0:06

This is the sounding board podcast with

0:08

Hachian Deimu. Thanks to Drinkwise.

0:10

If you're choosing to have a drink,

0:12

choose to Drinkwise. Good

0:14

to have your company on the sounding board

0:16

for Drinkwise. If you're choosing to drink, choose

0:18

to Drinkwise. It's a Tuesday morning of this

0:21

particular week. It's episode eight of the ninth

0:23

series of the sounding board for Drinkwise and

0:25

it's almost becoming regular and I'm enjoying it.

0:27

I think we get a better product when

0:29

Craig Cucheson is in the studio in

0:31

person. Hello. Hello, Domo. What

0:34

a week it's been in the world of media

0:36

and sport and news limited for

0:38

you and a big Easter week

0:40

in a footy head. So it's nice to be in Melbourne

0:42

for a rare change. No, it's pretty regular this year. I

0:44

think you've only had the one down the line this year

0:46

and I think it's a better product when we're about a

0:49

half a metre away. I don't think it's much of a

0:51

product and on a good day. No, let's all say true

0:53

too. But as we know and as we often say, we

0:55

just do it because we now amuse ourselves in it, doesn't

0:57

matter if no one cares. It's become that way. Where would

0:59

you like to start Domo? Well, you want me to start

1:01

somewhere and this is where our list is, I think, are

1:03

on to you. You load me up off

1:06

air with stuff that you know gets me going. Well,

1:08

News Limited, the front pages today were the one

1:10

that got... You had mail last night. You

1:13

had mail last night at the front pages of the

1:15

News Limited around the country today. I didn't have mail.

1:18

What I had was there's going to be

1:20

a launch of a big New York directive

1:22

from the base of New

1:25

York's News Limited operations. So we're

1:27

talking Rupert Murdoch had read

1:29

the right act about this whole meta thing to

1:32

all people associated in senior

1:34

management in Australia and

1:36

to go hard. Did it land on the front of

1:38

every one of you? As we are talking this morning...

1:40

You've been there anxiously. No, I still get the Herald

1:42

Sun delivered. So

1:45

yes, it was there and I've taken a photo of

1:47

that one, Hachi, for us. Where is it? Here

1:50

it is. On the

1:52

front of the Herald Sun this morning

1:54

is an attack on meta. Now,

1:57

it's on the front page, anti-social

1:59

meta. media bots Troll Kate. So

2:01

we're now bringing Kate Middleton into this

2:04

war that News Limited is trying to mount

2:06

against Meta. And this is all, as I say

2:08

Hachi, follow the money, Meta's pulling the money.

2:10

Meta's pulling the money so now Meta's evil, even

2:12

though the Herald Sun has actually helped its

2:15

own cause for it for many years using

2:17

Meta. It now hates Meta so we're going

2:19

to... Now on the Daily Telegraph in Sydney,

2:21

face off. This on the whole front page,

2:23

massive photo, it's got some young girls on

2:25

it. I'll just read the first paragraph and

2:27

this is an exclusive, and again it's anti-Meta,

2:30

Australian children should not have smartphones

2:32

before they are 14 due to

2:35

the serious mental and

2:37

physical health risks posed by

2:39

unregulated access to Meta platforms such

2:41

as Facebook and Instagram. A

2:44

whistleblower has warned. So you've got a famous

2:46

whistleblower now leading the front page story. I

2:48

saw that. So the whistleblower's not

2:51

new. The whistleblower was Ms. Hagen. I

2:54

think Hagen. You got further into the article than

2:57

I did. I did. Francis Hagen. Now

2:59

Francis Hagen was an

3:01

ex-product member at Meta

3:03

who in 2021 was

3:06

a quite un-quite whistleblower or just given

3:08

an insight into what Francis

3:10

thought of the tactics. I'm

3:12

not questioning Francis, she can

3:15

have a view. And when

3:18

all of the media outlets were in

3:21

cahoots with Meta, it was amazing how little Francis

3:23

was courted over that three year period from 2021.

3:25

You really were too blowing in? In fact,

3:27

you could

3:30

not have found a story

3:33

on Francis in the last three years anyway. And

3:35

now Francis is

3:37

doing exclusive interviews. And

3:39

what I found interesting in this was Francis

3:41

in all seriousness. And by the way, there's some very

3:43

significant themes in this story. So I don't want to

3:47

discredit any of the

3:49

very meaningful and

3:52

worthwhile commentary around. Anyone with a

3:54

child of any age basically

3:56

these days, let's go with five or six years

3:58

on, knows what this issue's about. about but it's

4:00

only been becoming an issue in the eyes of News

4:02

Limited because Met is pulling the money. Yeah so the

4:05

argument around year eight

4:08

and fourteen is old and some really meaningful

4:10

things. I've

4:12

got a 20 year old, a million year old and an 18 year

4:14

old and it's an issue. It's an issue for you. We acknowledge that

4:17

but the fact that all of a

4:19

sudden now Francis is speaking at CyberCon today at

4:21

a conference in Canberra and they've got the exclusive

4:23

interview ahead. Now did replay

4:27

this for me. Was

4:30

Francis speaking already at CyberCon? I

4:33

don't know. I didn't get that phone

4:35

of the article. If so would that have been

4:37

covered in the way that it's suddenly now big

4:39

news. I can't imagine CyberCon getting too much coverage.

4:41

Was it suggested to CyberCon that Francis would make

4:44

a very good whistle block keynote speaker? Yeah. And

4:46

how did the how did

4:48

we all play out to get to today? Well

4:50

I'll paraphrase you this way. The

4:52

care and the need to give

4:55

the public the warning on the

4:57

dangers of social media. It's amazing

4:59

how it's coincided with the

5:02

social media companies in question in these articles

5:04

on the front page have pulled their spend,

5:06

their money spent. They're hundreds

5:08

of millions of dollars pinned through news limited

5:10

operations. It's amazing how it's coincided with that.

5:13

I'd divide devil's advocate for just a moment.

5:15

News would argue and others would argue, other

5:17

publishers, as when I'm defensive of journalism and

5:19

this, would argue that the news

5:22

they were delivering Facebook or

5:24

Meta is now no longer there

5:27

and will be replaced by things such as this.

5:29

So the degree of governance and standards. Also the

5:31

newsletter papers are now going to be the barometer

5:34

on what's right and right in this. But

5:36

it is an interesting, really shifted gear. What's

5:38

beyond dispute is

5:40

the coverage has been given is disproportionate

5:42

to the public interest in it. There's

5:44

not many people sitting home going, what's

5:47

gonna happen today in the meta

5:49

versus news limited battle. It

5:51

is given, is it being given disproportionate coverage?

5:54

What is in dispute is whether that is a little

5:57

self-serving or whether it is actually in the

5:59

and meaningful public interest. Not in dispute, I'll

6:01

take public interest. Not in dispute. So take

6:04

me through this because we often talk and

6:06

you've dubbed it and it was dubbed sort

6:08

of colloquially inside the building as the morning

6:10

prayers where each individual paper has its meeting

6:12

at whatever time it was. I think when

6:14

I was there, it was the first meeting was about say

6:16

10am maybe for that next day's paper and then you'd have

6:19

subsequent meetings for that. And everyone of

6:21

any note in the building used to find themselves

6:23

in that room and the editors of each of

6:25

the sections would kick up. I've got the big

6:28

story. The day would unfold. So

6:30

that's the individual papers morning prayers. How

6:32

would this work? This is

6:34

and we know this to be the case. This

6:36

is a New York director. So this

6:38

is a next level morning prayer, isn't it? Is

6:41

this a full on St Patrick's Cathedral service? I

6:45

remember sitting in morning prayers from time to time back in the day.

6:51

Did you ever sit in the morning prayers? You got called in

6:53

if you had a story and they wanted a bit more clarity

6:55

on it. And I couldn't. Yeah. And then

6:57

you realize you've been competing against someone else trying to

6:59

sell a story. What my memory was

7:01

was that no one had a first name. They'd

7:04

go. You might find

7:06

Murdoch's been on the phone. No,

7:08

no, no. It was always Rupert. And

7:11

then it became Uncle Rupert as a... Okay.

7:13

Well, leave the Murdoch's here from it. They want Lynch

7:15

to write a story today. It

7:18

was just Jared Lynch. So everyone had

7:21

a, you know, what's she and Garwood in spot? Everyone

7:23

just had one surname in my memory. No one had

7:25

a first name. I don't know if you remember that.

7:28

And then the jockeying to write the story

7:30

is high. So Jared Lynch has got

7:32

his byline on the meta-holding

7:34

his hostage story. Don't give into the threats today. Right.

7:38

That's doing more career enhancing than 10 stories

7:40

on the public. So that's the other layer too, isn't it? Yeah.

7:43

Getting involved in these New York... It's come down the

7:45

line. It's come down the line overnight. We

7:48

would know who and why is having a look at this. I'm

7:52

just trying to find out what's going on

7:54

with the career mile and also the whatever

7:56

time as we talk. Where we differ, Damon?

7:58

Yes. They

8:01

are absolutely entitled to use their newspapers,

8:04

dot coms and

8:07

media assets as they we differ on this. They

8:09

are entitled to. They're a commercial business. They're not

8:11

the ABC. We'll get to Kim Williams' comments in

8:13

a moment. That was fascinating during the week. Kim

8:15

Williams. Yeah. Well,

8:17

I might start there. Yeah. Tell

8:20

us. Kim, we should move on. Yeah. I

8:23

don't know how we, did we miss this? Or

8:25

we may be covered. I'd just forgotten it. So

8:27

Ida Butrow's time as head of ABC's coming to

8:29

an end and Kim Williams. And Kim Williams, you

8:31

would have come across him. Even I have. He

8:34

sat on the AFL Commission on stage two.

8:36

He was head of Foxtel, I think it

8:38

was, wasn't it? Yeah. So

8:41

I always, and again, a few times I've

8:43

spoken to him, I just found him super,

8:45

super intelligent. As intelligent

8:47

a person as you could come across in our trade.

8:49

Is that a fair assessment of him? Yeah. Very

8:52

well respected. We've seen the commercial side and

8:54

we've just talked about one of those businesses

8:56

being News Limited. He's seen that side. He's

8:58

driven that side. And now he's

9:00

running the ABC and Monica Attard interviewed him

9:02

on a podcast during the week. And obviously

9:04

News Limited papers picked it up. And

9:07

let's delve into this. Very respected in the

9:09

news system. Oh, absolutely is. And

9:11

listen to this here. So I'll just do one

9:14

generic sort of take of Kim

9:16

Williams Hunchy here on this podcast with

9:18

Monica Attard. It's just about,

9:20

I suppose, the ABC,

9:22

which he's now going to be in charge

9:24

of, being respondents to what the public wants

9:27

to hear. I think it's a fascinating debate.

9:29

We talk about it regularly in our way.

9:31

Let's hear it through Kim Williams' words. You

9:34

know, I have grave difficulty

9:37

with journalists being a respondent to

9:39

what the public wants to hear.

9:42

I don't think the public gets

9:44

to dictate what the recital of

9:47

factual information in relation to human

9:49

affairs composes and comprises. I

9:51

don't think that is a balanced or

9:53

fair view of journalism at all. I

9:56

mean, going right back in journalism to

9:58

the writings of people. like Walter

10:00

Lippmann and that famous piece

10:02

that he wrote on News and

10:05

Liberty in the Atlantic in

10:07

1919 and then subsequently wrote

10:09

a small volume about these very

10:11

issues in 1920. The

10:15

recognition is there that objectivity

10:17

is always an aspirational objective

10:21

because we don't know what no one

10:23

ever knows enough. No one ever is

10:26

sufficiently centered in a wide

10:28

enough body of information to give

10:30

you a perfect rendition of what

10:32

is happening. But to

10:34

actually pollute that with the view

10:36

that in many instances

10:39

people are profound prejudice who are

10:41

contributing to public conversation on these

10:44

things should in some way impact

10:46

the way in which a journalist

10:48

is going about their professional duty

10:51

is a very long bow in my view.

10:53

So cover take-outs there, Harsi, and it's a

10:55

longer grab than we would normally play on

10:57

this program. Not sure I was getting a

11:00

job for the Daily Mail any time I've seen Kim on that

11:02

basis. But what are you referring

11:04

to there? I've got no idea what you're referring to about this article

11:06

written in this view in 1919-1920. This

11:08

has been a hundred year issue. We think

11:11

it's a social media issue. He's actually so

11:13

educated and so intelligent he knows effectively the

11:15

origins of what happens in this space. And

11:18

again now being the head of the

11:20

ABC which is held to a different

11:22

standard to the rest of the media

11:24

organizations. Rightly or wrongly? Well

11:27

it's perceived to be and I still view it

11:29

as differently. Are its prejudices more excused than the

11:31

commercial media? They're not more excused. I just think

11:33

they're different. And I think there's still a base

11:35

somewhere in the building and I clearly now get

11:37

that feeling under Kim Williams there will be. Not

11:40

that I'm saying there wasn't under either. Do you

11:42

think there's a political vote in the ABC building

11:44

that the votes would match and mirror the public?

11:50

Do you think it's a fair

11:52

microcosm of the society? No but

11:54

that's, you're getting off track here.

11:57

Why? I think his notion, his

11:59

unbelief... Noble. Noble. Good

12:02

luck carrying it out. I think the execution that is going to

12:04

be very difficult in a building like the ABC.

12:08

And I think it's very out of step where we're modern

12:10

digital journalism. You're not listening

12:12

to what I'm... The reason I wanted to raise that particular part

12:14

of that interview was media outlets

12:16

being respondents to what the public wants to

12:18

hear. We're all guilty of that, aren't we?

12:21

We work on TV shows. I don't think it's guilty

12:23

though. I think it is what digital journalism is. I

12:27

think if you read the Herald Sun, The Age,

12:29

anyone, watch Channel 9, 40 Class, whatever your platform

12:31

may be, it is a perceived attempt to tap

12:33

into what the public will consume. I would argue

12:36

too many outlets, and I'm talking about... And

12:38

again, I'm not washing my hands of any of this, by the way. I

12:41

fear whether we do it ourselves or

12:43

we work with and for people who

12:45

are attuned to what the public is

12:48

saying, does space a lot

12:50

of content around what they think the public

12:52

wants to hear. And that never used to

12:54

be the case. Or what we think we

12:56

can get the public to say. And that's

12:58

another version. They may not even be of

13:00

that view yet, but arrive there

13:02

based upon the way that something's covered, which

13:04

is the manufacturer. We've talked about this in the past

13:07

and manufacturing stories too. So

13:10

what Kim's saying there is that journalism should

13:12

be a matter of public record and the

13:14

interest in the public, I think I'm interpreting

13:17

right, should not be the biggest... From the public, should

13:19

not be the biggest lever in... And it never should be, but it is

13:21

though, isn't it? But it is in

13:23

everywhere other than the ABC, it is on scale. And the ABC, I

13:25

would argue, is the other way. It often

13:28

is at times what's in the interest of the journalist

13:30

at the ABC. Yeah, and that's equally

13:32

wrong. And opposed to the audience. I think

13:34

that's what he's saying there though. It's a

13:36

different problem. Yeah. So again,

13:38

we'll just do one more grab here. And this

13:40

is, again, News Limited papers picked up this piece

13:42

and they wanted to go down their certain angles

13:44

because they've got other agendas and objectives. No, that's

13:46

not... No, no, no, that's exactly

13:49

true. They were fair and reasonable enough to cover

13:51

it. Yeah, but they didn't cover this bit. Okay.

13:53

This is the bit I want to play. So are you saying

13:55

there that when journalists, ABC journalists do

13:58

come under attack, for example... as

14:00

they do very regularly in the pages

14:02

of newspapers. Ignore it.

14:04

Move away. Don't look at it. Don't read it. Don't look at

14:07

it. Frankly, that is my

14:09

view. I think few

14:11

people have the capacity to

14:13

read something and send it

14:16

to the deserved dustbin. They

14:19

tend to be deeply affected by

14:21

it. Now, that may be to

14:23

varying degrees, but very few

14:25

people are able to actually process

14:28

that information and be unmoved by

14:30

it. Probably some of the few

14:32

people in society who have a

14:34

well-developed capacity in that

14:37

regard are politicians because

14:39

they receive so much of it and

14:41

that they are able to stand back

14:43

and keep going. An articulate

14:45

answer. Yeah, it is. It's

14:48

an articulate answer. But he's right. A

14:50

lot of the

14:52

public perhaps don't see me included

14:55

through what is right, wrong, or

14:57

fair in a story they read

14:59

because they are reading it quickly and on

15:01

scale and trying to dissect it

15:04

in real time. We lighten things up a bit.

15:06

We've been a bit heavy. This is

15:08

unintended. We've got those issues down for comment, but

15:10

I didn't mean to go in that order. Just

15:12

stand upon this. You wound me up. You wound

15:14

me up on news again. Listen,

15:18

you're a customer. You buy the paper. You just deliver.

15:20

Just enjoy it. Relax. You lob these loaded statements, questions,

15:22

hey, look into these things in our WhatsApp group and

15:24

you know that I'm not going to be able to

15:26

help myself, but to go down that part. I'll lighten

15:28

a little bit. I want to go Cane Corns

15:30

next. Before you go there. I want to lighten it right up. Before

15:32

you go there. Our producers, if we'll have

15:35

this ready for me. There's a famous ad

15:37

demo in the 1980s that has

15:39

really become the genesis of what journalism

15:41

is becoming. Hit the ad

15:43

for me with Jack Thompson. Good

15:47

night, Jack. Good bit of writing. What

15:49

do you have? I have a

15:51

Clayton's and Dry, thanks. Plenty of ice. The

15:54

drink you have? When I'm not having a

15:56

drink. Reckon

15:58

you can handle the river crossing? Oh,

16:03

but I have a double scotch too, for

16:05

the horse. Clayton's

16:08

the drink you have when you're not having a

16:11

drink. So now these days we've

16:13

got the story or the controversy you're having when

16:15

you're not having a controversy, right? I didn't know

16:17

where you were going. The

16:19

Clayton's story has become the modern story. How do

16:21

we get something out in the footy world so

16:23

there's the better discussion and we don't want to

16:25

have our fingerprints on the opinion. So

16:27

it's the outrage you're having when you're not having

16:30

an outrage. The Clayton's story you're having when you're

16:32

not having a story. We saw it last week with the

16:34

Collingwood Grand Prix Gala. Who

16:36

wrote this? Well,

16:39

no one wanted to say it's wrong

16:41

that Collingwood players were out the night. Who wrote this

16:43

story? I'm coming to that. Okay. So

16:45

it gets, I think a flippant mention

16:47

on footy classified on... Well, I was on

16:49

the program. Eddie Maguire raised that and again,

16:51

he raised it fully in context

16:54

just to sign off on this. On

16:56

the Wednesday night, Josh Dacos, the best

16:58

and first winner from last year, was

17:00

attending the Gala, the Grand Prix Gala

17:02

event, the night before a game. And

17:05

in context, he didn't actually criticize? It's

17:08

not about that I'm heading towards the

17:10

Friday story. So John

17:12

Relf wrote, Collingwood poor start can't

17:15

be blamed on the Grand Prix Gala when

17:17

they just looked old and slow, right? And

17:19

I thought, I clicked, I went, I didn't know that

17:21

at the Grand Prix Gala. It's interesting. Because

17:24

the pitcher's going to drive the click. Josh Dacos. I

17:26

saw the pitcher of Josh and Scott. I thought, oh, gee, that

17:29

sounds a bit close to game, but I'm going to read. The

17:31

first 12 paragraphs were about, don't blame

17:33

this. Right? Yeah.

17:35

But you got further than I did. But

17:37

in actual fact, it just laid down here. Sure, the

17:39

optics weren't good and... And this is after they'd lost

17:41

their third game for the end. And sure, some might

17:43

say that Ginnivin went and did it. And sure, some

17:46

might say it's the second time it's happened. But they

17:48

can't be blamed in isolation because of this. So he

17:50

disappeared? So he wrote the story without... He wrote the

17:52

Clayton story. Here's this controversy that

17:54

seeds in your thinking without saying it is. And

17:57

so I would not have known that they even went to

17:59

the Grand Prix Gala. Until I consumed

18:01

that story. Yeah. And then it got

18:03

a little bit of the Herald Sun saying there's

18:05

a controversy over there. It became a thing. No it

18:08

did not. It didn't come across my radar. To the

18:10

point where on Monday, Ralphie

18:12

then had to do the double down. Had

18:15

to or had nothing else to write. Grow up.

18:17

Get used to AFL stars intending to grab Priya

18:19

or red color. Grow up. Well that's

18:21

the first line. What did Jack Guinaman do wrong? Asked John

18:23

Ross. And he wrote the... Oh God. So

18:26

he's written the Clayton story which sort of gets it out

18:28

there and gets it to pay to get it discussed. And

18:30

then there's double down saying,

18:32

I'm outraged at people who are outraged at this. But

18:35

I didn't know it even would have happened unless I'd read

18:37

it in your story. No. And no one else cared. That

18:40

is what happens these days. People go, oh I don't really want

18:42

to put the... Yeah, no it's

18:44

not really enough to criticize but you just got to drive

18:46

consumption. So there are two stories out of the Clayton. In

18:48

the end there was five days on the... And

18:50

one most shape or form on the fact that

18:53

Josh D'Aikos and Scott Pendlebury attended. What we

18:55

haven't yet heard is, what's Jack Guinaman's view

18:58

of how they... There's another go

19:00

in this. So do you know what I mean? Like

19:03

it's become the Clayton Jahn of the 2024 era. And

19:07

Ralph Brown. Oh sorry, John Ralph Brown about that.

19:11

Let's lighten it up actually. That's heavy as well. I thought

19:13

that was light. Let's go to Cane Corns. I've been light

19:15

the whole time. Let's go to Cane Corns as well. Can

19:17

we? Yes. In

19:19

fact let us start this with a glass jaw or

19:21

a combination. And we'll work back. Your own glass jaw.

19:23

On my own glass jaw. On my own glass jaw.

19:25

Yeah, on my own glass jaw. Right on.

19:28

Hit the music, yeah. Someone's got to

19:30

go around. This can't happen. Someone's got

19:32

to go around. It's fabulous. It's stunning.

19:34

Now a

19:37

lot of people

19:44

put this into my head hachi from our listeners that we

19:46

needed to nominate this person as a glass jawer. And we

19:48

all love him. I'll do what you do. I'll smooth it

19:50

out first. We all love him. He's

19:52

one of the best of the spikes ever to play the game. He's

19:54

one of the nicest people in media. And

19:57

I love listening to him on media. But it's Matthew

19:59

Richardson this week, hachi. for his take on

20:01

Cane Corns' take on the

20:03

Sunday Footy show which was

20:06

not received well by Channel 7 people.

20:08

This is the Matthew Richardson take on

20:10

Cane Corns' take on Trent Cottren taking

20:13

the P1-55 and it's a different spelling to that

20:15

that I've just said. Thanks for that. Well, I

20:17

don't like to swear hutch here. I have let

20:19

a couple of swear words slip on this program.

20:21

I don't like to. Taking the P1-55 out

20:23

of two AFL Premiership captains bar getting

20:26

lower and lower. Clearly

20:28

posted... I've offended on Trent's behalf. Yeah,

20:30

I've offended on Trent's behalf and I think seemingly. Well, you

20:32

were part of the skit. You were seeing... I was a

20:34

part of the skit. On a panel. You heard chuckling in

20:36

the background. I was chuckling because I thought it was funny.

20:38

I don't know how you thought it was funny too because

20:41

people have told me they've spoken to you and you thought

20:43

it was hilarious. People have told you that it was funny.

20:45

Sources. You don't

20:47

have to go through sources. I'll see you a

20:49

minute away from me. I mean peggable source. It

20:51

was you. I laughed at it. It was

20:53

funny. It was a clever idea. Hopefully

20:57

it was taking the spirit that it was. No, I don't think it was taking the

20:59

spirit of me. No, I don't think it was. I don't

21:01

think it was. A couple of

21:03

things. We on our show take

21:05

more P1-55 out of ourselves and

21:07

each other than anyone else.

21:09

So that's what we do

21:12

to ourselves. Yeah, that doesn't necessarily excuse

21:14

how you are to others though. And

21:16

that's a fair point. I think that's a fair

21:18

point too. But I also think it's fair game

21:20

too. There's still allowance for a competitive nature.

21:22

I mean we're going to talk about potentially

21:24

the essence and edge. I mean the essence

21:26

wants to be competitive. There's competitive elements to

21:28

all of us. I mean there can't be

21:30

too highbrow about it. Because

21:33

everyone's fair game, aren't you? Everyone's fair

21:35

game. Did you think

21:37

it crossed any line? It

21:39

was up there to the line. No,

21:41

I thought it was just right. I

21:43

don't think there is a line. So I'm on the

21:46

worst judge of the line. Because I don't take

21:48

anything personally. I struggle when others do.

21:51

But I could see those who might have felt it was

21:53

close to the line. It was

21:55

funny. It was clever. It was well edited. That.

22:00

And. It is a reminder that trend and all for

22:03

that matter own the first year of broadcasting. It's.

22:05

A tough gig their of the a high achievers him

22:07

and I do so I'll figure it out but as

22:09

I did it to be produced. Am.

22:12

Very very well in the first you say because

22:14

they are going to take taunt looked if you

22:16

look back at Little Guest on Act Messy Lawyers

22:18

now may not in the I would argue it.

22:21

Is. Because he won the country yet we we have a look at

22:23

his word. Fifteen years ago, He. Wasn't million at

22:25

the level of strength thought? you know? M.

22:29

M. He wasn't as am

22:31

authorities authority there with them and any delivery

22:33

is deliver your blender just as everyone delivery

22:35

sent to that point him this but when

22:38

it was funny. Or. Shortlisted:

22:40

It. It was the last one of it's

22:42

I'd have spoken to kind I've seen transit

22:44

center. In. Our he was into for.

22:48

Gebhardt Olivetti Hawthorne Boss

22:50

Business. Or pleasure did

22:52

that gives it a causes the case a

22:54

genius or your sixty's when you visit the

22:56

time when the victorian style government decided by

22:58

along the contracted they went in sword and.to

23:00

run the twenty twenty six com of games

23:02

and then the sort of the taken to

23:04

the regional areas and and one of the

23:06

do a certain way that that suited den

23:08

and or is who is that that tommy

23:10

charge on the government and as when everything

23:12

was done on the he wants his wife

23:14

a then decided though hang on his got

23:16

to be gone us we're just gonna bile

23:18

a many to sort of the bio attack

23:20

this remove the. Be government from the running

23:22

of those games and then just retire himself about

23:25

two weeks off that would have torn from the

23:27

was Soon after that the the heavy lifting on

23:29

the I'm On the. Withdrawal.

23:32

Of Contracts Mason the numbers has he and

23:34

on the Rancid artist six billion dollars in

23:36

Spain and and more because the seven billion

23:39

dollar Eighty Eight making up numbers on the

23:41

run I guess. And it's they'll been

23:43

proven to be the case. Big A report

23:45

released during the week from the official offices

23:48

on. The. State.

23:50

Governments. Is situations and systems are

23:52

two billion dollar lie behind Guy

23:55

Maxis. Basically. Yeah, I'm in high.

23:57

Get over it with the numbers. get that big?

23:59

Interpret them. And enjoy the loss on look at

24:01

it that money to sitting in a bank account an

24:03

actual number against rebels. A lot of it's

24:05

interpretable number and was my bedroom. I'll be

24:08

right at Model the Road or.sights right? Because.

24:11

The auditor general off at use the word

24:13

the gross exaggeration or I'm happy to say

24:15

has he is a lawyer having say have

24:17

rugby toy or is yeah. Detail.

24:20

Think. It was right decisions. That, but.

24:22

This isn't one point. Why go down this

24:25

path in the first place knowing how bright

24:27

the size. Of

24:31

Olympic games when. When. Other

24:33

countries you want to go to. My concern is not a

24:35

robot. What? Why don't you get the game to the first

24:38

places that not? No one asked them that? No, No one

24:40

asked. the Toy Gun and I can get the twenty twenty

24:42

six twelve games. Yeah. We

24:44

got to. That's my point. You can't get a consignment I'm

24:46

six foot could shed for me. it'd put on how it

24:48

worked. He died books. On. I will. They did

24:50

or did. It. Work just to

24:52

the low hanging fruit am. Starting.

24:55

Out on model tirelessly have a game of

24:57

forty at the him City or Marble post

24:59

a concert. It's in the gets in, the

25:01

contract has to be and up that on

25:03

the surface sorry right On Saturday Popstar thanks

25:05

for concerts and lifted a mark on Marvel's

25:08

stadium surface on the eighth by North Melbourne.

25:10

the I L A Not concerned by the

25:12

aesthetics, Dylan and Clarkson said the turf was

25:14

in good shape. Be headed North Melbourne. Classic,

25:16

experimental and so they only defensive only sit

25:18

at that's legitimate and it comes to sport

25:20

the clearly visible impact of Pinks concerts and

25:22

on a half would find it southern. the

25:24

ground. One sip of turf about

25:27

fifty miles long, That. Runs across,

25:29

the width is significantly less glass and the rest

25:31

of the grants. Are

25:34

we going to the to promote asylum predicament by

25:37

for contest but I do need the hills on

25:39

that will pop up to see him cel hunts

25:41

point on having I didn't have the will and

25:43

all all we would really want to foreigners three

25:45

where you would have done it is will come

25:48

we have gotten noted that you to go and

25:50

many thoughts of well it's not regarded soup and

25:52

stuff the turf yeah. but

25:54

that's where not not a good stories as it's

25:56

i'm a couple of years ago maybe lawsuit was

25:58

a put on notice the the supermarket,

26:01

this is my Nota Sachi, tongue in cheek

26:03

for those things, I'm serious about the plastics

26:05

industry and how you can't use plastic bags

26:07

anymore, but hey, if you wanna go and

26:10

buy some steak or some lamb or some

26:12

pork, good luck trying to cut it.

26:15

You need a power saw to

26:17

cut through the plastic that covers

26:19

those particular products. I'm now

26:21

putting on Nota Sachi, in my tongue in

26:23

cheek wave, submarines. Submarines?

26:26

Yeah, we're gonna be saved by the submarines that

26:28

we're building apparently. That won't come to us, they're

26:30

gonna be nuclear. Yeah, we'll be 100 years old.

26:32

They'll be 2050, but we'll have to eight, we'll

26:34

have two nuclear powered submarines saving us from everything.

26:36

You and I will be sitting in a nursing

26:38

home, having a symbol of beer. I

26:41

told you about those subs. Playing a game of you

26:43

know, they're gonna go to each other. Those

26:45

subs are coming along all right, aren't they? How far off are

26:47

they? We're gonna be saved by the subs. Every

26:50

government thinks it's a good idea to

26:52

build subs that don't actually ever get

26:54

delivered. So this one is

26:56

gonna cost $4.6 billion. Well

26:58

the thing about announcing them as a

27:01

government is you're not actually gonna be there.

27:04

No, they've already mentioned 2040 on

27:06

this particular project. And this

27:09

spend of $4.6 billion goes

27:11

to British industry over

27:13

10 years as part of the Orcus program,

27:16

which people have got question marks on and I'm not gonna dare

27:18

to venture down the path of I don't know enough about it,

27:20

but I've seen it. It's

27:23

basically researching to

27:25

the design of nuclear

27:27

submarines. Only the design, not even, it's

27:30

not actually the submarines. Anyway, what are

27:32

they gonna do? If something happens

27:34

in the world of a grave nature, what are

27:36

these submarines gonna do? Well, I've

27:38

always wondered this. We just gotta hang on 15 years

27:40

to respond to anyone that gives us a hard time

27:43

saying they're coming. They're on the way. The

27:45

other ones haven't got it. The other ones that

27:47

never got built. Just changing tune again. We've been bouncing

27:49

around a bit this morning. The

27:52

shipmates, Domo, I'm a big fan of

27:54

the shipmates. Yeah, I am too. I've

27:56

built an incredibly cool niche for themselves

27:58

in... Comic

28:00

commentary mimicking. yeah, In.

28:03

Maestro blazes to it took out my i

28:05

would argue to her to talk and Instagram

28:07

know this stuff and Pawnees? yep. And.

28:11

Have. Been. So successful that

28:13

a lot of sports actually paid him to

28:15

go to the sport to cover it. correct.

28:17

They live. They've actually reinvented the economics of

28:20

some. Sporting. It's because. Most.

28:23

Media preference for things. They've.

28:25

Actually being paid to attain go yard

28:27

agree if I'm wrong but the initial

28:29

foray into the spice for them because

28:32

it was during covert If it wasn't

28:34

it was around that once with I

28:36

were basically reboot casting five sports moments

28:38

their own Very particular had is how

28:40

does a whole era of. Buried.

28:43

Sounded content Producers between the eyes of twelve and

28:45

twenty nine that leave on largely ticked off Instagram.

28:48

yeah the crit that a crowding. they plexus the

28:50

sport and influencing know sports in their interest. Mama

28:52

Animal Missile. it's also the corn on the weekend

28:54

and the funny act and or family got you

28:56

like I want your love the sit all day.

28:58

I'm not sure whether or not like the and

29:00

little younger audience a d s younger. when it's

29:03

love humor it's a good it's very good. I

29:05

didn't go too far Imo on the weekend with

29:07

George Russell. fight on the are no yeah else

29:09

is a reminder of when you not trained. As.

29:12

A job as a journalist? Yeah yeah so

29:14

do is sit up. I understand Forza. I

29:16

believe I have officially apologize. I'm just trying

29:18

to find the official apology as we discuss

29:20

this topic on positive. Had these cued ready

29:22

to go home so we are sorry I

29:24

don't I saw your he sits ambiguous I

29:26

did toit which was will they uphold does

29:28

even as I did grunts a feature Isis

29:30

should be denied. Yet. It's

29:33

gonna come up with some time unfortunately though. Credentialed

29:35

so much as I paid to be there sign.

29:37

To be here, right? and i can't

29:40

and your hunch or this is really bad

29:42

are protesting i can't find what i did

29:44

seek out iga follow someone in the bathroom

29:46

lion and over the sky and that that

29:49

that is guy why to thought what it

29:51

does the code such he of alice you

29:53

women's basketball akeem mokes i think it is

29:55

how you sciences markets if i will sue

29:57

the washington post if they publish a false

30:00

story about me. I've actually watched

30:02

the initial media conference about this

30:04

topic. It's a preemptive strike on

30:07

a story that is clearly going

30:10

to be published. At some stage soon

30:12

the LSU team, as far as I

30:14

know, or at the point of time

30:16

of publication, was tracking very, very

30:18

well to reach the College

30:20

System playoff series. I

30:23

think Kim is a legendary coach in

30:26

the system, but she's referred to a

30:28

certain journalist about to do a, quote,

30:30

hit job on her. And as trying

30:33

to bring

30:35

into question the credentials, the ethics, the credibility

30:39

of the person in question, she didn't name

30:41

the journalist. He has since put his own

30:43

name out there, backing his

30:46

own work. He was basically

30:48

identified by referencing a previous article written

30:50

by this unnamed journalist, which he then

30:52

volunteered, well, that's clearly me, and here's

30:54

that article in question. Pick it apart

30:57

if you want. I just

30:59

wanted to raise it. Go early and throw shade on

31:01

the story. Yeah, I wanted to see it from your

31:03

perspective. I mean, you've been facing these situations. I certainly

31:05

have, but I would have mentioned you would

31:07

have probably by times 10, the multiplier of

31:09

10, faced these situations

31:11

before you go with something, the legal

31:14

threat, either publicly or certainly

31:16

privately, and the need to then wade

31:18

through all that. Yeah, it's bold. It

31:22

doesn't make the journalist any less determined. Actually,

31:24

it almost makes them more determined. You've got

31:26

to be able to hear the saying, why

31:29

they're so determined this doesn't run, and then maybe we won't

31:31

be told what to do. Although,

31:33

we're in a different landscape

31:35

now, a different environment where people are in

31:37

positions of power with a lot of litigation

31:39

going on. And look what's happened with NINE

31:43

and Fairfax through the Nick McKenzie

31:45

reporting of the alleged war crimes.

31:48

I feel it's a slight change in the

31:50

official dem of media outlets. There's a reticence,

31:52

there's a nervousness, I feel. Do you? Yeah,

31:55

I do. You think it's a good tactic?

31:58

I think it throws some shade on... What's

32:00

in question? Would you be thrown off course by that?

32:02

I personally wouldn't be if I'm you know I mean

32:04

all you can do is put yourself in that situation

32:06

If you've got something you want to go with it

32:08

You'll get it to the line if you know if

32:10

you have people around you allow you to But

32:14

I don't think it's gonna work. I mean the story's Not

32:17

going to disappear in my eyes. I mean, this is the

32:19

Washington Post. We're dealing with it. They've brought down Institutions

32:22

around the world. I mean, I don't think a

32:25

basketball coach in the American College system It's gonna be

32:27

too much of a worry to some of their people

32:29

now again. That's not to say anything I don't even

32:31

know what the story's about, but she's clearly

32:33

worried about it. Yeah, I mean interesting

32:36

You find it a good tactic. I just think

32:39

it brings focus to something that no one would

32:41

have known about How are we talking about here

32:43

in Melbourne about because we got referred

32:45

to it for a look I don't think it's a good tactic at

32:47

all How do

32:49

you notice a little little just a bit of

32:51

journalistic observation? Yep The

32:53

cost of food and drink at the footy. Yep or

32:56

sport We know it's a regular story, right?

32:59

You're saying that story how many times I send a

33:01

story written? Well to use your term. It's relatable Isn't

33:03

it anyone who goes to any sporting event? Can

33:06

relate to the cost of everything and the cost

33:08

of living it makes it even bigger You see

33:10

like it is a real like they are Significant

33:13

price and it's a real thing for families. There's

33:15

two types of food and drink stories these days If

33:18

the venue or the sport leaks the story first

33:23

And if they didn't and the paper So

33:28

they've all got what's called a public

33:30

affairs reporter now in newspapers and What

33:33

the sports do the AFL do it don't worry about

33:36

that cricket Australia do it They all do it is

33:38

they say to the public affairs reporter head

33:41

of the price announcements He's a good yarn for

33:43

you can have exclusively and you take

33:45

it because it's a walk-up start You take it

33:47

but the the problem with taking it is you're

33:50

actually hamstrung boy. How you report it So how it

33:52

was reported this year was price win

33:54

for 40 fans price freeze Nothing's

33:56

gone out. All right. Yes, like the tickets haven't

33:58

gone up and And then that

34:01

was story one. And then story

34:03

two I saw, which is when they

34:05

didn't get the heads up. All

34:07

of a sudden it was, well, the Saudis and Perones are up

34:09

$1.50 to $15.50. Great.

34:12

Northern's up $10.9, $11.50. Carton drafts rose $1

34:14

and craft beers are up a

34:16

cool 30 cents. Now, they're

34:18

significant numbers, but a

34:21

moral to sports, always get

34:23

ahead of your price structure and brief the journalist.

34:25

So here's a good news, a win for footy

34:27

fans. So the one item out of 25 that

34:29

you've reduced in price or at least kept the

34:31

same, that's your tell. That ends up in

34:34

paragraph 12 or 13. Yeah. Let

34:36

me try and find the exact story. I reckon

34:38

I can find the exact story for you. As

34:40

you do, as you do, you're speaking about morals

34:42

there and sport. I'm going to raise this one

34:44

today, Hachi. Now, again, I will happily say this,

34:46

Hachi. I gamble. I

34:49

think I would gamble responsibly. I've talked

34:51

about this. I gambled for entertainment. And

34:53

it's in reason. I know

34:55

I'm not going to win. So all those warnings

34:57

that get given now, I don't feel I need.

35:00

I'm an adult and I think I can make my own

35:02

decisions. And I like it. Equally, I

35:04

like a little drink, Hachi. And I've learned over the

35:06

journey and not that I needed to, but I drink

35:08

responsibly. So I drink and I gamble. So I just

35:10

want to table that so there's no hypocrisy with what

35:12

I'm about to say. Wurf

35:15

and Bulldogs decided to put out a press

35:17

release or media announcement during the week. We're

35:19

excited to welcome Ballarat locals, itinerant

35:21

spirits as the club's official spirits partner

35:23

for 2024. We're proud of

35:26

our connection with Ballarat and they're delighted to

35:28

partner with one of the up and coming

35:30

businesses that make the region unique. I'm really

35:32

happy. Again, I don't know itinerant spirits. Again,

35:34

the particular photograph of the itinerant

35:36

spirits is a vodka and a gin. I

35:38

love vodka. I love gin. So well done.

35:41

I think that's good. I just want to

35:43

raise it because footy clubs pick and

35:45

choose their moral causes to celebrate Hachi,

35:48

don't they? Some

35:51

people may look at a football club and

35:53

again, this has nothing to do with itinerant spirits. I

35:56

really hope that business booms. And I mean that

35:58

sincerely, in fact, we unsourced some. and buy it

36:00

now that I'm talking about it, and buy it myself.

36:02

So I hope it works, but some

36:04

people may look at that

36:07

thinking, here's a football club sending to

36:09

their many hundreds of thousands or dozens

36:11

of followers on their social media channels

36:14

and platforms an ad to

36:17

drink. Is that... Am I being

36:19

over the top in that? Yep. Yeah,

36:21

you are. Here's a wife. It's...

36:26

Aye, it's... I know

36:28

what it is, Achy. I don't need a... I don't need education on

36:30

it. It's gin or vodka? It's alcohol. Fair

36:33

enough to. But

36:35

again, that account can be accessed by a

36:38

seven-year-old. You know it

36:40

can. I don't care for it, Achy. I've just said that.

36:42

I drink. I drink, OK? Stop drawing

36:44

on it. I'm

36:46

calling the clubs out. I

36:49

think you're completely wrong. Here's why. It's

36:51

a commercial arrangement. Of course you've got

36:54

to back it. I am. Because it's how the world works. I know

36:56

how it works. I don't need education, Achy. All

36:59

I do need is for clubs to tell us

37:01

which causes they're picking up. Because

37:03

the alcohol one's not one. You're

37:05

almost insufferable today. This

37:09

is a local Ballarat up and coming... Achy, I

37:11

just set it up. I set it up that

37:13

way. You just chewed out as you're looking for

37:15

something else. You're not like talking about... It's

37:20

a small business in Ballarat that they're promoting. No,

37:22

but the gambling's not something the Bulldogs want to

37:25

link itself with. Because you think it's inconsistent.

37:27

That's where I'm getting at. This is a

37:29

press release, a MIDI release from a couple

37:31

of years ago. The Western Bulldogs are officially

37:33

free and they're promoting. A gaming machine ownership

37:35

after a handover was completed today with the

37:37

Melbourne Racing Club. I'll go

37:39

down to the quotes because I do want to

37:41

highlight this particular part of it. Now this is

37:43

the CEO of the club. And again, a meat

37:45

bane to the CEO of the Bulldogs. Other clubs

37:47

are in the same boat. It's a proud day

37:49

for our football club to now be formally out

37:51

of the gaming industry. So the

37:54

gaming industry is something this club wants

37:56

us to pick up the calls

37:58

on. Gambling's bad. I like gambling and I

38:00

can gamble and I can manage my gambling. I'm

38:03

never going to win but I use it as

38:05

entertainment. I can manage it. I can manage my

38:07

alcohol consumption but certain clubs want

38:09

to tell us don't do everything but then it suits

38:11

them to take a commercial deal with it. I understand

38:13

your point. I disagree with it clearly. I

38:15

just want you to be doing that in a ranting. I

38:17

just want the highlight. That's probably been in ranting and your

38:20

stress levels have been raising. I just went back and Googled

38:22

the last couple of years to get releases. And

38:26

I sit this up. And that's what you did shoot

38:28

it when I was sitting there last night. I sit

38:31

this up by saying if I was Peter Rolfe the

38:33

public affairs writer I'd write this story

38:35

too because that's what my job is to get into

38:37

the story. And if I'm the Herald Sun, sorry I'm

38:39

running it. It's great for

38:41

and if I'm the AFL I'm definitely leaking

38:43

it. So I'm acknowledging and

38:45

supporting all three roles in this. So

38:47

you've done the cover up before you say anything.

38:50

February 12, 2024

38:54

Herald Sun story by Peter Rolfe. The

38:56

AFL has announced its ticket prices for general admission seats

38:58

at the MCG in Marble with a new deal for

39:00

families to apply to all home and away matches. All

39:03

ticket prices to be frozen. The

39:06

cost of AFL tickets will be frozen

39:08

at last year's prices and a discount

39:10

family pass made available all season for

39:12

the first time in a win for

39:14

Victorian footy fans. The AFL

39:16

will on Monday announce, there you go

39:18

there's the story in advance, general

39:20

admission seats at the MCG in Marble will remain $27 for

39:23

adults, $18 for concession and

39:26

$5 for children in a boost

39:28

to the hip pockets of supporters battling a cost

39:30

of living crisis. That's

39:33

February 12, 2024. Yep.

39:35

February 15. Yep. Three

39:38

days out the leakers confirmed 2023 year before. AFL

39:42

imposes price freeze on tickets to

39:44

combat soaring cost of

39:46

living. The AFL has unveiled

39:48

its bold plan to ensure Victorians can attend more

39:51

games in posing a much

39:53

needed ticketing overhaul to beat the cost of

39:55

living. Are you pointing at suchy? The

39:57

point is that they have written the exact same story.

40:01

362 days apart because they've been leaked

40:03

in the exact same week the exact

40:05

same detail by the exact same people

40:07

Can I can I get I

40:10

don't want you to do this But I'm gonna guess

40:12

that was a Sunday night going into a Monday morning

40:14

of a new week just before the season started I

40:16

haven't checked Because

40:20

that's that's the perfect hitting zone We

40:23

might end it here. I think we lost their way a

40:25

bit toward the end there apologies for those who were if

40:27

they hadn't got that Yeah 40

40:30

fair outrage It

40:37

won't be coming you we won't need a

40:39

little debrief on this program the frame in

40:41

of the week Tim Arvio Oh, yes, you

40:43

want to go there? Yes Tim

40:45

Arvio is on the radar domain is either

40:47

the new PVO well tell no one he

40:50

may be it was a very good job

40:52

It was in relation to the Queensland government

40:54

and its Olympic Games the buckle Throw

40:57

still clip of himself includes a cutaway of himself.

40:59

We'll share this on our socials

41:01

Here's the audio for those playing

41:03

along at home Brisbane securing the

41:05

Olympics was celebrated by fireworks But

41:08

many are concerned our games are

41:10

at risk of imploding last night

41:12

9 news revealed advice was sought

41:14

by the miles Government about the

41:16

cost of potentially cancelling the Brisbane

41:18

games 9 news has again confirmed

41:20

with multiple sources Who

41:22

were inside the cabinet room the

41:24

cancellation costs were discussed on Monday

41:26

when the first time you heard that figure

41:29

Tim as I said, I think from day one

41:31

We've always known that if we ever walked

41:33

away there would be damages What was your response

41:35

when the cost of the cancellation of the

41:37

Olympics was raised within government? I want to be

41:39

very clear I'm not going to talk about discussions I

41:45

am NOT going to get into any discussions that did or

41:47

did not happen But if it didn't happen, you'd

41:50

be able to discuss it. So Tim, Avia being framed

41:52

in demo Yeah,

41:55

we might we might have a debrief I think let's

41:57

go have a coffee. Okay, you're right. No, I'm all

41:59

right I just think we need to sharpen up a bit

42:01

in the last 10 minutes of that show. Anyway, I

42:03

hope it was okay. This has been the

42:05

Sounding Board for DrinkWise. If you're

42:07

choosing to drink, choose to DrinkWise. Thanks

42:11

for listening to the Sounding Board

42:13

podcast with Hachien Damo. Tune in

42:15

for questions tomorrow and to send

42:17

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42:19

thesoundingboard at acm.com.au, follow the

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42:24

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42:26

thanks to DrinkWise. If you're choosing to

42:28

have a drink, choose to DrinkWise.