1:39

Several

2:02

women had come forward to share details

2:04

of their experiences with Brand over a period

2:07

spanning seven years at the

2:09

height of his career. Dozens

2:12

of people had been interviewed to corroborate

2:14

their accounts.

2:15

As I've written about it extensively in my books,

2:18

I was very, very promiscuous. Now during

2:20

that time of promiscuity, the relationships

2:22

I had were absolutely always consensual.

2:25

I was always transparent about that then, almost

2:27

too transparent. And I'm being transparent

2:29

about it now.

2:32

Brand,

2:33

a 48 year old father of two who has

2:35

worked as a presenter, actor,

2:37

YouTuber, lives in Oxfordshire

2:40

with his wife.

2:42

He claimed there was a sinister campaign at play.

2:45

The mainstream media in which he made

2:47

his name, career and fortune was

2:50

now out to get him.

2:53

I'm aware that you guys have been saying

2:55

in the comments for a while, watch out Russell, they're

2:57

coming for you, you're getting too close to the truth. It's

3:00

been clear to me, or at least it

3:02

feels to me like there's a serious and concerted

3:05

agenda to control these kind of spaces

3:07

and these kind of voices. And I'm in my voice along

3:10

with your voice.

3:13

For Brand and his millions of followers,

3:15

the revelations of the weekend were a conspiratorial

3:18

attempt to silence him. But

3:21

to the women he is alleged to have assaulted, he

3:24

is manipulating the truth.

3:26

It's laughable that he would

3:27

even imply that this is some

3:30

kind of mainstream media conspiracy.

3:33

He's not outside the mainstream. He

3:36

did a Universal Pictures movie last year.

3:38

He did Minions, a children's

3:40

movie. He's very much part of the

3:42

mainstream media.

3:47

On Saturday night, Brand arrived

3:49

to Cheers at a sold out gig in London

3:51

where he performed a set to over 2,000 people.

4:03

The rest of his one man tour has now

4:05

been suspended. His

4:12

former employers, including Channel 4

4:14

and the BBC, are now launching

4:17

their own retrospective investigations.

4:20

The police have received a report of a sexual

4:22

assault that took place in 2003 and

4:25

they urge any other alleged victims to

4:27

come forward.

4:29

I want you to stay close, stay

4:31

awake, but more important than any of that, if you can,

4:34

please stay free.

4:36

From The Guardian, I'm Nashénik

4:38

Bár.

4:39

Today in focus, understanding

4:42

the accusations against

4:43

Russell Brand. Lexi

4:51

Topping, you're a senior Guardian reporter

4:54

focused on gender inequality and you've

4:56

worked on major investigations revealing

4:58

very serious allegations of sexual assault.

5:01

On Saturday, The Sunday Times published

5:03

its joint investigation into Russell Brand,

5:06

which was followed by Channel 4's dispatches

5:08

later that evening.

5:10

Broadly speaking, what do these

5:12

stories say? This has been

5:14

a hugely

5:15

shocking story. Four women

5:17

have alleged sexual assaults by Russell

5:20

Brand between 2006 and 2013, while he was

5:23

a presenter for BBC

5:25

Radio 2 and Channel 4 and

5:28

a very successful actor in

5:30

Hollywood films. Others have

5:32

made a range of accusations about

5:35

Brand's alleged controlling, abusive

5:37

and predatory behaviour. He's denied

5:39

all of the allegations and he's said that the

5:41

relationships were all consensual.

5:45

The testimony of the four women who've gone on

5:47

record is really harrowing.

5:49

I mean, there was one woman who was 16 when she

5:51

met Brand. What did she say

5:54

about how Russell Brand treated her? In 2006,

5:56

she met Russell Brand when

6:00

she was just 16 and started a three

6:02

month relationship with him. I thought I

6:04

was very grown up, thought I was very mature,

6:07

like I knew everything about

6:09

the world. The

6:11

law enabled it as well. It

6:14

shouldn't be legal for a 16 year

6:16

old to have a relationship with a man in their 30s.

6:20

She was still in school and he

6:22

was then age 30. He was a BBC

6:24

Radio presenter and a host of Big

6:27

Brothers, Big Mouth. She says she met him in Leicester

6:30

Square when he approached her after she'd

6:32

been shopping. They started

6:34

talking. He went through the purchases

6:37

in her shopping books. And

6:39

then she says that he took out a dress and

6:41

said, you're going to wear this on our date next

6:43

week. She says that over the weeks

6:45

and months, the relationship became

6:47

darker. He referred to her as the child

6:50

as she alleged that he was controlling

6:53

and sexually and emotionally abusive.

6:55

I remember he ran a bath for

6:57

me and he made me sit in the bath. Then

7:01

he said he had to leave, but I should

7:04

stay in the bath for the integrity of him

7:06

being gone. She says that he asked

7:08

her how many people she had

7:11

slept with. And she said, in fact,

7:13

she was a virgin. She said that that

7:15

made him sexually aroused and that

7:17

he cradled her in his arms, calling

7:19

her his baby and would also

7:22

refer to his as like his little

7:24

dolly. She says that

7:26

now, looking back, she would

7:28

describe his behaviour as

7:30

grooming, that

7:31

he would send cars to pick her

7:33

up from her school. She says

7:35

that he also told her to save

7:38

his number under the

7:40

name Carly in her phone. And

7:43

that when he

7:45

asked her to come over one night when it was late, she

7:48

said no, she was still a school girl

7:50

after all. And he gave her

7:53

almost a script about

7:55

what to say to her parents so that

7:57

she could come out and meet him. also

8:00

really serious allegation of

8:02

sexual assault. She said that Brand

8:05

had forced his penis into her mouth

8:07

and had actually choked her with

8:10

his penis and to the extent that she couldn't

8:12

breathe, she said that she fought him

8:14

off. But the only way that she could

8:16

stop the attack was to punch him in the

8:19

stomach. And then he finally,

8:21

then he like, he

8:23

fell backwards and I was

8:26

crying and he said, oh,

8:28

I only want to see your mascara run anyway.

8:32

You see,

8:33

it is so grim to hear these stories

8:35

we told in such cold detail. And

8:38

yet, of course, it doesn't end there.

8:41

Russell Brand moved to Los Angeles in around 2011

8:43

and embarks on the next

8:45

A-list stage of his career. What

8:48

did the investigation uncover about that period?

8:51

One woman told the investigation that Brand

8:54

had raped her against the wall in his Los Angeles

8:56

in July 2012. She said

8:59

that her and Brand were friends and that

9:01

when he called her and told her that

9:03

he wanted her to come over one night, she

9:05

initially said no, it was too late. At first,

9:08

I said, no, I'm not going, it's late. And

9:11

he's like, please come, just come and come with me.

9:14

So then I gave in and I'm

9:16

like,

9:17

okay.

9:18

As soon as she arrived, he was

9:20

kissing her. She said they had previously

9:23

had consensual sex, but this

9:25

time something was very different. He

9:28

said she suddenly felt like there was no escape

9:31

for her.

9:32

And she said Brand told her he had

9:34

a friend in the bedroom and that

9:36

he wanted her to come and meet them.

9:39

She refused. She told him that

9:41

wouldn't happen. She said, but he didn't take

9:44

no for an answer. He kept trying

9:46

to take her clothes and

9:49

trying to pin her against

9:51

the wall. And at this point, he's

9:54

grabbing at my underwear,

9:57

pulling it to the side. I'm telling him to get

9:59

off me. he won't get off. But

10:01

he carried on that he got a glazed

10:04

look in his eye and then he was

10:06

pushing her up against a wall and

10:08

she alleges that he raped her without

10:11

a condom. She said that after

10:13

that had finished he blocked the door

10:15

because he didn't want her to leave and he

10:17

asked her if she was okay and

10:19

she said no you need to get away from me

10:22

and he said come on let's let's calm

10:24

down. She said he eventually

10:26

did step away from the door. She

10:28

said that she got out, jumped in her car

10:31

and went home. At 3 29 a.m

10:34

the same morning

10:35

Bran sent her a text message.

10:37

It said I'm sorry that was crazy and selfish.

10:40

I hope you can forgive me. I know that

10:42

you're a lovely person and he signed

10:44

it with a kiss. He tried phoning

10:46

her again at 3 51 a.m

10:49

but the call went unanswered. She

10:52

was treated at a rape crisis center.

10:54

The journalist working on this story

10:57

have seen those medical records. Text

10:59

messages that they've also seen sent

11:01

him the hours after she left the house.

11:04

She told Bran that she'd been scared by him. She'd

11:06

not taken advantage of and she'd

11:08

written when a girl says no it

11:10

means no. Bran replied saying

11:12

that she was barely sorry.

11:24

Lexi, another woman Bran met

11:26

in Los Angeles recounts another serious

11:29

sexual assault. He

11:31

met her at Alcoholics Anonymous which is

11:33

supposed to be a safe nurturing space. They

11:37

ended up working together. What did she say about

11:39

what happened to her? She

11:42

says that he tried to kiss her and take

11:44

her clothes and pinned her down forcefully and

11:47

she shouted at him to stop. I was

11:49

screaming and I was like what are you doing? Like

11:51

stop you're my friend.

11:53

I love you. Please

11:55

don't do this. I don't want

11:58

to do this. Like he I

12:01

think he had his hands down my trousers

12:03

but I was fighting so hard and I was

12:05

screaming so hard and

12:09

something snapped and he heard me and

12:11

he got off of me. Then he flipped

12:13

out and started shouting at her and saying

12:16

that she was fired. She says years

12:18

later that she spoke to someone who'd been working

12:20

on a project with Rand who

12:23

was outside the house at the time of

12:25

the incident and she said that he

12:27

apologised for not helping her saying

12:29

that he'd heard her screaming but

12:32

they were all really scared of him. She

12:35

says that Rand threatened

12:37

her with legal action if

12:39

she told anyone about the allegation and she never

12:41

reported him because she was really worried

12:43

about what it would do to her career. And

12:46

aside from these really serious allegations,

12:48

the most serious allegations of rape, the investigation

12:51

built a very clear picture of the culture

12:53

around Rand at the height of his career, his

12:56

ability to ultimately

12:58

get away with being entirely inappropriate

13:01

at the workplace both at Channel 4 and

13:03

at the BBC. Lexi,

13:05

can you tell me about what we learned about his behaviour

13:07

in that period? Things

13:10

throughout the investigation, what we've learned

13:12

is Rand consistently

13:15

behaved in a way that was

13:17

inappropriate then and certainly

13:20

would have been seen as inappropriate now.

13:23

He made inappropriate

13:25

remarks

13:26

to people as he was working

13:28

with them. When he performed on

13:31

stage, he

13:32

made rape jokes that even

13:35

at the time I think would have been

13:37

sailing very close to the wind.

13:40

What people said throughout the investigation was

13:43

that people warned about him. If

13:46

women were working with him, they would speak

13:48

to each other so that they knew

13:50

to take care if

13:53

they were on their own with him. It

13:56

was a known problem in some ways that

13:59

he was problem with him. around women, shall we say?

14:02

I think that

14:03

the investigation shows that there was plenty

14:05

of evidence both in the public eye

14:08

and behind closed doors

14:10

that

14:11

people knew that Brown's behaviour was problematic.

14:14

He was a self-confessed sex addict.

14:16

He called himself promiscuous. But

14:19

the people who worked with him thought

14:22

that it was a problem and that they had to protect

14:25

their fellow colleagues.

14:26

What has Russell Brown and

14:29

his lawyers, what have they all said in response to this?

14:46

I'm

14:56

being transparent

14:58

about it now as well. And to see that

15:00

transparency metastasised into something criminal

15:03

that I absolutely deny makes me question, is there another

15:05

agenda at play?

15:15

The

15:19

lawyers didn't provide a full response,

15:22

but

15:23

the allegations were then confronted

15:25

by Brand on his own YouTube channel,

15:28

saying that he'd been very, very promiscuous,

15:31

but said that all of his relationships had

15:33

been always consensual.

15:36

And what about Brown's former employers,

15:39

the production company Endemarle, Channel 4,

15:41

the BBC? What have they said? Several

15:44

of Brown's former employers have said that they're

15:46

going to launch investigations into

15:49

his behaviour while he worked for them. The

15:51

BBC, which of course

15:53

employed Brand as a DJ on 6 Music

15:56

and on Radio 2, said the reports

15:58

contained serious allegations of the spanning a number

16:00

of years and it was urgently looking into the

16:02

issues raised. A spokesperson to Channel 4

16:05

said it was appalled to learn of the allegations

16:08

and Bannerj UK which bought out

16:11

Endemol which was a production company that made

16:13

Big Brother's Big Mouth said that it

16:15

launched an urgent investigation again.

16:18

Lexi

16:24

Russell Brand has been famous almost from

16:26

the very beginning of his career in the early

16:28

noughties. He started out as a comedian,

16:31

moved on to MTV as a presenter, got

16:33

bigger and bigger as a Channel 4 Big Brother

16:36

host and from there he just became

16:38

a tabloid fixture and the very definition

16:41

of that mid-noughties Camden scene.

16:44

He was a BBC Radio presenter

16:46

as you said and the sort

16:48

of nice bad boy it

16:50

was okay to laugh along with. What

16:53

do you think it was about him that seemed

16:55

so irresistible to audiences at the time

16:58

and to the bosses that hired him? There

17:00

was something about Brand that really tapped

17:03

into that moosh debauched

17:06

era that was the early

17:08

noughties. He

17:11

was really opened about

17:13

his failings as the trauma that

17:15

he'd been through, his addictions. He

17:18

put everything on the line and he had

17:21

this image of being a cheeky

17:23

chappy, someone who was naughty

17:26

but not dangerous in any way.

17:42

Brand has become something of a periphery

17:44

figure in recent years but he was

17:46

huge, he was everywhere. He was

17:49

on multiple TV shows, he had

17:51

his own radio show, he was at

17:53

Hollywood, he was in big films, he

17:56

was a known womaniser, he was called

17:59

Shagger of the Year. by the son of three

18:01

times and he had high

18:03

profile relationships with incredibly

18:06

talented women. He was linked

18:09

with Kate Moss, he married Katy Perry.

18:12

So he was a

18:13

huge figure in the early noughties and

18:16

and blen like of that culture

18:18

of debauchery and naughtiness

18:21

that was was seen to be so popular at the time.

18:25

Looking back, Russell Brand said some

18:27

outrageously sexist things in his comedy. I

18:29

mean, he also admitted openly that he wasn't

18:31

always respectful of women, all the

18:33

while presenting himself as this safe

18:36

camp guy, you know, this ironic playful type.

18:38

I mean, as you said, the cheeky chappy rather

18:40

than the aggressive alpha male. Can

18:43

you talk us through some of the more egregious

18:46

examples of his on-air behavior? Brand

18:49

was constantly getting into trouble.

18:51

He was accused of exposing himself

18:53

to colleagues in a BBC studio

18:56

when he urinated in a bottle. The

18:58

bottle was talked about live

19:00

on air. He had a frankly disgusting

19:03

conversation with Jimmy Savile

19:05

before the full extent of Savile's crimes

19:07

was known, which he offered to

19:10

send over his assistant

19:12

to Savile who would be naked and

19:15

happy to do whatever he

19:16

wanted. I've got a personal assistant called

19:18

Marsha and part of her job description is

19:20

that anyone I demand she greets,

19:23

meets, massages, she has to do it.

19:25

She's very attractive, Jimmy. Well,

19:28

that's a good start. He

19:30

constantly undermined a

19:32

woman who was a newsreader when on

19:34

one of his news shows saying that she

19:36

wanted to get under the death and

19:39

that she was erotic and he even

19:42

referenced the fact that she complained about

19:44

this on air and

19:45

saying that well she had no right

19:48

of reply.

19:59

finally made him lose his

20:02

job at Radio 2 was

20:04

not his behaviour towards a woman

20:07

but was an incident which was then

20:09

known as sexgate. He

20:11

called sex, he was formerly Manuel

20:13

in faulty towers and had a

20:16

frank call with him with

20:18

the broadcaster Jonathan Ross in which Ross

20:21

said that Brand had fucked

20:24

his granddaughter.

20:25

Because you know what you're talking about.

20:27

He fucked her granddaughter!

20:33

And it was the controversy

20:36

about that and the fact that that should never

20:38

have been allowed to be on there that

20:40

finally lost Brand his job.

20:50

So for everything you say, he famously

20:53

and serially filled upwards. He writes in his

20:55

book that his management told him he quote,

20:57

f'd up every opportunity he was given. And

21:00

yet, you know, he still ended up in Hollywood as

21:02

he said starred in massive films, married

21:04

Katy Perry, carries on telling the world

21:06

about his sex addiction and his many,

21:08

many

21:08

conquests.

21:10

After he divorced Perry, he was back

21:12

in England and suddenly reinvented

21:15

himself as a voice for the politically disenfranchised

21:18

appearing on Newsnight and Question Time

21:20

and so on. This eventually

21:22

shifts into the wellness,

21:25

truth-seeking iteration of Russell Brand

21:27

we know today. What can

21:29

you tell me about that? Brand

21:31

has always positioned himself as

21:34

a sort of anti-hero outside of the

21:36

establishment back in the era

21:38

when he was taking rather left-wing views. He

21:40

was seen as a somewhat powerful character

21:42

who could speak truth to poon. In

21:45

recent years, he's really

21:47

gone 180. On his YouTube

21:51

channel, he has spoken

21:53

freely about conspiracy theories

21:55

such as the Covid pandemic, the war in

21:57

Ukraine, the climate crisis. He's

22:00

also amassed a huge online following.

22:02

He's got 3.8 million

22:05

followers on Instagram, 6.6 million

22:07

on YouTube, millions on

22:10

TikTok.

22:11

And he's positioned himself as a wellness

22:14

guru. He does cold water

22:16

therapy, he talks about healing,

22:18

he talks about addiction, and

22:20

he runs his own wellness

22:22

events. So he's really

22:25

put himself in the centre

22:28

of a culture that is known

22:31

for

22:32

dabbling in conspiracy theories and

22:35

that is known for for distrusting

22:37

what they call mainstream media. Is it right

22:39

that big tech companies and the

22:41

state are given the power to determine

22:44

whether or not you can enjoy everyday

22:47

freedoms?

22:48

Are we moving towards ID cards

22:51

by stealth and further empowering

22:53

massive centralised

22:55

authorities? Lexi, you've got a lot of experience reporting

22:58

big me too stories and

23:00

a lot of people this weekend have been asking why

23:03

that if there were rumours for so long about

23:05

Russell Brown's behaviour and if it was

23:07

considered an open secret,

23:09

why did it take until this weekend for an investigation

23:12

to be published?

23:13

Can you explain how or why

23:15

these stories can take a long time? I find

23:18

this really quite frustrating because

23:20

people have no idea

23:23

about the complexity of these stories,

23:26

how difficult they are to get over

23:28

the line, how many resources they take,

23:31

how legally tight every single

23:33

word in every single sentence, every

23:35

single minute of every single clip

23:37

in a film has to be in order

23:40

to get sign off to get these pieces

23:42

published. People knowing

23:45

about something or saying post-publication

23:49

everybody knew about this just simply

23:51

doesn't recognise the amount of work

23:53

that goes in to doing them. These

23:55

journalists will have worked for years

23:58

on this. Those years in needed

24:00

to build up trust. You're talking to people

24:02

who have been severely damaged by

24:05

their experience. You're talking to people who

24:08

may have been let down

24:10

in the past so building up relationships

24:13

take time. Verifying what

24:15

people have told you takes a huge

24:17

amount of time and that can involve hundreds

24:20

of phone calls, going through records,

24:22

sending off freedom of information requests,

24:25

going to employers and

24:27

the like for comment. These

24:29

are just really time-consuming things that

24:32

take a lot of

24:32

work so credit to the teams that have

24:34

done this. Coming

24:41

up, what's next for Russell

24:43

Brand?

24:53

Brittany's getting divorced, Lizzo's

24:55

in hot water and I am still

24:57

lost over Barbinheimer. There

24:59

is so much to come. But

25:02

don't worry, the Guardian's pop culture

25:05

with me, Chauncey Joseph,

25:08

will go beyond the gossip with smart

25:10

takes on the latest pop and internet. If

25:13

it's got you talking, listen now wherever you get

25:15

your podcast.

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to dominate the artificial intelligence space.

26:18

And reckon with the costs.

26:20

Follow Business Wars wherever you

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app. Hello, and welcome to the

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video. We're going to talk about the next

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video. streaming.

26:40

He's making a very decent living by presenting

26:42

himself as an alternative voice

26:45

that is anti-mainstream media and

26:47

is somehow a guru to what

26:49

he calls independent thinkers. In

26:52

his initial response to these allegations, he

26:54

has already insinuated that they are motivated

26:56

by a kind of attack against him

26:59

by the establishment. How

27:01

has all this gone down and particularly

27:03

with his followers? Well, that has,

27:06

of course, been complete outrage

27:09

at the allegations that have

27:11

been made about Russell Brand. However,

27:15

there are many people

27:17

who are brand

27:20

fans and enthusiasts who

27:23

are simply refusing to believe that

27:26

this is true. Or even

27:28

it seems in many cases to actually

27:31

read the details

27:32

of the allegations that have been made.

27:35

And they're saying that this is that

27:38

this is because Brand has become

27:40

too powerful as an alternative voice

27:42

that he's somehow a threat

27:45

to mainstream media. And it's not

27:47

only amongst his fans that he's getting

27:49

support. We have seen Elon

27:52

Musk, the billionaire owner

27:54

of X, which was formerly Twitter, saying

27:57

they don't like competition. And

27:59

that was before

27:59

the allocations had even been published, he

28:02

would step straight in. Exactly. He stepped

28:04

straight in saying no more cancelling, enough

28:06

is enough.

28:08

One supporter that he may not welcome is

28:10

Andrew Tate, the self-confessed misogynist

28:13

who's awaiting trial on charges of rape and human

28:15

trafficking in Romania. Tukhana

28:17

Carlson has also

28:20

supported Brand and said it's his views

28:22

on topics like drunk companies and the

28:24

war in Ukraine that's made him a target

28:27

and GB News host Beverly Turner

28:30

has said he's welcome on her show

28:32

any time and that he was being

28:34

attacked for creating knowing

28:37

and original content. All the

28:39

greats then, I mean you do wonder how

28:41

comfortable Russell Brand now is or the Russell Brand

28:44

of 10 years ago would have been with these alliances.

28:46

If those are your friends you don't want to know about your

28:48

enemies. Lexi,

28:57

these women have bravely gone on record, more

28:59

are coming forward. Brand went ahead

29:01

with a gig he had booked at the weekend and the

29:04

story is dominating the headlines and social

29:06

media. Where does this story go

29:08

now? I mean I think we've already seen

29:10

a really strong and concerted

29:13

effort by the broadcasters who've

29:15

employed Brand previously, including

29:18

the BBC, to get out on the front

29:20

foot and say that they're doing something.

29:23

Whether it's a little bit too little

29:25

too late and whether these things,

29:28

you know, what are the measures being put in

29:30

place now or what are the measures

29:32

that have already been put in place to

29:34

make sure that people who behave in race

29:36

it's just completely unacceptable in any

29:38

workforce. So to make sure that

29:40

they just can't continue to

29:43

act with impunity. So there's

29:46

still a lot of questions for

29:48

the people who've employed Brand who've supported

29:50

him, who've been his allies over the

29:52

years. There's a lot of questions for them to

29:55

answer as well as the

29:57

questions that Brand will have to answer

29:59

himself. I don't know what's going

30:01

to happen in the case of Ruff-A-Bran, but I do

30:03

know that when stories like this have come

30:05

out in the past, it has emboldened

30:08

more people who may have had negative

30:10

experiences, whether it's about the individual who's in

30:13

the news or other individuals to

30:15

come forward and also share their stories.

30:18

We may well see that over the weeks and months to

30:20

come. Lexi, thank

30:22

you so much for talking to us. Thanks so much for having

30:25

me. That

30:27

was Lexi Topping, Senior Reporter at The

30:29

Guardian. You can follow developments

30:31

on this story at theguardian.com. In

30:34

the UK, you can watch Dispatches, which

30:36

we referenced throughout this episode, on Channel

30:39

4's streaming service online. If

30:43

you've been affected by any of the issues raised

30:45

in this episode, there is help available.

30:48

In the UK, Rape Crisis offers

30:50

support on 0808 802 9999 in England and Wales.

30:57

It's 0808 801 0302 in Scotland, or 0800 0246 991 in Northern Ireland.

31:07

You can also contact the Samaritans on 116

31:11

123 or by emailing joe at thesamaritans.org.

31:16

That's it for today. I'm Lachy Nicbal,

31:18

and this episode was produced by Sammy Kent

31:21

and Courtney Eusis. Sound

31:23

design is by Rudi Zagablo. The executive

31:25

producer was Humma Khalili.

31:28

We'll be back tomorrow.

31:35

This is The Guardian.