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Butter cookie cones from Haagen-Dazs. That's

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DAS.

1:17

She called me about 10 years

1:20

after we did League of the Rhones. So,

1:22

you know, 20 years ago, 25 years

1:24

ago, maybe.

1:25

And she said to me, Rosie, could

1:29

you play soccer? I

1:32

said, what? Could you play soccer?

1:36

I don't know. I never, it wasn't my sport,

1:38

truthfully, too much running. I didn't like it. I'd

1:40

rather sit. But,

1:41

you know, yeah, I know how to play soccer. Why?

1:43

She's like, well, there's a team in Mexico.

1:46

Great story. You could be the lady. I go,

1:49

I'm Rosie O'Donnell. I'm going to be the Mexican

1:51

woman on the soccer

1:52

coach. But she was

1:54

always trying to get everybody back together

1:57

and do it again. And, you know, do you...

1:59

Play soccer.

2:07

Hi, this is Rosie O'Donnell and I

2:09

have a cold sore. Hello

2:16

friends. Welcome to this week's

2:19

episode of off the beat. I

2:21

am as always your

2:23

humble host, Brian Baumgartner. Today's

2:26

guest. Well, she

2:29

needs no introduction. I'm going to give one

2:31

anyways, but I just want you to know, I

2:33

am so excited to welcome the

2:35

legendary

2:37

Rosie O'Donnell to the podcast.

2:39

Honestly, it would be much

2:42

easier for me to tell you what Rosie hasn't

2:44

done in the entertainment business

2:46

than to list her, her countless

2:49

huge projects from the

2:51

last what?

2:53

Four decades. I mean, maybe

2:55

you know, Rosie from some of the

2:57

tiny movies she's done,

3:00

you know, a league of their own sleepless

3:02

in Seattle, or perhaps

3:04

you're more familiar with her standup

3:07

career or from her years

3:09

doing the iconic Rosie O'Donnell show.

3:12

The queen of nice is also the

3:14

queen of candid to be clear.

3:17

She's also responsible

3:19

for some of the biggest philanthropic

3:22

efforts in the history of

3:25

show business and was continues

3:27

to be groundbreaking for

3:29

the LGBTQ plus community

3:32

around the world. We'll hear

3:34

a lot about that

3:36

and the impact she has made in

3:39

that community. Look, she's a legend

3:41

for a reason. You might even

3:43

say that she's in a league of her own.

3:47

Okay. Not the best, but I'm, I'm

3:49

trying. Uh, this is a great

3:52

conversation. There is so much insider info.

3:54

And if you know anything about Rosie, you should

3:57

not be surprised that she

3:59

was able to be.

3:59

completely candid, moving,

4:03

and hilarious all at once. So

4:06

I'm not gonna make you wait any longer. Here

4:08

she is, Rosie O'Donnell.

4:12

["Bubble and Squeak"] ["Bubble

4:15

and Squeak"] ["Bubble

4:30

and Squeak"] Hi,

4:38

Rosie. How are you? I'm

4:40

good. I'm so happy to be doing

4:43

this. Well, I'm so happy that you're

4:45

here. It's a little bit

4:47

of a different environment than watch what happens

4:49

live the last time I saw you. I

4:51

know, that was

4:52

so fun. And I remember I said to Laurie,

4:54

I love that guy, we should hang out with him. So

4:56

this is our first hang. Consider this our

4:58

first hang. This will be our first of many,

5:01

I hope. Yeah, me too. Congratulations

5:05

on the new podcast. We're gonna talk about that

5:07

in a little bit. But I wanted

5:09

to start, by the way,

5:11

I told you this when I met, I'm

5:13

a huge fan of yours. Your

5:16

career is,

5:18

well, I mean, it's unbelievable and

5:21

inspiring, I wanna get into it a little

5:24

bit. When did you first

5:27

begin to have feelings

5:29

of interest in performing when

5:31

you were a kid? Pre-kindergarten.

5:34

Pre-kindergarten? Yes, in kindergarten,

5:37

everybody would do show and tell and they would

5:39

bring in a toy and I would go,

5:42

and now I'd like to do something from Guys

5:44

and Dolls. And I would belt

5:46

out a Broadway show song that my

5:48

mother would listen to the original cast

5:50

recordings all the time. So I knew every Broadway

5:53

show. Then I wanted to be a performer.

5:55

I wanted to be Barbara Streisand. I wanted to be

5:57

Bette Midler.

5:58

Now, the fact that,

5:59

that I really couldn't sing or

6:01

dance didn't really

6:03

dissuade me. I was still like,

6:05

gung-ho, let's do this. The

6:08

goal for me was never Hollywood, it was

6:10

always Broadway because Hollywood was

6:13

some imaginary illusion that

6:15

I had been on a plane. I didn't

6:17

know how to get there, but Broadway,

6:19

I knew how to get there, and I knew how to watch

6:22

sweaty people come out of that stage door that

6:24

I just saw on stage.

6:26

I'm like, this is the destination, Broadway.

6:28

So that's always what I thought I

6:30

would do. I would have a career as a Broadway

6:32

performer and then maybe producer. Did you,

6:35

so you went to a lot of shows, even as a young

6:38

kid. Okay. Yes. Very

6:40

often I would

6:41

take off Wednesday and go on

6:44

the train into Manhattan and then get

6:46

a $10 TKTS seat. TKTS,

6:49

yeah.

6:50

Yeah, or when they used to do standing

6:52

room, I don't know if they still do that now with COVID,

6:54

but they used to do standing room

6:57

for a very discounted fee.

6:59

And I saw all those hits in the 70s. I

7:02

saw, you know, Best Little Whorehouse. I saw

7:04

Pippin. I saw

7:06

Chorus Line. I saw,

7:08

you know, They're Playing Our Song. And

7:11

I loved it. I thought it was the most magical

7:14

part of the world. And

7:16

I

7:17

came to find out in my career

7:19

that I've been very lucky to do a lot of different

7:22

things and different

7:23

avenues. And I think the most enjoyable

7:26

for me

7:26

is definitely Broadway. But

7:28

it's a young person's game because

7:31

eight shows a week when you're 61, trying

7:33

to remember the lines is

7:35

not what it was in my 20s, you know? Yeah,

7:37

you know, it's funny because I, you

7:39

know, I don't know if you know this. I started off in

7:42

theater as well. And

7:45

I thought that that was my life. That was all

7:48

I wanted to do as well.

7:51

And so I was never

7:53

based in New York. I did some shows there,

7:56

but I was sort of on that major regional theater

7:59

circuit, traveling.

7:59

from city to city, Berkeley rep

8:02

and the Guthrie and others. And

8:05

I think what you just said is so true.

8:07

It is kind of a young person's

8:09

game. The eight shows a week, nonstop.

8:13

The only day you have off is Monday

8:16

and nobody else is off on Mondays. It's

8:19

hard to have a life,

8:21

right?

8:22

Well, you only have your life and your world

8:24

amongst the people who are on your schedule. So

8:27

it's a small community. It's a very

8:29

connected, kind community. Everyone

8:32

knows each other. It's so much more

8:35

tangible than the vagueness of Hollywood

8:38

success. When you're on Broadway, you

8:40

see the same people when you go out to eat

8:42

in between shows at Joe Allen's and you

8:45

get your routine and it becomes your life

8:48

and your world. And it is a beautiful part

8:50

of show business. It's the part that

8:52

kind of

8:53

moves me the most. When you go home

8:55

after doing a series,

8:58

you go in your bed, you go to sleep. It's not the same

9:00

as live performers

9:02

there with you making a show every

9:04

night just for those 1600 people in the theater.

9:10

You're in high school and

9:12

your dream is to be on Broadway. What

9:15

begins to get you into

9:18

standup?

9:19

I did a comedy show

9:21

where

9:22

you make fun of the teachers

9:23

called Senior Follies. And

9:26

I would take the whole Saturday

9:28

Night Live record and

9:31

I would change the names like,

9:34

Miss Baron, who was a very skinny

9:36

flat-chested teacher, more on this story

9:38

as it develops. I would just change

9:41

the, and I made it all about the teachers.

9:43

Well, they thought I was a

9:43

genius. They're like, I'm like, don't put

9:46

on that record because I stole everything from there.

9:49

And so I wrote it and I did Rosanne

9:52

Rosanna Dana. And you

9:54

ever notice you got a little piece of saliva

9:57

in your mouth that goes up and down

9:59

and up.

9:59

and I had a wig

10:02

on and this man comes over to me, who's

10:04

about 30

10:05

and I'm now 16, right? And he says,

10:09

my brother is in this play. Yeah, I'm his

10:11

older brother. I just opened a comedy club out

10:13

on Huntington, Long Island. You

10:15

know, next two towns over, why

10:17

don't you come and do some stand up?

10:19

And I was like, I don't want to do stand up. I want to be on Broadway.

10:22

And he was like, well, maybe before you get to Broadway, you can

10:24

do a little stand up. And I was like, well, I'll try.

10:27

So I go to this club and it's a Saturday

10:29

night and it's every kid

10:31

I knew in high school and I was popular

10:33

in high school, the whole place was packed.

10:36

And I didn't really have an act per se, but

10:38

I would make fun of the

10:40

people in the audience. Like, oh, Mindy,

10:43

you know, do you know that your boyfriend, Billy,

10:45

made out with Lisa Shachner last week? Like,

10:47

it would just be like, convincing, you know? Well,

10:50

I killed because they thought it was hysterical that I

10:52

was on a comedy club. And well, Richie

10:54

said, why don't you come back tomorrow night? And

10:56

I was like, all right, I'll try it again. Look how good I was.

10:59

The next night was a school night and nobody could come.

11:02

So it was just a regular

11:04

crowd. When I say that

11:07

I died a death on that stage,

11:10

it was torturous to watch.

11:13

So I get off and Richie goes, well, you know,

11:15

you're gonna bomb a little bit, kid, you're gonna bomb a little bit.

11:17

And I'm like, okay, all right. I

11:19

go back and he says I can start working

11:22

the open mic night as the MC

11:24

and, you know, not get paid really. But

11:26

I did that and I learned a lot. I learned how

11:28

to do it. And then Shirley

11:30

Hemphill from What's Happening,

11:32

she was the headliner and

11:35

she saw me at the open mic night and

11:37

she told Richie Minavini, oh, that kid's

11:39

gonna

11:39

open for me this weekend. And

11:41

he said, she's not ready. I'm not paying her. She's

11:44

inotid. She said, well, I won't perform

11:46

if you don't book her and pay her 50 bucks

11:48

a show.

11:49

So it was like, I made $300 on the weekend.

11:51

I could

11:54

not believe it. I

11:56

couldn't believe it.

11:58

And that's how it began.

12:00

A few years later,

12:02

when I was 22, a woman

12:05

at that same comedy club came over to me,

12:07

and she's in her 40s, and she says, my

12:09

dad is Ed McMahon,

12:11

and I'm the talent coordinator for Star

12:14

Search,

12:14

and we'd like you to come on Star Search. I thought, you're

12:17

not Claudia McMahon.

12:18

You're not his

12:19

daughter. What would you be doing here? Sure

12:22

enough, it was Claudia McMahon, and it was Ed's

12:24

daughter, and she got me

12:26

on that show where I won five or

12:28

six weeks in a row and made like $2,700 each

12:30

time I won. I

12:33

was rolling in it, and

12:37

I ended up not winning the year, but

12:39

the final $100,000 prize, but I

12:41

got to a point where now I was known enough

12:44

to be a headliner. So by 22,

12:46

after that show was on, I was headlining all

12:48

over the country in small venues

12:51

like little clubs,

12:52

but still, it was a living for sure.

12:54

I could make a living,

12:55

and that's how it began. So when

12:57

you say, I want to go back just

12:59

a teeny bit, but you were emceeing

13:02

these comedy nights. So

13:06

what were you learning as you

13:08

watched these comics?

13:10

Well, you know, it was mostly

13:12

open mic night, and you don't really learn a lot

13:14

from open mic night because nobody

13:17

there is a professional, but Richie

13:19

was so kind to me. He used to let me come

13:21

and hang out on the weekends in an empty

13:23

seat. So I rarely got to see

13:26

female comics, which was a bummer because

13:28

there were so few of us back

13:30

then. There were like 10 women,

13:31

and we were working the circuit, and we never got

13:33

booked together because they didn't think two

13:36

women could do a show together. It

13:38

was so rare to have a woman

13:40

comic that they didn't ever

13:43

let us work together, which was kind of sad.

13:46

What I learned from watching comics

13:49

is,

13:49

first of all, that you have to use your own material.

13:52

I used Jerry Seinfeld's material when

13:55

I was 17. And

13:58

not only did I.

13:59

take his material, I took his cadence.

14:03

So I literally went on stage

14:05

and said, you know, my car got stuck on the way

14:07

here. What am I looking for? A big on

14:09

off switch on off? I'm

14:11

thinking, hey, dogs don't

14:13

have pockets.

14:14

You know, I did it and I walked

14:16

off stage and I got very good response. Right.

14:19

And these male comics come over to me in their 30s and

14:21

I'm like a teenager. And

14:24

they said, where'd you get

14:25

that? I said, Jerry Seinfeld, he was on Merv

14:27

Griffin. Yesterday he's a comedian. They

14:30

say, well, you cannot use his jokes. I go, why?

14:33

They go, well, you have to write your own jokes. I go, hold

14:35

it. Barbra Streisand does not write music.

14:38

All she does is sing. I'm just going to be funny. I'm

14:40

not going to write my own

14:41

jokes. I'm not a writer. And

14:43

they're like, well, that's how you have to do it. And

14:46

here's our advice. Talk about your family,

14:48

something nobody else talks about. Talk

14:50

about your own experience and your own family. So

14:52

that's what I learned, how to take my life,

14:55

exaggerate it, twist

14:57

it,

14:58

and present it as a finished product. I

15:00

learned

15:01

that there's a couple kinds of comedy, conversational

15:04

and presentational. And

15:05

the difference is pretty big. And

15:08

which kind did you want to be? Where

15:10

did you naturally fall in your comedic

15:13

timing and your comedic vision?

15:17

And

15:18

it was very, very helpful. Whenever

15:20

I read like Malcolm

15:23

Gladwell, whatever his name is, and

15:25

it says you have to do like 100,000 hours of something to

15:28

get, I put in my time at those comedy

15:30

clubs, years and years and

15:32

years. Which type

15:34

do you think you're more? Conversational or presentational?

15:37

I definitely think when I started, I was

15:39

presentational. I

15:41

would work a bit, work a bit,

15:43

work a bit, get it till it was a finished product,

15:45

then wrapped up in a nice little bow. I'd

15:48

put it in the basket and then I'd go on and

15:50

on. But as I've gotten older

15:52

and with this job now of podcasting,

15:54

I think I prefer a more

15:57

conversational approach, even

15:59

when I'm one. I think I love when they're

16:01

having conversations rather than, you know, but I'm

16:04

pumped, but I'm pumped, you

16:05

know? Yeah. Well, it's interesting because you

16:07

know, we're all both in this business. And

16:12

by the way,

16:12

even people who are not in this business, you're, everyone's playing

16:16

a character, right? A certain

16:18

degree. You're playing a character with

16:20

your family or with your friends or with this set of friends

16:23

is different than that other set of friends.

16:26

And, but for you, did you feel like you were creating a character, which

16:28

was

16:30

Rosie,

16:32

the standup or what percentage

16:33

of, of yourself did you

16:36

bring into it? Um, well,

16:38

you know, I didn't bring anything about

16:40

being

16:42

gay because it was at a time when no one really talked about it and, or asked you

16:44

about it.

16:47

Like no one ever said to me

16:49

as I was, you know, growing up in the industry, Oh,

16:54

by the way, are you gay? Like it wasn't a, it

16:56

wasn't a conversation. And I remember once

16:58

when I was touring with Greece before we came into

17:00

Broadway. Um,

17:03

and Lois Smith, who was a legendary publicist,

17:05

was for one of the people who founded

17:08

PMK. She was my publicist

17:10

and she was amazing because she was also Marilyn

17:12

Monroe's publicist and she knew everyone in show business and she

17:15

was a legend and a wonderful

17:18

blessing that she was. In my life.

17:21

And she, um, had me interview somebody from

17:23

Patrick Pachanko. I

17:26

think his

17:26

name is from Cosmopolitan magazine. And

17:29

he asked me if I was dating anyone and I said,

17:31

no. And he said,

17:33

well, who would

17:34

you want to date? And I

17:36

said, anyone who applies.

17:39

And he said, could that person be a woman? I said,

17:41

you never know. Could be. Well, Lois called

17:43

Helen Gurley-Baker.

17:47

Well, Lois called Helen

17:49

Gurley-Brown and had that

17:51

part taken out of the

17:54

interview. It was a time

17:56

when there was no internet. The rumors weren't

17:58

flying around everywhere. you

18:00

could just remove it. She would make

18:02

a call and removed it.

18:04

I didn't

18:07

use that part of my life, but I used my

18:09

childhood because I was a young kid doing

18:11

it starting out. I was 20. It was

18:13

in my teens and early 20s.

18:17

I talked about my

18:20

Irish being Irish and what that meant,

18:22

and my dad with a brogue.

18:25

I did my life as much

18:27

as I could, but I

18:29

didn't put in any of the personal

18:32

stuff about sexuality.

18:35

I don't think I would have even been

18:38

able to imagine how to incorporate that

18:40

at the time. Did you lie

18:43

or was it just omission? It

18:46

was omission, but it was also a very

18:49

public non-secret. I

18:51

would take Kelly, who was my wife, and

18:53

to the Emmys

18:56

every year, would sit next to her. I

18:59

didn't show up with a boy. People

19:02

would say, well, you

19:04

pretended that you love Tom Cruise. I go, no, I

19:07

do love Tom Cruise.

19:08

I fully love the

19:11

14-year-old girl in me who put Bobby Sherman's

19:13

picture on the wall, loves

19:15

him in the same way that I loved

19:17

Bobby Sherman. He's turned

19:20

out to be, personally, in my experience,

19:23

the most unbelievably consistent,

19:25

kind man to me.

19:28

He sends me flowers on my birthday.

19:30

He sends me things when my children are born.

19:33

He's been stalwart and steady,

19:36

and really, really like

19:38

a dream almost to me, where he

19:40

could have run the other way

19:41

going stalker, stalker. I

19:46

don't think that I was hiding, but

19:49

I didn't have a way

19:52

to approach the gay thing

19:55

because of the time period

19:57

that it was in. When my show

19:59

started,

19:59

there was no Will and Grace. Right. They

20:02

said to me after the first season, oh, there's

20:04

a new show coming on NBC. It's a gay

20:07

guy and a girl, and

20:09

they're gonna be roommates. And I'm like, well, that'll never

20:11

last. I can have a show with a

20:12

gay person on it. I mean, seriously,

20:15

that was like what everyone thought. Right. If

20:17

people knew somebody was gay, they didn't watch. Remember

20:19

Love, Sydney? Do you remember that?

20:21

No. It was a Tony Randall

20:23

series that ran for like three weeks. Oh,

20:26

okay. They never said that

20:28

he was gay, but he had a picture of a man

20:30

over the fireplace, and he would sort of

20:32

look at it at the end of the episode. And

20:34

I remember the Catholic Church went batshit. Crazy.

20:38

And

20:38

it was pulled off the air. Wow. It

20:41

just wasn't in my reality to think

20:43

that it was accomplishable. Now,

20:46

then the lawsuit came out with the ACLU,

20:49

where gay foster parents like me, I was a

20:51

gay foster parent, were unable

20:54

to adopt even the children they raised,

20:56

because that was the law

20:58

in Florida. And the ACLU had

21:00

a lawsuit with, the Lofton

21:03

Croutteau is the two men's names who

21:05

the lawsuit was named after. They were pediatric

21:08

AIDS nurses

21:09

and AIDS carers. So

21:11

anyway, I came out through that, and

21:13

that was like in

21:15

January right after 9-11. And

21:18

it kind of was not even a story because

21:20

we were all in shock as a nation.

21:23

You know. Right. Thanks.

21:31

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23:53

Thanks for watching! Star

24:00

Search 1984, you're making $2,700 a week. Do you consider

24:02

that chance meeting with

24:10

Claudia McMahon?

24:11

What kind of impact do you feel like

24:14

that had on your career? Did that change

24:16

your life? Totally. 100%.

24:20

It was a very big show. I venture

24:22

to say that it was as popular in 1984 as

24:25

American Idol was at its height. Sam

24:28

Harris had been on the year before and

24:30

America fell in love with him and his

24:32

Judy Garland impression singing. This was

24:35

year two. It was a very big

24:38

deal. I went from being maybe

24:41

an emcee or an opener to a

24:43

headliner after that.

24:45

No, they weren't big venues like

24:47

Caesars, which I eventually

24:49

worked my way up to. They were little

24:52

clubs, but you could make a living. I

24:54

think if it hadn't been for Claudia

24:56

McMahon, I would have

24:58

toiled away in New York at the comedy clubs

25:01

forever and hopefully

25:04

got a career or a sitcom

25:06

or hopefully get to play Rhoda. I

25:08

was very happy with

25:10

that chance meeting and

25:18

stayed in touch with him throughout

25:21

his life. He was very proud of

25:23

the Irish me that got up there

25:25

to the finals. That's awesome. Yeah.

25:29

At this point,

25:30

do you consider yourself, and I've talked

25:33

to a lot of people about this. I

25:35

get introduced or identified

25:38

as this often. At that point at least,

25:40

did you consider yourself a comedian

25:44

or an actor?

25:48

I think I would say actor

25:51

because I was acting like a comedian. I

25:54

was studying comedy and then

25:56

performing it and trying to figure out

25:59

how

25:59

to model it.

25:59

that clay myself every night on

26:02

stage. And I got pretty

26:04

good at it. I got

26:06

nominated for a couple of Emmys for my

26:08

specials, and I

26:11

headlined Caesar's Palace. I mean, that's

26:13

a pretty big gig. You know? That's

26:16

a huge gig. Yeah. And I filled in

26:18

for George Burns on

26:20

his 100th birthday at Caesar's Palace. He was

26:22

supposed to be performing, but he couldn't,

26:25

and he asked me to perform in his stead. And

26:28

I did,

26:28

and he called me in the dressing room and said,

26:31

Ah, Rosie, did you hear the one

26:33

about the doorman at

26:36

the sperm bank?

26:38

His job was to say thank you for coming.

26:41

He told me jokes. 100 years

26:44

old, and he was on his deathbed. 100 years

26:47

old. He died like a week or two later, you know?

26:49

Unbelievable.

26:52

When I think about the people I've met. Right.

26:55

When I think about what my life has

26:57

been since that little girl on Long Island,

26:59

I'm kind of in awe of

27:02

what's happened to me. But

27:04

it almost, I have that dissociation still

27:06

where it almost feels like it's kind of not

27:09

me.

27:09

Not like I'll see myself at

27:12

the height of my

27:14

fame on the cover of a magazine.

27:17

And I'd walk by in New York in those

27:19

little magazine huts they have. And

27:21

I go, Oh, look, Rosie O'Donnell's on Newsweek.

27:25

But I wouldn't think, Oh, look, there's me.

27:28

There's me. Right. Right.

27:30

There's me. Right. You

27:33

do star search, you get some television shows, give me a break

27:35

to mention one. You're headlining comedy

27:37

clubs,

27:38

then bigger and bigger. And

27:41

then suddenly you're getting, I assume,

27:44

although

27:45

I shouldn't assume, make some ass

27:47

out of you and me, that you start

27:49

getting talked to about being

27:52

in the pictures. In

27:54

the pictures. The movies. A

27:57

league of their own, obviously.

27:59

Well, I mean, it's like

28:02

all time classic

28:04

status. Unbelievable.

28:07

Did you get approached to do that? Yes. You

28:09

got to approach. You got to ask to do that. I was a VJ. I

28:12

became a VJ on Video Hits One,

28:14

VH1. And I

28:16

would make

28:17

little two minutes,

28:21

bits four times an hour

28:23

live on TV. So I had

28:25

to say, coming up next is Whitney Houston

28:28

from VH1 Hits One, a special

28:30

edition of a new album. And okay,

28:34

that's 30 seconds. Now you have a minute and a half left

28:36

and I'd start telling stories. Oh, you know what

28:38

happened today on the way to... And

28:40

you'd see the cameraman laugh and

28:42

the camera would literally go like this because

28:45

it was just me and two guys sitting

28:47

there making it up for hours, right? And

28:50

my agent called and said, can

28:53

you play baseball? And I said, yes. And

28:55

she was also Julia Roberts' agent. And

28:57

I said, if there's one thing I can do better than

28:59

Julia Roberts, it's this. And

29:02

so you had

29:04

to play baseball first before you

29:07

could audition. And

29:09

I played baseball very well. And

29:13

Penny knew who I was and was very, very

29:16

sisterly and

29:19

took me under her wing. And there

29:21

was times when she was calling out direction

29:24

to us, right? So she's got a bullhorn,

29:27

she's got that accent. She usually

29:29

had something in her mouth, like a piece of bacon

29:31

or a cigarette. A cigarette for sure. Right,

29:34

cigarette. And she'd be going,

29:36

okay, well, one of you girls

29:38

are right over by the fair there. Do like bend

29:41

over and get the foul ball. Come up

29:43

with a hot dog in your mouth. Who wants to do it? Nobody

29:46

understood what she meant. Everyone looked at me and

29:48

I go, I'll do it. She go, why always Rosie?

29:51

It's always Rosie. Okay, go do it,

29:53

Rosie. So that part ended

29:55

up being much bigger than

29:56

it was written because of

29:58

her generosity. and her encouraging

30:01

improvisation. So

30:04

that was a huge, huge

30:07

role to get.

30:08

And then three days in, Penny

30:10

calls me in the office and goes, tomorrow

30:13

Madonna's

30:13

gonna come in. If

30:15

she likes you and likes me, she's

30:18

gonna do the movie. Try to be funny.

30:21

I was like, no pressure. No pressure at all.

30:24

My first movie, Best Friends with the most famous woman

30:27

in the world. What's the chances

30:29

of that happening? How

30:31

was that for you? I mean, so

30:33

you're a Madonna fan.

30:35

I was a Madonna fan totally. Yeah, everyone was. Everyone

30:38

was, of course. She was

30:40

magnificent. She was and still

30:42

is, you know, one of those one names, once

30:45

a generation, Bowie and Elvis and Madonna.

30:49

Like there's no denying her

30:50

legacy. Beyonce,

30:53

exactly. Beyonce and Eminem,

30:56

if I do say so myself. But yeah,

30:59

so it changed my whole life, my

31:01

whole career. It changed every single thing,

31:04

was being cast as Madonna's best friend. And,

31:07

you know, the thing is, we had very similar childhoods with

31:10

our mothers dying when we were young and big

31:13

families. And,

31:14

you know, we really got

31:16

along right away. And

31:18

the weirdest thing was, I had just seen

31:21

her movie, Truth or Dare, the

31:22

day before Penny said to me, you're

31:24

gonna meet her tomorrow. And when

31:27

I met her, I said, you know, my mother died when

31:29

I was young too, and I was named after her

31:31

as well. And when I went to her graveside

31:33

and laid on that grave with my own name

31:36

on the tombstone, I never thought I'd meet someone

31:38

else who did that. And she was

31:40

like, that was it for us. Then we

31:42

became like, you know, blood sisters. You

31:45

know, it's hard to maintain friendships

31:47

in this business sometimes when people live all

31:49

over the world and they're super duper

31:52

megastars, like Madonna, you know, but we

31:54

have maintained a consistent

31:56

lifelong friendship for the last 30 years.

31:59

And I cannot say that. imagine what my

32:01

career would have done or become

32:03

more if it hadn't been her in that movie,

32:05

if it had been any other actress,

32:08

but she was literally the most famous

32:11

woman in the world at the time. Yeah. And

32:15

totally. And also

32:18

Tom Hanks and also Gina

32:20

Davis. Yes.

32:24

I mean this and Penny Marshall,

32:26

by the way, And John Lovett. John

32:30

Lovett's that's right.

32:32

That's right. I, I

32:35

love that. That friendship

32:37

is real. I

32:40

don't know. I don't know if that's the, that's

32:42

the boy in me, the younger man

32:45

and me, but loving that

32:47

that is the case. I think we, you

32:49

know, everyone who watches that movie wants, wants

32:52

that to be the case.

32:53

You came back

32:56

skipping ahead and, and did a cameo

32:58

on the a league of their own series

33:01

last year.

33:04

Was that fun for you? I mean, this series

33:06

deals with issue you

33:09

discussed earlier. There was a time

33:11

when things weren't talked about as

33:13

great as that movie was.

33:15

Sexuality and race were not

33:17

prominently featured. Unlike

33:19

the series.

33:21

How did it feel for you to go back one

33:24

into that world and two, to be

33:26

dealing with some of those issues

33:29

a little bit deeper? Yeah. Yeah. You

33:31

know, Abby Jacobson is such a talent

33:34

and Natasha Leon is

33:36

a close friend and she introduces

33:38

me to all these young, amazing women

33:40

who are, you know, in their thirties and producing

33:43

and directing and writing, just like Natasha is

33:45

and acting. And it's

33:47

been so great, you know, cause it keeps me

33:49

like inspired and, you know, like I

33:51

see them doing so well. I'm like, Oh my God,

33:54

that's Aubrey plus. I know

33:55

her through Natasha. So,

33:58

uh, I met with her. And

34:00

we had dinner and me,

34:02

Abby, and Natasha, and Abby was

34:04

telling me that she had met with Penny and she had

34:07

the rights and she was thinking of doing

34:09

this. And I said, oh my

34:11

God,

34:11

if you could, it would be fantastic.

34:14

What a wonderful way that

34:17

the new generation of young women

34:19

athletes wanted to be represented.

34:22

She

34:23

wanted to put in all the realities

34:26

that we face in our world today about

34:28

all this. Anti-gay

34:30

rhetoric, all of these bills that are being passed

34:33

against trans people. And

34:36

what's currently political is very

34:38

relevant and it was then too. It's

34:40

just we've only now

34:42

caught up to almost telling

34:44

the truth. We don't wanna teach critical race theory.

34:48

God forbid we should actually teach

34:50

what we have done as a nation

34:52

and learned from and no longer are as horrible

34:54

as we were.com. I

34:58

mean, I don't know. I was

35:00

so moved that she asked me to do it. I said,

35:02

of course, I went down to

35:04

Pittsburgh and walked in and

35:06

they were all in our uniforms. Like

35:09

it was so weird. I'm like, this,

35:11

like I'm looking around for Biddy Shram and Renee

35:13

Coleman, all the women I did it with. Like I'm

35:16

going, how did this happen? And

35:18

I love the way they cast it as like homages

35:20

to people, like the girl

35:22

who's chubby and beautiful and

35:25

funny and wise cracking. They have a Madonna archetype.

35:28

They have a Biddy archetype. Like I

35:30

loved how they did that and they did it beautifully.

35:33

And I was so

35:34

proud of what that show

35:36

stood for.

35:37

The nuances, the inclusion,

35:39

the historical perspective,

35:43

the sociological relevance. It

35:45

just really, I thought it was an excellent

35:48

piece of art. And I'm very disappointed

35:51

that Amazon only gave them four

35:53

episodes. They got to pick

35:56

up for four episodes. And people

35:58

love that series.

35:59

I can tell you right now it's gonna be a fan

36:02

uproar because four is not enough

36:04

for that show the girls

36:06

were wonderful the young women and

36:08

I thought it was

36:11

an important role to play of this,

36:13

you know lesbian woman who based on

36:15

a real character real woman who

36:17

had lived in and Presented as

36:19

a man

36:20

mostly, you know in a time when that

36:23

would get you beat up by the cops and

36:25

I thought it was

36:27

a very Tastefully

36:29

done gay bashing

36:32

that happens every day and

36:35

that's been happening in our country, you know for

36:37

too many years and It

36:40

was very trauma trauma Like

36:44

I had a trauma response because even

36:47

though your brain tells you these

36:49

are cops these are not cops These are

36:51

actors and you just had lunch with them That

36:53

one has a kid and that when someone's

36:55

calling you names and hitting you

36:57

with a baton now It's

37:00

of course a prop one Your

37:02

body I think doesn't realize oh my

37:04

god This is fake, you know when you're

37:06

being thrown against a like or

37:09

I'm not a good enough actor to to separate

37:11

it But it was very traumatic

37:14

to film very emotional to film But

37:16

I was very proud of it and I'm so happy that they

37:18

asked me. Yeah, was it weird?

37:21

I mean you talked about seeing them in your

37:24

in your your uniform

37:26

Yeah, no our uniforms. I mean, this is what

37:29

this is 20 25 year 30, you know later Yes,

37:33

I mean what a gift to be able to

37:35

go back

37:37

Yes and experience that again and

37:39

to see also the

37:41

excitement of this very young very

37:44

gifted group of actors

37:46

and actresses Mm-hmm going

37:48

back, you know, we talked

37:51

about Madonna. There's Tom Hanks. There's

37:53

Gina Davis Penny Marshall

37:55

for her to be the director of

37:58

of your first film

38:00

as well. I mean, a legend as

38:02

an actor originally and now

38:05

as a director, do

38:07

you feel like she helped

38:09

you tremendously? Yeah,

38:11

tremendously.

38:13

Tremendously. I can't even articulate

38:16

it. She was my first director

38:18

and she

38:20

featured me prominently in the movie

38:23

that she didn't have to do that. She

38:25

took me on every talk show she went on because

38:27

she would usually get nervous and she wanted

38:29

someone to kibitz with her and we kibitzed

38:32

very good together and then

38:33

we started doing those Kmart commercials,

38:35

you know, which we made a lot of money

38:38

on. I forgot the Kmart

38:41

commercials, of course.

38:43

Me and Penny and sometimes, you

38:45

know, she would get there and she was in no shape

38:47

to be awake and

38:50

she'd had a few too many the night before and

38:52

so David Steinberg, who directed

38:54

them and I, would rewrite the

38:56

script and have Penny dressed

38:58

as an elf asleep on the toy shelf

39:01

and then I would just talk about what Kmart

39:04

wanted us to say. She

39:06

indulged a little bit, Penny Marshall,

39:09

and

39:11

she got sick at the end. It was very

39:13

sad and

39:14

when she lost Carrie, I think it was

39:17

devastating. They

39:18

were like glued at the hip, you know,

39:21

for a very long time and

39:23

I think, you know, she got lonely and towards

39:26

the end, had

39:28

gained a tremendous amount of weight from her cancer

39:30

treatments and was in a wheelchair

39:33

and, you know, was very unhappy,

39:36

you know, and tragic.

39:38

And I was in shock even though I knew

39:40

that

39:42

she wasn't well, I wasn't

39:44

expecting to get the

39:45

phone call that she had passed, you know. I

39:47

mean, she took me to Laker Games,

39:50

she took me to every basketball,

39:52

football, any sport. She was a hoarder

39:55

collector. Like she had 1,500 quilts

39:57

in her house.

41:59

And she goes, I'd

42:02

like you

42:02

to come on a playing part. We

42:04

got so much shit, I don't know if there's gonna be

42:06

a seat. And surely when I got

42:08

on it, it was like Santa's workshop.

42:11

She took everything, it was right before Christmas.

42:14

And

42:14

she's like, I got everybody what they made

42:16

for Christmas from Kmart. Oh

42:18

my gosh, that is amazing.

42:21

Those were legendary, those commercials.

42:23

I mean, I don't remember commercials,

42:26

but I remember those commercials. Yes. Totally

42:29

forgotten. So prior

42:32

to 96,

42:33

you also do

42:35

Sleepless in Seattle. Now, is that a connection

42:37

to knowing Mr. Hanks or is that totally

42:39

separate?

42:40

That was Nora Efron. And

42:43

her son, Jake, who is a wonderful

42:45

gay man that I've known since he was

42:47

a baby, he

42:49

loved Madonna.

42:50

In a way that I can't even.

42:53

So I went to Nora's house and I

42:55

read for her movie, Sleepless

42:57

in Seattle, and she went and got new pages

42:59

off the printer and had me read

43:02

those that they had just finished. And

43:04

then I talked a little bit about what I knew about

43:06

her, which I knew a lot. And

43:09

she was kind of charmed, I think. And

43:11

she mentioned at dinner, oh,

43:13

I interviewed this girl or auditioned

43:15

this girl, Rosie O'Donnell, and Jacob went,

43:17

mom, you have to hire her.

43:18

She's about to come out in this baseball movie and she

43:21

plays Madonna's best friend. And she's so great.

43:24

And Nora Efron gave me that job. And

43:26

then got

43:27

me an apartment

43:29

in the Appthorpe. And I lived

43:30

there with her and her husband, Nick, and her kids

43:33

for a big chunk of time in New York City.

43:36

Wow.

43:41

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44:19

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44:21

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44:23

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44:26

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45:01

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45:03

free this week into your Xfinity Voice

45:05

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46:12

In 96, you decide to

46:15

change careers again. Yes,

46:17

if you're Broadway actress, if you're

46:20

a standup comedian, you're a movie

46:22

star. Now

46:24

you decide to launch,

46:26

begin the Rosie O'Donnell show, talk

46:28

to me a little bit about how that happened. Is this something

46:31

you want? You say this is what I want

46:34

or did this kind of opportunity presented

46:36

to you? What happened was Kathy

46:39

Lee Gifford was always saying at

46:41

this time, and it was a very popular morning

46:43

show, Aaron Regis,

46:44

that she was leaving. She was, you know, she didn't like

46:46

the paparazzi and they did

46:49

said things about her husband

46:50

and she didn't like any

46:52

of it. And she was quitting. So I

46:55

had Parker,

46:56

my first child in June of 95.

47:01

And I did Harriet the spy

47:03

six months later. I did not have

47:05

a nanny because I never knew anyone who

47:07

had a nanny.

47:08

So I had the baby

47:10

with me for the first six months

47:12

and I bring my cleaning lady with

47:14

me to the movie set in Toronto

47:17

so she can watch him while I go do this

47:19

movie.

47:20

And I came back from work one

47:22

day late, you know, late hours, hard,

47:24

hard movie schedules and he

47:27

wouldn't come to me. She was holding

47:29

him and I put out my arms and he wouldn't

47:31

come to me. And I called my agent and

47:33

said, I want a job that I could stay home in

47:36

New York, that he can be raised with his cousins,

47:38

that I can have a life.

47:40

And I don't want to go away

47:43

from my family in life for months at a

47:45

time and live in a hotel. I did

47:47

it. I don't think I can ask

47:48

for more than the number one movie,

47:51

Three Summers in a Row I was in. I

47:53

don't know who wants more, but they're greedy if they

47:55

do. You know, shame on them because

47:57

that was pretty astounding.

47:59

And then

48:02

they said, well, Kathie Lee Gifford is leaving, we're

48:04

gonna put your name in. And I said, fantastic. Well,

48:07

Kathie Lee decided to stay,

48:09

but

48:10

they had got such a good reaction when

48:12

they went and focus grouped it

48:14

that

48:14

they said, let's do your own show.

48:17

And I said, well,

48:19

okay, I'm

48:20

gonna do it like Merv Griffin

48:23

and Mike Douglas. And they go,

48:25

well,

48:26

you know, is it gonna be, I said, no, it's gonna be exactly

48:29

Merv, nobody gets hurt. Celebrities come out,

48:31

we have fun, we laugh, we might sing an Irish

48:33

song.

48:34

We play games and nobody gets hurt. And

48:37

at

48:38

the time, Geraldo was being beat up

48:40

and Jenny Jones had a death with one

48:42

of the guests because he was murdered by the other

48:44

guests. And, you know, people were being

48:47

bloodied. It was like a horrible time

48:49

for daytime.

48:49

And so when I came on,

48:51

it was like a breath of fresh air. And then,

48:54

you know, they call me the queen of nice, which I

48:56

knew was gonna bite me in the ass and definitely

48:58

did because nobody really is the queen of nice. If

49:01

you had seen my stand up, you never would

49:02

have called me that because I went

49:04

after Woody Allen, I went after societal

49:07

ills. I, you know, I used my

49:10

voice loudly and wielded

49:12

it, you know, powerfully in certain

49:14

parts of my life and career and felt

49:17

like you have to, that is what's asked

49:19

of you. If you have access to a microphone,

49:21

you better use it

49:23

for a cause other than just yourself, right?

49:26

Anyway, I said, I

49:28

want the Oprah deal.

49:31

And at the time, nobody was paid

49:33

to do a pilot, right?

49:36

But they paid me $5 million upfront

49:38

because I was coming off all these movies and

49:41

I had, you know, made a

49:43

lot of money.

49:44

And then I had ownership and back end

49:46

like Oprah.

49:47

And I thought, well, this baby that

49:50

I'm doing

49:50

this for will be going into

49:53

kindergarten in four years. So

49:55

I'll make a four year deal. And then

49:57

I'll leave when he gets to kindergarten. Now,

50:00

my mother had died at 39, so

50:03

I always knew I wanted to retire by 40.

50:06

That was totally in my brain.

50:08

I worked very hard up

50:10

until I was 40 in

50:12

order to get that. One of the things was

50:14

the talk show. Now, it was a huge hit

50:17

instantly.

50:19

It threw me into a level

50:21

of fame that I don't think anyone is ever ready

50:23

for.

50:24

People think they

50:26

want it and they crave it, but how you maintain

50:29

your equilibrium in the middle

50:31

of a tsunami,

50:32

all you try to do is get some air.

50:36

You can't get to a stable place. You just got to

50:38

stick your head above the water and breathe.

50:41

It caused a lot of anxiety for me,

50:43

a

50:44

lot of depression, a lot of panic,

50:47

a lot of feeling responsible

50:49

for the things that go

50:51

wrong like April 20th, 1999 Columbine.

50:58

I could not believe

51:00

that in our country,

51:03

children were killing other children in schools

51:05

while the cops stood outside.

51:08

I couldn't.

51:10

As a mother, I felt a duty to speak

51:12

up. I

51:14

had two small children. I

51:16

thought, this has to stop. I'm going to go

51:19

speak out against the NRA. I

51:22

did. I also had a breakdown at that time.

51:24

It's what I think we technically would call that, where

51:27

I couldn't sleep and I would wake up and think that

51:29

my children were in the hallway and there was

51:31

a gunman in the house. It was the

51:33

first time I was put on medication. I

51:35

thank God every day that I was because

51:38

I'm still here in

51:39

one piece and having

51:42

a great happy life at 61. Thank

51:45

God everybody finds the way that

51:48

works for them. My

51:50

clinical depression and PTSD

51:53

and trauma tattoo

51:56

is pretty hard to

51:59

deal with sometimes.

51:59

But I'm on it, you know, I have

52:02

a great therapist. I have a great psychopharmacologist.

52:05

I'm

52:05

totally in charge of keeping myself

52:08

balanced and happy. That's great. And

52:11

I've been able to do it. Yeah, been

52:13

able to do it. But so I took

52:15

the show. I don't know how I got here from the show, but I took

52:17

the show and it became

52:20

a huge hit really, really quickly. And

52:22

then when it was a huge hit, I signed

52:24

on for two more years. So that would make it six years.

52:27

So he would be like in going

52:29

into second grade. So I thought that's

52:31

still young enough, but that's

52:34

what I did.

52:34

And so when I left, he was seven. When

52:37

I was done with the show, he was seven.

52:38

You talked about the label of

52:41

Queen of Nice is what your

52:43

label was yet. You started

52:46

your comedy career and through a lot

52:48

of your stan- I mean, you started your comedy career making

52:50

fun of your teachers. Let's be clear. That's the

52:52

story that I heard. Yes. And then

52:55

making fun of your classmates at

52:57

your first stand up, because

53:00

you don't have any material. Like was

53:02

that label for you difficult?

53:04

I just knew

53:07

right away. That's not really the right word,

53:09

you know, but comparatively at the time

53:12

to what was on daytime TV,

53:14

who's your daddy? You know, Maury

53:16

Povich, like it was crazy.

53:18

It was insane. People were having fist

53:20

fights. It was crazy. And

53:23

I wanted a safe place that my kids and I

53:25

could watch like my Nana and I watched Dinah

53:28

and Merv and Mike. I wanted

53:30

a multi-generational show like that.

53:32

And you know, for

53:34

that show, I was

53:36

the Queen of Nice at that time. But

53:39

whenever that's your moniker, you know,

53:41

people

53:41

are very happy to try

53:44

to pull you off of it. You know, do

53:48

you like that form

53:52

of entertainment? Like

53:54

I used to. Okay. I

53:57

used to. I used to love it. In

53:59

fact, when. they offered me my own show. I

54:01

knew exactly how to do it because I loved

54:04

and studied them so much all during the 70s

54:06

and 80s.

54:07

So by the time they asked me to do it, I was an expert

54:09

at it. I had done my 100,000 hours.

54:11

But

54:13

I found during my own

54:16

show, this was happening. You would only

54:18

get someone when they

54:20

were doing press for a certain movie.

54:23

They had specific stories because they're

54:25

not comedians.

54:26

And you had to

54:29

prompt them with the story that

54:31

someone produced talking to them and then told

54:33

you about, and you have to act surprised

54:36

at it. It's

54:38

hard to be authentic when those are

54:40

the rules.

54:42

And the more and more we became a celebrity

54:44

obsessed culture, the more social

54:46

media platforms were added to our

54:48

reality, the

54:51

harder it got to find

54:54

authentic ways

54:56

to talk to people as entertainment.

54:57

I think what

55:00

David Letterman has done is amazing.

55:03

He conquered that field

55:05

and then some. He

55:07

created a whole new generation

55:10

of kind of deadbeat, quirky,

55:12

weird comedy. And he's

55:14

now doing

55:17

these beautiful, produced sit

55:19

down interviews with

55:21

people that he wants to talk to. And

55:23

it's completely compelling

55:26

because his intent is

55:28

pure. He's not trying to make

55:30

a lot of money and I hope he

55:32

made a big deal. I'm sure he did. He's David Letterman,

55:34

but he's not sitting there going, I'm going

55:37

to do this for the money. He's going to do it as

55:40

a creative outlet to keep your brain

55:42

agile and your artistic

55:45

nature exercised.

55:47

So I loved the art form back

55:50

then. I would

55:52

love to see what it can become. Now Zach

55:54

Galifianakis between two ferns,

55:57

come on, that's a pretty good take on a talk show, right?

55:59

There's ways to

56:01

do it and

56:03

I'm just not so sure

56:05

that

56:06

the show would be able to be as popular

56:09

today because we're such a divisive

56:12

nation. We're really cut

56:14

in half.

56:15

You watch TV in France

56:17

and Israel and everyone

56:21

is on the verge of authoritarianism

56:24

pouncing and grabbing their country.

56:27

We're not the only ones. We're

56:29

not the only ones but we're all in crisis and

56:31

it's been for a while.

56:34

It's really hard to

56:36

stay balanced. We

56:38

had Rory Kennedy on yesterday and

56:40

today I guess it's

56:42

on. I'm sorry, I don't know. We dropped it. I

56:45

don't know what that means. She was saying

56:47

that scientists are saying that

56:49

there's maybe 10 more years and then

56:52

there is complete breakdown and failure

56:54

of the world because of climate change.

56:58

These are pretty meta concepts but

57:00

we have to get together. I don't know

57:02

if a show like mine, if I would be

57:04

allowed to be as loud as I want to be

57:06

on

57:07

TikTok and

57:09

whatever state my views.

57:11

It doesn't

57:14

seem that it would fit in today's

57:17

culture but I don't know. I think when

57:19

you watch it,

57:20

there's an innocence, there's a nostalgia,

57:22

there's a feeling of new babies

57:24

being born and life

57:26

blossoming. It's

57:28

really wonderful. I watch it back

57:31

and I get choked up sometimes and I

57:33

go, wow, look at that.

57:36

My kid will find a clip

57:38

on something and Blakey will send it to me. He's

57:40

like, mom,

57:42

you never told me you met him. I

57:45

met everybody. I met everybody. Everybody

57:47

there was to meet. I met him.

57:53

It's awesome. It's

57:56

so crazy

57:58

when you think back.

57:59

have all of this juice coming off, as you

58:02

say, the number one movie

58:04

for three years in a row. Three

58:06

summers in a row. Yeah. Three. Yeah. Three

58:08

summers in a row. Right. And you

58:11

create a show that you want to do that's different

58:13

than what's happening there. It becomes a huge

58:15

success.

58:17

And you're still

58:19

feeling the anxiety

58:23

in part, I'm sure, because

58:25

of all of the attention being focused

58:27

on you at this time. I mean, you truly

58:30

are

58:31

one of the biggest stars in the country

58:33

that everybody is looking

58:35

to and, you

58:37

know, diving into and all

58:39

of that.

58:40

What do you see now as the

58:42

show's legacy after

58:45

it's now done? I

58:47

would say it was the time of

58:50

the legacy of the show, I think is

58:53

love, because I think the reason

58:56

that I was successful is because

58:58

I really loved Florence Henderson. And

59:01

when I had her on the show, it

59:03

was trippy to think that I would dream that she

59:05

would be my mom

59:07

and that he or she is sitting next to me and

59:09

being motherly. Florence Henderson

59:12

would come over to my house and play

59:14

with Parker and these

59:16

older women who knew that I was

59:18

a motherless child, motherless child, you

59:21

know, and stepped

59:24

in in a magical way almost,

59:27

you know, there was something magical about

59:29

the show. It was pure and it was kind

59:31

and

59:32

it was fun.

59:36

I think we had fun, you know, and

59:39

everybody

59:41

wanted to be in the audience. It was a tiny little studio

59:43

with like 200 seats

59:46

and everybody wanted to be there. And

59:48

then when I did Tickle Me Elmo, I remember

59:50

getting a call from Aaron Spelling.

59:53

Aaron Spelling, like one

59:55

of the richest men in the world,

59:58

calls me to ask me if I had four.

59:59

tickled me Elmos for his grandchildren.

1:00:03

I was like, okay, sir, well, listen, thank

1:00:06

you for Dynasty. I enjoyed that

1:00:08

so much when I was a child. Let me get

1:00:10

back to you. And then I go to my assistant, find

1:00:12

four fucking Elmos for Aaron Spelling. Like,

1:00:15

and then I think, whose life is this? This is a crazy

1:00:17

life, you know?

1:00:19

It's a crazy life. And I never really

1:00:21

believed at the height of like, when, oh, you're

1:00:23

the most influential, you're on this list, you're

1:00:26

on that list. You know,

1:00:27

I usually didn't go to the party, you

1:00:29

know? Like, I didn't always

1:00:31

believe it. You know what I mean? Like,

1:00:34

I feel like I have a healthy amount

1:00:37

of reality in

1:00:40

my show business. I don't know. Is

1:00:42

that weird to say?

1:00:43

No, I think I get it. But

1:00:46

you must be aware, or you should be

1:00:48

aware of the

1:00:51

countless doors that you opened

1:00:54

in your career for other

1:00:57

people in

1:00:58

the LGBTQ community. You

1:01:01

opened up a lot of doors

1:01:03

during this time and after, for

1:01:06

people that came after you, do you,

1:01:08

are you proud of that?

1:01:10

Do you acknowledge that to yourself? Yes, I

1:01:12

definitely do. And I, you know,

1:01:15

I feel that

1:01:17

some people are marathon runners and

1:01:20

some people are sprinters. And I

1:01:22

knew that I'm

1:01:23

hardly a jogger, right? I

1:01:25

work very, very hard, but I'm tired, you know? Like,

1:01:28

I wanna lay down and watch something. I

1:01:31

don't have the kind of energy

1:01:34

that I did back then. And it was a very

1:01:36

large amount of work. But

1:01:39

I do realize that. And you know, I was

1:01:42

at Nobu yesterday. And

1:01:44

this beautiful- It's so funny, because you're so not

1:01:46

this. I'm gonna totally interrupt you. That

1:01:49

is like the most like-

1:01:50

Hollywood thing to say. Hollywood dropping.

1:01:53

I know, I know. I was at Nobu yesterday.

1:01:56

Anyway, sorry. I've never seen it. You're like the opposite

1:01:58

of that. So I had to at least-

1:01:59

Please call it out. You have to. I've never seen

1:02:02

a Kardashian there. I just want you to know. I go

1:02:04

there like three or four times a week. It's almost like

1:02:06

my neighborhood restaurant.

1:02:08

I'm right on the beach in Malibu.

1:02:10

And right next door is Nobu.

1:02:12

I just ate at Nobu

1:02:14

two nights in a row in Vegas. No,

1:02:17

if I could eat it every day, two nights

1:02:19

in a row, yes. I would eat it every day.

1:02:21

But can I read this to you, what this

1:02:23

note that happened at Nobu? Yes. So

1:02:25

I see this family sitting in front

1:02:27

of me and they're very young. I thought at first

1:02:29

they were teenagers, but very kind of good

1:02:32

looking. Like,

1:02:33

he looked like an artist to me. Like

1:02:35

I thought he had real funky clothes.

1:02:37

I bet he's a fashion designer. I thought to myself,

1:02:39

and what a pretty wife. And

1:02:42

I go to get the check

1:02:44

and the guy says, oh, it's paid

1:02:46

for. I said, what do you

1:02:48

mean?

1:02:48

He said, well, there's a note for

1:02:51

you.

1:02:52

And apparently this young man

1:02:54

paid my bill and left with, and never

1:02:57

bothered me, but he left me this note.

1:02:59

Rosie, thank you for being you and

1:03:01

setting an example of what it means

1:03:04

to be yourself in the face of adversity

1:03:06

and negativity.

1:03:07

Because of your strength and bravery, a

1:03:10

little boy found the light in a childhood

1:03:12

riddled with violence, drug abuse, and

1:03:15

depression.

1:03:16

And now I'm one of the biggest

1:03:18

rappers in the whole world.

1:03:20

Thank you with unconditional

1:03:23

reverence,

1:03:24

logic.

1:03:26

Bobby Hall. Now I

1:03:28

had no idea who logic was, but

1:03:31

I felt like this is the legacy

1:03:33

of the show. That there

1:03:35

are millions of artists

1:03:37

and they

1:03:39

were inspired and they knew to go

1:03:41

there and they knew what we were selling was

1:03:43

membership in this

1:03:45

world. And

1:03:48

I was so blown away.

1:03:51

I go on to my son who's 23 and

1:03:53

my daughter who's 20.

1:03:55

And I send the copy of

1:03:57

it to both of them. And they both call

1:03:59

me. screaming on the phone,

1:04:02

screaming, I am going

1:04:04

to use this for the next three

1:04:06

years. Like Blake was like, do you want to keep it? I'm

1:04:09

like, yes, I'm keeping it. He's like, I want

1:04:11

to show my friends. I'm like, I'll send you a picture

1:04:13

of it, you know? But

1:04:15

I was so, I was so moved.

1:04:18

That is, you know

1:04:20

what? I'm so, that makes

1:04:22

me so happy for you.

1:04:25

That makes me so happy that that happened

1:04:28

for you. Obviously for logic

1:04:31

as well, that he was able

1:04:33

to come out of a difficult situation in part

1:04:35

because of you, but for him to tell you that.

1:04:38

And to buy me a very expensive

1:04:41

dinner as well, a lunch with

1:04:43

a friend of mine who was, I knew was a comedian years

1:04:45

ago.

1:04:46

And I hadn't seen in 40 years, we had

1:04:48

a

1:04:49

lunch and talked about doing standup in the old days,

1:04:51

but

1:04:52

he did. And I thought, you know,

1:04:54

and I think to myself, every time

1:04:56

that somebody writes

1:04:57

to me or stops me or tells me, you

1:05:00

know, is a gift. It's

1:05:02

a gift. And

1:05:05

my children make fun of me because of the difference

1:05:07

between when they were little

1:05:09

and we used to go to the mall and going to the mall

1:05:11

now. And, or we'd go to a baseball

1:05:13

game or a football game and

1:05:16

my sons would totally rag

1:05:18

on me like, mom, nobody recognized you

1:05:20

at the whole game. You know,

1:05:22

I'm like, well, honey, mommy's lost it. I

1:05:24

got gray hair now and I don't know what to tell

1:05:27

you. Nobody knew you.

1:05:29

Well,

1:05:33

you start going to games again,

1:05:35

by the way, because you're, you

1:05:37

are hot. I am. I didn't

1:05:40

know that.

1:05:41

You are, you are absolutely,

1:05:43

you come back, you do

1:05:46

smilf. Yeah.

1:05:47

Then

1:05:50

your friend, as you said, Natasha Leon, you

1:05:52

get cast in season two of Russian

1:05:54

Doll.

1:05:56

And now onward

1:05:58

with Rosie O'Donnell. Uh,

1:06:01

for those who haven't heard it yet, this is Rosie's

1:06:03

brand new podcast where she

1:06:06

gets to have real conversations

1:06:09

with incredible people, right? Uh,

1:06:13

what has it been like for you, uh,

1:06:15

diving into the podcast world?

1:06:17

You know, I'm, I'm just learning

1:06:20

how to do it though, Brian. I, I thought

1:06:23

it would be more like the radio show and it's

1:06:25

very different than a radio show. Yeah. You

1:06:27

know, I had a thing on Sirius for a while

1:06:30

and yeah, it was four friends of mine

1:06:32

and we all just kind of did like what Howard does

1:06:34

in the morning, you know, we

1:06:36

could talk to a celebrity and

1:06:38

or wherever we could get. And we just,

1:06:40

that was the one to mimic. If you're going to mimic

1:06:42

a successful radio

1:06:44

pro person, it's going to be Howard Stern, right?

1:06:47

So, but I did think, I

1:06:49

did think I'm going

1:06:51

to do something creative that

1:06:53

I can stay home because

1:06:54

I have a daughter who has autism, who is

1:06:57

a 10 years old. And I want

1:06:59

to be, I have

1:07:00

to be

1:07:02

more accessible to her, especially

1:07:04

now that

1:07:04

she's getting to be a preteen. And you

1:07:07

know, they've, what I've heard from

1:07:09

doctors and experts and

1:07:10

people I use to help guide her is

1:07:13

the teen years are quite difficult usually

1:07:15

because, you know, hormones are going everywhere and

1:07:18

emotions are sometimes confusing

1:07:20

for autistic kids. And

1:07:22

so I wanted to do something I could do like

1:07:24

this, right? From my home. I hear her playing her

1:07:27

iPad in the background, right? So

1:07:29

it's, it works for me and it's

1:07:31

artistically fulfilling because I

1:07:33

get to talk to people like you or interesting

1:07:36

and have conversations that matter

1:07:38

and mean things without, you

1:07:39

know, a timeframe of you have to get off

1:07:42

at this many minutes.

1:07:42

I mean, that's what I always talked about, not being on

1:07:45

such a strict schedule. You know, the

1:07:47

idea of, you know, a

1:07:50

couple of weeks ago, I did the today show,

1:07:52

right? And it's like, I, all

1:07:54

I hear is

1:07:56

you have 35 seconds, you have 15 seconds.

1:08:00

Giggle, giggle, giggle,

1:08:01

one joke and we're done.

1:08:05

Being able to really talk to people, are

1:08:07

you having a good time with him? Very

1:08:09

good time, but I really am just

1:08:11

learning, like I have to admit that I never really

1:08:14

listened to any besides,

1:08:16

I've seen Joe Rogan a lot because I knew him as

1:08:19

a comic and I like

1:08:21

his podcast, I think it's very interesting. I

1:08:24

listen every day during the Trump administration

1:08:26

to Pod Save America

1:08:28

and those guys saved me and they helped me

1:08:30

navigate my emotions through the trauma. And

1:08:34

aside from that, I

1:08:36

haven't really known

1:08:38

the art form for very long. And

1:08:41

in hindsight, I think it was kind of

1:08:44

lazy of me. I should have consumed it more

1:08:47

before I started trying to do it. But

1:08:49

Lori and I, who's been a producer

1:08:52

with me since my TV show, she did all the music

1:08:54

on my TV show,

1:08:55

we put it together and

1:08:57

we got something that has a strong

1:09:00

voice and now the other parts we're gonna fix,

1:09:02

like where to put the commercials and how

1:09:05

many commercials and should it be longer?

1:09:07

Where should it be? Those things that I have

1:09:09

no knowledge about.

1:09:11

Yeah, well, look, you have

1:09:13

absolutely crushed everything

1:09:18

that you've done so far.

1:09:21

And you're such

1:09:23

a delight

1:09:24

to talk to. I have long admired

1:09:27

you and your career and all

1:09:29

that you've accomplished and done for

1:09:31

people.

1:09:34

Yeah, I wish you nothing but the best. Thank

1:09:36

you so much. And the same thing for you.

1:09:39

You've made me laugh so many times. My kid

1:09:42

does all the impressions and knows all the lines.

1:09:44

And it's a beautiful legacy to have been so funny

1:09:49

for so long on such a great show.

1:09:51

Those people like Mary

1:09:53

Charlemagne for me, Valerie Harper,

1:09:55

Vivian Vance, they're factors

1:09:58

in my childhood.

1:09:59

And you are that for so many.

1:10:01

Well, thank you. Thank you so much.

1:10:04

I can't wait for us to do it again. This is part one.

1:10:06

That's part one. I'll be back for part two. This

1:10:09

is part one. All right.

1:10:10

Thank you, Brian.

1:10:11

Thank you so much. Rosie,

1:10:15

thank you so much

1:10:19

for joining me. That

1:10:26

was a pleasure. I cannot wait to

1:10:28

check out your new podcast Onward

1:10:31

with Rosie O'Donnell. And truly, I

1:10:33

cannot wait for part two. Listeners,

1:10:37

I'll see you next week for another episode with

1:10:39

another fantastic guest who's thankfully

1:10:43

not dead yet. Boy,

1:10:46

you know, I love doing this podcast. I really,

1:10:48

really do. Thank you for listening.

1:10:51

Have a great week.

1:10:53

And yeah, I'll see you next

1:10:55

week.

1:11:06

Off the Beat is hosted and executive

1:11:08

produced by me, Brian Baumgartner,

1:11:10

alongside our executive producer, Ling

1:11:12

Li. Our senior producer is Diego

1:11:15

Tapia. Our producers are Liz Hayes,

1:11:17

Hannah Harris and Emily Carr. Our

1:11:20

talent producer is Ryan Papazackery

1:11:22

and our intern is Sammy Katz. Our

1:11:25

theme song, Bubble and Squeak, performed

1:11:28

by the one and only Creed

1:11:30

Bratton.

1:11:49

Support for this podcast and the following message

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