0:11

Luke: Today's episode is going to be a little unique and tell the

0:14

story of Vinny Panico, who in 2017 suffered a catastrophic knee

0:19

injury during a game his junior football season. I wanna have vi

0:23

on so you could hear his amazing story, but also so we all could

0:27

be reminded about the power of. And perseverance when faced with

0:30

great adversity, "I have no doubt you're going to walk away

0:33

inspired and reminded how important it is for all of us to

0:37

believe, support and motivate those who we lead. So Vinny,

0:42

it's, it's an honor to have yon. Obviously our relationship goes

0:46

back many years as "I got to coach you during that difficult

0:50

moment in your life. And "I wanna start with. the night that it

0:54

happened. I'm sure you remember it vividly. So take us back to

0:59

that infamous night of the injury and what you remember of the play

1:05

and what happened as the athletic trainer ran out and "I was out

1:09

there with you and where they're talking to you. Vinnie: Yeah. So first off, thank you so much for, for having me on

1:14

the show today. I'm, uh, super excited to be on. I've heard a

1:17

lot about it. Uh, listened in on it a bunch of times, so "I, yeah,

1:20

really excited first off. But, um, yeah, so "I "I, remember the

1:24

night like it was yesterday? It was, um, week four versus Zion

1:27

Benton, at home, on our home field and "I had my whole family

1:31

in the crowds. "I had one of my dad's old friends from high

1:34

school or. coming in to watch me and it was maybe the, the fourth

1:39

series of the game, I Playing Defense, the defensive. and "I.

1:43

"I was having a good season thus far and was super excited about

1:46

it. Um, was my first time playing defense was my junior year

1:48

transitioning from offense, in like my, underclassmen years and

1:52

yeah, "I "I. Remember "I was, um, face, "I was playing right

1:55

defensive end, and "I was facing their left tackle "I. "I hit a

1:58

spin move and then, um, made it kind of around their, their left

2:01

tackle. And then sort of as I'm planting to make the sack, the

2:06

quarterback was real shifty. We knew he was shifty on film. And

2:08

as I'm planting to make the sack, I see a body coming in and "I

2:12

know it's from my team "I. See the, blue jersey coming in, "I

2:14

remember it, and like a, like a bullet coming in towards my. And

2:18

"I was perfectly planted on the ground. And um, next thing "I

2:21

know, I'm on the ground and I'm just praying to God. I'm like, I.

2:24

Hope I'm okay. Because it looked like he got me perfectly and "I

2:28

didn't feel anything. and "I sort of "I hit the ground. "I had my

2:31

eyes closed. And as I'm getting back up, "I look down at my leg

2:35

and "I could, "I, could see the bottom of my foot. like upright.

2:39

I'm like taking a knee with my right leg is on the ground. And

2:41

then my "I kind of bring my left leg up and the bottom half of my

2:45

leg, that tio, which is pointed in the opposite direction, just

2:49

like right at the joint, which is like perfectly 90 degrees. And "I

2:53

seen my kneecaps all the way to the right side of my leg. And,

2:56

and next thing "I know, I'm not even focused on the injury. "I

2:59

see the quarterback sprinting down field and the first thing "I

3:02

felt was, damn, we didn't get 'em. Um, and then "I start

3:05

thinking in my head. Luke: you should have been thinking

3:08

Vinnie: Yeah, exactly. "I was like, damn, we didn't get 'em. And then in my head I'm like, wow, I have a massive problem

3:14

here. And I'm thinking like, "I, my, my poor Nona, my poor little

3:18

Nona is gonna be screaming in the crowd, um, when she sees her

3:21

grandson looking like this. And my mother is gonna be screaming

3:24

in the crowd crying, seeing me like that. And "I was like, "I

3:26

can't let anyone see me like this. And as he's running on the

3:29

field, "I like my perfect opportunity to put it back into

3:31

place without anyone knowing, and kind of act like it didn't

3:33

happen. So "I, "I reach with both hands to my Kneecap, right "I and

3:38

"I was on like the side of my leg. It was completely dislocated

3:40

and "I ripped my kneecap over first, and then "I kind of threw

3:44

a few upper cuts at my tibia to kinda get my legs straightened

3:48

out. And then I'm thinking "I "I had no clue about anatomy. "I

3:51

wanted to be, you know, like a law guy or business guy. So "I

3:54

had no clue what was going on. I'm like, oh, it's like a shoulder joint. "I just popped it back into place. I'm completely

3:59

okay. And "I "I, "I had heard "I, you know, "I know Joey was on

4:02

your podcast, Stutzman "I know he'd pop his shoulder all the

4:05

time. I'm like, I'll be back in, gimme two plays and I'll be right

4:07

back in. And I'm like, then that'll never, the quarterback

4:10

will never get that far down the field again. and as "I stand.

4:13

I've never felt a pain like that in my life and such a weird

4:16

feeling. It felt loose my joint and it crunches right back down

4:19

90 degrees again. And I'm like, wow, this is a serious problem.

4:23

Uh, so once again, "I gotta punch it back again and "I get it

4:25

straight. And then I'm laying, kind of laying on the ground like

4:28

on one Misa and I'm calling the trainers over, like both trainers

4:30

to come get me. And, um, only one of 'em comes out cuz they just

4:35

see me down. It's probably a cramp, you know, "I, they,

4:37

they're probably assuming no one really saw what happened cuz the,

4:39

such a big play was made by the, by Zion. And, um, as they're kind

4:43

of ones getting me and he is trying to get me up, I'm like,

4:45

um, Andrew, the, the trainer. I'm like, I'm like, drew, it's bad.

4:49

Like, this is really bad. He's like, oh, come on, let's do it.

4:52

And "I was like, "I, "I need more than one person. Cuz every

4:54

movement "I was making, trying to hobble "I, couldn't put weight on

4:56

it. And just that, that movement, that shaky. was, um, like killing

5:00

me. And then the other trainer came out and "I had to, they had

5:03

to kind of hoist me up. "I had to get 'em both around the neck and

5:05

they were, taking me off the, off the field. And "I was, you know,

5:09

on the sideline. I'm trying to walk on it, test it out and

5:11

stuff, and, um, nothing was working.

5:14

Luke: So, yeah, "I, remember you coming off the field with the

5:17

trainers, and I'll tell you as, as a head coach and "I have a lot

5:21

of listeners who are head coaches, injuries are always

5:24

tough because you're so concerned about the. But you don't want to

5:30

get the parents nervous cuz you know they're in the stands. And

5:32

"I feel like when "I go out there, sometimes "I almost add to

5:35

the anxiety of parents. So "I, remember you laying there and

5:41

you're not a guy that usually lays on the ground and "I was

5:44

like, ah, you know, again, the bait. Like, do "I go out there

5:46

and "I know how, what a tight-knit family you have. I'm

5:49

like, "I don't wanna get his parents nervous. And "I, remember

5:52

you coming off being carried by the trainers as you mention. and

5:56

you have your arms around him. "I "I vividly remember? And "I

5:59

locked eyes with Andrew, our trainer, and he shook his head

6:03

no, to me, which was cold. Like this is bad. Okay? So now you

6:07

have to go through and kind of face the rest of your team, and

6:11

you kind of have to lie. "I be like, all right guys, Vinny's all

6:14

good. No worries. We're gonna evaluate him. So you get back in

6:17

the game. Meanwhile, all the coaches in the headsets are like,

6:21

holy crap. this is serious, And. Everyone's thoughts go to, you

6:25

and your, and your wellbeing. So it, it was definitely a, a crazy

6:30

time, but even at that moment, we didn't know how severe it was.

6:35

Okay. So you have to fill in some gaps for me because I do know you

6:41

at the advice of our trainer. You ended up going to the er. Is

6:45

that. Vinnie: Yeah, no. So "I actually, so what didn't "I Yeah. Like you

6:49

said, this is my first time getting injured. So "I refused to

6:51

believe anything was seriously wrong with me. and like my, my

6:54

dazed in confused mind. And, um, when "I went in at halftime, like

6:58

he was kind of checking out my knee, our trainer, and he's like,

7:00

it's really bad. He's like, it's so bad. "I can't actually tell

7:03

what's wrong with. He's like, it just seems like everything is

7:06

wrong with it. And I'm like, there's no way. Maybe "I got a

7:08

little like tear or something. "I think it just, maybe my meniscus

7:11

is a little messed up. And "I was like, you know what? I'm just

7:13

gonna go home for the night. And um, "I went home and "I was

7:17

thinking like, I'll wake up and I'll be a lot better. And that

7:19

was the worst night of my entire life with pain. "I, couldn't make

7:23

it up the stairs. "I couldn't get any of my clothes off. "I was in

7:26

all my equipment, basically, in my living room, sitting on the

7:28

couch. "I couldn't even make it upstairs. and "I remember just

7:31

being there. and "I couldn't even turn. "I couldn't get to the

7:33

remote, and George Lopez was just playing nonstop on the tv. It was

7:36

ridiculous, all night. So "I, there was no sleeping either way.

7:39

And, um, "I make it to the doctor's office in the morning

7:42

and "I wait there for an hour, um, trying to get an appointment

7:45

with. And once "I get in, um, he's as white as a ghost. Uh, he

7:49

can't even believe, uh, sort of what's going on, and he rushes me

7:53

into his office after he sees my knee in the waiting room. and

7:57

starts saying like, why didn't you come last night? Like, where

7:59

were you? You should have been in the er. he's like, "I, think you

8:01

might have ruptured the artery behind your leg. He's like, you

8:04

could be bleeding out internally. He's like, you could die from

8:06

this. He's like, "I don't mean to like scare you. "I just mean to

8:08

create a sense of urgency for you. and he had thought, so is

8:11

that the artery, um, was the first problem and then he was

8:14

checking like, uh, we might have to get you into emergency surgery

8:17

as well. He said the compartments in my like, uh, my calf, could

8:21

have collapsed "I. Guess there's four compartment. in there. And

8:24

he, checked those with like a, a ginormous needle to check "I

8:27

guess like the pressure or something within the compartments. And "I was good to go there. And then it was a

8:31

matter of getting me to the ER as soon as possible to make sure my,

8:35

that artery wasn't ruptured and that "I wasn't bleeding out cuz

8:37

my leg literally turned into a balloon. "I know you saw it, even

8:41

after the fact. It was, it was absolutely ginormous. There was

8:43

no definition of. went there. My CAT scan was, um, actually okay.

8:48

"I never ruptured the artery. And then once "I got the "I, had to

8:51

wait a few days. Um, the "I came back. "I tore my acl, my M C L,

8:57

my L C, and my pcl. All four of the, all four of the ligaments in

9:01

the knee, "I tore my meniscus. "I tore the bottom of my. and "I

9:07

broke my tibia of the actual bone that, like the, the shin bone, so

9:11

to speak, right at the top, so it like would crunch like that. And,

9:14

um, right at the top it was just, crunched completely. So it was,

9:17

it was skeletal rather than vascular. but, yeah, so "I hit,

9:20

"I hit Luke: And let, let's go. Let's, uh, I'm sorry to interrupt you.

9:24

Let's go back a second before we move ahead. I, do remember the

9:27

next day, and again, usually. When you have these injuries

9:30

happen, the next day you touch base with the trainer and he or

9:35

she kind of gives you a rundown of everything that happened the

9:38

previous night. So of course we talked about you and "I. Remember

9:43

Andrew emphatically being like "I really think. He should have gone

9:48

to the doctor. All right. And "I know we have a team doctor on our

9:50

sidelines and "I don't, "I don't even know what the team doctor's

9:54

conversations, what, what your parents were. But "I do know that

9:58

given your personality, and this is probably ironically also what

10:02

helped you through this moment, is you're kind of stubborn and

10:04

you're a tough guy and you didn't wanna go to the doctor. And

10:08

that's what our trainer was filling me in on on Saturday. And

10:10

he heard from your parents as to what your, your diagnosis was.

10:14

And "I, just remember, Andrew saying he could lose his leg over

10:17

this. "I was like, oh, my "I mean, it was just, you know, you

10:20

you're thinking like, okay, maybe it's uh, a dislocated knee "I.

10:23

Wonder if he torn any tendons. Will he be back to season? "I

10:25

mean? That's kind of what, what you're thinking. So when you

10:28

heard that moment, "I was like, holy. "I "I didn't even know what

10:32

all the coaches were. Just like, holy cow. You know? It's just

10:35

really hard thing to, to digest. So that's us and we're on the

10:40

outside. "I, want to get inside your head. So when you heard the

10:44

official word and all the damage, "I mean, literally, your

10:47

everything around your knee was devastated. Right? what was going

10:51

through your head at that moment, that Saturday afternoon or

10:54

whenever that exact moment was? You heard all that damage that

10:59

really. Vinnie: So when "I, when "I heard that "I was like, um, "I, you

11:03

know, "I, "I started to honestly believe it a little bit like when

11:06

"I woke up the next hour, "I started thinking like, okay, the,

11:08

the macho thing and all the adrenaline's done. I told myself,

11:12

"I said like, there is something "I think that is seriously wrong

11:14

with me. at this point for like the size of my leg. And you know,

11:17

"I never been like "I said, "I had never been injured before.

11:20

So, you know, you refuse to believe it for a while. And then like once you get slapped with that pain, um, you start thinking

11:25

like maybe something could be, could be really wrong. And then

11:28

when "I, when "I have a orthopedic surgeon who's, who's

11:31

one of the best in the business, "I mean like for dozens and

11:34

dozens of years he's been practicing. He tells me this is

11:36

the. knee related injury he's ever seen in his, you know, some

11:40

odd years of working. You start thinking like, uh, wow. you know,

11:44

something seriously happened here and, you know, the, the act is

11:46

over and "I gotta take action on this now and stop trying to, you

11:49

know, walk on it and act like everything's okay. Um, "I really

11:52

gotta get the business here and figure this all out. Luke: and I'm sure being a. In high school, you probably pretty

12:00

quickly thought about the future and will "I get to play my senior

12:04

year because that's such a special time for any athlete of

12:07

any sport. I'm sure your thoughts went there and "I bet knowing

12:11

your parents, they probably thought about that as well.

12:14

Obviously your wellbeing came first in her heads, but you know,

12:16

there was that white elephant in the room and that was senior.

12:20

What was the doctor's feedback about your future and playing

12:24

football again? Vinnie: Uh, the first thing that came outta my mouth wasn't even

12:28

senior year. "I said, I think we're gonna win the state

12:30

championships. to my surgeon, as soon as he started telling me,

12:32

you tore this, this, and that, "I said, when can "I get back this

12:35

year and will "I make it to that state game? Cause "I know we have

12:38

the talent to do it. And he said, um, let's focus on step A here.

12:43

He said you might not even walk again. Um, he's like, you might

12:47

even lose your leg. so he said, um, let's be careful here and

12:50

think about your health first because football is most likely

12:53

over for you. Luke: And what was going through your head mentally when you heard

12:59

that news? Vinnie: yeah. And "I, it was hard and he tried putting it in the

13:02

best way possible, like trying to be nice about it. Um, "I refused

13:05

to believe it though. I said, like, "I, I'm, I'm super healthy.

13:09

I'm still young. And "I have that kind of, that fire and that

13:11

drive, especially as a junior, um, you know, like you have a lot

13:14

to prove for yourself, especially going on to play. And like "I

13:17

know football means the world to our little town in Lake Zurich.

13:20

Um, so "I was like, "I got something to prove and, you know,

13:23

I'm not gonna let a medical diagnosis, um, especially this

13:26

soon. like, determine my future. And you know, what "I want to do

13:29

with my life and "I think it's, you know, up in my hands, um,

13:33

rather than anyone else's. You know what I'm gonna do next with

13:35

this? Especially so early on, "I said a lot of things can change

13:38

and there's always hope. "I never lost hope. Luke: you kind of beat me to my next question, cuz "I, "I kind of

13:44

wanna get into that. you hear this news and "I know, you said

13:47

you refused to believe it, but there had to be some of you that,

13:50

that did believe it. I'm sure there was a larger chunk of your

13:52

parents that believed it because again, you want to protect your

13:56

kids was the moment that you really truly started to believe

14:01

and made the decision? "I am going to play football my senior

14:05

season cuz "I "I Find it hard. "I. "I. I'm not saying

14:08

impossible, but "I find it hard to believe was at that moment,

14:10

right? when was it, when you're like that because "I do think it

14:13

was a moment, like something switched in you and just said,

14:17

I'm proving everybody wrong and "I am going to play football in

14:20

my senior season. Vinnie: Um, yeah, "I, it certainly was creeping in bad. "I

14:23

wasn't fully committed to the idea. and so when he, when he was

14:26

telling me that, and "I was there, and, um, when "I before

14:28

testing, "I was certainly not committed to it. "I thought, I'm gonna lose my leg. And then after the testing, you start getting

14:32

some hope. You're like, okay, my artery's not ruptured. At least,

14:35

I don't have like the, the compartment issues going on in my

14:37

calf. and I'm like, yeah, there "I still like had that mentality

14:41

like, I'm gonna come back and then, but you know, "I have a lot

14:43

of self-doubt. Um, a lot of it, especially with all the doctors,

14:46

talking to me every single time like about like, oh, it's so bad.

14:49

It's this and that. It's the worst I've ever seen. But, um, it

14:52

kind of came during my recovery process. So "I was scheduled to

14:57

get surgery, and "I think it was like six to eight weeks following

15:00

the injury, maybe even four, four to eight weeks. We'll call it "I.

15:02

Think it. prior to getting that surgery because that bone was

15:05

broken, so they had to wait for the bone to heal before they

15:08

could take all the grafts and put all the screws and nuts and bolts

15:11

in, to, you know, restructure all these ligaments. So about four to

15:16

six weeks in "I was given like all these physical therapy

15:18

exercises to do before "I actually started the surgery,

15:21

before the surgery happened. While my bone. and "I mean every

15:24

single day. "I was doing like simple things, "I just moving my

15:27

foot around, keeping it stationary, icing it, doing the,

15:31

the compression work and stuff. And just, uh, really trying to

15:33

become like a student of the game. Like how can "I get, how

15:36

can "I be my best self even in this position? And then about

15:39

four weeks comes around and my mom hands me a phone. I'm in, um,

15:43

I'm once again on the couch. "I can't get upstairs still after

15:45

four weeks. "I, "I wasn't walking at all, obviously. And my mom

15:48

hands me a phone and she's like, it's Dr. It's Dr. Champs. "I was

15:51

like, "I, don't wanna talk to Dr. Champs. "I don't want to hear more, like terrible news. "I like, "I told him, I'm gonna get

15:56

the surgery and it's over with him. and then he was, she's like,

15:59

no. It's like good news and "I call. and then Dr. Cham is on the

16:02

phone with me and he's like, "I, don't think I'm gonna give you

16:05

surgery. in four more weeks, he said "I. "I called some of the,

16:09

the leading orthopedic surgeons at Rush and "I showed them, you

16:13

know, your updated MRIs that you just took a few days ago. And,

16:16

um, all these different results in your mobility and stuff. And,

16:19

um, "I think you're making like a, an incredible recovery

16:23

already. And "I think your bone is starting to heal itself as

16:26

well. And. He's like, "I, think you should be good to go without

16:29

surgery. Like, he's like, we may do your meniscus still. just to

16:32

keep that down the meniscus and cut part of the meniscus off that

16:34

was hanging. But he said, in terms of your ligaments and, and

16:38

your bone, all that is actually healing itself when it really

16:41

shouldn't be. after that Convers. I'm thinking I'm, I'm a hundred

16:46

percent committed to getting back to playing football if "I don't

16:48

need the surgery. "I said "I will be playing football either by the

16:52

end of this year and I'm gonna make it to that game. "I was

16:55

thinking in my head, or, you know, it's gonna be, next year,

16:58

and it ended up being next year. Obviously, it was very unrealistic for me to make it back my junior season, even

17:02

though "I, you know, "I hoped for it. but yeah, and then it just

17:04

kind of snowball effect. Just continued to be a student of the

17:06

game. "I never had the surgery and just, um, kind of was working

17:10

on healing myself and "I ended up working out. Luke: The doctor referenced the ligaments healing themselves, and

17:17

that should not happen. "I mean, did he give any insight like,

17:20

this is a medical miracle. I've never seen this before. "I mean,

17:24

what was his insight on that?

17:26

Vinnie: yeah, he had never, he had never seen something like

17:29

this before. and one thing "I and, and what "I think "I agree

17:32

with him is, is that like the ACL and "I could be completely wrong.

17:35

You know, I'm not a doctor, but, um, what "I remember him telling

17:38

me and what "I remember, the theory being is like the ACL

17:40

obviously doesn't heal on its own. Like once your ACL's gone,

17:42

it's gone. Um, it doesn't have its own blood supply. But all

17:45

this blood, this rich blood that was flown in there from the

17:48

broken bone, all these other ligaments that had the blood

17:51

supply, it was just flooding the entire. and you know, obviously

17:55

like some of the stuff that "I was doing, keeping it still icing

17:57

it, taking down some of that swallowing, letting everything

17:59

circulate, kind of, let it sort of the, the body, you know, go

18:03

through its course and, fix itself. Luke: Talk about the recovery and, and the PT "I know you were

18:11

obviously very dedicated to what you need to get done in terms of

18:15

therapy and the recovery that was suggested. So walk our listeners

18:20

through what your daily routine was cuz "I know coming back from

18:25

any knee injury is very rigorous.

18:28

Vinnie: Yeah, it, it was absolutely devastating. And it

18:31

was, yeah, like you said, rigorous. So the most devastating

18:34

part for me is that, you know, you go from being like a super

18:37

healthy 16, 17 year old kid. "I mean you were in the weight room

18:41

with me, we're all lifting a defensive lineman. Um, "I was

18:44

probably one of the healthiest I've ever been in my life. Um,

18:46

you know, squatting, benching, deadlifting, big. and then "I go

18:50

to the PT room and "I can't even walk anymore. "I didn't walk for

18:55

the first three months and doing the most simple exercises, and my

18:59

body "I could just feel it deteriorating. "I couldn't work

19:01

out. Um, and you see all that progress being lost, but you

19:04

know, still holding some faith. just doing the, the simple

19:07

workouts and taking it step by step. Like just even just going

19:10

to PT at the start and just going there to move my ankle around

19:14

for, you know, the entire hour. Or, getting like a massage on my

19:17

leg for an entire hour, like not doing anything. You see your body

19:20

deteriorating and, you know, "I remember like my PT progressed

19:23

after three months, "I finally walked for the first time, and

19:26

excruciating pain. Um, something that you never expect from

19:29

someone who's, you know, walks all the. but like after you

19:31

haven't walked in a long time, like the bones in your foot and

19:34

all your muscles and stuff, like feel an immense amount of paint

19:38

trying to press you off the ground and move. So "I barely had

19:41

any balance. "I felt like a little baby giraffe walking

19:43

around and "I was like, man, how did "I get in this position?

19:46

coming from the, you know, varsity football to, you know,

19:49

having someone help me to walk around, to walk 10 feet away and

19:53

um, you know, just con continued progressing. So "I went from that

19:56

to, you know, let's walk around the building one. let's, you

19:59

know, actually try and bend your leg and take your heel to your

20:02

butt, basically. and just, um, continue to do stuff like that.

20:05

And then "I, "I slowly progressed. And "I went to my

20:07

first facility, actually, which was in Highland Park, "I Believe,

20:11

and they got me on a zero gravity treadmill. So it was a treadmill

20:15

that basically blew up like a balloon, and you're like half in

20:17

the balloon and it picks you up off the ground. So you're like

20:20

10% of your body weight. And that was the first time "I had ran

20:23

again after, you know, that was at like the, uh, five month. And

20:27

then once "I could run again, you know, "I pushed the, the physical

20:30

therapist all the time. "I was like, yeah, make my weight

20:32

heavier, make me heavier, make me heavier. "I could do it, "I could

20:34

do it, "I can do it. And just pushing through that. And once "I

20:36

was able to, you know, run on my own body weight and stuff. And

20:39

then they sent me to the, the next facility and "I started

20:42

doing stuff like pistol squats, RDL stuff. And then once "I was

20:46

there, "I found, um, you know, a trainer "I really. Someone who,

20:49

you know, comes from an athletic background as well, who is really

20:52

like, Hey, you know, it might take, they're saying it's like

20:54

another six months. He's like, "I know you, you know me. He's like,

20:56

"I, come from an athletic background. "I know what you want. and he's like, let's do this quickly and let's get

21:00

through this, and, and you're gonna be strong. He's like, it's gonna be harder, it's gonna take more time. But, got through it

21:05

then and, and continued doing, like "I said, those pistol

21:07

squats, some of the harder exercises. And then "I was on the

21:10

field within, nine months back for

21:12

Luke: Yeah. Yeah. And let, let's save that moment cause we

21:15

obviously have to talk about getting back on the field cuz

21:18

that's the culmination of this that everybody's wait, waiting to

21:20

hear about. But before we do, you did reference your pt, I'm sure

21:25

there were dark moments. Throughout this recovery process,

21:28

no matter how much you believed in yourself, we all have 'em. And

21:32

like you said, just how mentally challenging it was for you to go

21:36

from healthy "I, have the world at my fingertips, 17 year old to

21:40

now I'm literally in a wheelchair. So talk about that

21:43

support system and let's start with. your coaches and your

21:47

teammates, and we're gonna go through kinda like a three-tiered

21:51

support system that "I think helped you through this process

21:53

because that's really what this podcast is, is about, positive

21:57

leadership, the power of belief, and the idea of being able to go

22:01

find our best selves and "I. Think it wasn't football that

22:05

helped you discover your best self "I really. It was this

22:09

moment, Vinny, that helped you really find out who you were as a

22:13

person, how great you can be. So how did your coaches and your

22:17

teammates help you through this and how did their positivity and,

22:22

and their check-ins and their belief in you help you?

22:25

Vinnie: Yeah. So, from, you know, a, a friend standpoint, like

22:28

other teammates on the team, "I, "I mean, they stood behind me in

22:32

every step of the way. um, "I, remember like some of my buddies,

22:35

like Galus was pushing me around on a wheelchair, making sure "I

22:37

still be, was able to come to the games. and "I think that was a

22:40

huge part of it too. You know, everyone wanted me at the games. Everyone was writing stuff down on their tape or putting in their

22:45

Instagrams and stuff and all this saying like, for Vinny, this and

22:48

that. Like, get back and, everyone made sure like "I got to

22:51

the games and when "I was at the games, "I was comfortable at the

22:53

games. And "I think that was a huge part of like that

22:56

inspiration for me because like, when you get distance away from

22:59

the. and you're just doing PTs. You kind of forget what your goal

23:02

is. You kind of forget what the goals are. You know, you're so

23:04

far away. but you know, the, the urge that, you know, my buddies

23:07

had to get me back out there even on the sideline in my wheelchair

23:10

and, you know, they'd get me the blankets and stuff and, and make

23:12

sure "I was pushed around, but made sure "I saw the entire game.

23:15

and, you know, that was just, um, uh, amazing for me and one of the

23:18

best parts about it, being able to see that goal right in front

23:21

of me and say like, Hey, I'm gonna get back here and I'm gonna

23:24

be able to do it with you guys. And, you know, thinking in my

23:26

head like, Hey, "I can get back with my friends too, and play,

23:29

you know, the game that "I love as well. And you know, it all

23:31

culminates. And "I think as well, just the, the coaches too. "I.

23:35

Think Lake "I is a, is a special town, you know, a smaller town.

23:38

It's very relationship based and, you know, the coaches emulate

23:41

that. Um, "I had, you know, a very close relationship with like

23:44

every single one of the coaches. and every single one of the

23:47

coaches checked in on me, made sure "I was doing okay. You know,

23:50

personally messaged me like yourself. and that was also like

23:53

me thinking in my head like, Hey, "I got like the entire coaching

23:55

staff behind me too. like I'm not, I'm not alone in what I'm

23:58

doing and, you know, there's faith, there's people behind me

24:01

that are pushing for me to do it. So that was just a absolutely

24:04

huge part as well as, you know, that third tier being like, you

24:06

know, my family as well Luke: Yeah. And before we get into to the family piece, that's

24:10

just great insight about you being present at games and still

24:15

feeling a part of it and how that inspired you. Because again,

24:19

talking from the lens of a coach. Injuries are really tough because

24:23

you're trying to still put your team in the position to go when

24:28

you still have other kids to coach, but you know, you have

24:30

someone behind that you wanna take care of as well. And, and

24:34

when they're not around, they, they don't feel a part of it and

24:37

you just. You basically just echo what "I always felt was just so

24:41

important, and that is get the injured athlete back around his

24:45

or her team. It is so important that they realize that they still

24:49

are a part of it because when we know we're a part of something

24:51

larger, that's when we're gonna really have purpose. "I mean. It

24:54

really helps give purpose and also at that moment in time in

24:57

your life, that's your identity. "I don't think. Necessarily

25:00

correct, to be honest with you, but it's the reality that high

25:04

school athletes tend to live in that identity of this is who "I

25:07

am, right? I'm a I'm a high school football player, and you

25:11

don't even know who else you are outside of that, nor are you

25:13

ready to figure that out yet. So that's really, really good

25:17

insight. And we definitely are gonna talk about Your family. But

25:21

before we do, let's now talk about the doctors and the

25:25

physical therapist. You've already referenced one. "I know

25:29

from talking to you back in this moment of time in your life, they

25:32

too although they hit you with some grim realities, They were

25:36

very inspirational and helped you through this as well. So talk a

25:40

little bit about that process with the medical professionals.

25:43

Vinnie: Yeah. "I, "I, "I lucked out, with the physical therapist

25:46

and "I had 'em like right at the exact moments that "I needed 'em,

25:49

like and "I. Think the personality of the physical therapist like really matters. Um, so like when "I first entered

25:55

physical therapy, once again, "I had never done physical therapy

25:57

before, and "I was in a dark, dark place like "I. Like "I said,

26:00

my body, my body was withering away. "I couldn't walk, "I didn't

26:03

walked the months, and, you know, what "I needed was, you know,

26:05

like, A kind, caring someone who's gonna be there. and "I had

26:09

that, with this woman in the physical therapy And, you know,

26:12

she was just the, the perfect amount of like, Hey, reality

26:15

check, you're not gonna walk today. And, you know, tough on

26:18

me, but also being like caring and, and, you know, really being

26:21

there for me when "I was like, I'm really struggling with this.

26:23

And, I can't do this anymore and it's hurting me. And this way "I

26:26

not walking really bothered me. And you know, she just talked me

26:29

through it the whole time. Like, it's okay. A lot of people feel

26:31

like this. and this is typically what it is when you're injured

26:34

and you, your body's gonna go away, but just understand, like

26:37

the stuff I'm showing you and teaching you will get you back to

26:39

where you need to be. So as long as you follow that process,

26:42

you're gonna get there. Just keep focusing on what your goals are

26:45

every day and, you know, don't let that darkness, you know,

26:47

overwhelm you. And "I had that perfect amount of caring. Then

26:51

once "I could walk, they sent me to the next facility. And "I, you

26:54

know, "I once again got the, the perfect physical therapist. "I

26:56

had a couple, um, ladies over there at the Highland Park. that

27:00

were, you know, very, very calculated in their work and, and

27:02

what they were doing. And that's exactly what "I needed. So they

27:05

ran all these like anti-gravity machines and stuff, and "I needed

27:08

the, you know, the science and calculations that they had behind

27:11

their expertise in order to make sure "I got to that final level

27:14

of being able to run again. So, you know, having that very

27:16

calculated being like, we're gonna get you X, Y, Z with data

27:19

every single day. So that was kind of that. weird point where,

27:22

you know, stuff can go very wrong and where you're gonna need that,

27:25

you know, that, data-driven approach. And then once "I could

27:28

run again, "I got to that final round in Libertyville, like "I

27:30

said, with the, with the physical therapist that "I, that "I

27:32

absolutely loved. Kind of like a, a hardnosed kind of guy that's

27:36

gonna get you where you need to go quickly. And that's what "I

27:38

needed. Cuz when "I a literally hit the ground running, "I wanted

27:41

to. So that's where "I got that final push to really, cut my time

27:46

down on recovery and have that for me because when "I was ready

27:49

to go, "I wanted to go, and "I had a person, that physical

27:51

therapist, who was ready to take me there and do that with me. So

27:54

"I had the, the perfect, sort of, uh, orchestra of people along the

27:57

way to kind of get me where "I needed. Luke: And the last piece of that, or. Course your family. So how

28:03

did mom and dad and your siblings handle this really tough time?

28:08

Cuz I'm sure they wanted to support your dream of getting

28:12

back on the field, but there's also the reality of "I. Don't

28:16

know if we want to take the chance of what could happen.

28:20

Vinnie: Yeah. Yeah. So "I mean, yeah, they were worried about it,

28:23

but "I think, like, just with my parents, they just really wanted

28:25

me to be happy and, you know, if, if that meant like getting on the

28:28

field and possibly getting hurt again, it was gonna make me

28:30

happy, like, to like be happy and do it. And you know, you might

28:34

have to learn the hard way, but, you know, do it make what's gonna

28:36

make you happy. But my mom was, my mom was a godsend. And even my

28:39

dad too. Um, my mom's a stay-at-home mom, just like my,

28:42

therapist, you know, did my laundry for me. Everything. Yeah.

28:45

"I mean she's my travel agent now, everything. And so having,

28:49

having my mom there for me and, you know, getting me, making sure

28:53

"I could get to the shower and stuff and all that and, and

28:56

making sure "I had food all the time, making sure. Get up from

28:59

the couch and go somewhere to use the bathroom, whatever it was. my

29:03

mom was, was there for me the whole time. She has no background

29:05

in, in nursing or helping people and she just gave it her all a

29:09

hundred percent. And seeing my mother give it her all and give

29:11

it a hundred percent and like literally be sweating, trying to

29:14

pick me up and get me out of there. She's a little woman.

29:16

really pushed me and motivated me to, keep going. Like, I said,

29:19

when you have an army behind you, it makes you want to go even

29:22

faster. So, uh, having her around me and really trying so hard and

29:25

to really get me back made me wanna do it even more. And, you

29:28

know, having my dad there as well to, continue pushing me like "I

29:31

said, and, and telling me like, you're gonna be good. You're

29:33

gonna do this. Um, if you wanna get back on the field, like

29:36

that's your goal. Hit it. Um, was perfect for the motivation and

29:39

then having my. it's like that, that infrastructure behind me to,

29:42

make sure "I got day to day and made sure "I was okay.

29:45

Luke: And now "I have to set the stage a little bit for our

29:47

listen. We are now approaching "I, don't know, maybe "I Wanna

29:52

say about eight months out from the start of Vinny's senior

29:55

season and we have morning workouts. Before school starts

30:00

bright and early, started before 6:00 AM we, we actually started

30:04

at 5:55 AM and Vinny was always there. It was unbelievable. He

30:09

was at all the workouts and he would tell me at the workouts,

30:13

coach, I'm gonna, I'm gonna be there. I'm gonna play my senior

30:16

season. And "I have to be honest, "I don't know if "I believed it.

30:21

Eight months. Of course, as the coach "I said, "I know you will,

30:25

but "I don't know if "I truly believed it. And as "I saw you

30:28

work, and as we kept getting closer and your mom would send me

30:31

PT videos, "I started to go, man, maybe this kid is gonna play his

30:35

senior season. "I. Remember being in the weight room and talking to

30:38

you about, Hey "I, think "I. Think you are gonna get out

30:41

there. And you're like, no, I'm gonna be out there. Like first

30:43

Snap game one. And now "I was really getting nervous to the

30:46

point where "I actually called your parents and said, "I

30:49

might've been to "I, email "I know "I talked to your parents. Are you guys okay with this? Do you really want me to support

30:55

this and push this? Because this is a really big dream and a

31:00

really big goal. And he, and he's going all in on it. And they were

31:04

a hundred percent, like you said, we support it. This is what he

31:07

wants. We're gonna move forward with it. And then some local

31:11

media started kind of hearing about the story and it kind of

31:14

turned. A little bit of a local legend, like, is Vinny gonna be

31:18

out there for the first game? And we're gonna fast forward now and

31:23

get to that first game for the sake of time. And you were suited

31:27

up and you're one of our team captains and we walk out. How did

31:32

you feel? What did, what did that moment feel like? It's probably

31:36

tough to put in the words, but here you are about the play. Not

31:41

only your senior season, but the very first. Vinnie: Yeah, just a absolutely crazy moment. And the fact to to

31:47

be named Team Cap "I didn't even like when you announced that "I

31:50

was just like in awe, "I was like, "I was really served as

31:53

like this inspiration to people. "I feel like "I, "I, "I wasn't

31:55

really trying to, but "I was like so happy in class. that "I was

31:58

able to like, get to that position, really inspire other

32:00

people to, you know, push through if, regardless if they were

32:03

starter or not, or if they were injured themselves, to kind of

32:06

push through it and um, was like super happy to step in the middle

32:09

of that field and take the coin toss for the team. You know, "I

32:11

felt "I worked so hard for, but you know, it wasn't all sunshine

32:14

rainbows. You know, "I, "I had like this macho mentality like,

32:18

I'm gonna get back and I'm gonna do. And then when a push came to

32:21

shove and "I was ready to get back and face, you know, a 250

32:24

pound left tackle with a knee brace, you know, there's a little

32:27

bit of self-doubt that comes to your mind. You start thinking

32:30

like, what if this happens again? And you know what, if this time

32:34

I'm not, I'm not as lucky and this leg is gone, or "I, don't

32:37

ever make it walk again. cuz that's the reality of what "I was

32:39

facing. If it would've happened again, I would've been done

32:41

walking. Probably my leg as well. And you know, you get that

32:45

self-doubt once you actually hit that goal and you kicked into the

32:48

deep end, you're like, you made it, now do it. So having that,

32:52

and then, you know, once you get that first plane and second play,

32:54

third, fourth, you're like, if you start getting like second

32:57

nature again, it starts feeling like the, you know, the lights

32:59

are back on. You just like your junior year again and you're

33:02

playing again. And then from there, "I kind of hit the ground

33:04

run and "I "I, uh, and continued.

33:07

Luke: Yeah, "I "I. Can't imagine what your. Of debt. Your whole

33:11

family was feeling at that first snap. "I know your coaches. We

33:17

were "I mean. It was pretty quiet on the headset for that first

33:20

snap cuz we just, no one knew what to expect and what was gonna

33:25

happen. And you're right. As you got into the flow of the game, it

33:29

started to feel. A little bit more normal. But with that said,

33:34

"I, appreciate your honesty of "I put on this macho front. But deep

33:38

down, "I had a lot of self-doubt because "I think that pertains to

33:41

a lot of things in life. We tend to look outside of ourselves and

33:45

we see other people and we, we tend to see them as so courageous

33:49

and tough and gritty, and we don't realize that in most cases,

33:53

they're. And they have the same self-doubt and the same dark

33:59

moments that we have. So how did you get past that moment of, of

34:05

that self-doubt when you're about to take that first series?

34:09

Vinnie: Yeah. "I. "I just kind of had to, you know, "I reflected

34:12

back a lot on what "I did. Um, so "I, "I thought back on, you know,

34:15

my nine months of recovery time and like the, the steps I'd

34:19

taken. "I had a lot of trust in, in, you know, my training and "I

34:23

in these nine months, like "I had become a student of the game.

34:26

Basically. "I knew everything about the anatomy of the knee,

34:29

different types of injuries to the knee, you know, what

34:32

different recovery processes look like, what could be the future

34:35

damages and what that means like, for the rest of my life in terms

34:38

like, what's a pop artery, what are these different ligaments and

34:41

all that. And just, trusting the science to know like, okay, "I

34:44

have some scar tissue now on these ligaments and it should

34:46

hold pretty well. It's like, nearly the equivalent of the

34:49

actual physical ligament itself. And, trusting the science behind

34:52

it that "I taught myself and, and really trusting the, the training

34:56

that "I had and reflecting back on some of those moments where "I

34:58

was, you know, sweating out pistol squats or all these R Dls

35:02

"I was doing and realizing "I spent months and months and

35:04

months on this one leg, like, I'm gonna be okay. And "I gotta, you

35:07

know, have some faith in myself cuz this was what my dream was

35:10

and you know, now I'm gonna make it happen. Now that "I have the

35:12

opportunity to do it. Luke: And looking back at it, what do you attribute to this

35:18

story? Was it. Dumb luck that your ligaments grew back the way

35:22

that they did. Was it a miracle of God? Was it just meant to be

35:26

"I mean? What do you take away from what was probably up to that

35:31

point, and maybe still is now one of the toughest moments in your

35:34

life? Vinnie: Yeah, "I. Think it. It was a bit of a miracle. Like "I

35:37

think "I think God played a role. and "I also think it was a, a lot

35:41

of what "I had done for myself as well. I took physical therapy in

35:45

incredibly seriously, Like "I said, "I learned everything

35:49

possible. about the, the knee, the leg, and you know, looked up

35:52

all these different things, even beyond my physical therapy of

35:55

what "I can do personally to, you know, better this injury and help

35:58

it. And, you know, that alone couldn't have done it. So "I

36:01

think there was something else out there. Maybe it was a miracle

36:03

by God, maybe it was something else. But, um, really sticking to

36:06

my training regimen and going above and beyond. even what they

36:09

were telling me to do. So I'd do my physical therapy at the place

36:12

and I'd go do it again at home and then do some other exercises

36:15

that "I could, that "I dreamed up or, or thought about given like

36:18

some of the research "I was doing on the injury and what "I thought

36:20

could work. So "I think it was like that, that perfect

36:23

culmination of, the right people around me training me, getting me

36:26

back, you know, myself, pushing a little bit beyond the, you know,

36:29

what "I was expected to do, and then a little bit of that

36:31

miracle, from whatever happened in these, these ligaments that

36:34

typically don't heal coming. Luke: majority of our listeners are coaches. And what would be

36:39

your advice to our listeners when they're going through a

36:43

situation? Hopefully nowhere near as severe as your injury, but. As

36:48

coaches, we deal with a lot of a c l injuries and people that are

36:52

out for a long time. What's the advice you would tell our

36:56

listeners what they need to do and how they need to support

36:59

their athletes going through these injuries?

37:02

Vinnie: Yeah. "I, "I. Think like, like you said, yourself, "I think

37:05

it's like making them still feel like they're a part of the team.

37:08

keeping them away from, you know, their, their future goal is

37:10

always to play. Like you said, a lot of these people, even myself,

37:13

have like their identity as football. And when you take that

37:16

identity away from them, that you take 'em into a dark place, they

37:19

don't really see what that goal is anymore. And it honestly

37:21

doesn't help with the training. so, you know, getting 'em out

37:24

there and just being behind them every single step of the way,

37:27

like, you feel so alone when you're hurt and you're injured

37:30

and like, you know, having other people around you really makes

37:32

you feel like everyone's got their eyes on me, they care about me. "I better make this happen. Um, "I think another thing is

37:37

like, you know, setting goals and checking in on, you know, Your

37:41

players if they're hitting these goals. Like for me it was am "I

37:43

gonna walk after three months and then it was am "I gonna run after

37:46

six and then it's gonna be like, can "I do a pistol squat and you

37:50

know, R DLS and all this stuff by nine and go play again. Um, so,

37:53

you know, having people around you that are checking in on you,

37:56

making sure you're hitting these goals and, um, being along you

37:59

every step of the way and building great relationships, "I

38:01

think is like one of the, the best things that helped me

38:03

through this. Uh, Luke: Yeah, that, that's great advice. "I really like the

38:08

check-in points. "I think it would be great for coaches to

38:12

understand what. The athlete's goal is, and help just like no

38:16

different for the, the ones that aren't injured. You wanna hold

38:19

them accountable to their goal, so, If you say, Hey, "I, wanna be

38:23

able to run in six months as a coach, be having these

38:26

checkpoints of, Hey, are you on pace to get there? And it could

38:29

be, and correct me if I'm wrong, if Fannie, it could be just a

38:31

text message, it could be something as simple as that, just

38:34

to make sure, are you staying on your goal? Right? So keeping

38:39

people on their path "I, think that's really, really good

38:41

advice. And uh, we'd be remiss not to talk about where you're at

38:45

right now in life. That's still with us listening, I'm sure wants

38:49

to know where Vinny Panco is in 2023. Here we are six years

38:53

later. So tell us where we're at right now, what's going on, with

38:57

your life as now you're an adult. Vinnie: yeah, yeah. So, like "I said, "I "I became a student of

39:02

the game during the injury in, uh, relating to science and

39:04

health. and "I know "I "I took that with me. "I "I got into

39:08

Berkeley, uh, my senior year, and, um, instantly went over here

39:11

chasing, you know, some of these Nobel laureates in science. And

39:14

two of 'em actually ended up being my professors, but, kind of

39:16

took that same, I'm gonna get it fast mental. "I graduated from,

39:20

uh, three years from Berkeley with a degree in molecular

39:22

biology, um, with an emphasis in neuroscience. "I, actually

39:25

fortunate enough to be named a salutatorian for 2022 in, uh, my

39:29

neuroscience class, and, um, went off from there and, you know,

39:32

stuck around in the, the private science space, so the industry

39:36

space. So started a bioinformatics company selling to

39:40

biotech companies with a few of my fraternity brothers from Cal.

39:44

"I ended up doing well, kind of taking some of my interpersonal skills and, you know, science skills into one role. "I started

39:48

the business development arm for them and, you know, did really

39:51

well. "I raised 32 million from CO2 and Luxe Capital to, pursue

39:55

that and pursue our, SAS software platform. Um, sort of a blessing

39:59

and a curse after that. And, kind of felt like, you know, maybe "I

40:02

could do something with my own research. Cause "I was actually a researcher at. and, uh, kind of followed from there and, and left

40:08

them to start my own company. Um, Nissan Bios, a medical device

40:12

company basically off a discovery. "I had made showing,

40:15

you know, ultrasounds, control over pain neurons. You know, "I

40:18

dealt so much with pain in my career as a football player. "I

40:20

thought about, chronic pain and new ways to do it, and "I found a

40:23

non-invasive way to do it using ultrasound. So, kind of going

40:27

through the gambit now of patent related issues and, and

40:30

intellectual property with the university, making it sort of

40:33

hard to pursue. But, um, "I applied to medical school

40:36

nonetheless. So "I still waiting to hear back from medical school.

40:38

"I recently applied. but hopefully going to maybe do both

40:41

at the same time and, you know, stick in that, in that medical

40:44

scene or private scene and, and continuing to kind of reflect on

40:48

these experience and, and push through these kind of things.

40:51

Luke: it's a heck of a journey. "I. Really appreciate you. Your

40:54

story because it's very inspiring and "I think it's one that anyone

40:59

who listens, again, a lot of the listeners are coaches and

41:02

teachers, but really any fan of the show who listens is gonna

41:06

walk away. Realizing how powerful belief in self really is, and "I

41:13

think that is something that is being lost a little bit. We tend

41:17

to become a little bit more pessimistic on people in today's

41:21

world. Maybe just because we see so much bad stuff on the 10

41:24

o'clock news. I'm not sure. But hey, that's, that's kind of what

41:28

what we're doing here with the podcast is reminding that, what

41:31

we do and how we treat other people. Really does matter and

41:34

you look at like the doctors and the PTs and how that motivated

41:38

you and impacted you to the point that, hey, "I will, "I am going

41:41

to go study science and I'm going to study medicine. So What came

41:46

out of a catastrophic situation ended up being a really great

41:50

story. And the, the Vinny Panco story still is many more chapters

41:54

ahead, but that's a big part of your story and why you are now

41:59

gonna eventually be Dr. Panco someday. Right. So thank you so

42:03

much for, for sharing that and, uh, taking us inside, really a, a

42:08

very personal experience. Because again, "I think a lot of people

42:12

can learn from your story, so thanks, Vinny.

42:15

Vinnie: Yeah. Thank you so much. No "I. Hope it was insightful and

42:18

I'm happy to answer any more questions that anyone has about

42:20

the whole thing. Um, feel free to contact me, but yeah, "I, hope it

42:23

was insightful and "I. Yeah, "I. Can't thank you enough for