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1:08

listening to Duropa Gando by the

1:10

Cycling Podcast. Today we are

1:12

in Rapalano, Tármán. Today

1:26

we are in Rapalano, Tármán.

1:55

It's been a frantic day, hasn't it?

1:57

It's been a breathless day. taking

2:01

for several reasons that we'll discuss in a minute but

2:03

it was a breathless yeah

2:05

I mean I've spent most of the day in the car I

2:08

don't know what you did but yeah in the car

2:10

with you yeah you were you were weren't you I mean

2:12

it was just I mean we're in the part of the

2:14

year now where the trends was a little bit longer but

2:17

I mean beautiful drive it was

2:19

you know through the landscapes

2:21

of this southern part of the

2:24

Chantilly area south of China

2:26

and with view of the Monta

2:28

Miata what a stunning place once

2:31

again Brian I

2:33

know Tuscany pretty well not as well as

2:36

you I've never lived in Tuscany but I've

2:38

explored the south of Tuscany quite a lot

2:40

especially the area around Monta Chino and over

2:42

towards Alleto I didn't really know sort of

2:44

the area around Ashano and we went on

2:46

a drive where we tried to cut into

2:48

the route onto the route for

2:50

reasons we'll talk about later

2:52

and that section of the

2:54

drive was one of the more

2:57

stunning drives I've ever experienced on the

2:59

Giro d'Italia these huge sweeping views one

3:01

of the characteristics of particularly

3:03

the country south of Siena is how

3:05

open it is and how open the

3:08

views are and you get these wonderful

3:10

sort of crests these wonderful platters where

3:12

you can see 360

3:14

degrees in every direction at this time of

3:17

year it's just sort of brilliant vibrant green

3:19

which is it's not the

3:21

image that you see on the famous

3:23

postcard pictures of this part of Tuscany

3:25

the sort of the gladi the end of

3:27

the final scene in gladiators isn't it yes

3:30

it is filmed just south of Snippians and

3:32

Monta Chino but it's not that that color

3:34

that shade that light is it it's a

3:36

much sort of more vibrant yeah like like

3:39

I mentioned to you in the cars well you also see

3:41

it in the in the soil types you

3:44

know often when you and this is a once

3:46

again the wine producing area when you see the

3:48

how much the composition is made out of

3:50

clay and how much is made out of

3:52

limestone and all that it just it

3:55

gives a very dramatic sort of shade to

3:57

the to the soil the lighter the

3:59

soil and the colorations down

4:01

here. And a

4:03

couple of years ago, seems like longer than that,

4:06

I did Star de Bianche, the Gran Fondo, the

4:08

shorter one, it was like 160 kilometers. Did

4:10

you win? No, I did not win. But

4:12

I had a great day. And this

4:15

was around the southernmost point, Buonconvento I think

4:17

was the southernmost point that days up. And

4:20

seeing that I went as slow as I

4:22

did, I had a pretty good time to

4:25

scout the terroir here. Yes,

4:27

Brian, and that's how well I'm talking about.

4:29

It's the, well, a lot of it is familiar

4:32

from Star de Bianche, isn't it? But of

4:34

course, Star de Bianche is in

4:36

March, and often, if I've

4:38

got a bugbear with Star de Bianche, I don't

4:40

think it's the season that shows off that area

4:42

in its best light, through its best effect. No,

4:45

I mean, we've even seen snow in

4:48

Star de Bianche. And it's a colder part of Tuscany

4:50

that obviously has a little bit more altitude than

4:53

any other place around here. Attitude and

4:55

altitude. Brian, can

4:58

you describe the slightly sad scene, sad

5:00

scene from our point of view, because

5:02

today we were blessed, the press room

5:04

was blessed, with one of the all-time

5:06

great Giro d'Italia buffets, and they're in

5:08

rarefied company because they're a great buffet,

5:10

most days on the Giro. Today's was

5:12

spectacular, there was an outdoor buffet and

5:14

indoor buffet, and I had almost none

5:16

of it, Brian, because we arrived with

5:19

30 kilometres to go on the stage, I

5:21

ran inside, had to sort out various things,

5:24

ran outside to the finish. And

5:26

here we are, and it's gone. Yeah, same for me, I think

5:28

we were just trying to catch the tail end of it to

5:30

get a cheeky glass of wine

5:33

for recording purposes. For recording purposes, I think.

5:36

But it wasn't to be. Brian,

5:40

we should, at this point in

5:42

the podcast, as we always do,

5:44

tell people what happened today, summarise

5:47

the stage in what we call

5:49

the Procheso a la Tapa. The

5:51

Procheso a la Tapa, the first stage

5:54

in position. We

6:00

are in Rapolano, Terme, I don't

6:02

think I've even mentioned that or

6:05

had mentioned that until now. Where

6:07

do we start this morning Brian? How long

6:09

was the stage please? The

6:13

stage 6 of this year's Giroitalia

6:15

started in Torre Lago which is

6:17

a small town right

6:19

in the outskirts of Vierrejo and the stage was

6:22

180km. Brian

6:24

it's a slightly mean question now because

6:26

I didn't ask you to prepare this

6:28

but the particular location of the

6:31

start, you know

6:33

it I think. It's an

6:36

unusual setting, a very

6:38

beautiful setting. It's got something

6:40

to do with Puccini and what can you tell

6:42

us about where we started? Honestly

6:45

it never looked better than it

6:47

did today. They did a bit of work to

6:49

get everything ready for the Giro. Ironically

6:52

I saw a sign saying don't leave yet, there's

6:54

still holes in the road you

6:56

need to fill. Yeah

6:59

it's some of this Puccini festival taking place

7:01

there with Luca being the birthplace

7:03

of Puccini. I've

7:06

been there once to see

7:09

maybe the Fanchula de la

7:11

West, one of his famous

7:13

operas. When

7:16

the road route was announced it actually said

7:18

in the initial paperwork that I saw that

7:20

it was to start in Vierrejo which

7:22

is very famous for its carnival which takes place

7:24

in the winter, second biggest carnival of Italy. But

7:26

it kind of makes sense to do it in

7:28

Torre Lago because I think it's like I

7:31

feel like there's a lot of cultural equity

7:33

in this Giro especially this year for one

7:35

reason or the other and it

7:37

kind of makes sense that it was

7:39

Torre Lago. It's kind of a sprawling

7:41

sort of biosphere type. It literally looks

7:43

like that and the wildlife, third and

7:45

second take place there all year but

7:47

in particular the festival as well which

7:50

takes place every year which is a sort of

7:52

tribute to Puccini who of course died 100 years

7:54

ago this year. Brian

7:56

Werwerwe, the stage. doing

8:00

breakaways today? There

8:02

were several breakaways, Daniel, and in a way,

8:04

it kind of seemed to

8:06

unfold a little bit like yesterday

8:09

in the sense that the early breakaways

8:11

were all caught with very, very

8:13

active once we started to hit

8:16

the climate, very high average speeds

8:18

initially. And, you

8:21

know, yesterday we spoke at length

8:23

about would this be or would this not be

8:25

a breakaway stage? And it ended up being so.

8:28

And there was a bigger breakaway that then

8:30

turned into a smaller breakaway and

8:33

that small breakaway. A breakaway was all

8:35

of a breakaway, wasn't it? Exactly, and

8:37

that breakaway eventually turned into a trio

8:41

that went all the way to the finish line and that

8:43

consisted of Pilayo Sanchez,

8:47

Juliana Le Philippe, and Luke

8:49

Plapp. And they actually built

8:51

up a gap that was

8:53

so significant that

8:57

Luke Plapp was actually in the

8:59

virtual pink jersey. He was 233

9:02

behind Pocati before today's stage and

9:04

the biggest gap they had was sort

9:07

of hovering above three

9:09

minutes. So

9:11

you have a stint in pink and that

9:13

was it. Virtual pink, yeah, a stint in

9:15

virtual pink. But

9:17

they fought very bravely to

9:19

keep the gap alive and

9:23

it was obviously diminishing and

9:25

it was quite sort of, I think,

9:28

speculation whether there would be an attack by

9:31

one of the GC guys or there would

9:33

be a fiamata from Tade

9:35

Pocaccia, it wasn't to be. And

9:38

all those three riders had a clear run

9:40

and by then Plapp was obviously not in

9:42

for any kind of GC hopes

9:45

regarding the pink jersey. So they,

9:47

with 4.3 kilometers, go as they

9:49

hit the strappo here

9:51

on the narrow roads around Rapulano.

9:56

They tried to kind of attack each other and Plapp was

9:59

more or less the one. keeping it cool and it

10:01

turned out he also was the one that had the

10:03

least firepower at the end and

10:05

everyone was looking to do to fell Alaphilippe to

10:08

do what Alaphilippe usually does and

10:10

he tried and failed and

10:12

opened up the sprint I mean

10:14

they had 21 seconds at 900 meters to go so they knew that they

10:18

were fighting for the win but Bilayo

10:20

Sanchez out sprinted Alaphilippe

10:22

and Platt finished third. Broan

10:25

were there any attacks, counter-attacks from the

10:28

group behind? Did they remain to detach

10:30

themselves and come home, for

10:33

example, on their own ahead

10:35

of the main peloton? Yeah

10:37

there was once again I mean there

10:39

were also riders who were in the

10:41

initial break but there was also an

10:43

attack at the end by Andrea Piccolo

10:45

of EF Education and

10:48

he also you know he did manage to

10:50

stay away. In five

10:52

seconds on the peloton

10:54

with all the general classification riders the main

10:56

general classification riders how many riders are in

10:59

that group five I'm looking now it was

11:01

a big group 30 over

11:04

30 riders and

11:06

on the general classification as a

11:08

result of that as

11:10

I said earlier breath pretty breathtaking stage

11:13

in a week of breathtaking stages at

11:15

this very blessed year in Italian blessed

11:17

for action blessed for weather are there

11:21

any changes on the general classification not much Brian

11:23

I have to say just looking down and no

11:25

changes really in top one no changes in top

11:27

14 positions no but I have to

11:29

we have to do a little bit of housekeeping

11:31

also because several riders and three

11:33

of them from the same team didn't take

11:36

start today so they were DNS and

11:38

it was not a rice back

11:40

from Israel Premetech his teammate Michael

11:42

Woods Florian Lipowitz I

11:44

believe one in your fantasy Giro team

11:47

and Riley Piccolo so yeah

11:49

Lipowitz and Broas and Riley Piccolo was the

11:51

last and third rider from Israel

11:54

Premetech who didn't take start today yeah crashes

11:56

in particular starting to take their toll and

11:58

they were coupled today as well

12:01

in the stage. Some minor, some

12:04

major possibly. Damiano

12:06

Caruso, former podium finisher of course

12:08

at the Giro d'Italia, he was

12:10

particularly badly hurt and

12:12

well there was a concern I have to

12:14

tell you among his team members,

12:17

team staff at the finish line,

12:20

he is now 17 minutes

12:23

down on general classification. He lost

12:25

a lot of time today but

12:27

more to the point, as

12:30

I said there are worries that he won't be able

12:32

to continue the Giro d'Italia. I

12:34

do also want to add to that you know

12:36

in the final stretch on

12:39

the steep line that went all the way up

12:41

to 19% at the steepest bit, Romain

12:43

Bate actually had a bit of a go but

12:46

Ine I think were the most active team in the

12:49

chase today and they were trying to set it up

12:51

I think for Navez and

12:53

so they were right on Bate's wheel. It

12:56

didn't look like Tade

12:58

Poggaccio basically did a

13:00

pedal stroke too much today. Brian

13:02

on general classification, Poggaccio

13:05

still leads by 46 seconds

13:07

over Thomas and in third

13:09

place is Danny Martinez who

13:11

is 47 seconds down, Oosterbroek

13:13

in fourth, 55 seconds down,

13:15

Rubio in fifth. He is

13:17

56 seconds

13:20

behind Poggaccio. In the points competition,

13:22

Milan still leads easily over Caden

13:24

Groves who looked very sprightly early

13:26

in the stage, was even sort

13:28

of motioning, posturing to

13:30

getting moves. Poggaccio

13:32

leads the King of the Mountains competition,

13:35

no real change there either and Oosterbroek

13:37

still leads the youth classification. Brian at

13:39

this point in the Prosthestola Tapa traditionally

13:41

you asked me a question. Yeah

13:45

the question is after

13:47

all the action who did you actually pinpoint

13:50

to tell us from the inside

13:52

of the peloton what happened? Brian I

13:54

spoke to Luke Plapp who was an

13:56

unlucky as we said and a lucky

13:58

third today virtual leader. One

14:01

point, I spoke to Geraint Thomas as well, who

14:03

as you said was

14:05

well shepherded, well led by his

14:07

Ilios team mates today. And also

14:09

spoke to the winning director Sportif,

14:11

the super tuscan himself, the man

14:13

who presented this stage to us

14:16

on the cycling podcast. Yesterday, marvellous

14:19

Max Chandry, who was a very

14:21

happy man as you can imagine. The

14:23

race was out of control the whole race. It

14:26

was ridiculous for the first ADK and

14:29

then went out of control and I was able to jump. Kaid

14:33

and Grosz actually set it up, it was amazing

14:35

how strong he was. For a sprinter

14:37

we all know how well he can climb, that was incredible. And

14:40

then the three of us worked reasonably well

14:42

to the finish. We

14:45

played games a bit, I was half

14:47

eyes on looking for time and half on the

14:49

stage. So I ended up riding a bit

14:51

harder than the others and they

14:54

were sort of playing it out but in the end I'm happy.

14:56

Was it being true to you and your mates? No,

14:58

no, no, I knew they were never going to let

15:00

it go, you could see from the gaps they were keeping

15:03

they weren't willing to let the jersey go. But

15:07

try to save, just be efficient and

15:09

save it for tomorrow as well. But no, it was a

15:11

good day, it was beautiful weather and it

15:13

was good fun out there in the break. Yeah I felt

15:15

really really strong on the climbs but those

15:18

two were super punchy so it was always going to be really

15:20

hard to get away especially on those short climbs.

15:22

So I knew I wasn't quicker

15:24

than them in the sprint. So I tried

15:27

to actually go on the gravel climb a long way

15:29

out but they were able to stay with me and

15:31

then I was just glad we worked reasonably well together.

15:33

You reek on the stage in March, I think the

15:35

weather was a bit different but did that help you

15:38

today? Yeah

15:40

in March I was in

15:42

the car the whole day, we planned to ride it and

15:44

it was pissing it down the whole recon.

15:47

But no it definitely did help on you, all

15:49

the gravel sections were coming and I

15:51

actually think gravel is definitely not my strong point

15:53

but I felt quite comfortable out there. I think

15:55

compared to the others I was riding quite

15:57

well on the gravel so I think the recon definitely helped. Who

16:01

knew the one stage I was so scared of for the whole race

16:04

ended up going pretty well? Yeah, we weren't

16:06

bothered about chasing the break, but obviously if

16:08

it did come back, yeah,

16:11

Johnny was going to have a good go. We don't know

16:13

what the gap was in the end, we knew it was

16:16

coming down, so that's why we kept the pace on a

16:18

bit. How about 20 seconds? Yeah,

16:21

so it would have been nice to come back and Johnny had

16:23

a good go, but yeah, it

16:25

was just a

16:27

day to definitely see the back

16:30

of. You're pretty

16:32

close to the break down the road, it looked as though you

16:34

might catch them at one point. Do you think the time trial

16:36

was on a lot of people's minds today, particularly in the finale?

16:39

Yeah, it was some of the GC guys, I guess. We

16:42

weren't bothered about it for most of the day, but

16:44

then coming into the final, we

16:46

were like, if we can just keep this pace

16:48

high and maybe we can come back

16:50

and Johnny can have a good go in the sprint. But

16:53

yeah, chappo to them, they stayed away,

16:55

but no, it was just

16:57

what we wanted really, just get through it as best as

17:00

possible. And based on the last

17:02

few days, how confident are you ahead of the

17:04

time trial? Well, I don't

17:06

know, it's always a funny one, isn't it? It's getting on a

17:08

TV bike now, but yeah, we'll see.

17:10

Just give it everything I got. It's

17:12

a tough one, you've got to pace it well with the

17:14

hard final. So we'll see. Well,

17:16

Max, yesterday, it was

17:18

for yesterday's stage, you presented this stage, you told

17:21

us exactly where it was going, you told us

17:23

all the intricacies, all the secrets of this stage,

17:25

but it worked, didn't it? That

17:27

reconning you did. No, you wouldn't... I

17:29

mean, if I say last night, I spoke to

17:31

the nutritionist and he's like, so who's

17:34

in breakaway tomorrow, I said Pelayo. Fernando's

17:36

going to try, but Pelayo's our guy. And

17:38

you know, I mean, it's not to say the story is like,

17:41

ah, this is bullshit, but we actually planned

17:43

Pelayo on the breakaway today. Magic Max.

17:46

No, seriously, seriously, I'm the guy, you know?

17:50

And it happened, it was tough. All

17:53

the first part was tough. Going

17:56

up to Wotterra, you know, the break didn't really go, it

17:58

took time, it took time, took time and then

18:02

all the strong guys came into action but

18:04

it still didn't go. Finally

18:07

the break goes first with the Torres

18:09

was in a bit, fantastic

18:11

day and then Pelayu got in with another

18:13

group they got together and then the group

18:15

finned out. We had an eye on the

18:17

breakaway, we had an eye on our GC

18:19

guy Enya Rubio and

18:22

we just carried on that way. And

18:25

then obviously Alafelipe and Plap,

18:28

you know, I mean Alafelipe is Alafelipe,

18:31

you know and Pelayu

18:33

probably underestimated him a little bit but

18:36

we knew he was fast and

18:38

yeah we got it. What about

18:41

that phase of the race Max when well

18:43

as they went over the Trappoda, the steep

18:45

climb, it was sort of 25-30 seconds.

18:48

It looked like if Pogacar had opened up

18:50

the gas they maybe could have caught the

18:52

break. What were you saying

18:54

at that point? No, we just fingers crossed

18:56

at one point you know. I saw the

18:59

whole thing, I knew the final,

19:01

then we got into the one minute

19:05

then I was talking to him as Jurgen

19:07

run on the second car, got pulled back

19:10

and I said listen if you can make it over

19:12

this then you're gonna get to the finish because they

19:15

gave it a stick but they didn't really happen so

19:17

then it then we said around 22 or

19:20

something like that seconds and we knew it's

19:22

gonna be a sprint then at that point. You

19:24

said to me a couple of days ago it was gonna be

19:26

a break but I don't think you meant that kind of break

19:28

did you? I think you maybe meant a bigger break was gonna

19:31

go and get more minutes. It had to

19:33

be a break stage you know. I would think

19:35

if I had a jersey

19:38

I wouldn't want to be you know

19:41

trying to win everything and not

19:43

before the TT maybe. Not before

19:45

the TT tomorrow and a day

19:47

but you know if you take

19:50

the edge off of the

19:52

group your group is not going to be winning group

19:54

then you

19:56

can race better and that's what happened. I think the Malia

19:59

Rosa group this kind of finally settled

20:01

into their own tempo and obviously

20:03

yeah. Paul Gertrude is an

20:05

instant, as I read left and right, he's an

20:07

instant guy and he made an attack and whatever.

20:12

Pelyo, we don't know too much

20:14

about him. Were you confident in that

20:16

sprint and also just tell

20:18

us a bit about him as a rider? Personally,

20:21

you know, he came to the team new so it's

20:23

the first time actually we're together in a bike race.

20:25

We didn't know each other because, you know, circumstances

20:28

of race program. But

20:30

Torino is really struggling the

20:33

first day, second day in

20:35

Toropa. I said, listen, Giro's

20:37

long, got tons of stages, we'll get there

20:40

and basically we are. Can't

20:43

see tonight. Thanks, Mike.

20:46

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a range of casual clothing to look

21:11

the part off the bike as well.

21:14

And you can sign up for that email at

21:16

the MAP website and get updates direct

21:19

from them. But the items that caught

21:21

my eye in particular were

21:23

the essentials hoodie, which comes

21:26

in a range of colors. But the

21:28

one that really appealed to me was

21:30

a sort of Giro-esque magenta pink hoodie,

21:33

kind of a mix, a

21:35

blend between the Malleurosa and the

21:37

Cuclimino jersey. The magenta is somewhere

21:39

midway between the two, a bit

21:42

like the color of bib

21:44

shorts that Tere Pagaccia got in trouble or

21:46

might have got in trouble for wearing the

21:48

other day. Because they

21:50

weren't the regulation Giro Malleurosa

21:52

matching pair, a very attractive

21:55

magenta color. Quite fancy

21:57

one of those hoodies myself. But there's a range

21:59

of t-shirts, long- sleeve t-shirts, crew

22:01

style sweatshirts as well. So go

22:03

to map.cc and check out the

22:06

clothing that will make you look

22:08

the part when you've finished your

22:10

ride. Talking of emails as I

22:12

just mentioned a moment ago the next edition of the

22:15

1101 Cappuccino will be coming

22:17

out tomorrow to subscribers. You

22:20

can subscribe at the cyclingpodcast.com website

22:22

and then the 1101 Cappuccino

22:25

will be delivered directly to

22:27

you and it's the debut column for

22:29

this duo from young Richard Abraham. So

22:31

look out for that sometime

22:33

tomorrow morning. Now back to Daniel

22:35

and Brian who well I hope

22:37

they haven't got too dusty out

22:39

there on the white roads. Well

22:44

Brian a surprising result I suppose as far

22:46

as a lot of people are concerned and

22:48

simply because you know Anna Philippe was the

22:51

man with the pedigree in that

22:53

leading trifecta that leading trio. It would

22:55

have been a nice story would have

22:57

been a bit of a redemption story

22:59

as well wouldn't it for Alaphilippe to

23:02

win here at the Giro d'Italia particularly

23:04

when today his well

23:07

némico in Casa you're saying in Italy

23:10

the sort of enemy not next door

23:12

but enemy in your own house Patrick

23:15

Lefebvre was not only at the Giro

23:17

he was on the course handing out

23:19

bottles. Yeah bottle service usually means something

23:21

else when we talk about Patrick Lefebvre.

23:24

Yeah yes

23:26

it would have been a great story it was

23:28

not a great story in the sense

23:30

that he was beaten in much in the same way that Valgríne

23:33

narrowly missed out yesterday and that would

23:35

have been a great comeback story. Alaphilippe's

23:38

is a different kind of comeback story

23:41

and let's face it the finale

23:43

today with that ramp that we

23:45

mentioned in what was the other

23:47

side of Ashana wasn't it was

23:50

absolutely tailor-made for the Alaphilippe of

23:52

yes the year the Alaphilippe of

23:54

his best years I mean Brian

23:56

we rode up it and just generally those

23:58

last 15 kilometers and indeed

24:00

the whole route today were absolutely spectacular. Brilliant

24:03

crowds, the crowds have been a feature of

24:05

these fantastic first six stages of the Gio

24:07

d'Italia. I don't know how much that has

24:09

had to do with the weather, the areas

24:11

we've gone through. The fact that the Italian

24:14

public, I mean I'm seeing it every morning

24:16

around the UAE team Emirates Plus, they're really

24:18

warming to Pogacia. Do

24:21

you think they're warming in

24:23

the sense that they didn't like him to begin

24:25

with? I don't think they knew him. I

24:28

think around here they do because of his

24:30

attack in the Strade Bianche probably. But I

24:32

think Italian cycling unfortunately is such a low

24:34

ebb or has been for the last few

24:36

years that the big international stars of cycling

24:38

are simply not very well known and I

24:40

think that applied to Pogacia as well. My

24:43

four year old daughters know Pogacia.

24:45

You work in cycling Brian. They do call him

24:47

Pogacia though so I don't know, he doesn't count.

24:51

So no stage win for Alaphilippe but

24:53

there was a stage win for Pelayo

24:56

Sanchez of Movistar Max

24:59

Shandris Pelayo Sanchez or the Pelayo

25:01

Sanchez that Max Shandris anointed to

25:04

get in the break today and

25:06

he's a young rider, a very

25:08

promising young rider. In

25:10

his first year at Movistar, he was

25:13

at Burgos Biace last year, 24

25:15

years of age. Brian came to prominence for the

25:17

first time. The first time I noticed him was in the Vuelta

25:19

in 2021. A

25:22

sort of home stage to El

25:24

Gamonitero, the stage that Superman

25:27

Lopez won for Movistar

25:29

actually and that

25:31

was the day before Superman

25:33

Lopez kind of self-immolated and got

25:36

himself kicked out of Movistar. But

25:39

Pelayo Sanchez rode very well that day. The

25:41

following year he contracted

25:44

glandular fever or mononucleosis and

25:47

that laid him low for

25:49

a while. Had another

25:51

good year, promising year last year, got

25:53

his moves to Movistar. One

25:55

early, one quickly for them this

25:57

year in Mallorca. He's

26:00

good in Asturias, again his home region, before

26:02

the Giro d'Italia. He's a fast rider, he's

26:04

a punchy rider, and he's a guy who

26:06

I think we're going to be seeing a

26:08

lot more of and hearing a lot more

26:10

about. Definitely, and once again, and

26:13

this is a... I'm

26:15

pretty convinced he hasn't done Erasmus, you

26:18

know, the EU exchange university program, but

26:21

brilliant English. And if this

26:23

is his first year at Movistar, I'm pretty certain that's not

26:25

where he picked it up because if you speak Spanish there,

26:28

you'll ride it home. Yeah, he

26:30

won't have learned it at Borgo Spiace either, I don't think, although

26:32

they do have some international riders,

26:34

but English is certainly not

26:36

a lingua franca in that team. Brian,

26:40

the race behind, we wondered

26:42

about Pogac chart this morning. I wondered about

26:44

him because I was standing next to... I

26:47

was listening in, I was giving interviews this morning, and

26:50

he did say at one point, it might

26:52

be a break today. A

26:54

break today, you get it? Yeah,

26:56

I get it. You get it?

26:59

He would make an exception. Yeah,

27:01

I wondered what he meant by

27:03

that. However, as I said, as

27:05

we were driving through

27:09

those last 15 kilometres, Brian, I

27:11

think most of the GC riders, and this is

27:13

the question I put together at Thomas, most of

27:15

them will have had an eye, some kind of

27:17

eye on tomorrow's time trial. We're going to hear

27:19

more about that time trial later in the episode. The

27:23

climb, particularly tomorrow, is so

27:25

significant that I think a

27:29

few general classification riders were preoccupied

27:31

by that today. Yeah,

27:33

without a doubt. Make no mistake, in

27:36

the sense that it was still a hard stage for

27:38

them. Once

27:40

again, we saw the Ineos team

27:42

take very big responsibility and goes

27:45

to show again, it's about being in

27:47

the right position, it's about dictating what's going to happen, it's

27:49

going to have a clear view of the race and keep

27:51

a pretty tight leash on whatever

27:54

scenario could eventuate. And

27:56

they do that because they're clearly not riding for some time.

28:00

second place here and that's in

28:02

spite of being against one of the strongest riders

28:04

of all time. But

28:06

goes to show and they

28:09

probably also with a

29:57

lot of preparation that went

29:59

into it. We heard about Luke Platt

30:01

reconning the stage earlier in the year and

30:03

that was the case with a lot of

30:06

the general classification writers. And Brian just briefly,

30:09

Poggaccia where he currently stands in the

30:11

general classification, where he obviously leads to

30:14

general classification. But we talked about him

30:16

being under par or

30:18

over par after stage

30:20

one in Torino or

30:24

after stage two. Do you think he will

30:26

be ecstatic about the way

30:28

the first six days he's gone? Broadly

30:31

satisfied? Yeah,

30:34

I think so. He still has a

30:36

complete team in

30:38

his support. No accidents.

30:41

The one that was where he punctured

30:43

and slid in the corner there, got

30:46

away with that and still won the stage. And

30:49

I think we've seen G-rolls.

30:51

I mean, just

30:53

think of how Garen Thomas has been fairing

30:55

here in the first year when

30:57

he was really going for the GC. He

31:00

lost that possibility on the first mountain stage to Edna.

31:03

So there's a lot of that as well. It's not a

31:05

vanity thing that how your lead

31:08

is after week one. It's just a question

31:10

of being in a good position to win

31:12

the overall bike race two weeks later. So why

31:15

wouldn't he be happy? Brian,

31:18

we'll talk later and we'll talk more about

31:20

the time trial and what we expect from

31:23

the time trial later on. But today

31:25

was another fantastic stage and lots of ingredients

31:27

have come together in the first six days

31:29

of this Giro d'Italia. We mentioned it yesterday.

31:31

One has been undoubtedly the course, the course

31:33

to ice. Well, I sort

31:36

of overlooked or underestimated before the Giro d'Italia. I

31:38

said it was a turkey. It's definitely not a

31:40

turkey. It's a prized bird of a stage or

31:42

it has been over the

31:44

first few days. The weather has been fantastic.

31:46

I have a hard point about the light

31:48

quality in these Italian races, but it looks

31:51

like the Giro d'Italia. It looks beautiful. And

31:53

as I said, I've never seen that area in

31:55

Southern Siena look more beautiful than it did today.

31:57

We've had fantastic crowds and we've had great racing.

32:01

The other sort of added garnish Hans

32:04

Rügenberg is walking past from

32:06

the Telegrath, making

32:08

jokes and gestures. The

32:11

added sort of garnish

32:14

of Pogacar and Pogacar's presence,

32:17

even when it hasn't been

32:19

him attacking, the threat

32:22

of Pogacar possibly attacking, that has

32:24

added to the spectacle as

32:27

well. I'm not the

32:29

only person who has enjoyed the first

32:31

six days of the Giro Vitalia. Our

32:34

good friend, Giro Scognamilia of La

32:37

Gazeta de los Sport, well

32:40

we know that sometimes it's difficult

32:42

to get Giro to even talk

32:44

about the race, even broach the race. Indeed

32:47

there was a survey

32:49

on Twitter the other day, do

32:51

you prefer Giro talking

32:53

about cycling or talking about beaches and other

32:55

things and people generally prefer him not to

32:58

even talk about the Giro d'Italia. However, you're

33:00

going to be disappointed because I did catch

33:02

up again with Giro this morning at the

33:04

start and we did

33:06

talk about a few things

33:09

two wheels. I

33:24

was going to raise this with you Giro, the

33:26

verdict of the survey was pretty unequivocal. People

33:38

don't like you talking about cycling but we

33:40

are not going to pay any attention to

33:43

that. We're going to

33:45

carry on regardless and we're going to

33:47

talk about the Giro d'Italia because that's

33:49

where we are. I'm Giro, you've become

33:51

famous for your scoops on

33:54

X as you rightly called it

33:56

and your transfer scoops. Yesterday

33:59

you and I were talking about... Jasper-Philipson, the fate of

34:01

Jasper-Philipson. Now you've followed this dossier and

34:03

the plot has thickened because I think

34:06

a few weeks ago you reported he

34:08

was likely to resign for Alpecin and

34:11

now there are people suggesting that no he's

34:13

going back to UAE team Emirates. What are

34:15

we to make of this? Yes it's true

34:18

but it's a strange thing that yesterday onyx

34:21

someone told me a fake account

34:23

of me. Daniel I

34:26

don't know if you know

34:28

this. There was a fake account on

34:30

me very well done but he was

34:32

fake and this account in

34:35

this account someone wrote that

34:37

Jasper-Philipson is going to sign

34:39

for UAE with details on

34:42

his new contract so this

34:44

was not for me this

34:46

has to be clear

34:48

I'm so famous. As

34:51

long as I don't start a fake only

34:53

fans for you. No exactly. No

34:55

but about Jasper to answer to your

34:57

question I mean obviously I don't have

34:59

the crystal ball my

35:02

bet now for Jasper maybe is

35:04

more likely than it stays. Okay

35:07

Chiro some more cycling

35:09

last thing for now. Yeah for

35:11

now Daniel. We're on our way

35:13

to we're in this beautiful park

35:15

this beautiful Puccini sort of well

35:18

what is it a

35:20

huge kind of eco-sphere dedicated

35:23

to Puccini who did

35:26

he die 100 years ago was died 100

35:28

years ago. I think so yeah listen for

35:30

every question about culture it doesn't belong to

35:32

me culture. Clarification about that in just a

35:35

moment and but you know on

35:37

the cycling I this morning

35:39

I've got an appointment with one of

35:41

you not really your boss but works

35:43

in the same organization Mauroveni because I'm

35:46

really enjoying this Giro d'Italia so far five

35:48

I think we've had five great stages and

35:51

I just want to ask Mauroveni about the sort of

35:54

soul searching the kind of islamide corseshin that

35:56

took place last year when a lot of

35:58

us thought the Giro was pretty

36:00

boring and RCS didn't really, obviously they

36:02

didn't really agree. I feel as though

36:04

they've gone away and they've changed quite

36:06

a lot of things with the route

36:08

this year. I mean certainly

36:10

from, didn't

36:12

happen such for a long time

36:15

that especially in the first stages

36:18

there was a parkour like

36:20

this, especially some finish as

36:22

Europa already in the second

36:24

day and mainly also one

36:26

day with two climbs up

36:28

600 meters, it didn't happen

36:31

since years So

36:34

I think that every year, every

36:36

one of us, this is a

36:38

little bit of philosophy, the listeners

36:40

maybe, but everyone of us learn

36:43

lessons from the past,

36:45

maybe from some mistakes,

36:47

why not? And yes, I agree

36:49

with the fact that this

36:52

year the start of the Giro has

36:54

been really entertaining maybe more than ever

36:56

in the last period. And we've also

36:58

been close to the seaside for most

37:00

of it, well for some of it

37:02

which must make you happy. And although

37:04

we're going inland today, we're going into

37:06

my kind of terrain today, into the

37:08

hills. Yes, dear listeners,

37:10

but my countdown goes and

37:14

especially all of us

37:16

and me mainly, we are waiting

37:18

for my stage on Sunday,

37:20

the stage of Naples. I will be there.

37:23

So Brian, Ciro very

37:26

much looking forward to Naples, looking

37:28

forward to the rest of the

37:30

Giro, enthusiastic about what

37:32

we've seen so far. And

37:34

indeed Brian, I have been so enthusiastic

37:37

and somehow contrite as well

37:39

about the way I trashed this Ciro

37:41

d'Italia route and I was sort of

37:43

about to send a strongly worded letter

37:45

to Mauroveni. I thought I should go

37:47

to Mauroveni himself and first of all

37:49

congratulate him and this organisation on RCS

37:51

Sport that is, on the

37:53

Giro so far and the route so

37:55

far and just ask him

37:59

exactly what. Was the thinking behind

38:01

it and whether there was some sort of soul

38:03

searching after last year after this year It was

38:05

full of very long stages and we didn't really

38:07

get the spectacle We wanted particularly in the first

38:09

couple of weeks and Brian.

38:12

I'm gonna live dub this interview Which

38:16

is sort of avant-garde podcasting bug give it

38:18

a go Mr. Freebie Well,

38:22

they are La

38:25

presenta tione job del giro de shendo

38:27

que Quelque mother Rankin

38:30

post UFO diva de request a

38:32

tap a do we corridor is

38:34

equal So

38:38

Brian I asked Maravini

38:42

Exactly what I just said was there

38:44

a kind of reevaluation what the jilis how your route

38:46

should be After

38:49

last year Maro said look I said that the

38:51

presentation of a GRO that I was a bit

38:53

tired of seeing these stages Where the riders just

38:55

look at each other the people at the roadside

38:57

don't get satisfaction I've seen them really compete and

38:59

neither do those watching on TV So

39:01

I said that if the athletes haven't understood that

39:03

this is their bread This

39:05

is their life You know their

39:07

livelihood if they haven't understood that I have to

39:10

do it. So based on experience

39:12

recent years I realized that this format no

39:14

longer provided satisfaction So we changed

39:16

it saying let's not do the so-called tough stages in

39:18

the last week anymore Because if

39:20

there are those the athletes wait for the last

39:22

week instead by reducing the mileage reducing the average

39:25

altitude game the whole Giro putting the climbs What

39:28

more evenly spread through the three weeks as

39:30

the possibility of those who lose seconds for

39:32

the general classification one day can Recoup

39:34

them the next day and therefore we all

39:36

we've got a battle on our hands That

39:39

was the idea and it's a format will

39:41

probably stick with I Then

39:44

asked Maro Brian when this

39:46

meant the artist was moving away from

39:48

this sort of tagline of the Giro

39:50

being the most Well the

39:52

hardest race in the most beautiful place He

39:55

said no because it remains the toughest race first of all

39:57

have to say the climbs initially and not like the climbs

39:59

you find anywhere else but having

40:01

them spread more evenly over the course

40:04

of the three weeks and doesn't mean

40:06

it's become less tough. Certainly

40:08

for example the start where you saw the first couple

40:10

of stages you have to get here on top form

40:12

it's not like it used to be when you could

40:15

train in the first and second

40:17

week here you have to be

40:19

on top form. You spoke about

40:22

how exciting these first few days

40:24

have been. I said that

40:26

today will be another cracker.

40:29

I say that today will be another cracker

40:31

tomorrow as an important time trial stage with an

40:33

uphill finish and the day after that it's uphill

40:35

finish at Plaști di Tivot. So it's a very

40:37

dense first week. Let's say

40:39

the toughness of a Giro is not

40:42

the altitude the mountains because as you've

40:44

seen we leaned into

40:46

that in the past and riders just

40:49

watched each other and nothing happened. Of

40:52

course you also need the right protagonist but

40:54

Mauro Veni was very

40:57

satisfied with what he's seen so far and felt

40:59

very vindicated I think today as he should.

41:02

Absolutely. The

41:05

architecture also means and I

41:07

guess that's also what he says it's way

41:09

more dynamic and he's also

41:12

I think he's been lucky in the sense

41:14

that imagine if Foggaccia

41:16

had taken two minutes

41:18

on every nose in Europa now

41:20

we're still in a position where it's

41:23

an open race I mean we'll see after the

41:25

time trial tomorrow. I don't

41:27

think there's anyone who can after

41:30

having seen this first Giro and not be

41:33

convinced that it's probably the best and certainly the

41:35

best first week of a Giro that I've experienced

41:38

as a spectator now working here

41:40

with you. I just I think

41:42

it's absolutely brilliant and we've been lucky also like I

41:44

said initially it's not you can't take for granted that

41:46

you can have any kind of Pacuor and you can

41:49

have whatever outcome on top of that it's always a

41:51

combination between the riders and and whatever RCS comes up

41:53

with. Right now for something

41:56

quite different today was a

41:58

gravel stage. Giro was going

42:00

off the beaten track. It

42:03

was going wild horse. I

42:05

thought it was a day to introduce a

42:08

sort of wild horse, a crazy horse of

42:10

the peloton. A bit of a maverick. Brian is a

42:13

rider who is well known in Denmark for being a

42:15

bit of a maverick by real sort of die hard

42:18

cycling fans but he's not so

42:21

well known outside of your home

42:24

nation. I'm talking about Alexander

42:26

Kampf who is here riding for

42:28

Tudor, former Danish champion of course.

42:30

I've known him for a few years

42:32

and he's someone who has very interesting

42:35

views on several things, lots of things,

42:37

very reflective rider, got

42:39

some curious, intriguing

42:41

interests. So I thought

42:43

he'd be a good candidate for today's

42:45

Kjakirata del Giorno. Here it is. Alexander

42:48

Kampf is making his debut on the

42:50

cycling podcast. Alexander

43:03

Kampf. Today is the day when

43:05

the Giro d'Italia goes off the

43:07

beaten track onto gravel roads into

43:10

uncharted territory, unfamiliar territory. I thought we needed

43:12

a maverick. We needed a bit of a

43:15

wild horse, a crazy horse. I remember the first

43:17

time I met you at the Tour of Yorkshire.

43:20

I did an interview with you and I said maybe

43:22

you're the dark horse for today and you looked at

43:24

me with mischief in your eye and you said maybe

43:26

I'm the white horse. But you are described as a

43:29

bit of a wild horse, a bit of a maverick

43:31

at times. Do you feel like a maverick?

43:35

I don't know. I don't want to

43:37

judge myself. I will let it

43:39

be up to other people to

43:41

do that. But if we look

43:43

at today, I think it's an

43:45

interesting stage. The

43:48

gravel section is

43:50

only a few gravel sections

43:52

of 11k in total.

43:54

So I don't think it will have

43:57

a big impact. I think it will be a breakaway. I

44:00

will make it to the finish and I

44:02

hope me or some of my teammates will

44:04

be in the break and we

44:06

can go for the stage race. What

44:09

I said about you being a bit of a maverick,

44:11

do you identify with that? Do you feel in this

44:13

world that you're someone who breaks the mould a little

44:15

bit? You're a little bit different from the average rider?

44:19

I didn't grow up in a family with a lot of sport.

44:22

Both of my parents were in politics. I

44:28

embrace diversity and we

44:30

have so many different personalities in this

44:32

sport and that's nice. I

44:36

like every single person

44:39

here. What

44:41

was that like growing up with two parents who were

44:43

in politics? You

44:45

have an opinion about your parents

44:47

and you

44:50

learn to deal with it. Were their politics

44:52

similar? Your mum's politics and your dad's

44:54

politics were at least similar? Yeah, they

44:56

were. They said Labour, the social-democrat

44:58

party in Denmark. They

45:02

believe in socialism and

45:04

we have the Scandinavian

45:06

model welfare system in Denmark which

45:08

means that as a taxpayer you

45:10

pay a lot but you also get a lot in return. It

45:13

doesn't depend if you are from a rich or poor

45:15

family. You are able to go

45:17

to university. Actually if you live outside

45:21

your parents' home and when you're 18 you get a

45:23

support of around 800 euros a month and

45:26

you are able to go to every

45:29

university you would like to. I

45:31

think we have a good model in

45:33

Denmark and they

45:36

supported the system. So

45:39

in all of that, how did you discover cycling? I

45:43

was watching the Tour de France and

45:46

now there's Tadej Pogacja. How

45:49

do you pronounce his name? I don't know. Pretty good, I think.

45:52

But I was watching Lance Armstrong and

45:54

I was just impressed that

45:57

he could show up every year for the tour.

46:00

I smashed him all. I felt a bit bad

46:02

for Jan-Ull. I know you wrote a book about

46:04

him, but who was

46:06

a great talent, but Lance, he He

46:09

was amazing and then I say, okay, I

46:11

want to be like Lance No,

46:15

but just the way he was riding

46:17

he was impressive, an impressive

46:19

athlete and now we

46:21

know the story behind but he still

46:25

Still

46:27

went out on the bike and busted his

46:29

ass, so you don't get

46:31

to that level for free Last

46:35

couple of things then I'll let you go.

46:37

I know in the last couple of years

46:39

you've been spending time in Colombia. No, I

46:43

went there on a training camp two

46:45

years ago, and then actually on

46:47

my First these

46:49

days because you always have a week of

46:51

adaptation I was scrolling through

46:54

Instagram and I went to explore and

46:56

I don't know that this amazing woman

46:58

popped up and I sent her I

47:00

make direct message and she

47:02

was seven hours away and

47:04

I kept texting her, hey where

47:07

do you live and What

47:09

are you doing? And and then

47:11

after two weeks I decided to drive

47:13

seven hours through Colombia to meet her

47:15

and I'm

47:17

happy that I did it. She's

47:19

an amazing woman and she support me

47:21

and I love Colombia and People

47:25

in Colombia they don't have much of course There's

47:27

people who have a lot but in

47:29

general they don't have a lot, but they have

47:31

good values and they're happy And

47:35

I love to be there and

47:37

there are people who's got a similar story about

47:39

meeting a young lady in Colombia

47:43

recently Okay, but

47:45

I support him in that Well,

47:48

I like that. Have a good day out there today on

47:50

the gravel. How's your Giro going

47:52

very quickly? How's your Giro been so far

47:55

so far? Just energy like you said you

47:57

didn't see me in the results, but I

48:00

hope I will be in a breakaway and can do something.

48:03

Let's see. So

48:10

Brian, I'm glad old campy,

48:13

I go on the camp sort of

48:15

issued a bit of a caveat qualifier

48:17

when he started talking about Lance Armstrong.

48:20

That's what I'll say. I think it was

48:22

required. You know, having had the conversation

48:24

the other day. I agree, but maybe

48:26

we're also at a point, especially for younger

48:28

riders, I mean, you're not as young as

48:30

many others. They come younger and

48:32

younger, but maybe it's

48:34

also something that we can take for granted. Yeah.

48:38

It's interesting. I think it's something that they

48:40

take for granted. Everyone knows, even

48:42

riders who are now, you know, starting

48:45

to come through professional ranks who

48:47

weren't even born when all that

48:49

happens. It's interesting though, that riders

48:51

now are starting to feel sort

48:53

of emboldened or at least able

48:56

to broach it where they weren't

48:58

four or five years ago. And you

49:00

know, the asterisk or the caveats,

49:02

they do have to be there as we,

49:04

we would be hypocrites if we didn't say

49:06

that having had the conversation we did a

49:08

few days ago about Marco

49:10

Pantan in sort of criticized some of our Italian

49:12

colleagues. Yeah, very true. Very true. Brian.

49:15

Not all of them, you know? Yes, we

49:17

are positively ancient. Brian,

49:20

it was a wonderful day

49:22

and a wonderful part of Italy. It

49:24

was a day rich with enlightenment,

49:29

chance encounters, planned encounters. And it

49:32

was a day which sort of

49:34

encapsulated a lot of what Tuscany

49:36

has to offer to the Giro

49:38

d'Italia and vice versa, the cycling

49:40

heritage of this region and

49:43

some of the culinary and

49:45

cultural heritage as well, that

49:48

Tuscany can sort of impart on

49:51

the Giro d'Italia. And we undertook our

49:53

sort of odyssey across the region on

49:55

our way to the finish. And over

49:57

the course of the day, as I

49:59

said. There were some chance encounters

50:01

and some planning encounters which

50:04

I thought would provide a nice sort of

50:06

postcard from today's 6th stage

50:09

after Girulio Hayaso. Here's some of

50:11

the people we met and spoke to along the

50:13

way today. I'm

50:32

a co-fisher of the Sieta de Mano The

50:36

Sieta de Mano concerto The

50:39

Sieta de Mano concerto He

51:00

was in the Clay Pidgey shooting game

51:06

Dario Pienni We were just

51:08

talking about his pal Moreno He was actually a

51:10

really really good rider but he became infamous for

51:13

being one of the larger riders shall we say

51:15

and he loved eating little Dario so

51:18

I'm glad that he's found... Ohh,

51:22

vocation! Yeah, he

51:24

was always one of his passions eating he

51:26

could suspend it once for being

51:28

rather too large for the

51:30

objectives that he had that season which were the classes

51:33

but our friend Malvento

51:35

have gone to his restaurant in

51:37

Volkera I think it's called Il

51:39

Bosqueto We'll find out more about that later but

51:41

I've got to give him a call Brian I've

51:44

got to give Dario a call which I've stayed in touch

51:46

I went to his house about 20 years ago for a

51:48

pro cycling magazine I spent the day with him,

51:50

ate a lot I've got

51:52

to give him a call because the

51:54

racest approaching his restaurant in Volkera

51:56

at the moment Destimpact

52:17

Salio? premieze

52:23

ahhh Nao Chocolate No

52:25

no no it Rodney gave

52:46

up I

52:53

am a travel hunter,

52:55

my name is Paolo

52:58

Val d'Ambriñe, sorry my English I

53:07

teach":- so

53:24

Ryan we'll go in order,

53:26

first voice we heard there was a gent

53:29

sight Belong to a gentleman who showed up

53:31

to the start this morning in a woolen

53:33

Bianchi jersey and plus fours, you

53:35

know plus fours are yeah and then we

53:37

kind of tweed they were they looked hot

53:41

I approached him and said you know excuse me sir you're

53:43

not a bit hot and he said well you know you

53:45

supposed to sweat when you ride a bike what's

53:47

the problem anyway I subsequently

53:50

found out this gentleman's called Marusco

53:53

Santorchi and he's a bit of

53:55

an institution him he's from Mezzana

53:57

de Pisa close to Pisa Born

54:00

in 1937, although at first he was a

54:02

little bit vague, shall we say, about how

54:05

old he was. He told me his birthday

54:07

next week but he didn't know how old

54:09

he was. He

54:11

was wearing this Bianchi jersey so I assumed he

54:13

was a FAFSA copy fan. He went on to

54:15

tell me that on the 27th

54:17

of July 1959, he remembered

54:19

the date FAFSA copy was riding

54:22

in Valer-Drome in Florence, I think,

54:24

for Nacete. And

54:26

Marusco got his autograph and also shook his

54:28

hand as he's shaken the hand of many

54:31

illustrious riders over the years. And

54:34

he became that day a

54:36

huge copy-an-or, huge copy fan. FAFSA

54:39

copy also died four months later. So unfortunately

54:41

for Marusco he would never be able to

54:43

meet him again. But Marusco sort

54:45

of dedicated his life to cycling in a

54:47

way, as an amateur cyclist at least. He

54:49

used to work in glass, blowing, cutting, that

54:52

kind of thing. He's

54:54

a virtuoso of the trackstand. I don't even hold

54:56

any records but he's certainly very good at it,

54:58

even at 87 years of age or 86 or 87. After

55:02

about the present day and he said there are no

55:04

real riders anymore. I said what about Pogacar? He said,

55:06

well, okay, Pogacar. I'll grant

55:08

you Pogacar. But that was

55:10

a fun little... Is

55:12

this the first time you encounter

55:14

this gentleman? He comes to a lot of races, I

55:17

think. Yeah, always here in Tuscany.

55:19

I mean, Tuscany's a fairly big region.

55:21

But I always see him at the

55:23

Enra D'Artico, which obviously starts very close

55:25

to both him and I. And

55:28

also I've seen him at

55:30

the now non-existing

55:33

race, Grand Premio

55:35

de Camayode, which

55:39

goes across the down Monte-Manu that they

55:41

went up yesterday, up Monte-Pietro. And

55:43

he's... I mean, as you described before, you

55:45

can't really not notice him. So if you

55:48

had seen him before, you probably would have

55:50

been there. I had a marvellous Tuscany accident

55:52

as we heard there. Brian, the second voice

55:54

we heard or the second sort of encounter

55:57

you heard is arranging there was

55:59

well. That was a telephone encounter. And that was with

56:01

my old mate, Dario Pieri. We explained a bit of it in

56:04

the car there earlier. Dario, he finished

56:06

second in a Paris-Roubaix, second in the

56:08

Tour of Flanders. In some

56:11

ways, one of the great unfulfilled talents of Italian

56:13

cycling, but someone who was a larger than life

56:15

in more ways than one, a figure, and one

56:17

of those people who, as soon as you meet

56:19

him, you can't help but

56:23

love him, really, and you heard the sort of

56:25

warmth there in his voice when he picked up

56:27

the phone to me. I've spoken to him a

56:29

handful of times in the last 10 years, but

56:32

it's as though we've known each other all

56:34

our lives and we're great friends. So it was

56:36

good to hear from him, and I'm just

56:38

disappointed that we didn't get to his restaurant. I

56:41

asked him what he was serving there today,

56:44

and he said they would have- Didn't really sound like

56:46

your menu anyways, did you? No, they had some bisteca

56:48

for your audience, some tea bone, that's a famous steak

56:50

in this area. I

56:54

mentioned the dinner I had with him when I went to see

56:56

him the first time we sort of spent a day together, and

56:58

I remember I told you this story in the car, Brian.

57:00

I might be getting this slightly wrong, but he

57:03

was on a diet, he'd been put on a

57:05

diet at the time by his team, and I

57:07

think they banned him from eating pasta. So what

57:09

did Dario order? He ordered a pizza followed by

57:11

a tea bone steak. I'm gonna stick to the

57:14

rules again. This was about three weeks before the

57:16

classics. Brian, the last person that we heard from

57:18

there was Paolo Valdambrini, and he is president of

57:20

the Siena Truffle Hunters. He's

57:23

been a truffle hunter for 28 years, and

57:27

I've asked him various questions about truffle hunting in

57:30

this part of Italy. He cultivates truffles. He

57:32

doesn't just go into the woods

57:34

and find them. He's,

57:36

as I said, he's made it into a business, and

57:39

it's a pretty lucrative business as well. Three

57:41

kinds, three main kinds of truffles

57:44

around here, the

57:46

summer truffle, the prize white truffle, and

57:48

they're also black truffles as well. He

57:50

said the province of Siena is a

57:53

province very rich in

57:56

white truffles. I

57:58

asked him about the hunting. itself as we

58:00

know or as a lot of people know

58:03

by pigs and dogs can

58:05

hunt for Truffles and

58:07

he said dogs it absolutely has to

58:09

be dogs. The pig was the one

58:11

who discovered the truffle in antiquity Because

58:14

while grazing freely it would pull the truffles

58:16

out of the ground But

58:18

now it has to be dogs. He said the

58:21

important thing is That

58:23

the truffle must bond with the dog in

58:25

a relationship of genuine friendship Brian The

58:28

truffle must befriend the dog. How

58:30

does that work? Does he name

58:32

them? No, yeah Anyway,

58:35

we heard the other day about climate change

58:37

and how that's affecting rice growing. He also

58:39

said that climate change

58:41

is having a ruinous effect on the

58:45

likes of him who Produce

58:47

well, they they sort of

58:50

sell commercial truffles really requires a very

58:52

specific Yeah, I think situation

58:54

also as to when how much rain when does

58:56

it get cold the first time? It's

58:59

it's more different more than just a triangulation

59:01

of all kind. Yeah I mean

59:03

he particularly said to me so the moisture in the

59:05

soil is a big problem There's often too much moisture

59:08

in the soil nowadays and he said in summer average

59:11

temperature sort of where he grows his

59:13

truffles would be 30 32

59:16

degrees now it reaches 40 or 42

59:18

on a regular basis And

59:21

I know people like to hear how much truffles

59:23

are worth how much they cost and the summer

59:25

truffle 300

59:27

400 euros per kilogram he said the summer black truffle

59:30

about 200 250 euros per kilo The

59:34

white truffle he said usually has an at zero added

59:36

on the end But in recent years due

59:38

to climate change last year, it was 3000 to 4000 euros per kilogram

59:40

two years ago He

59:44

even reached seven thousand euros per kilogram

59:47

just finally asked him what the Perfect

59:50

dishes just show the truffles off to

59:52

their best effect the white truffle This

59:54

is he said more fried egg with

59:56

white truffle Easter is

59:58

the speciality per echelenza

1:00:00

but he also says of course tagliolini pasta

1:00:02

with wet truffle he's cracking it as well

1:00:04

he's a big sports fan and he well

1:00:06

asked him who's going to win the giuriditalia

1:00:08

and he said do I really have to

1:00:10

tell you I think we all know who's

1:00:12

going to win the giuriditalia so um that

1:00:15

was Paolo Waldambrini

1:00:17

who thinks that today Bogatia

1:00:19

is going to win the

1:00:21

giuriditalia um that's

1:00:23

not all of the food

1:00:25

chat for this evening because it's about

1:00:27

that time in the podcast when we

1:00:29

talk about yesterday's dinner and tomorrow's stage

1:00:32

la tapa di domani, la trina diieri tomorrow's

1:00:36

stage, yesterday's dinner Brian

1:00:49

you didn't join me for dinner last night while you were at

1:00:51

home um Betty's Betty's is a

1:00:53

strange name I'm always you sent me

1:00:55

there twice and it's good but I'm

1:00:57

always dubious about the name um and

1:00:59

it's in Pietrasanta just off the piazza

1:01:01

and had some nice pasta some melanzana

1:01:04

some aubergine for starter and I had

1:01:06

some pasta with five types of tomato

1:01:08

which was good simple but good um

1:01:10

had a Chianti Classico as well which was so

1:01:12

nice which was excellent so I didn't have dinner

1:01:15

I didn't want my wife to cook for me I came home

1:01:17

quite late well later than

1:01:19

we have family dinner but

1:01:21

we had a delightful

1:01:23

glass of Chianti Classico

1:01:25

ourselves actually on the

1:01:28

on the terrace where we hosted you for dinner

1:01:30

last year excellent very apt very apt um

1:01:33

for these two days in cesca giuriditalia

1:01:36

Brian tomorrow we move into Umbria you

1:01:38

know region that's close to my heart

1:01:40

uh it's far away from the water

1:01:43

yeah that's true as well um

1:01:45

the green heart of Italy is often

1:01:48

called um I spent a

1:01:50

couple of months there studying

1:01:52

other university the university of

1:01:54

foreigners in 1999 which

1:01:56

of course unfortunately became infamous

1:01:59

in the United Kingdom for the murder

1:02:01

of Meredith Kirchhoff. This is in Berugia?

1:02:03

Yeah. Oh. Yeah. In 2007, that was Brian.

1:02:11

Does that involve an American student as well?

1:02:13

Yeah, Amanda Knox. Yeah. She was

1:02:15

cleared. Yeah. There's been ongoing and ongoing. Yeah,

1:02:18

and there have been lots of documentaries made,

1:02:20

including one on Netflix, which is worth watching.

1:02:22

But the case was, still is. So

1:02:25

certainly, it's very complex. So Brian, we're in

1:02:27

Umbria tomorrow. We've got a time trial from

1:02:30

Foligno to Berugia. You're off

1:02:32

duty again this evening. You don't have

1:02:34

to present it for us, because I've

1:02:36

roped in someone else. This

1:02:39

gentleman, who almost won the stage today, is

1:02:41

the Australian road race champion. He's the time

1:02:43

trial champion as well. Anyway, it's Luke Platt.

1:02:46

Jacob Lula's Luke Platt. From

1:02:48

Foligno to Beruja,

1:02:51

it's a 40k TT. And

1:02:54

it's really dead flat and quite un-technical for

1:02:56

the first 90% of the race. 34k

1:03:00

are all really flat and fast.

1:03:02

It's the Italian stallion standing next to

1:03:04

me now. So I think it's going to be a long.

1:03:07

You better identify who that is. The

1:03:09

one and only Felipe O'Gana. No,

1:03:11

I think it's actually going to be quite a held

1:03:14

back for 34k. That final six

1:03:16

kilometer climb is really tough. The first

1:03:18

2k, kick up really steep, flattens off

1:03:20

a little bit. And then the

1:03:22

last 2k is obviously beautiful. It's on

1:03:24

almost Parve up to the

1:03:27

Peruja town. And it's

1:03:29

a beautiful finish there. But yeah, it's a really tough last 6k.

1:03:31

So I think you have to hold back a lot in

1:03:33

the first 34k and then let

1:03:35

it rip at the end. So my money be

1:03:38

on today. You've got a chance that you can't, I

1:03:40

don't know, use a

1:03:42

sort of 62 chain ring in the first

1:03:44

30 kilometers and then just die up the

1:03:46

hill. That won't work. No,

1:03:48

I tried that in Recon. I tried to use a 60 and

1:03:51

a 62 in Recon. It's just too big. The

1:03:53

first 2k, the climbs, the steep, and that's where

1:03:55

it hurts. So I'll be on

1:03:57

the traditional 58 tomorrow. I

1:04:00

think there's some other teams that have got some different technology

1:04:02

that they'll try for tomorrow, but yeah, we'll be on the

1:04:05

traditional setup. I'm

1:04:07

looking forward to tomorrow. I don't like time trials

1:04:09

generally, but I'm looking forward to that finish up

1:04:12

through Perugia. Perugia is

1:04:14

a beautiful city. Do we finish on Corsa

1:04:16

Vanucci? It's one of the great streets in

1:04:18

Italy. In Italy you have this

1:04:21

phenomenon called the Passaggata, which is sort of

1:04:23

the after dinner walk or the Sunday afternoon

1:04:25

walk. The Passaggata on the

1:04:27

Corsa Vanucci is one of the great

1:04:30

Passaggatas of Italy. I

1:04:32

don't know whether we finished there. That's the main

1:04:34

thoroughfare in Perugia. I know we finished in the

1:04:36

middle of town anyway, but Brian just from technical

1:04:39

forces. I think if there's a myth busting of,

1:04:41

you know, personal thoughts tomorrow,

1:04:43

it's gonna be an amazing time trial and the

1:04:46

time trial that finished the Giro d'Italia last year

1:04:48

was also certainly like

1:04:50

an exception to that self-imposed rule. It's

1:04:52

not a rule. It's just a preference.

1:04:56

It's a self-imposed preference then. One

1:04:58

of many. Brian, first

1:05:02

40.6km is a long time trial as

1:05:04

we heard there, but this final climb,

1:05:06

6.6km. Okay,

1:05:08

the average gradient is only 4.2%,

1:05:10

but maximum is 16%. It's a

1:05:12

real climb as time trial. It's similar

1:05:15

to the one, another one we had in

1:05:17

Mumbria a few years ago, won by Tom

1:05:19

Dumoulin up to Monte Falco, if I'm not

1:05:21

mistaken. Really interesting what Luke Plapp said about

1:05:24

economising in the first 34km of the stage, the

1:05:27

flat part and, you

1:05:31

know, not trying

1:05:33

to, as he said, do what the

1:05:35

Italian stallion, as he referred to him,

1:05:39

might do, Filippo Ganna and

1:05:41

just try to gain as much time as possible in

1:05:44

those 34km and just sort of wing it up

1:05:46

the hill. Ganna can't win that one. No,

1:05:48

you can't win it, but guys like Ganna, they have no

1:05:50

choice really but to go as fast as they can on

1:05:52

the flat bit, I would assume. Tips

1:05:56

for the... Give me a time gap for Pogout Ciao

1:05:58

tomorrow, please, Brian. A time gap

1:06:01

for Pogacha, I mean, I think

1:06:03

the second on that time travel will actually be Garen

1:06:06

Thomas, the way he's riding right now, I

1:06:08

see him as an obvious candidate for

1:06:10

that, and let

1:06:12

me put it this way, I think

1:06:14

Garen Thomas will be happy with

1:06:16

losing anything less than a minute.

1:06:19

That would be a good result for him. Yeah,

1:06:21

if Pogacha goes nuclear, 40 kilometers,

1:06:23

we could see some, I mean, when you think

1:06:25

of the time gaps... Damage will be done, it's

1:06:27

just a question of how much. When you think

1:06:29

about the time gaps we saw in the second

1:06:31

time trial in the Tour de France last year,

1:06:33

inflicted by Jonas Vingegar, there

1:06:36

could be pretty, it could be a big

1:06:38

bill to pay tomorrow night. Brian,

1:06:40

hopefully we won't have a big bill to pay

1:06:42

at the end of our meal this

1:06:45

evening, but hopefully it will be a

1:06:47

delicious meal, as has been the case

1:06:49

very often on this Chiro d'Italia.

1:06:51

We're in Umbria tonight, I think

1:06:53

just, so we'll be

1:06:55

transitioning maybe to Umbrian cuisine, I'm

1:06:58

very much looking forward to it, and we will

1:07:00

reconvene tomorrow in Umbria

1:07:02

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1:07:07

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