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Music.

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Undiscovered You, a podcast for people who feel like they have so much more

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to offer but are somehow stuck where they are. I'm your host, Kimberly Johnston, and this season we're talking all about balancing on the seesaw.

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It's about finding that balance between life and work and life outside of work.

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Today I have with me Ruth Estelle, who is 80% of the time a professional triathlete

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and 20% of the time is working as a financial institution.

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Ruth, thank you for joining us today. Thanks so much for having me. Well let's just get started from the beginning.

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Tell me a little bit about where you grew up, what life was like and how you

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ended up getting to be a triathlete. I mean that's huge.

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Yeah definitely not something I would have said when I'm younger that's what

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I want to be or had any kind of inkling that I might be able to be sort of a

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professional athlete yeah I guess I grew up in Essex I'm one of four so there was a very,

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healthy competitive vibe between the siblings we were all pretty active I think

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you know our parents kind of encouraged us to be outside a lot get involved

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in as many sporting hobbies that we We could,

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my main sport kind of all through school and uni was hockey.

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And I was never particularly good.

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Like I definitely didn't have particularly great skills, but I could run around quite a lot.

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So I think endurance has probably always been my...

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Strength more than anything skill-wise or

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speed yeah I think throughout

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school and uni really enjoyed having that

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sort of competitive element something quite regularly to

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have hockey matches to focus on obviously the social element as well and when

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I left uni and I started my job with Lloyds on the graduate program on my second

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rotation that's when I moved to London and And I was actually working in the

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Charity of the Year team at the time. And they had a couple of spaces left at the London Triathlon.

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And they sort of said to me, they're like, do you fancy doing it?

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So I think I've been doing a bit of running. I was actually training for the

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Berlin Marathon at the time. Hadn't really been doing anything that serious sporting wise post leaving uni,

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but had been keeping fit. And I thought, yeah, why not? Like,

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I know how to swim. That wasn't particularly good, but I know how to.

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I'd done like a little bit of bike riding probably like the last couple of years

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of uni I had quite a lot of cousins that were really into it so we'd had like

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a few family weekends where, people went riding together like my parents actually moved

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up the Lake District and we did a whole family cycle from the

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Lake District down to Wales and we got

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rained on for three days so it wasn't particularly fun but I'd done like a little

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bit of cycling and obviously I was doing doing a fair bit of running so I thought

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I'll give it a go really enjoyed it I think just the whole there's something

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about that triathlon atmosphere I think partly it's the.

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I guess like the equality of it in the like everyone's doing the same thing

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like men women the pros the age groupers like you're all on the same course

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it's like it feels very inclusive.

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But I think also because of that it then also feels really supportive so like

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there was definitely a really nice vibe of you know I was saying to people on

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the start line this is my first triathlon. You know the amount of people trying to give tips and kind of say yeah

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like just have a little think think about this do this so

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like just the whole atmosphere I loved and off

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the back of it I was like oh maybe I'll join my local

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tri club because I also thought then I can make some

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friends but still at that point of London of like

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I don't know that many people so that seemed like a good a

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good way to kind of meet people and that

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was kind of the whole spark that yeah kind

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of from from there I started doing some of the local races and

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then start hearing about being

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able to represent your country and I was like oh my god like

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I could you know actually represent GB how

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cool is that and it yeah it kind of all

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basically spiraled from that getting into the tri club and then finding all

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these people that were going off and doing all these you know crazy races that

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I thought at the time like especially the idea of doing an Ironman I was like

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that's way too far like I'll never do that and then yeah bring on 2017 when I did my first Ironman,

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and then got to the point where at the

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end of 2019 I was like oh I think I could maybe actually be a pro yeah crazy

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journey I think my favorite part of the story is yeah I could swim so you know

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why not do a triathlon I can swim Ruth I'm not going to be doing a I try it a lot, just to be clear.

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You should give it a go. It's fun. I did one half marathon. I think that's probably my max.

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Berlin, you were getting ready to train for a marathon in Berlin.

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So was that your first long distance run or what had you done before that? Yeah.

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Yeah, that was definitely hard. I must have done a couple of half marathons

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up to that point. But yeah, Berlin was the first.

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And it's actually still the only standalone marathon that I've done.

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Fun fact for everybody. All the other marathons I've done have been at the end of an Ironman.

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So yeah, and I was doing it with my partner at the time and his dad.

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Yeah, it was like a kind of fun family-ish outing

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to go and do it and in fact it's a very it's

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a really good one I think in terms of like things to

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do that is a nice sort of holiday as well

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as something active I think marathons are usually actually a

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really good way of seeing different parts of the

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city which might sound a bit you know like you

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could obviously just go and walk around but there is also something

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really cool about being part of this mass event

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with like you know those big

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marathons usually have about 20,000 people like pretty

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special yeah i'd highly recommend going off

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and doing sissy marathons just as a a good

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way of sightseeing yeah it's like you can either take a tour bus or you can

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run 26 miles totally up to you what you feel like doing yeah let me ask you

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do you find the running easy like is it something so you know this was your

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first long distance run in terms of over and you did the half marathons did

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you find it quite easy to do. No I don't think marathons are ever easy and I think the training run like run

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training is definitely the one that I I'd say struggle with just from an injury

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perspective like it's obviously like pretty much the most hard wearing on your

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body I think trying to get the balance between,

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doing enough to be in your best shape versus not doing too much to get injured.

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That's quite challenging but I think on the

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other hand running is also the easiest because you

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just need a pair of trainers and you can kind of do it anywhere and

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and some yeah it's quite and some chafing

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gel you cannot run all the chafing gel everywhere yeah

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yeah but I think it's definitely

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like I yeah I think marathon is

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always hard like it is like it's a long way but I

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think you can can just like I find if you just break it down into the

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different chunks of it then you can I think process

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it a bit more in terms of just get through 5k at a

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time that seems quite manageable I think there's something really interesting

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there to kind of put a parallel and to work is sort of when you have that really

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big project or that really big promotion or that really big thing that you're

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pushing for it's actually it is hard and it is hard work and yes you probably have the the skills,

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you probably have the, you know, the sneakers, as I would say,

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or the runners or whatever language you want to use.

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And, and actually, you know, breaking it down into those chunk size bites allows

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you to get through to the next stage and kind of, instead of seeing it in the

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hole, seeing in the chunks, I think psychologically,

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that really helps not only in sport, but also in the business world as well.

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Yeah, 100%. I think, yeah, I mean,

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I found so so many parallels between sort of

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sport and work I think it's probably one

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of the reasons that I was actually able to go like

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to go pro because I think when I set

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myself up to go part-time so

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at the end of 2019 when I was like right I'm gonna take this step and made like

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a part-time role I think my boss at the time appreciated that I needed the sport

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to be able to do my work in a good way and I think the kind of the strengths

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that you can take from each I think for me,

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when I was working full-time and at

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that point it was in a very like intense job of like quite long hours quite

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intent or quite high level at you know like helping get stuff ready for the

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exec committee is I found for me having the mental release of sport super important

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but also some of of the other things that I took from,

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okay, if I want to get this training session in, but I've also got to be in

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the office by seven. So I've got to get up at this time.

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And then this is how I've got to organize myself, like all of those little things.

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That I took from sport that made me better at my job. I think like my boss could

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kind of appreciate that to be like okay I get that actually you're going to

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be a better employee from doing some of the sport stuff and some of the skills you bring from that.

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And then I think likewise some of the I think like mental resilience,

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some of organization, some of

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the other I think also some of the kind of stakeholder management as well.

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Like there's obviously I think like we'll come on probably to talk about it

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a bit more later but negotiating things

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with companies to try and get sponsorship agreements some of

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that stuff like having the kind of more

10:26

corporate background has definitely helped in that so yeah

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there's like I've taken a lot of things from both sides and brought them across

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to the other which has been super helpful I love that and you know we're going

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to be we're talking about balancing on a seesaw and I think one of the things

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you You mentioned there that organization piece is probably key when you're

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trying to do this, because as you said, if you've got to be at work, you've got to be at work at a certain time and

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you still have to train and there's only 24 hours in a day.

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So it's actually, how does that look and how does that feel for you?

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Can I just go back? You quit full-time, so you haven't quit your job,

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still working there, but you stopped working full-time in 2017?

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2019. 2019. Okay. So actually when you were doing the Ironmans.

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When you were starting to get into the triathlons when you were

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doing all that you were you were doing them simultaneously for quite a while

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yeah yeah wow okay so let's

11:18

let's kind of go back and then we'll come come back to here so we we've

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started the tri clubs we've done the berlin marathon

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you've actually you you ended up landing and we

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we just did a whole season on playing the cards you were dealt and

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i feel like you were dealt this card of like here go run

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a triathlon we have a space for it which is so incredible and

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so you went and did that triathlon how did you how did you do in that first triathlon

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on just out of curiosity I actually can't remember

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but I feel like I must have done quite well otherwise I

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probably wouldn't have enjoyed it but yeah I

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actually don't know okay I think the main thing

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was I finished it and I was I

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must have been nearer the front than the back otherwise I can't imagine

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that I would have come away enjoying it that much but

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I think also it was the day when when they

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used to do London and it was massive they had a day

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that was like all of the age age groupers and some of the pros and then

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the next day was all for corporates and we were doing on

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the corporate day so I think they might have also had a

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bit of a different way of kind

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of I don't know not scoring you but I think it didn't feel as much like the

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competition as if I'd done it in the day before so that probably also helped

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that I was only racing corporate people so yeah as I said I think I must have

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done quite well but I actually don't remember and just to be clear because I

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have this image of people in suits running along.

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It's actually corporate sponsorship as opposed to necessarily people working

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in corporates or is it actually everybody just working in corporate?

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No, I think it was all corporate places. I think everyone, you know,

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I think all of our people were people from Lloyd's doing it.

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And I think, you know, then like people from like JP Morgan or,

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yeah, so it was all, hence the like, I think there were less super sporty people

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because I think most of the like, really serious triathletes would have raced the day before.

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That's like the proper age group race. And probably worked at JP Morgan and

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Lloyd's as well, because they're all A-type personalities who would have high

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power jobs and be doing the triathlon for the weekends.

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Yeah. I love it. Okay. So we're doing our first, and what year was that for

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your first triathlon? That was 2013.

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Okay. So we've started, we've done our first triathlon in 2013.

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You've moved from Essex into London, joined the tri clubs in order to kind of make some friends.

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Friends you've got the bug and you're seeing that

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you might be able to race for GB you're seeing this

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might be something that might become professional so tell me

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a bit about your story from from 2013 and maybe

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up until you sort of did your first Ironman actually

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wait I want to ask a question before you do that what's the

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difference between a triathlon and an Ironman for those

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listeners so Ironman is

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just the brand but most people would

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have heard of it because it's the a long one so a normal ironman

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which might also be referred to as a full distance is

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3.8k swim 180k bike and a marathon what most people would refer to as a triathlon

14:16

I guess would be like the olympic distance which is the distance that's in the

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olympics which is one and a half k swim 40k K bike and a 10 K run,

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but there's then all sorts of different distances.

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So triathlon generally can just be like any distance.

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But yeah iron man is usually what most people would refer to as that like full

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distance but iron man is generally just the brand that kind of coined that distance

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there are now other brands that also do full distance it like gets basically

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gets very complicated but, an iron man is also a triathlon it's just

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the long one basically okay so when we say triathlon what we're referring to

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is there's going to be an element of swimming there's going to be an element

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of biking and there's going to be an element of running and then there are different

15:04

different distances so some people do like mini triathlons which might be like

15:08

a 5k you know 20k 5k whatever something like something probably not a 5k swim but.

15:16

One lap of the pool a little bike and a

15:19

run around the track my kind of triathlon so we've got

15:23

we've got different kinds of triathlons the iron man is the big one i know like

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in marathons they have like marathon du sable which is like the running through

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the desert do you have anything that's It's like the super intense Ironman triathlon

15:36

that's like the ultimate one that people are aiming to do.

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I think the ultimate Ironman is the one in Hawaii because that's where it started.

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And that is the world champs usually, although again, they've now changed it

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a little bit. So it's got a bit more complicated.

15:54

But generally every year in Hawaii in October, they have the world championship.

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You have to qualify for it.

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It used to be very hard to get a qualification slot. It's now not as hard because it's so expensive.

16:09

So the slots can kind of roll down a bit more and it's basically more of a who

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can afford it, which is a different issue.

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But yeah, so that I think is the ultimate solution.

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Kind of longer distance one and that was

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what basically made me do my first Ironman because I'd heard

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people at the club talking about Kona and I

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was like what is this Kona thing people are talking about

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and it is a pretty magical place out there

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it's probably not my favorite place to do a triathlon because it's

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hot it's humid it's windy it's really

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hard but you're like

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going to sea for a little swim and you'll just get this big pod

16:47

of wild dolphins that swim up to you it's like like it's

16:51

a pretty magical place but yeah I'd say that's the kind of that's

16:54

probably what most people who start triathlon and

16:58

end up doing the full distance like Ironman that's probably what most people

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are kind of if they could get to Kona they'd be pretty happy oh I was born in

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Hawaii so I agree it's a completely magical place but I was born I was born

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in Oahu not on the big island so so a little bit different, but yeah.

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Okay. So we are in, we are now, we've gone to 2013. We're headed towards 2017.

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Tell me a bit about this buildup towards your first Ironman.

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Yeah. So 2014 was when I'd kind of just joined the club, started doing all the

17:31

like training sessions they were offering. And at that time there was like a London league of lots of sprint distance and

17:39

Olympic distance triathlons. And I basically just went and did as many

17:44

of them as I I could so I just like I wanted to

17:47

race race it was fun and I reckon like

17:50

halfway through that year was when I realized

17:54

that I might be able to compete for GB but the way that that works is there

17:58

are certain races you have to qualify for so the 2014 sort of grand final or

18:05

like the championship you basically had to race in 2013 to qualify for it so

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I couldn't couldn't qualify for 2014, but I found the races in 2014 that I had to do to qualify for 2015.

18:17

So I managed to qualify both for the duathlon and the triathlon championships in 2015.

18:23

So I went out and did those and they were challenging, I would say.

18:29

So for someone, as I think, as I said, I can swim. Swimming is not one of my strengths.

18:36

I didn't do enough of it as a youngster to actually be quite good.

18:39

And at the sort of Olympic distance and sprint distance triathlons.

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I think in some ways the swim is more important because if

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you lose some of that initial time it's

18:52

just there's not enough distance to make it up so yeah

18:55

I basically found in 2015 when I

18:58

went out to Chicago to do this like the final

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yeah I think I probably lost like two three minutes

19:04

to the people at the front on the swim and I was

19:07

basically like I'm not sure that I'm ever going going to be that good at

19:10

this olympic distance stuff so then from

19:13

that point I was like maybe I'll look at some of the longer distance ones

19:16

there's like also half ironman distance so that's

19:20

what I then did in 2016 and I went out and raced again they've got like a half

19:27

distance world championship that was out in Australia and like that was all

19:31

good but again I was like by this time I'd had more people just talking about

19:36

Kona and I was like well I'm obviously just going to to have to try and try and go there.

19:40

Like that seems to be like a much bigger deal than the 70.3 world champs.

19:44

And I was still at this point finding that actually the longer the race,

19:49

probably the better for me because I have more time on the bike.

19:52

And the run to kind of catch people up the 2017

19:55

first Ironman I decided to

19:58

do it in Lanzarote because because I knew

20:01

that my ultimate goal was getting to Kona I was

20:04

like well if I do it in Lanzarote it's kind of similar like it's

20:07

hot windy it's hilly but

20:10

if I can do it there then I'll have more confidence

20:13

that I can go to Kona and it won't feel as hard

20:16

my coach was like that's a really really stupid idea

20:19

it's like you should definitely choose an easier one

20:22

but I'm quite stubborn so I was like I'm gonna go do Lanzarote and

20:26

it was awful like I think I over carbo loaded I was sick in the swim and then

20:34

didn't have a great tummy on the bike and the run was literally just get to

20:39

every single portal that I could find so it was not not the best first Ironman.

20:45

But I got really lucky in the so at

20:48

that point and it's still kind of the case now but generally speaking

20:51

in the female age groups you have

20:54

one slot to the world championship because they're like

20:57

limited or like some of the age groups might have

21:00

two but generally speaking there was

21:02

one slot and I ended up third in my age group but

21:05

the lady that had won already had a slot and the

21:08

lady that came second decided she didn't want it so the slot rolled to me so

21:11

I got my Kona slot like brilliant out that I'm gonna make it and I was also

21:16

a bit like well it can't be as bad as this race to be this race to be so miserable

21:22

but surely it'll get better so went out to Kona that year,

21:28

and had like a pretty decent race I think I ended up third.

21:33

Yeah, I was third in my age group and I think I was like the 10th age group overall.

21:38

So I was like, okay, that's kind of not too bad for the second Ironman.

21:42

And also like, I just want to stop for one second.

21:45

You're in Lanzarote, you are like vomiting and getting sick all along and you still finished third.

21:52

Like, that's pretty incredible. Yeah, I did all right.

21:58

Yeah I think with Ironman if

22:02

you basically because I have this conversation with quite old people who

22:05

are like I could never do it I think because it's such a long day actually if

22:09

you've got the right mentality and you can just keep moving forward you can

22:14

actually still do quite well because like I think a lot of people just suffer

22:20

from I don't know if you start, getting into a bad way quite early on in the run or like halfway through the

22:27

bike it just seems like such a ridiculously long way i think it just becomes a bit impossible.

22:35

Yeah i think going back to the like breaking it down into small chunks for me

22:39

when i was doing that i was like just get to the next portaloo that's all you

22:43

need to do just get then you can like have a little break so yeah like it paid

22:49

off yeah then had like quite a good first,

22:53

Kona but that then basically obviously gave me the bug of like I need to come back and I need to win,

22:58

and at this point I then started seeing some

23:02

professional women in particular because it happens more on the female side

23:06

than on on the men that kind of had come from corporate backgrounds or not sporting

23:13

backgrounds and had turned pro sort of in their 30s and were doing quite well.

23:18

So I guess probably, yeah, 2017 time is when I started thinking,

23:24

oh, like that could be an option. Like it could be something I could look at.

23:29

And it seemed like quite a good life as

23:32

I could travel around to all these cool places just do

23:35

some racing spend most of my time outdoors training but

23:39

I had in my head I was like I don't think

23:42

I can justify to myself going pro

23:45

until a I'm in a

23:48

like senior enough position at the bank to to

23:51

make it easy if i

23:54

stepped away to come back in b i

23:57

was like i want to be the overall age group

24:01

winner in kona because then i'll feel like

24:04

i've like justified getting my

24:06

pro license and there are also so like there's also

24:10

to get your pro license every federation has

24:13

slightly different qualifying things you have to do and the british one is quite

24:19

it's probably a little bit harder than some of the other ones but one of the

24:23

ways you could get it was by winning in Kona so I was a bit like then I would

24:27

have like ticked off lots of different things so 2018 went back to Kona.

24:32

Won my age group was third overall so I was like I'm still not quite there and

24:38

I'd that I must have been a few months into my job the like more intense job

24:44

at that point which I was loving as as well.

24:47

So I was also like, I want to do this job for more because I'm enjoying it. It's good.

24:51

Like I absolutely loved my boss at that point. He was great to work for.

24:55

I was like, I'll give it another year and then 2019 will be my hopefully go and win.

25:00

And then I can go pro and I can kind of figure out what I'm doing with work after that.

25:05

So I did 2019 I went and I won and I was like, right, I can go pro now.

25:10

So 2019 you went back to Kona and you won the whole thing. You beat all,

25:14

all the females in every age group. You were number one.

25:17

Yeah other than the pros obviously the pros are like different race

25:20

okay so pros in a different race so and you're going

25:23

for your pro license so this is sort of the the last sort

25:26

of amateur thing and once you've won and did

25:28

you have to win in your did you have to win your age group to get the pro

25:31

license or did you have to win win to get the pro license you just had to win

25:35

your age group okay so you'd already done that yeah but that wasn't good enough

25:38

for you so you needed to go back and win the whole thing to prove it to yourself

25:42

yeah okay and just to be clear during During all of this time that you are paying

25:48

for all the trips out to Hawaii, you're paying for your own equipment,

25:51

you're paying for, you know, anything else that you need your coach,

25:55

you talked about a coach, I imagine you had a physio. So this is like a massive expense that you're having to fund.

26:03

Yeah okay and then it still is and it still

26:05

is okay all right and then

26:09

you're working your job and but at this point you're kind

26:12

of how are you transitioning so part of this you know the entire

26:15

entire season is about balancing on the seesaw so

26:18

it feels like we've had a lot of conversation around what we've been

26:21

doing outside of work how many hours a

26:24

week do you think you were dedicating to doing triathlons

26:28

and preparing for triathlons and all that

26:31

I think on average I was

26:34

probably training about 15 hours a week and

26:38

at that point I was probably working between 50 and 60 hours a week wow so and

26:47

a lot of people and so then because the people are often like well how did could

26:51

you manage it and actually from a balancing act I don't think I'm the best example because,

26:58

all I was doing was working or triathlon I didn't really have any I basically chose.

27:05

Training and I had like a couple of the training sessions were social so I guess

27:09

they were with the tri club so I was kind of seeing that as my social time but

27:14

like I missed quite a lot of family things because I was like I'm training or

27:19

I'm racing or I've chosen to go and do this.

27:22

I definitely left let my relationship suffer like

27:26

I actually ended up getting divorced at the end of 2019 so

27:29

I'd also say definitely didn't get that balance right

27:33

and I wasn't really getting enough

27:36

sleep so yeah I actually coach a

27:39

few age group triathletes now and often the conversation is

27:42

oh but I need to fit this in and that in and it's like well from

27:46

every perspective like both the training and a

27:49

work and a general mental health perspective

27:52

like sleep is the most important thing I'd much

27:55

rather you cut back your training by like

27:58

half so you can get more sleep so I

28:01

think like I managed what I was doing because it

28:05

was for a relatively short amount of time because it

28:08

ended up being I guess basically like 18 months

28:11

but probably the first six months of that

28:14

I wasn't training as hard and I had like

28:17

a few ups and downs of like when I was training more

28:20

when I was training less I actually also had like

28:23

a big bike crash in August of

28:26

2019 so I then actually had a like enforced sort

28:30

of five four or five weeks of not really training which

28:34

I actually think really helped me in high

28:37

like it obviously wasn't very pleasant at the time but looking back i think

28:41

that probably helped me win because i had like this enforced rest rather than.

28:47

Trying to juggle everything yeah i think like i look back at how i was managing stuff and.

28:56

Like yeah I was very organized I was very efficient like

28:59

I got to a point where I'd have all my stuff

29:02

ready and I'd get the alarm going off and I'd be out the

29:04

door in like five minutes like I was pretty good at getting myself

29:08

up for that but yeah if I talk about the kind of broader

29:11

balance from a healthy everything else

29:14

perspective yeah it wasn't definitely wasn't

29:18

the best and I mean just hearing

29:21

your story you it feels like you were very single-minded in this

29:25

desire to win in this desire to head towards the

29:27

triathlon and Kona very specifically we were very very

29:31

single-minded about that and I think often that can happen when

29:34

you are passionate when you're driven when you're focused when you want something

29:39

and you're and that is your desire and I think it's almost like that little

29:43

bit of of an alarm of a warning bell is with that comes the repercussions of

29:49

being single-minded and so what's really interesting is you had the bike crash,

29:54

which was, you know, this enforced rest,

29:56

but it was almost like you needed some kind of a bike crash earlier,

30:00

potentially to get you back into that sort of,

30:04

that, that position of being able to balance the things that you wanted to out.

30:08

But what I want to, what I want to challenge you on here is like,

30:11

yes, you, you sacrificed a lot for it, but was, was it worth it in terms of

30:18

if you were to go back and do it again, would you still do the same thing or would you do it differently? Hard question, I know.

30:25

That's a really hard question because I think like where I am now.

30:30

I probably had to do all that to get here.

30:33

And I definitely would say I'm in like a way happier place.

30:38

Happier place yeah it's

30:41

really it's really hard to know I think I could I

30:45

could have died like I don't I guess I don't want

30:48

to think I should have gone and done it

30:50

differently I think I can look back and

30:53

I can take the learnings of like these are

30:56

the things that I need to prioritize these are the things that

30:59

I know that when I get single-minded I

31:02

can let slip or ignore I guess

31:06

so I'm obviously set up now in a much better

31:10

way of how I've made life much easier to juggle because I've just taken lots

31:15

of things out which so I have way more time yeah but I think yeah I think a

31:22

lot of it just comes back to having that ability to sit down and work out like

31:28

what are your priorities, like if it is family if it is triathlon if it is work I'm working out the kind of,

31:37

if that is your priority how are

31:40

you how are you like enabling yourself to focus on that and almost so I think

31:46

even if I'd sat down and kind of recognize these are the things that I'm letting

31:50

slip you can then kind of ask yourself like am I happy with that like is that

31:54

like am am I okay with the fact that I'm just ignoring my relationship,

31:58

for example, like, am I okay with that?

32:01

Which this, if I, if I was looking at that now and I saw that,

32:04

I'd be like, no, I'm not okay with that. So I'm going to change.

32:08

But yeah, I think like you said, you know, it's very easy when you have lots

32:11

of different commitments to not give yourself the time or space to think about

32:15

that and just literally be like, oh, I'm just going to do everything.

32:17

Cause I think also the other thing was there was a huge part of me that I.

32:24

Enjoyed being super busy and people always being like oh my god how do you juggle

32:29

everything and I was like yes I'm like super woman but it's like I'm not like

32:34

and you shouldn't you shouldn't be expected to be but I think there's a whole

32:38

sort of societal pressure especially on women,

32:43

to be able to like juggle everything or to kind of be like oh

32:46

you're only really good if you're a mum who's

32:49

also working who's also doing all this other stuff and she's

32:52

also looks amazing you know like there seems to

32:55

be this whole like narrative of like oh she's

32:58

doing it all but it's like actually I think in reality very few

33:02

people manage to do it all and if they do it's probably

33:05

because they've got a really they've probably got

33:08

some kind of extra support system that doesn't get talked about

33:11

whereas I think like the narrative around it is

33:14

like oh like look at her she's amazing like she works and she's like

33:16

so there's definitely a big part of me

33:19

that also liked that you know coming into work and people being like oh like

33:23

what if you like how long have you been up and I'd be like oh I woke up at like

33:26

half four and I've already done like a two-hour training session like look at

33:30

me I'm so great which is like that's that shouldn't really be celebrated that

33:33

much like it's not that healthy yeah like lots of like learnings but I think.

33:39

Yeah I don't think I'd go back and change it because I think where I am now

33:43

I probably had to go through all of that to get here but there are definitely

33:47

lots of things I've taken from that that time to,

33:50

make me a healthier and more balanced person going forward.

33:54

That is like such a great response because it's not about regrets.

33:58

It's about what's the learning we take from it. And I think there's something that's incredibly poignant about what you said

34:04

around that badge of honor of all-nighters, of waking up early,

34:10

of getting it all done, of being, you know, whatever it is that, that whatever this impossible thing that society expects of us.

34:18

And I And I think social media just feeds this even more so because,

34:23

you know, again, we all know this is the highlight reels.

34:26

We all know it's people putting their best face forward, but it does.

34:29

It looks like everybody else has it together. And so you're constantly feeling like I'm the one who's failing,

34:35

but actually what's happening behind the scenes there.

34:38

I often tell the story about a girl who I knew was about to get divorced.

34:44

Her whole relationship was falling apart. part. And on Instagram, they had just bought a new beach house and they were out there

34:50

and dressed in beautiful coordinated clothing and looking perfect.

34:54

And look at our new beach house and look how amazing it is. And I'm like,

34:57

yeah, but if you could see what was going on behind the curtain.

35:00

It's not even remotely what they're projecting out.

35:04

And I think so often we to ourselves are so mean to ourselves and so unfair

35:09

to ourselves because we're trying to strive for this perfection.

35:13

And then we then project that onto other people because we want them to see

35:17

us as being perfect as well, just as you just said.

35:20

And I just, Ruth, I think there's just so much wisdom in what you just said. And I love the...

35:26

Learnings that you've taken and the questions that you're asking.

35:28

And I was going to say the issue that happens when you're in that single-mindedness,

35:33

when you're in that push, when you're trying to get to whatever that goal is,

35:37

is actually don't have that time. You don't think you have that time to sit and reflect and say,

35:42

am I making the right choices here? Are these the priorities I want to have?

35:46

I coach people often where I say, you are running full speed down a road.

35:51

What's at the end of the road? What are you running towards? and do you

35:54

even want that and a lot of times people don't even

35:57

take the time to think about you know what

36:00

is at the end of this road like what am what am i losing along the

36:03

way what am i running past what am i not seeing

36:06

what am i not experiencing so i just

36:09

i love that thank you so much for sharing a very like very honest reflection

36:13

and i i really think that's gonna gonna resonate with

36:15

people that are listening so you're in

36:18

a state where you're working a lot lot you are

36:21

training a lot you are finding some

36:25

really good ways to do that as well like let's just bring out

36:28

the positives around I love the fact that you said you're able

36:31

to get out the door in five minutes like how many of us can do that I can't

36:34

get out the door in an hour and a half sometimes it's two hours

36:37

it's like it's it's especially with two children

36:40

I never get out the door actually I'm just dragging people out the

36:43

door but you that whole idea of

36:46

being organized and efficient so what were what were some of

36:48

the things you did have in place that really helped you yeah I

36:52

think my main thing was just getting

36:55

everything ready the night before and that was stuff like

36:58

making sure like my bag was packed that

37:01

was ready anything that I needed to like

37:04

to get dressed into was next to the bed ready I

37:08

did like a lot of meal prep as well because I was also also trying

37:11

to cut down on having to

37:14

go out like a lot of the time at work I would

37:16

try and not really do like a lunch hour as.

37:19

Such it would maybe be like I'd go and swim or run.

37:24

Or like something and then I'd be like well I obviously have to have lunch

37:27

like ready so I'm then not taking an extra 15-20 minutes to go out and get lunch.

37:32

And I was also trying to eat relatively healthy so that also seemed and saved

37:36

some money because as you said I was spending a lot of money on triathlons lots

37:40

of different things going into that yeah meal preps I did like a huge batch

37:44

of that at the weekend and. I think sometimes if it was training, I would quite often try and have other

37:54

people I was meeting to be like, I can't be late because I'm meeting someone.

37:59

That's the other side, I think. If you don't have that pressure, sometimes you can be like, oh,

38:03

I'll just take an extra couple of minutes. And then if I'm going to take an extra couple of minutes in bed,

38:07

then it's basically impossible to get out of bed. I never let myself snooze the alarm. That was like, I cannot do that.

38:14

Otherwise, I won't get up. up yeah I think they were the

38:16

main ones really and I think just knowing I think

38:20

when you've had a couple of successful races that feeling

38:23

of crossing the finish line it's kind of like

38:26

it's just bottling that up and being like anytime you're having

38:29

not a great day or not a great session thinking

38:33

back to that and being like I know it's worth it because that feeling

38:36

of crossing the finish line having had a good race is like

38:39

more than worth it yeah and then

38:42

I think I just did other things I

38:45

could all right so like one of my main challenges when

38:48

I was doing that job was getting time with my boss to actually

38:52

go through everything we had to go through so I

38:54

was basically his like business manager and because

38:58

his whole day was pretty much meetings that was

39:01

usually where I had to be in at seven because it'd be like that would be my one gap

39:04

of catching him and being able to talk through

39:07

the day talk through what we had to do get any feedback on on

39:09

stuff that I needed feedback on but yeah we often

39:12

also had you know there were some days where that couldn't happen

39:15

but I'd be like well I'm going to be on the turbo doing

39:18

a session at this time so I'll talk to you while you're getting driven in at

39:22

like 6 30 in the morning or whatever it is I remember some people being like

39:25

why you like you shouldn't be agreeing to that and I was like oh no I suggested

39:31

it because actually it works way better for me than trying to get in so I think

39:35

it's also knowing what are some of the things.

39:39

That work better for you which might not

39:42

necessarily sound like the best but finding ways

39:46

of I guess making some of that time

39:49

making it fit your time frames

39:52

more because I think often as well it's easy

39:55

to get sucked into the this is

39:58

the norms of how we work whereas I actually think now

40:01

probably like post-covid has probably been quite a good quite

40:04

a good readjustment of people people actually feeling more

40:08

comfortable to ask for more because I think a

40:11

lot of the time it's like you might as well ask because the worst that's going

40:15

to happen is someone's going to say no you can't you can't work in that way

40:19

or we can't do that but I had this whole conversation with people of when I

40:24

first went part-time because I basically just created my own job.

40:29

I was like what can I do on like one or two days

40:32

a week that I won't end up working way more than that so I was like I think

40:36

a lot of the roles there's a lot of roles especially in that kind of financial

40:42

institutions are pretty difficult to do on reduced hours so I basically just

40:47

created a role and I was like this is the role that I think I can do that I

40:51

still think adds benefit, and propose it to my boss and he was like yeah okay and loads

40:56

of people were like how did you manage that I was like I just asked like you

40:59

just you can only ask and if they say no

41:01

they say no but at least you tried and I think

41:04

as long as you recognize the flexibility of

41:08

trying to make it work both ways I think that's like because it's also the it's

41:13

easy to get caught up in your world and be like well this is what's best for

41:17

me but then you know if you're working with a team or whatever it's also trying

41:21

to think about how does it also work for them so yeah I think there was the.

41:28

There was definitely all of this stuff I did to make life easier to get out

41:31

the door and minimize time wasted doing stuff.

41:35

But then there was also the, from a work perspective, what have I,

41:40

what else can I do to make that more efficient?

41:44

And yeah, I basically like tried to cut out as much dead time as possible.

41:47

Yeah. I love that. And I think that that kind of efficiency.

41:51

So we're all, each one of us is given 24 hours in a day.

41:54

And the question is, how are you using it? And how much time,

41:56

you know, when you say, I don't have time for that question,

41:59

how much time are you on social media? How much time are you watching TV? You know, how much time are you taking doing

42:05

whatever it is that you're doing? And actually, can you use that time better? And are there more efficient ways

42:10

to use your time? And sometimes you do. Sometimes you need to just sit down on the couch and watch TV because you need to decompress.

42:15

And there's nothing wrong with that. But if that's part of your schedule every

42:19

day and you're feeling like you need more time, that's a great place to find it.

42:23

I also love the idea of ask, you know, the worst they can say is no.

42:28

And I want to add to that also, then they have an idea of what you want.

42:31

And so they can help to make that more of a reality. So even if you'd gone and

42:35

said, I want to do this, I'm thinking about this, and they said, that's not going to work.

42:38

We don't have the FTE, we don't have the budget, you know, all the kinds of responses.

42:42

Let's work together to find out a solution because they know what you're actually

42:47

aiming towards, which is really helpful.

42:49

And as you say, you know, the worst they're going to say is no and you

42:52

can find you can find other options you can find other ways to

42:55

do things so you got your pro

42:58

license in 2018 2019 end

43:02

of 2019 okay so really great timing

43:05

because nothing major happened in 2020 so really

43:09

good timing yeah just for the kind of sport where you

43:12

need to travel and be with a whole bunch of other people and yeah yeah that's

43:18

that's just perfect so 2019 we decide to go pro have you cut your hours way

43:23

back then at that point or are you so what's happened where are we now in terms

43:29

of the balance between hours. Yeah, so it was end of 2019. So the Kona race was mid-October and I basically

43:36

got back from that and had the initial conversation with my boss to then start

43:43

going really part-time in January. And basically in the meantime, I then had to find my replacement.

43:48

Because again, I was like, I appreciate that I need to find someone to replace me.

43:54

Yeah, that was like the rest of 2019. And then it was from January 2020 20 that

44:00

I went part-time I like initially I went to one day a week but actually quite quickly.

44:07

That didn't feel enough I basically spent one

44:10

day doing emails catching up on

44:12

stuff and never actually getting around to doing any work so

44:15

yeah probably like within like three four weeks I

44:18

was like this isn't this isn't working but I don't like

44:21

because I was finding it frustrating so I'm not managing to do anything so quite

44:26

quickly but then went up to two days a week but what was quite quite good as

44:29

I had the flexibility to sort of spread that across across the week so yeah

44:34

basically it wouldn't have worked from a training perspective just doing two

44:38

solid days of work and then nothing, and actually from a business perspective it was

44:43

more helpful to spread it across as well because then like I wasn't

44:46

only in for like two days a week I guess I was like

44:49

more responsive across the week so it's actually a bit easier from from

44:53

both angles so yeah

44:56

I basically spent the first first part there's like first three months

44:59

in 2020 just training catching

45:03

up on sleep I think that's probably the most important thing that

45:06

I did those first three months and then yeah COVID

45:10

hit actually again it was probably a really good thing for me from my triathlon

45:16

career because it just gave me longer to train before racing because I think

45:21

one of the things that people also So underestimate from a sport like triathlon,

45:27

where it's kind of more endurance based, is actually you sort of need time and

45:32

time being consistent to get anywhere.

45:36

Yeah, I mean, I was lucky. I actually moved in with Ben, my very new boyfriend

45:44

at the time, because he had a sort of endless pool so he could still swim.

45:50

And I was basically like, oh, I can't go through any time of not swimming. It was my weakest.

45:55

Like I might as well give up on being a professional triathlete if I can't swim

45:59

for, like at that point we thought it was maybe going to be like a month.

46:03

So I was like, yeah, I'll just come like stay with you for a month.

46:06

That then turned into like six months I was like I'm still here but yeah so like 20.

46:15

2020 I just I kind of just built the base we actually did like a few little

46:19

adventure things of like going off gravel riding and yeah like it was actually I quite enjoyed 2020,

46:27

and then we obviously had a few races towards the end

46:30

of the year then I started feeling a a little bit more

46:33

like a professional triathlete but actually my main sort of

46:36

learning in 2020 was also I was

46:40

like pretty thankful that I hadn't taken a sabbatical so

46:43

that I'd kept some work because like sabbatical had been one of my other options

46:46

of of going pro but actually I was like it works quite well the balance of having

46:52

something to think about that's not triathlon related because I think otherwise

46:56

you get quite insular it can also then I don't know if you get injured,

47:03

if you don't have anything else it's quite hard to have any kind of perspective so,

47:09

yeah it actually made me think it's good to have something else but yeah like it just,

47:16

yeah at the time it didn't feel like great timing with Covid but then I also

47:21

think like the good thing of like COVID put everything into perspective really

47:25

in many ways I was like well I'm healthy.

47:29

I'm doing all the things I like doing I get a bit of bonus racing towards the

47:34

end of the year I've still got a job like there were lots of good things so

47:39

yeah it kind of worked right in the end,

47:43

so use the time for COVID just to really get yourself up to training standards

47:47

to be able to So competed at a professional level, started competing at a professional

47:51

level from the end of 2020. And so you're at the end of 2020. Now we're having this conversation,

47:58

you know, three years later. So tell me a little bit about what's happened for you as a professional triathlete.

48:06

Yeah, it now feels like the last few years have been like lots has gone on.

48:12

Yeah, I think the first... 2021 was probably then more of the year of actually getting to some bigger races

48:22

like stuff felt a little bit more back to normal a race in perspective there was still some.

48:29

Ups and downs of like various various countries

48:32

that got red listed or that you couldn't really go to

48:35

but yeah I ended up doing I did

48:40

like a couple of Ironman toward the end of the year I'd also

48:43

been a little bit injured so I had like a calf injury that took

48:45

a while yeah I managed to win my

48:49

first professional Ironman which was wow that

48:52

was nice that felt huge yeah that

48:55

was definitely like a good a good one

48:58

yeah so I think like 20 2021 felt

49:02

like more the transitional year or I've actually finally had that base I feel

49:07

like it's coming through now I feel like I can actually be a bit more competitive

49:11

like the couple of races that I did at the end of 2020 I still felt quite far

49:16

away from being a competitive pro like I felt like.

49:21

I was enjoying it but I was like quite far

49:25

behind from being competitive and then 2021 I felt

49:27

like okay I'm kind of getting closer to that

49:30

point here now and then 2022 we

49:35

ended up having they had to delay the world

49:38

champs from 2021 to 2022 basically because

49:41

of covid so we had one we actually ended

49:43

up having two world championships in 2022 but the

49:47

one the one in like may that was the early one that was the hanover from 2021

49:55

that one actually went really well so i came fifth with that one and i was like

50:01

i finally feel like i'm where i want to be like i'm up at like the pointy end it's great it's.

50:08

Then the rest of that year was not as great i then had another little niggling injury we then had the,

50:16

back to like the normal kona world champs in

50:19

october and i just had a terrible day just one of those days where like nothing

50:25

felt like it's firing so then didn't feel like that was great but then i did

50:29

another race was the end of the year and won that one so like ended 2022 on a on a high note.

50:38

And then this year has just been terrible from a, again, basically just been injured like all year.

50:45

So I haven't really done much racing until recently, which I then went back

50:51

out to Kona for the world champs. Again, I didn't have like my best day, but I had an all right day and ended

50:58

up coming 12th, which considering I basically haven't been able to race all year.

51:04

I don't know. I also, see I've kind of had hopes and dreams of I might have

51:07

a pretty magical day and somehow end up,

51:11

somewhere near the top five but yeah considering the

51:15

year that I've had I was like I got the race I actually

51:18

had a reasonable day like yeah so

51:22

this year's been more challenging but

51:25

hopefully over some of the injury stuff

51:28

now and yeah hopefully like

51:31

set myself up for a bit of a better 2024 and you've

51:34

just gotten back from Kona is that right as we're having this conversation okay so

51:38

feeling feeling the time time lag as well as

51:41

coming off the back of that and having the injuries and all the

51:43

rest of it with with the kind of move into pro then so do you actually end up

51:49

making money off of races like depending on where you come in do you only make

51:54

money if you win do you make money from sponsors like how do you actually make

51:58

money as a pro triathlete yeah Yeah, it's challenging.

52:02

Yeah, so like you said, there's prize money, which depends on the race.

52:08

But like a reasonable size Ironman, you're probably getting paid usually like the top five to eight.

52:14

Like you might get somewhere between sort of 10 and 12 grand for winning and

52:20

down at the bottom, probably like $500.

52:23

That all gets taxed before you get it. So that ends up not being as much.

52:28

Much you also have to pay for all the travel all the

52:31

accommodation etc so yeah you can imagine that's about

52:34

ten thousand dollars in itself yeah if

52:37

you're going to hawaii you're basically not making any money

52:40

you quite then like through sponsors there's like a couple of different you

52:45

can either have like a base sort of cash sponsor agreement but quite often you'll

52:51

make more of the money through like podium bonuses again kind of often linked

52:56

to performance elements. Yeah that's probably the main thing but then obviously like again with sponsors.

53:04

That is generally like you

53:06

can get an agent but doesn't like agents

53:09

take 20 so like for me

53:12

at the moment I don't have an agent because I don't feel like I'm making

53:16

enough money from contracts to make it worth it so

53:20

I negotiate all my contracts which is also quite a challenge

53:24

part like mainly mainly from a like how

53:26

do you value yourself so I think the benefit of

53:30

being an agent is you see lots of different contracts so

53:34

you get a better idea of like what's the kind of you know

53:37

for the person that goes and wins the world championship what are

53:40

they getting versus someone who's maybe

53:43

just winning other Ironmans whereas like

53:47

yeah for me I'm like I don't really see I

53:50

obviously don't see any of those contracts I'm like I don't really know

53:53

where to pitch myself from a like because

53:55

you don't want to undervalue yourself but you also don't want to overvalue yourself

53:59

and go in way too high and then be like who do

54:02

you think you are yeah that is quite a challenge

54:05

but I generally say like there's really not very

54:08

much money in triathlon probably like

54:11

the top five in the world and making like relatively decent money but it was

54:17

making me laugh because I saw something thing from some of like the tennis players

54:21

talking about the fact that you can't make a living if you're outside the top

54:25

hundred and I was like yeah you're like you can't really make a living.

54:30

In triathlon unless you're in the top 10 and even then it's probably not a great

54:33

living so yeah it's got a long way to go as a sport I think.

54:38

To properly professionalize it and get a bit more money in but yeah it's like

54:42

you know that's obviously I'm not doing it for the like I didn't get into triathlon

54:47

so I thought this is a great way of making some money yeah I very much made

54:51

sure I set up like a little nest egg.

54:54

Of like savings before I went part-time I'm

54:57

obviously still working yeah I basically

55:00

made sure that I wasn't I wanted

55:03

to be able to do it in a way where it wasn't like a massive struggle because

55:06

yeah I was like I still want to be able to eat like

55:10

go out for nice dinners or whatever occasionally so yeah

55:14

that's been a challenge but I knew it was going to be so I was like prepared

55:18

that side of things yeah I had a mentor told me before I set off and started

55:22

my own business she said you need to just set aside one year's salary to have

55:27

available to you so that you know if things hit the fan you have the money available

55:32

so you're not worried about it because otherwise Otherwise, you might cash in your chips and just go back to full-time employment.

55:36

So it's sort of actually just having that off to the side allows you to be able to stretch that muscle.

55:42

We're coming really close to end. But what I want to ask is like, what is next for you?

55:47

What happens with Team GB as well? Because I know you were talking about the

55:51

distance being better for you and the Iron Man's and the long distances.

55:54

Does that have anything to do with Team GB as well? Or is that something that might be coming up?

55:59

Can we look for you on Team GB? be? Is there anything we can kind of see you

56:03

in if you're going to be doing that? And, you know, also just sort of what's next for you?

56:08

Yeah, so I'm going to try and race probably another couple of times this year,

56:12

just because I haven't really been able to race. So hopefully heading off to Mexico in a month for another Ironman.

56:18

And then I'll probably do another half after that, depending on how the body pulls up.

56:24

And then, yeah, hopefully heading into next year, just kind of be less injured

56:29

would be nice and be able to race throughout the year. Yeah, so Team GB doesn't really exist for long distance.

56:36

Distance it's like completely independent team gb is basically for the olympic distance.

56:42

So you won't find me there there's like a few weird little nuances to it but

56:47

yeah basically nothing to do with team gb but yeah it's like but obviously next

56:53

year is olympic year and actually one of the girls that i train with quite a

56:56

lot has now dumped her place in the olympics so So, yeah,

57:01

hopefully also get out to Paris and be able to watch the Olympics.

57:05

Wonderful. Yeah, I thought because when you were talking about how your strength

57:09

lies in having the longer distance, I was wondering what then happened with

57:12

that pull towards Team GB. And it sounds like actually it's not your strength and focusing on the Ironmans

57:18

and focusing on the longer distance and really being able to pull out what you're

57:22

good at, which is the biking and the running.

57:24

And then you can make up for the swimming. So I also love that about your story,

57:29

Ruth, is that, you know, there are parts of it where actually,

57:32

yes, I do do triathlons, but I recognize what I'm good at.

57:35

And then you're able to kind of focus on that and just the learnings that you

57:39

shared throughout all this and that balance, which, you know,

57:42

you didn't maybe necessarily do so well at before,

57:44

but actually now you're able to really pull yourself up on, ask yourself the

57:48

hard questions and then kind of try and find that rebalance.

57:52

So this has been a phenomenal conversation.

57:54

Thank you so much for taking the time and sharing your story with me and with our audience.

57:59

No worries. It's been great. I hope you enjoyed this week's episode.

58:03

Join me next time when I speak to a guest about how they are balancing on the proverbial seesaw.

58:09

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58:13

or just want to get in touch, check out my website, kljconsulting.co.uk,

58:19

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58:24

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