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Welcome to the Integrative Palliative Podcast

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, where we help physicians and other clinicians

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master the art of integrative symptom management

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so they can wholeheartedly care for themselves

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as they expertly care for their patients

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. Welcome

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to the podcast . I'm Dr Delia Caramanti

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, so I have been noticing

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wonder recently

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. Wonder , and that's what I want to talk about today

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, because I think we can look for

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it , we can see

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it when it's there , but also we can create some

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in this complicated , challenging

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, hard , sometimes sad world . And

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so here's what I want to talk about , and at first I want

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to tell you a story . You guys know that I

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just published a book called Coping Courageously

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A Heart-Centered Guide for Navigating a Loved One's

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Illness Without Losing Yourself , and

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I was working with a book coach , and

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so every week now every two weeks

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when I was writing the book , I would read

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a chapter to the coach and get some feedback . And

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so one time I had an appointment

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, and it was hard to get an appointment with them . Unfortunately

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, it worked out that the appointment was at the same time

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that I was going to have to be traveling

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to the train station , so I was going to be in an

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Uber and we couldn't change the time

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. So I just asked well , can

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I just read it to you ? From the Uber . They said

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, sure , so that's what I did . So I read this

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chapter and it happened to be a chapter on

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sadness and

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depression . And how do you handle it when

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someone that you care about is facing either sadness

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or depression or both ? And so I read

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the chapter in the Uber and it was fine

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. I got some feedback and it was all good . But

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when I got out of the Uber to get my

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bag , the driver got

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out and said I

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just want to thank you so much . You

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don't understand how important it

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was for me that you were in my Uber today

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and thank you . So I

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don't know exactly what was going on , but

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I know that that person needed

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to hear a message about sadness

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or depression or both , and I was so

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struck by that . I don't know if you believe in

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divine whatever or coincidence , but there

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I was reading that chapter in that

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Uber with that person and what a

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wonderful , amazing experience

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that was . It was amazing . So

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I look for situations like that and maybe they're made up

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, but I don't care , because they

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make it feel to me like there are nuggets

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of magic in the world

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. I don't mean that literally , but just something

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deep that we don't totally

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understand , and I think it's good for our

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well-being to look for them , even

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if it's made up . Who cares ? Because

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I felt something important from that

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experience in the Uber , and so did

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the driver , and so it was

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kind of powerful . And then recently

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I was in a store . I had specifically

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driven to this store to get a gift for someone

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and it was kind of a wellness

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type store and I

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knew that they had interesting things and that's why

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I drove specifically to this place and

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I really enjoyed being in the store and I noticed

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when I was in there that I felt like my blood pressure

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went down and I felt peaceful and my breathing

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slowed . It just had a nice vibe . And

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so when I was checking out I don't usually

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make small talk with people when I'm checking

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out at a store , but I said to the person who was checking

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me out do you order the things in here

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because they're really lovely ? And she

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got right away , tears in her eyes , and

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said , oh my gosh , thank you so much

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for saying that , because , yes , this

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is my store and just

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today I was talking with someone

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and trying to decide should I close

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it . And I said , oh my goodness , I hope

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you don't close it , because I drove here specifically

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for your store . It's such a special

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place and it feels like

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a wellness experience to walk in here . And

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she said , oh my goodness , the one idea that

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I had and the reason I'm moving things around

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. She showed me she was moving things around . The reason

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I'm moving things around is because I

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thought maybe I could increase

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traffic here if I made a

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seating area where people could come

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and I'll have tea and maybe they'll come and

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gather and they'll buy things when they're here . And

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I said , oh my gosh , that's such a wonderful idea

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. I would come here . I live in the neighborhood , I

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would come here for that and that's just the vibe

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that I feel in your store . And she

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really welled up and

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felt like she was kind

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of asking for a sign should I close my

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store or not ? And then this random woman

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walks in and makes small talk and tells

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her what a meaningful store she has . So

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again you could say , oh well , whatever , that

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was just a conversation , but for me and

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I think for her , it felt like

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there was wonder in it that we

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happen to have this conversation just

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when she needed to have this conversation . So

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how is this relevant to palliative care ? It

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is because illness is

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scary . Yes , of course , death

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and grief are scary and

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sad , but the whole

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deal , the whole thing is

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pretty wild , right , like

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we're not here

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and then we're born , and then we're here

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and we're on this blue ball

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that's floating in space . So

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what's at the end of space ? What

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on earth is on the other side ? And if there's nothing on

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the side , on the other side , and it's infinite

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, what on earth does that mean ? There

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is so much mystery in

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what on earth is happening

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for us on this planet , what life

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is , and I think that's

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relevant when we're thinking about

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death , which is also wild

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. Of course it's sad , of course we

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miss people when they're gone , of course , but

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it's also a pretty wild

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experience that someone is here , in

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the fullness of your relationship with them

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, and then they're not here

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. It's a spiritual

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experience , not religious necessarily

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, but a spiritual concept that

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a being is not here and

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then they're here and then they're not here . That's

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just wild , and I think it's

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important for us , as

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people who deal with others who are

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facing serious illness , to

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see it in a bigger , deeper

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way , and not just ex-patient

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as ex-illness and their treatment

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is not working , so go to hospice , it's time

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they're going to die . It's just so

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much richer than that and I

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think engaging with

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it and wrestling with it ourselves

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and showing patients

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that we understand how big and

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deep this is , and maybe even

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helping them see that too , and

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not just their loss and their fear and

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their grief , I think it's important . And

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you might say , oh well , some people know

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, very religious people know what happens

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after they die . But my

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experience as a palliative care doctor is that even

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very religious people sometimes

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, as the end gets closer , they

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also wonder what's going to happen . So

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there are some people , certainly , who are certain

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up until the end . But even very religious

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people sometimes have a different perspective

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as the end of their life comes closer and

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they're also not sure and also just

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seeing it as a big

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mystery that no one exactly knows the answer

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to . So the whole thing is just basically

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a big mystery and I think that it's important

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that we get that and we embody that

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and we think about that and we

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feel touched by that that it's

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not just illness , death

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, grief on the surface . It's

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deeper and it's crazy

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and it's wild and we don't know the answer

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, and it's something to be touched

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by . There is wonder in

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the whole experience of our

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time here on earth , including

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the time for us to go . So I

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would like for all of us to not only look

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for wonder , but to

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create some . I felt

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some pull in that store to say something

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to this woman , even though it's not my normal way

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. If you feel a pull like that

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, do the thing . If

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you feel like somebody needs a connection

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, or that there's a certain thing that you

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should do or a certain place that you should be

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, I encourage you to listen

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to that . I think our intuition is something

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that we don't totally understand , but I feel like it

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might be real and it might be the

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thread to what I'm talking about here . So tap

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into your intuition if you get a sense of something

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. So I had an idea today . I'm about to take

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the train to New York for work and

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I had an idea that I'm going to bring

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one of my books and I'm going to leave it on the train

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. Now , I don't know what's going to happen

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. Maybe someone will just throw it away and no one will ever

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see it . That's perfectly fine , but

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maybe someone will

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sit down after me and

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maybe this is the very book that they need

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. Maybe I don't know , but at least

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I'm putting some opportunity into

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the world to possibly create

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some of this wonder . So I

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had the idea , I felt like that was some intuition

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, that it might be helpful , and if it doesn't turn

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out , that's fine . But I'm going to listen to it anyway

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and I encourage you guys

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to do the same . So look

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for the little nuggets of wonder

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in your experience and your life and

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then look for opportunities that you can create

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some . Thanks for being here . I

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so , so , so appreciate that

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you listened . I really would like to spread

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the reach of this podcast . So , if

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you're willing , I would be so grateful

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if you would tell a colleague or a friend

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about this podcast . Just send them

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the link , just tell them about it and tell them to go

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find it on their favorite podcast place . Send them

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an email , send them a text . It would really be

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a blessing for me . All right , thank

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you so much and I'll see you next week . Bye-bye

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.