As the retail apocalypse looms large, the hospitality and entertainment industries are sitting up to take note, and the world of commercial office real estate is coming under threat like never before. The big question is what happens next.On the guest list today is Bart Higgins, a partner at the international innovation consultancy WhatIf.

Bart runs the firm’s 4D Experience practice, helping companies across retail, workspace, hospitality and entertainment identify new business models, create better experiences and build their internal capabilities.

In this conversation Bart shares his insights into what other industries can learn from retail’s struggles, the future of the company town, and how real estate owners can reimagine the experiences they provide.

Episode overview:05:00 Lucky breaks and designing a workplace for Wired Magazine13:00 Reimagining retail store design - people, place and technology19:00 Lessons from Little Waitrose and Whole Foods27:00 The new commercial opportunity in the world of work30:00 The office apocalypse, the 3 models of real estate ownership, and 3 big shifts37:00 The future of the company town42:00 Advice for real estate developers45:00 The emergence of an important new hybrid role47:30 Managing tension between old and new working styles52:00 Thinking human55:00 Iron Maiden and supermarket shocks