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The Season with Peter Scheger is a production

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of the NFL in partnership with iHeartRadio.

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What's Up, everybody, This is Peter Schreger and you're

0:19

listening to the Season with Peter Schreger.

0:21

We are in the middle of July

0:24

right now, which is the NFL's quote unquote

0:26

slow season. But if you follow

0:28

the league and you love the game like I do, you know

0:30

there is no days off when it comes to

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an NFL season. This podcast has

0:34

been a blast this summer because we're getting coaches and

0:36

gms in their homes and

0:38

we're getting them at their vacation houses

0:41

that we're getting them maybe a little bit off

0:43

the clock, which means they can be a little looser

0:45

than they might usually be. I say

0:47

this with great confidence.

0:50

I don't think I've enjoyed a podcast more

0:53

than the conversation you're about to listen to since

0:55

we've begun doing this thing back last

0:57

September. This is Brad Holmes,

0:59

the manager of the Detroit Lions, with

1:06

no further ado, really excited about

1:08

this guest and trying to get him on for a couple of weeks

1:10

and we got him, and I'm excited, and it's right

1:12

before the start of training camp, so I'm

1:15

sure he's fresh as a daisy. This is the Detroit

1:17

Lions general manager, mister Brad Holmes.

1:20

Brad, what's up man?

1:21

How you doing man? Thanks for having me. Glad we'll

1:23

be able to finally get this together. I hope

1:25

you to think I.

1:26

Waste No, you know what, it's

1:28

funny because this is like the off

1:30

season, but it's also the only time that people

1:32

can get away. So it's yes, I'd

1:34

love to do your podcast, but I also have a family. I'd

1:36

like to see you.

1:40

Yeah, no, it's and you know, really

1:42

like during the season. I know we started

1:44

talking about during the season, and the

1:46

season is probably the most like normal,

1:48

lies regimented part of

1:50

the whole year because you kind of know what's

1:52

gonna happen. But

1:55

when the season ends, that's when it gets like crazy

1:58

crazy and then we actually

2:00

we do quite a bit after the draft

2:03

preparing for the upcoming year. So but

2:05

you know, fresh off vacation, Uh, you

2:07

know, got a good little week at home and uh, it's

2:09

a great time. Man.

2:10

I think that's a good segue. So take us

2:12

through, and you are a general manager, what is the schedule

2:15

because I think most people think, all right,

2:17

draft and then kick your feet up and then

2:19

free agency, you know, but it's

2:22

really year round.

2:23

Yeah, it really is. Man. You

2:26

know, you have a training camp and you go through

2:28

that and you you know a lot of rods reduction

2:30

stuff. But after training camp,

2:33

you know, I say, the season. Everybody

2:35

thinks like the season is like that's the basest part, because

2:37

it's the football season. But from

2:40

a GM standpoint, it's actually probably

2:42

the most regiment a part because you pretty much know, okay, you

2:44

got game day. Game day is going to bring all your stress

2:47

and emotions. And but after game

2:49

day, Mondays you're dealing with you

2:51

know, injuries and medical stuff.

2:53

And then Tuesdays you're dealing with you

2:55

know, roster management and

2:58

getting all your moves done. And then the week

3:00

starts and actually

3:02

we actually kind of devote a lot of that time

3:05

for draft prep actually, so

3:07

because you kind of have the time. Yeah,

3:09

and then you kind of just operate normally. But

3:11

then after the season ends, and that's

3:13

when you're like full throttle,

3:16

like you know, you're head straight into

3:19

you're balancing free agency and draft

3:21

at the same time, and then you're

3:23

going all the way up to free agency so that's

3:26

probably the most hectic time. It's

3:28

pre free agency because you're kind of doing

3:30

both, and then once free

3:32

agency kind of like that second or third

3:35

wave kind of hits, you can start

3:37

downing more so towards straight

3:39

draft, and then you know, it's kind of just

3:42

full throttle through the draft.

3:44

Because we're heading into the twenty twenty three season

3:46

and we're still just a couple of months removed. I want to go back

3:48

to that first round for you guys in the Detroit Lions.

3:50

We're going to get into your story in a second, but I

3:53

feel like just the excitement

3:55

about the Lions is real, and you've read all the

3:57

headlines. I'm sure you've blocked as many headlin

4:00

you can't out about how this is like the hot team in the

4:02

NFC. But the draft, you know, right

4:04

in the days leading up to the draft,

4:07

I had a couple of birdies in my ear man, like I

4:09

think Jamiir Gibbs might go earlier

4:12

than the mock drafts are saying, and another one

4:14

saying he might go before be Jon Robinson.

4:17

Sure enough, you guys, you

4:19

get him early top fifteen, and

4:22

everyone around like, oh, I want a shot. But like people

4:24

that I was tart to say, that's not such a shock. That's

4:26

about where he was slated. When

4:29

did you fall in love with Jamir Gives and what did

4:31

you love about him?

4:32

Man, it's funny that she said you heard that about

4:35

him going at early because I was

4:37

sitting here thinking, uh, I

4:39

was like, nobody's going to do this.

4:43

And then and then after we

4:45

picked them, and I heard all these other gentlemen.

4:47

Oh yeah, yeah, that's what we wanted.

4:48

Yeah, yeah, right, I'm glad

4:50

you picked them. He wasn't gonna make

4:52

it. But no, I

4:55

first fell in love with him. Obviously, I didn't

4:57

know about him that much. Like it's at

4:59

Georgia Tech year before. So I

5:01

went to Texas Alabama game earlier

5:03

in the year and I kind of got tipped

5:05

off about him, like right before the start of the game. Man,

5:08

I was like, okay, and I saw his body type

5:10

and like this I was intriguing. And then I kind

5:12

of saw what he was doing in both

5:14

phases. Yeah, I mean he can run

5:16

it, but when he was doing as a receiver and the

5:18

explosiveness and everything about

5:21

him, and we just kept doing work on him

5:23

and like I said, kind of do some draft prep

5:25

during the season and kept doing work on

5:27

him, and that was just kind of

5:30

it for me. I was like, this guy's

5:32

uh and he's he's a weapon. He's

5:34

a weapon. And you know, we

5:36

talked about all the running

5:39

backs going in the first round and

5:41

all that kind of stuff. You

5:44

know, I always say, like, if

5:46

he's a weapon, then forget

5:48

the RBS.

5:51

That's like, that's how that's that's.

5:53

What he is. Like, that's like he

5:56

we thought he was a multi phase, elite

5:58

explosive position list weapon

6:01

and you know he was a special

6:03

player. You know, you have some you have

6:05

to combine to confirm some things, you

6:07

know, but he ran what I thought he was

6:09

gonna run. And you know, all the testing

6:12

and his workouts and we're

6:14

just really excited about him. I think you're gonna

6:16

he's gonna bring another dimension to our offense.

6:18

That's as good as we were offensively last

6:21

year, you know, I think something even

6:23

better this year. But bottom line

6:25

this is you just got to get the guys that you want.

6:27

And I kind of

6:29

look at especially this past

6:32

draft. You know, everybody was saying like

6:34

this is a different draft, is a different draft. Well,

6:37

let's call it what it is. It just wasn't as strong

6:39

of a draft as it normally has been.

6:41

And by that you mean blue chip guys

6:43

top twenty yeah, yeah.

6:46

Yeah, Like you know, in a normal year

6:49

you had like true first round talent

6:51

players, you might have about seventeen

6:53

or eighteen guys. I really

6:56

haven't seen any higher than twenty in

6:58

all the years that I've been doing it. This

7:01

is we ended up with fourteen

7:03

guys, and that was at

7:05

the very end. It was less than that at

7:08

one point, Like at one point we had like nine

7:10

or ten, but Jamiro was always

7:12

one of those guys. So I just looked

7:14

at it as like, damn, look, let's

7:16

just get the who the hell we want and let's

7:19

get the hell out of there and let's see you

7:21

know, like like like one of my favorite movies

7:23

is Training Yeah, like

7:26

me and my dad one of me and my dad's favorite

7:28

movie. And uh, there was a scene in Training

7:30

Day where have yeah,

7:34

so like it was one of the scenes where

7:37

you know, he goes into this you know, the rough area,

7:39

and he goes to his lady's house

7:41

and takes his money and then he goes out and

7:44

him and even Hawker trying to get out of the neighborhood

7:47

and the girl comes out there and rats him

7:49

out and says, hey, this guy just took our money. And

7:51

then Ze just send his shootout and he's just

7:53

shooting out trying to get out of the neighborhood,

7:56

and he's basically shooting his way out of there. And

7:59

I was like that drafts kind.

8:01

Of get me out of.

8:04

Get get who we want, and just shoot

8:06

our way out of here and get on out

8:08

of there. And uh, we were just ecstatic

8:10

about how the whole thing went.

8:11

Would you say that you and

8:13

Dan Campbell are Jay Quoy and Alonso

8:15

Harris in that film? Would you put.

8:22

You know? I don't, I don't want to have

8:25

that, but I

8:27

will say we we

8:29

work as a pair very very well. We

8:31

partner very very well. You

8:34

know. Again, I know a lot of people

8:36

know now that we didn't really

8:38

know each other that much before we

8:40

got hired, But always give

8:43

so much credit to Sheila

8:45

and Rod Wood and

8:47

Chris Bilman and Mike dis and everybody

8:50

was involved in that interview process of

8:52

that. I guess that they just knew

8:54

that, you know, we would pair so so well.

8:56

And he's a joy to work with and

8:59

he's a hell of a coach.

9:00

He's cool and he's got a great personality,

9:02

and those players really rallied around him, especially

9:05

in the second half of the season. You look at that running

9:07

backs room, obviously it's it's Gibbs

9:09

and now it's Montgomery. Last year you had something

9:11

fun with Williams and Swift. You

9:14

know, everyone might say the value of the positions

9:16

devalued and whatever you want to say about it. That's

9:18

a pretty big change for the running backs room. Considering

9:20

you guys were so red hot at the end of the season. You feel

9:22

good about where you guys are at with that position group.

9:25

Yeah, I mean overall, when you look

9:27

at it just systematically, I

9:29

do think that we'll be better offensively.

9:31

And that's no knock on the contributions

9:34

that that those other two guys gave us,

9:36

because Swift is a dynamic player

9:38

and Jamal, you know, he was

9:40

a great leader for us and he

9:43

did he did so much for us. He had a

9:45

great season, awesome touchdowns.

9:47

You know. Yeah, I mean, but what

9:50

we do think that Montgomery, You

9:52

know, I think we make Montgomery and Jamal are

9:54

different backs. You know, Montgomery

9:57

does a little bit more in the passing game, uh,

9:59

And you know, adding being

10:02

able to add Gibbs. You know, I

10:05

think he just he's so dynamic as

10:07

a receiver. And look, he's a home

10:09

run hitter as a running back. I mean that's the easy

10:11

part. But what he does as a

10:14

receiver, I mean he runs routes

10:16

like I mean like a receiver. Is

10:18

that right?

10:18

Because I you know, you get all this

10:20

Alabama talent and then here's another

10:23

one and it's like, no, this one's special and has

10:25

his own skill set that maybe because he's only

10:27

there one year, didn't get the same hype as the other guys.

10:31

Yeah, he was just different. He was just different.

10:33

And you know, going through that process, I

10:35

was like, man, how many guys have I

10:37

seen that was like equally as

10:39

effective? You know, Like when I first got

10:42

with the Rams in two thousand and three, Marshall

10:44

Fulk was still there and I was a

10:46

huge Marshall Faulk guy just coming

10:48

in and so just kind of seeing

10:50

what he does in both phases, and then

10:53

just from a scouting standpoint, when Christian

10:55

McCaffrey came out, he was like the last

10:58

guy. I was like, holy cow, like this guy,

11:00

I can run routes like a

11:02

slot receiver. But also

11:04

run it, and so you start getting

11:07

reminders of you know, some of those players.

11:09

I'm not sitting here those

11:11

players, but you know, just a special

11:13

weapon like that, just you know, we

11:15

have a lot of excitement otism.

11:18

Yeah, and I think the offensive coordinator story

11:20

is pretty cool too. Had opportunities

11:22

to interview for other head coaching jobs and kind

11:24

of withdrew his name and said, I'm good here in Detroit

11:26

with this group. Take us through that

11:29

decision from Ben Johnson and what that meant in the

11:31

organization as a whole man.

11:33

That was huge, And you know, look at the end of the

11:35

day, Look, it's it's hard

11:37

to keep the good ones, you know, I mean, eventually

11:40

the cat gets out the bag and you

11:42

know there's there's just no hiding. But

11:45

you know then, you

11:47

know, you saw it right out the gate. You

11:49

know, even when he was a tight ends coach, and

11:52

you know obviously Dan, you know, had had

11:54

prior experience with him, but you

11:57

know, when things got rough in that twenty

11:59

one season and we had

12:01

to make that change from Anthony Lynn and

12:04

you know, Ben basically became the

12:06

passing game coordinator basically,

12:08

but Dan was called in plays

12:10

and Dan plays before and

12:13

and Dan was just doing a great job and

12:16

just having fun with but Ben just added this other

12:18

element was just like, Wow,

12:20

this dude's crazy.

12:26

But you know that that's another component of

12:28

when I when you asked you a question about the running backs

12:31

about and I said, I think will be better

12:33

offensively this year as good as you were last

12:35

year. It's just that you know, Ben

12:38

going into his second year as THEOC,

12:40

like I think last year he showed everybody

12:42

like I can do this, like I'm legit,

12:45

but going you know, having

12:47

the experience under his belt going into year

12:50

two, having shared with

12:52

him going in year two, and then all the

12:54

other components that we had in creating in

12:56

the draft. That's why I feel

12:58

better about William to be better.

13:00

Real quick, a couple more things Lions related, then we're going

13:02

to get more into your story. The Jack Campbell

13:04

picked that was one where if Gibbs was like okay Campbell,

13:08

that left people slack jawed and just being like, wait, what not

13:12

not a first round mock draft guy whatsoever?

13:14

And yet I saw Jack Campbell, I turned

13:16

to my co host on nfn R like, well, that's Chris Spielman

13:19

just walking through the door again. That's what I who,

13:22

of course works in your organization and has a great

13:24

role. But a linebacker

13:27

another position not considered necessarily

13:29

the same as pass rusher, offensive tackle or quarterback

13:32

in this league. And you guys, you liked them, you took them,

13:34

and away we go.

13:35

Yeah. I mean, you know, I think with these

13:39

I think sometimes it's

13:42

almost like the draft's not

13:44

that easy, Like the draft is not Oh,

13:47

you take these positions and

13:51

these players that played these positions put them up

13:53

top because they

13:55

got stats and they've been on the internet, and put

13:57

them up top. And then these players have played these positions

13:59

put them at the bottom and that's it.

14:01

And just working for a couple of months.

14:03

And Daniel Jeremiah says, mel

14:06

Kiper says, take him there,

14:08

Like, come.

14:10

On, I give it a little bit more credit to drafts.

14:13

Not that easy. And he's

14:15

going to look me talking about building a defense

14:17

and me and Aaron going to have very

14:19

similar philosophies in terms of like what

14:22

does it take to really elevate you? And you

14:24

got to have guys the front. You better have guys that

14:26

can cover, so you know, often

14:29

the inside

14:31

linebacker or the off ball linebacker,

14:33

like we took Malcolm Rodriguez year before sixth

14:35

round, and he had a great year. You

14:38

know he's gonna be He's going to be

14:40

something that's going to be contributed for us going

14:42

forward. But it was just that you

14:44

got to look at the player like, not

14:47

not the position. We don't draft positions.

14:49

We draft players. And so when you

14:51

looked at the player of Jack Campbell and

14:54

we saw it as like, no, we're not drafting inside

14:56

linebacker. We actually went into after

14:59

we signed if to resigned Alex Angeloni,

15:01

and we feel really good about, you know,

15:04

the direction that Derek

15:06

Barnes and knocking Rod Driguez was heading.

15:09

It's not like inside linebackers like

15:11

oh you better get like it's

15:14

not just like no, but Jack Campbell

15:17

was just a hell of a football player. And

15:19

I just think that like we're looking at

15:21

it as he's going to be an anchor

15:23

in our defense, not we're

15:25

drafting an inside linebacker, Like no,

15:28

we're just taking an anchor. That's defense.

15:30

And we tell about guys. We look at free agency,

15:32

you look at inside linebackers. You

15:34

know, you might have this whole list,

15:37

But then when you're looking at guys I can actually wear that

15:39

green dot and really

15:41

run the show, that list shrinks

15:44

down like this, like it goes from

15:46

this and it goes to this. And so then when

15:48

you have a guy like Jack Campbell that's

15:51

six five, two fifty,

15:53

that's extremely instinctive. He's

15:56

he's heavy in the run game, he's

15:59

extremely smart, and I just

16:01

love how the kid is wired. I mean he's

16:03

wired to fake what we're all about.

16:06

We're all about grit, doing

16:08

it the right way, like the truly earning

16:10

it. And this guy just loves football. He's

16:13

he he's all business.

16:15

And so it's about

16:17

the player. It's not about not

16:19

about oh it's gone place. It's notline

16:22

it's got a place running back. No, like

16:24

go to Jamiri gibbss Like, oh no,

16:26

he's a weapon. But Jamira Gibbs is really smart.

16:29

It's not like you know, oh yeah, he can

16:31

align all these different places. You got to be smart

16:34

to line in all these different places. You

16:36

don't just align all these different places, No, Like, you got

16:38

to be really smart. You got to be really heady

16:41

and instinctive. And so I

16:43

thought Jack Campbell, you know, had

16:45

all the trades that we look for in a football player.

16:47

And so that's how we felt really good about

16:49

it again going back to what I was saying about

16:52

in one but a certain amount of players

16:55

that we had in that first round bucket,

16:57

and he was one of them. And but

17:00

I say it was only fourteen guys. Jack Campbell

17:02

wasn't fourteen, you know what I mean? So like

17:05

it's that's that's why I just it was

17:08

it was easy.

17:08

I love it. You guys have your board, you

17:10

have your guys, and hey, if

17:12

we can get this guy at eighteen, and he was

17:14

a top fourteen player of ours and may even higher top ten, we're

17:17

taking them.

17:17

Yeah.

17:18

Mock drafts be damned.

17:20

Yeah, that's kind

17:22

of what that's that's our stance. We're

17:24

just we do a lot of work. We're

17:27

very thorough, and I know I

17:29

think every team is going to say that, but we

17:31

just have a lot of conviction in our

17:34

process and in what we believe,

17:36

and we just stick by it, and that

17:38

that's what we did.

17:40

I love it. And last year not only had Hutchinson

17:42

step up, but you had so many rookies playing

17:44

big roles, especially on that defense, that it's hard

17:46

not to say, Okay, let's give them the benefit of the doubt. Let's see before

17:48

everyone starts giving them, you know b's and c's

17:51

on their draft grades based on what the mont Draft said.

17:54

Yeah, and I mean that's always

17:56

say like it's such a psychological

17:58

component of like the mock drafts

18:01

and look it's no, I'm.

18:03

Not looking at it.

18:04

Look I know you, like, I.

18:06

Know you do much, yes, but take a lot of pride

18:08

in it.

18:08

But like, but I'll say this, I mean, stra

18:11

you you do football every

18:13

single day, Like that's

18:16

what you do all the time. You know a lot of people

18:18

you I mean, like, I like I look

18:21

at like So I'm not going to say like I don't look

18:23

at mock drafts. Yeah I look at him

18:25

because people talking, people do the research

18:28

and all that. But you can't.

18:30

You just still have to have ultimate belief

18:32

and ultimate conviction in your own

18:34

process. But but no, there's

18:36

plenty of guys that are doing that. I respect,

18:38

And I'm like, man, I know this guy knows

18:41

people. You know, he's

18:43

done a lot of work, you know, and I

18:45

think he puts a lot of pride. But when

18:47

it doesn't go down the

18:49

way you projected

18:52

it, your your brain

18:54

doesn't really like that. And it's kind of.

18:56

Want to be right.

18:58

Everybody wants to be and so

19:01

then now you're mad, and now you're like, damn

19:03

it, no one said he

19:05

was gonna go that high. And then now you got

19:07

to sign a grade while you're still mad. So

19:10

now I was like, oh, no one said you're gonna go there. No,

19:12

And I'm just like and I was like, at the end of the day.

19:14

I'm like, march, you

19:16

know, because

19:19

really the.

19:19

Only ranks that really matter is the thirty

19:21

one other general finishers and uh

19:24

and and those are the rankings that nobody

19:26

has. And that's what makes

19:28

the draft so fun. And so when

19:31

when when when I see people get mad about,

19:33

uh, it didn't go the way, I'm like, look, you

19:35

should embrace the excitement of that, Like

19:38

that's that's the part. You don't know how

19:40

it's gonna fall. And you see a name that goes out

19:42

and be like, whoa, I didn't know that.

19:43

It's like embracing it is ultimates

19:47

the ultimate reality show. It's more than the season

19:49

even because it's so rapid fire. And

19:51

I say it before the draft, I beg my colleagues

19:54

on Twitter on ESPN, I

19:56

don't tip the picks. It is such a fun

19:58

experience as a viewer. If you don't and

20:01

you guys in the war rooms and then trying

20:03

to manipulate the chessboard. It's

20:05

it's war games and it's fun to watch

20:08

from outside, but I'm sure it's stressful as hell in your chair.

20:11

But it is. You're right, it's fun. And and

20:14

what I was I was selling a lot of people out in the draft,

20:16

you know, I was like, Okay,

20:19

this was the draft, this was the draft

20:21

season. This was you know, the build up,

20:23

and then when it's over, then

20:25

it's over. And then now now the ota

20:28

start and guys start get on the field, and

20:31

now that's the thing. And then now training

20:33

camp is about to start, so that'll be a thing.

20:35

So it's like it goes in phases

20:38

where it's just like I was telling you about

20:40

the movie, you know, with Ethan

20:42

Hawkins Denzel Aushington. It's like you

20:44

do the shootout and the back windows

20:47

shot out, and you know, the cars kind

20:49

of shot up a little bit, but they

20:51

got out. They go. You

20:53

gotta so you gotta take the you

20:56

know, the d's and halfs

20:58

of the mock drafters and all, okay,

21:00

all right, you know it'll be it'll

21:03

be back at home.

21:11

I love your story. I think it's a story of

21:13

perseverance. But also you've

21:16

had a great career. Can can we go

21:18

back to your high school days.

21:20

You're a star player in Tampa, Florida.

21:22

You were I want to say, Homecoming King, Is that

21:24

true? I did my research. Homecoming

21:27

King, captain of the football

21:29

team. You go to North Carolina A and T,

21:33

and you're having a great freshman

21:35

sophomore here and then a major

21:37

life moment occurred. I'm going to say something

21:40

and then you take us back and explain what happened.

21:43

But I'm just going to say the Music City Miracle game

21:45

and then take us backwards and lead up to what

21:47

that game means in your life.

21:50

Oh man, So yeah,

21:54

you know, I'm at home visiting,

21:57

you know, my my parents

21:59

once Ampa, and you know, have

22:02

a you know, near fatal car accident,

22:05

just get get sidelined, and

22:08

you know, I mean, I mean, I see

22:10

you for a week and it

22:12

was it was I mean, I'm just I'm I'm

22:14

very blessed and lucky to

22:17

pull through that. But yeah,

22:19

I was. I was in I see you in

22:21

Saint Joseph Hospital in Tampa, Florida,

22:23

watching the Music City Miracle and

22:26

I never forget I was. And then when I got released from

22:28

the hospital, watching then in nine

22:30

rams, you know, uh go their

22:32

Super Bowl when they played

22:34

the Bucks, you know, and then NSC Championship

22:37

game, and uh it was. I mean

22:39

I was watching that just just kind of couch

22:41

written when I got released. But those

22:45

moments kind of really

22:48

resonate with me because you don't you

22:50

don't take anything for granted.

22:52

And you know what what that

22:54

taught me is that, you know, look, if

22:57

you have something that you believe, all

23:00

is believe it and don't let anybody take

23:02

your dreams away. Because I never

23:04

forget that. My college coach phil As

23:06

visits in the hospital and

23:09

you know, he's he sees one of his players

23:11

in ICU bed mangled up,

23:13

and I'm sitting there telling them that I'm gonna

23:16

play again, and he's like, all

23:18

right, yeah right, I mean, like you're lucky if

23:20

you'll walk around like no, I'm gonna play again.

23:22

And sure enough, it just

23:24

gave me time to get as

23:26

healthy as I could rehab.

23:29

It was able to, you know, join

23:31

the team. I had missed that whole spring, and

23:34

I joined the team during summer workouts

23:37

and a big part of my rehab

23:39

process was my grandfather coming down and my grandfather

23:41

played golf twice today and just

23:44

driving his car really kind of

23:46

just or yeah, like just getting

23:49

used to even driving again. Stuff

23:51

like that. And you know, you go through all this occupational

23:53

therapy and all that, but

23:55

but be able to join my teammates

23:57

that summer and I

24:00

felt actually stronger than ever was. I

24:02

felt even better in shape, and you

24:04

know, and we we went on and

24:06

you know, I was able to finish my career

24:09

at North Carolina A and T. But that's

24:11

definitely the biggest

24:14

adversity that I've ever overcome

24:17

in my life and and something

24:19

that I'll never forget. And it sticks with

24:21

you.

24:21

You went into a coma, you had a stroke,

24:23

and then what was it? How many how many weeks or

24:25

months in the hospital were you?

24:27

And yeah, so I was in I was

24:29

in ICU for almost two weeks.

24:32

You know, it was like ten days in ICU, and

24:34

then I had almost close to another week when I

24:36

got released and moved from ICU.

24:39

But yeah, had a had

24:41

a coma stroke, was paralyzed

24:44

all the way on my right side. And you

24:47

know, I still to this day, I

24:49

still have like I still don't feel like I have

24:53

the exact same amount of strength,

24:55

you know, like in my right arm as

24:57

my left or you know, it's just it's

25:00

certain things that kind of just give you some reminders

25:02

of that moment. But having

25:05

kids now, being a

25:07

parent, I just can't even

25:11

think of you know, uh, my,

25:14

my my parents. Getting that call from

25:16

one of my closest friends Gape GALAGOSU.

25:19

I just saw back when I was on vacation

25:21

that you know, he's the one that had to make

25:24

that call to my parents of what

25:26

happened, and it was I

25:28

just can't even fathom me get in that call when

25:30

day just out of the blue, and you

25:33

know, I just I just have so much respect for

25:36

my family, uh, my closest

25:38

friends. Uh and you know, I

25:41

just I just kind of it's just

25:43

one of those moments that lives with you

25:46

in really a good way.

25:47

I was gonna say, is it almost in a weird way? And they

25:49

say this about survivors of traumatic events,

25:51

but also survivors of illnesses. It's

25:54

almost liberating where you're like, wait,

25:56

I've been through that, I can do anything now.

25:59

Yeah, exactly, Like it's

26:02

yeah, it's it's not a good moment because

26:05

it's life threatening, but at the same

26:07

time, It's one of those moments that shape

26:09

for sure, and those

26:11

are one of those things that I think kind

26:13

of started my journey.

26:16

Like I felt like I was always a hard

26:18

worker. I always felt like I always

26:20

had that mindset that was kind of overcoming

26:22

the odds. My father had

26:24

taught me that a long time ago, you

26:28

know, he had he he played in the NFL

26:30

for a short a while, and I never

26:32

forget he bought me a weight set, you know,

26:34

when I was in length the seventh grade and

26:37

and he was like it was no, it

26:39

was in the eighth grade. I think it was in eighth or

26:41

ninth grade, but he bought me a weight set, And I never forget

26:43

he told me. He was like, Brad, it's it's

26:45

not about what other

26:48

people are seeing you do, and it's about what you're

26:50

doing, about what you're doing when other people

26:52

aren't watching, about how hard you're working.

26:54

And so I always felt like I was a hard

26:56

worker. But going through that car

26:59

accident and going through that process getting

27:01

back on my feet and not only having a chanced play

27:03

football, but having a chance to have life again, I'm

27:07

just forever grateful and fortunate.

27:09

But I do think that

27:11

that did kind of spark

27:14

that fuel of getting

27:16

to where I got to now

27:18

because I had to take a really

27:20

long road. It was a very unconventional

27:24

path in terms of getting

27:26

started and just you know, being

27:28

told no when I first shot to

27:30

get into business and just keep

27:33

fighting at it, and I think

27:35

it both will.

27:37

It's an amazing story. And I think what you're alluding

27:39

to with your career, I was looking in

27:41

your bio. You were in Atlanta Hawks

27:46

public relations, you know, entry

27:48

level guy doing PR for the Atlanta Hawks

27:50

coming out of school for you, and then you

27:52

were at the Saint Louis Rams

27:55

doing p R, which

27:57

is yeah, setting up interviews, which is

27:59

working on messaging for the team, which is helping

28:02

the players you know, talk to the media and arrange

28:04

that kind of How do you make that jump from

28:06

PR to being an NFL GM twenty

28:08

years later?

28:10

Yeah, So my degree

28:12

was in PR, and

28:14

in credit to my mother's been in the

28:16

education field forever,

28:19

and like halfway through college, I started

28:21

off as a business and marketing major.

28:23

I didn't even know why. I just thought

28:26

that was the cool major to be in. And then my mom

28:28

was like, right, you might want to change

28:30

that, dude, Like you're more of

28:32

a verbal writing person. You're

28:35

not a man. I was like, all

28:37

right, So I changed my degree to PR

28:40

and uh, and it was it was the best

28:42

thing for me. And I really like my grade

28:44

to start to change. But anyways, when

28:46

I got done playing, you know,

28:49

I knew I wanted to get in the NFL and

28:51

you know, try to get into Scout again.

28:54

I sent my resume to all the teams like everybody

28:57

else does. My dad had

28:59

a complic actions, but none

29:02

of that fell through. So my mom

29:04

was basically like, dude, you got to come

29:06

back home. You know, You've got to come home and

29:08

just figure it out. And so I

29:10

moved back home, and I was ringing cars

29:13

for Enterprise Rental Cars, and yeah,

29:15

I was rinting cars for Enterprise Rental Car and

29:18

uh, you know, I'm wearing the shirt

29:20

and tie, washing cars and rinting

29:22

cars and all I'm doing is I'm thinking about

29:24

sports. And that was a very psychological

29:27

and emotional period of my life because that was the

29:29

first time that I

29:32

was not getting ready to play football.

29:34

I wasn't like I'm going through It's

29:36

like.

29:36

In July, you don't have

29:39

a training I don't

29:41

have.

29:41

A training camp. Awaiting for me. I'm not involved

29:43

in football. So I'm in that

29:45

little branch that Enterprise rental

29:47

car just thinking about football all day

29:50

and saying about sports. And so finally

29:53

an opportunity came about with the

29:55

Atlanta Hawks for a

29:57

media relations trainee, and so

30:00

I talked to my mom about it and I'm like and my mom was

30:02

like, look, at least you'll be back in sports, and

30:05

I was like, yeah, you're You're right. And

30:07

so I got that opportunity

30:10

with the Atlanta Hawks. And because

30:13

like I only could only

30:15

work forty hours a week with the Atlanta

30:17

Hawks, it was a meat relations trainee position,

30:20

but because of my experience with Enterprise,

30:23

Enterprise allowed me to work part time

30:26

at the Atlanta airpe Line. So one

30:28

of the one of the greatest perks that the Atlanta

30:30

Hawks gave me was a free Marty card.

30:33

Because I didn't have the money to

30:38

I lived way up in Norcross

30:41

and had this little one bedroom apartment

30:43

and so I would take

30:45

the you know.

30:48

You're taking ups arena.

30:51

So I had to start up top at the Furthest

30:53

Formal station.

30:56

In the early two thousand. Yeah, you

30:59

know about that's not a yeah,

31:02

all respect to the marks that ain't the New York City

31:04

subway system.

31:06

So you literally added take the

31:08

door into the northernmost

31:10

stop and go down and then drop

31:13

me off downtown at to see an Inventor Center

31:16

of building. And that's when I would do my

31:18

meat relations trainee job. And

31:20

then when I got off, then that's

31:23

when I would go down to UH. I

31:25

get off and I take the Marta down

31:27

to the Atlanta Airport and then I go

31:29

to the Atlanta Airport and I would just work cars,

31:32

so probably about about eleven

31:34

o'clock at night, and then you

31:36

know, the Atlanta air Force is the last

31:38

time, so I'd have to take

31:41

that that Atlanta Airport

31:43

Marta all the way back up to

31:45

that door bill station up north and

31:47

UH. And that's really what's the lesson. What's

31:50

a lesson from Atlanta?

31:51

What's a lesson for kids? Right now? Who are I say? Kids?

31:53

College graduate? I want to get in sports, I

31:55

want to be a GM. You hear that story that that could

31:57

be discouraging, but it should also encourage.

32:00

It should encourage you. And again, like I said

32:02

at the beginning, man, look if you're confised

32:05

on what you want to do, don't let anybody

32:07

ever tell you know, and people

32:10

will tell you no, and you got to use the nose

32:12

as fuel to just keep

32:14

going. And you just gotta have you just got to be

32:17

convicted, and you just got to know that you're not

32:19

going to have the easiest path. Yeah.

32:21

I had plenty of friends from college that

32:23

got these high paying jobs and

32:26

all this stuff, and it was it was, it

32:28

was great. But I was struggling.

32:31

You know, I wasn't making I think I was want to make like eight

32:33

bucks an hour as a relations trainee,

32:35

and then maybe I was making like nine

32:38

dollars an hour renting cars. But I

32:40

had enough to survive, as

32:43

you know, to pay for my apartment

32:45

and pay for my bills. But the

32:47

great thing about that year, though, in two

32:49

thousand and three, was that the NBA All Star

32:51

Game. I remember.

32:55

Yet contest that year.

32:57

Just as a fan.

32:59

I actually thought it was a cool job because

33:02

one of my main duties was I had to get the

33:04

post game quotes from the opposing

33:06

teams. So, like

33:08

Jordan and everybody, they would be

33:11

coming in and I'm like in the locker room

33:13

and I'm like, holy cal, Like this is Tracy

33:15

McGray, Like, holy cal, this is

33:17

like I'm saying, like, this is Shaquille O'Neil,

33:20

Like what Like I thought it

33:22

was awesome. So, but the

33:24

NBA All Star Game comes and then my boss

33:27

at the time, ARTHA. Trish, was a he

33:30

was a president communication for basketball

33:32

for the House at the time. He knew I wanted

33:34

to get in the NFL, and he

33:36

said, hey, look, man, a lot of these PR

33:38

directors from the NFL come

33:40

to the All Star Game. You know, I can introduce

33:43

you to some of them. And so I met

33:45

Dwayne Lewis and we

33:47

just kind of did a little kind of lunch interview

33:50

and he had offered me a

33:52

PR internship and I

33:55

was like great, And so then

33:57

I just did the PR Internship

34:00

of the Year and during that year, so I was

34:02

starting the two thousand and three season.

34:04

So you make the shift from Sharif

34:06

Abdurraheim and Dan Dickau and

34:09

Dion Glover and my man

34:11

Alan Henderson and now you're at where

34:14

you're going, you go, do you move everything? Go to Saint Louis

34:16

for an internship.

34:18

Yeah, So I just kind of packed the U

34:20

haul. I just I just

34:22

packed the U haul and drove

34:24

the Saint Louis and

34:27

and I just started there.

34:28

Had you ever been there before?

34:30

I've never been the same. I've never been.

34:32

This is the lesson. How many of these

34:34

people that we talked to are like, yeah, the opportunity, but

34:37

I'm from New York. I'm not moving to you know.

34:39

Like, no, I think

34:41

it's easier when it's when you're

34:43

single with no kids a little bit. But

34:45

but you know, I'm now. I was twenty

34:49

three years old, twenty two years old at

34:51

the time, so but yeah, I just

34:53

packed the U haul and just kind

34:55

of drove drove the Saint Louis.

34:58

Uh it's about eight nine

35:00

hour drive, I think or something like that.

35:03

You know. Then I started my PR internship

35:05

and back then the RAMS would have

35:08

training camp in Macomb, Illinois,

35:10

Illinois. So uh, it's

35:13

like assume I get there and I'm there

35:15

for like maybe a week. And then I

35:17

got to go to Macomb, Illinois and

35:19

start my PR internship, and

35:22

uh, it was it was it was cool again. I

35:24

was doing interviews and

35:27

with Marshall Faulk and stuff like that, and I

35:29

was like, this is great. But during

35:31

that time, you know, during

35:33

that training camp, I see these guys

35:36

that weren't players. They

35:38

were just regular guys and they had

35:40

their helping out in practice and I'm like, what

35:42

are those and they're like, oh, there was a scouting assistance

35:45

and I was like scouting assistants

35:47

and I'm like, they can like help

35:50

out in practice and walk through

35:52

and stuff. And it's like yeah, I'm like wow. So

35:54

I'm like I gotta get So,

35:58

you know, I struck up a good relationship with

36:00

our running bass coach at the time, Wilbert Montgomery,

36:03

former

36:06

Eagles. Yeah. I mean, and

36:09

I think Wilburt just saw that, you know, I

36:11

was just a young kid fresh

36:14

out of college that I love

36:16

football, and we would just taught football

36:18

and h Then as

36:20

our relationship developed, I

36:22

would start helping him out with stuff. I would

36:24

help him. I would help him do his running back

36:26

risk band things, you know, I

36:29

do that kind of stuff. And one day

36:31

he just asked me, He's like, man, why

36:34

are you in pr Like why

36:36

are you not? I said, Wilburt, Man, I don't know

36:38

anybody. I don't. I try to

36:40

get in, but I couldn't. And so he was like,

36:43

hey, look man, I'm gonna talk to Charlie. Charlie

36:45

Armers our gem at the time, and

36:47

he said, I'm gonna talk to Charlie. And

36:50

at the time, all the

36:52

Scotting assistants kind of had

36:54

this it's called

36:56

it like a nepotism kind

36:58

of everyone. Yeah,

37:01

like one uncle was

37:03

the president, another one, you know,

37:06

his dad played quarterback for the g

37:08

another one is like his

37:11

his grandfather used

37:13

to be the owner's far like all. And I'm

37:15

just like, I don't have any of

37:17

that. And he was like, look, I never this

37:20

is Wilbur talking. Wilver's like, look, Brad,

37:22

I never go to Charlotte or anything. So he knows

37:24

it's real. It's real. So he

37:26

talks to Charlie and he comes back. And one

37:28

thing that I had to do as a PR internship

37:31

is I had to print out the daily clips.

37:34

And I had to print out the daily clips and pass them

37:36

out to all the coaches offices in the gym's

37:38

office.

37:38

And so here's what Bernie milk Klass

37:41

wrote about the team this week.

37:42

Right is Thomas Bernie

37:44

mclass like all of

37:47

them and so and

37:49

so, and you know, now we get

37:51

them all and PDF and all that.

37:53

I let I tell these interns now, I'm

37:55

like, we used to have to print these

37:57

things out.

37:58

You print out, You cut out the newspaper article,

38:00

you put it on a piece of white paper, you paste it.

38:02

Then you gotta go to the copy machine, make forty

38:04

copies, and you gotta staple it. And this is every

38:07

day.

38:08

It every single day.

38:10

And so now on

38:12

that again, I can look

38:15

at it as grunt work or but

38:17

I was looking as an opportunity. Like I had to hand

38:20

out some clips to Lovely

38:23

Smith's office deep into Coordinate,

38:25

and I'm like, holy cow, love Smith,

38:27

like you know what I mean, Like I was able to

38:29

meet. So after Wilfrid told

38:31

me about that, he talked to Charlie. I

38:34

had to pass them out to the general manager's office

38:36

and I passed it. I gave the clips

38:38

to Charlie and Charlie

38:40

said, hey, uh. I talked to Wilburt

38:43

and he said, you know you're interested, and

38:45

so come come come meet me on Friday

38:47

in my office. And so I'm

38:49

like, holy coun like this is

38:51

it, like it's coming. So I

38:55

didn't know, and this is being a young kid

38:57

and not knowing really how to communicate

38:59

affectively and handle business right.

39:02

So I didn't tell Dwayne

39:04

Lewis or PR director because.

39:05

I'm not giving that job?

39:07

Am I supposed to? Yeah? I'm like, what am

39:09

I supposed to do? Like tell him

39:11

I'm about to leave, you know what I mean? So,

39:13

so, you know, and Fridays were like a

39:15

dress down there. So Friday, T

39:19

shirt Friday,

39:21

I'm sure. So

39:26

people are looking at me like I just got

39:28

dressed up. And so

39:31

I go up there, I meet Charlie Army and

39:34

it was him and his assistant Debbie Pollam

39:36

in there, and I just had

39:38

a bunch of writing samples from my time

39:41

with you know everything that I

39:43

and I wanted to show Charlie like I

39:45

can write, Like.

39:46

I can write.

39:48

I have a passion for writing. I love like

39:51

I'm a grammar snob to this day.

39:53

All my staff kind of jokes on me all the

39:56

time because I'm like, man, why is he not a comment

39:58

or something like that. But anyways, I want

40:00

to show him that I can write, you know. And

40:02

so I'm in there and

40:04

I'm sitting at this table with Charlie and

40:07

his assistant Debbie, and then next

40:09

thing, you know, my PR

40:12

director Dwayne Lewis walks into Charlie's

40:14

office and I'm like, and

40:19

Dwayne's looking at me and He's like, what

40:23

the hell did you just do? Like he's

40:25

like, why is why is my PR intern

40:27

in the general manager's office. And

40:31

and so Charlie was on the phone

40:34

and Debbie tells Dwayne that was

40:36

like, no, he's fine, he's fine, he's fine. And

40:38

so then Charlie gets

40:40

off the phone and he just

40:43

tells Dwayne. He goes, hey, look, I

40:45

was talking to Brad here, and you know, he's interested

40:47

in getting the scouting So after

40:49

he's done with your internship, he's going to be by

40:52

intern starting the draft prep process.

40:54

He hadn't even told me that you found out.

40:56

I'm just like, I'm like, whoa,

40:59

okay, right, and so

41:01

so then you know I had a you know, I had a

41:05

sorry, yeah, a.

41:06

Quick lesson on what this

41:11

guy takes president.

41:14

So so yeah, so that's that's that's

41:16

how it got started. And I got a

41:18

shot to be, uh

41:21

a scouting intern. So when

41:23

the season ended, you know, basically

41:26

like January through the draft

41:28

and I was a scouting intern and I was

41:30

just you know, labeling

41:33

beta tapes and you know, entering

41:36

reports, and you know, you have to make

41:38

profile tapes we call

41:40

profile profile tapes, and you got to

41:42

write the time codes from the beta tapes

41:44

and all that, and every now and

41:46

then they should watch these tapes during the draft

41:49

meetings. And so every now and then

41:51

Charlie would ask one of the scout assistants,

41:54

you know, to come in and talk about

41:57

the player. And so I never

41:59

forget the first who is the guy? He

42:01

could? They called me in?

42:03

Oh, come on, give it to me. I want to hear.

42:05

God, I can't remember who it was. I

42:07

don't want to make some but

42:10

but I probably should remember it. But I

42:12

never forget he called

42:15

me in. And it's like the room is like dimly

42:17

lit and projector screamed

42:19

on and they're watching my profile tape

42:21

and it's a room full of scouts

42:23

in the GM and Lawrence mccut

42:26

player personnel director, and I'm like, smokes,

42:30

and he's like, what did you think?

42:32

And I just told him I said, I think

42:34

he's this, I think he's that. I think he's boomom boom,

42:36

bom boom. And he was like, all right, thanks,

42:39

and I stopped out the room and I'm like, I

42:41

have no idea like anybody

42:44

thought what I said. But

42:47

but you know, there was a scout, Big

42:49

Daniels, who's been been one

42:52

of my mentors for a long

42:54

time, and I remember he came

42:56

out and he told me, he said, grad, you did a

42:58

really good job. And he was the

43:00

one that really taught me how to construct

43:02

the scouting report and how to kind of

43:04

ride a.

43:05

Play or a young kid

43:07

come in like give me your thoughts on Roscoe Parish.

43:10

Go and you're like, no,

43:15

it was it was. It was intimidating,

43:17

man, and you just had to be right.

43:19

But guess what, it was just me and those PR

43:21

skills, the enterprise front facing salesman

43:24

skills, all of it comes into play because

43:26

guess what you're presenting.

43:27

Absolutely absolutely.

43:30

It's almost like another

43:32

one of my favorite movies is The Karate. You

43:35

know, the scene of

43:37

when he's complaining about you're not teaching

43:40

meaning karate, you know, like I thought I was

43:42

supposed to be doing karate and

43:44

he's like, no, wax and watch off paint

43:46

the house like he's doing. And he's

43:48

like no, Like do you get it now? Like you've

43:51

been learning it this whole time, you just

43:54

now it's showing. So but

43:56

yeah, you're right, like all those skills just

43:58

goode. Well, but as a young kid, you don't realize

44:01

that at the time. So after

44:04

I got done with that draft, I

44:06

believe that's when we drafted

44:09

Steven Jackson in the first round. And

44:13

I'll never forget that. And then Charlie he

44:15

hired me on as a full time scouting assistant,

44:18

and you know, I did that

44:20

for like three years, and uh,

44:22

we're just picking players up from the airport. Just

44:25

a lot of just you know, going to the combine,

44:27

not watching players, just grabbing

44:29

lunch for the GM, you know,

44:32

between workouts and stuff like like that,

44:34

and keep doing profile

44:36

tapes and you know, just

44:38

enormous scouting assistant duties and did that for three

44:40

years and then that's when I became

44:42

a combined scout in NFS

44:45

Combine scout and

44:47

that, to me, that's the best training

44:49

that you can get from a scout because

44:52

you're always woroking on the next year's

44:54

draft class and so like so,

44:57

say it's the H five draft

44:59

and that March in April or

45:01

February, March April whatever like that,

45:04

will you're working on the

45:07

six guys. And so what

45:10

I think is the best training is I'll never forget

45:12

my first junior day. I just had to

45:14

go to university Missouri, and

45:18

you know, I met the pro

45:20

liaison and he

45:22

just gives me a list and he was

45:24

like, here's a list. He walks

45:26

me into the film room. I don't know anything about

45:29

him, and I just had to sort out

45:31

that whole roster, like I

45:33

don't know what anybody is,

45:35

I don't know how good anybody is.

45:37

And I remember I just grinded like.

45:40

Some of that justin Smith first round pick,

45:42

or it could be a guy that has no chance of being drafted,

45:45

but you've got to do it.

45:45

Yeah, you just do. You don't know, and you

45:48

don't know until you watch him. And that's

45:50

why I tell my Scott's all the time, like You're

45:52

like all these free agents and all these guys

45:54

that are undrafted guys, and I'm like, well,

45:57

you don't know if they're free agents or guys

46:00

you look at them. So but that

46:02

that moment right there kind of showed

46:05

me like, look and going through the whole

46:07

spring, It's like it kind of gave

46:09

me the whole thing of don't worry

46:11

about what anybody else thinks, like just

46:14

trust for your I, C and

46:17

and and that's all. I

46:19

mean that that's kind of a hard thing

46:21

to kind of especially

46:24

as a young scout, because you got a lot

46:26

of noise that affects you, and

46:28

you got group think and all this stuff

46:31

that affects you. And just like we were talking about earlier

46:33

about the mant dress up, you want to be right.

46:36

And so it actually takes

46:38

a very special skill to

46:40

be able to say, look, I don't care what anybody

46:42

else thinks, this is what my But being

46:45

a combine scout forces you to be in

46:47

that moment of like you're riding

46:49

all these players for the up for the next year's

46:51

draft class. And there

46:54

is no mock drafts out, there is no

46:56

nobody's talking.

46:57

About change from

46:59

the combine to the draft, and yet

47:02

you hear this guy's rising up aboard. But it's

47:04

like that's the group thing where it's like, well, maybe we have

47:06

taken another look at.

47:06

This guy exactly

47:09

exactly, And so that's I've

47:11

always been big on the

47:13

psychological part of the draft

47:15

process and still am. And

47:18

so but those are the one of

47:20

the things of the group think. The

47:23

it's a very or just the whole conformity.

47:26

Always look at the Solomon Ash conformity

47:28

experiment that you look at on YouTube,

47:30

and you know it's all those guys in the room

47:32

and they're looking at these lines on this paper

47:35

and it's this guy. They

47:38

say all the wrong lines, and then

47:40

the guy knows that he has the right answer,

47:42

but he keeps sharing something else and

47:44

he's just like, oh, shoot, it's

47:47

gotta be three, but everybody's

47:50

saying two. So I

47:52

guess I'm gonna say two. But in your heart

47:54

you know that no, it was three.

47:56

It's not it's not two. And so

47:59

those are the things that you know that I'm

48:01

always big one and try to eliminate that group

48:03

thinking, try to cut out that outside noise.

48:06

But I think that being a combine scout

48:08

really really helped me out

48:10

with that. And you just kind of get training

48:13

in all aspects of scouting, of running

48:15

a pro day and having your

48:17

own conviction and all that stuff.

48:20

So doing that, you

48:22

know, or I did the

48:24

Midwest and cross checked the Southeast, and

48:27

after that I finally got an area job doing

48:30

the Northeast, and you know,

48:32

we had a new regime come in, you

48:35

know, fit Billy Devaney became

48:37

my general manager and began

48:39

the Northeast area scout job. And

48:41

then the rest of his.

48:42

History fast

48:50

forwarding to the You're Rising up the chart

48:53

with the Rams Go twenty thirteen

48:55

rolls around. This kid out

48:57

of Pittsburgh is a defensive tackle. What

48:59

was your initial thoughts and feelings

49:02

on Aaron Donald the prospect?

49:04

So, Aaron Donald, he's another great,

49:07

great study in terms

49:09

of blocking out the outside

49:12

noise. And because

49:14

at the time we had I

49:17

think we had Michael Brockers and

49:20

Kendall Langford and

49:22

you know, we had already

49:24

drafted Chris Long. So we

49:27

had these big defensive linemen at the time.

49:29

And I'm going to pitt

49:32

and I'm like, this guy's amazing.

49:34

But I'm like, the coaches are

49:36

gonna hate him because he's not big.

49:39

And I'm like, and then, so now you're battling.

49:41

Sure, you know, going in, how how.

49:44

High of a grade do I give him? Because

49:46

I get this guy this high of a grade, but the coach

49:48

is gonna be like, what are you talking about? This guy's only

49:51

six foot and twenty five. So,

49:53

but I'll never forget. And this is why

49:55

always say to this day the intangibles

49:58

are the separators of success. Is

50:00

that I knew

50:02

the defensive coordinator at Hit the time,

50:04

Matt House, because he was working

50:06

with Stagnola in that previous

50:09

staff under spags. And so I

50:12

go in the pit and I see Matt

50:15

and Matt tells me, hey,

50:17

Brad, are you staying for practice? And I said, yeah,

50:19

yeah, he said come out about a half hour early.

50:22

And he didn't tell me why. He just told me to come out

50:24

of holf. So I'm thinking, as a scout, I'm like, oh,

50:26

he's gonna give me some more background information, some

50:28

more intel. He'll be out of practice earlier.

50:30

So he didn't tell me that. He just told me to come out of practice

50:33

early. So I come out of practice early. You know, they practiced

50:35

in that bubble at the Steelers Steelers,

50:38

and so I go out there

50:40

and I walk out to the bubble and it's

50:43

the ball boys, the equipment

50:46

managers, the specialists,

50:48

the kickers, the punter of the long snapper,

50:51

and Aaron Donald. Those are the only

50:53

people in the bubble. And Aaron Donald

50:55

is sitting on this bag fully taped

50:58

up with this which

51:00

in his knee as if like, man,

51:02

I've been waiting all day,

51:05

like where's everybody at

51:07

because I've been waiting on this all day?

51:10

And so then I see Matt House.

51:12

He comes out with other coaches and

51:14

Matt goes, Brad, you come out early. I

51:17

was like yep, and he goes, did you see it said?

51:20

I was like

51:22

nothing else needed to be said. I was

51:24

like, that's that's it. That's

51:27

it. So yeah, Aaron Donald, I mean a

51:30

very talented player, ny explosive, very

51:32

strong, I mean all that, very athletic.

51:35

I mean, he had this rare combine. But it's

51:38

his work in indangibles

51:40

and his passion for football that a

51:43

lot of people just don't. I mean they

51:46

know now, but at the time, like

51:48

and that was my story that I

51:51

told, you know, less need and Jeff

51:53

Fisher like, I'm like that

51:55

said it all to me is that when Matt

51:57

House told me to come out there early, and

52:00

and sure enough he's always been that way.

52:02

When he starts slipping in the draft, are you

52:04

in the war room like, hey guys, Scott or is

52:06

it understood, Like, hey, if he's there, we're taking

52:08

them.

52:09

Yeah, it was pretty understood. You know, we

52:11

had two picks that year, so you

52:13

know we had we

52:15

we we took Greg Robinson and

52:19

then and then you

52:22

know that's the that was the premium

52:24

position, that was the talented you

52:26

know what I mean, like, that's that's that's

52:29

what it was.

52:29

So and guess what, every mock draft had

52:31

Robinson going first or second.

52:33

There's no doubt it was himboy Sammy Watkins

52:35

that I think we were we were targeting, and

52:37

then finally we just kind of settled

52:39

in on Greg Robinson. But that

52:42

that was a great draft. But I mean that was after

52:44

that. It was so then after that when

52:46

we when we when we got to that next pick,

52:49

it's like, now, yeah, Aaron

52:51

Donald, you got you

52:53

know, Mike Evans, you got Zach

52:56

Martin. It's just yeah,

52:58

so many that was a great go down Odell

53:01

Beckham, I mean, c J.

53:03

Bos like, you got all these great

53:06

players and so but you

53:08

know, the sites were said on

53:10

on Aaron Donald. I never forget.

53:13

We got to that pick and a

53:15

team called and uh

53:17

they offered a pretty tyson trade

53:19

offer, and I'm never Jeff

53:22

thetheless was like, absolutely not, We're

53:24

pitching this guy. And that's just

53:26

it. And uh, I'll never forget

53:29

in that draft meeting of our assistant

53:31

general manager Ray Agne, he

53:33

was the one that really like in that

53:36

draft meeting leading up to that draft

53:38

because a lot of people are saying because of the size, you

53:41

know, he was going to be a sub

53:43

rush you know, specialized

53:47

nickel sub rush guy. And

53:49

I never forget. Rad was like no, no, no, no, no, no, no,

53:51

no, no, no no, he's every day like

53:54

it is. No, it's no specialized

53:57

nothing, and like he said it with the most

54:00

passion. And you know Ray Agnew, you know Tompson

54:03

Page like he's

54:05

like when you hear Ray Agnew and

54:07

Radnews, very salt smoke guy. But when he hit

54:09

said, I was like, Okay, this

54:12

is real.

54:13

They played you guys played Tampa and it was a thunderstorm

54:16

and I remember I don't know who the decordinator

54:18

was at the time, as probably Greg Williams.

54:20

They were lining airing up and outside

54:22

linebacker in a three four yeah, and I

54:24

was like, I've never seen this before and it was in a rainstorm

54:27

and he was just out there sacond quarterbacks from

54:30

the OLB position.

54:31

He is he has rare I

54:33

mean, if you look back at his combine,

54:36

he had Shuttle times like he had dB Shuttle

54:39

times, but he just had like thirty

54:41

reps in two twenty five and ran

54:43

a four six. And because

54:45

of the way he's built and he's still got long

54:48

arms and he's so explosive, but

54:50

again like he's talented. I tell the

54:52

story all the time about Aaron

54:55

Donald and I say it about Cooper Cup as well, and

54:57

it's like, yeah, man, like this

55:00

guy loves football and he

55:02

was hard,

55:05

like because that time where

55:07

he was the first one in that bubble in practice,

55:09

He's been that way a freaking old

55:12

day. He's the first one out

55:14

at practice every day. And

55:16

I'll never forget, even his rookie year, before

55:19

he was even starting, I never forget.

55:21

I had to run to the facility real

55:23

quick. It was. It was a Saturday,

55:26

Saturday night and I

55:28

think I was heading out on the road somewhere

55:31

the next day, and so I

55:33

run the facility grab stuff, and it

55:35

was Aaron Donald and he was in

55:37

the world because I was like, there's no players here. It's like

55:40

it's like eight nine o'clock at night, Aaron

55:42

Donald in the whirlpool watching his

55:45

iPad like he's not even a starter.

55:47

He's not even the starter, but he's

55:50

preparing like he's the starter as

55:52

a rookie. And

55:54

and it was it was the same way with with with

55:56

Cooper Cup when you know he drafted him,

55:58

and that's when it really it hit me. I'm

56:01

like, look, man, if these players

56:03

don't have the tangibles in the passion

56:05

and the work ethic in the football character,

56:08

it's not gonna work. It's just bottom

56:10

line.

56:11

I love this stuff. We're gonna we're gonna do rapid

56:13

fire and then we're gonna wrap this up. We'ven't been gotten into

56:16

some of the Lions stuff I want to talk about. Jered, I

56:18

thought it'll be another time. Yeah, I'm gonna go rapid

56:21

fire and you just give me some answers and

56:23

we go from there. Your greatest mentor

56:26

as a football professional non

56:28

life, but it's a football person in your career. Who

56:30

is the person that kind of you look

56:33

to and say, this guy showed me the ropes?

56:36

And I have to say, Dick Daniels.

56:38

I have to say Daniels.

56:39

I don't know, I don't know that name. So tell me who he is.

56:41

Yeah, so so Dick Daniels. He

56:44

was a Northeast scout at the time when

56:46

I first joined the scouting

56:48

apartment as a scouting intern. And

56:51

he's the one that kind of took

56:53

the time out. That's the that's

56:55

the guy that told me good job after I winning

56:57

that Yark rooman stilled my

56:59

gut, it's about this player on this profile

57:02

tape I made, and

57:04

and he just kind of told me like, hey, look man,

57:06

like this is this is what you got to do. This

57:09

is how you do it. And we went to

57:11

this college All Star game called the Cactus

57:13

Boll It was like this small school college

57:15

all star game down in Texas. This is

57:17

back when they saw like one forty yard dash and

57:20

stuff at All Star games. And I

57:22

remember it was just me and him and

57:24

every morning before he went out to

57:26

practice, we would sit in that lobby

57:29

and he would just tell me just all

57:31

the ins and outs of Rochster

57:33

building, team building. I

57:35

mean like he was he was

57:38

that guy, and you know he had

57:40

been in the league for

57:42

thirty years you know then

57:44

there and he just would just give

57:47

me so much knowledge and intel. So if

57:49

I there's a lot of guys, That's why I kind

57:52

of like that, because a lot of guys I

57:54

can name. I can name Lawrensman, Cunson, I

57:56

could, I can name

57:58

less need but uh,

58:01

from from the very gig go, I'd have to say the

58:03

game.

58:04

Who is the player that you remember being

58:07

most convicted about and using your voice

58:10

the loudest and maybe if you want to

58:12

say, pounding the table to be selected

58:14

in any any draft, any team you've been

58:16

a part of.

58:18

Hm hmm.

58:20

Could be a late round guy who you're like, hey, let's take

58:22

a shot on it. Could be a first round pick, someone

58:25

that you were like, this is my dude.

58:27

And I remember asking Jason Light about this and he was like,

58:30

in Philly, Trent Cole was my

58:32

guy. You know, like you just have this random guy. They're like,

58:34

that's my guy. You know.

58:35

For me, it was John Johnson,

58:39

the safety BC.

58:42

Talk about it. I love this.

58:43

So it was funny that draft.

58:47

I remember it was like that's when we first

58:49

hired Sean McVay, and

58:51

you know, we had a lot of new

58:53

coaches and Less, you know,

58:55

Less was in that whole hiring process,

58:58

so you know,

59:00

he usually is like deep diving and everything

59:02

all the time. He didn't have that kind of time

59:04

because we're doing this.

59:05

No, he's interviewing Doug Maroon and guy.

59:08

Regime makeover and

59:10

so I'll never forget.

59:13

We get into the third round and you

59:15

get to those points in the draft where

59:19

the board just looks kind of foggy,

59:21

like no one's really standing

59:24

out. No, one's really it's

59:26

just kind of just static and staying

59:29

and everyone's kind of staring at

59:31

it, and you know, everybody

59:34

started names and I just said I was just like John

59:37

Johnson. I said, just let's just pick John

59:39

Johnson. And I never forget

59:41

Wade Phillips. He looks over

59:44

at me and he's like John Johnson. I said,

59:46

I'm telling you, this guy's a starter, Like he's a starter.

59:48

So Wade Phillips. I love Way Phillips.

59:50

He just like, oh, he's a starter man.

59:56

And so I just and so I just kept on the

59:58

table for John Johnson. I said, I'm telling

1:00:00

you John Johnson, like, because I

1:00:02

remember I went out the BC Yukon game

1:00:05

saw him live, Like I just love what I

1:00:07

saw out of him, like another guy just

1:00:09

high and tangible is how working. I actually

1:00:12

thought he was going to be more of a coverage

1:00:14

player and then he actually transformed

1:00:16

himself into more of a box kind

1:00:19

of player. But I'll never forget.

1:00:21

I just that that was the moment I think

1:00:23

that I felt like, you know, I had just

1:00:25

like a voice, and I think it was a needed voice

1:00:28

because everybody

1:00:30

was new, Like, you know, he had a whole new

1:00:32

coaching staff. You know, we did just a lot

1:00:34

of change and you know,

1:00:36

make over there and I'll never forget,

1:00:39

you know, I just had a lot of.

1:00:41

You're in New Orleans NFC Championship

1:00:43

game a few years later, who makes the biggest play of the game.

1:00:46

Oh well, you

1:00:49

can say a lot of guys did, but

1:00:53

I actually think Jared Golf played one

1:00:55

of his best games there. Johnson

1:00:58

john made the big thing at the end.

1:01:01

Yeah, that Golf was

1:01:03

awesome in that game. You know everyone, And I've

1:01:05

worked with Sean Payton this past year and he's

1:01:07

still sensitive about it because obviously the non

1:01:09

call on the Nicole Roby Coleman thing. But I always

1:01:12

said, you're up thirteen

1:01:14

to nothing at home, you got you got

1:01:16

the ball first in overtime, you got to close

1:01:18

the door. But Jared Golf that day

1:01:21

would not quit it.

1:01:24

Like what people don't realize about the game.

1:01:26

It was. It was the loudest

1:01:28

thing ever. And

1:01:31

it's like he literally he couldn't hear his headset

1:01:33

win all these He's busting

1:01:35

enough to try to run to the receiver before

1:01:38

the PLAYFOD game to tell him to sit like that.

1:01:41

It wasn't just about his stats, about him throwing.

1:01:43

It was about the adversity came through. But it's

1:01:45

funny saying that about Sean Payton because I

1:01:48

talked about I talked to Dan about that game

1:01:51

and this is when sure,

1:01:54

yeah, and and you know

1:01:56

Dan, like me and Dan are just we're

1:01:59

so much like the same in person. Dan

1:02:01

he never said anything about all

1:02:04

that call was. You know, No,

1:02:06

he was like, no, we shouldn't

1:02:08

have put ourselves in position to actually

1:02:11

get to up you know what I mean, Like, you

1:02:13

know, he like, we're all about accountability,

1:02:15

Like that's just waying so much in

1:02:18

our building. And Dan was like, no,

1:02:20

no, man, we shouldn't have put ourselves in

1:02:22

the position to actually give y'all

1:02:24

an opportunity to do that, you know what I mean. So you

1:02:27

know, you gotta love Dan's response on

1:02:29

that. This is like, that's such a Dan Campbell.

1:02:32

Were you were you at Jared Goff's

1:02:35

pro day at Cow? Were you there

1:02:37

that day?

1:02:37

No? I wasn't at the pro day.

1:02:39

They speak, they speaking legendary. I

1:02:41

mean, I think Mike Silver wrote a beautiful piece on it

1:02:44

when it happened. But like the Rams,

1:02:46

whatever its private workout or a private.

1:02:48

It was a problem. Range.

1:02:51

Yeah, we actually purposely

1:02:53

didn't really send people out to his pro

1:02:56

daye because we kind of, yeah,

1:02:58

we kind of wanted to keep it close of the best.

1:03:01

But no, I remember the

1:03:03

private workout and I wasn't there,

1:03:05

but I know less you know,

1:03:08

Jeff, all those guys were there and

1:03:10

you just heard it was just like man

1:03:13

like because I think they did him and Carson

1:03:15

Wentz like back to back, and

1:03:19

I guess you know, it was all good for

1:03:21

Carson Wentz in terms of the weather and the conditions,

1:03:24

but Jared and I never I

1:03:26

think we kind of gave Jared a choice

1:03:28

to move the.

1:03:29

Location and he's like,

1:03:31

no.

1:03:32

Let's go, and and he

1:03:34

was out there just whipping it, man, and he's

1:03:36

extremely talented, and I'm

1:03:39

so happy for him. Just kind of too.

1:03:43

I mean, I've been covering Jared since he got in, but like

1:03:45

for you, it's a personal connection where you

1:03:47

know, you draft him in La

1:03:50

then you yourself get this job in Detroit in the

1:03:52

first big movie you make, because you trade their franchise

1:03:54

quarterback. And it almost felt like it was a throw in, like

1:03:56

yeah, we'll give you golf, but here's

1:03:59

Jared Goff. Last year as one of the best quarterbacks

1:04:01

in the NFC.

1:04:02

Well, I remember when we were hammering

1:04:04

out the details of the trade. I'm

1:04:07

because you know, it was kind of that carousel

1:04:09

of available quarterbacks that year in

1:04:11

terms of like who was going to be available. So obviously

1:04:15

you know Stafford was getting traded

1:04:17

to the Rams, but I never, forget less asked

1:04:20

me. He was like, do you want Jared

1:04:22

in this trade? And I was like, hell

1:04:25

yeah, like absolutely, Like

1:04:27

it wasn't like, just give me any quarterback

1:04:29

and I was like, no, I want Jared in this trade.

1:04:32

And the reason why I'm so proud

1:04:35

of him and I'm so happy for him is because

1:04:38

that first year, man, like you

1:04:40

know, look, it was almost like the

1:04:43

guy as a starter in LA, Like

1:04:45

we're out of five years, he's in

1:04:47

the postseason, if not super Bowl,

1:04:49

and so it's like

1:04:54

the one year that he did. But yeah,

1:04:57

so like we make the trade, and

1:05:00

the way that the narrative was of how

1:05:03

the trade went, it kind of went like, up

1:05:05

when Jared Goff can play? And I'm like, dude,

1:05:07

this guy was just in the divisional playing with

1:05:10

a broken hand, completing seven percent

1:05:12

of his passes, Like why can't he play anymore?

1:05:14

So then we start the season and

1:05:17

me and Dan we tear the roster down to

1:05:19

the stunt. I mean literally, the only thing

1:05:21

we really had was an offensive line,

1:05:24

and even all of those guys got hurt.

1:05:26

I mean, besides Fenny Sewell, all

1:05:29

those guys are beat up. So we

1:05:31

really didn't have much in the skill player

1:05:33

department. We didn't really, I mean, we had a beat

1:05:36

up offensive line. We didn't really have any weapons

1:05:38

around him to throw to, Like we

1:05:40

thought that we didn't have any money to play with

1:05:42

in free agency really, so we kind

1:05:44

of had to play the cow formula. And

1:05:47

then we got Tyroll Williams number Shan Paarriman

1:05:50

as like the oh

1:05:52

we have those guys, and then Tyler Williams kind

1:05:55

of gets hurt. He's there. We cut with Sean

1:05:57

Pairman. So now we have like this

1:05:59

rookie a Moners Brown and

1:06:03

that like that's it and so and

1:06:05

then we kind of claim but you

1:06:07

know, everything that he went through that

1:06:10

year, I mean, you know, you

1:06:12

gotta think Detroit, you're

1:06:15

talking about a football town, Like this

1:06:18

is a fan base that is

1:06:20

unlike anything I've ever experienced.

1:06:23

Like this fan base

1:06:26

they care about their football.

1:06:29

I mean, it's legit I

1:06:31

absolutely love them, but

1:06:33

they're mad at Jared. I mean, he was getting

1:06:35

the booze and all that, and

1:06:37

I'm like, all right, we don't have any

1:06:40

weapons for this guy. Offensive line is

1:06:42

beat up. We had to make a mid season

1:06:44

offensive coordinator change

1:06:48

plays for the first time. Actually did

1:06:50

a really good job at it. But and

1:06:52

I'm like, what quarterback

1:06:55

would be successful going

1:06:57

through that kind of situation?

1:07:00

Way, Like, I don't I don't know what quarterback

1:07:02

would be six.

1:07:03

I like, I tell you something

1:07:05

also doesn't happen.

1:07:07

An offensive line didn't have a no c Like

1:07:10

do.

1:07:10

You know where I got my respect for him? The toughness and

1:07:12

all that's great, and that's quarterbacks. And yeah,

1:07:14

didn't say a peep, didn't speak negatively

1:07:16

about McVeigh once, even though there was rumors out

1:07:18

there that like, oh yeah, McVeigh couldn't win within him just

1:07:21

kind of put his head down,

1:07:23

went to work. Okay, I'm a quarterback,

1:07:26

let's go. And I know he's a number one pick and he makes a lot of

1:07:28

money. And everyone says, well, that's what It's a

1:07:30

lot easier said than done.

1:07:32

Absolutely absolutely, And that's

1:07:34

I've always said about Yeah, like you said, like the toughness.

1:07:37

Yeah, the quarter you gotta have that, but the

1:07:39

mental and I've always respected Jereds's

1:07:41

mental toughness, Like he that's one

1:07:44

trait of him that I think kind

1:07:46

of goes under the radar a little bit, but

1:07:49

he has like top level,

1:07:51

elite mental toughness because I've seen a lot

1:07:53

of things that he's been to, Like if something off that NFC

1:07:55

Championship game first New Orleans,

1:07:57

like people want to talk about, like the

1:08:00

noise that he had to deal with and all that stuff,

1:08:02

But he goes to that twenty one season and

1:08:04

he does not complain. He

1:08:07

just goes through it and it starts coming

1:08:09

together late in the season and

1:08:11

then you know, he has a year that he had last

1:08:13

year, and now it's like, oh, Jared

1:08:16

Golf's good, And I'm like, well,

1:08:18

he's actually always been good.

1:08:21

But everybody, like I talk about the psychology

1:08:23

of the process, it's the recency

1:08:25

box, and it's like, oh, well, the

1:08:28

last thing we saw is Jared Golf got cast

1:08:30

it off, so he can't play anymore. It the last

1:08:32

thing we saw is him in twenty twenty one, so he can't

1:08:34

play anymore, right, Like I'm like, no,

1:08:37

he can't play. So when he had

1:08:39

the season he had last year, I think

1:08:41

a lot of people were like, oh, Jared

1:08:43

Golf, and I'm like, no, he's

1:08:46

He's always been a good quarterback. He's always

1:08:48

been uber talented, you know, he's always had

1:08:50

those traits to excel

1:08:53

the football team. And so again

1:08:55

I'm just super happy. But like what you're saying

1:08:57

about him, not complaining him, not you

1:09:00

know, saying this and that, Like

1:09:03

that's what makes him pretty cool. He's

1:09:05

a Detroit line like he's

1:09:07

he's he's that, Like he's

1:09:10

embodied what the city's

1:09:12

about. And I think the toughness and

1:09:14

everything that he's endured, and i think everybody

1:09:16

just has a lot more appreciation about him. Man. Again,

1:09:19

i think we'll be even better offensively

1:09:22

this year coming up. And I'm

1:09:24

just I'm excited about it.

1:09:25

All Right, we've been on for over now, we're going to wrap it here one

1:09:28

last Yeah, it's been amazing. I

1:09:30

could do I could honestly do an audiobook with you for six

1:09:32

hours. I'm loving this. I want to talk about

1:09:34

Tavon Austin. I want to talk about Steedman Bailey.

1:09:36

I want to go I want to go deep. I want

1:09:39

to go deep, dude, I

1:09:41

want to talk about what that was Another one of.

1:09:43

Those drafts though, man like that

1:09:45

twenty thirteen drafts.

1:09:46

Man, I know I want to talk Toby Dress

1:09:49

for the next hour with you. Let's

1:09:51

wrap it with this. Lions fans listening. This

1:09:53

is the first time in two decades I'd say that they

1:09:55

actually have a little pep in their step and there's

1:09:57

actual some national media attention saying the Lions

1:10:00

could be the team. I know you're

1:10:02

excited with what you've built. What would be your message to Lions

1:10:04

fans as we head towards the start a training camp.

1:10:06

You know, just continue to stick with

1:10:08

us and just continue to know that

1:10:10

we're not done yet, and just know

1:10:13

that we're always gonna work hard,

1:10:15

keep our pedal to the metal, is going to stay

1:10:17

aggressive. You know. I

1:10:20

love the fact that it's a lot of

1:10:22

this what they call buzz and hope,

1:10:24

and I think this fan base and

1:10:27

our city deserves that

1:10:29

just through all that they've been through. But

1:10:32

at the end of the day, me and Dan

1:10:34

know that, you know, we hadn't made the playoffs

1:10:36

yet, and so that's that that's

1:10:38

what has to be. We got to get in the dance

1:10:41

and Uh, you know we we we have

1:10:43

full faith and optimism that I think

1:10:45

we have the right structure place, uh

1:10:47

that that we can we can get that done.

1:10:49

But uh, we got to go out and improve it. And

1:10:52

that's that's how we're wired. We're

1:10:54

we're all about accountability and earning

1:10:56

it and do it the right way. And that's what the

1:10:59

city of Detroit is. It's roll up to sleeves,

1:11:02

get it done, no excuses, and

1:11:05

just know that you know that your

1:11:07

your your football team is doing the exact

1:11:09

same thing. And I think it's a lot

1:11:11

of reasons for the optimism and

1:11:14

excitement, but I do think

1:11:16

that you know, all the very

1:11:19

healthy and all that. I do think

1:11:21

that the fans would be really excited.

1:11:23

And first game Thursday

1:11:25

night kickoffs.

1:11:26

Absolutely, Brad Holmes, this was awesome.

1:11:29

Honestly, I feel like we should do a weekly hour

1:11:31

long show.

1:11:32

Oh this is awesome. I didn't even know it's an hour.

1:11:34

I'm like, you've been a good conversation.

1:11:36

Out the clocks. I love talking to you.

1:11:38

I think you're great at what you do. But I really honestly

1:11:41

think you've got great perspective, not only

1:11:43

on football, but on life. And it's

1:11:46

cool your path man. I didn't know the enterprise running car stuff,

1:11:48

but it makes a lot of sense to me. Yeah, as well

1:11:50

rounded a guy as you'll meet in the NFL. I love

1:11:52

you coming on. Thanks so much for joining.

1:11:54

Thanks a lot. You do it the right way

1:11:56

man. I got a lot of respect for what you do. Man,

1:11:58

And you know you.

1:12:01

Hey, I had I had Jack Campbell in my top

1:12:03

ten just so you know. In

1:12:09

Brad Holmes, everybody thanks Brad. All

1:12:12

right, all

1:12:16

right, So if you're listening to that, you're like,

1:12:18

all right, this is the guy. That's the guy. The Lions

1:12:20

are in great hands.

1:12:21

Aaron.

1:12:21

I don't know if you had a great familiarity with

1:12:24

with Brad Holmes. Aaron Kaufman, my producer,

1:12:27

your thoughts.

1:12:28

I mean, I love hearing his like

1:12:31

his stories from the draft room and and you

1:12:33

know, it's such a real story. Everyone

1:12:36

is talking about every pick and the

1:12:38

Lions in particular had so many comments

1:12:41

that you every draft pundit is

1:12:43

talking about they took the wrong

1:12:45

people at each spot. And I love

1:12:47

hearing him just being like, no, this

1:12:49

guy was was like you said, yeah,

1:12:52

who we.

1:12:53

Want Amble as a top fourteen guy, So

1:12:55

screw it. We're taking him

1:12:58

Enterprise rental car to working

1:13:01

as a as an assistant to the media

1:13:03

coordinator with the Atlanta Hawks in a different sport,

1:13:05

to working at the airport. Like I

1:13:08

hear that stuff and it's like, yeah, there's there's

1:13:10

it takes hard.

1:13:11

Work, yeah, yeah, and

1:13:14

his resilience and like sticking with

1:13:16

it and just I also loved

1:13:19

I was out in the field and I saw these guys that were

1:13:21

over there helping with practice.

1:13:22

I was like, what are they?

1:13:23

Oh?

1:13:23

I want to be that. Yeah,

1:13:27

Brad Holmes was awesome. If you're listening

1:13:29

and you're Alliance fan, I think you got to feel pretty

1:13:31

good. If you're not a Lions fan, you gotta at least respect

1:13:33

the hell of the guy who's calling the shots in the front office.

1:13:36

This is the season with Peter Schrieger is what we do.

1:13:38

We talk to men and women around the league

1:13:41

and we try to get them in a different light than you usually see

1:13:43

in front of a press conference or at

1:13:45

a podium. It's produced by the great Aaron

1:13:47

Wan Kaufman. I want to thank Chason

1:13:49

English. I want to thank Kurt, our editor,

1:13:51

who's going to do a bang up job on this. I want

1:13:53

to thank Jack Rudd, our music maestro.

1:13:56

I also want to thank over on the NFL

1:13:58

side, the great Jason Kleinman and

1:14:00

Matt Schneider and Meredith Batt and

1:14:02

David Jurenka and their team at NFL

1:14:05

Media having a blast. Gu season

1:14:07

is rapidly approaching, but these off

1:14:09

season episodes are some of my favorite. Hope you listen

1:14:11

to next week's Got Another Good Guest Up Ahead

1:14:22

the season with Peter Schrager is a production

1:14:24

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1:14:27

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