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there, you're listening to Unfiltered, a

0:33

production from Casefile Presents, where we invite people

0:35

from all walks of life to share real

0:37

stories about justice and transformation. When

0:41

Paul Joseph Fronzac was 10 years old, he

0:44

discovered a family secret. In

0:46

1964, when Paul was just one day old, he

0:49

was kidnapped from the Chicago hospital he'd

0:52

been born in. Paul's abduction led

0:54

to the largest manhunt Chicago

0:56

had ever seen. One year later, an

0:58

abandoned child was found outside

1:00

a New Jersey department store and ultimately

1:02

identified as Baby Fronzac. Paul

1:06

was reunited with his parents and

1:09

soon had a baby brother. Then, in 2012, Paul took a DNA test

1:14

and made a shocking discovery. He

1:16

was not the real Paul Fronzac, and

1:18

the story he'd been told about his identity

1:20

was wrong. In an instant, he became what

1:23

he was. In

1:26

an instant, he became what

1:28

is known as an unidentified

1:30

living person. Over the

1:32

past decade, Paul has been digging for

1:34

answers, seeking his true identity, and connecting

1:37

the dots to find the whole truth.

1:39

And he joins us today to share

1:41

his remarkable story. I'm

1:43

Raquel O'Brien, and this is Unfiltered. Paul,

1:51

firstly, thank you so much for

1:53

joining me today. Now, I know you've

1:55

shared your story on many different occasions

1:58

and platforms, including the two books. that

2:00

you've authored, True Identity, and The

2:02

Foundling. So today, I'd like you

2:05

to begin from the point of

2:07

which you are most comfortable in

2:09

sharing. All right, first, thanks for

2:11

having me on Unfiltered. I love this show. It's

2:14

one of the, probably the best. Probably

2:16

the best place to start would be the beginning, when

2:19

I was 10 years old and everything changed. Tell

2:21

me about that fateful day leading up to

2:24

Christmas. Okay, so it's Chicago

2:26

time, 1974. I

2:29

was 10 years old, and I was snooping around

2:31

the house looking for Christmas presents, because, you know,

2:33

every child wants to know what they're getting before

2:35

they get it. It's just the way we are

2:37

as kids. So I looked around

2:39

the house, and I figured the only place they could

2:42

hide any presents would be in the crawl space downstairs.

2:44

My mom was upstairs in the kitchen, so

2:47

I moved the couch, and I opened the

2:49

crawl space door, and I looked inside, and

2:51

I thought, if they have any presents

2:53

at all, they've gotta be in here. So

2:55

I turned on the light, and I low crawled towards

2:57

the very back of the crawl space, and I saw

3:00

about four or five boxes. I

3:02

thought, this is it, this is the big score. Loads

3:05

of presents. Loads of presents, right?

3:07

This is it, Christmas came early.

3:10

So I start opening the boxes, and I'm like, I

3:13

see cards, newspaper headlines.

3:16

I'm like, this isn't Christmas, these aren't

3:18

presents. So I started looking at

3:20

the newspaper articles, and they were headlines. Sad

3:23

City drags on for Missing Kidnapped Child.

3:26

A hunter drags on, 10,000 people looking for

3:28

this baby. I'm all

3:30

kidnapping, and I see a picture of my mom and

3:32

dad, and they look really sad

3:34

and distraught. And then

3:36

I see Paul Joseph Franzek kidnapped from

3:38

Michael Rees Hospital. I was

3:41

like, wait a minute, Paul Joseph Franzek,

3:43

that's me. I was

3:45

kidnapped. So like any 10-year-old,

3:47

I was excited. I grabbed one of the clippings, and

3:50

I ran upstairs to my mom. I said, mama,

3:52

what's this, what's this about? And

3:54

she turned around, looked at me, and her face got all

3:56

red. And she said, how dare you

3:58

snoop around the house. those aren't your things.

4:01

But I said, mom, this is about me, right?

4:04

Was I kidnapped? And did I get

4:06

returned home as well? I mean, I got

4:08

kidnapped and I got returned home to you

4:10

guys as well. There was a happy ending.

4:12

Yeah, all those things are going through my head. And

4:15

she looked at me and she said, she

4:17

probably realized I wasn't gonna just go away. So

4:20

she said, you were kidnapped. We found

4:22

you, we love you. We'll

4:25

never talk about it again. And

4:27

I was just like, I was deflated. But

4:30

what my parents said, that was it. So

4:33

I knew that we wouldn't talk about it again. But

4:35

I never, ever forgot. And

4:37

that's how I walked away. And

4:39

so you're telling me that over the

4:42

years, you kept reflecting back on that

4:44

day that you found those clippings. Did

4:46

the thought recur to you over the years? It

4:48

was funny, I moved probably 100 times in my

4:50

life. And the only

4:53

thing I've kept with me are a bunch of

4:55

those clippings. I still have them.

4:58

Back then, I didn't realize what an impact

5:00

that would have on my life. But

5:02

that one event set a course in

5:05

my life that has always been unfolding

5:07

up to the point we are today. That

5:10

you keep discovering more and more

5:12

and more. Before we get to

5:14

all of what led to you

5:16

discovering all sorts

5:18

of things about your true identity,

5:22

what was life growing up for

5:24

you as a kid in the Franz

5:26

Zek household? Okay, first of all, I

5:29

wanna say the Franz Zek's are probably the best parents

5:31

in the world. They were

5:33

just amazing. They raised me, they raised Dave.

5:36

It was just really good parents. On

5:39

the other side, I was highly,

5:41

highly over protected. With

5:43

good reason, their child was kidnapped. So

5:47

when all the other kids were playing out past the street

5:49

lights coming on, I had to be home. My

5:51

parents never wanted me to talk to people. You know, like

5:54

if I did not have to use my last name, don't

5:56

use it because it always bring back a

5:58

possibility of reporters coming around again. because

6:01

once Paul was returned, every

6:03

year reporters would come around, like on the

6:05

anniversary of the kidnapping in April 27, and

6:08

they would just hound my parents. So

6:10

they didn't want that to happen again. So at

6:13

any cost, don't let anybody know who you are. On

6:16

that point, I think it's really important

6:18

for anyone who hasn't come across your

6:20

story yet to give a bit of

6:22

background about the case

6:24

of how Paul Franzek came to be

6:26

missing and kidnapped in the first place.

6:29

Okay, so Doris Franzek gave birth to Paul

6:32

Franzek in April 26, 1964 in Michael

6:34

Rees Hospital in

6:36

Chicago. On April 27, in the

6:38

morning, someone dressed like a nurse

6:41

came in to visit Mrs. Franzek's room, told

6:44

her that the doctor needed to see the baby while

6:46

she was feeding. So Mrs.

6:48

Franzek handed the baby over, and that nurse

6:51

walked out of the hospital, jumped in the cab,

6:53

and was gone forever with that baby. And

6:56

how do you tie into that? You

6:59

show up somewhere else a few years later.

7:02

So I was found abandoned outside

7:04

of McCrory's Variety Store on

7:06

July 2, 1965 in Newark, New Jersey.

7:09

I was placed in the foster care system. I

7:12

was living with a family of Fred and

7:15

the Eckerds. They ran probably

7:17

the number one foster home in

7:19

that area. And Amy Scott

7:21

McKinley, they had baptized me, and I was living with

7:23

them, and they had thoughts of adopting

7:25

me because they wanted to keep me. After

7:28

about a year of living there, the FBI

7:30

shows up and says that I'm the kidnapped

7:32

child, Paul Franzek from Chicago. It

7:34

was all based on the shape of my ear. Out

7:37

of 10,000 other boys, I was the

7:39

only one that they couldn't disqualify, and

7:41

it being Paul Franzek. So based on

7:43

that alone, I think the heat was

7:45

so hot on this case, they really

7:47

wanted to close it. The FBI, local

7:50

law enforcement, so they contacted the Franzek's

7:52

and said, we think we have your

7:54

kidnapped child. I was going to pick

7:56

you up on that point because of course I

7:58

read your book, The Foundling, And you

8:00

get the sense when you're explaining the events

8:02

leading up to that day that you

8:05

were taken to the Adoption Bureau office

8:07

to meet Dora and Chester Franzak. There

8:10

were a few question marks surrounding

8:13

that specific day as well.

8:15

Can you share a little bit about that? So

8:17

pretty much back then in the

8:19

60s, the FBI were known as probably

8:21

the top authority. So

8:24

the FBI is telling Dora and

8:26

Chester Franzak that Scott McKinley is

8:28

Paul Franzak. My parents were

8:30

asked to drive from Chicago to New

8:32

Jersey. They were put in

8:35

a room with reporters right outside and they

8:37

were given like 10 minutes to make up

8:39

their mind on whether this child was

8:41

actually their son. My mom

8:43

said that the whole world was watching. And

8:45

what was she going to say? No, that's not

8:47

my son. And then I

8:49

always wonder, was that really

8:51

Paul and have this child be placed back

8:53

in the system? Or yeah,

8:56

you know what? That's my son because

8:58

I very well could have been. So

9:00

they said, yeah, that's Paul. And

9:03

in your book, you say you

9:05

follow that realization with a really

9:07

thought provoking contemplation. I'm quoting you

9:10

here. When Dora claimed

9:12

me as hers, she was

9:14

voluntarily accepting a lifetime of

9:16

questioning herself. Gave

9:19

me pause because

9:21

I hadn't considered it until

9:24

you presented that perspective.

9:28

And it's true to this day. I was

9:30

just in Chicago talking with my mom

9:32

and she still told me that they

9:34

really didn't know, but they want

9:37

to do the right thing. And in

9:39

their hearts, they really wanted me to

9:41

be Paul. Of course. But deep, deep

9:43

down, did they know

9:45

that you weren't or not? They

9:48

didn't know. I mean, because so much time

9:50

had passed. I mean, my mom, I'll

9:53

use that term, was

9:55

basically always spent maybe

9:57

a half an hour total with Paul.

10:00

years earlier. That's an

10:02

excellent point. How, I

10:04

mean children change so much. My daughter has

10:06

changed in the last eight months. She's grown

10:08

like six inches. So imagine

10:11

a baby in a couple of years, how much

10:14

they change. You know, how could you

10:16

possibly know? Before we get

10:18

into your adult life, you mentioned

10:20

that you've lived in over a

10:22

hundred different places. I know in

10:25

your late teens, your love for

10:27

music wound you up in

10:29

Las Vegas. A little backstory please. So

10:32

actually I was in bands since I

10:34

was 14. We always had garage bands

10:36

and Okilon growing up. And

10:39

I had an opportunity to join this band

10:41

when I turned 18 from Tucson. My

10:44

parents wanted me to go to college. I was all

10:46

set to go. I got in this band. So we're

10:48

sitting around dinner and I said, hey I'm gonna go

10:50

to Tucson. And they said, what?

10:53

I joined this

10:55

band. I'm gonna move to Tucson, Arizona. It

10:57

didn't go over very well. But

10:59

that's how I left home to be in a

11:01

band. And it's taken me all

11:03

over, which is really cool. And

11:06

then I went back and forth from Arizona

11:08

to Chicago. And then I ended

11:10

up in Las Vegas. I've been here

11:12

since 1995 off and on. Incredible.

11:14

You also got into acting. Yes.

11:17

I've been doing that since I don't know, 1998 I think.

11:21

What I'm interested in is I, you know,

11:23

when I traveled for the first time, it really

11:26

enabled me to explore parts

11:29

of my identity that I wasn't able to

11:31

explore when I was living in my home

11:33

environment. I'm wondering how that was for you.

11:35

It was the first time you were outside

11:37

of your family environment where you mentioned it

11:40

was quite overprotective and then you're in Las

11:42

Vegas. Well, when I first left home,

11:44

I moved to Tucson. So I

11:46

went from a very staunch

11:49

Catholic family, very strict,

11:52

to living in a house with other bandmates

11:54

in Tucson, Arizona. So to

11:56

say that we were wild is putting

11:58

it mildly. There was no rules. It

12:01

was amazing. You know, you're in a rock and roll

12:03

band. And that's, I mean, you

12:06

can fill in all the blanks. It was a lot of fun. And

12:09

then going again back to Chicago and

12:11

then back to Las Vegas, where everything

12:13

closes in Oakland around 10 o'clock at

12:16

night, and in Las Vegas nothing ever

12:18

closes. So it's a

12:20

huge difference, right? Exactly. And back

12:22

to that question of what parts of

12:24

your identity were you able to explore

12:27

in this coming into who you

12:29

are, this evolution of self

12:31

that happens? I was able

12:33

to really just focus on

12:36

music and not worrying about rules.

12:40

The family dinner at five and all

12:42

those things. Because we pretty much

12:44

just did whatever we wanted to do. If we

12:47

were practicing, we practiced, if we had a show, we'd do a show. If

12:50

we went on the road, we went on the road.

12:52

It just, it was great. It's

12:54

just pretty much every day you write the story

12:57

that you want. You do. You

12:59

also fall in love. At least

13:01

once, yeah. Let's

13:04

jump now to 2009. You

13:07

mentioned your daughter, Emma, who's grown, did you

13:10

say five, six, seven inches in the

13:12

past six months? She's actually,

13:14

I think, taller than me today. And

13:16

how old is she now? So

13:18

2009, Emma was born. It's

13:22

a life-ordering moment for the obvious

13:24

reasons, but it also activates a

13:26

desire to investigate your

13:29

own identity. Tell me about

13:31

it. Having Emma, the doctors

13:33

always ask you what your medical history is.

13:36

And I always spotted off what I was told. And

13:39

for the longest time, it's really bothered me,

13:41

you know, am I really Paul? But

13:44

I had no way to really know because

13:46

DNA kits weren't available. It wasn't really a

13:48

big thing unless you were in some crime

13:50

database or something. You've done something wrong. So

13:54

finally, the doctor asked me again

13:56

and I looked at Michelle,

13:59

my ex-wife. I said, what

14:01

if I'm not Paul? Am

14:03

I doing an injustice to our daughter or to

14:05

you or to myself? Medical history,

14:08

all these things. I've got

14:10

to find out. After

14:12

saying that, in a short time after,

14:15

I was able to actually find out. It was

14:17

amazing. If we could jump now to

14:19

2012, Paul

14:21

Franzak meets DNA testing.

14:24

So I'm in a CVS drugstore

14:26

and I happen to see an

14:28

identi-gene paternity test. It was like

14:30

25 bucks. I

14:33

was like, I can afford that. Because before

14:35

the DNA tests were hundreds and hundreds of dollars.

14:37

So I bought one and I put it in

14:39

the closet and I thought, next time

14:41

my parents come out to see Emma and hang out with

14:43

us, I'm going to find a way

14:45

to have them test with me. So

14:48

a short time after I bought that, they came out. They

14:50

were out here for about two weeks and I

14:53

love my parents, and I didn't know how to bring it up. So

14:55

I got down to about an hour before they were going to, I

14:57

was going to take them back to the airport and

15:00

I just blurted it out. Hey, mom, did you ever really

15:02

wonder if I was really your son? She's

15:05

like, yeah, I guess we thought about it. I'm

15:08

like, what if we had a way to find out? Would

15:10

you want to do it? She's

15:13

like, possibly. So I

15:15

ran to the closet, brought out of the

15:17

DNA test and within three minutes, we're all

15:19

swabbing away. I know I

15:21

caught him off guard. It was probably

15:23

a little devious. It

15:25

really was, but I really wanted to know

15:28

the truth. So after we

15:30

did it, I was so happy

15:32

inside. I'm like, I have the

15:34

way to find out the truth right now in this little box. They

15:37

didn't say a word to me. I took them back

15:39

to the airport. It's maybe a 15-minute ride. I

15:42

like it took about six hours. Didn't

15:44

say a word. Drop them off,

15:47

they get to Chicago. A couple hours later,

15:49

I get a phone call. Pick it

15:51

up. My mom said, don't do it.

15:53

Don't mail it in. We don't want to

15:55

know. You're our son. That

15:58

was it. To be. clear,

16:01

was that the first time

16:03

you'd spoken to your parents

16:06

about the possibility of you

16:08

not being their biological son

16:11

after the conversation that you had when you were

16:13

10 years old? Absolutely. Oh

16:16

my gosh. My parents said we

16:18

won't talk about it, so we didn't talk about it.

16:20

You know, me and my ex-wife Michelle, we joked a

16:22

lot about my parents would come out and visit us,

16:24

about getting hairs off their pillow, and

16:26

maybe sending them in for testing to find

16:29

out, you know? But that wasn't really available

16:31

to a regular person, a civilian, you know?

16:33

But I was always in the back of my mind,

16:35

because I really wanted to know the truth. If

16:38

you think about it, the chance of

16:40

me being a kidnapped child found

16:43

in New Jersey a couple

16:45

years later, really, what are

16:47

the chances, right? Slim. Slim

16:49

to none, yeah. So you get

16:52

the results back, and you

16:54

decide, well, first, how

16:56

did you react to the results? I was at

16:58

work at my desk. My cell

17:00

phone rang, and I answered it, and

17:02

it says, this is a denti gene. We need to

17:04

ask you some security questions. So

17:06

I answered all the questions, and then

17:09

the guy very dryly said, there's no

17:11

remote possibility that you're the son of

17:13

Doran Chester Franzak. You're not Paul

17:15

Franzak. Even though I knew it, I

17:18

knew it in my heart for the

17:20

longest time. Once you hear those words,

17:23

and you know it's real, I felt

17:25

the color drain from my face. I got

17:28

all sweaty, and I started thinking, everything I

17:30

thought about myself was a lie.

17:33

Am I really Polish? Am

17:36

I really a Taurus? All

17:38

these things that I was raised to believe, but

17:41

to be honest with you, I always knew I wasn't a Taurus. You

17:44

knew? Well, you don't like

17:46

the comforts of home and eating good meals? I

17:49

didn't have the anger stubbornness that a Taurus

17:52

has. Oh, good point.

17:54

Good point. Bullheaded. Even

17:56

though your parents had told you they

17:58

didn't want to know the results. results because in their

18:01

minds you were their son and that was

18:03

it. You did decide to tell

18:05

them. I had to. So

18:07

once I found out that I wasn't really Paul,

18:10

all I wanted to do, I had one mission. I

18:13

wanted to find out what happened to their kidnapped

18:15

child. Cause my parents gave

18:18

me the greatest gift, an amazing life. They're

18:20

amazing parents. This horrible tragic

18:22

thing happened to them that was never

18:24

solved. So I thought I

18:27

could just find their son. You

18:29

know, to me that would be like the best payback

18:31

I could give them. Unfiltered

18:34

will be back shortly. Thank you for

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your biological identity. I

20:29

never thought about it. I really didn't think

20:31

about it. So it was a Saturday

20:33

morning and I thought the best way to

20:36

try to solve this mystery would be

20:38

to use the media. And

20:40

the only guy I thought of was George

20:42

Knapp from KLAS TV here in Las Vegas.

20:45

He's an old school reporter, the

20:47

coolest guy. He's won numerous Peabody

20:50

Awards. He cracked Area 51, paranormal

20:54

conspiracies. He's a co-host on Coast

20:56

to Coast AM, one of my

20:58

favorite radio shows. So

21:00

I sent him a

21:02

three sentence email. I said,

21:04

this is my situation. What do you

21:06

think? He got back to me in 15

21:09

minutes. I want to meet you. So

21:11

that following Monday, I went to their

21:13

studio. We talked. He's like, we got

21:15

to do a story on this. We got to solve this. And

21:18

after we're talking for a while, he looks at me and he said,

21:21

by the way, don't you want to know who you are? And

21:23

I'm like, I guess. I really didn't think

21:26

about it. I just want to find their kidnapped child.

21:28

So we started putting together a segment. And

21:31

right before we finished it, he looked at me and he said,

21:33

you better tell your parents because

21:35

when this goes out, it's going to be

21:37

a shitstorm. And you don't

21:39

want your parents finding out by

21:41

watching TV. And he was right. How

21:44

did you present the truth to your parents? So

21:48

that was a little tricky for me. My parents were

21:50

both up in age, a little hard of hearing. I

21:53

knew if I told them over the phone,

21:55

they would only hear what they wanted to hear. They

21:57

would probably miss most of it. and

22:00

not process it. So I wrote an email.

22:03

I just sat down and it just flowed out of me.

22:06

I just poured my heart out. This is

22:08

the situation. I love you guys. I want

22:10

to find your son and I want to

22:12

do this with you and

22:14

on this journey together. And that's

22:16

what I sent them. But in

22:18

your mind, was that going

22:20

to go well? I thought

22:22

it's going to be beautiful. They're going to

22:24

understand it. They're going to say, yes,

22:26

we want to do this journey together with you. Let's

22:29

find our kidnapped child together. It

22:32

can go over that. Not at all. Not at

22:34

all like I thought. What happened?

22:37

Well, first, I didn't hear anything for about a day. And

22:40

the story is going to air in a couple of days. Finally,

22:43

my phone rings because my mom screaming

22:45

at me. How dare you do this

22:47

to us? We told you not to

22:49

do this. You're not happy with us.

22:51

You're looking for better parents. My

22:54

dad gets on the phone. My dad never

22:56

cusses. He said one thing to me. You're

22:59

an asshole. And you're sitting

23:01

there thinking, what the fuck

23:03

just happened? What the fuck?

23:05

Yeah. But

23:08

I will tell you, in all honesty, I

23:10

never had any regrets or second thoughts ever

23:13

because I only want to live the truth. But

23:16

not live in the truth. You're living a lie. And

23:18

you mentioned that the story was going

23:20

to air a few days later after

23:23

your parents contacted you. Did you

23:25

speak again until the show? We

23:28

didn't talk for, I'm going to say, about

23:30

a year. That must have been hard.

23:32

Yeah, it was terrible. It wasn't what I expected,

23:34

you know, because I mean, I

23:37

was embarking on something that was new territory for

23:39

me. I just wanted to

23:41

find the truth. And I just wanted to help

23:43

find their kidnapped child. You know,

23:45

and what's funny is everyone said, don't waste your time.

23:47

It's been so many years. You're not going to find

23:49

anything. Just let it go. Really

23:52

surprises me. Yeah. I

23:54

mean, because I never entered my mind. I

23:56

had a mission and I was determined to

23:59

solve that mission. No matter what. Contrary

24:01

to what people said, this is

24:03

the moment where the momentum really

24:05

starts picking up. I

24:07

know that a real key figure in

24:10

this was American genealogist,

24:12

Cece Moore. She

24:14

gets in contact with you, I believe,

24:16

after the airing of the show. Right.

24:19

So I did a 2020 with Barbara Walters

24:22

and George and I set up George Knapp.

24:24

We set up this website, you know, a

24:26

Facebook page who was Paul Franzak. People

24:29

could write in tips, information,

24:31

suggestions, or just comments, whatever.

24:33

Because we were determined to solve this mystery.

24:36

After I did the 2020, tips started flying

24:39

in. And then I did

24:41

an episode of Coast to Coast AM with George and

24:43

Cece Moore heard that and she reached out and said,

24:45

Oh my God, I'm getting into

24:47

this. I have a team of DNA soccer

24:49

moms and this is what we do. Because

24:52

it was 2012. That was just getting

24:54

started. You know, Ancestry was, you

24:56

know, starting to grow a little bit. But

24:59

everyone, it wasn't, it wasn't like, it wasn't

25:01

part of your conversation that everyone has now.

25:03

So she reached out. She said, I'd love to help you on

25:05

this. You know, pro bono. Let's find out who you are. Let's

25:07

try to find Paul. I said, great.

25:10

Let's do it. Which answer came first? Well,

25:14

I found out who I was. So we started

25:16

this at the very end of 2012, 2013. I

25:19

thought this is how naive I was. I thought

25:21

we'd, you know, a couple of weeks, we'll get

25:23

the answers. It'll be great. It took

25:25

years. We didn't find out who I was till 2015.

25:29

How did that information come about? What

25:31

was the first breadcrumb in cracking

25:33

the case? So when I first did Ancestry, I

25:35

had no matches for a couple of months. Talk

25:38

about being abandoned. You put your

25:40

DNA out on the website and you get no

25:42

matches. Right? It's not

25:44

going to be a self-confidence. So

25:47

eventually I had a match. I had a second

25:49

cousin, third cousin, Alan Fish. I'm

25:51

like, oh my God, this is amazing. It

25:53

turns out that Alan's children gave him

25:55

a DNA test to help him find

25:57

his family because he was adopted. He

26:00

was adopted as well. That was adopted.

26:03

So he and I talked and we're like, oh my

26:05

God, let's solve this. You know, I'm

26:07

like, who's your family? He goes, I don't know. I'm

26:10

like, I don't know my family. So we had

26:12

each other and that was it. So

26:14

we thought, okay, together, we can

26:16

help solve this mystery. So we're all

26:19

set to go to New York because he lived in New York

26:21

upstate. I was going to fly to New York and we're going

26:23

to meet. A couple of days before we're

26:25

supposed to meet, he wakes up not feeling

26:27

so well. Chest pains. So he

26:29

goes to the hospital for a checkup. He's telling

26:31

everybody to hurry up at the tests because he's going

26:33

to meet his real family. Right? He dies.

26:38

Absolutely tragic. The story of your

26:40

life is filled with incredible highs

26:42

and incredible lows. You know, you

26:44

have these breakthroughs and then all

26:47

of a sudden something

26:49

like this happens. The highest

26:51

peaks in the darkest valleys. And so

26:53

once Alan transitioned,

26:55

what then did you

26:57

do? So thankfully,

27:00

with the help of 2020 and other

27:02

people, we were able to get his

27:04

adoption file opened. His

27:06

mom was listed, but no father. I

27:09

started having more matches on my family tree.

27:11

We had a third cousin and a fourth

27:13

cousin. And one of

27:15

my cousins remembered getting an oral history of

27:17

the family through her grandfather. She

27:20

remembers something about

27:23

the name of the high school where

27:25

Alan's mom was from. At

27:28

the same high school, I had a second cousin,

27:30

Lenny. So Cece

27:32

Moore and her team reached out to Lenny, DNA

27:34

test. Lenny was

27:36

Alan's father. Lenny, of course,

27:38

had a little fling when he was like 16 or so,

27:40

17. And

27:44

he never knew that she was pregnant and she

27:46

had Alan. So he never knew. And

27:49

it's a really bittersweet for Lenny because

27:51

he found out that he had a grandson after

27:54

he passed away. No. Yeah,

27:56

it was tragic all around. point

28:00

of meeting Lenny, I'm trying

28:02

to figure out how you

28:05

discover that your biological identity

28:07

is Jack Rosenthal. So

28:09

thankfully meeting Lenny and then C.C. Moore

28:12

and her team built a tree and

28:14

they started going through all the family, both

28:17

sides. Turns out that

28:19

Lenny's first cousin Gilbert had

28:21

twins, Jack and a Jill. But

28:25

Gilbert was my dad. So you

28:27

find out that you're can simultaneously

28:29

you find out you have a

28:31

twin sister Jill which raises another

28:34

huge question mark, where is my

28:36

twin sister Jill? So

28:39

I started out trying to find the real Paul and

28:41

maybe find out who I was. The very

28:43

second I found out my true identity, I was

28:46

hit with your Jack and by the

28:48

way you had a twin sister Jill

28:50

and she's missing. Mind blowing. You also,

28:53

do you find out then that you have

28:55

two older siblings as well? Yeah, I found

28:57

out that I had two older sisters and a

28:59

younger brother. Two older sisters and

29:01

a younger brother and are you able to get in

29:03

contact with them at that time? It

29:05

took a while and it took a lot

29:08

of going back and forth. I was able to meet

29:10

my older sister. My in between sister

29:12

passed away. I got to meet my

29:14

older sister and I got to talk an email with

29:16

my younger brother. But

29:18

after a little conversation

29:20

with them, they kind of just said, we want

29:22

nothing to do with this. They just shut the

29:24

door on me. Did you have any

29:27

idea or suspicions as

29:29

to why they didn't want to

29:31

have anything to do with you?

29:33

Well, I have a lot of a lot of ideas, but

29:36

I can't get into those right now. But

29:39

you can use your imagination. Yes,

29:41

I mean you

29:44

do also, I don't

29:46

know when this comes in the story, but

29:48

you get to meet up with a

29:51

lady who babysat you for a short

29:53

period of time back when you were

29:55

still living in the

29:58

Rosenthal household. What were you? you

30:00

able to discover about

30:02

the first two years of your life? So

30:05

I discovered, well, before I even I was

30:07

able to meet the babysitter, I've heard stories

30:10

about how Jill and I were treated. We

30:12

were definitely neglected, abused, not

30:15

treated very well at all. But when

30:17

I got to meet the babysitter who watched us

30:19

for one night, she was

30:21

a junior or senior in high

30:24

school. When I met her a few years ago,

30:27

it's like it just happened. All

30:29

the emotions and everything that

30:32

she felt was still there. It

30:35

just impacted her so, so

30:38

heavily at the nightmare that she

30:40

went through. The night that she found Jill and I,

30:43

my parents were going out. She babysat

30:45

the neighbors. My mom

30:47

leaned over the fence and said, can you watch my two

30:50

daughters for a night? So

30:52

she came over to watch the two daughters. My

30:56

parents were leaving. I said, don't worry about

30:58

the twins upstairs. They're totally

31:00

fine. So she heard twins.

31:03

All she ever saw were the two other girls playing

31:05

outside. My parents left. She ran

31:07

upstairs to look in the bedroom. Darken

31:10

bedroom, smell, no food,

31:13

no water, dirty sheets, dirty

31:16

diapers. Jill and I were in

31:18

separate cages. She didn't

31:20

even say clay pens in a

31:22

dark room. I had a black eye

31:24

and she said that Jill

31:26

was just staring at her and I was

31:28

kind of cowering, but we didn't make any

31:31

sound the whole night. So she called

31:33

her sister over to take care of the other kids. And

31:35

she took care of Jack and Jill the whole night. She

31:38

did confront your parents about it. Did she

31:40

not? My parents came over the next morning

31:43

and she said, by the way, the twins are fine. I took

31:45

care of them. My mom said, I

31:47

told you not to go upstairs. You

31:49

don't listen very well. Started screaming at her. She

31:52

said that she ran out of the house and she never

31:54

looked back. Shortly after

31:56

that time, the twins were gone. And

31:58

that's when you're found. abandoned

32:02

at the front of a

32:04

storefront and Jill disappears. What

32:08

can you share with us about

32:10

the discoveries you've been making in

32:12

your quest to find your missing

32:15

twin sister Jill? Are

32:17

you under the impression that she is out there and

32:19

you are going to find her? So when

32:21

I first started this, the stories I heard

32:24

were that one of the twins seemed to

32:26

be a little weaker and fragile and

32:28

perhaps something bad happened to one of

32:30

them. So when I

32:32

first started this journey I was afraid that

32:34

maybe Jill had died. That's why my parents

32:36

got rid of me because they couldn't explain one

32:39

twin hanging around the house. But

32:41

since then I've changed my whole way

32:43

of thinking. I believe she's alive and

32:46

I can't get into too much right now because

32:48

working at something really big and it's

32:51

going to come out really soon. Can't

32:53

wait. Oh, I love

32:55

this journey. But I really believe

32:57

that she's alive and she has no idea who

32:59

she is. What methods are

33:01

you using to find Jill?

33:04

Is it online? Is it

33:06

campaigning to raise awareness? Is

33:09

it the use of psychics? I don't know if

33:11

you've ever tried psychics as alternative forms

33:14

of finding answers. Okay,

33:16

so I'm an ex-filer guy, right? Yes,

33:19

I know I'm looking at the tattoo. So

33:21

I believe in psychics. I've

33:24

talked to numerous psychics and they all say

33:26

the same thing. She's alive.

33:28

They had no idea who I was. Right?

33:32

That's very promising. I'm

33:34

also working with NACMEC, the National Center for

33:36

Missing and Exploited Children. There's a

33:39

whole story with that that I can't

33:41

get into right now. But it's actually

33:44

it's in my book True Identity. It

33:46

gets really in depth about what happened with that

33:48

whole opening the case. NACMEC

33:51

has a great campaign. They have an age

33:53

progression photo of what Jill could possibly look

33:55

like. And to be

33:57

honest with you, they're really good because the age

33:59

progression... photo of the real Paul

34:02

was pretty much spot on on how the real

34:04

Paul looked when we found him. Tell me

34:06

about how you found the real Paul. That

34:08

was, there was a

34:10

member Watergate, they had

34:13

a deep throat. Deep throat was the

34:15

informant, right, undercover informant that would tell

34:18

the information. I had a tipster.

34:21

This tipster was close to the

34:23

story, reached out and said, I think

34:25

I found the real Paul. So

34:27

that person would give me little tips and I would follow

34:30

up on him and then give me a little more. I

34:32

would follow up a little more. And we ended

34:34

up using one of my mom's

34:36

enormous cousins as kind of

34:39

bait on 23andMe. Had

34:41

a match and that turned out

34:43

to be the daughters of the real

34:45

Paul. And the real Paul

34:48

match has brothers to Dave who was also

34:50

on 23andMe. Absolutely

34:52

fascinating. What were

34:54

you able to find out about

34:56

what happened to Paul from the

34:59

point he was kidnapped? So he ended up

35:01

being in a small town only a few

35:03

hours from Chicago. That's where

35:05

he was raised. It's funny,

35:07

it's, you know, everyone said when

35:09

I started this don't waste your time, you'll never find

35:11

them, especially alive. And

35:14

I always said, no, we're going to find

35:16

this guy and I'm going to give him his birth certificate

35:18

and I'm going to claim mine because I

35:20

had both. And sure enough, we

35:22

found him alive. But once again, you

35:24

know, it's always with this journey,

35:26

it's always one step forward, two steps back,

35:29

right? The same time that

35:31

he finds out he's the real Paul, he's

35:33

diagnosed with a very aggressive cancer. Oh,

35:36

he has a few months to live.

35:38

And your parents are unable to meet

35:40

him? Double whammy. Diagnosed

35:42

with cancer and then COVID hit our

35:44

country. And of course, everything got shut

35:46

down. The reason I

35:48

started this was for one reason. And my

35:51

parents reunite with their kidnapped child. I

35:55

was able to accomplish that. My

35:57

mom was able to speak with him numerous times.

36:00

and she got to say goodbye to him before he

36:02

passed away. And to me, I didn't

36:04

have to meet him. I didn't care about

36:07

any of that. I just wanted my mom to

36:09

have closure on the kidnapping. The

36:12

whole journey was worth it for that

36:14

one thing. When you were

36:16

able to give your mom closure

36:19

for the kidnapping, what

36:21

was your perspective or perception

36:24

of how that helped her

36:26

in her own healing? I'll

36:28

summit like this. My mom, who

36:31

never wanted to do anything, or

36:33

listen to this or talk about it, this

36:35

whole event, she told me, she

36:37

said, you know what? Because of

36:39

you starting this, we were able

36:42

to find my kidnapped child. But

36:44

you're my Paul. You're

36:47

my son. I

36:49

was like, wow, that was like the heaviest

36:51

thing I could have ever heard. That is

36:53

so beautiful. I'm getting emotional. Yeah, my

36:55

mom's an amazing woman. You've obviously accrued

36:58

so much wisdom relating

37:00

to self-discovery, truth-telling, and

37:02

identity. Can you please

37:04

share some of those drops of

37:07

wisdom with us? I'll

37:09

tell you, you know, you have to knock on

37:11

doors. You've got to find

37:13

your truths. If you think something's not right

37:15

in your life, something's not true,

37:18

it doesn't matter. To me, you've got

37:20

to do it. If you

37:22

think something's a lie, you've got to find

37:24

the truth. I think the

37:26

biggest problem in our lives is that if something's

37:28

not true, we make up things in our head.

37:31

And those things that you make up, that's what really

37:34

hurts you because you don't know. You

37:36

know, you can ruminate, and it can

37:38

make it worse and worse. But once you know

37:40

the truth, no matter how bad it might be,

37:42

at least you know it's the truth. You

37:45

can take that and then start healing and

37:47

moving forward and processing it instead

37:50

of making up all these things in your head that aren't true. People

37:53

ask me how to get started, what to do on their

37:55

journeys. Just start, you

37:58

know, start knocking on doors. calling,

38:00

talking to people, don't

38:02

take no for an answer. And don't let someone tell

38:04

you that you won't find answers,

38:06

because if you work hard enough, you're gonna find

38:09

something. Beautifully said. Last

38:11

thought, what would you like your legacy

38:14

to be? Okay, so

38:16

I'm starting a podcast called The

38:18

Franzac Files. And basically, we're

38:20

gonna tell my whole story inside and

38:22

out and we're also gonna help

38:25

people that have identity issues. Maybe they don't know

38:27

who they are. Something's not right

38:29

in their background and they're afraid to get started.

38:32

So I want my legacy to be that I've

38:34

done everything I could to help

38:36

anyone that would like help. And

38:39

also, I want my daughter to really, really

38:42

appreciate the family that she has,

38:45

you know, through my film and my books.

38:48

And to just, you know, never be afraid

38:50

to seek the truth. Because

38:53

the truth is out there. We

38:55

just have to find it. Thank

38:58

you so much for joining us for this week's

39:00

episode of Unfiltered. To follow

39:02

Paul's ever-evolving journey and quest

39:04

to find his missing twin sister, Jill, please

39:07

check out the links we've included in our show notes.

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