0:06

that building a mortgage business, a successful one, is like playing

0:12

a game. There's winners, there's losers, there's certain things you try.

0:16

Some of us are playing checkers while others are playing chess.

0:20

I've had the ability to coach and

0:22

mentor hundreds of mortgage brokers. I myself built a very nice business.

0:26

So now I want to distill all that information, all the things I've

0:29

learned from that and bring it directly to you in a simple to

0:32

understand way. I hope you enjoy. right, welcome to the Mortgage Game Podcast.

0:38

West Coast Wiley in the house.

0:41

Oh So I hold strong opinions You've heard that phrase I do good common sense, man.

0:58

loosely. before. good argument. I can be swayed to something else,

1:02

right? I don't have this all figured out, but there's certain things where I'm like, nope, can't change my

1:06

mind on that one. You can try, but it's not

1:08

happening. I already know that. I already know there's certain things.

1:10

I'm like, nope, I don't believe that. It's not part of my belief system.

1:13

This is one of more important in your business, relationships or content?

1:16

What will allow you to have a thriving mortgage business?

1:24

You build awesome relationships or awesome content.

1:28

I'm here to tell you content, content, content, content,

1:30

content. Over and over again, a hundred

1:33

times over, without a doubt, not even close.

1:37

It's like a baby fighting Mike Tyson in the ring.

1:41

Not even close. Now let me clarify some things

1:44

here and then I'll back this up with my reasoning.

1:46

And this is hopefully the whole thing here is to get you just

1:50

thinking differently, right? The world is moving fast. A lot of you listening here, you're dinosaurs.

1:53

You're dinosaurs in this business, or at least in your marketing.

1:56

And that's okay. And new people coming in, like you

1:59

get it more.

2:02

You're like the younger people coming in.

2:05

You're like, yeah, that's, yeah,

2:07

that makes sense. I mean, this is the world we're

2:10

in. And then I'm watching my kids come

2:12

up and I'm watching, you know, kids a little older than them.

2:14

And just like how everyone's, you know, acting and what they're doing with their time and energy.

2:18

And it's content, content, content, attention. People's attention is the number

2:20

one currency in the world. It is.

2:23

It's why you can be a TikToker or a Instagrammer, whatever you call

2:27

them. And you can be 14, make millions

2:30

of dollars. It's not because you have good

2:33

relationships, because you have good content and then you get

2:37

people content, and then you get people's attention. And that's where the money is.

2:41

And so my whole job, or my goal,

2:43

my job goal with this podcast is just to get you thinking

2:45

differently. Get you going, yeah, right. You're Yeah, I need to put more time and energy into that and less

2:49

time and energy over here. Now, when I say content is way

2:52

more important than relationships in your business. Let me clarify, because some of you are probably foaming at the

2:56

mouth right now. I can't believe you're saying

2:58

that. Relationships matter, Ryan. They matter. Yes, of course they do.

3:02

Come on. I'm not talking about how happy

3:04

you are. I'm not talking about the

3:07

relationships you have with your lenders. Those are very important with your BDM, your BRM, your underwriters.

3:13

I'm talking the front end stuff.

3:15

The relationships you have to get

3:17

leads for your business. Talking about that versus content.

3:20

Okay. Not the relationships you have with your friends and family and all that.

3:24

I'm not talking about that. Okay.

3:26

So let's just peel that out.

3:29

There goes your whole argument.

3:32

It's out the freaking window.

3:35

I don't know. Or not. Right? And you carry on building your relationships and having your

3:38

business act as if you 2010. it's, know, And you can slowly

3:42

just keep growing your business. Or you can focus on content and

3:49

throw some gas on the fire.

3:56

Right? And so here's my thoughts on this. You've got back in the day, let's

3:58

just say I was going to jump you, drop you in a city and I'm going

4:02

to drop you in, let's say Calgary, Alberta.

4:07

You still live there by the way. Horrible hockey team. I liked the city though.

4:09

15 years I lived there. So went to school there, high school and one year university then dropped out not my jam went to play pool instead go figure uh

4:15

so you're learning stuff about me so i drop you in calgary we have

4:20

no friends or family or anything no call no relationships nothing

4:23

you just get dropped there with a phone and a laptop it's like go

4:27

crush mortgages put money in the bank account uh 100 commission go

4:31

okay well you go build relationships and i'll go and you

4:34

can't do both Crush mortgages, put money in the bank account, 100%

4:37

commission, go. Okay, you go well, build relationships and you can't do both.

4:40

In a perfect you get world, to do both things.

4:43

But we're not in a perfect world. A perfect you would call world, your freaking database four times a year. Nobody does. That's a perfect way to run a

4:49

mortgage business. On top of many other things, but that would be the thing to do.

4:52

But we don't. So we're in a messy world.

4:55

Life is messy.

4:58

So, and we tend to take the path of least resistance and we're lazy and enter excuse here.

5:02

So I'm going to say you have to

5:05

pick one content or relationships. So you go run out and you go knock

5:09

on real estate office doors and try to meet mortgage brokers.

5:11

And you go, I don't even know who you would build relationships

5:14

with, to be honest. I don't know where you would go

5:18

and who you'd talk to. You go join B&I groups and you go

5:22

to Toastmasters and you join the Chamber of Commerce and you try to

5:25

build relationships with centers of influence and financial, you do

5:27

that. And I'm going to go over here, and I'm going to create content, and I'm going to put it on Facebook,

5:33

Instagram, LinkedIn, just those three, I'm going to do that.

5:36

And I'm going to build, use that same content for my email

5:41

marketing, when I eventually get email addresses from people,

5:45

because I'm going to ask them for email addresses through DMS.

5:48

And I'm going to start contacting people through I'm going to ask

5:51

them for email addresses through DMs. social, And I'm going to start contacting people through social.

5:56

I'm going to start putting it out on social.

5:58

And I'm going to start DMing the people who are interested and who

6:01

are looking at my stuff. Who do you think is going to have

6:04

a half million dollars in the bank faster? That's not even close. It's going to be me with the content. You're going to be out there

6:07

hobnobbing it, walking around, shaking hands, kissing babies, building these relationships for whatever reason. I have no idea.

6:10

I actually don't even know what you're doing out there, to be honest. Those other groups were, here's my thoughts on this.

6:14

You can go build a relationship with a broker owner of a real

6:18

estate brokerage. Hey, I have a hundred agents.

6:21

Get to come in and chat. Great. That's awesome, Tom.

6:26

I have a hundred agents get to

6:32

come in and That's Tom. brokerage. Hey, chat. Great. awesome, I'm coming You come in.

6:33

Boom. you in, you start present, talking to realtors. Remember, Okay. or they're under someone at a

6:36

brokerage. All you've gotten is they've given you a platform, a 15, 20 minute window where top producers don't

6:40

really even show up. It's more everyone else who's

6:43

struggling shows up and they come to listen to you talk. And then you still have to go build the relationships. Each of those people have their own mortgage people.

6:50

Just because Tom gave you a platform doesn't mean agent ABCD under the brokerage or under the team, right?

7:02

If you have a team of five, I have five agents. It doesn't mean they use you.

7:05

They're not forced to use you. They can use whoever they want.

7:08

They're empowered to go build their own relationships and their own business.

7:11

So you're no further along. And while you're doing that, I'm,

7:14

as they say, sliding into the DMs.

7:17

I'm coming over here. I've already green screened some listings for you.

7:23

I've already show you I'm going to run a webinar showing you how to

7:26

get business from your database. And I've already been talking to

7:28

you with videos and voice memos and texts through your DMs. We already have a relationship.

7:31

And then they just happen to go in and listen to you talk for 20, 30 minutes.

7:36

And I've already got a relationship built over here,

7:38

right? Just because you have a relationship with the mothership does not equal money in your bank

7:44

account. It just gives you a platform.

7:46

What do you do with the platform? Most brokers don't even know what

7:49

to do with that platform.

7:52

Same thing. If you're in a relationship with a financial advisor, sure, they have

7:55

certain clients and they, but those clients still have to agree

7:58

to work with you, right? They still have to have a relationship with you.

8:01

It's a referral, but it doesn't

8:03

mean it's a done deal.

8:05

Whereas I'm going to be marketing to the direct consumer through my content directly, and I'm going to

8:11

build up trust. They don't know you from a hole in

8:14

the ground. They just said, their realtor said

8:16

to talk to you. account, their financial advisor,

8:19

who they trust. Sure, that's cool.

8:22

Maybe not realtors as much, but sure, you're from FAA.

8:25

That's fine. But they still have to meet you

8:27

and trust and like build trust with you.

8:29

Well, I'm sleeping over here. My content's out there building up

8:33

trust and awareness and grabbing people's attention. And then when I put in certain strategies in there, it's

8:39

collecting email addresses for me. And this is building that up while

8:41

I sleep. While you sleep, your relationships aren't doing you anything. Hopefully there's like a, huh, that's interesting.

8:47

Yeah. Right. Hmm. Your time, the best bang for your

8:50

buck highest and best use real estate term we know that is not

8:53

building relationships those relationships only go so far you

8:55

move no relationship that person quits no relationship that person

8:59

dies no relationship there's a personality conflict no

9:02

relationship something happens no relationship. There's a personality conflict, no relationship.

9:07

Something happens, no relationship. Content lives forever. It's digital real estate.

9:09

You're building digital real estate. And the cool part is if you know what the hell you're doing, you

9:14

get to take that digital real estate and repurpose it into your

9:20

email marketing and build a machine there, which you hear me

9:25

talk about all the time, which we show people do in our

9:29

accountability groups and inside Strategy Hub, right? This podcast brought to so good.

9:33

Starbucks today. Been making them at home lately.

9:37

Nespresso. Nespresso. Starbucks. It's a weekend right now.

9:40

Okay, so back to like content versus relationships. And so I see just so many people

9:44

out there, you know, they're getting dressed up, they're going

9:48

out, they're belly to belly, they're meeting people.

9:51

That's fine. Sure. Can you build a business around that? Sure. That's how it wasn't back in the

9:54

that's how it was back Sure, in the day.

9:57

day. Absolutely. Absolutely. But it's 2024, But it's 2024,

10:00

right? Then it's going to be five years 2025, from it's going now, to be 2030.

10:03

That stuff's going away. It's not as important as you

10:08

think. It's not.

10:14

It's not. It's not. It's not. You having a kick-ass Instagram

10:22

page that engages people, that shows you your personality and you

10:25

as an expert and gives them opportunity and you're asking them

10:29

if they need help, that will outperform any relationship you

10:32

have on the lead gen side.

10:34

100%. Remember, I'm not talking about lenders, BDMs behind.

10:38

Yeah, over here. Not talking about that.

10:40

That's very important. Will be less important in the future if you've heard my other podcasts, but we're not talking

10:43

about That's that. very important.

10:46

Will be less important in the If future.

10:49

you've heard my other podcasts, but we're not talking about that right now.

10:52

So you can go build these

10:54

platforms and with putting all your energy in there, or you can

11:04

go and, you know, walk around and shake hands and kiss babies and hold these events and do this and do that. That's great.

11:06

But highest and best use of your

11:09

time is content. It always is. It's the leverage on top of leverage.

11:13

You get to leverage you sitting at home, crushing out a 20 minute

11:18

video, which is really two minutes, but a bunch of takes,

11:21

some scripting, some editing, throwing that out to the universe, getting thousands of eyeballs on it forever with calls to actions,

11:24

and then just doing it again. And you get to do that from home or wherever you want.

11:27

There's no better use of your 20

11:29

minute, half hour. So I always talk about content

11:32

days. I have a content day. Content day is like, it feeds your business.

11:36

It should feed your business. This should be the most important

11:39

day of the month for you is your content day.

11:42

It's the lifeline of your business. So if you have a content day, let's just call it three hours.

11:47

You have a three hour content day where you're making your emails

11:51

for your drip. You're making your videos for your

11:54

platforms. You're making your static posts. You're making your, right.

11:58

You're just doing all the stuff you're doing for your social and your email marketing.

12:02

There is no better. This is the part like I just, I

12:06

want to say it 100 times in a row.

12:10

I might just do that right now.

12:12

I might just say it for 100 times.

12:15

So you might want to just fast forward. There is no better use of your

12:19

time for those three hours.

12:21

There is no better use of your

12:24

time for those three hours. There is no better.

12:26

I'm not going to do it.

12:29

I'm kidding. But you get the point.

12:31

Like I want to hammer this home. And then a lot of you say, I don't like content.

12:36

I don't want, I don't know what to, yeah, we'll figure it out.

12:39

Figure it out. You have to figure it out or you

12:42

die. You have to evolve your business or you die.

12:46

Or you just have less money in the

12:49

bank account. Maybe you don't die, but it's a

12:52

painful death. It's like death by a thousand paper cuts.

12:54

The goal is to make money. And I get it.

12:56

We're changing lives and we're helping. And I get all that.

12:59

But you didn't get into this business for that.

13:02

You got into it because you thought, hey, I can go make a

13:06

bunch of money and have a good work-life balance, which is funny

13:08

to say that because a lot of us don't.

13:11

And, you know, live a good life and blah, blah, blah, and have some freedom and be my own boss and all that stuff.

13:15

But without the money, there's no anything.

13:17

And the byproduct is you're helping people. So let's just own it.

13:21

Let's say I want to make money.

13:23

The byproduct is you're helping people. So let's just own it.

13:25

Let's say I want to make money. The byproduct is I help a lot of people.

13:30

Cool. Awesome. Warm hugs for everybody. But it's money, right?

13:34

The money which helps you, your family, buy better food, healthier

13:37

food, get private health care, go on better vacations, go on more

13:40

vacations, right? Impact the quality of your life and those around you, help out family members and friends who

13:43

need help, help out other people who need help. It all stems off of money, right? So please, let's not, I'm not this

13:48

evil money person, by the way. I'm like, I share a lot of stuff.

13:52

I give back a lot of stuff. I'm not like money.

13:55

I wake up in money, money, money, money, money, money.

13:59

That's not me. That's the farthest thing from me.

14:01

If you know me, I don't spend money on fancy things. That's not to show off.

14:03

That's not my jam. I don't do that. But I'm just trying to get across

14:07

the point to you that money is very important. Like it's not an evil thing.

14:13

The people who think it's evil are

14:15

typically the people who don't have it.

14:18

That's so true. Because I used to not have money.

14:23

And I was like, I don't need money to be happy.

14:27

And you get money and you're like, oh, this is better.

14:30

I like this. This is way better.

14:32

I can still, I'm still a good person.

14:35

I can help more people with money.

14:38

So back to why we're doing this,

14:41

doing it to earn money. And so your business needs the

14:44

content to thrive. Back in the day, there was no

14:48

social media, or if there was, it was very minimal.

14:50

I can't even remember. This podcast is brought to And

14:53

Americano again. Okay. So, but back in the day, it was, there wasn't social.

14:58

So yeah, relationships did matter. It was, but it was the same old

15:01

school thing. Go make relationships with the

15:03

owner of a real estate shop. Try to get in.

15:07

Try to get access to agents. Try to get in.

15:09

Try to maybe get a contract somewhere with a moving company or

15:13

something, try to get in with builders and developers, and then

15:16

try to get relationships with center of influences and get...

15:19

Sure. But this is the point everyone's

15:21

missing. go and make those relationships. You still...

15:23

The end user is the one who's

15:25

going to use you. The end, the consumer, it's the

15:29

person who's agreeing to work with you and how you get paid your

15:32

$5,000 for your file. So just because you have

15:37

relationship with the mothership, the team lead, the broker owner,

15:39

the FA, the whoever, whoever, whoever, does not mean the end

15:41

user uses you, right? So now you're going out and

15:53

building all these relationships so that you get introductions, so then you can go build relationships user.

15:56

Why not just skip that part? Why not skip the middle man, the

15:59

refer, and go right to the end person and build up the trust

16:02

there right away that you're going to have to do anyways.

16:04

You're going to have to build that at some point.

16:08

Why not do that with your content? And you're like, why don't I do

16:13

both right? Yeah, I get it. We're not talking about that because everyone has a plan like

16:15

that. I'm going to do social. I'm going to do that.

16:20

And I'm going to have, I'm going

16:23

to be in iGroups. I'm there.

16:26

And I'm going to prospect through DMs.

16:28

I'm going to call. Yeah, no one does anything.

16:31

They don't. 99% of us do like very little of

16:34

that. Right? So I'm going, what's the thing you can focus on the most that'll have

16:41

the quickest amount of impact on your business and long-term,

16:46

short-term, long-term, and put money in your bank account.

16:48

It's a lot more the people who are on social and you go look at their

16:53

stuff and you see their posts and you see they're engaged and you

17:03

say, do you think they're doing if they weren't a mortgage broker,

17:08

they would be doing all that stuff? Like if they didn't have some, like, let's just say they won the

17:12

lottery and they said, I'm done being a mortgage broker now.

17:14

Do you think they would still be posting? It wouldn't be talking about mortgages.

17:17

Do you think they'd still be posting all the stuff and sharing things? Hell no. Most people wouldn't,

17:21

right? They're doing it because it works. I always go to that.

17:23

Like the blueprint's laying in front of all of us. Ah, it doesn't work.

17:25

There are people on social media in the mortgage industry where

17:28

majority of their business comes from social media. And that's why they continue to do it.

17:32

If you see someone that has been at this for over a year, they are

17:37

winning on social media. They've given you the blueprint.

17:39

It's right in front of you, plain as day.

17:42

What you don't see is what they're doing on the back end through DMs.

17:51

But what I am going to tell you is that the good news is they're not

17:54

doing a lot. I know this for a fact. Very, very small percentage of people actually crush all the

18:02

content and then have a strong DM prospecting game.

18:04

They don't. Or a strong email game.

18:07

They don't. Big opportunity here.

18:10

But from the front end, the content drives everything.

18:12

I'm living proof of this. A year ago, I had no social media.

18:16

This podcast is brought to ago, I had no social media.

18:18

And I said, well, well i don't like social but it's where my

18:22

avatar my avatar mortgage brokers you you listening hopefully you're

18:26

a mortgage broker if you're not i don't know why you're listening

18:29

unless you're my family which i still once again i don't know why

18:33

you're listening uh i go that's where my avatars are.

18:36

They're hanging out on Instagram. They're listening to podcasts.

18:39

They're in Facebook groups. They're I'm going like, to go get

18:43

their emails and mark to them through there. They're on Facebook.

18:45

They're on LinkedIn. Like this is where my avatar is.

18:49

So I have to go there. I have to go where they are.

18:52

If I like it or not, I have to go

18:54

where they are. Same mentality for you. So I said, well, I'm going to go all in on social.

18:57

And I haven't even like went all in, all in.

19:01

I'm like all in. I still have other gears to get

19:04

to, which we will get to. You'll see where there's other

19:07

things coming. But I went there.

19:09

I'm probably a year in, maybe even less. 10 months, 11 months.

19:13

Actually, we're not even. I think we started in May last year.

19:16

So we're coming up on it.

19:23

We're about 10, 11 months in. And I can tell you, social media works.

19:26

I can tell you that for a fact.

19:29

Social media works. It does everything people are telling you it does.

19:32

now. But now it's just a part of the

19:35

business. And I cannot imagine me doing what

19:37

I do without social media. And I could not imagine going to

19:41

be a mortgage broker now without social, without a strong content

19:47

game, right? I have relationships.

19:49

I have relationships with certain people.

19:54

Those relationships don't put money in my bank out content and telling a story and having a good offer does.

19:59

It does. This works, kids. Right? The content. So you have choices to make. We all have choices to make,

20:01

right? We are where we are because of choices we made at some point in time. And so I just wanted to put this out in front of you with some

20:06

examples, right? And just my thoughts on this, why

20:09

content is king over relationships. And hopefully that reframes how you think about things.

20:13

The cool part is building relationships takes a lot of time.

20:17

Content doesn't. Building relationships can work.

20:20

Yeah, 100%. But there's pros and cons to

20:23

everything, right? a combination? Absolutely. I just see way too many people

20:27

focusing on relationships and we're not in a relationship world.

20:29

As sad as it is to say that, it's very sad to say that actually.

20:33

We're not there and we're trending even more out of it.

20:38

We're attention. You have a kick ass social media

20:42

game will get you attention, which will get opportunities for you for

20:51

applications to then close and put them on your bank account.

20:54

Your relationships will only get you so far. Only so far with a lot of work, a lot of effort, right?

20:58

That's where we're going. So it is what it is.

21:02

I sound sad about that, but I'm winning on the content side.

21:08

So I'm like, ah, it's pretty good over here too.

21:14

Like it's pretty good. And here's the cool part.

21:17

I'll leave it on this and then we're done.

21:21

Relationships come out of the content. You putting this content out will open up doors a lot quicker with

21:26

the opportunity for relationships to impact your business with those

21:29

referral partners, with other people, with people joining your team, with whoever.

21:31

Relationships come out of the

21:34

content because you have attention.

21:37

Content doesn't come out of relationships, right?

21:40

The content drives everything.

21:42

It's a big umbrella over everything you're doing in your mortgage business.

21:45

And all the other stuff comes out of it.

21:49

Right? So it's not like you're never

21:54

going to have relationships again.

21:56

You end up having them. So that's it, kids.

22:03

Wanted to put that out there. I'm going to want to make this one specifically.

22:07

I just didn't know how to frame it.

22:09

But hopefully that helps you think a little differently or just get

22:12

to understand what's banging around in my coconut um enjoy your

22:16

week that's it kids peace