0:00

Welcome to The

0:00

Month End CPG community chat,

0:03

The Month End will provide

0:03

emerging CPG brands real life

0:06

knowledge into the accounting,

0:06

finance and operational worlds.

0:09

Our guests will be key

0:09

stakeholders from those same

0:11

brands as well as other key

0:11

contributors to the industry.

0:17

Welcome to Episode 26 of The

0:17

Month End podcast. Today's guest

0:20

is Jeff Wiguna from Kuju Coffee.

0:20

How you doing Jeff?

0:23

Hi Brad, thanks for having me.

0:25

Yeah, excited to

0:25

chat about Kuju and your journey

0:28

the last several years within

0:28

the brand. So before we get

0:32

started, just give a little background on yourself where you're at, you know, what, why

0:34

did you get into CPG? And why

0:36

did you launch Kuju?

0:38

Yeah, I'll start

0:38

I've got a I've got two

0:42

daughters. I'll say that first

0:42

before the company that's always

0:46

the kind of a top-of-mind thing.

0:46

And I started the company with

0:50

my brother before the first one

0:50

was born. And it was a

0:55

Kickstarter, I think back in

0:55

2015. So the brand story is Kuju

1:00

was founded by two Eagle Scout

1:00

brothers who got tired of

1:03

instant coffee while camping and

1:03

the Kickstarter in 2015...mind

1:08

you at that time, outdoor was

1:08

not a thing, and I remember a

1:11

lot of people thought this was

1:11

the most specific niche kind of

1:15

idea you could ever come up

1:15

with. And at the time, REI was

1:19

only carrying Starbucks Via. So

1:19

we did it. And, you know, we

1:25

were just inspired by the idea

1:25

of bridging a passion for the

1:29

outdoors with the quality

1:29

experiences of a great cup of

1:33

coffee that was really

1:33

compelling to us. And you fast

1:36

forward. You know, a couple of

1:36

years we debuted at Outdoor

1:39

Retailer, which is the outdoor

1:39

industries Expo West August of

1:43

2016. And shortly after that,

1:43

literally the day after that, we

1:48

got a vendor packet to the

1:48

National Sportsman's Warehouse,

1:52

which is a great hunting retail

1:52

chain with about at the time 75

1:57

doors. And a couple of months

1:57

later, we had a meeting with REI

2:00

and we went into REI stores, I

2:00

think May of next year in the

2:04

following year. And from there,

2:04

I guess you could say it all

2:09

worked out from a distribution

2:09

standpoint, today, we're in

2:11

roughly 2,000 doors national and

2:11

Whole Foods and Sprouts and REI,

2:15

Academy Sports and all those

2:15

places. But it's been quite the

2:19

journey, as I'm sure a lot of

2:19

your listeners can imagine. But

2:22

But it all started with a

2:22

passion for being outside with a

2:25

really good cup of coffee and

2:25

kind of the transformative

2:28

impact that can have on your

2:28

psyche, even if it's just for

2:30

five minutes.

2:32

Again, I'm a

2:32

coffee lover, I got three kids,

2:35

if I can get up 10 minutes

2:35

before them and enjoy a cup of

2:38

Joe before. Before all hell

2:38

breaks loose. Better, so good.

2:44

Um, let's great background, I'm

2:44

looking forward to chatting. So

2:47

in terms of I guess , how long

2:47

have you guys been in business?

2:51

This is probably

2:51

our sixth year, depending on how

2:53

you cut it. Six full year of

2:53

operation. Yeah.

2:56

So then, I guess

2:56

from a six year standpoint, you

2:58

know, number one congrats on

2:58

that, like, you know, three

3:01

years, four years, five years,

3:01

six years? That's all kind of

3:03

good things to kind of

3:03

celebrate. But how many

3:06

different phases of the

3:06

business? Like have you had?

3:08

That's an awesome

3:08

question, actually. I would say,

3:11

I mean, the last two and a half years was COVID. So that was like 2020 was a phase 21 is a

3:14

phase now 2022 is a phase. I

3:24

think prior to that, I'd probably say two or three phases. I think there was a

3:26

Kickstarter to launch and first

3:30

retailers, then there was

3:30

figuring out to make sure we

3:33

don't run out of inventory, just

3:33

make stuff. And then I think the

3:37

third phase was probably "okay,

3:37

we can make a lot of stuff,

3:39

let's start just continuing to

3:39

sell like hell and market and,

3:45

and that's probably phase

3:45

three." And then phase four has

3:49

been from 2020 on but that

3:49

simultaneously been grappling

3:54

with scale. We went national in

3:54

Sprouts in February 2020. We

3:59

went national in Whole Foods at

3:59

the end of 2021. So there's been

4:05

a lot of organizational

4:05

learning, leadership learning on

4:09

my in the last two, three years

4:09

to set us up for the next five,

4:12

six years, really. So I'd say

4:12

maybe four or five stages.

4:15

Awesome. I think

4:15

that's a, that makes a lot of

4:17

sense. And it's always

4:17

interesting to kind of reflect

4:20

and look back on your business

4:20

like in terms of, I guess the

4:24

segmentation of different

4:24

periods. Yeah, going to kind of

4:28

first number one Kickstarter,

4:28

like, like, how did that go?

4:32

What did you learn? Like how do

4:32

you take money in and then how

4:34

do you earmark money for

4:34

inventory and selling?

4:38

Yeah, you know, I

4:38

we did the Kickstarter at a time

4:43

when Kickstarters were very

4:43

popular, and a lot of

4:47

Kickstarters were not fulfilling

4:47

on time. And so I was personally

4:50

very sensitive about making sure

4:50

we could get it done on time.

4:54

And I think that's kind of an

4:54

integrity value that just

4:58

pervades into the way we do

4:58

business now. Um, but they're

5:01

most of the work was in the

5:01

planning, like, what were the,

5:04

what were the items? How much is

5:04

that going to cost? How much do

5:08

we need, so we didn't raise a

5:08

ton, we only raised $16,000. We

5:13

use it to fund the trip to a

5:13

trade show to check it out, buy

5:16

some preliminary equipment. But

5:16

the real reason we did it was

5:20

just to test our chops, quite

5:20

honestly, just to see if we

5:23

could even get it done. We

5:23

didn't have any product, we had

5:27

a prototype. But it was mostly a

5:27

marketing and planning and

5:32

supply chain exercise. So we

5:32

fulfilled it on time, we had a

5:36

little bit of extra money to use

5:36

for other things. And it felt

5:41

like a big challenge at the

5:41

time, I was so tired after it

5:44

that I said, "Hey, I don't know

5:44

if I want to keep doing this

5:47

after a Kickstarter." But, but

5:47

we kept on going. And in

5:52

retrospect, the Kickstarter

5:52

looks like a nice little project

5:55

now compared to the problems we

5:55

deal with today. So this is kind

5:59

of what that was, like.

6:00

Awesome. So then

6:00

the next kind of step of

6:03

national distribution, kind of

6:03

at a young phase, your business,

6:06

how did that go?

6:07

Well, the way it

6:07

went on a production standpoint

6:14

was generally fine, because I

6:14

think production is a little

6:19

more predictable than maybe

6:19

sales forecasting, or buyer

6:23

behavior predicting. So to put

6:23

it really bluntly, we just

6:29

worked our ass off to make sure

6:29

to fulfill the National

6:32

Sportsman's Warehouse order,

6:32

we're still manufacturing in our

6:34

living room. And for REI, we

6:34

were not manufacturing in our

6:40

living room, but an actual kind

6:40

of office space, but still

6:43

packing by hand. And we just put

6:43

a lot of time into it, had part

6:48

time workers doing it, and we

6:48

shipped it out. I think it

6:51

wasn't until we got a real good

6:51

production line operations set

6:56

up that the national stuff on

6:56

Sprouts and Whole Foods started

7:01

kicking in and getting involved

7:01

with distributors and

7:03

chargebacks and all that stuff

7:03

when when you're that management

7:07

has to be I don't know if it has

7:07

to be tight-knit because I think

7:10

it's pretty hard to keep it so

7:10

tight-knit, given what it's like

7:14

to work with these people. But I

7:14

think we have to be very good

7:18

with understanding. We had to be really good with

7:24

understanding the risk

7:28

mitigation and risk profiles of

7:28

distribution production across

7:32

the board. And that's something

7:32

that we're kind of constantly in

7:35

now, especially with the COVID

7:35

things on pricing, inflation and

7:38

supply chain so forth.

7:40

Yeah, well, let's get into that. Like how have you, how was your suppliers I

7:41

guess number one, how has your

7:44

product mix changed from like

7:44

selling to the customer since

7:48

inception. And then number two,

7:48

what else has changed within

7:52

that specific last couple years

7:52

of COVID, supply chain, freight

7:56

costs, etc. So number ones, I

7:56

would like the product next

7:58

year, the same product mix, you have a different product mix?,

8:00

We've been

8:00

extremely focused. One of the

8:03

things I was told when we first

8:03

launched our first Expo West,

8:06

which was March 2017, was just

8:06

to be known for one thing. And

8:10

for that, I've always kept this

8:10

in kind of the back of my head

8:13

just to be known as Camp coffee

8:13

or outdoor coffee. And I think

8:17

that's translated into a product

8:17

mix that is almost basically the

8:22

same as day one, today. We've we

8:22

started with kind of our core

8:28

set of three roasts, we launched

8:28

our single origin line, which is

8:31

the three additional roasts the

8:31

year after. And we have not

8:35

really played around with it

8:35

since. We've had different

8:38

packs, like gift packs, and we

8:38

went national in World Market

8:41

and Paper Source. But we've

8:41

divested from that since. And at

8:46

the grocery level. We're just

8:46

focusing on three core SKUs,

8:52

which is have been the core

8:52

things from the very beginning.

8:54

So not a lot of changes there. Yeah.

8:56

Good. Good. And

8:56

then I guess from moving on to

8:59

the next question of in terms of

8:59

what has changed last couple

9:02

years since COVID, related to

9:02

costs, or supply chain or just

9:05

managing the business; buying

9:05

inventory sooner versus later,

9:08

kind of operationally, supply

9:08

chain aspect. Like what, what's

9:12

changed, what's stayed the same?

9:14

Yeah. I think,

9:14

well, one, we were not expecting

9:18

to go national in Whole Foods.

9:18

When we did that review, I

9:22

actually had only pitched for

9:22

maximum half of the regions and

9:28

at the time, we were only in one

9:28

region in NorCal. And it wasn't

9:30

even the whole region. It was

9:30

like 26 stores in NorCal out of

9:33

like 40, 50. So I was sitting

9:33

outside and I got this email

9:38

from Whole Foods and I counted

9:38

the DCs and the doors and and

9:42

the list. It goes horizontally.

9:42

And I was like, "holy cow this

9:47

like wait, there's another

9:47

column, and another column", and

9:49

having been experienced enough

9:49

at the time. This was probably a

9:52

fourth fifth year. I wasn't

9:52

ecstatic nor was I scared I was

9:56

very level and realized this was

9:56

going to be kind of a big thing.

10:02

On a supply chain basis, I think

10:02

we have a very strong supply

10:06

chain and good relationships

10:06

there. So it's definitely

10:08

challenging, but not as much a

10:08

source of risk. But, you know,

10:17

the launch of Whole Foods, Whole

10:17

Foods themselves were awesome.

10:20

But I think there were

10:20

definitely some kind of touched

10:23

on it before some challenges

10:23

with UNFI, on the amount of

10:29

orders. And in particular, in

10:29

this case, we had not gotten

10:34

paid for multiple months,

10:34

actually from UNFI. Even though

10:37

we had done a national Whole

10:37

Foods launch. And upon pursuit

10:40

of this investigation, we found

10:40

out that our POs were actually

10:43

deleted from their system. I

10:43

hope so I hope it was an

10:51

accident. So the you know, I

10:51

kind of paused because I, you,

10:57

you see a lot of stuff when

10:57

you're building a company from

11:00

scratch, especially pioneering a

11:00

category, but I never thought

11:04

during one of the most critical

11:04

launches, the POs would get

11:08

deleted. So if we didn't pursue

11:08

it, we likely would have never

11:10

gotten paid. So this was months

11:10

and months over time of just

11:15

working on this, investigating

11:15

with our shipping partners,

11:19

where things are, escalating

11:19

where we needed to. And I don't

11:24

know. I'm happy to go into it,

11:24

but it's just so such an effect

11:28

so many components of the

11:28

business that it was a good rite

11:33

of passage, I think to

11:33

understand, you learn different

11:36

kinds of things when something

11:36

like that happens. So

11:39

So let's get into that, you know, this is a podcast targeted towards the CPG

11:41

brand owner. Some of them may

11:46

not know, like even the

11:46

logistics of UNFI, or

11:50

distribution or whatever. So I

11:50

guess step one, can you just

11:53

explain the structure and then

11:53

on UNFI Ke, and how that works

11:59

from the front standpoint in the

11:59

process? And then we can kind of

12:03

go through the phases of what

12:03

happened and how you reacted at

12:05

that the end? What did you

12:05

learn? So go ahead.

12:07

Yeah, well, at a

12:07

basic level for anyone who might

12:10

be more new to CPG, when you

12:10

sell in particular to Whole

12:12

So the number one just specific

12:12

to this, like, is there anything

12:13

Foods, or Sprouts, they have a

12:13

distributor. So UNFI is the key

12:17

distributor that Whole Foods

12:17

works with. And Ke is the key

12:21

distributor, Sprouts works with.

12:21

And there are a lot of these DC

12:25

is 10 to 15. And I don't know if

12:25

it reaches 20 around the

12:28

country, but you're essentially

12:28

selling to the distributor. And

12:32

then obviously, at this point,

12:32

the distributor is selling to

12:36

the the chain to Whole Foods. So

12:36

we have a great relationship

12:40

with both chains. But it's

12:40

incredibly critical to maintain

12:44

your distribution forecasting

12:44

and cash flow monitoring with

12:47

the distributors, because that's

12:47

that that's what's paying your

12:51

bills. I mean, the chain is

12:51

giving you the chance, but your

12:55

cash flow comes from the

12:55

distributors. So to say that

12:58

UNFI is the one that by mistake

12:58

deleted, our POs is actually

13:02

basically saying we had spent a

13:02

lot of money on production. And

13:06

over six to nine months, we were

13:06

not getting anything back. And

13:10

you say the least that was very

13:10

challenging, but it affects it

13:14

affects your priorities as a

13:14

company because usually you want

13:18

to be focused on the marketing

13:18

at that point. But if you're

13:22

dealing with cash flow

13:22

challenges of that magnitude,

13:25

you have to have ridiculously

13:25

keen understanding of the levers

13:29

of your business. So you know

13:29

where to move things at certain

13:33

times and so luckily, we got

13:33

through it. But it was it was

13:36

very difficult. You should

13:36

probably ask me a specific

13:40

question. Because my usually I

13:40

can articulate very clearly, but

13:44

this was such a unique

13:44

situation. There are a lot of

13:47

different components to this. that you could have done or

13:55

somebody else a different, you

13:59

know, CPG brand could have done

13:59

to minimize that risk of the PO

14:05

getting deleted before you ship

14:05

the product? Or before you

14:07

produce the product? Yeah, I think it's, it's the

14:08

basic "watch your A/R time lines

14:15

very meticulously". And the day

14:15

that somebody is maybe one day

14:19

late, don't be afraid to just

14:19

say, "hey, we wanted to see if

14:23

this is coming in, I think UNFI

14:23

is not necessarily the best at

14:27

responding. So second to that

14:27

kind of matrixing urgency or

14:33

importance of the A/R that

14:33

you're following. And if you're

14:36

not getting a response,

14:36

understand if it's like a $400

14:38

order, it's okay. But if it's a

14:38

$400,000 order, it's probably

14:42

not okay, so I think we presume

14:42

that payments would come in,

14:47

because they have in the past

14:47

when we were working with other

14:49

DCs so we just assumed it would

14:49

just take some time. That was

14:54

probably not the best assumption. I think if we were more proactive about

14:56

communication, we might have

14:58

been able to get ahead of it.

15:00

Gotcha, good. And

15:00

for the listeners out there,

15:02

what do you mean by A/R is

15:02

accounts receivable. So you

15:05

enter an invoice on your end, a

15:05

PO on their end is they're

15:10

purchasing product from you, you

15:10

invoice them, which is revenue

15:13

and accounts receivable, and

15:13

then basically maintaining and

15:16

reviewing your accounts

15:16

receivable and open invoices,

15:20

just from an accounting

15:20

standpoint. I urge all just

15:24

businesses, small business

15:24

owners, make sure you invoice on

15:27

time and make sure you review

15:27

your A/R at least weekly. And

15:29

then feel free to follow up with

15:29

people when you're past due. And

15:32

sometimes you're like, well,

15:32

they're gonna pay me I feel bad

15:34

for following up. No. It's a

15:34

contract. They owe you based

15:39

upon terms, it doesn't always

15:39

happen that way. But there's

15:42

nothing wrong with you bugging

15:42

them, whether you do it, your

15:44

bookkeeper does it or whatever. So.

15:46

Ya, what, what we

15:46

do now is, we did go over A/R

15:50

weekly. But what we do now is go

15:50

very specifically into A/R in

15:55

particular larger POs just to

15:55

know, because you might run into

15:59

something where the distribution

15:59

center, even if it's not UNFI,

16:02

somebody else might just have labor problems. So they're processing inventory, slower

16:04

effects, accounting, you just

16:08

want to know all that stuff. And

16:08

so it's essentially for an early

16:12

CPG brand, I think it's it all

16:12

rolls up into just cash flow

16:16

management competencies, which I

16:16

should say is very different

16:19

from managing your P&L. And

16:19

that's an important distinction,

16:23

I think, you know, on the P&L

16:23

basis, things can look that

16:26

fabulous. And you won't feel

16:26

that way on the cash flow if you

16:29

don't pay attention,

16:32

That was actually my second question on this topic, like how did you manage

16:34

cash like throughout that

16:37

process? And then how did you

16:37

figure out just to fumble and

16:40

get through that-those several

16:40

months, you know, periods of not

16:44

getting paid while having

16:44

already paid for your inventory

16:46

and running the normal operations of your business?

16:48

Yeah, that's a

16:48

great question. So one thing I

16:51

think that's really unique about

16:51

us is we are, even though we

16:55

sell coffee, and it's a

16:55

consumable, we're actually at

16:59

heart, an outdoor company, and

16:59

we have a lot of outdoor

17:03

industry distribution. And the

17:03

really good thing about that

17:07

channel is it doesn't have a lot

17:07

of the complexities that the

17:10

grocery side has, across the

17:10

board: margin, distributors,

17:15

overhead. So we have a

17:15

diversified set of business

17:21

where that was helping us quite

17:21

a bit, move forward. The second

17:27

component of that is just

17:27

watching cash on a weekly basis.

17:31

And just asking the question,

17:31

well, what do we need to make it

17:36

through the next couple of

17:36

weeks. And, and, I mean, this is

17:40

maybe not super helpful, but

17:40

figuring it out. So what I mean

17:43

by figuring it out, are we

17:43

didn't have a line of credit,

17:46

with a bank vendor or finance

17:46

vendor, whatever you call it.

17:51

And we did some small additional

17:51

raises on a convertible note

17:55

that we had out with friends and

17:55

family, which helped as well.

17:59

And on top of that, I think you

17:59

just want to be really

18:03

resourceful with where you're

18:03

putting the money. And sometimes

18:06

you have to stop spending money

18:06

where it's not returning at the

18:08

time. But if you stop spending

18:08

money, you need to know the

18:12

levers of your business well

18:12

enough that you understand the

18:14

impact clearly. So I think,

18:14

yeah, just understanding your

18:18

business alone is, is very

18:18

powerful. I think that's

18:21

probably an understated thing.

18:21

Understand what makes it tick,

18:25

you know?

18:25

Yeah, no, I

18:25

think, yeah, I think figuring it

18:27

I agree. Yeah, absolutely. Yep.

18:27

Good.

18:27

out is a great term. It's very

18:27

vague, but it's a when you

18:30

understand your business,

18:30

understand the mechanics of p&l,

18:33

cash flow revenue, what do I

18:33

need to spend this month to keep

18:37

my business operable with, I was

18:37

taking a step back and

18:40

understanding all the solutions

18:40

out there. And really, once you

18:43

understand all that, that really

18:43

helps out in terms of these

18:47

these downturns because that's

18:47

when you can be like, look at

18:50

him like, Okay, I need $22,000

18:50

In next two weeks, versus like,

18:53

"I need money". And so people

18:53

come and say, "Well, how much do

18:57

you need?" You're like, "I don't

18:57

know". No, it's like, if you're

19:00

very precise, and you know

19:00

what's going on, then that's

19:03

kind of - it's an easier problem

19:03

to solve for. And I think that's

19:07

kind of what you're getting to

19:07

with what you're saying.

19:14

So last thing, looking back, is

19:14

there anything that you change

19:18

or anything, you know, within

19:18

that process of you wish you did

19:22

or you didn't do?

19:25

Do you mean just

19:25

kind of broadly speaking over

19:27

the course of just having grown the business or just

19:29

know just

19:29

specifically that example of the

19:32

UNFI situation like after, once

19:32

you hit like, once you got paid

19:36

for those delayed POs, would you

19:36

when you look back, you're like,

19:39

Gosh, I wish you would have done

19:39

that month one, or you just you

19:41

think you handled as best as you

19:41

can and you got through it?

19:45

No, I think we

19:45

handled it in general quite,

19:49

quite well. We handled it, and

19:49

we moved forward. I think it's

19:53

such it was a big thing. But

19:53

it's not as big as your

19:57

overarching momentum and

19:57

strategy for the organization as

19:59

a whole. And I would say it's

19:59

not as big as just understanding

20:04

the nature of the equity you

20:04

want to build with your

20:06

stakeholders and vendors,

20:06

overall. I think our ability to

20:10

get through it was and continues

20:10

to be a testament, I think, to

20:14

the strength of the

20:14

relationships that we've built

20:17

within our company's ecosystem.

20:17

And so maybe the one thing I

20:20

would say to anyone listening is

20:20

product has to be good,

20:23

operations has to be good, but

20:23

but all your power and equity,

20:27

and ultimately, long term growth

20:27

and profits from a company

20:33

usually happens long term. So

20:33

you need to ask this question of

20:37

"Are you building relationships

20:37

that are investing into long

20:39

term equity? and, narratives not

20:39

transactional?", and I have

20:44

found, we were only able to

20:44

handle that, because the equity

20:49

that we have with the

20:49

relationships in the company, on

20:52

both sides; with our buyers and

20:52

our supply chain, are uniquely

20:56

very strong, I don't think we

20:56

could have handled it, if that

21:00

was not the case.

21:03

Relationships the

21:03

the key to life. So now kind of

21:07

moving forward, just kind of

21:07

getting a more financial kind of

21:10

standpoint, like what KPIs from

21:10

a financial standpoint, do you

21:14

look at now, to run your

21:14

business or to see the health of

21:17

your business as well as how

21:17

does that differ from what you

21:20

used to look at it? Or does it

21:20

differ? So I guess let's start

21:23

out number one, like what are you looking at on a month-over-month basis from a

21:25

more pure financial standpoint?

21:27

That's a great

21:27

question. I think on a on a

21:30

finance basis, I'm constantly

21:30

paying attention these days to

21:34

cost trends, logistics, and

21:34

fulfillment being a key one, and

21:38

also understanding our pricing

21:38

strategy. Because obviously, I

21:42

think the biggest impact you can

21:42

make on your bottom line tends

21:46

to be within your COGS or cost

21:46

of sales. Actually, I think your

21:51

marketing and everything can get

21:51

managed. But if you want you

21:55

know, if you can save one to 2%

21:55

on your COGS, that translates

21:59

pretty heavily I think if you're

21:59

doing volume, so we we I think

22:03

about that trajectory. The other

22:03

thing I look at is actually the

22:07

question of how do we look at

22:07

our finances, not even so much

22:11

what KPIs we look at, because

22:11

you want to make sure the way

22:15

you think about your financial

22:15

KPIs is reflective of the unique

22:19

value proposition and structure

22:19

of your organization, I actually

22:24

think that's relatively

22:24

challenging. Because if you're

22:27

looking at it in a very standard

22:27

way, you're going to inevitably

22:32

derive the types of KPIs that

22:32

might be standard, which usually

22:36

results in more standard

22:36

behavior, more standard

22:39

operating in value propositions

22:39

into the marketplace. So I think

22:43

being able to understand the

22:43

uniqueness of your organization

22:47

and product and have that pull

22:47

through every component of the

22:52

company, I think is really

22:52

valuable. But that's a little

22:55

bit. I think that's a little bit

22:55

more of an advanced thing. So I

23:00

understand our p&l and

23:00

everything at an intuitive level

23:03

at this point. But But that's

23:03

kind of the that's how I think

23:07

about it now, right now.

23:09

That's, that's

23:09

interesting. It makes a lot of

23:11

sense. Can you me kind of a

23:11

breakdown of where you're

24:13

selling your product today?

24:21

Yeah, the way we

24:21

think about distribution is is

24:24

really around where does our

24:24

customer which is the outdoor

24:28

enthusiast shop. So we're really

24:28

focused on on Whole Foods and

24:32

Sprouts and REI but we're also

24:32

in a lot of other outdoor stores

24:35

like Academy Sports in the

24:35

South. Shields is a new retail

24:39

partner during the Midwest,

24:39

Cabela's, Bass Pro. A lot of

24:44

those those types of those are

24:44

types of places but those are a

24:48

lot of the majority of places

24:48

that we're pushing business

24:50

right now. Awesome.

24:52

Well, this is

24:52

this has been a great chat like

24:54

it's always great getting

24:54

specifically into a situation

24:58

and just as a have, you know an

24:58

accounting firm who targets CPG

25:02

brands and I deal with all the

25:02

sales calls. A lot of times when

25:06

I'm talking to the folks,

25:06

deduction management UNFI Ke

25:11

nightmares get brought up. So

25:11

it's very industry specific.

25:15

Yeah, it's interesting, but it

25:15

is I'm just kind of get ahead of

25:18

the curve, understanding what

25:18

you signed up for, managing it,

25:22

managing cash as best as you

25:22

can, and then moving on. So you

25:26

know, very appreciative of the,

25:26

the example and the situation

25:30

that you discussed, and I think

25:30

it'll be a great value add to

25:33

that for the listeners out there. So

25:35

No, my pleasure to share. Thanks for having me.

25:38

All right. Before we get outta here, a couple of things, we got our typical kind

25:39

of two questions that we asked

25:42

ask all of our guests. Number

25:42

one, what is one CPG industry

25:47

do?

25:50

What is the CPG? Industry Do?

25:52

Do? So for any

25:52

fellow brand owners? What was

25:54

the one piece of advice to do?

25:57

Oh, not not what

25:57

does the industry do - one piece

25:59

of advice to do? I'd say stand

25:59

for one thing. There's a lot of

26:05

stuff out there, but you can

26:05

only stand for one thing. And I

26:07

would even say that is for the

26:07

lifetime of the company, one

26:11

thing and if you can own that

26:11

thing, then you'll accompany

26:16

equity with your brand. Even if

26:16

the revenue is low brand equity

26:21

and owning that one thing will

26:21

eventually turn into sales. It's

26:25

just the way it works.

26:27

Ya, I remember

26:27

back 10, 15 years ago, when I

26:29

was getting into the business world and entrepreneur world, I was trying to do like five

26:31

things. And it's like, all of

26:33

them sucked. So it's like focus

26:33

on one. And then you know, it's

26:37

like, really focused on it. And

26:37

it really does help you grow

26:42

that brand, or that equity. The

26:42

way you're looking at so then

26:47

the second question is, then

26:47

what is one CPG? Industry don't?

26:52

For for the folks out there?

26:55

I would say don't

26:55

get distracted by all the press

26:59

releases on LinkedIn.

27:03

Give us a little more background on that.

27:04

Yeah, sure. The

27:04

CPG industry is has a very low

27:10

barrier to entry, so anyone can

27:10

create food, go to the farmers

27:14

market and say, Hey, I'm in CPG.

27:14

But I think it has a very high

27:17

barrier to entry to profit

27:17

driving enterprise and network

27:21

capability. And a lot of the

27:21

companies in the space tend to

27:26

be venture capital backed and

27:26

those incentives that accompany

27:32

that as V/C backed has in the

27:32

way they grow, market, leverage

27:36

PR is not always necessarily

27:36

indicative of the best ways to

27:42

build a long standing profitable

27:42

business. And so when I say

27:46

ignore the the press releases on

27:46

LinkedIn, it's really about if

27:51

you understand your business

27:51

supremely well, and understand

27:56

the customers who are buying

27:56

from your business and serving

27:59

them. I just genuinely don't

27:59

think any press release matters

28:04

at that point. You can have a

28:04

competitor and land on the front

28:07

page of the Times. But I think

28:07

you ask anyone who's had press.

28:12

It's like a party like it was

28:12

great that night. And then the

28:16

next day, the sales didn't

28:16

really uptick, but people

28:19

thought I was cooler. That's

28:19

what press is like to me. So

28:21

don't get distracted by what you

28:21

see, get focused on serving your

28:25

customers and maintaining your

28:25

margin. It's not sexy, but

28:29

that's how you will make money.

28:29

And that's how you serve more

28:31

people over time.

28:33

Love it. That's a

28:33

very unique don't. But I

28:36

couldn't agree more on a that

28:36

those kind of short term, like

28:39

daily are here and there. Like

28:39

"win moments". People know about

28:43

Kuju or Accountfully. I'm out in

28:43

the world. And the next day, the

28:47

next day, it's back to work.

28:49

No, I think I could

28:49

say it because because most of

28:51

my CPG peers are V/C backed,

28:51

we're not V/C backed. So if I

28:55

had VCs on my board or

28:55

something, I would obviously not

28:57

be saying that, because it

28:57

doesn't make sense. But I think

29:01

we tackled growth on a very

29:01

unique basis. So I kind of feel

29:05

like I have a little bit more

29:05

flexibility and kind of saying

29:08

these things.

29:08

Awesome. Well,

29:08

this was a great chat. Jeff,

29:12

before we get out of here, give

29:12

everybody where they can find

29:15

Kuju. What do you got brewing?

29:15

You know, with Kuju any new

29:19

products anything, just give us

29:19

a you know, your little 30

29:21

second elevator pitch on Kuju here.

29:23

I'd say you know,

29:23

we make pour over coffee really

29:27

easy. And just buy us at REI,

29:27

Whole Foods, Sprouts. And if you

29:34

like it, share it. Share us on

29:34

Instagram, we'll take a look.

29:38

We've got some new stuff coming

29:38

out. I'm not going to comment on

29:41

that just yet. But just keep on

29:41

buying us, follow us on

29:44

Instagram and you'll see and I

29:44

trust we'll make you happy.

29:49

Awesome.

29:49

Kujucoffee.com KU-JU out there.

29:53

So again, Thanks, Jeff. I hope

29:53

everybody enjoyed the

29:56

conversation here. Really,

29:56

really good example of a a bad

30:00

situation with UNFI go wrong but

30:00

turn it into a positive

30:04

longterm. Jeff really enjoyed

30:04

it. Episode 26 of The Month End,

30:09

Jeff Wiguna from Kuju Coffe.

30:09

Take care of Jeff.

30:11

Thank You Brad. See ya.