0:00

In Birmingham, Alabama, 60 years ago,

0:02

black students, some still in elementary

0:04

school, marched for an

0:06

end to segregation. They

0:09

were met with police dogs, fire

0:11

hoses, and handcuffs. Today,

0:13

three people who can remember those events

0:16

because they themselves were students right

0:18

here in Birmingham. Businesswoman

0:20

Mary Bush, University President

0:23

Freeman Hrabowski, and former

0:25

Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice. On

0:28

Uncommon Knowledge Now. So,

0:31

my friends, they did

0:33

not die in vain. God

0:36

still has a way of ringing good

0:38

out of evil. History

0:41

has proven over and over

0:43

again that unmerited suffering is

0:45

redemptive. Welcome

0:52

to Uncommon Knowledge. I'm Peter Robinson. Mary

0:55

Bush grew up in segregated Birmingham, then went

0:57

on to a career in finance and business

1:00

that saw her earn an MBA from the

1:02

University of Chicago, work at Citibank

1:04

in Chase, Manhattan, serve in

1:06

the Treasury Department during the Reagan Administration,

1:09

sit on the boards of companies including

1:11

Marriott and Texaco, and found Bush International,

1:13

the consulting firm which she now serves

1:16

as president. Freeman Hrabowski

1:18

III grew up right across the street

1:20

from Mary Bush. He went

1:22

on to a career in academia, earning a

1:24

doctorate in higher education administration

1:27

and statistics from the University of

1:29

Illinois. Beginning in 1992,

1:31

Dr. Hrabowski served as president of

1:33

the University of Maryland Baltimore County,

1:35

one of the 12 universities in

1:37

the University of Maryland system. During

1:41

his tenure, UMBC became the number one

1:43

producer in the nation of

1:45

African Americans who went on to

1:47

complete STEM PhDs. Dr.

1:50

Hrabowski stepped down as president of UMBC

1:52

just last year. Condoleezza

1:54

Rice grew up here in Birmingham in

1:56

the same neighborhood as Mary Bush

1:59

And Freeman Hrabowski. ski. She went

2:01

on to earn a doctorate in International Relations

2:03

from the University of Denver. She.

2:05

Then went on to a career at

2:07

Stanford University that saw her rise to

2:09

provost. And that she interrupted

2:12

to serve during the administration of

2:14

George W. Bush as National Security

2:16

Advisor and Secretary of State. Secretary

2:19

Rice now serves as Director of

2:21

the Hoover Institution. The. Public

2:23

Policy Center at Stanford were

2:26

gathered in Birmingham today in

2:28

the Westminster Presbyterian Church. Where.

2:31

The pastor in the nineteen sixties

2:33

was the reverend John Wesley Rice,

2:35

Jr. Com. These father. I've

2:39

only been here a damn ask, but that seems

2:41

to fall to me to welcome this review back

2:43

to your hometown and Birmingham. The.

2:46

Spring Of Nineteen Sixty Three. April

2:49

third: A local civil rights organization,

2:51

The Alabama Christian Movement for Human

2:53

Rights. Led. By Birmingham Zones

2:55

Reverend Fred shuttles worth. Is. Joined

2:58

by Dr. Martin Luther King Jr.

3:00

Southern Christian Leadership Conference in conducting

3:02

citizens of downtown lunch counters. April

3:05

Six. Reverie. Shuttles Worth

3:08

leads a march on City Hall.

3:10

More than thirty protesters are arrested.

3:12

April Eleven. Doctor. King is

3:14

served with an injunction against

3:17

boycotting trespassing or encouraging such

3:19

acts. April Twelfth Doctor

3:21

King, Reverend Shuttles Worth and others

3:23

lead a march protesting the injunction.

3:26

Their. Arrested. April

3:29

Fourteenth, Easter Sunday A thousand

3:31

protesters. Attempt to march on

3:33

city Hall. Police block their way,

3:35

arresting more than thirty. April.

3:38

Nineteen. The. New York

3:40

Post. Publishes. Excerpts of a

3:42

document The Doctor King. Using

3:44

fragments of newspapers has composed in

3:47

what would soon become known as

3:49

the Letter from Birmingham Jail Doctor

3:51

King Rights quote. I cannot

3:53

sit idly by in Atlanta. And.

3:56

not be concerned about what

3:58

happens in birmingham We are

4:00

caught in an inescapable network

4:02

of mutuality tied in a

4:05

single garment of destiny. Anyone

4:07

who lives in the United States can

4:09

never be considered an outsider. May

4:13

2nd, young blacks begin

4:15

leaving school to march. They walk

4:17

in groups of 10 to 50 across Kelly Ingram

4:19

Park, the city square, intending to

4:21

protest at City Hall just a few blocks away.

4:24

They never reach City Hall. The Birmingham

4:26

Commissioner of Public Safety, Bull Connor,

4:29

orders his men to assault the students with

4:32

fire hoses and police dogs. Many

4:34

of the young people are injured. More than a

4:37

thousand are arrested. May

4:40

10th, a settlement is reached under the

4:42

terms of the Birmingham truce. Dr. King,

4:44

Reverend Shuttlesworth and other civil rights leaders

4:46

agree to end the protests. Birmingham

4:49

business leaders promise in turn that within

4:51

90 days they will desegregate businesses and

4:54

public facilities. For the most part, they

4:56

keep the word and

4:58

official segregation in Birmingham. Unofficial

5:01

segregation would continue for a long

5:03

time. But official segregation in Birmingham

5:05

comes for the most part to

5:07

an end. That's not by any means the means of

5:09

the story and will continue to what

5:12

happened afterwards. But

5:14

for now, let me ask you

5:16

about those events, what is now

5:18

referred to often as the Children's

5:21

Crusade. You're the

5:23

last generation who experienced

5:25

the Old South and the

5:27

civil rights movement that rose against it. Mary

5:31

Bush, you were only

5:33

in your teens. But

5:36

if I understand this correctly, you heard Dr.

5:38

King speak. I did. Tell

5:40

us about what he was like, what it

5:42

meant to this town when he came here.

5:45

The time that I heard Dr.

5:47

King speak was at my church,

5:49

6th Avenue Baptist Church. Those

5:53

were my community members. The

5:57

church worked so hard that I think it was churchy. packed.

6:00

My parents and I went

6:03

and it was really

6:05

a momentous event because

6:08

here was Martin Luther King who

6:10

had become well-known for his civil

6:13

rights activities. He was a famous figure

6:15

coming to town. He was a

6:17

famous figure coming to town. So

6:21

it was it made a huge

6:23

impression on me, one,

6:25

to hear him speak and to talk about

6:27

freedom. When the

6:29

children's marches were organized, I

6:32

wanted very much to participate,

6:35

but I had a father who

6:37

when he meant said something he

6:40

meant it, he said, no you

6:42

cannot go. However, I will

6:44

tell you one other part of the story.

6:46

As you probably know, my friend Freeman Robowski

6:49

did participate. It's a very interesting story as

6:51

to how he got to do it, which

6:53

may be failure, but he

6:56

was arrested. And I came

6:58

home from somewhere one day and

7:00

my father is in our front

7:02

yard and there are tears strolling

7:04

down his face. And

7:06

I said, Daddy, what's wrong? And

7:08

he said, Freeman has been arrested.

7:11

Well, you see, Freeman was like

7:13

his trial too. Freeman lived across the

7:15

street. He lived right across the street

7:17

from me. So my father was in

7:20

much distress because he didn't know

7:22

what was going to happen to

7:24

Freeman because this was a

7:27

city that reacted to people trying

7:29

to get their freedom in

7:31

very violent ways. So

7:33

Freeman, Mary's father

7:36

said, no, you're not marching, right? Did

7:39

you get your parents permission? Did you march

7:41

in spite? Let me

7:43

explain the question. It's

7:46

easy, looking

7:48

back on these events 60 years ago, to

7:50

think that the black community rose as one.

7:52

Well, you were

7:55

united, but there were hard

7:57

decisions to make every day. There was violence

7:59

all around. This notion of children marching

8:01

was not easy. Dr. King himself resisted it for

8:03

a number of days before deciding it had to

8:06

be done So how did your how did you

8:08

and your family address that you were how old

8:10

at this stage 12 12 years old? Yeah,

8:14

you were still a child. Yeah, but I was

8:16

I was in the ninth grade. I was about

8:18

to go to the tenth grade I skipped a

8:20

couple of grades and I

8:22

should tell you that most people saw

8:24

dr. King as a Certainly

8:27

a hero, but he was also a Troublemaker

8:32

he was gonna change things

8:34

people don't realize that in

8:37

that It

8:39

was uncomfortable people were

8:41

worried Particularly

8:43

people who were maybe buying

8:45

houses The word

8:47

had gone around that my goodness

8:51

Banks could pull mortgages Right

8:54

people were saying we don't know what's gonna

8:56

happen You know, it

8:58

wasn't everybody was saying this is the right thing

9:00

to do when you look back on it It

9:02

seems like this was all a good idea No,

9:05

people were very confused about what to do and

9:07

about sending children out So

9:10

it wasn't a given that oh, this

9:13

is the right thing to do. They

9:15

were proud of the idea We're doing something but

9:17

no we went home. I didn't want to go

9:19

to church. Anyway Who wants

9:21

to go to church in the middle of

9:23

the week? I was a belliose kid and

9:25

they placated me by letting me take my

9:28

math. I love the math Reverend Rice knew

9:30

I love the math So I'm sitting in

9:32

the back doing my math and this man.

9:34

It's electron says if the children participate They'll

9:37

go to better schools. No, we love their teachers, but

9:39

we always have been told the white schools were better

9:42

We wanted to see what that was all about

9:44

and I wanted to see if they were as

9:46

smart as people said they were Cuz I knew

9:48

I was smart because to me smart meant you

9:50

could work hard, right and you could you could

9:52

solve the math problems So I'm doing

9:54

my algebra and this guy says this and I look up

9:57

and of course, it's like the king and here's the point I.

10:00

Went home and I said I want to go.

10:02

And. They said What? Absolutely

10:05

Not. Same. Reactionary?

10:07

Absolutely not. And I said to

10:09

my parents and typical Freeman for.

10:12

You. Guys are hypocrites. You make me

10:14

go. I listened and

10:16

now you say no, And

10:18

What? What were your parents

10:20

say? Korea, Room. Because

10:23

you are not supposed to

10:25

tell your parents they're hypocrites,

10:27

right? And. So I

10:29

was punished. They sent me tomorrow. The next morning

10:31

they came in at not slept. They prayed all

10:34

night. I knew I was

10:36

in trouble and they said to me

10:38

with real distress on their faces. It.

10:41

Wasn't that we didn't trust you. We.

10:45

Don't trust the people the over

10:47

you because if you march against

10:50

jail. But.

10:52

We're gonna put you in God's hands. Now.

10:54

My students a shot. You

10:56

must have been really brave.

10:58

I was not a brave

11:00

sol. Of. As if a fight

11:02

broke out in school. Freeman.

11:05

Was running the other way. He's only

11:07

thing I'd ever attacked in my life

11:09

was a math problem. You. Get that

11:11

right? But I didn't want. A.

11:13

Better education. My teachers were wonderful. We

11:16

did not have the resources. We.

11:18

Didn't understand what. Grade.

11:20

Education might the within understand what it

11:22

might be. A. But I did go.

11:25

And it was the. And who

11:27

received experience? They treated us like

11:29

slaves. Like. Animals

11:31

Too many kids. Think

11:34

he. None. Of bathrooms. This is

11:36

in prison in his energies some what was

11:38

it like when the when you were marching.

11:41

It was. It was

11:43

both inspiring and frightening. Can I

11:45

can? Isis is a think this

11:47

is. Is.

11:50

A hard questions to ask. You.

11:52

Ah, I don't have you

11:54

noticed this but I'm like that makes it

11:56

very very comfortable hat but I keep thinking

11:58

that we in Berlin. But

12:04

what was it like to have an

12:06

encounter with a white

12:09

person? What

12:11

was it like not to be able to go to a

12:13

certain store or

12:16

during this event to have an encounter with

12:18

the police and you knew

12:20

they were going to be against you just because you

12:22

were black? Do

12:25

you avoid them? Do you shrink from it? How

12:28

does this work? You know it's interesting that Dr. King's

12:30

people, the two things I would say, we are all

12:35

from privilege in that we have these

12:38

wonderful parents, working mothers

12:40

and fathers and of faith.

12:44

We were going to church all the time, 6th Avenue

12:46

Baptist, Westminster and her father, Reverend

12:49

Rice, our beloved Reverend Rice, Reverend

12:51

Porter, dear friends and Reverend

12:53

Rice was our youth fellowship,

12:55

and by this amazing Presbyterian

12:57

who would come to 6th

12:59

Avenue, we would have these

13:01

wonderful conversations about what it

13:03

meant to be teenagers, right?

13:08

And talking about ideas in our honest

13:10

society, he was an advisor to

13:12

our honest society, right? And

13:14

he was an intellectual and we would

13:16

have these. So in our

13:18

community, we could talk about

13:21

ideas and yet we, you

13:23

can tell me about you all, but I've

13:25

never talked to anybody white. You

13:27

never did. No, the only time I

13:30

remember a white person was we went to visit

13:32

Santa Claus. And

13:34

I was five. You

13:37

would go down to Pizzas or down

13:39

to Lubbins to visit

13:41

Santa Claus. And this

13:43

particular Santa Claus was taking all the little

13:46

black children and holding them out here. He's

13:48

taking little white children and putting them on

13:50

my, their knee. Now, you know, my father,

13:52

my father said to my mother, Angelina,

13:56

if he does that to Condoleezza, I'm going to pull

13:58

all that stuff off of him and show him. to

14:00

do the cracker that he is. So

14:02

they were sitting there, you know, it's, I'm

14:05

five. Daddy, Santa Claus, daddy, Santa

14:08

Claus. What a

14:10

way to meet Santa Claus. So, um.

14:12

That's Reverend Rine. So

14:14

I think somehow Santa Claus could

14:17

see my father, who was six three and

14:19

a football player. And

14:21

when it came time, Santa Claus took me and he

14:23

put me in a, he said, next little girl.

14:26

So that was the only, but to your question, he was

14:29

the only five parts tonight, everything. No, no. That's

14:31

context. Yeah, yeah. Before we, we'll return

14:33

to it in a moment, but before

14:35

we depart from those events

14:38

in 1963, your

14:40

father, as we've heard, was a

14:42

beloved figure. Yes. He was Reverend in this

14:44

church. The black community was, as

14:47

I've looked, it's about 100,000 people. It

14:50

strikes me that the pastors, the ministers must have

14:52

known each other. They did. So

14:54

your father knew Reverend Shuttlesworth.

14:56

They were good friends. Good friends.

14:59

And of course

15:01

you were a very little girl, but do you

15:03

remember at the time, these tensions, it's

15:05

fascinating to me to think,

15:09

once you think it, it seems

15:11

obvious, but the assumption that there's

15:13

this uprising of righteousness and peaceful,

15:17

nonviolent protest, but of

15:19

course it was more complicated than that. Dr.

15:21

King was an outsider, this notion of putting

15:23

children in harm's way. Do you remember your

15:25

father talking about that at home?

15:27

I do remember my father talking about it.

15:29

I was little, I'm a little younger than

15:31

these two. And I remember a

15:34

couple of things about it. I remember my father

15:36

saying to my mother, we're standing in our little

15:38

hallway. Angeline, I'm not gonna

15:41

go down there and pretend to be nonviolent, because if

15:43

a policeman takes a billy club to me, I'm gonna

15:45

try to kill him, and my daughter will be an

15:47

orphan. Because my father

15:49

actually didn't believe in the nonviolent part.

15:52

Do you know one of my father's

15:54

great friends was Stokely Carmichael? Really?

15:57

Yes, he somehow found...

16:00

In that more confrontational side, something

16:02

that he admired. And so when

16:04

the Children's March came along with

16:07

a little lot like Mary and

16:09

and Freeman's parents, my father said,

16:11

why would you send children. Into

16:14

Bull Connor since been over to do

16:16

that. I wouldn't let my daughter co

16:19

and he was very much against the

16:21

children's march but when they were all

16:23

his students were all carted off to

16:25

have to jail He came down and

16:27

he walked around. He had good relationship

16:30

with the police they let him walk

16:32

around and he would call parents and

16:34

say i saw your daughters. And I'm

16:36

happy either. Nine thousand tubes? Yeah yeah.

16:39

We're jail. Yeah, not too far from here.

16:41

the trail. Of your he was

16:44

one of when I j by T. it's

16:46

just two three parts of the sword. Israel

16:48

was Bruce a first. A lot of the

16:50

reason they allow me to go was that

16:52

I challenge my mother. My mother had led

16:54

a protest. In Nineteen Forty

16:56

Eight. Risk for the equalisation of

16:58

teacher salaries. I was fired for them. She

17:00

was always proud of it. In.

17:03

In another county. And.

17:05

Are One of her best friends was

17:07

the mother I'm Angela Davis. We.

17:10

Have year or and my mother and

17:12

into a Davis' mother taught together. Over

17:15

the years and my mother

17:18

taught Angela Davis and her

17:20

sister. And my mother. And.

17:23

As a Daves, his mother taught me. And

17:25

they had this great. Sisterhood.

17:29

About fighting for justice. Or

17:31

right. And. I reminded as a mother

17:33

you. You fought for justice she

17:35

said. but I was an adult. And

17:38

I said what you taught me to paint. And

17:43

they deal with ago was it was

17:45

made about her father when I when

17:47

I moved. When we we did get

17:49

back to school. He. And

17:51

George Bell. Game. A

17:53

Special attention. To. See how

17:56

was psychologically. And.

17:58

He said. you are an

18:00

A student. You are

18:03

an A student. You want to

18:05

be remembered that. He wanted me

18:07

to remember how to define myself. It

18:10

was very important. Just as Mr.

18:12

Bell, who was the uncle of

18:14

Alma Vivian Powell, General Powell's, was

18:16

right. Yeah, no, there's something else

18:19

you need to know about Dr.

18:21

Bell. He was the principal of

18:23

the Omen High School that I

18:25

mentioned earlier that Freeman and

18:27

I both went to. Dr.

18:30

Bell was an amazing

18:32

man. He was

18:34

very much about excellence. He

18:36

would come to our classes. He

18:39

would give the students extra

18:41

problems to solve. But

18:43

he was also a disciplinarian. So

18:46

even the really big guys who might

18:48

have a tendency to act out were

18:50

cowered by Dr. Bell because he had

18:53

this little, little, little, little, little man.

18:55

And he was a tiny man. But

18:59

we loved him because he

19:01

was all about hard work and

19:03

excellence and always, you know, striving to

19:05

be the best you could be. So

19:08

when my class was going

19:10

into its senior year, Dr. Bell

19:13

was about to retire. And

19:16

we literally begged him not to

19:19

retire. This shows you,

19:21

one, how close

19:23

the principals, the ministers that

19:26

we've talked about, the teachers

19:28

were to the students. So

19:30

it was our parents who

19:33

really pushed us about hard

19:35

work and excellence and the value

19:37

of education. But it was

19:39

also our teachers and our principals. You

19:41

had to be twice as good, right?

19:43

Twice as good. Twice as good. So

19:47

I find this so striking that

19:52

here you are in the Jim Crow South and

19:56

you've got parents who

19:58

are wonderful parents. and

20:01

schools that are good

20:03

schools. Yes, and good teachers.

20:05

And good teachers dedicated, I

20:07

mean honestly, truly, I hear

20:09

you describe the circumstances in

20:11

which you grew up and I wouldn't hesitate,

20:14

would not know my children or older now,

20:16

but I'd have dropped my children in

20:19

black Birmingham like that because of

20:21

the education, the self-confidence. Yeah, but let me

20:24

step back a little bit because

20:27

I want to

20:29

say two things. First of all, about the principles. To

20:32

be a principal in a school in

20:34

Birmingham was like

20:36

being a god. We

20:39

had my revered position. So

20:41

Alma Powell's father, Mr. R.C.

20:44

Johnson, was the principal of Parker

20:47

High, which was the largest black school,

20:50

and her uncle was the principal of Alman

20:52

High, which was the second largest. When

20:55

Mr. W. W. Hwetstone, who was the

20:58

principal of our elementary school, died,

21:00

his funeral was like that forehead

21:02

of state because teachers

21:04

were revered, principles were revered,

21:07

but there was a dark

21:10

underbelly to that, which is that if

21:12

you were an educated black

21:14

person, you really only had a

21:17

couple of good options, and

21:20

teaching was the best option.

21:23

And so it was in a sense a

21:25

lack of opportunity for black

21:28

professionals that led to the best and

21:30

brightest going into teaching. In

21:33

another time- The best funeral. Everybody understood. This

21:35

is a man who

21:37

holds a position of importance to us, but he's

21:39

also the best we have produced, the best of

21:42

our community. And

21:44

if you were a teacher, you were

21:46

really highly regarded, and in

21:49

another generation or two, people

21:52

would have other options, and some

21:54

would take them. With few exceptions, who became

21:56

physicians and lawyers. You had a couple of

21:58

lawyers, a few. I call this

22:01

the best minds. We

22:03

got the best minds because, just

22:05

as Condi said, the generation

22:08

before us, our parents and teachers,

22:10

they didn't have the other opportunities.

22:12

The doors were not open, so

22:14

they became teachers, and we

22:16

were the wonderful, blessed recipients

22:19

of that. I

22:21

see. But see, you know, I want to go

22:23

back, please, as you talk about your children coming

22:25

here. It depends on what background your children would

22:28

have had, because, again, I want to say this,

22:30

we were so privileged. They gave us the piano

22:32

lessons, and we had books in the house. And

22:35

French lessons, and all of that.

22:37

The symphony. Yeah, yeah. Which

22:40

we couldn't go to, but they did it at home. We

22:43

couldn't go into the museum. My mother

22:45

would get the pamphlets, and we

22:47

would read stuff on the outside. And so

22:49

my parents sent me to Massachusetts to get

22:52

extra education and to see what it would

22:54

be like to be in classes with white

22:56

kids in the summers. But I saw the

22:58

difference between the southern education and the education

23:00

in New England, and I saw the superiority

23:03

in Massachusetts. You see, in chemistry, in

23:05

literature. And here's the point. Clearly,

23:10

the money that they were

23:12

putting into education in New England would

23:15

make that education there far

23:17

superior to any education in

23:19

public schools for black or

23:21

white in Alabama. You see

23:23

it in the standardized test scores for

23:25

children in general, you see. As

23:28

I look at it, as I study test scores,

23:30

whatever level, all right? Number

23:33

one. Number two. When you look

23:35

at beyond the well-educated

23:38

families, as we were from

23:40

the working families, all right,

23:42

when you look at poor

23:44

children, white and black, in

23:47

here or in America, but in

23:49

Alabama, and you see what happens to

23:51

those children, back then and

23:53

today, the future

23:56

is not right. That's the challenge.

23:58

But, Truman, I want to just... I challenge you

24:00

on one thing and agree with you on another. I'm

24:03

not sure it was superior. That's

24:07

the New England education. I'm

24:10

not sure I could have turned out better if I'd gone to

24:12

school in New England or that you could or that Mary

24:14

could. And I look at Amelia Rutledge

24:17

and I look at Cheryl McCarthy. And we-

24:19

For the best, for the very best. But

24:21

we weren't actually elite. We were kind of

24:23

professional class, middle class. There

24:26

was a more elite black community

24:28

that lived over past Smithfield. All

24:30

right, so- But I'm looking at, I'm looking at,

24:33

I'm particularly looking at math and science. I'm

24:35

looking at math and science, all right. I'm looking at

24:37

chemistry, looking at those areas. And I'm

24:39

looking at, for example, what

24:42

was covered in chemistry in

24:44

Massachusetts and what was covered here. And

24:46

then I looked at what happened when

24:49

I took some courses at the university

24:51

here, at the white university compared to

24:53

there. It was superior as

24:56

a mathematician, I'm saying. All that

24:58

I'm saying is the resources may have

25:00

been superior. I'm not sure that the instruction was.

25:02

And I'm gonna tell you why. Because

25:04

I then went to Denver

25:07

and I went to one of the

25:09

best high schools in Denver, St.

25:11

Mary's Academy. When we arrived in Denver,

25:14

I went to St. Mary's Academy because my

25:16

parents who were educators said the

25:18

Denver public schools are not as good as

25:20

the schools that you went to in Birmingham, right?

25:23

So they made that choice. I love the fact that

25:25

we can disagree like that. Because we also disagree on

25:27

philosophies and other things. And let me just say that.

25:30

Listen, let's go there too. Let's go there too.

25:32

And I always say middle class Birmingham may love

25:34

each other in many ways, but politically

25:36

and stuff, we have some differences. We have some

25:38

differences. But let me tell you my question. I

25:40

want to get to you. But let me tell

25:42

you my question. Standardized test scores. All

25:44

you need to do is look at standardized

25:46

test scores in Massachusetts compared to Alabama. And

25:49

my point is made, QED. Yeah, no, well, I

25:51

don't know about standardized test scores. I know where

25:53

you end up. So

25:57

let me go back to a point, a place where

25:59

I agree. want to extend the story. All

26:01

right. So it is absolutely

26:03

true that if you were poor, in

26:07

the communities here where Mary

26:09

and Freeman and others of

26:11

our friends grew up, faith

26:13

family education. All right. Faith

26:15

was first, family was, and

26:17

we had two parent families that cared

26:19

and then education. Right

26:22

behind this church, there was a government

26:24

project that called it in those days

26:26

called Loveman's Village. And those

26:28

kids were poor. Yes. But

26:31

my parents and were

26:34

determined that those kids were going to get some

26:36

of what they were able to give me. And

26:39

so my father would have the, when

26:41

he would have, there was a dentist

26:43

who came here on Tuesday nights

26:45

to do dentistry. Those to the

26:47

church. Those kids got to come.

26:50

When he had math and

26:53

algebra tutoring and those

26:55

kids got to come. And Sixth Avenue had those. And

26:58

so I don't want to

27:01

give the impression that we just sat on

27:03

our privilege. That's right. That's right. Our parents

27:06

were determined that that privilege was going to

27:08

be extended to those who might not otherwise

27:10

have had it. I'd like

27:12

to return to the events

27:14

of the spring of 19 spring and autumn of 1963.

27:17

But can I just,

27:20

I want to go back to this notion of

27:22

what deprivation you felt. You

27:25

said that Santa held black

27:27

children out here. Yes. That's

27:30

something everybody can get. Yeah. You

27:32

said your parents had to send

27:34

you to New England. And they

27:37

were geniuses. I'm going to say something today, wouldn't say.

27:39

Okay. Both of these young women, and

27:41

I say this based on my own

27:43

education. They're geniuses. They both are geniuses.

27:45

That's just that damn good. No, no,

27:48

no. She's playing it down. But

27:52

they, I mean, of course they

27:54

went ahead and they had a

27:56

good, good, solid education. But they're

27:58

geniuses. They are. Oh,

28:00

look at that. That's not fake. In

28:02

what way? I mean, I am

28:05

conscious. I'm conscious that the year 1963

28:07

began in this state with

28:10

the inauguration of George Corley Wallace.

28:13

And he said, January 1963. Segregation

28:17

now, segregation tomorrow,

28:19

and segregation forever.

28:22

Woo! I

28:24

will never forget looking at that man's face

28:26

when he told me I couldn't go

28:28

to the University of Alabama. I was sitting

28:31

in front of the TV crying. And

28:33

you know what my mother said to me? You

28:36

don't have time to be a victim. She

28:38

said, get the knowledge. When

28:41

I was in Massachusetts, I called

28:43

my parents and I said, they don't like

28:45

me. Because all of my talking about the

28:47

quality of the education, nobody would

28:50

speak to me there either. They wouldn't

28:52

speak to me. The children wouldn't speak to me.

28:54

The teachers wouldn't speak to me. I'd raise my

28:56

hand when nobody else was raising them because I

28:58

was getting an answer. I was 13 and they

29:00

were 16, all right? I'd

29:02

raise my hand. Yeah, I was precocious. And I'd

29:05

have the answer. They'd look right through me. It

29:07

was my first time understanding what Ellison meant by

29:09

the invisible man. And I would be so hurt.

29:11

I'd be raising my little fat hand, trying to

29:13

get them to get called on me. They would

29:15

not call on me. I called my mom and

29:17

dad and I said, they don't like me. And

29:19

she said, how many more black kids

29:21

are in the class? I said, none. She said,

29:23

how many people you think from Birmingham were there

29:25

getting that education? I said, none. She said, you know,

29:28

I love you, right? She said,

29:30

yeah. She said, have a seat. I sat down.

29:32

She said, son, suck it

29:34

up. She

29:36

said, suck it up because you know what? The

29:38

world is not there. Let's talk about it. So

29:42

how did you experience it in your life?

29:44

How did you experience the thing? Deprivation. Deprivation,

29:46

yeah. Well, okay. I couldn't

29:48

drink water from a white

29:51

water fountain, but there was a black water fountain.

29:53

And I'll tell you a funny story. One of

29:55

our other friends, Otto Stallworth, said

29:57

that he was downtown one day with

29:59

his... and he sort of ran

30:01

away from her while she was buying something and drank

30:03

out of the white water fountain. And

30:06

he ran back to her and said, mommy, mommy,

30:09

their water tastes just like ours. Okay,

30:12

so deprivation was not being

30:14

able to go to a

30:16

restaurant other than the

30:18

one black-owned restaurant or hotel other

30:20

than the one black-owned hotel. Or

30:23

the Kiddy Land Park. But

30:28

what I found out years later, you

30:30

know, after we could finally go to

30:32

Kiddy Land Park when I was adult,

30:35

I said, oh, I gotta see it.

30:37

It was horrible, it was dirty, it

30:39

was just unbelievable. So we were not

30:42

really deprived except for things that Freeman

30:44

is talking about, like going

30:46

to some of those schools that we might've

30:48

wanted to in Alabama.

30:52

So our parents made up

30:55

for what would have been

30:57

deprivation, we could only go

30:59

to the symphony downtown one

31:02

day a year. We could not. Blacks were

31:04

allowed one day a year. Blacks were allowed one

31:06

day a year. We could not go

31:08

to the Birmingham Public Library downtown. We

31:10

could only go to the community one,

31:12

which is a few blocks from here.

31:15

However, our parents made sure

31:17

that we had exposure to

31:20

symphony, to classical music. Condi's

31:22

mother and grandmother, you know,

31:25

taught her classical piano. And

31:29

some of my other friends, they

31:31

were taught ballet. So

31:33

they made up for it. They made sure

31:36

that we had, we've read

31:38

broadly and widely. I read so

31:40

much, Freeman loves to tell this

31:42

story. It almost burned our house

31:44

down once. It did. It

31:46

did. Flashlights on the under the cover.

31:49

Oh, yeah. Yeah, a naked lamp bow,

31:51

because I didn't wanna stop reading. And

31:53

after that- We were reading, we were reading

31:55

broadly. We were done, but the Pramish kids.

31:57

No, and the Freeman, I have to keep challenging.

32:00

Our parents were, I doubt my parents ever in their lifetime, made more

32:02

than $80,000 together.

32:07

But really, other blacks in our community.

32:11

But let's stick with this. Because

32:14

to say we were privileged, I think,

32:16

is to underestimate what our parents achieved.

32:18

That's right. When

32:20

you think about what Mary said, we have a friend,

32:22

Deborah Cheatham, who said that she

32:26

wanted to go to Kiddyland. And

32:29

her parents said, you don't want to

32:31

go to Kiddyland. We're going to Disneyland.

32:34

So they found ways. But

32:37

when I think of privilege, I think

32:40

of it was almost ordained. And

32:43

I don't think you can say, my parents

32:45

worked, my mother was a teacher, my father

32:49

was a teacher, football coach, minister.

32:52

He had more jobs. And we

32:54

talked about Denise McDarr's father.

32:58

He was the milkman, the mailman,

33:00

the photographer, and he taught. So

33:04

they did everything to

33:06

give us opportunity.

33:09

And I think they worked

33:11

hard to make sure that other kids could.

33:13

My parents worked six jobs. My

33:16

father had a college degree. He

33:19

left it to become a still, working

33:21

a still. Because he

33:23

could make more money working in a

33:25

still factory and doing the reading and

33:28

writing for his white supervisor, who

33:30

was illiterate. He worked at the

33:32

railroad station and doing the same

33:34

thing for the right. And

33:38

then he worked at the funeral home on the weekend.

33:41

My mother worked as a math

33:43

and English teacher, but then she

33:46

did GED in the evening. She

33:48

tutored. No, no, no, she taught

33:50

people to get the GED. And

33:54

then she sold insurance to give

33:56

me the best. And

33:58

yet, and yet you had a magical job. My

34:00

father were three jobs. My

34:02

parents were not educators like

34:05

Condies and Freeman's, but they

34:07

were passionate about education. And

34:10

to a large extent, they were self-educated.

34:12

They grew up in a small

34:15

farm town about 90 miles from

34:17

Birmingham. And

34:19

the Black high school went to the 10th

34:21

grade, whereas the white high school went

34:23

to the 12th grade. So my mother

34:25

got a 10th grade education. My

34:28

father, unfortunately, had to stop

34:30

school when he was 13 years

34:33

old because his father died and he

34:35

was the only boy who could work

34:37

the farm. And that

34:39

hurt him all of his life because

34:42

he passionately loved education. However,

34:44

he read everything he could

34:47

get his hands on, newspapers,

34:49

books. He was

34:51

the center of conversation at dinner

34:53

parties my parents would give. I

34:56

can remember him talking about things in the

34:58

international world, the Bay of Pigs invasion,

35:02

the Cuban missile crisis, what Chris

35:04

Jug was doing, what was happening

35:06

in Asia. And I think that's where

35:08

I got my love of international things.

35:11

It started there. So

35:13

they both really educated

35:16

themselves. Let's go

35:18

back to the late spring

35:20

and the early autumn of 1963. Another

35:23

timeline here. We

35:28

ended the timeline a moment ago with the truce. Now

35:31

here's what happens. Official Birmingham,

35:33

the business leaders in Birmingham, promise

35:36

to desegregate and they begin to do so. But

35:39

they can't control all of Birmingham and

35:42

the white racists continue a fight. May

35:45

11th, the bombing at the Gaston Hotel. You

35:48

mentioned Mr. Gaston. He was the black businessman

35:50

who owned the one hotel in

35:52

town. We'd agree he was privileged. He was privileged.

35:54

He was rich. He was our

35:56

billionaire. All right. May

36:00

11th, a bombing at the Gaston Motel.

36:03

May 12th, President Kennedy sends troops to

36:05

bases near Birmingham, intending to use them

36:08

to restore order if necessary. May

36:10

20th, the Birmingham Board of

36:12

Education orders the expulsion from school

36:15

of the more than 1,000 black students who had

36:17

been arrested in the protests. Two

36:20

days later, a federal judge reverses the

36:22

expulsion, ordering the schools to

36:24

admit those students. July

36:27

23rd, summer, schools out. The Birmingham

36:29

Council votes unanimously to repeal all

36:32

of Birmingham's segregation laws. August

36:35

and early September, a

36:37

series of bombings take place. Among

36:39

these incidents, there are too many for me to list. Two

36:43

bombings at the home of Arthur Shores, a

36:45

black civil rights lawyer. Fire bombs thrown into

36:47

the home of Mr. Gaston,

36:49

A.G. Gaston, once again. September

36:52

9th, Alabama Governor

36:54

George Wallace turns black students away

36:56

from state universities, including the University

36:58

of Alabama at Birmingham. September

37:01

10th, the day afterwards, President

37:03

Kennedy federalizes the Alabama National

37:05

Guard, ordering Secretary of

37:07

Defense McNamara to enforce the

37:09

integration of Alabama schools. And

37:13

this brings us to

37:15

the Sunday morning of September 15th, when

37:17

the 16th Street Baptist Church is bombed

37:20

and four girls are

37:22

killed. Three

37:24

were 14 and one was just 11. You

37:27

remember that morning? I remember that I was

37:29

right here in this church because my father

37:32

was the pastor. My mother was the minister

37:34

of music. And so we were here early.

37:37

And of course, no cell phones, but

37:39

words started to spread. You could feel the

37:41

church shutter because it's not that far.

37:43

You felt the explosion. And

37:46

down at 6th Avenue, I'm sure you did. You were

37:48

in church that morning as well. I was

37:50

not. It was one of the few Sundays we did not go

37:52

to church, but I felt it at my home. We

37:55

all felt it. And you knew what it was because there had

37:57

been so many bombings. Then

38:00

word started to spread. It had been at

38:02

16th Street Baptist Church. It was, there

38:05

were four little girls. They were in

38:07

the basement in the bathroom, and then

38:09

the name started to come out. And

38:11

everybody knew at least

38:13

one of those little girls, Denise McNair,

38:17

who had been in this

38:19

church kindergarten. I

38:21

have a picture of my father giving her her kindergarten certificate.

38:26

My uncle taught Addie Mae Collins,

38:30

and he said that Monday morning when he woke

38:32

up and went to school, her chair was

38:34

empty, and he just broke down and cried.

38:37

Cynthia Wesley, everybody knew these

38:40

little girls. Yeah, yeah. That's

38:45

a day I will never forget. It

38:48

brings me almost to tears now, because

38:50

these four little girls would

38:53

also have been stars. Yes,

38:55

it would have been stars.

38:57

Denise McNair was the daughter of

39:00

one of my elementary school teachers. So she was

39:02

the youngest, so not

39:04

in my age group, but she always

39:07

came to her mother's classroom after

39:09

her classes, so knew her very

39:11

well. Cynthia Wesley

39:14

had just been at my birthday party

39:17

a few months before. So

39:20

this was an

39:22

unthinkable, unimaginable,

39:25

and it just tears at me

39:27

to this day. It really does.

39:31

Again, difficult questions here. You've

39:36

been thinking about this all your life, so

39:39

difficult questions for me, but was there, what

39:44

was the effect, was there any thought that

39:48

it had gone too far, that maybe

39:50

it all had pushed the white

39:52

community too far, too fast, that that criticism

39:55

of Dr. King had been validated? No such

39:57

thought ever. I

40:00

think if anything, this one did

40:03

reinforce the sense that these were

40:06

awful people who had

40:09

to be stood up to. I

40:12

just remember being for the first

40:14

time really scared because my parents I

40:16

thought could deal with anything.

40:18

I never worried that I was going to.

40:21

But that night I asked if I could sleep in their bed. Oh

40:23

did you? I did that night. And this is the difference

40:25

in ages. I was a little

40:28

girl. She was a little girl. I remember I was

40:30

in 10th grade. You

40:32

were in high school too. People

40:35

said to those of us who had

40:37

gone to jail, if you all hadn't

40:39

done this, those girls

40:41

would still be alive. Really? I never heard that.

40:44

So you did say that? Never heard that. They

40:46

told King that. They told those of us who

40:48

had gone to jail. If you all hadn't done

40:50

this, if Dr. King hadn't come in things

40:52

would be done. Where was that coming from? From blacks. Oh

40:55

yeah. But I mean who? Oh yeah.

40:57

It was very clear. Very

40:59

clear. Very clear. And Dr. King

41:02

felt it. When he took courage,

41:04

when he came and had to

41:06

look into the faces of those

41:08

mothers at the

41:10

funeral. And I

41:12

was chosen to represent

41:15

Ullman. And

41:17

I came to Ullman High School. And

41:20

my parents had said I could come to the funeral.

41:24

And Dr. Bell

41:26

saw me and he said come here

41:28

son. And I didn't have an

41:30

appropriate tie. At the time he was supposed to wear a

41:32

dark tie and I just put on a tie. And he

41:34

took off his tie. He had a black tie.

41:37

And he tied the tie on me.

41:39

It was so special. And he

41:41

said you're representing all of us. And

41:46

he said just remember you're representing all of

41:48

us. And we're proud of you. It

41:50

was so special. It really was. But

41:53

this is the point. Dr. King I looked in his face. I

41:55

was sitting up in the back looking right

41:57

at him and he said when he was

41:59

looking into faces of those mothers.

42:01

And you, I'll never forget the three coffins,

42:04

the little Denise's little coffin in the middle.

42:06

I'd never seen multiple coffins,

42:08

the small coffin. Only three. One

42:10

mother refused to allow her daughter.

42:12

Yeah, it was only three coffins,

42:15

but the baby, Denise,

42:17

they left in the middle. And

42:19

he said, life is

42:21

as hard as steel. And

42:25

he looked into those faces. Life

42:27

is hard. At

42:29

times as hard as crucible steel,

42:33

it has its bleak and difficult

42:35

moment. If one will hold

42:37

on, he will discover

42:39

that God walks with him and

42:42

that God is able to lift you

42:44

from the fatigue of despair to the

42:46

buoyancy of hope and

42:49

transform dark and desolate valleys

42:52

into sunlit paths of inner

42:54

peace. And

42:57

no greater tribute can be paid to you as parents

43:00

and no greater epitaph can come

43:02

to them as children and

43:05

where they died and what

43:07

they were doing when they died. They

43:10

died between the sacred walls of

43:12

the church of God. And

43:16

they were discussing the eternal meaning of

43:18

love. Mm-hmm. And

43:22

he was just, what

43:24

do you say to that? To those mothers when he

43:26

know what people are telling them that it's

43:28

your fault. That was, I'll

43:31

never forget that feeling. The other thing though

43:33

that I've talked about before was the first

43:35

time in my church and our church, I

43:37

had seen white people on

43:40

the right-hand side, men

43:42

of all faith, of all

43:45

rabbis, Muslims, priests.

43:49

And it was the first time I'd seen white men crying. I

43:54

think as heinous an event

43:57

as this was, I think it's

43:59

one of the... things that really

44:02

started changing minds and

44:04

hearts in America, in

44:06

Birmingham and in America.

44:08

So see I didn't

44:10

know white men could cry about black

44:12

girls being two. They

44:15

had never thought about that. So that event,

44:18

to some component of the white

44:20

community in Birmingham, that event, they

44:23

said this has to stop. Not just in

44:26

Birmingham, but in the country. I

44:28

also think that you mentioned the

44:30

truth and what was happening in black businesses.

44:33

And I'm going to say something fairly controversial. For

44:35

a lot of the white community, segregation

44:38

had become just a pain. You

44:41

know, it was just an inconvenience in

44:43

some ways. And so I remember my

44:46

dad was highly regarded by a man

44:49

named Clay Sheffield, who was the head

44:51

of counseling, guidance counseling for the whole

44:53

city. And my

44:55

father was kind of his protege in some

44:57

ways. And my mother

45:00

got a very bad infection,

45:02

a bad bronchitis.

45:04

And so she kept trying doctors and

45:06

nothing was working. And so my father

45:09

mentioned this to Mr. Sheffield. And he

45:11

said, I want you to take her to

45:13

this doctor, Dr. Carmichael. And so we went

45:15

and the black, this was probably 1961 or

45:18

1962, maybe. And the the

45:20

waiting room was for the blacks

45:22

was next to the pharmacy and

45:25

the paint was peeling and you had to go

45:27

up the back stairs. And

45:30

Dr. Carmichael saw my mother and then he

45:32

said to my father, Reverend Rice,

45:35

Angelina needs to come every week to see me, but

45:37

why don't you come after five? And

45:40

then after five, we could sit in

45:42

the regular waiting room. And so you

45:44

could sort of see that, you

45:47

know, we forget there were people of conscience

45:50

who were white. And so I do

45:52

think this

45:55

was catalyzing. But even before then, beginning

45:58

to think that my father father had a

46:00

very close relationship with the pastor

46:03

of Shades Valley Presbyterian Church, which

46:05

is over in Mount Brook. And

46:08

they would exchange youth fellowships and so

46:10

forth. And then the white, the white,

46:12

wealthy white enclave.

46:14

But when when 63 happened,

46:18

they had to stop because it was

46:20

so violent. But there

46:22

were there were things going on

46:24

underneath. There were very,

46:27

very good point. My father's

46:29

three jobs. He was a steelworker.

46:32

And he would go there from seven to

46:34

three, he would come home, have dinner, get

46:36

a little rest. And then he would go

46:38

to his two other jobs, which

46:41

were to clean two buildings. He

46:43

was the janitor for

46:45

Liberty National Insurance Company,

46:48

and for the US Steel Credit Union.

46:50

So I tell everybody I got my my

46:53

start in finance very early. Because

46:57

my brother and I sometimes on a

46:59

Friday evening, or sometimes even during the

47:01

week, we would go with him and

47:03

my mother, because she would help them

47:05

sometimes. And we would do our homework,

47:07

you know, while they were finishing up the

47:09

work. Sometimes there

47:11

were and it was, of

47:13

course, all whites who staffed

47:15

both organizations. And the

47:18

ones who were still there were

47:20

just so very kind to my

47:22

brother and me to a person.

47:24

And whenever they had

47:27

parties, they would leave little treats

47:29

for us. So there were people

47:31

of good conscience, and

47:33

people who really cared about

47:36

what was going on and didn't agree with

47:38

what was going on. Two

47:40

final questions, if I may. And

47:43

here's the first one. Here

47:45

we sit, six decades

47:47

later, six

47:49

decades later, your

47:51

own lives have turned out pretty darn well.

47:55

An amazing career in finance and business,

47:58

the presidency of a major institution,

48:01

Secretary of State, when

48:05

you return to this town, do

48:07

you feel, looking back

48:11

on those events, that

48:13

they had to happen, that it

48:16

was right, and

48:18

that the events of 1963

48:20

represent a victory? Or

48:23

when you look at this town today where there's

48:25

just no racial tension,

48:28

at least that I've experienced, do you say,

48:30

well, it was inevitable? That somehow or other,

48:33

segregation had to end. Maybe

48:36

that wasn't necessary. Maybe we would all

48:39

just wash itself out in time.

48:41

Well, let me say something to this

48:44

controversial. People think of Cunney as the

48:46

Secretary of State. I see her still

48:48

as this amazing force who still to

48:51

me was a little girl walking with

48:53

her father with a book, because when

48:55

she left Birmingham, she was only maybe

48:57

11 or so, 1965. So

48:59

when we still have this argument, she

49:01

was privileged. I don't care what she

49:05

says, she was not able to listen.

49:07

Let me say why, because our church

49:10

and 16th Street were privileged

49:12

churches. This was a

49:14

privileged church, a Presbyterian church, a black

49:16

Presbyterian church is a church of privilege.

49:19

Now, compared to whites, it's

49:21

a different word, but in the black

49:23

community, usually you're going to have

49:25

a larger percentage of educated people. In

49:27

the 60s, only 3% of

49:29

blacks had a college degree. Just think

49:32

that way, and you'd have more blacks. I

49:34

could play classical piano, in

49:36

that sense. Now, why do I say that? So

49:39

we were challenged in the sense that

49:41

there was segregation. We couldn't go to

49:43

places. Today,

49:47

educated people have

49:49

done well in America and in

49:51

Alabama, in Birmingham, the head

49:54

of medicine for the University of Alabama,

49:57

quite frankly, and African American. I'm

49:59

into who recently moved to New York to

50:01

a big position, says, big deal, big deal, at

50:04

the same time, at the same time. In

50:07

this state, you still have major

50:09

challenges. While you may have a black

50:11

who is the mayor, all right,

50:15

and you have some blacks at the

50:17

University of Alabama, Birmingham, you've got the

50:19

same challenges that you have in other

50:21

cities that the vast majority of black

50:24

children still cannot read well. And

50:27

you still have the segregation. So, yes, we needed

50:29

the 60s. And what

50:31

it showed was that even in the most privileged

50:33

of churches like 16th Street, when you did have

50:36

a number of educated people. Are you proud

50:38

of going to jail? I'm very proud. I'm

50:40

very proud to have been. Are you proud

50:42

of employment? Oh, absolutely. Yes. Yes.

50:46

Absolutely. Yes. Of course.

50:49

But I want to come back to what we

50:51

should celebrate and what we shouldn't. Yes. So,

50:55

I won't use the word privilege. I still don't like that

50:58

word. But were

51:00

we in a position to succeed? Yes.

51:03

I'm not even the first PhD in my

51:06

family. My father's sister. Yes, as

51:08

well. PhD in Victorian literature, right? So, you

51:10

make purity. Yeah, right. Not even first PhD.

51:12

So, were we in that sense? Yes.

51:17

Were we given a head start? Absolutely. But

51:20

that head start came from Mary's parents

51:22

who were your

51:24

father who had dropped out of Labor.

51:29

So, in that sense,

51:31

the head start, the privilege,

51:33

if you will, came from

51:35

an attitude about what ought

51:38

to be our lives and our prospects

51:40

and our horizons. It

51:42

was almost like Bull Connor is not going to own our

51:44

children. And so,

51:46

that was the privilege that we

51:48

had people who believed that. It

51:52

is still the case that

51:54

there are people who are trapped in the

51:56

witch's brew that is race and poverty. are

52:01

black and educated and

52:03

doing well, yes, there are still

52:06

some awful things. The

52:08

young man, Albury, who was running and

52:11

was shot, it

52:13

happened. But for the most

52:15

part, you can make a great

52:17

life in America. And now you can

52:19

go to a restaurant, and now you can go to the

52:21

University of Alabama. And if you want to take your kids

52:23

to kiddie land, they'd be happy to have you. So

52:26

that constraint, that ugliness is

52:29

gone. But we

52:31

have to remember that we can't

52:34

celebrate as a country when so

52:36

many people are left behind. And

52:39

now not all of them are black.

52:42

If you live in the rural

52:44

South, your prospects are not very

52:46

good. And so people

52:49

like us, what

52:51

our parents taught us, what our teachers

52:53

taught us is not

52:55

to just enjoy

52:57

your privilege, that

53:00

you have to extend

53:02

to others. You have to care about

53:04

others. What Freeman

53:06

has done as an educator is

53:09

really remarkable, because your students

53:13

didn't all come from privilege. That's right.

53:15

And they were all black and white.

53:17

Yes. And so to be

53:19

able to extend that

53:21

hand of, all right,

53:23

I need to pull you up too. That's

53:26

what we need to do, because

53:28

we should celebrate

53:31

what Birmingham produced

53:34

in us and in others. But

53:36

Birmingham's got a lot more work to do. And so

53:38

does every city in this country. Last

53:40

question. Again, I'm taking you back to the events

53:43

of the spring of 1963. Students

53:48

listening, well,

53:50

let's put it this way. Freshmen

53:53

at your institution at Stanford were

53:56

born four decades after

53:58

these events. Four

54:00

decades ago, they

54:02

stand farther from the events

54:05

of 1963 Then

54:08

you stood from the First World War When

54:11

those events were taking place, this is old

54:13

history to them Can

54:15

you give me a sentence? I

54:18

mean really compress it What

54:20

do they need to grasp? What

54:23

do they need to hold on to is that? Is

54:28

that a lot of life is

54:31

about attitude and belief Now

54:34

I know as Freeman and Condi

54:36

have Beautifully pointed

54:38

out here that there are

54:41

many people many young people

54:43

many children Who

54:45

live in such? Circumstances

54:48

that it's hard to take

54:51

on that attitude and belief

54:54

But but but it's made

54:56

harder by either

54:59

parents or society or

55:03

Whoever tells them that they are

55:05

limited and what they can do

55:07

and what they can be We

55:10

were told despite the circumstances here

55:12

in Birmingham that we could do

55:14

and be anything that we wanted

55:17

Our parents believed that they had

55:20

that vision our teachers believed it

55:22

They said we knew change

55:24

was coming and that we had to

55:26

have you in a state of readiness

55:29

That's what one of my teachers said to me

55:31

and and that is the message

55:35

That we all need to

55:37

carry to children today to

55:39

parents particularly those

55:41

who live in Circumstances

55:46

that are very very

55:48

challenging I chair an

55:51

organization in Washington Where

55:54

our kids come from the poorest

55:56

areas. There's a lot of violence

55:59

in their neighborhoods, but we get

56:01

the mentors, people who can help

56:03

them see that there are opportunities

56:05

and that they can be those

56:07

things as well. That's part of

56:09

the purpose that we serve. Yeah,

56:13

I would say that there are two

56:15

messages depending on where you sit. So

56:18

if you sit in a position where

56:21

you have been fortunate enough to

56:24

be in a, to

56:26

be able to really take advantage of what

56:28

America is, then by all means,

56:33

go and help somebody who has less. Because

56:36

the thing that sometimes really gets on my nerves

56:38

about young people, and that means I'm getting older,

56:42

is that sense that, oh, woe

56:44

is me. If

56:46

you go and help somebody who has less than you

56:48

have, you will never again ask, why do I have

56:50

so little? You'll say, why do I have so much?

56:53

And so if you're in that position, then I

56:55

don't care what you do, volunteer to go help

56:58

a kid, work at the Boys and Girls Club,

57:00

do something to help others. If

57:03

you are that young person, and I work with

57:05

Boys and Girls Clubs, and I see them, the

57:08

kid living in a car where

57:10

the parents are totally dysfunctional,

57:14

but you can still make it.

57:17

There are still ways up and out. You have

57:19

to work very, very hard. But

57:22

to Mary's mentoring a point, there

57:25

has to be an advocate for it, that child. It has to come from

57:29

someplace. But I just

57:32

feel so badly when kids will sometimes say to

57:34

me, 75% of the people in

57:37

my neighborhood never finish school. And

57:40

they think of themselves as a statistic. And

57:43

I say, be in the

57:46

25% that does. That's the challenge.

57:49

No, a 19-year-old student of yours says,

57:52

you went to prison? What was that all about? I

57:56

say that I hear so many elected

57:59

officials today. talking about

58:01

moral clarity. Now here's

58:03

my moral clarity that

58:06

I talked about when I was 12. We

58:09

must speak truth to

58:12

power and

58:14

I believe in our country. So

58:17

the first thing I'm gonna say to young people

58:19

is that we must vote. And

58:22

I'm not gonna tell you to whom to vote for but I

58:24

am gonna say this, vote for people

58:26

who tell the truth. Thank

58:28

you. Vote for people who

58:30

care about children. Okay

58:32

vote for people who care about

58:34

poor people. Right?

58:37

Who want a country who don't want

58:39

to see poor people at the bottom

58:41

killing each other. That

58:43

we can be better than this as a country.

58:46

Where poor people are

58:49

dying every day. That's

58:52

what we have to be. We can be so

58:54

much better as a country. We are better than

58:56

this as a country. We're

58:58

better than this. And

59:01

Birmingham I think shows that

59:03

we can be better than this. Because

59:06

despite its long and

59:09

difficult and tortured history it

59:12

did produce some

59:15

of us. And oh

59:17

by the way it is

59:19

a different place than it was. But

59:22

I would travel around the world as Secretary

59:24

and people would say how can you speak

59:26

for America? Your country was slave-owning. You grew

59:28

up in segregated Birmingham. And I would

59:30

say since when did people tell you that democracy was

59:32

ever a finished product? And

59:35

in fact that is

59:38

the one lesson that

59:40

Birmingham chose. Condoleezza

59:43

Rice, Freeman Hrabowski, Mary

59:45

Bush. Thank you. Thank

59:48

you Peter. For uncommon

59:50

knowledge filming today at Westminster

59:52

Presbyterian Church in Birmingham, Alabama.

59:56

I'm Peter Robinson. Thank

59:58

you for joining us. What

1:00:02

a beautiful honeymoon. Isn't it gorgeous? We

1:00:04

got very fortunate about that. Did

1:00:09

you see Dr. King at all? I

1:00:11

did. I saw his, one of

1:00:13

his speeches. I

1:00:16

saw him leading

1:00:18

and marching close to our neighborhood.

1:00:21

I never met him. I've

1:00:23

met his children and I knew

1:00:26

Coretta, Scott King. But

1:00:29

yeah, I remember him well.

1:00:32

Condi, I have to say, prepping

1:00:34

for our visit here today, I read

1:00:37

and reread the letter from Birmingham

1:00:39

Jail. Birmingham Jail, yes, yes. This

1:00:41

document, all that he was doing,

1:00:44

comes out of his notion of the church. And

1:00:46

children of God. The children of God. If

1:00:48

you are a child of God, then how could you

1:00:50

treat other children of God this way? He

1:00:53

also, we've tended, you know,

1:00:55

what happens with a figure like Dr.

1:00:58

King is that over time, people

1:01:00

put on him whatever their thoughts

1:01:03

are and their beliefs and their ideology. And

1:01:06

we have to keep going back to the

1:01:09

essence of who he was. He

1:01:11

believed in this country, actually. Yes. He

1:01:14

believed this country could redeem itself. Yes.

1:01:17

He believed in a colorblind content

1:01:20

of your character. And

1:01:23

yet sometimes he's

1:01:25

used to talk about

1:01:27

other ways of thinking about race. And

1:01:30

so, you know, and he would have a long

1:01:32

legacy, actually, beyond the civil rights

1:01:35

legacy because he would get concerned

1:01:37

about human rights across the world

1:01:39

and the treatment of workers and

1:01:41

the like. The essence of

1:01:43

what he did here Was to

1:01:45

try to make America be what it said

1:01:48

it was.