0:07

Hey , leader , and welcome to another episode of the L3

0:09

Leadership Podcast , where we are obsessed with helping

0:11

you grow to your maximum potential and to maximize

0:14

the impact of your leadership . My name is

0:16

Doug Smith and I am your host , and today's episode

0:18

is brought to you by my Beratung advisors

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. We also recorded this episode live from

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the new reiturn . com studio . If

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you're new to the podcast , welcome . I'm so glad that you're

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over on our YouTube channel , so make sure you're subscribed

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or wherever you listen to podcasts through . That

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really does help us to grow our audience and reach

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more leaders , so thank you in advance for that . Well

0:50

, leader , in today's episode you'll hear my interview with four

0:53

time Super Bowl champion , Jon Kolb

0:55

. If you're unfamiliar with John , let me just tell you

0:57

a little bit about him . Jon Kolb was drafted

0:59

by the Pittsburgh Steelers out of Oklahoma State in 1969

1:02

. He played with the Steelers from 1969

1:05

to 1981 . Overall , Kolb

1:07

started at offensive tackle in 177

1:10

games and earned four Super Bowl rings during the 1974

1:13

, 75 , 78 and 79

1:15

seasons . During his playing days

1:18

, Kolb was widely regarded as one of the strongest

1:20

men in the NFL and played

1:22

one of the strongest , protecting Terry Bradshaw's

1:25

blindside from his left offensive

1:27

tackle position and opening holes for running backs

1:29

like Franco Harris , rocky Blyre and others . Like

1:32

many of the Steeler players of the 70s , john

1:34

had his own cadre of fans known as Kolb's

1:37

Cowboys . Kolb competed

1:39

in the second and third annual World Strongest

1:41

man competitions in 1978

1:44

and 79 , finishing in the top three both

1:46

times . After his playing career

1:48

ended , he became an assistant coach with the Steelers

1:50

, working in different capacities as the line coach

1:53

, tight ends coach , defensive line and

1:55

also a strength and conditioning coach . Kolb

1:57

currently resides in Hermitage , pennsylvania

1:59

, with his wife , Deborah , and he's currently running

2:02

a nonprofit called Adventures

2:04

in Training with a Purpose , which is an organization

2:06

focused on helping those most in need to improve

2:08

their quality of life through an adventure

2:11

of purposeful physical

2:13

training . And in our conversation

2:15

you'll hear John share some of his favorite

2:17

memories and stories from playing with the Steelers

2:20

, and he tells a story about almost killing

2:22

Terry Bradshaw . That is absolutely hilarious

2:24

, so you're going to love that . He'll share what

2:26

he learned from Chuck Noll , how faith played

2:28

a part in his journey , and so much more , and I

2:30

just think you're going to love this conversation . But

2:33

before we dive in , just a few announcements . This

2:35

episode of the L3 Leadership Podcast is sponsored

2:38

by Beratung Advisors . The financial

2:40

advisors at Beratung Advisors help educate

2:42

and empower clients to make informed financial

2:44

decisions . You can find out how Beratung

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Advisors can help you develop a customized financial

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plan for your financial future by visiting

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their website at beratungadvisorscom

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. That's B-E-R-A-T-U-N-G-Advisors . com

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. Securities and investment products

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and services offered through LPL Financial

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, member of FINRA and S-I-P-C Beratung

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Advisors . Lpl Financial and L3 Leadership

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are separate entities . I

3:08

also want to thank our sponsor , Henne Jewelers . They're a jeweler

3:10

earned by my friend and mentor , John Henne and

3:13

my wife Lara and I got our engagement and wedding rings

3:15

through Henne Jewelers and had an incredible experience

3:17

. And not only do they have great jewelry

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, but they also invest in people . In fact , for every

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couple that comes in engaged , they give them a book to

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help them prepare for marriage , and we just love that . So

3:26

if you're in need of a good jeweler , check out HenneJewelers . com

3:29

. And I also want to thank our new sponsor , reiturn . com

3:31

, and Leader . Let me just ask you this have

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you ever had an interest in investing in real estate ? Well

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, now , for as little as $500 , you can become

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R-E-I-T-U-R-Ncom . Investing involves risk

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. Just consult the Return offering circular if

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you're interested in investing . And with all that

3:52

being said , let's dive right in . Here's my conversation

3:54

with John Kolb . John

3:57

Kolb , it is quite an honor to be with you . I

3:59

didn't mention this before we started recording

4:02

, but the first time I met with you was several

4:04

years ago . I think you were speaking at a big-sea

4:06

breakfast and I didn't realize it , but

4:08

my dad told me that you were his favorite

4:10

player to watch for the Pittsburgh Steelers . He

4:13

used to have season tickets and he would literally spend the

4:15

whole game with his binoculars on you

4:17

watching you destroy people , and so

4:20

this is a great , great honor . And

4:22

I want to start so , for those who don't know , you're a four-time

4:24

Super Bowl champion for the

4:26

Pittsburgh Steelers and I just thought it would

4:29

be great to start off with Do you have a

4:31

favorite Super Bowl or maybe a favorite moment for your

4:33

career that you like to share .

4:35

Well , people

4:38

will ask that my college roommate

4:41

. We go back

4:43

in Oklahoma . They have a high school

4:45

all-state game . So

4:47

Terry and I met in the high school all-state game

4:50

. We became friends and

4:53

at that game then we went

4:56

to . We both signed to go to Oklahoma

4:58

State University . We were roommates . And

5:01

then he's drafted by the Vikings , I'm

5:03

drafted by the Steelers , and

5:06

so we played against each other in

5:09

the first Super Bowl and I

5:11

could take up all the time I

5:15

snapped punts . He was the short

5:18

man on their punt return . So

5:20

that's when we were on the field together . And

5:23

so Roger Worley

5:25

was the punt returner

5:27

and he's the short guy . So if the punt

5:30

short , terry would catch it , but

5:32

Bobby Walden , he was launching them . And

5:37

so I'm watching the

5:40

deep guy , the catches of all , roger Worley , and

5:43

Terry steps off . He just kind of goes

5:45

off out of my sight to

5:47

set up the wall . And here comes

5:49

Roger Ketches and starts this way Bang

5:52

. And my roommate

5:54

, the best man in my wedding , blindsights

5:57

me .

5:58

Oh man , you know , and I think , there's

6:02

a lot of things there .

6:03

One of them is that's the way football's played . You

6:07

know , I used to go on

6:09

. I went on USO tours

6:11

a couple of times with Joe Cleco and

6:14

the games were much more violent

6:17

after we became friends than

6:19

they were before . That

6:21

. That's the way

6:23

football's played . So I

6:25

think perhaps just that , no

6:29

matter what you do , I think there's always a relationship

6:31

factor in it .

6:32

That's cool . You were also

6:35

on the field for one of the most famous plays in NFL history

6:37

the maculate reception . Can

6:39

you just take us there ? What was it like to be on the

6:41

field and see that transpire if

6:43

you even got to see it , yeah .

6:45

So here's the thing that I think is

6:47

amazing To get into that game

6:50

, we had to beat San Diego

6:52

in San Diego the week before , and

6:55

so there was a lot of pressure

6:58

. I mean we have to win this game

7:00

or we don't get to call the macular reception

7:02

. So before the San

7:04

Diego game we're sitting

7:06

, we have a chapel service and

7:09

the chapel speaker and I can't think of his name right

7:11

now , but he started off and

7:13

he asked us do you pray before

7:16

the game ? And Ray Mansfield

7:18

was the oldest guy

7:20

on the team and he says yes , and

7:23

so then he says well , what do you pray for ? And

7:25

so Ray gives him that

7:28

Mary Poppins , you

7:30

know , answered . He says well , I

7:32

pray that nobody gets hurt

7:35

and the best team wins , and this

7:37

kind of stuff . You know , and he goes

7:39

oh really , it's the best team wins

7:41

. He says , don't you want

7:43

to win ? And Ray

7:45

goes , yeah , and he says , well , why

7:47

do you ? And this is what

7:50

the lesson was about . Why do

7:52

we pray and hold

7:54

what is really in our heart behind

7:56

our back as

7:58

if God can't see it ? And then

8:01

we all forgot in our prayers

8:03

garbage

8:05

stuff that is not in our

8:08

heart . Like we pray , the best team wins

8:10

or nobody gets hurt . I mean , I didn't want

8:12

somebody to get hurt and

8:15

so and so the thing was about being

8:17

praying from your heart . You know , the

8:19

body in Romans A says that we say

8:21

Abba , father , daddy , and

8:24

that was the lesson . Here

8:28

we meet San Diego . We're

8:30

ahead of Oakland

8:33

the entire game . Craig

8:35

Hanuman loses containment on

8:37

Kenny Staber . He runs up the

8:39

field and with less than a minute to

8:41

go , we're behind . We

8:43

run three incomplete passes and

8:45

now there's seven seconds on the clock

8:47

and Terry calls

8:50

the regular reception play . And

8:53

as we break the huddle , ray

8:55

Mansfield goes . Somebody

8:58

forgot to pray to win , and

9:03

I will never forget that . And

9:07

one of the things that's kind of for me

9:09

sad is Ray Mansfield's gone

9:11

. Sam Davis is gone

9:13

. All the guys that probably would have heard

9:16

that are

9:18

no longer living . But

9:20

I remember that . And then I kid Franco

9:22

. You know you get a statue at

9:25

the airport and I

9:27

set up the play because my guy jumps

9:30

inside . It makes Terry step

9:34

to his right just long enough to

9:36

get Franco down the field . That's what I tell everybody

9:39

. So without me sacrificing

9:41

Franco , you wouldn't have become the hero and

9:43

get a statue at the airport .

9:45

So do we need a statue of John Colb at the

9:48

airport ?

9:48

right next to that .

9:51

Hold off on that . So beautiful

9:53

you got to be a part of that and I just want to start

9:55

with a bunch of fun stories . Just , you know , as we highlight your career

9:57

, I've heard you tell the story many times but

9:59

it's probably one of the greatest stories I've ever told . Can

10:03

you tell the famous story about when you brought Terry Bradshaw

10:05

to I think it was your ranch or a ranch

10:07

. Can you just share that story ?

10:09

I just think listeners you know

10:11

, one of the things that I think that

10:14

was amazing about our team is

10:16

we had , if you're

10:18

a white guy at that time playing

10:21

for the Steelers , you're a minority . I

10:23

thought that was kind of cool . I mean , the

10:27

way the

10:29

team . Today we have to use words

10:31

like adversity and stuff like that . That's

10:34

the wrong word . The word is purpose

10:37

goal . Well

10:40

, you know , getting a group together to accomplish

10:42

something , and that's what

10:44

it was like . But nevertheless

10:47

there were guys on the team that

10:49

had different , like

10:52

Fringey , fuqua and LC Greenwood

10:55

. We called him bags , hollywood

10:57

bags , but those guys

10:59

they were dressers . I mean , they

11:01

always they'd come to practice , all dress

11:03

stuff . And then there were the . There

11:05

were guys like Andy Russell and

11:08

his group and they

11:10

were the investors and they

11:12

and so before practice , the investors

11:14

would be in a group . We had a group of

11:16

hunters and Terry

11:19

wanted to get in that group that

11:21

was the man's group , you know and he

11:23

never knew how to fit , and

11:25

so we were roommates and that

11:27

night he

11:30

was asking me questions that

11:32

during Mullins and a couple of the other guys

11:34

Jack Lambert was a hunter still

11:36

is we're talking about and

11:39

so we were going back and forth and he said well , I never

11:41

shot a deer and I'm going , my

11:44

gosh , in Pennsylvania you never shot a deer and

11:46

you go so . So anyway , I told

11:48

him , come out , come out to the farm

11:51

and I'll tie

11:53

one up . That's what I said . I'll tie him one up

11:55

so that you can . You

11:57

can for sure shoot it . So anyway

11:59

, he was late getting out there . I'd already fed

12:02

the cattle . I was actually going to get

12:04

ready and go in to work out , and

12:07

here he comes , and so

12:09

then he's in the barn and he's looking

12:11

at it . One of the horses and I'm explaining

12:14

this is a horse that I wrote with . So

12:17

he said , wrote

12:19

something . And

12:22

I went , okay

12:24

, I settled the horse , I

12:27

told him to go across the pasture , take

12:30

off running . I'm

12:32

alignment , okay , and he takes

12:34

off running . But he started it , he

12:36

goes . You know he's looking over the shoulder

12:39

and he goes . You can't catch me . I'm

12:41

on a horse with four legs . He got two legs

12:43

, and so in

12:46

about half a second I'm right up on

12:48

top of him . You know , I roped him

12:50

, popped the slack , and he's standing there

12:53

, roped , and

12:55

so now I got to get the rope off of him

12:57

, but he keeps walking up to the

12:59

horse and she keeps backing up . So

13:02

I kept saying , terry , stay there , stay there

13:04

. And he , he

13:06

didn't understand that . So my

13:08

second mistake at the opening was

13:10

I got off the horse and

13:12

I go to take the rope off and then

13:14

he goes . Oh my gosh , what happens if she

13:16

spooks ? Well

13:19

, that's spooker . And out the pasture

13:21

she goes . And if you've

13:23

ever been to the three rivers , rivers

13:26

, we got a . You see that spray behind

13:28

the boat . Yeah , she was pulling him

13:30

so fast . The dew on the grass

13:32

was all

13:34

this spray was popping up

13:36

and he's going as

13:41

it go out the pasture and anyway . So

13:43

there's a barbed wire fence and I

13:45

thought , oh my gosh , she's going to run through the fence

13:48

. And and she didn't , and

13:50

she came back around on the second move

13:52

. I tried to grab the horse and I missed

13:54

. So I and I grabbed the ropes . So now she's

13:56

pulling both of us and the

13:58

thing that saved us was he had put the wrong

14:00

reins on . He put split

14:02

reins on and one of them was dragging . I was able to grab

14:05

the reins and a little loose of the

14:07

rope and and that spun her around

14:09

. She just starts eating . And

14:11

I look over there and he's like not moving

14:13

.

14:14

Oh man , and I thought oh my gosh , she's

14:16

, he's dead .

14:19

And I don't remember who we played , but

14:21

he , he threw three touchdown passes

14:23

and that that that

14:26

three days later . And

14:29

the neatest part about it just happened a couple of years ago

14:31

and I it was

14:33

the last time I was with Chuck , no , and he died just a couple of months after

14:35

that , and

14:40

I was talking about being alignment and

14:42

how we , you know , we don't call

14:44

plays , we don't ? You know

14:46

, we're not supposed to be the smart guys or something . And

14:49

then Chuck goes , you

14:51

mean like roping , your course , you're quarterback

14:54

and getting in the past , and

14:57

I went , I went . This

14:59

is 50 years later . I went , you

15:02

knew about that . Oh man , you

15:04

know , chuck , it was just this , you

15:08

know , just this little greasy

15:10

smile , you know , and

15:12

just it was , just it was , it was a neat

15:14

thing , it was neat .

15:17

So two follow-ups on that One . Where was

15:19

that in Steeler history ? Like , had

15:21

you killed him , would

15:24

Steeler's Nation would have missed out on you know three

15:26

Super Bowls ? When was that ?

15:28

Oh , that was yeah . We

15:30

had not won a Super Bowl yet .

15:32

Oh my God , all right . So

15:35

, wow , you would have ruined it all for .

15:37

Steeler's . Nation Beautiful , you know the

15:39

funny is , while while

15:42

she was dragging him and I'm trying

15:44

to catch him , I thought this

15:46

is not going to work and I'm actually

15:48

thinking the humanness of us

15:51

. I'm thinking what are they going

15:53

to do to me ? Will this be murder

15:55

one ? Could I plead insanity

15:58

?

16:01

Oh , I'm glad it all worked out . You

16:03

mentioned Chuck Noll , obviously a legendary

16:06

coach . You got to play for him . I believe your whole

16:08

career . Everyone

16:10

I've talked to that's gotten to play for him or coach

16:13

just talked about how much they've learned from him and I'm just

16:15

curious what was the impact that Chuck made on

16:17

you ? You know what was your big takeaway from

16:19

sitting under his leadership for so long .

16:21

One of the things is , could

16:23

you use the word leadership ? And

16:26

I think of leaders . Chuck

16:29

definitely was a leader . Chuck's

16:31

leadership style is different than

16:33

anybody's leadership style that I've ever been

16:35

around . So I think when somebody

16:38

wants to , you know they're in a position of leadership

16:41

. You've got to look at a lot of

16:43

different people and bring

16:45

in the concepts and

16:47

the qualities that

16:49

God created in you . You know you can't

16:51

be a Chuck . No , there

16:54

was only one , chuck , and

16:56

my son , caleb , is

16:58

a great leader . Tony

17:01

Dungey is another one that's

17:03

a great leader . All

17:05

three of those coaches

17:07

. Caleb coaches wrestling

17:09

at Pine Richland . If you watch

17:11

him coach and you watch

17:13

him after the match , you

17:15

wouldn't know if his kid won

17:18

or lost the match because

17:20

he's going to coach with so much

17:22

love . And Chuck

17:24

wasn't a huggy , feely

17:27

person , you know . So there's

17:29

, you know you , god has given

17:31

us different qualities , but Chuck

17:34

, you

17:38

know he was a technician

17:40

, which is that

17:43

? I think that's the number one thing that I

17:45

learned from him is

17:47

he , he's a technician

17:50

. He's a technician

17:52

in football . I got to play for

17:54

him for 13 years and then I got

17:56

to coach for him or with

17:58

him for 10 more years . So

18:00

when I left this , when I left the Pittsburgh

18:03

Steelers I had

18:05

spent 23 years with Chuck

18:07

. No , over half my life , Wow , I

18:10

spent over half my life with

18:12

which up , no , and the runes

18:15

and this and the Steelers , and you

18:19

know , and Chuck would say things you

18:21

come up the line here , you know , line of scrimmage

18:23

, say you got together information

18:25

. You know he had these quotes

18:27

. He would say you

18:30

got to do whatever it takes , you

18:32

know . And if we lost

18:34

the game he would say , alright

18:37

, today we're gonna go back to basics . I

18:40

mean those are just . I mean there's a bunch

18:42

of them , but those are things the

18:44

Chuck would say . And he was a big guy

18:46

on basics and I

18:49

think that gathering information Sticks

18:52

with me before I take off trying

18:55

to do something . How much information

18:57

on that can I gather ? Now , if I'm playing football

18:59

, it could even be looking

19:02

at the tip tilt of my opponent

19:04

to read is that mean he's

19:06

thing ? You know , if I , because a guy , if

19:08

he's gonna come inside , he's gonna drop his hips

19:10

just a little bit , and

19:13

then you can read that and that's , that's

19:15

an example . So you gather an information

19:17

. You want to do whatever it takes . So

19:23

those are , yeah

19:25

, chuck is them .

19:27

Outside of Chuck , and I don't even know that he was the most

19:29

influential . But who ? Who impacted

19:31

you most is your , your time as a player

19:33

? I'm just curious was it another coach

19:35

, was it a player , and how did they impact

19:37

you ?

19:40

From a coaching standpoint . Lolley

19:42

Dodge Was

19:44

our offensive line coach and

19:46

Dan Radikovic . Both

19:48

of them were technique guys

19:50

. They were so

19:52

technique oriented . I Remember

19:56

Jerry Mullins . You have to be around Jerry

19:58

Mullins . He's a kind of guy

20:01

that can . You

20:04

know , no matter we would , we had tough practices

20:06

and so you got it . You need a guy

20:08

that complains all the time so that

20:11

you know you're not as bad off as they are . Jerry

20:13

Mullins is getting inducted into the Hall of

20:15

Honor but we would think , you

20:18

know , did we lose that game the

20:20

way they ? You know , the

20:22

way they would be ? The

20:26

coaches would be honest , like that . But

20:29

Donnie

20:32

Shell Was a defensive

20:34

back Strong safety is

20:36

a free agent came with the you know Lambert's

20:38

install worse , and swans came

20:41

that year as a free agent . Donnie

20:44

Shell would knock on my door at seven

20:46

o'clock in the morning and

20:48

I'm trying , I'm trying to get every last

20:51

minute of sleep that I can because

20:53

I gotta go out and have two days and and

20:56

I would get up and open the door and he'd say , oh great

20:58

, you're up . I'm having Bible study

21:00

down in my room , so come

21:03

on down and and

21:06

I wasn't up , but I would

21:08

go down and Donnie would Start

21:11

, he give his Bible and he would go . I

21:13

was just reading this last night and

21:15

here's what popped out at me . He

21:18

just was talking about one having authority

21:20

. So I was looking up what's that word

21:22

authority me ? And then he would go on

21:24

and and so

21:26

Donnie was a guy

21:28

that Was

21:32

Lived his faith 24

21:35

it still is . He called me . I

21:37

mean , he'll text me . Hey , john

21:39

, I just praying for you today . You know just

21:41

something like that . And then also

21:44

, hollis half was our team

21:46

chaplain and we had Bible studies

21:49

on Wednesday

21:51

nights that a bunch of guys

21:53

came to and then we did . He

21:56

would organize high school

21:58

football camps at Geneva College where

22:01

we would Minister

22:04

to high school kids , and

22:06

I think that was so Pivotable

22:09

, pivot , pivot . I

22:11

won't try to say that word to you , though .

22:13

I got you there you go .

22:14

That was . That was a really a Changing

22:18

thing , because Christians we

22:21

tend to want to be served and Sometimes

22:24

we don't get the idea that , okay

22:26

, you've been to training camp

22:28

, now go out and serve . Bud

22:31

Wilkinson was the head coach at Oklahoma . At

22:33

Oklahoma , when I was a kid , they'd

22:35

run 47 games in a row . He asked

22:37

they . He was asked what's his definition of

22:39

football and he said football

22:42

is 40 young men Running

22:44

around on a football field desperately in

22:46

need of rest , been watched

22:48

by 40,000 people up in the stands

22:50

, desperately in need of exercise

22:52

, and there's Christians who

22:54

got to get out of the stands and get down on the field

22:56

. Wow , and . And Donnie

22:59

was one of those guys

23:01

and Hollis half started

23:04

doing that . He did . He did the Sunday

23:07

services for us , he did the midweek

23:09

Bible studies and then he started

23:11

doing camps where we would go

23:13

and and and and teach

23:16

not just football techniques but

23:18

have little Bible studies and stuff

23:20

at Geneva College for high school kids . And

23:23

45 year old men will come up to me now

23:25

and say , hey , I was in your , we

23:28

came to your camp when I was in .

23:31

Yeah , can you ? It's interesting . We have a mutual friend

23:33

turn joking . Played for the Steelers

23:35

dealer broadcast . Unfortunately just lost him a few years

23:38

ago , a huge supporter of light

23:40

of life , and I just remember him talking about you

23:42

and and basically your whole era of players

23:44

I think were , you know , the captain's of the team etc

23:47

. When he came into the league and he just talked about

23:49

the impact that you all made and His

23:51

life . I'm just curious Can you talk about

23:53

how to make a difference ? You know you talked

23:55

about getting into the game . How can we , as

23:57

people of faith , get into the game and

23:59

actually make a difference in the lives of others ? A passive

24:02

and just being an Example . Is it really

24:04

intentional ? And going on being aggressive ? You

24:06

know , I'm just curious your view on that .

24:08

Yeah , I , that's a great question

24:10

and it's something that I think about

24:12

a lot and I wished that

24:14

we , as Christians

24:18

, would change the

24:20

, the way we present

24:23

Christ . Jesus

24:26

died on the cross for us , amen . I

24:28

get it . Okay , I am

24:30

saved through faith

24:32

, not as a result

24:34

of works , and no man should boast . I

24:36

get it . But Paul , I

24:39

Hear that all the time from

24:41

Christians . But Paul also writes

24:43

you show me your works

24:46

Without your faith

24:48

, or you show me your faith without

24:51

your works and I'll show you my faith by

24:53

my works . So I

24:56

Don't think , as

24:58

Christians , we , we

25:01

, we we've been given a gift

25:03

, the

25:05

worst thing in the world . Okay , anybody

25:08

watching this Romans 12 says

25:10

you've been given a gift . I think it's first Corinthians

25:12

, chapter 12 . It says we've been

25:14

given a gift . James , the book of

25:16

James , talks about God has given

25:18

you a gift . The word

25:20

I , we don't want to die and not

25:22

know what our gift is and

25:25

not have an employed it

25:27

and some of the places that it talks

25:29

about serving , talks about teaching

25:31

, talks about leadership .

25:33

I am curious that you have any regrets looking

25:35

back at your careers . A stealer , you

25:38

know .

25:39

No , I have lots

25:42

of regrets , the

25:44

things that I you

25:46

know from outside of sports , from

25:48

being a coward and you know , saying

25:51

you should go up and talk to this

25:53

person . And then I didn't do it . John

25:56

guest , one time I'm

25:59

at the airport and and we're

26:01

we're , we're flying out to play

26:03

a football game , and and

26:06

I meet John guest . He's coming , he's

26:09

coming off the plane , and so

26:11

he says hi , say hi . And we stand

26:13

there and we're talking , and

26:15

this little boy comes up and he

26:18

says Mr Cope , could I

26:20

have your autograph ? And so

26:22

he gives me this paper and

26:24

I'm thinking , okay , typically

26:26

I write my name and

26:29

then I put Jeremiah 12.5 on

26:32

there . Your people can look it up , okay

26:34

. And I thought , well , if I do that

26:36

, john Guest is going

26:38

to , he's going to

26:40

think I just did that to impress him

26:43

. I just put

26:45

my name and my number and handed it back to

26:47

the little boy and he said thank

26:49

you , thank you . And the little boy runs off . Then

26:52

John Guest goes with that English

26:54

accent John

26:57

, I can't do that . You

26:59

just missed an opportunity

27:02

to make an impact

27:04

on this boy for

27:06

eternity . And

27:09

I'm looking for a hole in

27:12

the airport to crawl into

27:14

. And

27:18

so

27:21

those are the things that

27:23

God does , things for a reason . I don't

27:25

know if God's a Steeler

27:28

fan . I don't think he's a Cleveland fan

27:30

but

27:32

, he does have a plan

27:35

for our life and there's a reason

27:37

for things . And

27:41

so we've got to look

27:43

and say what is that reason , why

27:45

is this ? And then take advantage

27:47

of it . And I'm not

27:49

glad that happened . It's a regret

27:52

, but I

27:54

can tell you , if you're

27:57

out somewhere and somebody asked me for an autograph

27:59

, I'm

28:01

going to put my Bible verse on there . That's so good .

28:04

No , I think that's such a powerful story . We

28:06

all get this prompting sometimes and the fear comes up . So

28:09

thank you for sharing that . A few

28:11

more fun questions . What

28:13

do you think the biggest difference is about today's

28:15

NFL versus NFL you played in in the 70s and 80s .

28:19

Well , somebody said the other day to me and

28:21

it's kind of funny . He

28:24

says aren't you amazed at how much

28:27

stronger and faster the players

28:29

are today ? And I went what

28:31

, what , what

28:34

? I ran

28:36

a 4-6-5-40 . Larry Brown

28:38

ran a 4-6 . Jerry Mullins ran a 4-7

28:40

. Sam

28:43

Davis ran a 4-7 . There's not

28:45

a guy , a lineman in the Steelers or

28:47

maybe perhaps in the NFL

28:50

, that can run under

28:52

a 5-flat today . They're big and fat

28:54

. They're big and

28:56

fat . They can't bend their legs , they

28:58

can't change directions . Stronger

29:01

my best squat was

29:04

715

29:09

pounds , over twice my body weight . There's

29:12

not a guy . I

29:15

don't know for sure but I'll bitch it . Call

29:17

me up whoever watches this and tell me

29:19

if I'm wrong . Somebody that can squat

29:22

twice their body weight . Larry Brown

29:24

, close grip bench press

29:26

495 . 495

29:29

pounds , like that Thumbs

29:32

touching . Okay

29:35

, I'll buy anybody dinner if they can

29:37

show me a guy

29:39

that can do 495

29:42

or 500 today . The

29:45

today's players aren't stronger

29:47

and faster . I mean , I'm talking lineman .

29:50

I love it , so I

29:53

guess I would be curious then . Do you think you'd be playing

29:55

? Would you have been a tackle in today's NFL , or

29:57

would you be a different role ? Do you think ? I don't

30:00

know .

30:01

I probably wouldn't have got a look because

30:03

I was only 6'3"

30:06

, my heaviest weight was 258

30:08

to play , so I may not have gotten

30:10

a look . We

30:12

trapped , we ran

30:15

trapping plays and pulling

30:17

plays . Today

30:19

they run zone blocking schemes

30:21

. It's a whole different scheme

30:24

and

30:26

the way they do it you've got to kind

30:28

of be a big person to , because

30:31

they actually take a step back , which

30:34

is so

30:37

un-football Offensive

30:41

lineman . That's why we're called offensive

30:43

. We want to be offensive

30:46

, but they'll take

30:48

a step back on their zone blocking

30:50

schemes . So it's

30:52

just a different technique and

30:54

it

30:58

doesn't fit my head .

31:01

One thing I'm curious you won four Super Bowls , had

31:03

a legendary career and

31:06

, again , I've only known you recently , but

31:08

you just seem like you have a humility about you that's

31:10

so sincere and authentic

31:13

. And a lot of people may see you

31:15

as the legendary four-time

31:17

Super Bowl winner , etc . But you had pretty

31:19

humble beginnings . How do you stay humble

31:21

and what did that have to do with your humble

31:23

beginnings ?

31:24

Yeah , I read a book I'm

31:27

trying to take who was the author ? And

31:29

they said nobody could ever write a book about how

31:32

they became humble . I

31:34

always thought that was cool , but

31:39

I do

31:41

think you have to remember who you are and

31:43

where you came from , and so

31:46

many of our guys . Larry

31:50

Brown went

31:55

to school in Kansas , grew up in Florida

31:57

and was

32:00

not allowed to play on

32:02

a football team because

32:05

he was black until

32:08

his senior year . Then he got to another

32:10

school , john

32:12

Stallworth and a couple

32:14

other guys told me when the

32:17

quarterback club would feed their team

32:19

that before the game

32:21

that the white guys went in the front

32:23

door of the restaurant , the black guys had

32:26

to come in the back door of the restaurant . So

32:29

most of the guys that

32:32

played on those stealer teams they

32:35

kind

32:38

of dug themselves up , I think

32:40

, and they remember who they were . I

32:43

was allowed to go in the front door of the restaurant

32:45

but I sat

32:47

on the left side of the bus and everybody

32:49

else sat on the right side of the bus going to

32:51

school . And the reason is because

32:53

I fed pigs in the morning . I would

32:56

call it slopping hogs in

33:00

the morning . That's why I love the

33:02

parable of the prodigal son , because

33:05

what does he end up doing ? He ends up slopping

33:07

hogs . So

33:11

pigs do not live

33:14

on dry ground , pigs live

33:16

in mud . It can be 110 degrees

33:18

in August in Oklahoma . Somehow

33:21

they live in mud , and mud

33:23

has property called suction . And

33:25

when you feed your pigs you carry

33:27

these buckets across

33:30

the pig pen and they got pig

33:32

slopped in them and it kind

33:35

of pours out and

33:38

so the pigs will come in and they go away 300

33:40

pounds and they'll ram their head in that

33:43

bucket and as you're trying

33:45

to hold that up and you take a step , suction

33:47

will pull the boot in the mud and then your foot

33:49

comes out and your sock comes

33:52

down in that mud . And

33:55

then , if I'm late , I don't have time

33:58

to change

34:00

clothes , take a shower I just

34:02

got to go get on the bus and so

34:04

pig mud . I

34:06

could give you a description

34:08

you can wipe cow poop

34:10

off , you can wipe horse poop off , you can't

34:12

wipe pig poops . And dogs , pigs

34:16

is the epitome of it . That's

34:19

what I remember and that's what

34:21

I want to remember . That's where

34:23

I came from , just like the

34:25

prodigal son , and

34:28

so just like a lot of the guys

34:30

on our team . We came

34:32

from places and God

34:34

has brought us to

34:37

where we are . Not anything I did . I

34:42

got a football scholarship to Oklahoma State University

34:44

. My best friend got a

34:46

scholarship to Vietnam . They

34:49

had a big dinner for me , 800

34:52

people in Oklahoma for

34:54

their hall . Oklahoma has the state of Oklahoma

34:57

has a hall of fame . They flew

34:59

me down there . My buddy

35:01

called me up and says can I pick you

35:03

up at the airport ? Yeah , so

35:05

he's picking me up at the airport and

35:07

he's carrying my luggage . As we walked

35:09

to his car , his license

35:11

plate says Bron Star , bron

35:15

Star . And

35:18

I got to banquet . Why ? Because

35:20

it played in a Super Bowl . And

35:23

I said , gary , bron Star , like when

35:25

somebody says to me well , you got

35:27

a Super Bowl ring , I said

35:29

, oh , bron Star , what ? And he just

35:31

went like this and

35:34

I said what happened ? And

35:37

he didn't say anything for 10 minutes . When

35:39

we got there , poor , he goes . There

35:42

was an ambush and a lot of guys

35:44

didn't come home .

35:46

Can you just tell people what you're doing today through

35:48

ATP , what it is and what you're doing

35:50

, because it's remarkable .

35:55

Yeah , atp is called

35:57

Adventures in Training with the Purpose . I

36:00

picked those words on purpose . Adventure means

36:02

I don't know how it's going to turn out . Training

36:07

I hope there's some physical therapists

36:09

here watching this because they'll go

36:11

. Are you a therapist and

36:13

I go ? No , and I didn't go to Pittsburgh

36:16

Steel or Therapy Camp either . We

36:18

went to training camp and I didn't go to basic

36:21

therapy . At Fort Campbell , kentucky , I

36:23

went to basic training and it feels

36:25

okay . So therapists

36:27

do , somebody has a surgery or whatever

36:30

. They go to a therapist

36:32

. That's limited typically

36:35

by insurance , because

36:37

that , in fact , that's why we kind of started

36:40

this , because

36:43

we would do . I was working

36:45

in an orthopedic office and we would do a surgery

36:47

. Yeah , if anybody needs their hip

36:49

done or their knee done I've seen enough hip

36:52

and knee replacements . I'm pretty good . Carpal

36:54

tunnel you don't want me to do that one , you've

36:56

got to have these special glasses . But

37:01

we would do a hip replacement and

37:03

12 weeks later insurance

37:05

would say you're done and I would

37:07

run upstairs and I would say to the doctor

37:09

this lady can't get off a toilet seat

37:11

, she can't go downstairs

37:14

, how come she's done ? Well , insurance

37:16

isn't paying . So

37:19

when therapy is done , people , many

37:21

times older people . What

37:23

about people with Parkinson's ? What

37:25

about people with MS ? What about people

37:27

with strokes ? What about amputees

37:29

? Amputees aren't going to grow a new leg

37:31

and all

37:34

of our amputees we've got I have

37:36

five right now None of their legs

37:38

. The leg keeps shrinking and

37:41

so they've got to go back and get new prosthetics

37:44

. Those are 5,000 apoc , I

37:47

mean I'm sorry , I'm not trying to be honest so

37:50

box , but so

37:52

ATP is adventure . I

37:55

don't know how it's going to turn out . We're doing training

37:57

and we want to have a purpose , just

38:01

like . I think it took

38:03

me a while to figure this out . 20

38:05

veterans plus every day take their own life

38:07

. If you read Tony Dunge's book

38:09

, tony Dunge played

38:12

with the Steelers , won a Super Bowl coaching

38:14

he talks about in his book

38:16

. The suicide rate for former NFL

38:18

players is 10 times

38:20

the national average . What's the common

38:22

denominator ? Well

38:25

, it took me a while because I'm a lineman , but

38:27

after a couple of days I figured it out , because

38:30

both groups are in

38:32

a mission . They have

38:34

a mission , they have a purpose , they

38:36

have a team around them . Somebody's got

38:38

their sixth . That's army talk , for

38:41

I got your back and

38:43

then , all of a sudden , you're done . You

38:48

know , I do not know a single football player

38:50

that said I'm tired of this , I don't think I want

38:52

to do this anymore . No , we

38:54

get to the point where we can run as fast

38:56

. Something's broke our fingers , you

38:58

know , our fingers go different directions . Our

39:00

noses are flat . That's the good stuff

39:03

. And then we're done . And

39:05

then you're trying to figure out now what do I do ? What

39:08

is there out there that

39:10

is as challenging and

39:12

purposeful as

39:15

going to a stadium

39:17

and 70,000 crazy

39:20

Stealer

39:22

fans waving terrible towels

39:24

, yelling Well

39:26

, serving

39:28

people is .

39:30

Come on , and

39:33

so is that . I was going to ask you about that

39:35

when you transitioned . You know a lot of people would say for

39:37

Super Bowl is . It's not going to get any better than that . And I'm

39:39

assuming I don't know how old you were and you were tired Early

39:41

30s . Maybe Was

39:43

that a hard thing for you to find another

39:45

purpose , or did that take a while ?

39:49

It was really hard , Really really

39:51

hard . One

39:56

night I

39:58

got these cramps so bad that

40:03

I thought I can ask

40:05

my wife to save me . Doctor , I thought

40:07

it was going to die . So she takes me

40:09

to divine Providence , that's

40:12

. You know . It was right after I got done or

40:14

finished playing . And God

40:17

is so amazing . So

40:20

the next morning they stick these

40:22

tubes down my mouth

40:24

and up the other end , and

40:28

so the technician

40:30

that was running the tubes up and

40:32

down , he

40:34

comes in and he's like , okay , John

40:36

, I'm not supposed to be in here . The

40:38

doctor's supposed to tell you , but you got

40:40

an ulcer , and the kind of ulcer you got

40:43

is from being

40:45

anxious and worried . So

40:48

the doctor's gonna give you these pills called

40:50

Tagamet and they'll clear the ulcer

40:53

. But

40:55

he said I read , you're a Christian , so

40:59

I'm suggesting that if

41:01

you're a Christian , why don't ? Whatever's bothering

41:03

you , why don't you give it to the Lord ? Wow

41:06

. And so he leaves and

41:09

as he's walking out , the doctor

41:11

comes in looking doctorly . He's

41:15

got these doctors , Dr Beard , and he

41:18

goes John , you know , and we're gonna

41:20

give you these Tagamet's and now clear it

41:22

up . And so I kept that

41:24

bottle of Tagamet's probably five

41:27

or six years and

41:29

I finally thought I don't need that in

41:32

my drawer anymore and I threw them away . But

41:34

God brought that guy his name was Dell

41:37

into my life

41:39

. I said whatever's bothering you

41:41

, and so sometimes

41:44

I think God brings people into

41:46

our life like that and we don't listen . If

41:48

we take the time , you know he really

41:51

has an angel usually , or

41:53

something in scripture for us to

41:56

connect with .

41:57

Yeah , I know we're a few minutes over time . Do you have

41:59

two more minutes for maybe some fun questions ? Yeah

42:02

, I'm here , all

42:04

right . So yeah , I usually do lightning round

42:07

. I'll just throw a few at you . One

42:09

we didn't get to talk a ton about this , but you

42:11

have . I think that's kept . Is that Mount Kilimanjaro

42:13

behind you ?

42:14

Yes , so that's painted by

42:16

an 86 year old vet

42:18

who was paralyzed for 50 years

42:20

and now he walks .

42:22

Wow , come on , that's a beautiful

42:24

painting . One thing you all do

42:27

is take people on adventures , which I fully

42:29

plan to partake in at some point . But you

42:31

got to Mount Kilimanjaro . You've been to the

42:33

Grand Canyon . I heard you on another podcast

42:35

saying you've whitewater rafted upside

42:37

down over waterfalls . You

42:40

know I always encourage people to have a bucket list . What

42:42

are one or two of the top adventures

42:44

you've ever had that you would say , hey , if

42:46

you don't do anything else before you die , do

42:48

these things .

42:51

You know , adventure . I

42:53

picked that word because adventure means I don't

42:55

know how it's gonna turn out Me

42:57

. That's the definition of adventure , so

42:59

got it on there . Okay

43:02

, adventure means I don't know how it's gonna turn out

43:04

, and

43:06

so you don't know how it's gonna turn out . One

43:08

of the first ones ? Well

43:11

, no , I think all the way back

43:13

from being a kid , but I remember

43:15

hiking across Newfoundland with

43:17

my son when he graduated , and

43:19

so it was the last day and

43:21

there was a mountain , and

43:23

that's so . They

43:26

had their GPS's

43:28

and I didn't know . I mean , I'm old

43:31

fashioned , this is when they were really new

43:33

. I still , I was carrying a map , and

43:35

so we were in , we were eating breakfast , and

43:38

I said I think I'd like to go around the south

43:40

side of this mountain , and it's the

43:42

last day . And they said , well , no , let's go around the

43:44

north side . And so I said

43:46

, well , you know what ? Let's

43:48

take a chance . You guys go around the north

43:50

side , I'll go around the south side

43:52

, I know we'll . You know , every

43:55

day you've plotted your course , I've

43:57

plotted mine . We come out in the same spot

43:59

. So they agreed

44:01

they go around the north side . I'm going

44:03

around the south side . I'm walking through

44:05

some willow trees . I'm

44:08

20 miles from

44:10

the nearest person . I walked

44:12

up face to face to a moose

44:14

.

44:15

Oh man .

44:16

Moose are 10 feet tall

44:18

and

44:22

he . We're just staring at each other

44:24

and I'm you know , my

44:27

poker hand right here . I don't have any aces

44:29

, and

44:31

I'm in these willow trees . At the bottom of

44:33

the willow trees are this bee . They

44:35

may be 10 foot tall , but if I climb

44:38

up there and

44:42

so I start walking

44:44

backwards , just have

44:46

not taken my eyes off that moose , and

44:53

he didn't . He didn't , he chose not

44:55

to run over me and later , 30

44:57

minutes later , I was going . Phew , that was

44:59

close , and I'm walking

45:01

along the hillside now and up on the hillside

45:04

, 50 yards up above me , was

45:06

a black bear . And

45:08

so now I

45:13

don't want to scare anybody , because I love

45:15

your people to come do adventures with us when

45:18

we go to Fillum and Jor-O , I promise there will be

45:20

no moose or black bears . But

45:22

that was , that was just

45:25

one of the adventures

45:27

in one of the first ones .

45:30

So I mean , with a 750 pound squat , you

45:32

were still afraid of a moose . You don't

45:35

think you could take it out ? Last

45:37

question , I guess just to end , and then I'll leave it open and end

45:39

for you . But would it just be ? You

45:41

know you're towards the end of your life . You know , looking back

45:43

one day , what do you want to be remembered for and what do you

45:45

want your legacy to be ?

45:49

You know , wow , I hadn't started thinking

45:51

about that until

45:53

you mentioned

45:56

it . 10 days

45:58

before Tunch died he

46:01

was still able . He couldn't walk very

46:03

well , but he could run in

46:05

our underwater tread-milk tank , because

46:08

if Tunch weighed 180 pounds

46:11

when he died but

46:13

in that tank he weighed 18 pounds , would

46:16

enable him to actually run

46:19

. And

46:22

I remember going at

46:24

his funeral I was one of the

46:26

pallbearers and

46:29

so we carried Tunch's

46:32

casket over the

46:34

grave hole , over

46:36

the hole , and I'm claustrophobic

46:39

, I don't get on elevators

46:41

with three people Too tight

46:43

. I'll get off and take

46:45

the stairs and

46:47

I'm going don't look down that hole , don't

46:50

look down that hole . And

46:54

as I put the casket down

46:56

I looked down in the hole and

46:59

then they had the funeral

47:01

and everybody left

47:03

and I kind of hung around the wall thinking

47:06

they're putting that casket

47:08

in that hole . And for the

47:10

next three days I

47:13

thought about Tunch being in that hole

47:15

with that dirt on him , and

47:18

I knew that the Bible

47:20

says to be absent from the bodies , to be present

47:22

with the Lord , but

47:25

nevertheless , and so his

47:28

spirit and soul went to be with God

47:30

. I get that , but

47:32

the body was still in there . And

47:35

then I read in Ezekiel and

47:38

it talks about when Christ returns

47:40

, and

47:44

it talks about this valley and

47:46

I was there when I got to go do

47:48

football camps for Israeli soldiers

47:50

fellowship of Christian athletes , football

47:52

so I'd mentioned that and

47:54

I was there at that valley and

47:58

God asked Ezekiel , there's

48:00

all these bones . And

48:02

he asked Ezekiel , ezekiel

48:05

, can I put flesh on these bones ? And

48:08

Ezekiel says you're God , you can do whatever you want

48:10

to do . And so he puts

48:13

flesh on the bones , but it's still dead and

48:16

only God can breathe

48:18

life into a body . Somebody

48:22

can die and every ingredient

48:24

that they need for life is

48:26

there , but we

48:28

can't create life . Only God can

48:30

do that . And so all

48:32

these bodies now

48:34

have bones

48:37

, have bodies on them , and

48:39

Ezekiel says can I

48:42

? God asks Ezekiel

48:44

, can I breathe life into these

48:46

bodies ? And

48:49

Ezekiel says you're God , you can do whatever you want to . And

48:51

they all come to life . And

48:57

I was cured . I

49:00

still don't like to get on elevators . So

49:07

I thought about I'm 76

49:09

, you're right , I'm still healthy enough

49:11

to fall off my mountain bike . I flipped over the handlebars

49:14

twice last week , so

49:16

I'm healthy enough . But

49:19

those are things that and

49:23

I talked to Hollis half we talked the other day

49:25

because Craig Wolfley's brother died and I

49:27

was at his funeral and

49:29

I told Hollis I want my funeral to be

49:31

like that . I want

49:33

him to talk about how God puts flesh

49:37

on bones

49:40

, no matter how long those

49:42

bones are laid there , and then he breathes

49:44

life into it and then he's coming

49:47

to bring that back up . So

49:52

that's what

49:54

we do when we get out of the stands . We

49:56

come down on the field and

49:58

we live that way . And

50:02

I saw a

50:05

guy I

50:07

don't know as a podcast or something had

50:09

a rope and the rope was white

50:11

, but the end of the rope was red

50:13

and he goes this

50:16

is your life , right here , that

50:19

tip of that rope , this is your life

50:21

. And then he starts pulling

50:23

and he's pulling this rope

50:25

and I don't know how long

50:27

the rope was . It had to be a couple hundred

50:29

feet , but he's pulling the rope and

50:32

he never got to the other end of the rope and

50:35

that left an impression on me . So

50:37

you and I and everybody listen , here

50:39

we're just on this little red tip and

50:43

that rope is going to run out , and how

50:45

we live now can

50:48

make a difference for light

50:51

of life people , for veterans , for

50:54

those people with Parkinson's and also

50:56

those people that are healthy , and

50:59

that's our mission . That is so much they

51:02

don't make . If you

51:04

see a guy wearing a Pittsburgh steel or

51:06

a Superbowl ring , probably

51:09

now that's not 100%

51:11

, but probably he didn't play in the

51:13

game . He was on the sideline , because

51:17

you don't need as big as those things

51:19

are . You don't need a Superbowl ring

51:22

to

51:24

remind you you were there . You

51:26

were there with your buddies , and

51:32

so what it's about is

51:35

the

51:39

little red part right now of that

51:41

rope . Now , how

51:43

can we get out of the stands ? What's our gift

51:46

? How's God gifting us ? And

51:49

what he gives , he will supply .

51:52

Well , john , I've loved our hour together . Thank you

51:54

so much for the conversation . Thank you for following

51:57

God's plan for your life . Thank you for being faithful

51:59

with it . Thank you for discovering your gift and laying

52:01

it all out on the battlefield for Christ , and I just

52:03

love that . And you've got a lot left in you

52:05

. You're still a beast at 76

52:08

years old . I still wouldn't want to mess with you , and

52:10

I can't wait to see how it uses you in the years to come

52:12

. Thank you .

52:13

Doug , thank you .

52:15

Well , hey , leader , thank you so much for listening to my conversation

52:17

with John . I hope that you enjoyed it as much as I did

52:19

. You can find ways to connect with him in links

52:21

to everything that we discussed in the show notes at

52:23

l3leadershiporg 4 slash 395

52:26

. And , as always , leader , I want to challenge

52:28

you that if you want to 10X your growth this next year , then you

52:30

need to either launch or join an L3 leadership mastermind

52:32

group . Mastermind groups are simply groups

52:35

of six or 12 leaders that meet together for at least

52:37

one year on a consistent basis to help

52:39

each other grow , hold each other accountable and to do

52:41

life together . For me personally , mastermind

52:43

groups have been the greatest source of growth in my life over

52:45

the last eight years , which is why I believe

52:48

every leader needs to be in a mastermind group . So

52:50

if you're interested in learning more about launching or joining

52:52

a group , go to l3leadershiporg 4

52:54

slash masterminds or email me at dougsmithl3leadershiporg

52:58

. And , as always , I like to end

53:00

every episode with a quote , and I'll quote coach

53:02

Ants and Durant , who I interviewed last episode

53:04

, who said this this is this

53:06

is candid . He said there is no

53:09

better coach than the bench Boom

53:11

. Oh , leader

53:13

, know that my wife Lauren , I love you , we believe in you

53:15

and I say it every episode . But don't quit , keep

53:18

leading . The world desperately needs your

53:20

leadership . We'll talk to you next episode .