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If the Jordan Lebron debate ever gonna end,

1:28

it ain't gonna end, but Bron's ago all

1:31

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1:32

Then grind and all my life, sacrifice,

1:35

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1:36

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1:38

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1:40

life, grind in all my life, all

1:42

my life, then grinning all my life,

1:45

sacrifice, hustle, ped Price

1:47

one slice. Not the bronuc geis swap

1:50

all my life, poppy, grind in all my life.

1:56

Hello, Welcome to another edition of Club Shay Say.

1:58

I am your host, Shennon Sharpe. I'm also so the propriet

2:00

of Club Shasha, and the guy that's stopping about for

2:02

conversation on the drink today is one of

2:04

the most powerful figures in sports. He's a

2:06

self made superagent, founder CEO

2:09

of Clutch Sports. His agency represents

2:11

over two hundred athletes in multiple leagues.

2:13

He's negotiated over four billion

2:15

dollars in contracts. He's an entrepreneur,

2:18

a businessman, and he's from the

2:20

east side of Cleveland to the top of the

2:22

sports world. His newest memoir,

2:25

Lucky Me, a Memoir of changing the

2:27

odds Rich Paul.

2:28

Frich, How you doing it? Bro?

2:30

This is no, don't even

2:32

start.

2:33

Go ahead, go ahead, tell your story, go ahead,

2:35

and then trying.

2:35

To get on club and you skip over

2:37

everybody but your dog.

2:39

But it's cool. Don't worry about it. You know what, you

2:42

know?

2:42

I got my old Brandon Kanyac. I said you about

2:44

it. I know you got it.

2:45

It's on my shelf.

2:46

Yeah.

2:47

Uh, you don't let me an investment. But

2:49

it's fine. I don't think. Don't

2:51

worry about it.

2:53

To come to get to where you got

2:55

to, come to where you came from and

2:57

do it in the class, in the manner in which

3:00

done it, and to help those

3:02

coming behind you to show them I did

3:04

it.

3:04

You can do it. Chiz,

3:07

thank you.

3:13

Let's let's start with the book, luck

3:15

at Me, a memoir of changing the odds.

3:18

Why was it important for you to write this book.

3:21

I think it's important because we

3:24

need as many positive examples,

3:27

positive examples that we as we can too

3:30

and oftentimes it doesn't

3:32

have to come in a figure.

3:34

It can come in a storyline, shared

3:37

experience.

3:38

And so this book is lucky

3:40

me, but it's really about us.

3:42

This is a gift for me to.

3:46

You. In terms of whether you youth,

3:49

where you came from a certain community. I

3:52

think everyone aligns with the people

3:54

that have been that has been reaching out

3:56

and the comments that I've been getting

3:59

from all people.

4:00

I was in the gym this morning, the

4:03

man came up to me.

4:04

He had to be seventy years old, and

4:06

he just was you know, he was just floored

4:09

by the story.

4:11

And he was just like, man,

4:13

you know, just more blessings to you.

4:15

I think that impact

4:18

is really helpful, right And for

4:20

me, I didn't know how much I actually

4:22

needed to write the book. I was

4:25

withholding that trauma that

4:27

I went through for all those years

4:29

and I didn't find out that I needed to release

4:32

that until I was writing

4:34

the book. And so for

4:36

me, it's not necessarily about

4:38

sales, etc. If I can help

4:40

one person change the perspective

4:43

that I started here. I'm

4:45

going through this right now, but

4:48

I see an example of somebody who also went

4:50

through some of the same things. And I don't have

4:52

to finish here. I don't have to give up hope on

4:54

my life. I don't have to give up hope

4:57

on an opportunity.

4:58

That lies ahead.

5:00

I can take little bits and things of what I

5:02

do have, not so much focus on what

5:04

I don't have, but let me focus on what I

5:06

do have and make the best of that. Just

5:08

to get to the next step in

5:10

life is what I deemed

5:12

important today, and so I'm

5:15

ecstatic for you to to get through

5:17

it all.

5:17

I know you touched on some of it, but

5:21

you know.

5:21

It was I haven't been able

5:23

to get through the whole book fits and

5:25

pieces, obviously because it's just such

5:27

an emotional rollercoaster for

5:30

me.

5:30

But as we were writing it, and as I was.

5:32

You know, just going telling it, I did

5:35

the audio book, which was extremely

5:37

emotional, and at the end, I'm

5:39

not gonna spoil it for you, but at

5:41

the end, I you know, I

5:44

do something for my mother, and

5:48

it's tough.

5:50

In the book, you mentioned that your dad

5:52

on a corner store, convenience store.

5:54

You worked in the store.

5:56

So by that stretch of the imagination kind

5:58

of you kind of get on rich. I mean, you got a little convenience

6:00

store, you know.

6:01

What we felt like that that wasn't

6:04

the truth because you got to remember

6:07

so the store was my was

6:09

my Savannah State.

6:11

Okay, Okay, That's where I got

6:13

my curriculum. That's where it was at,

6:15

right. But I also just.

6:16

I learned math, I learned customer

6:19

service, I learned marketing.

6:21

But the most important thing I learned.

6:23

Was people, right, because there's

6:25

all walks of life coming into that

6:27

store, and you know, through the

6:29

course out through throughout the course of their day,

6:32

their energy is different,

6:34

you know, so you had to be able to balance

6:36

certain things.

6:37

I had to learn this at a very young age.

6:39

Everybody's not happy, everybody, somebody

6:42

had a bad day.

6:43

Yeah, and there probably became your problem. I

6:45

had to watch my father navigate

6:47

his way through this to make margins

6:50

on Boston baked beans and cigarettes

6:52

and beer and wine.

6:53

That's not those aren't big margins. You

6:56

understand what I'm saying.

6:56

But yet in still his approach

6:59

to opening that store every

7:01

morning, how he treated people, whether

7:03

you had a dollar or one hundred dollars

7:06

was important, and he explained to me, and as a

7:08

chapter in's book where

7:11

we talk about just having

7:13

the empathy for others, where

7:16

he taught me that this

7:18

is your family is these customers,

7:21

these consumers. It's important

7:23

to take care of them right and to treat them

7:25

a certain way. And it

7:29

really affected my life

7:31

and really shaped me right

7:33

because I would learn stuff from a textbook,

7:36

but my education came from that store.

7:38

Right. I think the thing is rich is

7:40

that empathy. I think.

7:43

Empathy is being able to

7:45

divorce your ego, set aside your

7:47

ego, and see yourself as someone else. And

7:49

I think when people will like circumstances,

7:52

it's easier to have empathy. Because

7:54

your dad saw himself. He's

7:56

like, I ain't really rich, so he saw

7:58

himself. It's some of these poor,

8:01

less fortunate have less having than

8:05

others, and so he could empathize. So

8:07

was he that type of store owner that hey, mister

8:09

Paul, how you doing today?

8:11

Hey?

8:11

Hey uh Savanah,

8:13

Hey Ricky, Hey.

8:14

Johnny, Miss Sharp sent you down there,

8:17

Little Shannon.

8:18

Yeah, you don't got a dime in your pocket,

8:20

but you need bread, right, you need soap?

8:23

Toilet paper.

8:24

Well, miss Sharp sent you. That's

8:27

all he needed to know. Miss Sharp sent because

8:29

she already called before you got that, right, you

8:31

understand I'm saying. So now when you get there, and

8:33

then you may be sitting there looking and

8:35

he may say what you want, boy, and you said, man, can

8:38

I have some of the cherry clans?

8:40

Go?

8:40

You go ahead take it, you know, And so that

8:43

exchange. Now you become

8:46

Shannon. Now you shanning

8:48

from such and such. Now here

8:50

come a little rich.

8:51

You know what I'm saying.

8:52

How my dad treated Shannon,

8:56

miss Sharp's grandson at that moment, and

8:58

now you're shanning.

9:00

You get them saying.

9:02

Save my life in a lot of ways. And

9:05

people don't understand that. And so my

9:07

daddy would always tell me you want

9:10

a man twice a child, and I never

9:12

understood what that meant. And then he explained

9:14

it to me right around the age on

9:16

the cover of that book, and he said,

9:19

as you climb, as you're born a child,

9:21

you grow to become a man. As

9:23

you get older, you start to

9:25

become a child again. And

9:27

how you treated people as a man

9:30

will have a direct correlation of how

9:32

they treat you as you become a

9:35

child again, and that always

9:37

stuck with me. And I come from a place where

9:40

your money didn't matter, that

9:42

don't matter.

9:44

Who you are at your core

9:47

is what mattered.

9:47

And so despite my

9:50

successes, I always carried

9:52

that with me, even into the representation

9:54

business, which you and I both know as a former

9:56

player, that don't

9:58

exist, right, And so

10:00

I brought that with me and it's

10:03

and it's it's extremely important and I live

10:05

with that every day.

10:07

I read in the book and it seems to me one

10:09

of your proudest moments is that the

10:11

family was struggling. You didn't have a whole lot to

10:13

eat, and you go ask your

10:15

uncle and he gives you twenty dollars out of the register

10:18

and you go and you go and hit the lick

10:21

and you were able to go buy bread.

10:23

You was able to go buy a daily meat. We call it lunch

10:25

meeting in the South.

10:26

Y'all, well okay,

10:30

okay, okay, so we call it

10:33

color le me.

10:33

So you were able to buy some things and

10:36

at that moment it dawned on you like

10:38

man.

10:40

It made you feel good.

10:42

I can provide.

10:45

Then, was that the moment that

10:47

you saw Because we all have a purpose same

10:50

thing happened to me. When I would get paid, I would buy

10:52

I would you'd give my grandmother ten dollars or the forty

10:54

dollars that I made. It wasn't much, but

10:57

it helped buy something. From that moment

10:59

on, I've been a to my entire life. My job

11:01

is to provide for my family with that. In

11:03

the moment that you said, you know what rich

11:06

Paula's are provided?

11:07

Yeah, because me, my

11:09

brother and sister. I got two older

11:11

sisters and the older brother. I'm the youngest,

11:14

but my older sister

11:17

Brandy, and my older brother Miko.

11:19

We lived together.

11:20

So my mom wasn't

11:23

there, Okay, my dad

11:25

had his family, and

11:28

so there was plenty of times where

11:30

it was no one there.

11:32

So we had to do things as

11:34

a collective.

11:36

How much older are there than you?

11:37

My brother's three years older and my sister five years

11:40

old, but you know, seven

11:42

and twelve, and that's I

11:44

mean, you know, that's that's a big jump in

11:47

terms of responsibility, right,

11:49

Yes, And so I

11:51

watched my sister babysit other

11:54

people's kids and then you

11:56

know, take her money and I would go to the mall

11:58

with her. That's how I learned fashion. My

12:01

sister taught me about She she made

12:03

that bug bite me for clothes

12:05

and all that. And then I watched my brother

12:08

do what he had to do, and so I

12:11

had to play my part, and so what

12:13

I was able to do. So like you're saying,

12:15

whether it was that, whether it was shooting

12:18

jump shots and not having no money and had to

12:20

make it to win and going to

12:22

to to get the you know, I used to buy

12:24

the juice the lunch meat because my

12:26

mother taught us how to do this. A couple pounds

12:28

of lunch meat, the juice, and

12:30

then we would get the bread or whatnot.

12:32

You said, you're going through the juice too quick.

12:35

Exactly. I had to get to cooler cause it was going too

12:37

fast. We had to stretch it, you know. And so

12:40

and so.

12:40

But but when I when I felt like you

12:42

said, I felt good as

12:45

a young kid, and I'm going to I went to a school

12:47

called Upson in Euclid, Ohio.

12:49

I'm in the fourth grade, and I remember this

12:52

adding to.

12:55

The calls in the fourth

12:57

grade, and I didn't have nobody

12:59

to to say to you, you better be

13:01

going to school. It was a decision that I

13:03

had to make that I wanted to make at

13:05

a very young age, and so did my siblings. But there

13:08

was also time to where I used to walk to parking

13:10

we had. It was a place called the Americana. My

13:13

dad had a little we called the Honeycomb hide Out.

13:15

He had a little Honeycomb hide that we had to take over

13:17

right because we had nowhere to go. But

13:20

I would walk and pick up a quarter here,

13:23

a dime here. And it was a little bar next

13:26

to another apartment complex called

13:28

the Horizon House. Back then, it was a little

13:30

bar and grill, and they would have these cheeseburgers

13:32

and you and as a kid, you can go in there before

13:35

a certain time in order from the grill and

13:37

the doubt, you know, and that and and that's

13:40

how I would eat some days, you

13:42

know, And so all those things

13:44

don't shape me.

13:45

I don't look at that as a negative

13:48

thing.

13:49

And it was a struggle, but I didn't

13:51

know it as much, right because I didn't know anything

13:53

per se.

13:54

Different, And because

13:56

everybody around you was probably going through

13:58

the same thing, you didn't think you any different.

14:01

Everybody else was struggling.

14:02

Because you know what separation you at that point, you

14:04

could be struggling and have a

14:06

new pair of shoes on. Yeah,

14:08

right, and it elevated you. So

14:11

those things. I always had

14:13

the things right. But what I didn't

14:15

have is that family infrastructure,

14:18

that consistency in the household.

14:20

I didn't have that. But what

14:23

I was able to control,

14:25

I controlled. Just because I didn't have X

14:28

didn't mean I was gonna sit in class and be a dummy.

14:30

I wasn't gonna follow the class clowns.

14:33

I wasn't gonna do abacadaba on my

14:35

test just because you know, I

14:37

wanted to be in school. I didn't want to miss

14:39

school. And that showed a lot about

14:41

me as a person. The

14:43

things didn't make me. That was, you

14:45

know, because I can make shift. My

14:48

sister taught me how to make shift things where

14:50

you can go to TJ Max and

14:52

get a Ralph Lauren it may be a little defective,

14:55

you know, and wear

14:57

just the same.

14:58

And so I learn

15:00

those.

15:00

Little things to feel good

15:03

because you know, when you don't have much, especially

15:05

back then, the littlest things elevated

15:08

you make the biggest difference, right, And so

15:11

that.

15:11

Was that was important to me.

15:14

But I also knew then the responsibility

15:18

of right from wrong.

15:19

At that at that point, and that's what I was about to get to.

15:22

You said, Okay, I'm a hustler. I

15:24

rolled dice, trying to hit the lick, shoot

15:27

pool, shot.

15:28

Jump jumpers, horse, casino

15:32

race, whatever you wanted to do.

15:34

Back you didn't want to do it, but you didn't

15:36

go a lot of times kids like well,

15:38

I didn't really have a choice, so I had to

15:40

go this route.

15:42

You never not.

15:44

Then when I made those choices,

15:46

I understood because I had the influence

15:49

in front of me. So I set on the porch

15:51

until it's when I jumped off the porch. It

15:54

was because of survival. Because

15:56

you know, when you have an entrepreneurial spirit in

15:58

the hood.

16:00

What's your options? What's

16:02

your real opportunity?

16:04

Right?

16:04

The lady who took that picture, we

16:07

called her picture Lady. She

16:09

would that was her, that was her her hustle.

16:11

She would have the polaroid and she would come on the

16:13

block and she turned our best outfits

16:16

into pictures.

16:19

That was art.

16:19

She could have been Dina Lawson.

16:22

That was art.

16:22

She could have been uh she,

16:25

that could have been Instagram.

16:26

But nobody's nobody recognized

16:29

what she was doing and recognized

16:31

the business of it and

16:33

say to her.

16:34

You ever thought about this and let me invest

16:36

in that. Everybody on the right of me had

16:39

a hustle. Everybody on left of me had a hustle.

16:41

The person in front of me had a hustle, and the

16:43

person in back of me had a hustle.

16:45

There's no careers, there's no great

16:47

job, there's no equity

16:49

positions. You get what I'm saying, there's no

16:52

VC, there's none of that. I didn't even

16:54

know what that meant. You understand

16:56

what I'm saying, and so understanding

16:59

what it means today is different.

17:01

But when I look back on it,

17:04

the only difference between me or

17:07

someone like me and anybody

17:09

else in the world that has been

17:12

an innovator, a genius, uh,

17:15

you know, created something and

17:17

built it and grew it. They

17:19

had the opportunity, the

17:22

option, and someone willing to

17:25

support.

17:26

We don't have that. So we had

17:28

to turn to what was placed

17:30

in our environment.

17:32

Now, some people did it, and they did

17:34

it with malice, they did it with whatever.

17:36

That was never me.

17:37

My intent was always I

17:39

always tried to find the right, even within

17:42

doing wrong.

17:42

That makes sense.

17:43

Yeah, what's the most money? You like roll?

17:45

You say you like rolling dice? So what's the most you

17:47

you've made in a day and the most you've lost?

17:49

When what age

17:52

con sine? You gotta understand.

17:53

So what age did you start rolling dice?

17:55

About seven or eight? See, my dad taught

17:57

me.

17:57

The reason why my dad taught me how

17:59

to He taught me and my siblings how to gamble,

18:02

shoot dice, and play cards. It wasn't

18:04

from a gambling perspective. It

18:07

was from a survival perspective because

18:09

he said to.

18:10

Us, these are the tools.

18:12

These were exact words. These

18:14

are the tools that would allow

18:16

you to get from

18:19

here to here.

18:20

If you get laid off on this job, to

18:23

get to the next job, you're gonna need some time

18:26

to get by.

18:27

Here's some things you can do to get

18:30

by. I turned it into

18:32

my.

18:32

Job, you know, because I got I got

18:34

infatuated with it, you know, And so

18:37

because it's.

18:37

Quick even money, cause because every

18:40

road money's moving.

18:42

And and that's the thing and everything. So I and so my

18:44

dad would take me to the family reunion and

18:48

you know, once to drink, I'd

18:52

be grand out to money.

18:53

It don't matter.

18:56

Talk brandy money. I don't grady take the money

18:59

out of the bullsom.

19:01

I beat your grandma out of the money, my grandma.

19:04

Whoever got the money I wanted. I'm beating about

19:06

the money. You don't have to worry about that, because

19:09

that's what it was. There's no when you start

19:11

gambling. There is no age limit when you

19:13

if you got money, you in play.

19:16

You in play soon as you put that money.

19:17

And ain't no.

19:18

I didn't mean to do that because.

19:19

You know, and when we was back in the day, we used

19:21

to catch the doctor. We had to

19:23

cut that out because you know somebody doing

19:26

it.

19:27

You seen what I did?

19:28

I did, I did like this, What

19:32

did.

19:32

You talk about that?

19:35

So so when I was young, we totally

19:37

cut catching out. There's no more

19:40

catching. Now that

19:42

does the number of things. It

19:44

opens the game up, it spees it up. But

19:47

then you got the slickster's comedy. So

19:49

now you got to match that sickness.

19:52

So now it's it's it was. You

19:54

know, it's a free free fraus.

19:55

So we had spots, right, and

19:58

so the best way for me to quit it. DuPont

20:02

was like Massive Square

20:04

Garden or the Staples Center. That's

20:06

where all the everybody was.

20:08

Those are the big game. That was the big game. Average

20:11

role in that game was probably about one thousand

20:13

dollars a row.

20:14

Wow, you know, and it's and it's the who's

20:16

who you know everywhere.

20:19

So when you and so as a young kid being

20:22

allowed to be in that game, you

20:24

know, that's.

20:25

Like a rookie start. It's

20:27

like a rookie making All NBA team.

20:29

But you know rich when that kind of money is involved.

20:31

People got them things on them, they got them

20:33

switches.

20:35

Well they ain't had that back then, but

20:37

yet you know, but that was necessary. But

20:40

you know that.

20:41

You know, because you know, money, money

20:43

does thingily if I lose a.

20:45

Big yeah, but I'm gonna tell you something about these

20:47

specific areas and every now and

20:49

then you had issues, but not like it would be today

20:51

because there was a lot more respect right

20:54

But back then it was just different

20:56

because again when I talk about the who's

20:58

who, there ain't even

21:00

no conversation.

21:02

That's no go period.

21:03

You knew that that was a you

21:06

know, it was a respect and a rapport

21:08

and but at the same time, you

21:11

know, it was things that got a

21:13

little chippy here and there. But

21:15

it started with these youn't

21:18

Yeah you wasn't doing

21:21

but again but we had so

21:23

we had the hut the Hut wasn't The hut

21:25

was like you know, the hut

21:27

was like the United Center, right, and

21:29

then Forest hill Pool said, Forest

21:31

hill Pool, that was again, that's

21:34

like the Staple Center or the or the

21:36

or the Garden, because that's

21:38

where all everybody come. There many

21:40

and they Deamonte's with the vogues on them.

21:42

They force, they got the gator sandals

21:45

on with a fresh pedicure, and they

21:47

popping down pay This was I come up.

21:49

So as a kid, I'm seeing guys pop the trunk.

21:51

They got a case of Don Perry out so

21:54

as we get a hold of them when we get fourteen fifteen.

21:56

I didn't even drink, but that's

21:58

what we wanted. My

22:00

friend cases are mo ad cases

22:03

are down, you know, going to Blue

22:05

Point for dinner and stuff like that as

22:07

young men. Because because we're hanging with forty

22:10

five year old men.

22:12

That's teaching us this. And so I was

22:14

never really allowed to be a child

22:17

per se. But the

22:19

game was given. That's why the ceet I city

22:21

in today. I got to get a game because

22:23

it was given to me.

22:26

Been to a have a dice game recently.

22:29

No, you don't have dice because

22:31

you know some some player like to play cards and you

22:34

know with their buddies. Yeah, now you can't have outside

22:36

because they're gonna try to sleep. They're gonna bring the crooked dice,

22:39

loaded dice that roll the

22:41

channel four all day.

22:42

I would love to in a in an environment

22:44

because you know, you like to be the shop, you

22:47

like to be you know, we just love that part.

22:49

But it's just too dang, it's two days. I won't

22:51

to do it today, but amongst friends

22:54

if they would. But now all my friends they need to back.

22:57

So you can't be you know, you can't.

23:00

You can't be shooting for eight hours because

23:03

you know they need they have to go out and score forty

23:05

five.

23:05

You know, you can't do that. So it's a different dynamic

23:08

now. But they love it right, you know.

23:10

But but again, but just the house, the

23:12

gambling house, the characters within

23:14

the gambling house, the teachings within the gambling house.

23:17

See, we had to learn by losing. That's

23:19

how we learned by losing. These

23:22

kids today they want to skip every step in the

23:24

process and they.

23:25

Don't want to just win win win.

23:27

No, it don't work.

23:27

They won't take it, you know eventually.

23:30

Yeah, yeah, for sure, you were raised

23:32

by your grandparents, And you said that when

23:34

in the book I read in the book where you went to live

23:36

with your grandparents, your granny was really

23:39

strict.

23:39

Most grandparents are.

23:42

Detail you were like all the

23:44

kind of like, like, damn, what was the first time I ever had

23:47

my own room?

23:49

When I moved with my grandma Johnny May, it was

23:51

the first time I ever had my own

23:53

room, right, you know,

23:56

And I'm looking around.

23:56

I can't believe it, but it's me.

23:59

It's Johnny. My grandma Johnny made my grab

24:01

my camera. My uncle Charlie, now they

24:03

are These are on my father's side. My

24:07

great grandmother.

24:09

All she ate was Wrigley's

24:11

gone. So when I would

24:13

come home from my dad's.

24:14

Store shed she ate spearmint

24:17

big not big red cause it was too hot, right,

24:20

spearmint uh doublemint, and

24:23

juicy fruit cause it wasn't no winter fresh then

24:25

yet. And my grandma Paul the

24:28

only thing she ate was peanut M and m's.

24:32

My uncle Charlie went to see his girlfriend

24:34

one one day out the week. He

24:37

leave at ten o'clock on Tuesday. He come

24:39

back eleven o'clock on Wednesday, A

24:41

wear white shirt, hat, Stacey

24:45

Adams.

24:46

You could eat off the car, but was so clean. But

24:48

he was so detailed.

24:49

At ten o'clock, no matter what the game, the game could

24:51

be in overtime when that clock strike

24:54

ten o'clock. If you sitting outside my house,

24:57

you could see him going up the stairs to get in the bed. This

25:00

is what so I know I don't use alarm clock right now

25:02

to this day because my grandmother

25:04

get up every day at three thirty in the morning, Babe

25:07

her mom. Then she go downstairs

25:10

and you know, do what she needs to do. She washed

25:13

it and she cooking it at the same time. Then

25:15

I get up at five thirty. My dad's picking me up.

25:17

We opened the store at six. That was

25:19

my routine every morning.

25:21

Wow, you said your mom struggled

25:23

with addiction when you were a child.

25:28

What impact did that have on

25:30

you? Not having her

25:33

the mother? We know what the mother brings

25:35

to the family. Yeah, the matriarch. What

25:38

did that do to a young rich loss.

25:40

Of emotion and vulnerability? You

25:43

know, because in order for you to love something,

25:45

you have to allow yourself to be vulnerable.

25:47

I had to wipe that out because it

25:51

affected me in a way in which I loved my mother

25:54

loved my mother.

25:56

When she was around.

25:59

Life.

25:59

For the part, you could smell the food coming

26:01

from down the hall. Oh you would have been you

26:04

would have been so overwaken, my

26:06

god, cakes, pies, chocolate

26:09

pie, cherry pie, peach.

26:10

Cobbler, but not a pudding. I mean, it was

26:12

the work. It was unbelievable, unbelievable.

26:16

But you know I didn't

26:18

have that.

26:19

I'm only getting that for two three days at a time. I

26:21

may I may be without it for six months,

26:24

six seven months at a time. And

26:26

I just had to understand.

26:29

And the way my dad put it to me, it was a sickness.

26:31

So I had to just understand it and move on. But

26:33

it was tough, you know, because parent teacher conference,

26:36

I look in the stands, I'm at my.

26:38

Games, homecoming, you know, whatever

26:40

the case may be. She ain't

26:42

there.

26:43

But I'm always I was always in somebody

26:45

else's car with they parents, or

26:47

at somebody else's house with they

26:49

parents, you know, holidays and things like that.

26:52

It was always that, and so it

26:56

could break you, but it didn't break me. Mentally.

27:00

I was able to overcome it.

27:02

And you would never know, you would

27:04

never know what I was with, what you deal with

27:06

Oh, you would never You would never know that because I didn't

27:09

wear it on my jacket.

27:10

You said earlier that some of

27:12

the things that when you started writing this book you

27:14

didn't realize how much trauma you had endured.

27:17

And as you started to write, it became very

27:19

emotional, and in the audio books it

27:21

really audio portion.

27:22

It really started with this. The

27:25

main reason why.

27:26

Yeah, because you know, you relive in those

27:28

moments, you get extremely

27:31

emotional. You know, I lost

27:33

both my parents at such a young

27:35

age nineteen and thirty six, lost

27:37

my mom at thirty six, lost my dad in nineteen

27:41

and you know, just reliving

27:44

those moments, man, it's tough, and I know

27:47

what kids go through today

27:49

because there's you could be My dad wasn't

27:51

present, but he was present, right,

27:53

He didn't live with me, but he was present. My

27:56

mother wasn't there, but I had

27:58

so much respect for that. The I

28:00

did get to spend with her, I spent

28:02

it. It was never a place of then. I never

28:05

came from a place of anger. I never

28:07

came from a place of disrespect. And by the

28:09

way, even if I wanted to come from a place of disrespect,

28:11

my mother could throw down, so she ain't going for that

28:13

anyway, You're gonna

28:15

get your lip flat for sure.

28:18

So but I never even came like

28:20

that. You understand what I'm saying.

28:22

And so, but when I was

28:24

writing a book, and especially when I was doing the audio

28:26

book, when I got to the end where

28:29

I write this message to my mom, it

28:32

really choked me.

28:33

You only get one mom, man, you get

28:36

one mother. And I try

28:38

to explain that to my clients

28:40

today.

28:41

The way our industry is today, sometimes

28:45

it becomes a joust amongst

28:50

families, and it's very

28:52

important for everyone within

28:55

the family to have perspective and

28:57

to have clarity. For

29:01

many years, had a black

29:04

cloud over that title that was considered

29:06

somebody that was shady or

29:08

somebody that was It was a gray

29:11

area there. I wanted

29:13

to change that. The The

29:16

the fortunate thing is I have been

29:18

able to change it somewhat. The

29:20

unfortunate thing has been, and

29:22

we talked about it, is that

29:25

you still wake up every day. I can't change

29:28

the color of my skin. And

29:32

as tough as it is with

29:34

the industry, we

29:36

make it even tougher on

29:39

ourselves because there's still a competition.

29:41

And don't get me wrong, when you when you're going out and recruiting

29:44

clients. Yeah, you're competitive,

29:46

so, but.

29:49

But you're not speaking ill, you're not speaking negative

29:51

on some way. And that's the thing to the best, the

29:54

best man, best man woman win the

29:56

job. So I'm not but I'm not gonna say,

29:59

oh, this person, that person is that

30:01

to try to conjure up so the athlete

30:04

feels some type of way.

30:05

Yeah, yeah, this is what I can

30:07

abide. This is what I believe.

30:09

I'm the best man for the job. My

30:11

agency and I think we can do the best

30:13

job for you moving forward.

30:14

And that's the point I was making when we talked about it, when

30:17

we did first take The point I was

30:19

making was, of course I didn't.

30:21

Expect white agents

30:23

to help to try to help me.

30:25

That wasn't even expectation, right,

30:28

But coming from where

30:30

I came from, the

30:32

game was given by the older

30:34

guys. Whether you decided

30:37

to digest it or not was on

30:39

you. But I can't sit here and say that

30:41

my coattail wasn't pulled to certain

30:44

things to help me get through the day,

30:46

get through the month, get through the year

30:49

of survival.

30:50

So that's all I know.

30:52

I only I got to give that back when

30:54

I started that wasn't the case. And I seen people online

30:57

like, oh, well you didn't say that. I'm like, you're

30:59

missing the point, right.

31:00

Did you reach out? Did you? I mean, I

31:02

don't need to call it any names, but did you reach out to any

31:05

agency?

31:06

And I first started the business, I talked

31:08

to everybody because I wanted to understand

31:11

why are things the way they are? And

31:14

what I came to understand is ain't

31:16

no different in the block and

31:19

man for themselves. That's just that's

31:21

just that that that has been placed

31:23

upon us from a thought process.

31:26

But what happens is when.

31:28

You create those that psychology,

31:31

it stunts to growth and stunts of communication

31:33

habits.

31:34

It's stunts. I should

31:36

have came up under something

31:38

that was already built, right, That's.

31:40

Normally how it happens. Agency.

31:41

They normally come up in a big agency and

31:43

then they branch out on their own. You started

31:46

differently, You started out.

31:47

On your own.

31:48

I started differently.

31:49

I started a place, but I don't even count that because

31:51

there was no education there, There was no there

31:54

was no plan for me to become who

31:56

I am today. But what

31:59

I started to realize is, oh,

32:01

you know, we work in a small industry,

32:03

so things get back.

32:05

Yes, the only.

32:06

Difference is the kid

32:08

on the cover of that book. In that environment,

32:12

when things get back.

32:13

Oh we're pulling up.

32:16

You get what I'm saying.

32:16

In this industry, when someone

32:19

goes and and speaks about

32:21

you in a very derogatory

32:24

way for two.

32:24

Hours, ain't

32:27

that much to say? Now, the

32:30

business is the business. Competition is in all

32:32

business.

32:33

But when you make it personal, that's

32:35

a different dynamic like primes

32:37

and then you made it personal, right, But but

32:39

we couldn't do that.

32:40

I you know, it's not in me. I

32:43

couldn't be trying to talk to a girl

32:45

and mentioned Shannon. We

32:48

don't. That's no go where we don't. We don't

32:50

do that.

32:50

And so but I'm in this game where

32:54

I left a game that was being played

32:56

with no rules and no rest. But you understand

32:59

that, yes, yes, but in the

33:01

corporate setting.

33:03

It really ain't.

33:04

There's rules, but

33:07

the rest are signed to the

33:09

establishment. In a lot of cases, I had to learn

33:11

that. I had to learn narratives. I had to learn how

33:14

media works. I had to learn all these

33:16

things. And I also had to learn

33:19

that the smiles is not really the smiles. But

33:21

I was used to that because I came from that, so

33:24

I was prepared thoroughly

33:26

for the position I'm me in today.

33:28

It's just that it's hard for me to respect

33:30

it.

33:31

That's all.

33:32

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34:34

You love sports? Coming up? Your

34:36

team? Yeah?

34:37

Basketball? Your team won the state

34:39

title. How good of an athlete was

34:41

Rich Park?

34:44

On the scale of one to ten depend

34:47

on the year. If you're talking about ages, if

34:51

you're talking about a seven,

34:53

live up total a seven to

34:56

twelve.

34:57

I was about an eight because everybody's

34:59

just the same about it, eight or not. You

35:03

got the tape, go look at the tape. I got the tape.

35:05

Pull the tape.

35:06

We wanted.

35:07

We wanted that. We won the city championship.

35:09

I won MVP, I did an interview. I think my teammates

35:11

everything. But then

35:13

once I got into high school, it

35:17

changed. But it also changed cause I didn't put in the work.

35:19

See I'm down at the hut. They gambling.

35:21

I'm missing something. You know, we got a big dice game.

35:24

We got a summer of the game, a euclid. I show

35:26

up at halftime.

35:28

That ain't right, man, But you know

35:30

I'm down forty five hundred. I got to get back.

35:36

But so I just took the riddle of it. The suite. I understood

35:38

it right.

35:40

But as I talk about this, me

35:45

not starting on my team didn't

35:48

discourage me from being a part of the

35:50

team. I was a part of a great

35:52

team. I had great teammates, and

35:55

I was on the second team every day in practice,

35:58

and we made the first team work. Sometimes

36:01

we would beat the first team. Sometimes I would get

36:03

in the game. Sometimes I wouldn't get in the game at

36:05

all. Right, and I look up in the stands. I

36:07

stood my brother there some die. Nobody

36:09

in my family really cared about sport. But my brother

36:11

would be there sometimes. My dude would

36:13

be there off the block sometimes and support.

36:16

But it was okay because I

36:18

understood my position, understood my role.

36:20

But when we leave out this locker room, now

36:23

it was my turn to be the man.

36:25

And that's all fair. Shame had never been no robber,

36:27

you know what I'm saying.

36:30

After the game, you hit it back down to the block.

36:33

We had it somewhere. You know, I may have some if

36:36

my dudes came to the game. They didn't come

36:38

to the game for the game. They came to the game because where

36:40

we're.

36:40

Going after the game, Yeah, And we would go down

36:42

certain places.

36:43

But I respected my teammates, you

36:46

know, we we and I enjoyed

36:48

it. I played against Mike Gansey, who's

36:50

a he's a GM of

36:52

the cast now.

36:55

A lot of guys. We played against Steve Logan,

36:58

Sam Clancy, a lot of guys that was

37:00

that was top guys. We

37:02

loved it.

37:03

We loved the game we played. Sat played

37:06

football right, his dad, his

37:09

son played for USC. They all played

37:11

for a team called Saint Edwards. I went to Cleveland Beverdicton,

37:14

but Glennville was my neighborhood high school.

37:16

That was pretty yeah. But during

37:18

the basketball side was pretty good. We played

37:20

with the same same Saint Mary

37:22

every year.

37:23

We had a we had a big time schedule.

37:25

I want to and I'm really close with a

37:28

family in Columbus. Shot and seen family

37:30

in Columbus, and we

37:34

I won the last state championship in

37:36

Saint John's and the first state

37:39

championship in the shot on Ohio

37:41

State's campus. You know, And

37:44

so when you when you plan in it, you

37:46

don't know. And then you meet the family whose name is

37:48

on the arena, you know. All these things just how

37:50

life takes you. But I was a I

37:52

was a pretty good athlete. I

37:54

will say this laugh if you want to.

37:57

I'm one of the best shooters though even still

38:00

to this day. And I'll take my chat.

38:02

If I was in the one of four fifty, I'll be at the top.

38:04

It's guys like me, Steph Clay,

38:08

Clay Who Thompson. Oh,

38:10

I was gonna be dang.

38:13

This man talk about he shooting? Like,

38:15

are you talking?

38:16

If you're just talking shooting, this

38:19

is a class I'm in y'all.

38:20

Going down to the gun range that you

38:22

talk about basketball into a.

38:24

Rim, Trey Darious Garland.

38:26

I'm just talking about guys in the league right now that shoot

38:29

the three really well. I would

38:33

be amongst the.

38:35

He's having good See he's having a good old interview.

38:37

I mean it was going well. I really the story that you was telling,

38:39

it's been similar.

38:41

But I'm talking about in terms of I didn't

38:43

say dribbling, playing, I said

38:45

shooting.

38:46

That's all I'm said.

38:47

The mere fact that you put in yourself Ridge.

38:50

You are talking legends. You gotta throw Reggie

38:53

in there, and Ray, it's all of us.

38:55

My point is you putting yourself in that

38:58

group.

38:58

I ain't got no problem with the name you miss it's

39:00

just the fact that your name is in there in

39:02

terms of shooting.

39:03

I don't care what it is.

39:05

Well, yeah, I feel good about

39:07

it, and I ain't drinking. I'm not drinking

39:09

no, yack, I'm drinking water.

39:11

No, you should have drannk you too

39:13

sober to be saying something like that. I need a reason why

39:15

you said some bullshit like that.

39:17

I'm just sorry. Where you saying some police

39:19

just like that?

39:20

Well, I'm just telling the truth. I

39:22

put it this way. You know, when

39:24

two men got discrepaned, what's the next word?

39:28

Ben? Exactly?

39:29

That's all. It's

39:32

the only way for you to find out.

39:33

I want you to tell the people what you told us before

39:35

we came on there. I said, you played

39:38

sports. You're like, you know, we're getting into that.

39:39

So y'all. In football, I could run some routes. Go

39:42

ahead.

39:44

I was a good route runner. I played

39:46

every position.

39:47

Man, But I'm not saying I was the best because

39:49

I was. I'm the first to say to you, no,

39:51

I was not the best on my team. I wasn't

39:54

the best on any team I ever played on. But

39:56

you know what, I was great at leadership,

40:00

having perspective, okay, right,

40:02

corralling the guys, helping

40:04

them understand the moment what

40:07

needs to take place, my

40:09

practice habits.

40:10

I'm leading the leading the team when

40:12

we run in the lapse.

40:14

Because I have to respect that, because

40:16

I was expecting you to come out here and say, yeah, man,

40:18

I could if i'd have grew like another five

40:20

secs, I could have played in the NFA.

40:23

We don't do no one thing about it, you got. We

40:25

don't do no bunch of lyne. We don't

40:27

do no bunch of line. Ain't need to be getting on.

40:29

They're talking about no line because all somebody gonna

40:31

do is put up to take, So

40:34

I don't need to do none of that. No.

40:36

So college, high

40:39

school, you did what you like. You said you were no dumby,

40:42

no.

40:43

Being smart, very smart at

40:45

tend it in class.

40:47

Make sure I got my homework, because

40:49

at that point in time in high school, did you know

40:51

the kind of the direction that you wanted to go in when

40:54

you became an adult?

40:55

Not at all, Not at all. I thought I was gonna be a

40:57

pro until my father told me I wasn't.

40:59

In ninth grade, I read in the book that

41:01

you said you used to like drinking coffee. I

41:03

did, And then your dad told you that coffee stuted

41:06

your growth, and you stopped. But you might have stopped

41:08

a little bit too late.

41:09

Because I was drinking black, drinking the coffee

41:11

black.

41:11

Yeah, but do you let it realize

41:14

that coffee don't start the growth.

41:15

I didn't know what to believe, you know, they concept, you know, craying

41:19

back then anything. I didn't know what to believe.

41:22

And you started drinking tea. So you're and you're

41:24

in high school, you graduating high school.

41:26

What's rich Paul's next plan?

41:30

I wanted to go to college.

41:31

I did go to college. I went to college, and my

41:33

dad was still alive. My

41:35

dad stressed education so much. I

41:38

just wanted to further my education. Nobody

41:40

in my family went to college, right, So I

41:42

went to college, and I did everything on my own. I

41:45

remember picking the college I wanted

41:47

to go to, going to guidance counselor

41:49

you know, going to my uh you know, my

41:52

orientation right and seeing

41:54

the dorm and all that I had.

41:55

No my dad or mom didn't come on this

41:58

stuff with me. I did it by myself else,

42:00

you know.

42:01

And but unfortunately my

42:03

my my freshman year of college, uh,

42:06

around September, my dad got sick. My

42:08

dad got really sick. And I remember

42:11

the conversation I have my dad because I was talking

42:13

to him about some books I had to order, and

42:15

he had this this attitude about

42:18

it. And my dad never had an attitude about education.

42:22

But he didn't tell me anything. My uncle Joe had

42:24

to tell me what was going on, and my you know, my sister

42:27

and so and and it just it just

42:29

happened so fast, and so I had to transfer

42:33

to be closer to my dad, and

42:35

I would that's when I went to Cleveland State.

42:38

And then man, it be some days I'll be

42:40

driving the class and.

42:42

I would just turn around and go sit with my dad because

42:44

I didn't know how long I was gonna have with him, right,

42:46

And you know, and that was a tough tough

42:48

thing for me.

42:49

How did you balance that knowing that that

42:54

death is on the horizon for you?

42:56

Yeah, while all the wi but.

42:58

I still got to live. Yeah.

43:00

My dad used to always tell us, though I ain't gonna be here

43:02

forever.

43:03

He used to tell us that my dad didn't shoot coat

43:05

anything because life didn't shoot cot anything.

43:08

And the store was on that corner, and when you stepped

43:10

out on that corner, you was a part

43:12

of the environment, and so at

43:15

that time, anything could happen,

43:18

right, and so that's how he prepared us.

43:20

And so it was tough. Though it

43:22

was tough, but I got

43:24

through it.

43:24

But it was tough, but I I'm

43:27

glad I did spend those days, and

43:29

some days I would just go and just sitting next to his bedside.

43:33

You know, you say, I read where

43:35

you said that the streets

43:37

was your more house, was your Harvard. That

43:39

the knowledge that you got to deal with people

43:42

in business on a corporate level, on higher

43:44

side. Now, all that information you

43:46

didn't get from books, you didn't get from a college.

43:49

You got it from the streets and dealing with people

43:51

in the streets, dealing with people in your dad's

43:53

convenience.

43:54

Yes, yeah, because to

43:58

me, And that's why when they brought.

43:59

Up the rich Paul Rue, I didn't think that made

44:01

any sense, especially working in the business that we're

44:04

working.

44:04

Within the service industry.

44:05

You don't learn how to service people from a textbook.

44:08

You learn that through experience, right, And

44:10

when I was out there, that was my experience

44:12

at my dad's store, dealing with people,

44:15

seeing the pitfalls and challenges, and.

44:17

I realized something you

44:20

can learn so much from from

44:22

someone telling you.

44:24

Their failures, because

44:26

everybody want to know what's what should

44:29

they be doing successful, but you

44:31

also should want to know what you shouldn't be doing.

44:34

It's so much in to learn from

44:37

what not to do. And so

44:39

that's how we learned. We had to learn the silhouettes so

44:41

people, we had to learn cars, we had

44:43

to learn how to just diffuse situations

44:47

like I talk about my friend Cactus in

44:49

this in the book, and it was

44:51

a situation.

44:52

It's my friend.

44:53

He lived on the next street Edmonton Woodside.

44:56

And I told the story not

44:59

because today currently

45:02

he's incarcerated, but when he gets out. It not because

45:04

we won't be friends, because we were friends.

45:07

But as a young.

45:08

Black man, you don't always

45:11

understand how to communicate right.

45:13

You don't want to be judged because you always

45:16

are being what judged, and

45:19

so what that does is it causes

45:21

you to act even

45:24

despite you not wanting to act a certain

45:26

way. So I tell this story about what took place

45:28

with us, and I

45:31

had to understand the position

45:33

that he was in and I had

45:35

to pivot. So therefore

45:38

he wouldn't be in a position where

45:40

he had to act even on something

45:42

he probably would have regretted down the road,

45:45

and so that's all I was the reason I.

45:47

Told that because it's the same way

45:50

today.

45:51

Everybody's everybody's

45:53

committing things an act

45:56

because they don't want to be judged, or they don't

45:58

know how to communicate something to

46:00

someone else, and so you

46:02

know, a two minute decision cost

46:05

them twenty years of life, right, and it's

46:07

too much of that.

46:09

How did you decide to

46:12

go into the line of work that you're currently in.

46:15

It was organic. I love sports,

46:17

I love fashion, I love people.

46:21

I played the game, I watched every game,

46:23

I played every sport, did taekwon, doe box,

46:25

gymnastics, football, baseball, basketball,

46:29

and all

46:31

my friends played sports for the most part.

46:34

And then I had another half that, you know, we was

46:36

kind of split down the middle.

46:38

And so.

46:40

As I you know, as I was getting

46:43

into the jersey business, I'm selling the jerseys.

46:46

Again. It's just sports

46:48

and culture. It's all the same. It's like it intersects.

46:51

And I never planned

46:54

on being an agent, but I always

46:56

had this ability to connect with people.

46:59

I knew the game. I know the game. I can talk

47:01

football, I can talk basketball, I can

47:03

talk baseball. Right, and so.

47:07

As I started to see what representation

47:10

looked like. I started

47:12

to understand that it was in a

47:14

lot of ways.

47:15

It was surface deep.

47:17

There was a perception that the agent

47:19

should look like this, and then

47:22

from that perception, there was an opportunity

47:24

given to others, right,

47:28

and so now that game

47:31

was started to be played. Your agent

47:33

has to look like this. There was a narrative

47:35

that it has to he had to be a lawyer or

47:38

whatnot. And then on

47:41

the flip side, they have a relationship

47:43

with the shoe company or whatever, and

47:46

the shoe company understands the players coming

47:48

in.

47:48

They know what they have and what they don't have.

47:50

They're given that information to one

47:53

or two or three individuals

47:56

only, and then here they come

47:58

and because of because

48:01

of the perception of them and

48:03

how they looked, the families

48:06

deemed them to be what, educated,

48:09

better, position, smart,

48:13

all these different things. And

48:15

then when I got behind the walls, I'm like, well,

48:19

that's food's goal because they

48:21

don't know our culture for sure. So

48:24

when I'm doing a shoe deal, if

48:26

I have a signature athlete, there's

48:30

some things that you need to know to better

48:32

position that person.

48:34

There's a reason why.

48:36

Certain decisions was made for certain

48:39

athletes because that representation

48:41

didn't know cool right and didn't

48:44

know culture. But we tend

48:46

to skip over that and not value

48:49

certain expertise because it's not packaged

48:51

a certain way.

48:52

See this is packaged.

48:55

When you look at the best brands in the world, they're

48:57

packaging matters right.

49:00

Our packaging automatically

49:03

was discredited from

49:07

day one, So now I had to work around that, right,

49:10

So.

49:12

Started Clutch. You says, Okay, I'm gonna do this. I'm

49:15

gonna start my own company. Yeah, what

49:18

was your thought process behind starting your own company?

49:20

I was so motivated. I was

49:23

in a position where, you

49:25

know, you could just feel with

49:29

somebody trying to play you. And

49:31

I wasn't that type of guy. I was never dependent

49:34

of somebody. I was always know

49:37

how to get yeah, and

49:42

so there wasn't no challenge for me to lead

49:44

an agency. I left, and I wasn't really

49:46

like you know, they

49:48

would tell you, oh, it was planned

49:51

or we positioned like that, that's all bullshit.

49:53

No, it was it wasn't planned. I had an

49:55

issue. The issue

49:57

wasn't being resolved.

50:00

And oftentimes, when someone

50:02

quote unquote feels like they

50:05

gave you an opportunity, you

50:07

should forever be.

50:11

Indebted to them. But

50:14

I'm like, no, you can, you could.

50:15

I mean, I understand the idea

50:17

of the opportunity, but it didn't.

50:20

It came because I was somebody's friend.

50:22

We had to we have to learn to start being

50:24

a slave the lord.

50:25

Yeah, and I'm like, somebody gives us an opportunity

50:28

and we feel forever debted although

50:30

things are not going the way that they should.

50:33

Nah, I appreciate the opportunity.

50:35

Yeah, but but but my thing is, you

50:39

know, the opportunity of of

50:42

what entirely?

50:44

You know what I'm saying, because at the end of the day, yeah,

50:46

there's an opportunity, but what's the plan?

50:49

Right?

50:49

There was no plan the

50:52

play. It's just all good as long as somebody

50:55

else has had I never want to be in that in.

50:57

That position, and it

50:59

was all good. Played the role. I played the role,

51:01

and I was doing

51:04

my thing. I started to

51:06

get talent.

51:08

I started beating guys out and I wasn't even

51:10

a registered agent and I was beating guys out right,

51:14

and they didn't know how. Nobody

51:16

really knew how. But I had a connectivity.

51:19

And so when I when I

51:22

seen it, I can.

51:22

Actually do it.

51:24

I decided, and once I seen

51:26

I can actually do it, and this didn't feel

51:28

good. And I'm seeing what's transpiring,

51:31

I'm like, I'm out. I it

51:34

wasn't it wasn't a plan. It

51:36

was May conversation

51:40

ship by by by

51:42

August. My mind was already made up

51:46

regardless, and I didn't care if

51:48

Lebron stayed. I didn't care who stay.

51:51

I was out and I had to and I

51:53

had the mentality that I was gonna build it. It

51:56

just so happened that they left with me, and

51:58

I was appreciative of that.

51:59

You know what, you know, I'm

52:01

not breaking down. I'm not interrupting your normally

52:03

scheduled programming to break news to you. You

52:07

know what's being said. You know what was

52:09

said. He got Lebron James.

52:12

So it wasn't that he was good

52:14

at what he does. Is that he just had

52:16

the best player in the NBA. And everybody

52:19

says, Okay, if he's that Lebron,

52:21

trust him, I'll trust him.

52:22

Also.

52:23

Boy, that's bs because it actually goes the other

52:26

way. In a lot of cases, it's

52:28

more challenging, at least for me. Now

52:31

when they have it or

52:33

have him, or if you got this

52:36

person, it's a different dynamic.

52:39

You can use your client list and

52:41

it's to your benefit.

52:42

It's to your benefit. But when it's me and

52:45

it's my client list or I got the

52:48

stars, it's a detriment

52:51

that comes with that.

52:52

People don't understand. It's like, oh, you

52:54

had Lebron, it should be easy. No, it's actually harder.

52:56

You know why.

52:57

It's harder because we come from a place

52:59

where that can only be one king. Our

53:02

environment teaches us to

53:04

always be competitive. There's

53:07

no collaboration, there's no communication,

53:10

you know, there's no connectivity that's

53:12

there. There's no compounding of

53:14

anything. So it actually becomes harder. And by

53:17

the way, I've lost clients.

53:18

Because of this.

53:20

The person next to them feel like they're

53:22

in competition with me. So no,

53:25

I'm not even in that space, not in competition

53:27

with me.

53:28

The position I'm in right now.

53:30

I could do anything for

53:32

anybody within reason, and

53:35

I want to do that. I'm not I'm

53:37

not competing

53:40

with other agents. I'm not competing

53:42

with young, up and coming

53:45

people that have a guy

53:47

that want to be positioned and empowered.

53:50

I want to empower you. But they're

53:52

putting out there, oh, well, you know, rich

53:54

ain't gonna do this rich. See for yourself.

53:57

I don't need the peanut gallery. See

53:59

for yourself. And if there's a conversation that

54:01

makes sense, and if it make business sense, then we

54:03

can do business. But at the end of the days,

54:06

it's.

54:07

Actually it works for me, its

54:10

it works against you in a lot of ways.

54:12

Now, in some cases it does work for it. You don't get me wrong.

54:15

When you have the talent

54:18

that we have at our company, you

54:21

can't deny that.

54:23

But yet, and still, unfortunately,

54:28

we have to break down the

54:30

psychological barriers

54:33

of all.

54:34

Right.

54:35

I learned I come from it when

54:37

I was young selling candy and

54:39

popping beer wine at.

54:40

My dad's store.

54:42

Some people chose not to patronize

54:45

with us because in their mind, if I

54:47

spend my money with rich, then little

54:49

rich get to Jordan's and

54:52

I don't have them. So God

54:54

was already preparing me for this position I'm in now.

54:56

So when I see it, it don't even bother

54:59

me.

55:01

When do you remember, did

55:03

you know who Lebron was when you first met

55:06

it? And what was your first impressions when you did

55:08

meeting?

55:08

Yeah, our high schools played against each other every year, so

55:11

myself and Maverick we played against

55:13

each other every years, mandatory football,

55:16

basketball, baseball. Our high schools

55:18

played against each other every year. Bron wasn't

55:20

yet Bron. They had won before,

55:23

but he wasn't on the cover.

55:23

Of Sports Illustrated.

55:24

But I knew I know every kid. I knew every kid

55:26

cause I'm I go to games all that. And

55:31

my impression was he asked me a question

55:33

about what I had on my energy

55:36

was nice enough, not because I was looking for something

55:38

in return. That's another thing our

55:40

environment teaches us. If you give me something

55:43

I get, I gotta get something in return. That's

55:45

why we never build anything. That's

55:47

why everyone wants to be the talent, because the talent

55:49

brings forth fortunate and thing. No

55:51

one ever thinks about building, and no

55:54

one ever thinks about playing a different role within

55:56

the ecosystem of physical therapists, you

55:58

know, analysts, GM,

56:01

et cetera. There's a lot of roles to play

56:04

within the ecosystem, but that's not

56:06

the popular role to play.

56:08

And that's why everybody can't be shot at sharp.

56:11

Just can't.

56:12

Everybody ain't gonna wear that yellow jacket and go

56:14

and can. But my jacket could

56:17

be a difference. It may not be yellow, but that's port

56:19

of Hall of Fame. But I got

56:21

a jacket on.

56:22

You understand what I'm saying. So that's always been my mentality.

56:25

Why it's such a problem is that,

56:27

you know, Phil Knight, Jeff Bezos. You look

56:29

at some of the greatest men in the world, wealthiest

56:32

men in the world, women have had

56:34

someone believe in them. But

56:36

it seems to be a problem that Lebron I

56:39

don't know, and you don't have to address

56:41

this. I don't know if he invested money, but

56:43

I know he invested an opportunity.

56:45

Yeah, Lebron never gave me a dollar, and that

56:48

was the that's what they wanted to put out there, right,

56:50

But they didn't say that about Jeff Schwartz.

56:52

They didn't say that about Arn Teller. They

56:54

didn't say that about Mark Barlestein. They

56:57

didn't say those things, right, Right, what

57:00

you think happened with them?

57:02

Did they?

57:02

Just what you think happened. You get what I'm saying, and

57:04

I respect those guys, but

57:07

but that's not what's being said.

57:09

Right.

57:10

You get what I'm saying is when they have the top player,

57:13

that player don't have to own a piece of they business

57:15

for them to represent them. That players represent

57:17

them.

57:17

They're represented by that that that players

57:20

represented by that person because

57:22

that person is deemed to be

57:25

capable of of doing

57:27

the job.

57:29

Same for me, same

57:32

for me.

57:33

I want to know this after

57:36

Dan Garber said, what the hell he's saying?

57:38

Yeah, he wrote what he wrote, said

57:41

Lebron quick putting that thing up in the paper,

57:44

How the hell did you convince Lebron to take

57:46

his ass back to Cleveland?

57:48

Legacy? About

57:50

legacy?

57:50

Man, we come from a place where two brothers shoot

57:53

at each other and sleep in the same bed.

57:55

What we're gonna what we're gonna set that for? You're

57:58

gonna put that over your legacy?

57:59

When you Bron checked this side,

58:01

bro for your legacy, I think you ought to go back to Cleveland

58:03

with the title.

58:04

What Lebron said, what was his exact word

58:06

to you?

58:10

He was open minded.

58:12

He was open minded, But he wasn't the first person I had a conversation

58:14

I had to have a conversation with. You know, we were close,

58:17

so I Savannah and I'm glow

58:19

and having Randy we had to come. We talked about

58:21

it and but this was but again,

58:23

when you talk about this

58:25

is my.

58:26

Job, this is the role I play So before

58:28

you talked to bron, you talked to Savannah, you

58:30

talked to Glow, you talked to Math.

58:33

In addition to talking to them, I talked

58:35

to everybody.

58:37

How did Savannah feel?

58:41

Well? You know, man, man, we've been down like

58:44

four fat tires for so she

58:46

understood Robert because I have a perspective

58:49

on it, right, and.

58:50

I don't make it about me. What I'm

58:52

saying is in terms.

58:54

Of legacy, right, and

58:56

we we we we identified

58:58

the talent that was currently the team.

59:01

And it wasn't about winning.

59:02

I didn't know they was gonna go to the finals in the first year.

59:04

That was That was all I was saying was

59:08

there's an opportunity and

59:10

if you're able to win, it's

59:14

a rap. Nobody forget

59:16

anything else. If you win a championship

59:19

for the city of Cleveland and the Cleveland Cavaliers,

59:22

I don't care what anybody get on

59:25

any media platform

59:28

and say it don't even matter. From

59:31

that point on, it's all uphill.

59:33

How recept it was his mom, Gloria.

59:36

Coming from me, she understood it.

59:40

She understood it, and she gonna support what he support. She

59:43

understood it like a mom to me. So

59:46

when I come I barely come. But

59:48

when I do, I barely come to the table

59:51

with anything. When I do come

59:54

to the table with something, they know it's serious

59:56

because I'm not coming to the table just for the sacond coming

59:58

to the table.

59:59

I'm coming to the table.

1:00:00

I thought this through, I've strategized

1:00:03

it. You know, it makes perfect

1:00:05

sense, and so on and so forth. What would they allow

1:00:07

me to do my job?

1:00:08

The conversation of leaving Cleveland going

1:00:10

to La. Whose idea was that?

1:00:13

Well, the conversation leaving Cleveland, I mean, and I

1:00:16

talked about this before, and I you

1:00:19

know, people just go crazy, But the

1:00:22

conversation was pretty simple in terms of what

1:00:25

is it that you want to do. If you want

1:00:28

to stay here, let's stay here. But

1:00:31

if you want to go somewhere, your

1:00:35

brand is here. You

1:00:37

only got so many options, right, We

1:00:40

wasn't going to New York, even

1:00:42

though New York, you know, was

1:00:46

was it was an option. But

1:00:51

ultimately he had already had a place in LA

1:00:54

and uh, I

1:00:57

had the opportunity of spending a

1:00:59

year here with because I had KCP here and getting

1:01:01

a better understanding of the organization Magic

1:01:04

and I talked a lot new Rob just

1:01:06

through throughout the years, and

1:01:11

his family wanted to be in LA and

1:01:13

so ultimately it became an easier choice.

1:01:16

But when we started doing the process

1:01:19

of elimination, it's only

1:01:21

there's only so many places to go.

1:01:22

And you know, LJ gets bored about things and

1:01:24

whatnot, and people take that out of context.

1:01:26

But I'm just saying in terms of and I said to him,

1:01:29

now, the only thing is we

1:01:31

already you came back from three one, you brought

1:01:33

a championship and either been to eight straight finals.

1:01:37

I think he went to eighth straight. Yeah, he went to h.

1:01:39

Straight Miami four in Cleveland.

1:01:41

Then you're coming down off that mountaintop. Now

1:01:44

you know when we go we go to LA, it's

1:01:47

all about championships. But

1:01:49

all you need is one. You don't need fifteen because

1:01:52

you ain't not gonna have the time to do that. But

1:01:54

if you can get one, you

1:01:57

know, and made

1:02:00

a decision and that was and that

1:02:03

was it, Like it's not again

1:02:06

when I come to the table. It was something I

1:02:10

don't come to the table that often, so when I do, it

1:02:13

has some substance to it.

1:02:15

So what what is your take on the player

1:02:17

empowerment? We see players being able to

1:02:20

I'm not happy here. I'm going there. I'm not happy there.

1:02:22

I'm going somewhere else. I'm not happy. There's the

1:02:24

James Harden situation. What's your take

1:02:26

on the hard situation?

1:02:28

Well, I mean, in James's case, I

1:02:31

think from what I understand

1:02:33

about and what he's said publicly.

1:02:36

I know James known him for a long time.

1:02:40

It's a personal thing that he feels as if

1:02:42

something was promised, was

1:02:44

positioned for him, and it's different. I

1:02:46

don't know if it's totally basketball, because

1:02:49

I know James loved the game of basketball, and

1:02:54

you know, there's there's there's some things

1:02:56

that probably could have take place prior to but

1:02:58

that's up to them. I don't represent James, you

1:03:03

know, but but yeah, it's

1:03:05

a tough situation for him.

1:03:06

Man.

1:03:06

But ultimately, when you're in these

1:03:09

type of situations, the one thing that's

1:03:11

very important that I think people

1:03:14

have to monitor and understand is your

1:03:17

value.

1:03:17

Right.

1:03:18

You want to keep your value up, and

1:03:20

so you think about the value coming from the

1:03:23

extension that could have been in Brooklyn to

1:03:25

currently now, Well, you're never gonna get that money.

1:03:28

We don't know where that where that is rich.

1:03:30

You're not getting that money and for.

1:03:32

Me to say, I don't know where it is. I don't know, but I'm

1:03:35

just saying.

1:03:36

I don't see it.

1:03:37

I don't I don't see him at that age

1:03:40

wanting out of Houston, wanting out of Brooklyn, want

1:03:42

and out of feeling and somebody trusting him to

1:03:44

give him that much. You've represented

1:03:46

a lot of guys and you get close, you build

1:03:48

a relationship. But how hard

1:03:51

is it for you to part ways with a guy or guy

1:03:53

said, you know what, man, this is just it's

1:03:55

not that hard.

1:03:56

If not, no, because at

1:03:58

the end of the day, you have to understand

1:04:01

you're not gonna be able to please everybody. And sometimes

1:04:03

we could work a very very thankless job.

1:04:06

Sometimes you could do everything right and

1:04:08

it's not good enough. Because again,

1:04:11

our athletes are being taught a

1:04:14

certain way. They're being taught everybody

1:04:18

should be doing stuff for you for free. They're

1:04:21

being taught that come play for my AAU team.

1:04:23

I'm gonna give you this.

1:04:25

Your parents can fly on us. So

1:04:28

now you build your assage when

1:04:31

it comes to doing business.

1:04:33

And it's a talent right so now

1:04:36

if anybody has an entitlement to that

1:04:38

talent, that's like the steering.

1:04:40

Wheel of the car.

1:04:41

So now, well, what

1:04:44

are you doing? He's scoring the points,

1:04:47

what are you doing. We

1:04:49

don't only work on July first, We work all

1:04:51

year round. But it's not looked at like

1:04:54

that. So you have to start to distinguish

1:04:57

and yourself from who actually values

1:04:59

you and value your expertise, because

1:05:01

treat me the same way you treat that person.

1:05:04

Sit behind the counter at the Louis Vuitton

1:05:06

cash register. They ain't

1:05:08

giving you no discount. You ain't coming to

1:05:10

them. You're throwing everything on and you because

1:05:13

it costs more, and it's a thing,

1:05:16

it's the stature thing. You want to

1:05:18

show that you spent two hundred

1:05:20

thousand at the store.

1:05:22

Right. But then when it comes to someone

1:05:25

who.

1:05:25

Your percentage, they want to cut you if your percentage

1:05:28

and.

1:05:28

Have that that that doesn't that

1:05:30

don't make sense to me, right, But this is

1:05:32

what's happening in the

1:05:34

space and for

1:05:37

those that for those

1:05:39

that lead with that, because there's a

1:05:41

lot of companies that lead with that, they

1:05:44

do it playing on the ego that

1:05:47

I'm so good that they want to

1:05:49

work for less, right, because I'm so good.

1:05:53

But when you think about life, nothing

1:05:55

else in life works like that if you need

1:05:57

heart surgery, you want

1:06:00

discount. I'm

1:06:03

just asking you got club sha,

1:06:05

share your production crew you want, you want

1:06:07

to just get some guys off the street.

1:06:10

But only in.

1:06:11

Sports is where they can feed the

1:06:13

egos so much that

1:06:16

it causes you to have bad

1:06:18

business practice. Now people may say, oh, you're just

1:06:21

saying that it's self serving. No, it's

1:06:23

in anything anything you

1:06:25

do in life that's worthy.

1:06:28

There's no shortcut to that. Right

1:06:31

you go up and mass you

1:06:33

can't even buy nothing.

1:06:36

You want to buy that. This

1:06:38

is no matter how much money you got. This

1:06:41

is my point. So that's what I'm saying. But you

1:06:44

but but when they can't get it there they

1:06:46

go and pay what double

1:06:48

and triple. You get what I'm saying.

1:06:51

So that's my thing is just about respect.

1:06:53

I mean, I can't say what other people

1:06:56

do and don't do. It's just but for me, it's

1:06:58

just it's so it's not that it's not that hard. When

1:07:00

if it's not working out, then

1:07:03

it don't work out.

1:07:04

I'm gonna get you out of here on this one. And you're the

1:07:07

closest to the story, so you would know what

1:07:11

if with the vitriol of the older

1:07:13

players towards Lebron. It seems

1:07:15

like and it seems like a lot of the old players

1:07:18

don't want to give these young this younger generation

1:07:21

the credit that they deserve.

1:07:22

But it seems like a lot of the ire is

1:07:25

pointed at twenty three.

1:07:27

Why do you think that is really corny?

1:07:28

To me? I will absolutely and I do like

1:07:31

I said, you know, and when you're out there, you deal

1:07:33

with certain things. It's it's it's

1:07:35

layered in my opinion. Got to remember

1:07:38

when Lebron came in, a lot of guys were

1:07:40

still in the prime and all

1:07:42

the attention turned to him in two thousand,

1:07:45

says to all the attention boom,

1:07:47

one hundred min dollars of contract, real

1:07:50

hundred men, not that fluff that be going out today.

1:07:51

I'm talking about one hundred minion dollars contract.

1:07:54

Never drive with NBA basketball in the

1:07:56

NBA, they.

1:07:57

Never seen nothing like that, you

1:07:59

know, sending a private jet

1:08:01

when he's sending the high school. We going up to New York every

1:08:03

weekend, every other weekend with whatever. When

1:08:06

you could you know what I'm saying, all

1:08:08

these things, they wasn't

1:08:11

it? And so quite naturally

1:08:13

in the neighborhood you develop what NB.

1:08:17

It's it's much easier for you

1:08:19

to be like, man, that's some cold man, that's

1:08:22

some that's player, that's real player.

1:08:24

Man.

1:08:24

I appreciate that. I'm proud of you. That's

1:08:28

the hardest thing to do. The easiest

1:08:30

thing to do is what they do.

1:08:32

Ah this you know you have and then now

1:08:34

when you give that to a media platform,

1:08:36

and now it's even trickling down to some of the younger players

1:08:39

just they purposely don't say

1:08:42

his name and things, Oh

1:08:44

I played this because of these people. But again,

1:08:47

if you everybody didn't always had a mama

1:08:49

mentality. The mama mentality came.

1:08:52

After Kobe was really done. Then all

1:08:54

of a sudden, everybody had the mama mentality.

1:08:55

Because the mama. Everybody frowned the planet because

1:08:58

they say he was ball home.

1:08:59

Yeah, but when he was playing, because

1:09:01

I was there, we said he wasn't hanging

1:09:03

out with none of these guys.

1:09:06

You know, you give what I'm saying.

1:09:07

But I'm

1:09:11

not surprised because I come from it.

1:09:14

I wish it was different, but I'm

1:09:16

not surprised because I come from it. But what

1:09:19

impresses me more is

1:09:22

that guy don't

1:09:25

do unto those what they do to him. His door

1:09:27

has always been open. Every

1:09:29

time you see somebody, man, what's up? Show love,

1:09:32

et cetera.

1:09:32

Even when there's is he too nice?

1:09:36

Because because Jordan gave the players, he played

1:09:38

it with him. But he.

1:09:41

Understand some familiarity breed disrespect.

1:09:44

And I tell him that sometimes they

1:09:48

can walk past somebody, don't even speak. That

1:09:50

make that person want to speak to you more. If

1:09:53

you speak to that person every time, it becomes

1:09:57

And that's that's the.

1:09:58

Treatment that he gets.

1:09:59

Sometimes what I'm saying, they get on Dremond

1:10:01

for being his friend. It's craziness,

1:10:04

right. But but but again

1:10:07

this is this is not about That's not an athlete

1:10:09

thing. That's a people thing. And

1:10:12

that's why I said what I said

1:10:15

when we were talking on first take. We have

1:10:17

to break those sites. I'm not gonna do unto

1:10:19

those others as they've

1:10:22

done to me. That's not just not what

1:10:24

I come from, because you don't want those habits

1:10:26

created.

1:10:27

So if the Jordan Lebron

1:10:29

debate ever gonna.

1:10:30

End, it ain't

1:10:32

gonna end. But Bron's a goat, Jordan

1:10:35

a goat. Le Bron's ago.

1:10:37

One guy one one

1:10:39

one guy got gold Horne.

1:10:41

The other guy got platinum horse.

1:10:42

Yeah, I

1:10:45

got a little platinum in here, but it's like platinum dog

1:10:47

and then Bron's all platinum.

1:10:49

Lucky me. A memory on changing the odds,

1:10:51

Rich Paul.

1:10:52

Precid, Thank you, Thank you.

1:10:54

All my life, all my life.

1:10:57

Sacrifice us, want

1:11:00

to slice, got to brow the dice, the squad

1:11:02

all my life.

1:11:03

I've been grinding all my life.

1:11:04

Yeah, all my life, grinding all

1:11:07

my.

1:11:07

Life, sacrifice, Mussell,

1:11:09

play the Price, want to slice,

1:11:11

got to brow the dice, the swap all my life.

1:11:14

I've been grinding all my life.

1:11:16

M