0:08

Do you feel

0:08

like it's possible to find joy

0:10

and positive change within

0:10

veterinary medicine? Are you

0:14

looking for a community that is

0:14

striving for fulfillment rather

0:17

than perfection? Hey there, I'm

0:17

Dr. Stacey Cordivano. And I want

0:21

veterinarians to learn to be

0:21

happier, healthier, wealthier,

0:25

and more grateful for the lives

0:25

that we've created. On this

0:28

podcast I will speak with

0:28

outside of the box thinkers to

0:31

hear new ideas on ways to

0:31

improve our day to day life.

0:35

Welcome to the whole veterinarian. Hey everyone, today I am so

0:46

excited to share an interview

0:50

with a very inspiring colleague

0:50

Dr. Michael Bugg. Dr. Bugg is a

0:54

2008 graduate of the Western

0:54

College of Veterinary Medicine.

0:58

He practiced and mixed animal

0:58

medicine initially and then

1:00

moved into small animal general

1:00

practice. Like many of his

1:04

colleagues, Mike struggled with

1:04

the unique demands of veterinary

1:07

clinical practice. And in 2012,

1:07

he and his wife Rosalie began

1:11

building their real estate

1:11

portfolio while working in their

1:14

respective careers. Eventually,

1:14

this side hustle allowed Mike to

1:18

take the leap into real estate

1:18

investing full time and explore

1:22

new ways to be a part of the

1:22

veterinary community. He is the

1:25

co founder and co host of the

1:25

veterinary project podcast and

1:29

the author of the new book

1:29

you're gonna get peed on. Mike

1:32

believes that the greatest way

1:32

veterinarians can combat burnout

1:35

is by taking charge of their

1:35

personal finances and aligning

1:39

every aspect of their lives with

1:39

their veterinary vision. Mike

1:42

lives with his wife, Rosalie

1:42

daughter Riley and son Ethan in

1:46

Saskatoon, Saskatchewan, Canada.

1:46

I am in alignment with so many

1:50

ideas in this book that I cannot

1:50

recommend it highly enough. big

1:54

kudos for completing this

1:54

awesome project. Mike, you and

1:58

your family should be really

1:58

proud. I hope you will all check

2:01

out the book after listening to

2:01

today's episode. And make sure

2:05

to let us know what you think

2:05

all of Mike's contact info will

2:08

be listed in the show notes. I

2:08

hope you enjoy

2:18

Hey, Mike, how are you?

2:19

I'm doing well. Stacey. Thanks for having me. It's a pleasure to be here.

2:22

Well, thanks

2:22

for being here. I cannot believe

2:25

that you are here to not solely

2:25

talk real estate. If I ever

2:29

thought this collaboration was

2:29

going to happen. I for sure

2:32

would have said it was going to

2:32

happen talking about real

2:34

estate. But I'm glad you're here

2:34

anyway. And I'm sure we'll get

2:37

to it a little bit. So for

2:37

listeners who don't know you

2:40

tell us a little bit about

2:40

yourself and your journey thus

2:43

far.

2:44

Yeah, I'll do a very

2:44

condensed version. So I am up in

2:48

Canada, kind of the western

2:48

half. I grew up on a beef cattle

2:52

farm and you know, as a little

2:52

boy watching the veterinarian

2:55

swoop in like a superhero kind

2:55

of, you know, in the middle of

2:58

the night doing C sections.

2:58

That's kind of how my journey

3:01

towards that nearing medicine

3:01

began. And I had it all figured

3:05

out, right, I was going to have

3:05

a whole bunch of beef cows, I

3:08

was going to have this big ranch I was going to be a veterinarian, do mixed animal

3:09

practice live on a farm. No

3:12

problem. Fast forward, I get

3:12

into vet school don't last that

3:16

long and mixed animal practice.

3:16

I think I was there for about 18

3:20

months, I always thought I would

3:20

own a veterinary practice or

3:24

multiple because I'm fairly

3:24

business and entrepreneurial

3:27

oriented. But skip all the way

3:27

to 2023 I don't own any cows.

3:33

I'm not even clinically

3:33

practicing as a veterinarian. I

3:36

don't live on a farm I live in

3:36

the city. So long story short,

3:39

what I thought my veterinary

3:39

career would turn out to be

3:43

looks nothing like what it

3:43

actually is today.

3:46

Isn't that the

3:46

truth for so many of us so

3:48

interesting. Yeah. You know, we

3:48

think we're so smart back back

3:52

early on. Okay, so you're

3:52

actually here today because you

3:56

are now a published author. You

3:56

have a book, what is it called?

4:00

You're gonna get peed on.

4:02

When I read

4:02

the story about the title of

4:06

this book, I literally spit out

4:06

my coffee. And I felt very

4:10

validated in the fact that

4:10

whenever someone asks me about

4:14

how I feel about working with

4:14

dangerous horses, my response is

4:17

always I'll take a horse over a

4:17

mean cat any day. So share just

4:23

like a brief synopsis of how

4:23

this book got its title.

4:27

I mean, in the grand

4:27

scheme of things, the things we

4:30

deal with as veterinarians, this

4:30

is fairly innocuous. But just

4:34

the way that event hit me in

4:34

that frame that I was in that

4:37

was sort of my my miserable Mike

4:37

days will say, but this was the

4:41

classic tom cat that comes in

4:41

playing very coy right but I've

4:46

seen enough cats to know this is

4:46

all a ruse he is acting at any

4:50

moment. He's going to spring to

4:50

life and try and kill everyone

4:53

in this room. So sure enough, he

4:53

springs to life on the treatment

4:57

table. Our poor technician

4:57

unfortunately I believe God like

5:00

scratched and bit he goes flying

5:00

off the table. And they kind of

5:04

catch Him in the air and the

5:04

momentum because he's a big guy

5:07

swings around here I am standing

5:07

there with a syringe in my hand.

5:11

And he just soaks me like, on my

5:11

head all down my face.

5:16

Obviously, my mouth was open

5:16

because I'm my mouth is now full

5:20

of cat pee. And I'm just sitting

5:20

there being like, oh, like, and

5:24

it was like that was the

5:24

metaphorical straw that broke

5:27

the camel's back, right? Where I

5:27

was just sitting there being

5:30

like, I'm done. Right, like, I

5:30

am done. I'm I'm swallowing cat

5:34

pee. Right.

5:35

This is it for

5:35

me. Okay. So before we get into

5:39

some of the many amazing topics

5:39

that you cover in the book, I'm

5:42

curious who you wrote this book

5:42

for?

5:45

It's a great question. I have to be completely honest. Number one, I

5:46

wrote it for myself.

5:49

I was wondering if that was maybe the case? Yeah.

5:52

Yeah. So I like

5:52

writing, you know, I have a

5:56

laptop of all sorts of half

5:56

written blogs. And every once in

5:59

a while, I'll publish some

5:59

stuff. But I really, truly do

6:01

like writing. And writing a book

6:01

is something I just always

6:05

wanted to do. And I knew if I

6:05

didn't do it, that would be a

6:09

regret forever in my life.

6:09

Right. So I actually started

6:13

this back in 2020, when COVID

6:13

hit, everyone's calendar

6:16

cleared, I had all this, you

6:16

know, free time, I thought, and

6:20

I was like, I'm gonna write my book, and it's gonna be really quick. And in six months,

6:22

there'll be a book, it was like,

6:24

okay, it took way longer. But

6:24

number one, for myself. Number

6:28

two is to impact, you know, the

6:28

veterinary community. So

6:32

everything in the book is stuff

6:32

I've experienced, you know,

6:36

things I've gone through, and I

6:36

wish I knew them back in 2008,

6:41

when I was graduating, so in a

6:41

small way, this is this is my

6:45

way to kind of, you know, pay it back to the veterinary community, and be like, here,

6:47

this is some of the stuff that's

6:50

worked for me, this is some of

6:50

the stuff I've experienced. And

6:53

hopefully, you know, the newer

6:53

generation of veterinarians can,

6:56

you know, learn from from our

6:56

experiences and not have to go

6:59

through it, per se. So

7:01

awesome. I

7:01

love that ...totally resonate.

7:04

So let's start to dig into some

7:04

of the stuff that you're

7:07

sharing, because it is super

7:07

helpful. And I think it's not

7:10

talked about enough. I was

7:10

thinking that I might just read

7:13

you some of your quotes that

7:13

really stuck out to me, and then

7:15

we can kind of go from there if

7:15

that if that's okay with you.

7:18

Absolutely. Wherever you want to go.

7:20

All right,

7:20

perfect. So you say Desperation

7:24

can be a catalyst to change. But

7:24

inspiration is what keeps you

7:27

going. I think, really early on

7:27

when I was listening to your

7:31

podcast, I heard you mention

7:31

transitioning out of clinical

7:34

practice. And you said it very,

7:34

I don't want to say lightly, but

7:38

you said a very matter of

7:38

factly. And I remember my brain

7:41

being like, wow, you made that

7:41

seem really easy. have to

7:45

imagine that this cat pee in the

7:45

mouth story is around this sort

7:48

of time. But I can't imagine

7:48

that that was actually easy, was

7:54

it?

7:54

No, no, I've tried to

7:54

remember what I said or what

7:58

that episode was. But if I made

7:58

it come across that way, it was

8:02

hard. And it spanned many years.

8:02

So I had mentioned this sort of

8:08

moniker of miserable Mike, that

8:08

came up, you know, just in a

8:12

conversation with my wife and

8:12

sort of how miserable Mike was

8:15

born was the idea of you know,

8:15

everyone has a bad day. And a

8:19

bad day is just whatever they

8:19

happen. But you start stringing

8:22

enough of those together. And

8:22

that was a bad week, a bad

8:25

month, now you're in a bad mood.

8:25

And if that keeps going on long

8:29

enough. At some point, you just

8:29

have to accept Well, I'm not

8:32

just in a bad mood anymore. This

8:32

is just my new personality.

8:36

Right? This is my new default

8:36

setting. And unfortunately, I

8:40

had to kind of wake up to the

8:40

harsh reality like that was a

8:43

fact like I was I was having too

8:43

many bad days in a row. And

8:46

being in a bad mood enough days

8:46

in a row that that was just who

8:50

I was. I was no longer happy go

8:50

lucky joking around playful,

8:54

Mike. I was miserable, Mike,

8:54

that really hit me hard. Because

8:59

it was it was such a gap from

8:59

you know who I want to be who I

9:04

thought I was. But it was

9:04

undeniably true. Right?

9:08

Yeah. Yeah. So

9:08

then I think that kind of ties

9:11

into this next quote that I want

9:11

to pull out because I think you

9:15

get to that stage because of

9:15

this quote. So when one's

9:19

identity is solely based on

9:19

being a veterinarian, their self

9:22

worth and satisfaction is

9:22

derived from the external

9:25

validation of their career by

9:25

others and their perceived

9:29

success in it. Yeah, totally

9:29

agree. I think we can't hang our

9:33

hats on being veterinarians, but

9:33

say more.

9:37

Well, this is a heavy

9:37

one. And this is a hard one

9:39

because it'll probably hit those

9:39

that are most attached to that

9:44

identity the hardest and they'll

9:44

have the most resistance to it.

9:48

I'm speaking of myself here,

9:48

right. So when I look back at

9:51

you know, that miserable mic and

9:51

I am a veterinarian, right.

9:54

That's how everyone knew me back

9:54

home. All my circles, Mike's

9:58

Mike's the veterinarian And it's

9:58

like, you feel like you're

10:01

failing at that. And that is

10:01

100% of my identity in my own

10:08

head. So I feel like a failure,

10:08

right? Like my sense of self

10:12

worth goes down. Right? That is

10:12

why all of a sudden, I'm having

10:16

bad days bad weeks bad mood,

10:16

miserable, Mike. Because I've

10:20

hung my hat, I've attached

10:20

everything I am to, I am a

10:23

veterinarian. And all of a

10:23

sudden, I find myself not, you

10:27

know, loving it, and I'm

10:27

supposed to be loving it.

10:30

Everyone everywhere says, you

10:30

know, this is this is like the

10:33

best career and in lots of ways

10:33

it is. And it can be sure, I

10:37

just wasn't in that space. And

10:37

then you feel like a complete

10:40

failure. Right? So you have to

10:40

start peeling yourself away from

10:44

that.

10:45

You talk about

10:45

a way to do that, being creating

10:48

new im statements for yourself.

10:48

And using this idea of working

10:52

backward, I'd love to have you

10:52

explain a little bit more about

10:55

that.

10:56

So I mean, at some

10:56

point I, in this miserable mike

10:59

phase, I finally reached the

10:59

conclusion, Okay, it's time to

11:01

do something about it. And I

11:01

mean, I literally went off the

11:04

deep end in terms of studying

11:04

and immersing myself in, you

11:08

know, personal development, for

11:08

lack of a better word. And one

11:13

of the things that came out of

11:13

that that really resonated with

11:16

me is looking at like cable, why

11:16

do we do everything we do? And

11:21

why do we have the results we

11:21

have in every area of our life.

11:24

And if we work backwards on

11:24

that, we have thoughts, and we

11:28

have feelings, right? And so in

11:28

a really simplistic way, our

11:31

thoughts are going to affect how

11:31

we feel, right? So if I'm

11:35

constantly in my head being

11:35

like, I'm a failure, I'm a

11:38

failure, I'm a failure, I'm

11:38

going to feel like a failure,

11:42

right? Those have a feedback on

11:42

each other. So the more I feel

11:45

like a failure, the more I think

11:45

I'm a failure, and around and

11:48

round we go, but spring off of

11:48

that, that is going to dictate

11:53

my actions, right. That's how

11:53

I'm going to act because that's

11:56

how I believe who I am. And if I

11:56

continue to act that way, I'm

12:01

going to continue to get more of

12:01

that result. Right. And so we

12:06

end up in this situation where,

12:06

unconsciously now that and

12:10

that's a that's a big word, and

12:10

I'm pausing on that,

12:13

intentionally, is, we can end up

12:13

in a space where we don't even

12:17

realize we're doing this, right.

12:17

When we think about how much of

12:21

our life, how many, how much of

12:21

our thoughts are unconscious,

12:25

the stats vary, but it's a large

12:25

percentage, like upwards of 95%

12:30

of our thoughts, right. And so

12:30

you get in this situation where

12:34

you're just getting more of what

12:34

you don't want, because you're

12:38

repeating the same thoughts and

12:38

feelings and patterns that

12:41

you've always done. So,

12:41

traditionally, we're taught,

12:44

okay, you know, if you want a

12:44

different result, you're gonna

12:47

have to do something different.

12:47

That is completely true. The

12:52

catch is, we have to go further

12:52

back, right, we can't just like

12:56

we all know what it's like on

12:56

January 1, to be like, from here

12:59

on forward, I am going to do

12:59

this new health habit, right.

13:04

And we know how that goes by

13:04

January 15, has completely

13:07

fallen away, we have to go back

13:07

further. Right, we have to

13:11

reprogram what we think and how

13:11

we feel. So that that dictates

13:16

our action, right? And then we

13:16

will get the result.

13:20

And getting

13:20

clear on the exact result is

13:22

also important. And that kind of

13:22

ties into that whole idea of

13:25

inspiration as well, right? If

13:25

you can be inspired by the end

13:29

result that you want, it's going

13:29

to be easier to go back and keep

13:32

up with those actions and

13:32

retrain your thoughts.

13:35

100%. I'm a massive

13:35

fan of goal setting, or vision

13:39

statements, you know, Vision

13:39

planning. And I do believe and I

13:42

was guilty of this as well as

13:42

we, we tend to set a lot of

13:45

goals or visions that we think

13:45

other people want us to do you

13:50

know that we feel like we should

13:50

do for X number of reasons, as

13:54

opposed to what do I really

13:54

want, like me, myself, and when

13:59

you can set that vision, set

13:59

those goals? You're absolutely

14:03

right, right. Like that's what

14:03

you're guiding towards, that

14:06

dictates your thoughts, your

14:06

feelings, your new action and

14:09

your new result.

14:11

It's also

14:11

where core values work comes

14:13

into play, which you talk about,

14:13

and we didn't you know, prep on

14:16

this. But I have been saying for

14:16

the last couple of years since

14:20

I've done work on it. It's been

14:20

so helpful. How do you see core

14:25

values playing into that?

14:26

I'm a big fan of core

14:26

values. I'll even wrap those in

14:30

with like the word standards,

14:30

right? And it is, it's

14:34

interesting because the same

14:34

thing applies when we write core

14:38

values down on a piece of paper

14:38

tendency is to write you know,

14:42

all the big topic ones that

14:42

everyone's going to write. You

14:45

know, I'm authentic, I'm honest,

14:45

I'm transparent. Nothing wrong

14:49

with those, but it just it has

14:49

to pack like a little more punch

14:53

to you personally. Right? Like

14:53

it has to mean something to you

14:57

deeply. It has to inspire you

14:57

Right, because the thing was

15:01

core values, it's great to do

15:01

that work in advance, because

15:05

we're not going to be prepped on

15:05

when we're going to be

15:07

challenged with them. Right when

15:07

that client walks into the

15:11

Veterinary Clinic, you know, on

15:11

emergency or on walk in, and

15:15

they're going to push your core

15:15

values and standards, they don't

15:19

know what yours are theirs are

15:19

different. You know, and, you

15:22

know, maybe we're in Lexa,

15:22

morally distressing situation.

15:26

That's where you have to have

15:26

them already prepped. So you can

15:28

just reach in the tool belt,

15:28

bang, there they are, if you

15:31

haven't done the work upfront,

15:31

you don't know what they are. So

15:34

you don't know how to respond to

15:34

those situations.

15:37

I've also found them to be super helpful in understanding why certain

15:39

interactions, whether it's with

15:42

clients or colleagues, bothers

15:42

you more than it bothers other

15:47

people, you know what I mean?

15:47

I've found that a really big

15:49

mismatch in core values can

15:49

explain a lot of conflict that

15:54

other people don't necessarily

15:54

always have. Yeah, but again,

15:57

have to do it ahead of time to

15:57

get it. Okay, next quote, I want

16:01

to pull out, when you take

16:01

charge of your day, everything

16:04

changes, suddenly, you have room

16:04

to breathe. And you talk about

16:08

getting intentional here. And I

16:08

love all of these things. So

16:11

let's hear them.

16:13

I mean, this is, this

16:13

is a big piece. And honestly, if

16:16

you were to, you know, look at

16:16

all the podcasts I put out and

16:20

content I put out, this is a

16:20

huge bucket like this is one of

16:23

the things I'm sort of standing

16:23

on the mountaintop screaming at

16:26

veterinarians about is get

16:26

intentional with your life. So,

16:29

you know, let's dive into that

16:29

we already touched on how much

16:34

of a of a person's thoughts and

16:34

how much of their day is

16:36

unconscious. So the most

16:36

important thing is just getting

16:41

conscious, like getting aware,

16:41

realizing you have some control

16:45

there. So the thing I'm looking

16:45

at is we want to go from

16:48

reactive to proactive,

16:48

basically, and in every

16:52

situation that we can possibly

16:52

have, we can't control

16:55

everything. That's not what I'm

16:55

saying. But as best as we can.

16:59

Let's put some pieces in place.

16:59

Right.

17:01

So my number one, whether we

17:01

call it core value, or standard

17:06

is lead with gratitude, right.

17:06

And I feel like if people adopt

17:10

that sort of philosophy, it will

17:10

serve them very well. You know,

17:14

on the science side of this, we

17:14

know we have a reticular

17:17

activating system in our

17:17

brainstem, it helps filter

17:21

everything we're seeing whether

17:21

we're seeing it hearing and

17:23

smelling and tasting and just

17:23

all the stimulus of the world, I

17:27

like to think of it of every

17:27

morning, you get to get up and

17:30

you can put on two pairs of

17:30

glasses, right, you can put on

17:33

the pair that filters the world

17:33

negatively, and will show you

17:37

all the negative stuff. Or you

17:37

can put on the pair that will

17:40

show you all the positive stuff.

17:40

Right? So everyone's probably

17:44

had a car shopping experience.

17:44

You decide, Okay, I'm getting a

17:48

Tesla, right? This is the year

17:48

I'm buying a Tesla. And while

17:52

you're thinking about that, you

17:52

start driving around and you're

17:54

like, there's a Tesla, there's a

17:54

Tesla, there's a Tesla, and it's

17:57

like they were always there.

17:57

There's not more, it's just that

18:01

now you're thinking about it,

18:01

you're focusing on it. So your

18:04

brain, your reticular activating

18:04

system is just bringing them to

18:07

the forefront and being like

18:07

here they are

18:09

best resource

18:09

for starting to increase your

18:13

gratitude practice?

18:15

Well, I don't know if

18:15

I'll say the best they are. The

18:17

one I started with was the Five

18:17

Minute Journal. Very simple,

18:21

right? Like it's just a quick

18:21

one page. It's called The Five

18:24

Minute Journal for a reason. It

18:24

should take you less than five

18:26

minutes. It's a few quick

18:26

prompts, you know, you know,

18:29

three things, you know, what are

18:29

you most grateful for on the

18:31

day? What are you looking

18:31

forward to? You just have to

18:34

start looking that way. Right.

18:34

And it is amazing. Once you

18:38

start thinking that way and

18:38

looking that way. More and more

18:41

gratitude appears. Right? So I'm

18:41

not talking like toxic

18:45

positivity. I'm not saying like,

18:45

everything has to be reframed.

18:49

Like, there will be patients

18:49

that pass away. Those events

18:53

will will suck. But overall, how

18:53

can we start our day and lead

18:57

with gratitude and it will it

18:57

will change the course of your

19:00

day?

19:00

Great. Okay, what's next in getting intentional?

19:03

Second point,

19:03

planning. planning is not that

19:06

like sexy when I say it my point

19:06

on this would be easy things are

19:10

easy to do. And they're easy not

19:10

to do. Right. So side tangent A

19:18

long time ago, I don't know

19:18

several years ago there's this

19:21

there's this thing called 75

19:21

hard you know like you got to

19:24

work out twice a drink a gallon

19:24

of water nutrition plan. It's

19:26

like it's meant to be this

19:26

really hard physical challenge

19:30

but it's actually more of a

19:30

mental challenge. But anyway,

19:32

one of the things in there is to

19:32

take a selfie everyday take a

19:36

progress photo. Almost everyone

19:36

I talked to you that has

19:39

attempted 75 heart and you have

19:39

to do these every day in a row

19:42

if you miss once of anything you

19:42

start over. Almost everyone

19:47

fails on taking the selfie. No.

19:47

Easiest thing on the list by

19:54

far. Right. Yeah to 245 two

19:54

separate 45 minute wear Gotta

20:00

one of them has to be outside.

20:00

That's hard. Selfie that takes

20:05

you two seconds. Easy things

20:05

easy to do, easy not to do. So I

20:11

think a lot of times, you know,

20:11

when people get in these

20:14

survival modes, they are looking

20:14

for this big massive like

20:20

swooping in, aha, like

20:20

transformational just big thing.

20:26

It's like, no, no, no, no, no,

20:26

we're gonna go extremely simple,

20:30

right down to the basics. So the

20:30

two things that have helped me

20:34

the most, number one, I kind of

20:34

call it my Sunday system is just

20:38

on Sunday, me and my wife get

20:38

together quick overview, like,

20:42

who's got what meetings where?

20:42

Where do the kids need to be,

20:46

you know, is there any big

20:46

events coming up, we have to

20:48

plan for, you know, I drop in my

20:48

key tasks. And it just sort of

20:52

sets the stage for the week, you

20:52

know, what's coming. Then on a

20:56

daily basis. I'm a big fan of

20:56

the book, Miracle Morning by Hal

21:00

Elrod, he lays out a whole bunch

21:00

of different things that you can

21:03

do. The key here is you can pick

21:03

and choose, right, like it

21:08

doesn't have to be this big,

21:08

elaborate, you know, two hour

21:11

thing. And I have found that the

21:11

more that you are in survival

21:16

mode, the more you need this,

21:16

like the more you just need one

21:19

or two pieces that you can just

21:19

latch on to, you know, and

21:23

execute, whether that's an

21:23

exercise component, or just like

21:26

a healthy breakfast, or whatever

21:26

it is something that sets your

21:29

day in the right direction.

21:29

Great. Yeah. The last thing I'll

21:34

say just on the planning, before

21:34

we move on, there's so much

21:38

stimulus in the world, begging

21:38

for our attention, right. So

21:42

every morning, you wake up your

21:42

emails full, your Instagram

21:45

messages are full, you have all

21:45

these notifications, the world

21:48

is trying to tell you focus on

21:48

my priorities, the number one

21:52

thing you can do is just write

21:52

down one and only one. And this

21:57

is not a to do list. This is a

21:57

must do list. So one thing I

22:02

will do today, that leads me

22:02

towards that five year vision

22:06

that we talked about, and you

22:06

don't have to be perfect on it.

22:08

Honestly, if you go three for

22:08

seven on the week, you'll be so

22:12

far ahead when you look up a

22:12

year, two years, three years

22:15

down the road, but everything's

22:15

trying to pull us away from

22:18

that. So the final piece in the

22:18

book, I call it boundaries, you

22:23

and I before we hit record, I

22:23

was laughing about the fact that

22:26

I had to lock my content a long

22:26

time ago. And then the book gets

22:29

released. If I was writing the

22:29

book. Now, I would probably

22:33

reframe this as boundaries and

22:33

standards. Okay, so how I look

22:37

at this is I look at boundaries

22:37

as in place for other people. So

22:43

like that's kind of the might

22:43

say it will say my fence for

22:45

lack of a better word that I put

22:45

up, where it's like, okay,

22:48

that's, that's a boundary,

22:48

you're not allowed to come in

22:50

there. And I used to get really

22:50

angry, you know, kind of like

22:54

you said, different things hit

22:54

different. I used to get really

22:57

angry when people would infringe

22:57

on my boundaries. But then I

23:01

realized, like, they don't know,

23:01

if they're infringing, it's just

23:04

because I haven't clearly

23:04

communicated them. They have no

23:08

clue what my expectations are,

23:08

they have a totally different

23:11

set of expectations going on in

23:11

their life. And so I kind of let

23:16

go of the word boundaries,

23:16

because I really have no control

23:19

of that, like people can

23:19

infringe on my or try to

23:21

infringe on my boundaries all

23:21

the time. That's out of my

23:24

control. What I do have control

23:24

of is my standards. So my

23:29

standards is me looking

23:29

outwards, where it's like, this

23:32

is where I will come to, but I'm

23:32

not going to go further than

23:35

that. Right. And I have control

23:35

over that. So I've really

23:39

shifted that in the last while

23:39

focusing on what is my standard,

23:43

you know, so for me, I'm I'm

23:43

trying the reason I'm saying

23:47

trying is because I always get

23:47

the question people listen to

23:50

like the podcasts we put out.

23:50

And I'll say something and they

23:53

think I'm perfect at it. I'm

23:53

like, No, not even close. Right?

23:58

We do this work because we're trying to learn more and get better.

24:01

Yeah, what are my

24:01

standards is nothing before

24:04

30am? Like no input, right?

24:04

No, no email, no, no social

24:09

media, no TV, no, nothing like

24:09

nothing should be infringing on

24:13

my attention for the morning.

24:13

It's me, the kids, Rosalie,

24:17

we're doing our thing. Not

24:17

perfect on it. But that's my

24:20

standard as long as I can most

24:20

of the time hit it. It's going

24:23

to be a good day.

24:24

Yeah.

24:24

Interesting. Well, so yeah, I'm

24:27

thinking about your definition

24:27

kind of, of boundaries. And I've

24:30

developed some, like some talks

24:30

around this. I had to do one at

24:33

AAEP last year on communication

24:33

boundaries. And I really dug

24:38

into Nedre Tawaab's work, which

24:38

really resonated with me and so

24:42

I guess like my thoughts on that

24:42

are that boundaries are actually

24:48

for you. You set them and then

24:48

set actions to uphold them, but

24:54

you can't like you said you

24:54

can't control if someone's going

24:57

to keep infringing on your

24:57

boundary. is, but that action to

25:02

then, you know, change your

25:02

relationship with that person is

25:06

what the follow up needs to

25:06

happen in order to not get so

25:09

angry about them being infringed

25:09

upon. Same Same idea, just like

25:14

a little bit of a different

25:14

thought on it. Yeah,

25:16

I like it. I'm

25:16

thinking back to just what we

25:19

said on core values. The key

25:19

again, is you had them upfront,

25:24

right? So it's like that, you

25:24

know, what the boundary is in

25:27

advance of the situation where

25:27

you have to enforce the

25:30

boundary? Yeah.

25:31

And you

25:31

clearly communicated it ahead of

25:33

time, right? Because that if

25:33

that's on you, if you haven't

25:35

clearly communicated it. So yes,

25:35

you know, what, ahead of time,

25:38

you've clearly communicated it.

25:38

If it keeps getting infringed

25:41

upon. It's up to you to change

25:41

that interaction or, you know,

25:46

relationship in some way. Yeah.

25:46

Yeah. Love boundaries, love

25:49

boundaries. Okay. Last quote,

25:49

I'm gonna pull out, nothing sets

25:54

you free, like not needing a

25:54

paycheck. And first of all, I

25:58

didn't know that you spelled

25:58

paycheck that way in Canada, and

26:01

I love it. And I might try to

26:01

steal. But I also think the idea

26:06

of financial independence is

26:06

really important. And I think I

26:10

don't know about you, but I feel

26:10

like a lot of here a lot of

26:12

veterinarians not even

26:12

considering that as an option.

26:15

So I'm curious on your thoughts.

26:18

This is, this is a

26:18

big one I like I love this. And

26:21

this, we're, I'm excited that

26:21

we're chatting, because I think

26:24

we could go forever on this one.

26:24

But the veterinary industry, for

26:27

sure. But honestly, just the

26:27

world right now, I don't know, I

26:32

haven't talked really to anyone

26:32

that isn't feeling more pressure

26:37

as of late, right? Like when we

26:37

just everything going on the

26:40

cost of stuff, we went grocery

26:40

shopping, the other day was like

26:43

365 bucks, and we didn't buy any

26:43

meat. Like that's just like

26:46

vegetables and fruit and stuff.

26:46

Everyone is feeling the pinch.

26:50

And I look at you know, my life.

26:50

And there's kind of four

26:53

freedoms that I consider, right

26:53

freedom of time, freedom of

26:57

money, freedom of relationship,

26:57

freedom of purpose, right, and

27:01

I'm trying to kind of optimize

27:01

in those areas where if I have

27:04

as much choice as possible in

27:04

those areas, I know that my joy,

27:10

my fulfillment in my life is

27:10

pretty high. And I see a lot of

27:14

veterinarians, truly in survival

27:14

mode, financially, right, they

27:19

have, you know, the mountain of

27:19

debt, they're working 50 6070

27:24

plus hours a week, working

27:24

really hard. And they're feeling

27:29

like they're not getting ahead.

27:29

They just feel stuck. They're

27:32

everything totally changes. If

27:32

you don't need that, like if you

27:37

don't have to go do that. I'm

27:37

not saying that doesn't mean

27:40

you're not going to do it,

27:40

right. Lots of people get

27:43

financially free, and would

27:43

still choose to do the work

27:46

they're doing because they love

27:46

it, they would probably just do

27:48

quite a bit less. Me. Yeah. And

27:48

then the interesting thing that

27:54

happens is, you get that time

27:54

back for sure. But you get all

28:00

of that, like mental and

28:00

emotional energy back. Right?

28:04

And the things that come of it

28:04

like you hear, I've heard so

28:07

many stories, when people are

28:07

finally able to step away from

28:11

something, they don't know

28:11

what's next. But they still have

28:15

the courage to make that step.

28:15

And in very short order,

28:19

something just absolutely

28:19

amazing comes along, right. And

28:22

I've heard that just so many

28:22

times where it's just like

28:25

there's something here, right

28:25

where you can break free from

28:28

that survival mode. And then all

28:28

of a sudden, you know, things

28:31

that truly lights you up fill

28:31

that space, because you have the

28:34

energy to like, step into them

28:34

now.

28:36

Yeah, for

28:36

sure. So thoughts on how to get

28:41

veterinarians a little bit more

28:41

comfortable or secure in their

28:45

finances?

28:46

Oh, that's a good

28:46

one. I do think we have to talk

28:48

about it more. I mean, that

28:48

being said, as you've heard

28:51

already talking is one thing

28:51

doing is another. The reason I'm

28:55

starting with talking is people

28:55

don't talk about money, in my

29:00

opinion, nearly enough. Like

29:00

it's still kind of this taboo

29:04

thing. And what that sets us up

29:04

for is a situation where if

29:09

we're not talking about it very

29:09

much, but when we do talk about

29:13

it, it's a very negative

29:13

conversation. That means that

29:17

you know, the body of work, the

29:17

body of conversations happening

29:20

around money are negative. So

29:20

what does that lead to, that

29:24

leads to us feeling negative

29:24

about money that leads to our

29:27

actions being fairly negative,

29:27

and that leads to our results.

29:30

So I want to see way more

29:30

positive conversations away from

29:35

scarcity Towards Abundance in

29:35

the veterinary space. Right, and

29:39

that can get us all primed, you

29:39

know, thinking it is possible,

29:43

like it is possible to have a

29:43

financially abundant life as a

29:47

veterinarian.

29:48

Well, let's

29:48

talk a little bit about multiple

29:51

streams of income, though also

29:51

because I think that's not truly

29:56

necessary, but I think it's

29:56

definitely a way that I was I'm

30:00

aware of, you know, before I got

30:00

into real estate and things like

30:03

that, that people may not even

30:03

understand the concept of

30:07

the multiple streams

30:07

of income is kind of like it

30:09

sounds like most people

30:09

listening to this podcast are

30:12

going to have as stream of

30:12

income, which is their

30:14

veterinary employment. Right?

30:14

And that's fantastic. When we

30:18

look at multiple, we're just

30:18

looking at how can we add other

30:22

streams that come in? I know you

30:22

and I are big fans of real

30:25

estate, I pivoted over to real

30:25

estate because I was looking for

30:28

a way to decouple like my

30:28

earnings from me needing to

30:33

punch the clock and spend time

30:33

there. Right. So that's why I'm

30:36

such a big fan of real estate is

30:36

because once I have a rental

30:39

property up and running, it

30:39

doesn't require much of my time.

30:43

Right? Right. So for you and I,

30:43

we've chosen real estate, we

30:46

have rental income that comes

30:46

in, I mean, it can literally be

30:50

anything people talk about

30:50

different side hustles, you

30:52

know, whatever is going to light

30:52

you up, that you enjoy doing

30:55

that you can make some some

30:55

money at, and just start adding

30:58

those in. Because, in my

30:58

opinion, the most dangerous

31:02

place you can be is having only

31:02

one source of income, because if

31:06

that source of income goes away,

31:06

you now have no source of

31:09

income.

31:10

Right? And do

31:10

you hear pushback from people

31:13

that you talk to you are

31:13

veterinarians? Like I just, I

31:15

can't possibly do that. I don't

31:15

have time I you know, do you

31:18

hear things like that?

31:19

Sometimes? Yeah. I

31:19

mean, I'm always I'm very

31:22

supportive. And so it's like,

31:22

everyone's situation is going to

31:25

be very different. And I'm fully

31:25

transparent. I don't think real

31:31

estate is for everyone. And then

31:31

you'd have to break that down

31:33

into like active real estate

31:33

investing or passive real estate

31:36

investing. And I also will never

31:36

say that it's better, right? If

31:41

you're a veterinarian who's

31:41

always wanted to own their own

31:45

veterinary practice, and you're,

31:45

you know, you're inclined, you

31:48

want to learn about the business

31:48

side, and you're going to dive

31:50

in, you should go do that. I'm

31:50

never going to try to talk you

31:54

out of that and say, Oh, no,

31:54

real estate's better. It's like,

31:56

no, if you want to go run a

31:56

veterinary clinic, 100% dive in.

32:01

Yeah, that's a really important point. Everything needs to be kind of

32:03

individualized. And just like

32:07

we've talked about a lot

32:07

throughout this whole episode,

32:09

you really need to kind of step

32:09

back and take time to plan that

32:13

and see what works for you, you

32:13

know, and your family or

32:16

partnership individually. So

32:16

yeah, well, thank you. Thanks

32:21

for all the insight that you've

32:21

provided in this, you know,

32:23

chat, I really appreciate it.

32:23

Where can people find the book,

32:28

find out more I know, there's

32:28

also an awesome workbook and I'm

32:32

gonna get this out soon. So

32:32

there's still a new bundle

32:36

going, I believe, is that correct?

32:38

Yeah. So you can find

32:38

the book online, you know, what

32:41

all the major platforms Amazon,

32:41

it's your gonna get peed on. On

32:45

our website over at the

32:45

veterinary project, there is a

32:48

book page. And on there, I have

32:48

kind of a little book bundle, I

32:52

think that runs till April 22.

32:52

If you miss it by a few days,

32:56

just email us and I'll hook you

32:56

up. But yeah, it has a workbook

33:00

in it, kind of my daily

33:00

intention checklist, which is

33:03

from my Miracle Morning, kind of

33:03

what I've whittled down in use,

33:07

and then I will be running a

33:07

goal setting workshop sometime

33:10

later in 2023. So anyone that

33:10

kind of, you know, buys the book

33:14

within the first month, you get

33:14

access to all of that stuff. And

33:17

you can feel free to follow along the veterinary project. That's that's the podcast me and

33:19

Jonathan run, same website, same

33:24

Instagram handle.

33:25

Perfect. And I'll put all those links in the show notes. Again, I highly

33:26

recommend the book. So

33:30

informative, actionable, loved

33:30

it. Congratulations. Thank you

33:34

for being here today. Last

33:34

question, what is one small

33:38

thing that has brought you joy this past week?

33:41

Yeah. So I knew this

33:41

was coming because I know that's

33:43

your your classic question. This

33:43

is easy for me. So I am up in

33:46

Saskatoon, Saskatchewan, Canada,

33:46

it is sort of spring melt time.

33:51

So we have all this snow it

33:51

starts melting means that

33:53

there's huge puddles. And I

33:53

tried to be an active runner.

33:58

And on Saturday, this weekend, I

33:58

was going for my run. And Riley

34:01

my three and a half year old

34:01

wanted to come. So I strapped

34:04

her in the running stroller. And

34:04

we were heading down the trails

34:07

and they're very slushy and

34:07

puddles everywhere. And we

34:10

decided we're not going around

34:10

any of the puddles. We're going

34:13

through all of them. So we spent

34:13

like an hour just bombing

34:16

through puddles, you know,

34:16

getting soaked just being little

34:20

kids playing in puddles. And it

34:20

was fantastic.

34:22

That's awesome. She probably had such a blast as well. What a great

34:24

memory. Well, thanks again and

34:28

I'll talk to you soon.

34:30

You got thanks, Stacey.

34:33

Thank you so much for tuning in to the whole veterinarian podcast. I so

34:35

appreciate the time that you

34:38

spend with me to connect. Please

34:38

find me on Instagram at the

34:41

whole veterinarian, or check out

34:41

the website at the whole

34:45

veterinarian.com and you can

34:45

sign up for our monthly

34:48

newsletter as well. Thanks again

34:48

and I'll talk to you soon