Welcome to episode 46 of The Way Out Is In: The Zen Art of Living, a podcast series mirroring Zen Master Thich Nhat Hanh’s deep teachings of Buddhist philosophy: a simple yet profound methodology for dealing with our suffering, and for creating more happiness and joy in our lives.

This time, Zen Buddhist monk Brother Phap Huu and journalist Jo Confino talk about healthy boundaries. In this busy and complex world is it possible to remain open and vulnerable whilst also ensuring our safety and protection? This question is answered via stories from the Buddha’s time and Thich Nhat Hanh’s life and teachings, as well as from the presenters’ own life experiences.   

Brother Phap Huu further shares about practicing awareness; the two protectors: the warrior and the bodhisattva; teaching and the importance of understanding those you teach; deep listening and loving speech; friendships that end and being OK with someone not loving us; setting boundaries with people who have passed away; and creating a bodhisattva heart. Also, if there’s no self, why are we protecting it?

Jo shares about courage and communication; speaking the truth; protecting ourselves from abusive behavior; loving people from a distance; change and shifting boundaries; and the power of presence.

The episode ends with a short meditation guided by Brother Phap Huu.

Co-produced by the Plum Village App:
https://plumvillage.app/

And Global Optimism:
https://globaloptimism.com/ 

With support from the Thich Nhat Hanh Foundation:
https://thichnhathanhfoundation.org/ 

List of resources 

Bodhisattva
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bodhisattva 

Bhikkhu
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bhikkhu

Mahāyāna
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mahayana 

Classes: ‘Right Diligence’
https://plumvillage.org/library/classes/class-13-right-diligence/ 

Old Path, White Clouds
https://plumvillage.org/books/old-path-white-clouds-2/ 

Aṅgulimāla
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A%E1%B9%85gulim%C4%81la 

The Five Mindfulness Trainings
https://plumvillage.org/mindfulness/the-5-mindfulness-trainings/ 

Deer Park Monastery
https://deerparkmonastery.org/

Quotes

“Being mindful, having love for oneself, is also learning to be true to oneself. And sometimes that means learning to say no to certain situations because we’re not yet capable. The practice here is not to feel despair or to lose faith in oneself because one cannot yet embrace such a situation; that can become an ingredient for aspiration and determination, so that we can cultivate our capacity to be there, to embrace, and to transform.” 

“Am I watering the seeds of mindfulness, the seeds of concentration, the seeds of understanding, the seeds of kindness? Or am I being watered by the seeds of violence, anger, fear, despair, jealousy? As a practitioner, mindfulness becomes a light to identify what is coming into our senses via our eyes, our ears, our nose, our tongue, our mind, and our body. And we have to learn to be mindful of what is coming in, because that will be the energy for us to give out.” 

“A good teacher, a good leader, a good parent, a good mentor is someone who is attentive to the kind of training that the one that they’re training needs. Our teacher, Thay was very mindful in understanding his students. In a way, Thay was studying us and he had to have the sensitivity – his mindfulness and his openness – to see each student differently and recognize what kind of ‘medicine’ they needed.” 

“In hostile moments, if it’s not safe, you are allowed to protect yourself. Don’t think that being compassionate is to withstand everything; we also have to love ourselves. We have to know our capacity, we have to protect ourselves for everyone else. Thay would sometimes tell us, ‘You are more than just you: you also have to protect your teacher, which is me, you have to protect your parents, who are your ancestors, and your colleagues. So don’t allow yourself to burn out, because when you do, we all burn out with you.’ And at first I thought he was just referring to work, but there is also burning out in our spirit. We have to continue to nourish our heart and compassion. We have to know our limits.” 

“Please, do not wait until you are angry, until you are violent, to practice. At that moment, it is too late. We have to already have invested our capacity to embrace and call our emotion by its name in the present moment.” 

“If you want revenge, dig two graves.”

“With distance, there’s understanding. With time, the heat of the moment dissipates.” 

“A good teacher is someone who takes time to have a relationship. I truly believe that before trying to help someone, I have to also have time to be human with that person: having a cup of tea, seeing them as a friend, not just as a student or as younger, or a mentee.” 

“In Buddhism we always say don’t be too intense with everything but also not too loose, knowing what is enough.”

“Sometimes true love is just learning to let go.”

“Thay talks about how, if you say something negative to someone or you’ve acted in anger, you can send a kind thought afterwards to neutralize it.”