0:03

Hey, what's up everybody? Welcome

0:13

into Tom Carver's Patriots Talk podcast

0:15

joined by Dan Dreesen

0:21

of the Cincinnati Reds. You

0:23

have no idea who Dan Dreesen was. He was a late setter. I

0:25

thought for sure you were going to go Chris Sabo. Oh,

0:28

I could have gone Chris Sabo. But I mean, I'm

0:30

so old that my first frame

0:32

of reference are guys who I would have

0:34

seen from 10 to 13. And

0:38

that would be guys from 77 to 90. That's

0:41

your George Foster's, your David

0:43

Concepcion's. Johnny Bench. Johnny

0:45

Bench. Yeah, that's a layup right there. But

0:47

Danny Dreesen is one of those guys. Joe

0:49

Morgan. John wants us. The Skull

0:52

Crusher wants us to mention for the audio people

0:54

that I'm wearing a Cincinnati Reds hat today. Yeah,

0:56

that's a good point, folks. As

0:58

you know, if you listen to this pod

1:00

strictly on audio, sometimes Phil and I, because

1:02

we do this on Zoom, we start babbling

1:05

about things that the other are doing like

1:07

you can see. So we apologize for that

1:09

ignorance because it is ignorant of

1:11

your audience when you don't include them like

1:13

that. So, John, thank you for saying that.

1:15

Phil, the Buffalo Bills swung

1:18

a trade with the Houston Texans and

1:20

Stefan Diggs is now a Houston Texan.

1:24

And while you can see things spiraling a

1:27

bit in Buffalo last year between Josh

1:29

Allen and Stefan Diggs, he was being

1:31

frozen out in different games. And you

1:33

also saw just

1:35

a disgruntled, agitated, irritated Stefan Diggs

1:37

gesticulating on a regular basis on

1:40

the sidelines of Josh Allen. I

1:42

think it's shared agitation

1:44

there. I

1:48

don't think Stefan Diggs loved playing with Josh Allen or

1:50

the kind of his particular jib. And

1:52

I think that the Bills get sick of that. So they ship them.

1:56

There's a couple of different levels to this conversation.

1:58

The first level is brought up. on early edition.

2:00

It's interesting. What's the window

2:03

of the Buffalo Bills now? Also,

2:06

what's the window of

2:08

the New York Jets and the window of the

2:12

Miami Dolphins? All of these teams

2:14

have those quarterbacks who

2:16

are entering question mark time.

2:19

And why is two entering question mark period? Because

2:21

his salary cap is going to go up so

2:24

much, it's going to get harder to afford guys

2:26

around them. So talk

2:28

about the window and how it affects the Patriots on

2:30

these three different teams. I

2:33

think the windows for the Jets and Dolphins

2:36

are mirror images of each other for different

2:38

reasons. But I really

2:40

do believe that it's going to get difficult for Miami

2:43

if they plan on paying to a ton of my

2:45

low and they haven't done it yet.

2:47

But if they plan on doing it, it's

2:49

going to get really difficult to make sure that

2:52

they keep the star power that they have, certainly

2:55

offensively moving forward. So

2:58

that's a brief window to me. And

3:00

he is not a tide

3:02

that lifts all boats. I

3:05

mean, Tom, I think there's an argument you could make that

3:07

their window is not open because the

3:10

quarterback is not Super Bowl caliber. I really

3:12

do believe that. Now you could push back

3:14

and say, well, can

3:16

he be left handed Brock Perdy? And he could. So

3:18

that's a fair argument. Right. Brock

3:21

Perdy is $40 million a year without Deebo

3:23

Samuel and or Brandon Ayuk and or George

3:25

Kittle is a much different player than Brock

3:28

Perdy with all those guys. And Christian McCaffrey.

3:30

I mean, Christian McCaffrey, I don't know, not

3:32

to the best player, not to

3:34

proofread you, but it's like that is an absolute

3:36

wagon of an

3:38

offense. And that's sort of what you need, I

3:40

think, for two to be a

3:42

Super Bowl winning quarterback. So I that's why I say

3:45

it's a brief window there. And

3:47

I think it's almost equally

3:49

brief in New York, because I think that's the

3:51

one that's the next year thing. And then it's

3:53

probably done until

3:55

they get another quarterback. The

3:58

bills to me is a different conversation because I

4:00

think that window will be open in

4:03

some form or fashion for

4:06

the next seven years. Yeah.

4:08

I mean, I think Josh Allen is that good. He's

4:11

he's, he should be a, a

4:15

seven win for hard

4:17

floor at all times. And,

4:21

and that's being generous. Um, you know, if

4:23

the bills don't have anybody and they get racked by injuries,

4:25

there's still going to be a seven win team. They're never

4:27

going to be a four win team as the knowing the

4:30

Patriots were because he's

4:32

that good, but we

4:36

never thought the Patriots would be a four win team under

4:38

Bill Belichick either, which is something I do want to delve

4:40

into later conversation relative to that.

4:42

Phil, if those cycles for those other

4:45

teams are bringing them to the bottom

4:47

of the Ferris wheel and

4:49

the Patriots are rising on the Ferris wheel, what

4:53

can they do to mirror what the Houston

4:55

Texans did in terms of

4:57

extracting a wide receiver? I do believe the

4:59

Patriots are very amenable to making a trade.

5:02

They have $46 million worth of cap space.

5:04

You can't just sit there with that in your pocket.

5:06

Yeah. You can roll over a bunch into next year,

5:09

but then you might be looking at the same movie. You're not

5:11

a good team. It's hard for

5:13

you to get guys to come here. So

5:17

trade, who could they extract?

5:20

I think they would be amenable to figuring out

5:22

a way to trade and spend that

5:24

money and get a guy. So

5:28

where I start are the guys who are

5:31

going to be free agents next year, right?

5:34

As teams start to anticipate, okay, who are we going to pay?

5:36

Who are we not in 2025 and beyond? Right,

5:40

Tom? So you have to start to me at the top of the list

5:42

with T Higgins. Okay. On the

5:44

franchise tag, true

5:46

X boundary receiver. You know what you're getting

5:48

there. But that class,

5:50

that free agent class for next year, Tom, so

5:53

one year left on these deals for these guys

5:55

is absolutely loaded.

5:58

It's T Higgins. It's Keenan L. It's Chris

6:00

Godwin. It's Mari Cooper's Deontay Johnson.

6:03

It's DeAndre Hopkins. He's still good at this

6:05

point I'm Jamar Chase is scheduled to be

6:07

a free agent though I believe that the

6:10

Bengals will lock him up Jalen waddle Does

6:12

he shake free because the Dolphins decided to

6:14

pay to a in Tyreke and not Tyreke

6:16

and waddle? Devontae Smith

6:20

CD lamb that Justin Jefferson Tom. This

6:22

is it. It's a ridiculous Ridiculous

6:25

list of receivers that are scheduled to be at

6:27

this point in time Free

6:29

agents next offseason. Those would be the

6:31

kinds of calls that I would

6:33

be trying to make right now It's for a

6:35

true stuff, you know, I might see Deontae Johnson

6:37

off that list I'd take DeAndre Hopkins off that

6:39

list But boy if you could figure something out

6:41

with T Higgins Chris Godwin

6:44

CD lamb Justin Jefferson That's the

6:46

kind of big ass swing that

6:48

I would be that

6:50

I would be attempting at this point in time if I'm New

6:52

England Would

6:54

34 be too rich to

6:57

give up We just saw

6:59

what the bills got back for

7:01

Stephon Diggs, which was really not It

7:04

was minimal Considering how good

7:06

he can be in the the amount of the s

7:08

left on his contract would 34 be amenable to you

7:10

Phil Perry pseudo Gia To

7:13

send and then bring in a guy and pay him Because

7:19

free agency went the way it did for the Patriots

7:22

right now, I would say yes Initially

7:25

before really getting into This

7:28

offseason. I believed that hey

7:31

figure out a way to give That

7:33

guy just ended up in Tennessee all

7:36

that money Calvin really give him give him whatever he

7:38

needs to come to New England And then you're boy

7:40

You've got you've got so much wiggle

7:42

room in the draft He's a second-round pick on

7:44

another receiver because you'd eat another one Probably you

7:46

could use one on a tackle you could go

7:48

all sorts of different ways, but free agency didn't

7:50

go that way So now I would say yes

7:52

one name I didn't mention Tom Brandon I use

7:54

what I trade 34 overall for Brandon. I you

7:56

can give him a boatload of money. I Sure

7:59

would At this point in time, I

8:01

would. Yep, how about you? I

8:04

think what's hard about it is the player

8:06

that they trade for is going to be in the

8:08

same boat that Calvin Ripley was. And

8:11

Calvin Ripley, I don't think, wanted to play in New England.

8:13

It might be easier. So, again, that's being

8:16

wary of the situation. It's not saying it's

8:18

a disqualifier, but anybody who gets traded to

8:20

the Patriots right now is

8:22

going to be less in a prove-it situation

8:25

for himself, more in a prove-it situation for

8:27

the Patriots. How is it here? Do

8:29

I like it? You want to franchise me? All

8:31

right, well, I guess they could do that. That's

8:34

their option, right? They bring in an IUC. Well,

8:37

IUC is on the tag now, so I, you know, it would

8:39

go up even more. It would go up even more. It does

8:41

it go, you know, it goes to 120. Exorbitant

8:44

amount, doesn't it? If they franchise it. It would go to

8:46

120 percent. The

8:48

reason it's different than Ridley though, Tom, isn't it?

8:50

Like these guys would have to be willing to

8:52

incur injury risk, which Ridley

8:55

was not threatened with as

8:57

a free agent. These guys are not free agents yet. So unless

8:59

they're going to set out the entire year because they didn't like

9:01

being traded to New England, if

9:03

they say no to a big term, big time

9:05

extension from Elliott Wolf and Gerard Mayo,

9:07

they have to say to themselves, I'm

9:10

comfortable knowing that someone might lay

9:12

to my ankle the wrong way. And then

9:14

next year, my big payday that I might

9:16

have gotten here in New England might

9:18

not be on the table anymore. So I don't think you'd

9:20

have a better shot at trading for one

9:22

of these guys and paying them than you do in

9:25

true free agents. And

9:27

I wonder if the Patriots say if

9:29

they have Drake May and A.D.

9:33

Mitchell and

9:35

Hunter Henry and Antonio Gibson and Ramondri.

9:37

Ramondri is going to be a free

9:39

agent. Anyway, if they have a better

9:41

looking offense with at least a whiff

9:43

of competency going into 2025,

9:45

if they become a more attractive free agent

9:48

spot, go ahead and build this year with

9:50

those different draft picks. Don't trade and then

9:52

look at that free agent class because your

9:54

free agent class that you laid out to

9:57

me actually gives me pause on.

10:00

Should they trade now or just get

10:02

the sidecar wide receiver? Don't give

10:04

anything up to do it. If you can,

10:06

if you can. One player that I

10:08

keep coming back to though is AJ Brown. And

10:11

that would be the most ideal guy to trade for. And

10:14

why would the Philadelphia Eagles trade AJ Brown? Well,

10:17

by the end of the year, things were kind

10:19

of sideways with AJ Brown and the Eagles. And

10:21

he actually went on WIP in Philadelphia to talk

10:23

about the fact that he wants to be in

10:25

Philadelphia. But he was clearly pissed off at the

10:27

direction of the team. And I think

10:30

a lot of people were because the team went sideways. But

10:32

AJ Brown cried his eyes out

10:36

when the Patriots didn't draft him. And

10:40

you stretching? Yeah,

10:43

sorry. Just loosening the old backup. I'm listening. I thought I

10:46

was losing you for a second. I thought

10:48

something was going to happen. I thought someone was coming up behind

10:50

you. Folks, again, if you're on audio, Phil just did like a

10:53

Turkish twist or something like that. And

10:55

I thought he was looking over his shoulder at an attacker. Back

10:58

to live action. AJ

11:01

Brown cried his eyes out

11:03

when the Patriots didn't draft him. Now, those Patriots are

11:05

not these Patriots. I don't know. I think he might

11:07

cry his eyes out if he gets traded here. But

11:10

he's making $25 million a year. He's

11:12

got three years left on his deal. Boy,

11:15

if you can, as

11:18

Elliott Wolf, call Howie Roseman and

11:20

say, we'll give you $34 for

11:23

AJ Brown plus.

11:27

That would be dreamlike

11:31

for a Patriots fan. The

11:34

only issue would be, and now maybe the

11:37

value and the trade compensation would be different

11:39

because he is under contract now. You would

11:41

have to take on a lot of money.

11:45

But he was just dealt

11:47

for in 2022, a first

11:49

and a late third or

11:53

an early fourth. And

11:56

he's still that player. So we may be cool taking

11:59

34 over. Overall, I think you got to

12:01

give more than that, Tom. Next

12:05

year's two. Second

12:07

round pick. Second round pick to the next

12:09

two years. It

12:13

does feel kind of... Well, it's going to... It

12:16

would impede the development of type one Thornton. I

12:18

think that is the problem with bringing in an

12:20

AJ Brown. Yeah. Yeah.

12:23

You've hit on the obvious drawback to this.

12:25

And that's the point. You can say, oh,

12:27

hey, can't give up two-two. Well,

12:31

what if it ends up being a two that's type one Thornton? You

12:35

give it up. So I like the

12:37

AJ Brown idea. I'm going to keep tub thumping on

12:39

it because I think the Patriots are going to keep

12:42

exploring trades. Go ahead, Guy. I

12:45

just want to mention one more thing and

12:47

why I like the idea of a trade. And

12:50

it does get back to the conversation that we had about our

12:52

prototypical Patriots receivers in this year's

12:54

draft class. There are

12:56

not a lot of legit

12:59

X-boundary difference-making true number ones

13:01

that are going to be

13:03

found on day two. This

13:05

is to me, even though it's a good receiver class,

13:08

it ain't 2019 where

13:11

you had AJ Brown, Deebo Samuel and

13:13

DK Metcalf all go off in the

13:15

second round of big body difference-making athletes.

13:18

There's not that many of those guys where

13:21

they're going to last to 34, certainly

13:24

not to 68, which I think is the next

13:26

Patriots pick in the third round. So

13:28

if you want that kind of, if you want to

13:30

slot, then don't

13:32

trade because there's a million of them in this year's draft.

13:34

And you could have any number of them and they'll all

13:36

be good. But you don't need a slot.

13:39

You need that other guy. And so

13:42

it might be A.D. Mitchell who you mentioned. It might be

13:44

Xavier Laguette. And maybe

13:46

those guys are there on day two

13:48

and options for you. But

13:51

after that, it gets pretty dicey pretty

13:53

quickly. So I would want to

13:55

sort of not mess with that if I don't have to, make

13:57

the trade. And then we know, Tom, they still need to do

13:59

that. need a tackle, you might be able to get

14:01

a halfway decent tackle 34 overall. Maybe

14:03

you, you put that pick

14:06

aside that second round pick aside for that tackle. Bill,

14:08

this fascinating. And I understand the

14:11

cost donation among Patriots fans right

14:13

now, because it is jarring to

14:16

be a four win team, to see your team at the

14:18

top of the draft, to have the

14:20

amount of uncertainty that you're looking at, because

14:23

the greatest coach of all time has been excised

14:26

from the franchise, and now you're dealing with

14:28

a de facto GM and a first year

14:30

head coach and people that you've never heard

14:32

of really running your beloved

14:34

team, but it is a

14:36

fascinating opportunity for the Patriots to build right

14:38

now. And we've talked time and

14:41

again about trading and what it

14:43

would take to trade down for the

14:45

Patriots and whether there's wisdom in that from

14:47

number three passing on Drake

14:49

may slash Jayden Daniels slash JJ

14:51

McCarthy and getting that wide out

14:53

that X that you absolutely could

14:55

get in the first dozen

14:57

picks. Getting that

14:59

offensive tackle, flipping the

15:02

build to an extent and

15:04

doing it that way and popping the

15:06

quarterback in later, however you extract him.

15:11

But what I'm hearing in terms of the bag that

15:14

you robbed male reference last week, what

15:17

kind of currency do the Patriots need

15:19

to see coming to them? And

15:22

I keep circling back to it's going to be

15:24

three first round picks, meaning Minnesota at 11 and

15:26

23 and their first round pick from next year.

15:30

From what I'm hearing, it's going to take a lot more

15:32

than that for the Patriots to be moved off their spot.

15:36

Because they as a team

15:38

collectively understand the opportunity that

15:42

these three quarterbacks represent at the top of the

15:44

draft. Take McCarthy

15:46

out these two quarterbacks, whether it be Daniels

15:48

or May. This isn't Trey

15:50

Lance and Zach Wilson. It's

15:53

two people that. There

15:56

is full consensus. that

16:00

they're franchise quarterbacks. So regardless of what I've

16:02

been saying, I'm giving you a sense now

16:04

of what the Patriots mindset

16:07

might be. It

16:10

would take an unbelievable amount to move them

16:12

off their spot. Not

16:14

that they couldn't be, but it would take them

16:16

a lot to move out of three because they

16:19

see it right there in front of them. The

16:21

hardest thing to capture is there. It's

16:24

not as acquisition. It's not a trail. It's one of

16:26

those guys. They end up with them. It's

16:29

not a Ryan Lee for whoever else

16:31

we can come up with, Sam Bradford, whoever. It's

16:33

a good flipping player. What

16:37

are your thoughts on that little intel? I

16:40

find that fascinating because it would be a real,

16:44

not overpay, but it would blow out of

16:46

the water. It

16:49

sounds like the trade

16:51

that was made in 2021 for trade

16:53

lands to get from 12 to three, that's

16:57

three first round picks. Two

17:01

of them are in the future. Those picks get a

17:03

little bit devalued. If

17:05

it's three first rounders, that includes two first

17:07

rounders this year, maybe that changes the equation

17:10

a little bit. Or maybe it's a team

17:12

like Denver that has to come up from

17:14

a little bit deeper in the draft or the Raiders a

17:16

little bit deeper in the draft than where the Vikings sit.

17:18

That's the trade that we've been talking about so much, the

17:21

potential trade we've been talking about so much. But

17:24

maybe one of those guys, maybe Sean Payton says, how much longer

17:26

am I even going to be doing this? I

17:28

love those guys. So yeah, four first

17:30

rounders. Is that what you need, Elliot Wolf? Five?

17:35

What do I care? I'm not going to be here in five years anyway. That

17:40

would be wild because it would

17:43

be indicative of the fact that the entire

17:45

league sees these top three guys as

17:48

different from everyone else in the class,

17:50

different than Penix, different than Nick, different

17:52

from McCarthy, and that they are that

17:55

good, that they would be worth

17:57

a quote unquote overpay.

18:00

based on past league history. And

18:02

the interesting thing about that too, Phil, is

18:04

you use the comp of the San Francisco trade,

18:07

use it again. You're not trading up

18:09

for Trey Lance. From

18:12

North Dakota State, did play a year. Had

18:16

a 28 touchdown, zero pick season, and then

18:18

took 2020 off because of COVID in

18:21

essence, and was a full-on project

18:23

coming from Division II. You're talking about

18:25

a guy who was kind of a made man, and

18:27

you've been watching full for two years in

18:30

Division I highly competitive football, whether it

18:32

be LSU or North

18:34

Carolina. So I

18:37

would say that the tax,

18:42

the surety tax, is okay.

18:46

So you're not trading up for Trey Lance here, guys. You're

18:48

trading up for a guy who's kind of a made man

18:51

here, and we all have consensus on how good

18:53

he is. It's not trying to say, oh,

18:55

should we take Trey Lance or Mack Jones? And

18:58

they still went up and did that, the Niners

19:00

did. So I find

19:02

that really interesting to discuss

19:05

because as we sit now, what, are we

19:07

three weeks out? Four

19:10

weeks out. No, no,

19:12

about three. Yeah.

19:14

Yeah. Starts on Thursdays, right?

19:17

Exactly three. Wake

19:19

up, Tom. Christ. 30

19:22

years in the business. One day the draft started

19:24

giving you more. See, I never

19:26

should have bought those zip-up cardigan than I found. I

19:28

love that. I'm going to be cruising around the

19:31

assistive living joint, just like this. Can

19:34

I just ask you that your intel

19:36

tells me that, and

19:39

you never say never, it

19:41

tells me they're not moving out. It tells me

19:44

they feel that strongly about one of

19:47

these three quarterbacks that

19:49

in all likelihood, they're sitting

19:51

there, and they're taking the one that

19:53

falls to them. How

19:55

do you feel about that? You have been

19:57

Mr. Tradeback at the bag. It's

20:00

a collaboration and that's the interesting thing. We are

20:02

three weeks out and any

20:05

information we get can be changeable and

20:08

folks that we talk to who

20:11

give indications of where

20:13

things might be have

20:15

an army of people they also talk to. So

20:18

it's a collaboration. It

20:21

can be a developing opinion. But

20:24

I think that that seems to be a

20:26

baseline stance. Mayo stated it

20:28

last week. Publicly. It

20:32

has to be a bag. It's just now we have a better.

20:36

I feel like I have a better grasp on what that bag

20:38

has to look like and it has to look bigger than the

20:40

potential bag that

20:42

will be dangled by

20:44

the Vikings. How do I feel about that?

20:47

I haven't hated Drake May. I've

20:50

just seen the opportunity of

20:53

trading down and filling those other spots. Wide

20:56

receiver and offensive tackle and then having

20:58

the quarterback materialized because I think building the

21:00

team is the quicker way to get

21:02

there. You've pushed back a dozen times

21:05

rightfully so that what you guarantee that you're

21:07

going to get a

21:09

shut down offensive tackle in

21:11

past protection and a wide receiver who's

21:13

going to be a Devonte Smith

21:16

or a Jaden Waddle. There is none or

21:18

Jamar Chase. But if

21:20

you think that Drake May or Jaden Daniels

21:22

or both are that good and you're going

21:24

to forego the trade down, then

21:27

I get it. I get it

21:29

because the more I watched Drake May, the

21:32

more I am persuaded

21:34

by intangibles, which

21:36

we're going to get to in a few

21:38

minutes with Joe Persson from the Athletic. The

21:40

intangible that stands apart for me with a

21:42

wide receiver who's going to be a Devonte

21:44

Smith or a Jaden Waddle. There is none

21:47

or Jamar Chase. But if

21:49

you think that Drake May or Jaden Daniels

21:51

or both are that good and you're going

21:53

to forego the trade down, then

21:56

I get it. I get it

21:58

because the more I watched Drake May. the

22:01

more I am persuaded by intangibles,

22:05

which we're going to get to in a few

22:07

minutes with Joe Persson from the Athletic. The intangible

22:09

that stands apart for me with Drake May is

22:11

simply that he's six, four,

22:13

five, two hundred and thirty pounds and

22:15

he's going to be out there 17

22:17

weeks a year. That

22:20

to me is irreplaceable

22:25

in some ways. His durability,

22:27

his flatline nature, the stoicism, the things

22:29

I wrote about earlier this week and

22:31

observing him and his full tape from

22:33

2023. Yeah, this

22:36

picks from his end zone that he

22:38

throws is a flurry of picks against,

22:41

um, who was it? Just

22:44

back to back to back picks. Um,

22:46

there's a team that went started six and oh, and

22:48

finished seven and four. There's a

22:51

terrible performance against NC State.

22:53

Um, a loss, I think the Appalachia State

22:56

best game against Campbell. He's

22:58

a really, really, really, really, really good player.

23:01

So the qualifiers that I had watching

23:04

those games were superseded by the

23:06

throws I saw him make in

23:10

his on field demeanor and tenor. He's

23:13

Matt Stafford, low

23:16

budget, Matt Stafford. Matt

23:18

Stafford's arm was ridiculous, but

23:21

there's a toughness component. There's a leadership component.

23:24

Um, there's a mobility component.

23:27

A lot of things match up to Matt Stafford

23:29

with May except for the arm. And

23:32

that's not cause May's arms not good. It's

23:34

because Stafford's was friggin stupid. But

23:37

that's if you can

23:39

get Matt Stafford, you get

23:42

drafted to an ass team. The Patriots are

23:44

quite clearly an ass team. You

23:46

need a guy who has the attitude of

23:49

Matt Stafford who's just soldiered through the shit

23:52

in Detroit when they sucked and

23:56

liked it. There's so much that he got the

23:58

rebore treatment at the end. We

24:00

love you. We're going to trade you someplace you can go win. I

24:03

love you guys too, even though we suck the

24:05

whole time. See ya. That's what

24:07

you want in the quarterback. And I

24:09

think Drake May has that. That's

24:12

why I can see it.

24:15

That's why I'm starting to come across the aisle.

24:19

Well, that was what at the end there? That's why I'm

24:21

starting to come across the aisle. Oh,

24:23

so we've – so I just want to make it

24:25

clear. At

24:27

1052 on Thursday, April

24:30

4th, exactly one

24:32

– sorry, exactly three weeks and

24:36

I don't know, nine hours or so from

24:39

night one, the 2024 NFL Draft, Tom

24:43

Curran no longer wants the Patriots to trade.

24:45

He no longer believes that that is the

24:47

way. He believes – I didn't say that.

24:50

Drafting Drake May is the

24:52

way. I'm more amenable. No, no, no,

24:55

no, no. Look,

24:57

I'm an objective journalist, Bill.

25:00

Look, you know what? I'm just looking

25:02

at what they do and telling you what I

25:04

think of it or projecting what the best

25:06

course is. The best course is, oh, hey, Draft

25:08

Drake May, I need – that's

25:12

my guy. I don't have guys. I'm

25:14

not one of those people. I can be an unbiased

25:16

– What's the best course? Stop the – what's

25:18

the best course? Don't

25:21

yell at me. Whatever they

25:23

say. The

25:26

best course – look at how mad he is. I

25:28

trust your opinion. The people listening to this program trust

25:30

your opinion. They want to know what Tom – I

25:33

still think there's extreme value in trading

25:35

down and being a player starting

25:37

to try and operate in this draft, even

25:39

if you go just to 1123 in a

25:41

first-round pick next year. Now you have currency

25:43

to move in myriad places.

25:46

You can come back up and get Roma Dunze because you have

25:48

two picks and you're sitting there

25:50

at 1123 and you say, hey, he's still there on

25:52

the board at 7. Let's jump back

25:55

up there. Let's send these picks, or one

25:57

of them, and come back up and get that

25:59

guy. Now you've done that.

26:01

So to me, once

26:04

you trade out, you give yourself extreme

26:06

mobility. I love

26:08

the idea of having that. I

26:10

think that's what great GMs do. And

26:12

I think that a GM trying to persuade his owner

26:15

that he's the guy for the next decade should

26:17

do that stuff. But I think

26:19

that Drake May, when

26:22

you look at the Patriot situation, is

26:25

the best fit. He's bled Soviet in

26:27

that he is stoic, a

26:29

good leader. Hopefully he's a better

26:31

decision maker and a little bit more mobile than that birdbath

26:34

was. But he's

26:37

what you need for an ass team in

26:40

terms of being a flatliner. So

26:44

what am I saying here? I'll

26:48

be enthused by the prick of Drake May.

26:50

I'll be equally enthused by

26:52

the intrigue of trading down. Equally, okay.

26:54

So they both know, wouldn't we? So when we

26:56

are on TV live and the Patriots make a

26:59

decision at three and we're asked

27:01

to, for instance, this is the kind of thing we

27:03

do on TV. I'll be more worried about Jayden Daniels.

27:06

If the Patriots end up with Jayden Daniels, I'll

27:08

have more consternation and say they should have traded

27:10

out because I think Jayden Daniels could be one

27:13

of those 11 games a year, 12

27:15

games a year, 15 games a year, 11 games a year

27:17

players. I'm

27:20

picturing us having to give the

27:22

decision, whether it's a pick or a trade,

27:24

a grade in real time. So

27:27

I'm trying to work with you here because

27:30

you can say something's a B plus and something's an

27:32

A and say both of these things are good. Just

27:34

one is better than the other. Okay, good point. So

27:37

you would give Drake May selection

27:39

at three overall a what?

27:44

A minus. And you would

27:46

give a trade down for three first round

27:48

picks. A minus

27:51

also. We have three weeks. Well,

27:58

I'll get you to move even a little. bit further.

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your order, select podcast in the survey and

29:00

select our show in the drop-down menu that

29:03

follows. We've

29:07

gone longer than I wanted to because we

29:09

still have JP Finley from Washington, covers the

29:12

commanders for NBC. He's going to jump

29:14

on and talk about what the commanders might do at two,

29:16

talk about the chips and how many he'll put

29:19

of his hundred on Jaden Daniels being the pick

29:21

there because that's critical. What are the commanders doing?

29:23

And we're also going to talk, as I mentioned,

29:25

to Joe Person from The Athletic. He's down in

29:27

North Carolina. He covers the Panthers, but he's also

29:30

watched up close Drake May because his kids go

29:32

to the same high school. So it's good to

29:34

get intel on what are these guys like off

29:36

the field. But the last thing I wanted to hit

29:38

was, this was posited

29:41

by our guy Rob

29:45

Snyder in the Boston Sports

29:47

Tonight thread. We send out an

29:49

email every day for these programs so

29:51

that we have stuff to talk about. Just

29:54

what are you guys like? What are you hot on is what

29:56

they like to say. What are you hot on today? And

30:01

toward the end of the email, Rob

30:04

Snyder says the Patriots win total is set at

30:06

4.5 wins. Four

30:08

and a half. That's so

30:11

bad. For the record,

30:13

the Cardinals were the lowest last season at

30:15

4.5 and went under. Maybe I'm crazy because

30:17

this team is in a rebuild and they

30:19

aren't supposed to be, quote, good. But I

30:21

think four wins absolutely hurts this franchise so

30:23

bad. Again,

30:26

he's just throwing things out in

30:28

observation. Talker. My

30:30

reaction to that in reading it, and it

30:32

often is with the emails because I'm a

30:35

cynical naysayer. Like, what do

30:37

you think? What did you think it was going to

30:39

be? What do you even watching? They

30:42

don't have a left tackle. They don't have

30:44

a quarterback. And I understand there's a realization

30:46

component of, wow, I just see things that

30:48

remind me how bad they are. Yes, they

30:50

are that bad. They

30:53

deserve to be a 4.5 win projection team, even though I

30:55

had them win in 11 last year. You know why I

30:57

had to win in 11? Because

31:00

I thought their coaching would be better. I

31:03

never thought that the floor for

31:06

a Bill Belichick team would exceed six or

31:08

seven wins under that. No way.

31:10

Not with Bill there. Why

31:12

are they a 4.5 win projected team right

31:14

now, Phil? Why did they

31:16

win four games with Bill Belichick? To

31:19

me, we're looking at a team

31:21

in disarray that was left there,

31:23

put there, and remains there

31:25

until further notice. By

31:29

the desperate straits that Bill left of it, I

31:31

keep coming back to that. You know,

31:33

people are hand wringing about the decision that the

31:35

Patriots made to move away from Bill Belichick. Still,

31:39

wrong thing to do. Now we have Thunder

31:41

and Mayo and they're running

31:43

the team and we don't have a G.

31:45

And I don't blame you for being irritated

31:47

about all that stuff. It was a, you

31:49

know, Popsicle stick and glue decision

31:53

making. They are still flying by the seat of

31:55

their pants at the top of this organization. Without,

31:59

I think, a coach. plan, but

32:02

they got to be a four win team because

32:04

the last rebuild in 2021 went so south

32:07

and the decisions made really since 2019

32:10

went so south. That's why they're here. What?

32:15

Why are they a four win projected team?

32:18

Phil quarterback

32:20

uncertainty, coach uncertainty across the

32:22

board offensively and not

32:25

enough improvement from the team that won four

32:28

games a year ago. Where would

32:30

they be if Bill was here projected wins?

32:32

Same. No,

32:37

maybe one maybe one more win.

32:40

Maybe. So I do

32:42

think there is. I did just mention I do think

32:44

there's some uncertainty baked into the drug Mayo experience. No

32:47

doubt it should be. But Tom, you have certainty in

32:49

what Bill Belichick was able to give this team last

32:51

year with a lot of the same question marks. So

32:54

like, like how

32:56

much lower can you go? And

32:59

Bill Belichick's reputation is what it is. And

33:01

so again, maybe it's worth a win. But

33:03

you just saw him win four for games

33:07

with a team that you can't feel much better about on

33:09

paper. How would you feel with a Bill

33:12

Belichick Drake made Bill O'Brien trica

33:16

at the top of this organization better than you

33:18

might with a Mayo

33:20

May Alex

33:23

van Pelt been McAdoo quadrant

33:26

quadra Fina. I

33:28

think in terms of the betting markets, it

33:30

probably would. Um, again,

33:33

you'd probably you'd probably see about a game

33:35

difference. Um, personally,

33:37

would I feel much better? I'm

33:41

not sure I would because I think it's a line would still be

33:44

in frigging disarray. It had obviously

33:46

run its course and I and I and

33:48

I would not trust

33:51

based on recent evidence

33:54

that a Bill Belichick

33:57

run organization would handle

34:00

the young quarterback properly. It's like

34:02

looking back at Brady in 2020 and saying

34:04

the Patriots shouldn't have moved on. And

34:08

we can all say that, but the foundation

34:10

for keeping Brady should have been laid way

34:13

prior to 2020. Because if Brady

34:15

had stayed, they were heading

34:17

for a nine or an eight win season with Brady

34:19

here. It was getting

34:23

worse, maybe a 10-win season. But

34:25

it wouldn't have turned out the way it didn't, because

34:27

the team was in decline, really

34:30

beginning in 18. Super

34:33

Bowl win nonetheless, notwithstanding.

34:37

11-5 team. Anyway, BST may just

34:40

recent history brought to me by Rob Snyder as we

34:42

look at this team as a four-win team. What would

34:44

it be if Phil was here? No, I think I'll

34:46

put that in the email and say maybe that's something

34:48

we should discuss. Phil,

34:50

I have BST tonight. You have early

34:52

edition. We have a big day

34:54

ahead of ourselves. Now get

34:57

ready for first, JP

34:59

Finlay. After that, Joe Person.

35:02

Enjoy these guys. Good intel. Phil, we'll see you

35:04

at the beginning of next week. I'm lining

35:06

up Matt Slater for next week. I'm going to try

35:08

and get Matt Slater in here. I want to talk

35:10

to him about kickoffs, direction of the team, et

35:13

cetera, et cetera, et cetera. Love

35:15

it. Goodbye. Ladies

35:19

and gentlemen, it's the hardest working

35:21

man in sports down in Washington.

35:24

It's JP Finlay from NBC4. Longtime

35:27

friend of the show, longtime friend in general.

35:29

JP, thanks for taking a little break while

35:31

you're on vacation to talk about

35:33

the commanders because they run to a large

35:36

extent what New England will do. What are

35:38

their leanings right now at number

35:40

two? Thank you for the kind

35:42

words, Tommy. I'm just trying to be like you big Apple

35:44

TV star. For

35:47

the commanders at number two, I want

35:49

to be crystal clear that I don't

35:52

know and nobody does. You can tell

35:54

that new Washington GM, Adam Peters, absolutely

35:56

came up in that check

35:59

lineage. because they are silent, man.

36:02

Being a Washington guy, this is very different for us. But

36:07

it seems they're leaning Jaden Daniels. If

36:10

you think about the type of player you

36:12

can get there, the immediate high ceiling he

36:14

seems to offer, repeatedly,

36:18

Dan Quinn, the new head coach, and Adam

36:20

Peters have talked about how important mobility is

36:22

in the modern game. Then if

36:24

you factor in Josh Harris, the new owner,

36:27

has said that he wants to model his

36:29

organization like the Ravens. Nobody's

36:31

Lamar Jackson, but certainly Jaden Daniels

36:34

can run. I think that's the

36:36

lean, but I think Drake May is certainly in

36:38

play. I think JJ McCarthy

36:40

might be in play. I

36:43

keep reminding myself, so Peters,

36:45

the new GM, started with the Pats, then went to

36:47

the Broncos, won a ring there, and then went to

36:50

the Niners when Kyle and John Lynch started that operation.

36:53

And he was the number three guy the

36:55

whole time building that. And remember when they

36:57

traded for Trey Lance, they traded up to

36:59

draft Trey Lance, and then it was

37:01

going to be Trey Lance, then there was a period of time where

37:03

it was going to be Mack Jones, then it came back to Trey

37:05

Lance. They don't let anything

37:07

out, so I'm not writing anything

37:09

in marker until draft night. What

37:12

should I read into the signing of

37:14

Marcus Mariota as what will

37:16

be the placeholder bridge quarterback or

37:18

more likely the backup sooner

37:21

rather than later? They

37:23

say they're totally cool with Mariota coming in

37:25

and running the show. I kind of don't

37:27

believe it. But it's really a

37:29

similarity to Daniels that I can infer. So

37:31

I have pointed that out, and

37:34

to me, when they signed

37:36

Mariota to me, it meant two things. One, they're

37:38

leaning Daniels because if you're going to build

37:40

an offense around somebody, you could at least have

37:42

a backup that could run the same offense. And

37:45

two, I thought it meant bad news for

37:47

Sam Howell. And sure enough, Sam Howell was traded

37:49

like three days later. It

37:52

might be a bridge too far to

37:54

say definitively, like, oh, Mariota equals Daniels.

37:56

But the two players

37:58

are... If Daniels

38:00

goes number two, they're both going

38:02

to be Heisman Trophy winning quarterbacks

38:04

that went second overall that Daniels,

38:07

I think, is a really refined pocket passer, but

38:09

they both can run. And that's just a lot

38:12

of similarities to me. When

38:14

you think about Drake May, I'm

38:16

cool on him relative to Caleb Williams

38:19

and Gene Daniels because they have what

38:21

I think are transcending qualities that can

38:24

lift all boats because of their dual

38:26

threat ability. But one

38:28

thing that I think May has in his back pocket is

38:31

the fact that he's so big, so

38:33

physically durable, ran the ball 300 times

38:36

over the course of his career, and

38:38

never had more than an ankle sprain. So

38:41

to me, we've

38:43

said it before, availability is the best

38:45

ability. Joe Burrow is one of the

38:47

best quarterbacks in football. Same

38:50

with Lamar Jackson. But you have

38:52

to count on every year of the year, maybe them missing

38:54

six games. Sure. Do you

38:56

think that's a lure at all for Washington?

39:00

I think so. I think the prototypical

39:02

size for Drake May is

39:04

absolutely a part of the equation. And then if

39:06

you look at Daniels, he's skinny.

39:09

He's got a thin frame. Tom,

39:12

I don't know about you, but I have certainly gained

39:14

weight as I've aged over the years. I don't know

39:16

that that'll happen to Daniels. Like, I don't think he's

39:18

ever going to play at 225 or

39:21

something. But I had scouts tell me before

39:23

the LSU Pro Day that as long

39:25

as you weighed in at 210, nobody's going to freak

39:27

out. And sure enough, he got to 210. But

39:29

specific to May, the size has got

39:32

to be part of it. And he's plenty athletic.

39:34

He can move. He's mobile. I

39:37

think if you're taking Drake May, you're betting

39:40

on the upside, right? I think you

39:42

think there's a lot more there because

39:45

of the physical trends, the way he

39:47

throws the deep ball. People

39:50

make the Herbert Cup. I think it's a you're

39:52

hoping for a Josh Allen Cup. Because I think

39:55

accuracy is one of my question marks

39:57

with Drake. And accuracy for accuracy. Allen

40:00

coming out of Wyoming was a question mark. I

40:04

think in any other draft rig, made it a clear number

40:06

one. You

40:08

just, in watching a

40:10

full complement of his games, which

40:14

I did the other night, every throw, every run from 2023, team

40:18

started 6-0, they finished 7-4, and

40:23

there are games where he makes

40:25

mind-numbing mistakes. He also, though,

40:28

has just that

40:30

physical, he's a decisive runner. He's not a scrambler,

40:32

but he's a decisive runner. He's

40:34

not like Allen in that he's like

40:37

a wild stallion galloping down the field,

40:39

running people over, but he's decisive, he's

40:41

tough. His physical toughness after taking hits

40:44

is really unique. I watched

40:46

him get speared by a kid from Minnesota.

40:49

He got up on the next play, ran it

40:51

again with purpose, not just because he had to,

40:54

and then the play after that, he threw an absolute dart,

40:56

which might have been one of his best throws of the

40:58

game. But that's

41:00

what the Patriots' contention is, JP,

41:02

is he's got the highest ceiling,

41:05

which is crazy. When you look at Jaden

41:07

Daniels and his speed,

41:10

he's as fast as a wideout, and

41:12

his motion is

41:15

better than Drake Mays. It's just,

41:17

boom, economical. There's not crappy footwork

41:19

going on. So to me, you're

41:22

dead on with the high ceiling that

41:25

the Patriots are perceiving for May. Do

41:29

you think there's any chance that all the Washington moves out of

41:31

that spot? Not

41:33

much, but again, I'm not ruling anything out. On

41:38

our podcast, we do this 100 chips thing. I

41:40

put 80, 85 of my chips on Daniels,

41:44

but there's still a whole

41:46

lot that could happen. And if some team, the team

41:48

I've been watching all along, and I don't know if

41:51

you heard any of this, but Vegas, Antonio

41:54

Pierce told us on the record at

41:56

the owner's meeting breakfast how much he loves

41:58

Jaden Daniels. He recruited... to Arizona State, thinks

42:01

he's going to be a game-changing quarterback in

42:03

the NFL. I think if

42:05

Vegas thought they could get Daniels, they'd

42:07

be making you guys the offer, right?

42:09

If they thought Daniels wasn't going to,

42:11

and I think to

42:15

me that Vegas isn't trying to get

42:17

up there tells you a lot about

42:19

what's going to happen, but we still

42:21

got three, four weeks till draft night.

42:23

A lot can change. It's so funny,

42:25

the hype man, isn't it? Antonio Pierce

42:27

for Daniels, you got Harbaugh for JJ

42:29

McCarthy, who's closing fast on the outside.

42:32

It's interesting in that these four

42:34

guys, you can look back three years

42:36

ago with the absolute disaster from the 2021 group,

42:40

but maybe we're just chasing rainbows and saying,

42:42

I'll be different this time. These

42:44

four will be good. I

42:46

mean, what's your perception?

42:48

Are we inflating

42:51

how good these guys are? Because I

42:53

don't think we're doing it in the same way that we

42:55

may have been projecting with Zach Wilson and

42:58

Trey Lance. Totally. I mean,

43:00

Zach Wilson came out of nowhere, COVID

43:02

year, was there scouting for him? Were

43:04

people able to scout him? BYU is

43:06

kind of other side of the world.

43:08

And then Trey Lance played what? Two

43:11

college games or something? Yeah, one game in his

43:13

last year, it's like a JV game. And

43:15

I think if you look at those

43:18

2020 and 21 draft classes that got

43:20

heavily impacted by COVID about people's ability

43:22

to travel and even medicals, all sorts

43:24

of stuff, I think maybe

43:27

we wouldn't have had the same hype about

43:29

it. But outside of that

43:31

Kenny Pickett draft, every year, this is going

43:33

to be different. So I don't

43:35

know. It's an exciting

43:37

time here. It's bizarre though to

43:40

be drafting around the

43:42

Patriots. It's just been so different for

43:44

so long. Well, it's so different

43:46

here too. It'll be the first time since

43:49

1993 that they're in the top five

43:51

picking the quarterback. They've only

43:54

taken quarterbacks in the first round four times

43:56

in their franchise history since 1971. So it's a

44:00

different joint. It's only Blevio. Wetso

44:03

was first overall in 1993. They

44:05

took Tony Eason, 15th in 1983, and

44:09

they took Jim Punk at first overall in 1971, then

44:13

Mack in 2021. Mack.

44:17

If you screw it up again, the decade

44:19

is toast. Yeah. I

44:21

mean, then you're the commanders. I'm

44:25

preaching to the choir on that one. I know all about

44:27

it, man. All right.

44:29

JP Finlay, thank you so much for

44:31

taking some time out of a

44:34

vacation week to talk to us about

44:36

what the commanders might do. Anything for

44:38

Utah? All

44:43

right, ladies and gentlemen, we've now bring in a

44:45

friend of the program. It's Joe Person from the

44:47

Athletic. And before we unveil Joe, this

44:50

is the portion of the program where

44:52

we don't really care as much about

44:54

what Drake May does on the field.

44:56

It's what he's like off the field. Just

44:59

who is he? What's he about? What

45:02

was his upbringing like? And

45:04

you go and talk to everybody. Look, Joe

45:06

Person was not embedded in the May family

45:09

home. But his

45:12

kids go to the same high school that

45:14

Drake May went to. He's a little bit

45:16

acquainted with the family to a degree. And,

45:19

you know, Joe's on camera. He's not going to tell us that.

45:21

He's a dink. I guarantee you. But

45:23

it's important to understand how

45:25

does Drake May contrast from

45:28

Mack Jones in that Mack

45:30

was an OK player, high

45:33

ceiling, low floor, May is the

45:35

flip side of that. But what

45:37

really bit Mack in the ass was the tennis brat

45:39

attitude. So let's bring in Joe right

45:42

now. Joe from the Athletic, he's

45:44

down in North Carolina. He's on vacation again.

45:46

And we always catch him on vacation. Thanks

45:48

for making it a tradition. Yeah,

45:51

I promise I'm not on vacation all the

45:53

time in case any of the athletic editors

45:55

are higher ups or watching this. It just

45:57

happens to be spring break and Tom Curran.

46:00

has a real knack, Tommy, of you calling

46:02

me on spring break every year. So let's

46:04

keep this going. You know what's great though

46:06

about the way a guy like Joe does

46:08

his business? If somebody needs

46:10

something about football, he's going to jump on to

46:13

try and lend some intel. Tell

46:15

me about the high school that Drake May

46:17

went to where your son's also a sophomore

46:19

pitcher slash tight end. So

46:22

Myers Park High School traditionally,

46:24

I won't give you the whole

46:27

history, but it is in a

46:29

well-heeled part of in-town

46:31

Charlotte. Josh McCown's

46:33

kids went there. He famously had

46:36

the clause in his Eagles contract

46:38

where he would fly down on

46:40

Fridays and help coach a

46:43

lot of the Panthers coaches who decide

46:45

to send their kids to public school.

46:48

This is the public school they go to. So

46:52

there is, and this is a school that

46:54

used to be good at the country club

46:56

sports. So I heard your Mac Jones lead

46:58

in. Now let me say

47:00

this though, this is not the school that

47:03

Drake May was zoned for. This was

47:05

a deal where he transferred in from

47:07

kind of a northern suburb of

47:09

Charlotte where his brothers, you

47:12

know Tommy, very athletic family.

47:17

Our audience remembers Luke May who was

47:19

dominant for Carolina in the tournament.

47:21

He's only 27. I'm surprised. Seems like

47:23

it was just yesterday. He was so good for

47:25

Carolina, but you guys remember Luke bang with the

47:27

beard. That's Drake's brother. Anyway, go

47:29

Joe. He also had a brother that

47:31

won a college world series as a

47:33

pitcher at Florida. The dad you know

47:35

played for the Tar Heels as

47:38

a quarterback, but here's what I would

47:40

say. Here's a little snapshot. So this

47:42

is a well-known Charlotte family. One

47:45

of the first games, maybe the first game

47:47

that Drake May transfers to this new high

47:49

school is going to be this starting quarterback

47:51

right out of the chute. His

47:53

dad, former NFL guy Mark

47:55

May, is taking

47:57

a shift, a volunteer shift, in

48:00

the concession. Guys, he's taking a shift.

48:04

A volunteer shift with an F.

48:07

I mean, his kid was out playing

48:09

his first high school game starting, and

48:11

I thought that showed a lot about

48:13

the dad and the family, that

48:16

he was like, you know what? We're new here. I'm

48:19

going to flip hamburgers just like every

48:21

other Joe at Myers Park

48:23

High School. And I don't know.

48:26

I don't know. We don't want to read

48:28

too much into it, but I thought that

48:30

was cool. Yeah. I mean, you and I

48:32

have been doing this long enough. People get

48:34

gold stars for the most benign human activities.

48:37

And it's an even better person off the court. But

48:41

with May, you certainly would have watched him in

48:44

high school. Everyone's emotions run high in high school.

48:46

If you're a new kid in town, you might

48:48

feel some pressure and anxiety.

48:52

What were his on-field histrionics

48:54

like? Give me the full McGilliff. Was

48:56

he a baby or a finger

48:58

pointer or a moper? Or if

49:00

he was really a flatliner or somewhere in between? I

49:04

thought he was probably just

49:06

kind of a dude. I

49:09

think he knew he was good, but he

49:11

did not talk about it. I

49:13

mean, he played

49:15

when, again, to my

49:18

point about this high school, his

49:20

top receiver when he first got

49:22

to Myers Park was Massen Muhammad's

49:24

son, who's now at

49:26

Texas A&M. So he had some weapons

49:28

to throw to. And he did very

49:31

well. I

49:33

remember Tom pulling up to pick one of

49:35

my kids up in the spring. And

49:38

my dad was with me. My dad was visiting

49:40

from out of town. But he's a big football

49:42

nerd like the rest of us. And

49:45

we pull up to this little

49:47

side field where Drake May was

49:50

throwing. And he would throw a

49:52

hitch to the left side, then

49:54

a hitch to the right side, and then a

49:57

slant to the left. That going through

49:59

the right. tree. And

50:01

my dad and I sat there for

50:03

like five minutes and just were like,

50:05

wow, could I have

50:07

told you then he was going to be the number

50:09

two, number three, number four pick in the draft? No,

50:11

but he was impressive right

50:13

off the bat. Big

50:15

kid. This something too that

50:17

you probably know because you you know

50:20

just about everything but not all of

50:22

your listeners and viewers might not know

50:25

is that Drake would go

50:27

right from football into basketball.

50:30

Like the like the brother had played and

50:33

and he was

50:35

one of the best guys on the basketball court

50:37

too. You know without

50:39

having done any of the preseason

50:41

hoop. Right. Yeah,

50:44

he seems like he's got excellent for a

50:46

bigger guy. He's not slow foot. His

50:48

feet are actually almost again. I'm not

50:53

you know a quarterback guru but his

50:55

feet are really active and they sometimes are so

50:57

active. He never sets them and

50:59

that impacts a little bit of his fundamentals

51:01

and accuracy. I can tell that just kind

51:04

of the league for 30 freaking years. But

51:07

it's interesting because when

51:10

the Patriots have spoken they've spoken about

51:12

body language, leadership, physical

51:15

toughness so that players can look at a

51:17

guy and say Joe Burrow

51:19

being their shining example. I

51:23

watched a game against Minnesota. I watched every

51:25

single throw and run from Joe from excuse

51:27

me from Drake May last year and I

51:30

watched the play against Minnesota. He

51:32

basically got speared and he was hurt and

51:35

within a minute he's back up and threw one of his

51:37

best throws of the game. I just

51:41

think it might be kind of what a shitty

51:43

team needs is

51:45

that kind of guy. He's going to take a beating

51:48

because the line might not be there and

51:50

the guys might not be getting available. He's

51:52

going to be able to physically take it and it

51:55

seems like he can mentally show the resilience to take

51:57

it. I think

51:59

he's got a great I mean, I know we

52:01

talk a lot about that. And, you

52:04

know, we don't always, even

52:06

these athletes that we feel like we

52:08

get to know pretty well, you never

52:11

entirely know. But I've,

52:14

in my experiences with him and being

52:16

around him, and I did some stories

52:18

with him for the athletic. I remember

52:20

during COVID, when we

52:23

were kind of looking to do some different

52:25

stuff, it was right around the time he

52:27

was enrolling at Chapel Hill early. And

52:29

I got in touch with him, I got in touch

52:31

with the dad and just did a nice profile. And

52:33

I don't know, I think your example

52:36

from the Minnesota game, I think is a

52:38

good one. I think that

52:40

was kind of my view of him.

52:42

I never thought he put

52:44

himself like above this team, this

52:47

high school team. I didn't

52:49

obviously follow him as closely in college,

52:51

but I did notice this too, again,

52:53

not a quarterback guru. And I think

52:56

this was pretty obvious to anyone who

52:59

has watched him. He thickened

53:01

up, like he's now got

53:03

a chest and shoulders and

53:05

a neck where he

53:08

was pretty thin when

53:10

he played in high school. As I said, he

53:13

would kind of go right into basketball season. So

53:15

he wasn't a guy who was like doing a

53:17

ton of lifting. I've noticed him,

53:20

and he had the six foot four or

53:22

six foot five frame to fill out. And

53:24

it looks like he has done that. You

53:28

are excellent to have on as well during

53:30

your spring break because you

53:32

covered a team that took with the

53:34

top three pick, the number one overall pick, Bryce

53:37

Young last year, he struggled, he was on a terrible

53:39

team and his

53:41

situation certainly impacted his

53:43

performance. Frank Reich was fired in the middle of

53:45

the year. I don't think that's gonna happen with

53:47

Gerard Mayo, but it's a first year head coach

53:49

who does not have offensive background.

53:52

And Alex Van Pelt is their

53:54

OC, Ben Macadou's offensive

53:57

whisperer. A lot of people are kind

53:59

of thrusting. together. I think that they're gonna like each

54:01

other. I think they might have nice chemistry, but

54:03

it's very hard. All that said, if

54:07

you were a team like the Patriots, who was

54:09

picking three, not one, would

54:12

you look at a Bryce Young type situation and say, you

54:14

know what, we're kind of like those

54:16

guys. We have an opportunity here

54:18

this year to trade down and

54:20

in a wide receiver and offensive tackle

54:23

heavy draft, we can load those spots

54:25

up. That's an idea I've been advocating

54:27

for the Patriots considering. Do

54:31

you see the logic in that first? Yeah,

54:33

for sure. I mean, if you're

54:35

not convicted on any of these

54:37

quarterbacks, then absolutely don't reach. I

54:40

mean, I'm not breaking new

54:42

ground with that. But

54:45

May is a tough guy to pass on, I guess

54:47

is the second level of this particular question. I

54:49

keep saying, Phil Perry and I go back and

54:52

forth and he's like, I just don't think that

54:54

you're going to find a May type. And

54:56

I'm like, these guys are always there

54:58

in the top three, whether it's Darnold

55:01

or Trey Lance, or they're always there.

55:03

Somebody always materializes. The more

55:05

I watch May though, the

55:07

more I'm saying he's not Darnold, he's not

55:09

really even Baker Mayfield. He is a

55:13

little bit of a throwback and even at three, when

55:15

we've seen so many busts on the top five, all

55:19

the elements of trading down look so good, but

55:23

May just might be the right fit at the

55:25

right time because of the intangible too. I

55:28

think so. I mean, honestly, I

55:32

asked you this off the air, but

55:34

because I haven't followed it that closely

55:36

this year because the Panthers got their

55:39

last year. But I

55:42

asked you, are

55:44

the commanders not going to take Drake? And

55:46

of course we don't know, but I

55:49

think if Drake May is there at three, I'd take

55:52

them. I mean, that's not my money, not my

55:55

team, but I do. And I try to

55:57

put my mind to it. Myers

56:00

Park Homer hat off. I didn't

56:02

wear it on your show. But

56:06

I just again

56:08

I don't have any real

56:11

reason to champion Drake man. He

56:13

doesn't need much but I thought

56:15

he had really good makeup in

56:17

addition to being an excellent thrower

56:19

of the football. Again your footwork

56:22

point is valid. He

56:25

can I think he's big enough where he

56:27

can take hits. He's big enough

56:29

and ab agile enough that

56:32

he can get out of the pocket. Keep

56:35

you know go scramble for seven

56:37

and keep the drive alive kind of

56:39

thing. I take him. He's a decisive

56:41

runner. That's what's actually cool and

56:43

watching the cut ups is he

56:46

when he decides he's gonna run he's running.

56:48

It's not oh do I want to come

56:50

back a little bit and rethink this. No.

56:53

Oh gone. It's good to see the decisiveness

56:55

from him. So let me ask you this.

56:57

This is what does argue in favor of

56:59

May as opposed to certainly Jayden Daniels if

57:01

you have the decision. I

57:03

think May is gonna play 17 games every

57:05

friggin year. Did Bryce

57:08

Young was he able to play throughout the season?

57:11

Played 16 and the game he missed early in

57:13

the year there was a lot of speculation that

57:15

it was sort of just like a mental health

57:17

break more than an ankle but

57:20

for the beating Bryce Young took as

57:23

a five foot ten a hundred

57:25

and eighty pound nothing quarterback

57:27

nothing meaning no bulk.

57:31

He took a beating and he missed

57:34

as I say one game. It's

57:36

such a huge aspect of it though. Like

57:39

the beating the guys are gonna take and

57:41

can you play all those games or are you gonna be

57:43

like Joe Burrow is an

57:45

excellent player. We all know that great

57:47

leader. He's unique. He's elite. He's everything

57:49

else but he's had

57:51

two seasons in which he's missed more than six games

57:54

and that impacts the entire franchise and now he's

57:56

making whatever 200 300 million dollars. on

58:00

the contract and deserves it but when

58:02

you start pro-rating a guy and how

58:04

much he makes Lamar Jackson that was a big knock on

58:06

him I thought going in last year as a free agent

58:09

we have to pro-rate it because he's going to play 10

58:11

games and then he goes out and plays 17 is

58:14

brilliant but Joe I'm talking

58:16

I'm just spewing now and wasting your

58:18

spring break so anything else to

58:20

add my friend? No like

58:22

I said I like the

58:25

kid I think he comes from good

58:27

stock it

58:30

would be easy I guess to think

58:32

a guy who kind of grew up

58:35

in this very athletic and well-known

58:37

family would just sort of mail

58:40

it in I never witnessed that

58:42

at all quite the quite the opposite

58:44

very competitive those brothers you know there's

58:47

been a lot of stories written about

58:50

how Drake is and I guess he's the

58:52

youngest there's a one that's still at Chapel

58:54

Hill but

58:56

I think Drake is younger

58:58

anyway good kid good

59:01

family and he looks like he

59:03

is a guy who could play 15 years

59:06

in this league yeah

59:09

we always say this stuff at the beginning of

59:12

April I'm so scared all right Joe enjoy

59:16

your week buddy thanks buddy have a great vacation

59:18

thank you for taking the time you