

the mirror at myself so much. Like.

47:45

Anything I see, That's that. I

47:48

would have just been. All of us

47:51

are struggling with this the temptation right

47:53

now to. The. Of of attention

47:55

like we want, we want to. I mean I

47:57

have a podcast on Friday? Get people to see

47:59

me. And I found myself unable to

48:01

even have a criticism that I wouldn't be able

48:03

to laugh at myself. and I was guilty of

48:05

and of like. If whoever. Is

48:08

whoever is without sin cast the first stone

48:10

And that was really? Like. Which

48:12

struck me about the whole situation was like i

48:14

can't say anything here because anything like use anybody

48:16

of i'm onto person guilty of. Done.

48:21

And sides good self awareness and as

48:23

I said like not everyone has either.

48:25

A. Take on everything and just seeing all that

48:28

are mostly what I just wanted to have.

48:30

his I'm Always is trying to put forward.

48:32

How do we lower the obstacles

48:34

and the barriers that keep people

48:36

from Christ and his church? Ah,

48:38

and and. If. You're gonna put

48:40

up a barrier if we're going to make

48:42

something difficult for someone. You. Better have

48:45

really overriding evidence that it's it's

48:47

necessary for. The. Wellbeing of others.

48:49

and not just because you think it's a heartache.

48:52

Will Not just that, you have to

48:54

remember when your conversion happens, how excited

48:56

you are, and how much you want

48:58

to share that? Yeah, Drug. Users

49:00

want to share that with people's It's

49:02

like how can you expect somebody who's

49:04

whole life? It's France formed. The

49:07

go from living one way and then they

49:09

actually a different person. Limited nevertheless and expect

49:11

them to not want to tell people about

49:13

a little merchant. It wasn't until the next

49:15

big yeah it's It's a double standard to

49:17

to be like oh these former only fans

49:19

models. Now they're just grifters. They've got a

49:21

new thing to get attention. But. Then

49:23

if you hear of but a lot of the

49:25

but I feel like a lot of it is

49:27

no you just consider them more detestable another sinners

49:29

length at it like have you here like news

49:32

Tessa My former gang members are like people in

49:34

my British gangs and stuff and of fast or

49:36

sound Jesus now used to crack people over the

49:38

head with my decision in the yo and and

49:40

then I talk about Jesus like all it's really

49:42

good or even like a former. Yeah.

49:45

Or even like a former price and pastor who

49:47

now like teaches the all a d somewhere. And.

49:49

A beer like most people are like what a grifter.

49:52

It's I am a city so it's

49:54

like he wanted to give everybody a

49:56

fair shake. It and give them

49:58

as a lot. I think they're probably. Are like

50:00

I did like that must be told

50:02

her story in written form right? I.

50:04

Think that, ah, there's probably better outlets

50:07

to do things on. But that the

50:09

knowledge thing. It was weird because. I'm.

50:12

Like she's not even Catholics and if it

50:15

became such a Catholic conversation, it's like. Are

50:17

you know I got Agra? I'd much rather him

50:19

as be supported and now salary Give her a

50:21

mean it's it's new it's a news item I

50:23

get a famous person know I think like a

50:26

that's why I said in all my both and

50:28

my older video on celebrity conversions and in this

50:30

one. Yeah. You should celebrate People

50:32

Pleaser Prudence Like a someone's brand new convert, you

50:34

don't just put them out on the convert. Speaking

50:36

to our. I. Gotta lie on. Let.

50:39

They they need some time. You just joshua.

50:41

you didn't somebody give you advice like that.

50:44

Yeah. Scott Han I had

50:46

a number of opportunities. To

50:50

write. Conversion memoirs right away.

50:53

And. I. I

50:56

was leaning against it but I was

50:58

excited by but I talked with Scott

51:00

and he. He. Recommended being in

51:02

the church at least five years before doing

51:04

it and I think it was one of

51:06

the some of the best advice I've ever

51:08

been given and. Yeah. You have to

51:11

live the fade as become part of your. Being.

51:13

And of course, being a Catholic, that and that's

51:16

a process that continues until the day he died.

51:18

So as I think I was catholic for about.

51:20

I. Sorry, where he a Catholic Answers or the

51:22

As and eleven years after after my daughters and.

51:25

Yeah. I mean we could

51:27

talk about why me and robber cradle Catholics

51:29

and that's much better than being of over

51:31

by bullets Could my little real good that

51:33

they're still prayers I can't learn. My wife

51:35

and her family will Sam and I'm like

51:37

yeah I don't have phrased couldn't afford a

51:39

large. As right like that,

51:41

neither of us are going along a vegan. I have a

51:44

lot of eight months to re anthony. It

51:46

is a month if you say among your

51:48

actually not even technically part of the church.

51:50

so it's as an art thou amongst women

51:52

and anybody who says among. Your. Actually

51:54

caught a schematic so. Resist

51:58

your prayer life and something. Val

52:00

Di he's hit it gives

52:02

a blizzard. Are you among

52:04

women are marry only hears

52:07

prayers in our. A.

52:09

Victorian. English and Charlie Years

52:12

Prayers and Latin as the

52:14

Truth. Films.

52:17

Have a are going to fight over. We're going to

52:19

go over there. Were going to get into some of

52:21

the Jews years affix. We will see you guys on

52:24

Thursday with Jay. Dire object: I are feminine. I'm

52:26

going to tell him why he is large thing

52:28

as an ortho bro and he needs to come

52:30

home to Rome in a go of real well

52:32

because lot of people who have a husband and

52:34

among the you guys they were you are gives

52:36

of of the. Other side.