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Slows. mintmobile.com. Welcome

1:02

back to Bon Tom. I'm Kristen Bauer.

1:04

I'm Debra Ann Wohl. We're back hosting

1:06

a new season of Truist Blood, the

1:08

official True Blood podcast. We interview, cast

1:11

and crew reminisce about favorite moments and

1:13

dive into how the show got made.

1:15

Rewatch the HBO original True Blood on

1:17

Mac, subscribe and listen wherever you get

1:19

your podcasts. The

1:25

following podcast contains explicit language and

1:27

content that may not be suitable

1:29

for all listeners. Attorney

1:37

and victim's advocate, John Ray, held

1:39

a symposium on the Long Island

1:41

serial killer case and it stirred

1:43

up controversy. I mean,

1:45

either you have an alibi or you don't. And

1:48

he raised some interesting points. We

1:51

don't know when these women

1:53

died. We know when they

1:55

disappeared. But

1:58

the big reveal involves someone. very

2:00

familiar to this story. She's

2:02

absolutely certain it was James Burke. And

2:05

we talked to a source who connects

2:08

him to Rex Heurman. We

2:10

found him in news and the first thing I did to

2:12

my boyfriend was, oh shit that's

2:14

the hunter. From

2:30

I.D. and Joke Productions, this

2:32

is Unraveled. Long

2:35

Island Serial Killer. On

2:49

January 30, 2024,

2:52

John Ray, attorney for the Shannon Gilbert

2:54

estate, and arguably one of the loudest

2:56

voices for justice in the case of

2:58

the Long Island Serial Killer, hosted

3:00

a symposium at St. John University

3:03

on Long Island. The

3:05

purpose, as he told me, was

3:07

to lay out his case. The evidence

3:09

he's gathered, not piecemeal, but

3:11

in one sitting. The event

3:14

lasted almost four hours and he still

3:16

wasn't able to cover everything. As

3:25

expected, a big chunk of the information was

3:28

in regards to Shannon Gilbert, which is something

3:30

we'll explore in a future episode because there

3:32

are a lot of new pieces we haven't

3:34

yet covered here. But

3:36

this episode will focus on the largest bombshell

3:38

to come out of the event. A

3:41

possible connection between James Burke,

3:43

the disgraced former Suffolk County

3:45

Chief of Police, who's

3:47

been alleged to have slow rolled Long Island

3:50

Serial Killer investigation, and Rex

3:52

Heurman. The

3:54

man who stands accused of four murders

3:56

associated with that investigation. The

3:59

connection. between them can mean anything, but

4:02

it's a first step in a

4:04

direction toward the point that

4:06

they're acting in common regarding

4:08

sex workers. If you haven't

4:10

listened to our earlier episodes on James Burke,

4:12

please make sure to do so as

4:15

it will help make sense of what we'll be covering.

4:18

Later, we'll also share an interview I

4:20

conducted with an independent source whose

4:23

story not only bolsters that

4:25

potential Burke-Hewerman connection, but brings

4:27

insight into the dark pervasive

4:29

attitudes toward sex workers that permeated

4:31

Long Island life. But

4:34

first, there was something else Donray presented

4:36

at the symposium that caused quite a

4:38

stir. Never a stranger

4:40

to controversy, this time he involved

4:42

Asa Elarepp, wife of Rex Hewerman,

4:45

and their children. New evidence meantime could

4:47

be coming today the Gilgo Beach murder

4:49

case. An attorney represents the family of

4:51

the victims, planning to reveal the

4:54

details on that. We have five bombshells from

4:56

the event hosted by an attorney for

4:58

some of the Gilgo Beach victims. The

5:01

accusations that John Ray

5:03

has been praising recently

5:06

in a symposium was Asa Elarepp

5:08

in town or out of town

5:10

does her alibi in fact stand

5:12

up that she was not there

5:14

when her husband allegedly committed these

5:16

crimes. And according to John Ray,

5:18

there's a whole lot more to this story

5:20

than we're aware of. In

5:25

fact, John Ray's statement travels at the

5:27

speed of light all over the world,

5:29

prompting Vess Metheve, the attorney for the

5:31

Hewerman children, to give the following quote

5:33

to the US sun. Quote,

5:35

I guess in America anyone can

5:37

say anything about anyone, but rambling,

5:40

unhinged and inflammatory statements are especially dangerous

5:42

because it endangers the health, safety and

5:44

welfare of people who want nothing to

5:46

do with any of this except to

5:49

move on with our lives. End quote.

6:00

for the murder of Maureen Brainard Barnes,

6:02

which we covered in our last episode. D.A.

6:05

Tierney stated that travel and cell

6:07

phone records reveal that Asa Ellerup

6:09

and the kids were out of

6:12

the state during the time periods

6:14

Melissa Bartholomew, Meghan Waterman, and Amberlynn

6:16

Costello all went missing. The

6:18

disappearance of Maureen Brainard Barnes occurred

6:20

a full three years before the

6:22

Gilgo Four were found along Ocean

6:24

Parkway. And it looks like

6:26

perhaps there wasn't any cell phone evidence to

6:28

prove where Asa Ellerup and the kids were

6:30

at that time. But there

6:32

was a bank statement recovered from Rex

6:35

Uerman's storage unit after his arrest. And

6:38

it showed the family took a trip to Atlantic

6:40

City during that time, the month of July in

6:45

This is important. You don't want to miss

6:47

this. The big date

6:49

to remember is July 9th, 2007. Once

6:53

the last time Maureen Brainard Barnes was heard

6:55

from, we've established that

6:57

the Uerman family owned in vacation

6:59

at timeshares. And the bank

7:01

statement shows three hotel stays, which were

7:03

timeshare hotels about a week each, during

7:05

July of 2007. The

7:08

bank statement shows a transaction at the flagship

7:10

hotel on July 14th in the amount of

7:12

$37.45 posted to the account on July 17th.

7:19

The statement also lists the words, quote,

7:22

arrival date, July 6th, 2007, end quote.

7:26

July 6th would be before Maureen

7:29

Brainard Barnes was seen or heard from.

7:32

This bank statement and an alleged interview

7:34

between Asa Ellerup and investigators corroborating

7:36

that she was in fact in

7:38

Atlantic City at that time, led

7:40

district attorney Ray Tierney to state the

7:42

following. We

7:45

had checked into a hotel in Atlantic

7:48

City July 6th of 2007, and they

7:51

remain there until approximately July 20th of 2007. And

7:55

both the documentary evidence as well

7:57

as witness statements have indicated that

8:00

during the time of Maureen Brainerd's

8:02

barn's disappearance on

8:05

or about July 9th of 2007, Yurman

8:08

was not with his family. He joined

8:10

them sometime thereafter. So

8:12

what's John Ray's problem with this? Why

8:15

did this become an issue? Well,

8:17

in the press conference, Ray Tierney committed to

8:19

the family checking into the hotel on July

8:21

6th. In the actual bail

8:23

document filed with the court, the writing

8:25

is less certain. Quote, Mrs.

8:28

Ellerup and her two children stayed in

8:30

Atlantic City, New Jersey from on or

8:32

about July 6th, 2007 through on or about

8:34

July 20th, 2007. End

8:38

quote. Here's what John Ray told me.

8:41

As soon as I looked at that evidence, I said, wait,

8:43

let me read this a little more carefully. He

8:46

said they were gone on or

8:48

about. That's the phrase he used.

8:51

On or about July 6th and came

8:53

back on or about July 20th. Now

8:56

when you're dealing with pleadings where

9:00

you want to cover yourself in case you're wrong about

9:02

the exact date, you say so and

9:04

so crashed his car on or

9:06

about blank, whatever date. It's

9:09

a standard attorney phrase for

9:12

pleadings which are fungible. It's

9:14

not a standard attorney phrase for alibis.

9:17

I mean, either you have an alibi

9:19

or you don't. It's not on

9:21

or about. On or about takes away

9:23

the alibi. So I said, let's call

9:25

the hotel and ask them what these things mean. So

9:29

I, with three witnesses who were working on the

9:31

case with me, called the

9:33

hotel. We finally got the

9:35

hotel manager. I said, can you just

9:37

tell me, do you have any records that

9:39

go back to 2007? She said,

9:41

yeah, of course we do. I

9:44

said, can you look and see

9:46

what the actual check in time

9:48

was for these people? Sure. So

9:50

she went back. I said, look up,

9:53

please Rex Horeman. She looked everywhere.

9:55

She said, no, he's not in this, not

9:57

there. So, okay, can you

9:59

look for. Elorip, the

10:01

name Elorip. She goes,

10:03

oh yeah, here it is right here.

10:05

It's Asa. She called it Asa. It's

10:08

Asa Elorip. She read off the

10:11

bill and she read the exact amount of

10:14

the bill just as it was sitting in front

10:16

of us from Tierney's filing. And it

10:18

said, check-in date was

10:21

July 17th, 2007. And check-out

10:23

date was July 23rd. We took it through

10:25

the whole process

10:29

twice to make sure that what we

10:32

had was right. Now

10:35

this conversation, if accurate, is concerning

10:37

for many reasons, not the least

10:39

of which is the hotel sharing

10:41

this information with anyone other than

10:43

law enforcement. On

10:46

January 31st, the day

10:48

after the John Ray Symposium, Vess

10:50

Metheve, the attorney for the Heuermann

10:52

Children, sent a letter to the

10:54

Flobship Hotel and its parent company,

10:56

demanding to see workers, call

10:58

logs, the name of the

11:00

hotel manager, and a clear understanding of

11:02

the company's privacy policies. He

11:05

maintains that his clients were out of town

11:08

and questions the validity of John Ray's statement.

11:11

To be fair, if this new information

11:13

is correct with a check-in date of July

11:15

17th, then the July 14th transaction of 3745

11:17

still requires explanation. There doesn't

11:23

seem to be a clear, simple timeline

11:25

here. But the other

11:27

reason this is a big deal is

11:29

that prosecutors stated, quote, based

11:31

on the foregoing, the murders of all

11:33

four victims occurred at times when defendant

11:35

Heuermann's wife and children were traveling out

11:37

of state, which allowed defendant

11:39

Heuermann on fetter time to execute his

11:41

plans for each victim without any fear

11:44

that his family would uncover his involvement

11:46

in these crimes, end quote. As

11:48

John Ray points out, It's a

11:51

hell of a lot easier to go forward with

11:53

his trials on the evidence they have

11:55

against him by isolating him

11:57

and his cases. and

12:00

thereby discarding people who are not crucial

12:02

to their proving his guilt. But

12:05

because Asa Ellerup corroborated to investigators the

12:07

bank statement with its post of Atlantic

12:09

City arrival date on July 6, 2007,

12:13

if that date turns out not to be correct,

12:16

then John Ray says we have a problem. You

12:19

have to draw the reasonable

12:21

inference that she's lying

12:24

to the district attorney. Of

12:29

course, it could also be that she was simply

12:31

mistaken about the dates. After all,

12:33

all of this occurred almost 17 years ago. The

12:37

investigators are painting a pretty clear picture

12:39

with travel records, including passport stamps in

12:41

and out of the country, as

12:43

well as cell phone records for the other,

12:45

later three, Gilgo 4 murders. It's

12:48

not a stretch to assume that Asa and the

12:50

kids were also out of town at the time

12:52

Maureen Brainerd Barnes disappeared. Whether that bank statement

12:54

turns out to be a solid piece

12:56

of evidence or not, but

12:59

John Ray makes another point that we haven't

13:01

really discussed. We

13:03

don't know when these

13:05

women died. We know when

13:07

they disappeared. And

13:09

so one says, okay, well, then why

13:12

shouldn't you assume it's reasonable that they

13:14

died when they disappeared? Okay, but that's

13:16

not proven. Look, Corbin

13:18

indulges in torture pornos. Apparently, that's

13:20

what he gets off on. Now,

13:23

if he's a torturer, you don't torture

13:25

dead people. You can only torture

13:27

live people. And that's where you get

13:29

your pleasure. So you have to keep them

13:32

alive. If he likes it that

13:34

much, maybe he keeps them alive for a while.

13:38

If the reasonable possibility that they

13:40

did not die when they

13:43

disappeared, then we don't know the

13:45

real parameters of the

13:47

alibi. That's

13:49

a scary but factual thought. The

13:52

remains were found long after they were

13:54

placed along the ocean Parkway and exposed to

13:56

the elements for a long period of time.

13:59

It is. awful that forensics could pinpoint an

14:01

exact time or even exact date of

14:04

death. But when it comes to

14:06

Asa, many believe that while she may have

14:08

been aware of her husband's sexual proclivities, that

14:11

doesn't necessarily mean that she was

14:13

aware of any more nefarious behavior.

14:16

Core documents show that investigators watched

14:18

Rex Heuerman and his family for over

14:20

a year. If Asa or

14:22

the kids showed any signs of being more

14:24

involved, would the district attorney go

14:26

out of his way to state their innocence? John

14:29

Ray, though, feels like the matter hasn't

14:32

been thoroughly investigated. I think that

14:34

if they had other things that ruled

14:36

out the mother and the children, they

14:38

would have come forward with them and said so

14:40

in that application. There's one innocent

14:42

explanation, and there are many guilty explanations.

14:45

How about they investigate and stop trying to

14:47

cover up these people? So

14:51

about four weeks since my revelation

14:53

at the symposium about the

14:55

hotel, where are the deniers? It

14:58

was Ntew and Macedonia both who said they

15:00

were going to get the information to show

15:02

I was a liar. Four weeks

15:04

have gone by, nothing. And why

15:07

is the DA silent on it? We'll

15:09

surely hear more about this in the weeks to come.

15:12

We also reached out to Vesemative directly

15:14

and have not heard back from his office. Of

15:19

course, the John Ray revelation that caught

15:21

all of our attention was

15:23

the affidavit he presented from an

15:25

Alice Poe. For her

15:27

request, her identity has been withheld from the

15:30

public. Her story is

15:32

the first public alleged connection between

15:34

Rex Euremin and James Burke. The

15:37

two men whose names will be forever connected

15:40

to the case of the Long Island serial

15:42

killer. She

15:44

indicates that when she

15:46

was a girl of about 18 years old

15:49

and had dropped out of high school, she

15:52

was living at a motel in Patchogue.

15:54

And she was befriended by a sex

15:56

worker who had a baby and the

15:58

sex worker convinced her to go. to

16:00

a party in a room,

16:02

not a bedroom, but in a room

16:05

at that motel. She

16:07

went to the party and

16:09

in the party were all these men

16:11

and the sex worker eventually left. The

16:14

girl got really scared. She was

16:16

there all by herself. And the reason she got scared was

16:18

that there was a

16:20

man who was a police man and

16:22

he was happily lighting a crack pipe

16:25

and in a ritualistic sort of way,

16:27

he had the men line up

16:29

and they come up to him and take

16:32

a hit of the crack and

16:34

then the next guy would step up and so on. And

16:38

he was enjoying himself. She's

16:40

absolutely certain it was James Burke. And

16:43

this went on for some time, but

16:45

she didn't want to be there. And she

16:47

went outside on the pretension that she was

16:49

going to smoke a cigarette. The men had

16:51

continued to go in and out, standing out

16:53

there leaning against the wall in the fashion

16:55

that his back was up against the wall

16:57

and his legs were extended at a 45

16:59

degree angle. So you

17:01

couldn't see his true height. Was a

17:03

very large man and it

17:05

turned out to be Herman. He and

17:07

the men were looking at a fancy car

17:10

that had come. She

17:12

talked to this guy and he, you

17:14

know, he seemed friendly and nice and

17:16

then everything shifted and changed

17:18

and he put his arm around her and

17:21

tried to hold her firmly and guide her

17:23

away from the

17:25

car and over towards the

17:27

building. And she had to talk away fast. She

17:30

told him that she had to go get her cigarettes at her

17:32

room, which is right there. And she'd

17:34

be right back and he let her go. By

17:37

the way, you might say, Oh, that doesn't sound like him.

17:39

That's exactly him because I have many

17:41

other, several other statements who said

17:43

the same thing that he let them go.

17:46

He didn't kill everybody that he had sex with. He

17:48

had sex with hundreds and hundreds of people. So

17:51

this is not a surprise, but she

17:53

was so intimidated by him. She went in that

17:55

and locked her door and then somebody came and

17:57

knocked on her door twice and she didn't answer.

18:00

And that's the end of her story. But

18:03

it does connect, if she's right,

18:05

Burke and Hooriman. As

18:07

we've covered in the early episodes of

18:09

this podcast, James Burke has been found

18:11

by the Suffolk County Police Department's internal

18:14

affairs to have had a relationship with

18:16

a sex worker engaging in sexual acts

18:18

in his police vehicle while on duty.

18:21

And during his sentencing for civil rights

18:23

violations and obstruction of justice, his history

18:26

with sex workers and drugs came to

18:28

light in the courtroom. Burke

18:30

has a predilection for sex workers. I

18:33

represented one of them. She

18:36

described how at a

18:38

place, a house that he seemed to have

18:40

control of in Ronkunkkama, he

18:44

would take her regularly where they would

18:46

smoke crack together. So the crack

18:48

piece fits in quite with this other girl

18:51

who didn't know what I just told you. What

18:55

John Ray didn't know then is that

18:57

I've been communicating with an independent source

18:59

whose story has many similarities. This

19:02

source and I connected before the symposium.

19:05

Her story, next. Normally,

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19:35

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19:37

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19:39

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19:42

Health Protector Ryan Reynolds here for Mint Mobile.

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22:57

January 15th, we've received an email

22:59

to the Unraveled Tip Line Gmail

23:01

account. It stated, quote, I

23:04

don't know if this is nothing, but I also don't

23:06

know if it's something, end quote. The

23:09

email was from a female, worried about

23:12

her name being exposed. Not

23:14

sure if what she had experienced was worth

23:16

sharing. Quote, I don't think I'm

23:18

going to be much help considering he's in jail,

23:20

end quote. She was referring

23:22

to Rex Uriman. I've

23:25

interviewed quite a few women who had

23:27

strange or disturbing experiences with Rex Uriman.

23:29

But what made this email stand out

23:32

is she also referenced James Burke.

23:35

Quote, I also know Burke, end

23:37

quote. I reached out and

23:39

started building some trust and vetting her stories.

23:42

We're keeping her name anonymous per her

23:44

request. This is her

23:46

story from when she lived on Long Island. I

23:49

went away to school and I

23:51

had moved back. I just

23:53

went to a bar in town

23:56

and saw these people I graduated high

23:58

school with and like, oh my God. We all

24:00

started reconnecting that night. They

24:02

were all still in town. It's

24:04

only spring of 2009? That

24:07

point it was like 2010 already. This

24:09

is before we even knew there was a Long

24:11

Island serial killer because those revelations were made in

24:13

the winter of 2010. It

24:16

started because I had this one friend

24:18

who, growing up, his dad

24:20

had a lawnmower company. My

24:22

friend was selling drugs, like a lot of drugs, all

24:25

over Long Island, like all over the country. He'd go to

24:27

many places. He was just like

24:29

not a nice kid, but I kind of

24:32

fell into that whole weird, I guess, group.

24:35

I went to this party and it was just like

24:37

the sales of like old people, you know? The older

24:39

people in us. I wasn't even 20 yet. I

24:42

was still 19. Can you explain

24:44

how and why you guys ended up these

24:46

parties with these older people? My

24:49

friend's dad would always be at these parties. I don't

24:51

know if he's friends with them or how he friends

24:53

with them or if it was just through like the

24:55

limo company. He had all

24:57

these friends and my friend would get

24:59

called because he had the

25:01

younger friends. He had like the drugs. We

25:04

would roll up and he had

25:06

a bunch of drugs. I have an exchange

25:08

of like drugs, alcohol,

25:11

people. It was weird. Talk

25:13

about when you started to realize that there

25:15

was a cop at some of these parties

25:17

and when you realized who

25:20

his name was, how often it was, just

25:22

anything you can remember letting you back. I

25:25

remember seeing him before knowing

25:28

who he was. The

25:32

day I found out who he was exactly, someone

25:36

walked in and said, oh, that guy

25:38

Jimmy Burke, the police was here and

25:40

I got nervous because I'm like, what?

25:43

Like the cops are here? And

25:45

then my friend was like, no, no, no. Like,

25:49

it's okay. Don't worry about it. Do you know who

25:51

I am? Like, we're all good. We don't have anything

25:53

to worry about. So to be clear, Burke,

25:56

having been there at these parties, what...

26:00

I would have had some idea about

26:02

the drug use involved at the

26:04

parties and your

26:06

friend dealing drugs among

26:08

the party. Like this

26:10

would have been something Burke would

26:12

have had to be aware of if he was there.

26:15

A thousand percent. Like if he was not something that

26:17

was like hidden. So what was

26:19

your impression of James Burke before you realized he

26:21

was a cop? He

26:23

was really personable. He was

26:26

like a long-eyed guy. You know, he could literally talk to

26:28

anyone. He knows everyone. He's

26:30

very personable. And I didn't have like

26:32

in-depth conversations with him that much. He

26:35

seemed friendly enough to

26:37

like be comfortable around

26:40

him. Did you think it was

26:42

weird, your friend's relationship with this cop? Yeah,

26:44

I mean, I thought it was weird, but I thought it was

26:47

like kind of cool, I guess, that

26:49

we didn't have to worry. You've got

26:51

to admit like the thought of that as a 19,

26:53

20, 21 year old, like I can

26:55

do that and you feel like this is, oh, this

26:57

is like exciting. There's a

26:59

particular interaction with James Burke that she

27:01

recalls that still haunts her today. At

27:04

least one night we were at one

27:06

of the parties and you know, like Burke,

27:08

he was just like making conversations with everyone

27:10

emotionally and gave me a pipe. Before

27:13

I even could say no to the pipe, we

27:15

offered like my friend's dad was like, no, no,

27:17

not these kids. I guess that was

27:20

like, why is some police

27:22

officer doing this? And my

27:24

friend's dad is the one telling you to like not

27:26

do something stupid. You

27:28

know what kind of drugs they were doing that night? Cooking

27:31

crack for sure. They all were

27:34

like a bunch of them were. It wasn't like

27:36

a hidden thing. They didn't try

27:38

to hide it. Nobody tried to hide it

27:40

ever. So whoever was smoking out of this

27:42

pipe, you believe they were smoking crack? Yeah,

27:46

yeah, 100%. As

27:48

with John Ray's witness and the

27:50

previous former sex worker he represented,

27:52

crack is a reoccurring drug in

27:54

these personal testimonies. Our

27:56

source also places James Burke at a

27:59

very specific location. a strip

28:01

club called the Oasis in

28:03

Smictown, Long Island. He

28:05

was going to Oasis on time and birth was 100% there. I

28:09

know very clear in my mind

28:12

for sure. And like nothing crazy

28:14

happened those nights when he was there and I

28:16

was there. I think

28:19

a picture goes on in that place all the time. And

28:22

like 15 girls that you can see like dancing and stuff

28:24

would end up being there if somebody started living. So

28:26

the Oasis, if you have to explain it is

28:28

someone who's never been there. The look, the vibe,

28:30

like how would you describe it? What is it

28:32

like in there? Okay,

28:35

yeah, it's this

28:37

little building. It looks like a

28:39

house. It looks like somebody's home. The

28:42

only mansion in the front is for men. Like if girls are

28:44

there and I have to leave the bathroom, you have to hopefully

28:48

like one of the dancers who

28:50

are you there. Like it's a sketchy

28:52

place. Hold

28:54

on, I need to take some water. I'm like, I don't know,

28:57

I can feel like I would shame around myself. I

28:59

don't know. Like such a weird position

29:01

in my life. You know, like it's just weird to like

29:03

look back on. Their

29:06

whole lives are so grown down

29:08

to just like what they did

29:10

for like their bodies and away. And

29:12

it's like, I don't know, just makes

29:15

me uncomfortable in the fact that these girls

29:18

had to go through that and he

29:21

meant the advantage of like the situations

29:23

that they were in and their bodies

29:25

and their like, you know, how naive

29:27

we all were really young. Like no

29:30

grown woman wants to be around those people. No

29:32

grown woman wants to be in that situation. And

29:34

like it hurts to know that like even

29:37

though, thank God,

29:39

nothing happened to

29:41

me ever. Like I was around this shit

29:45

that anything sort of gone terribly

29:48

wrong. I don't trust any of

29:50

these people anymore. So like, I

29:52

hope they're all okay. But like I have no

29:54

way of knowing. I do it because anyone, does

29:56

anyone have any way of knowing if they're okay

29:59

at this point? I'd

30:01

like to take a moment to talk about the Oasis and

30:03

the women who work there. The

30:07

Oasis Gentlemen's Club had operated under a

30:09

few different names since its launch in

30:12

1979 and took up some prime real estate

30:14

next to the Smithtown Bull, which is a statue

30:16

at the fork of the Jericho Turnpike,

30:19

a historical landmark of a metal

30:21

bull named Whiffer. From the

30:23

outside, the Oasis looks like a

30:25

nondescript building. There is brick, there

30:27

is siding, and an unpaved parking

30:30

lot. According to some reviews we

30:32

found online, the place was quote, pretty good. A

30:34

little pricey though for a lap dance. $60 for

30:36

10 minutes, $100 for 15 minutes, and $175 for

30:38

30, end quote. Another

30:44

reviewer said quote, I've been hanging out

30:46

at the Oasis for the past 10 years

30:48

now and it's both my Smithtown's best top

30:50

secret. Oasis House is some of

30:53

the most beautiful girls on Long Island. Not

30:55

to mention the droves of Russian girls they

30:57

get from Brooklyn, end quote. The

30:59

township of Smithtown purchased the Oasis in 2021 for

31:02

the price of $815,000. Residents

31:06

apparently were sick of it. The

31:09

purchase received unanimous support from the

31:11

town board. But those in

31:13

the adult entertainment industry claim that the

31:15

owner was forced to sell or be

31:17

subject to eminent domain claim, with the

31:19

city taking this land no matter what.

31:22

Here's the thing. I lived in

31:24

Smithtown throughout my entire childhood and drove

31:27

by the Oasis every day on my

31:29

way to high school. Growing

31:31

up it was elusive to me. But

31:34

my high school guy friends would crop jokes about wanting

31:36

to go there when they turned 18. I

31:39

called one of those friends to see if he could

31:41

tell me what the Oasis was actually like. Tell

31:45

me all about Oasis. Security

31:47

was always pretty tight. Like

31:50

even as adults, they were

31:52

very hard on IDs. And

31:54

then you'd get inside and it would be

31:57

like basically empty. The

31:59

girls. were like, strung out, drug

32:01

addict, white girls, but

32:03

there would be a lot of them that

32:06

were like, from Russia or like some sort

32:08

of Soviet country. As far

32:10

as like, clientele goes, it

32:12

was definitely a mixed bag.

32:14

Like I said, there's never that many

32:17

people there, but it was

32:19

usually like, seedy old white dudes.

32:22

In fairness, any time I was there was like,

32:24

the end of the night. Like it was,

32:27

I was never there for like, normal prom

32:29

time drinking hours. When you walk

32:32

in, is it like there's a bar? It

32:34

looks like a house. Like it's a very

32:36

unassuming place to be a strip club. If

32:38

you're looking at the front of the house, the

32:41

entrance is on

32:43

the right hand side. There's a parking lot

32:45

and like the side door is

32:48

the entryway to the club. When

32:50

that door opens, you

32:52

enter and the stage is directly to

32:55

your right. So you like walk past

32:57

the stage to get to the bar

32:59

and the bar was on the like

33:01

opposite wall. If you turn to your

33:03

left, there's all like seating. And then

33:05

across the room that way,

33:08

is like the room where you would get like a lap

33:10

dance. How big was it? Like how many people

33:12

did it look like could fit in there? The

33:14

whole thing was maybe a

33:17

thousand square feet. There's like the size of

33:19

like, a decent size apartment.

33:21

There definitely were like other rooms

33:23

that I think there was like

33:25

an upstairs of some sorts. That

33:27

was like the office. I never

33:30

went back there. I do remember

33:32

like people coming and going up

33:35

a staircase in the back, but like I have no idea

33:37

what was up there. Next,

33:41

we get back to our source and

33:44

the alleged interaction between James Burke and

33:46

Rex Heurman that she witnessed. The

33:59

source meant a few. years in her late

34:01

teens, early 20s, on the Long Island

34:03

party scene. A friend of

34:05

hers brought her to these parties, frequented

34:08

by older participants, including

34:10

James Burke and also

34:12

Rex Huerman. I

34:14

asked her what she thought when she saw the

34:17

news of his arrest for the Gilgo IV murders.

34:21

We saw them in the news and the first thing

34:23

I said to my boyfriend was, oh shit, that's the

34:25

hunter. So my friend that I

34:27

was speaking of, well, all the guys, they all

34:29

loved hunting and they would go

34:31

upstate, they would go all over and

34:34

go on these hunting trips and it would be gone for like

34:36

four or five, six days at a time. To

34:39

clarify, the same group of men

34:41

that were friends with your friend's

34:44

dad, the same group of men at this party,

34:46

they were just a group of hunters. Yeah,

34:48

I don't know if they were, but yeah, definitely.

34:51

My friend, his dad, two of

34:54

his friends that were always at the party for

34:56

hunters, they always went hunting together

34:58

and then other people, they would

35:00

talk about that. You saw

35:02

the picture in the news. You go, oh my God, that's

35:04

the hunter. So explain how you

35:06

knew that he was the hunter. When did

35:08

that nickname come into use? One

35:10

of the first parties that we

35:12

went to, Rex was

35:15

there for sure and I know this

35:17

because my friend's

35:20

dad introduced us all

35:23

to him. And then my

35:25

friend said, oh, we go hunting. He

35:27

looks like he would go hunting, Rex. I

35:30

don't know, he just looks like our bear. He

35:32

wasn't mean or anything. He hadn't said

35:35

anything mean. He was a huge man

35:37

and a scary man at that

35:39

and I don't know, he was just like

35:41

a hunter in my mind. So you

35:44

met Rex through your

35:47

friend's dad and you met Burke through

35:50

your friend's dad. Did those

35:53

two, Burke and Rex, end

35:55

up at the same parties per your recollection?

35:58

So there was one. I

36:01

know for sure. They were just like talking

36:03

like in the distance. I wasn't paying

36:05

attention to like they were just casually talking

36:07

in the distance. They have an exchange and

36:09

it wasn't like it was a negative one

36:11

or like nothing. It just looks they said

36:13

words and then they like notion to each

36:15

other like knotted heads and then like walked

36:17

away from each other. And I

36:20

don't remember what else happened like you know, like the

36:23

party just kept going and nobody wasn't like a

36:25

big day. That's like what I know for sure.

36:27

I know other nights where just Rex was there

36:29

at that point because you

36:31

know like I didn't say hi to him but like

36:33

I would be like oh there's Hunter like okay that

36:36

means it's like you would associate him with like oh

36:38

this group of people must be there like be here

36:40

tonight you know like whoever these guys were. And then

36:43

he just started to become the hunter.

36:45

Is that because like when your friend's dad introduced

36:47

you to Rex like he's like that's my hunting

36:49

buddy or something? Yeah something like somebody

36:51

like we go hunting together or this is my hunting

36:53

friend and then like I just called

36:55

him the hunter never knew his face like

36:58

I was like no

37:00

never that. I don't know I just maybe

37:02

because I wasn't good at names when I was younger

37:04

like everyone when I would meet them like had like

37:06

an association and that was his. When

37:09

you saw Rex's face on the news how did

37:11

you know for sure that it was the hunter?

37:14

You just like don't forget that

37:16

face and like I had seen him enough times

37:18

to know like once I saw the face I

37:20

was like oh shit like that's my

37:23

friend's dad's friend like that's this like once I you

37:25

know once I put it was like like

37:27

oh my god that's this guy. After

37:30

a couple years in this party scene the

37:32

fun the excitement she seemed to have had

37:34

worn off and she tells

37:36

us the last time she ever attended one of

37:39

these parties. To the last

37:41

time like I ever went to a party

37:43

Rex was at that night. Was

37:46

that like a house my friend was already

37:48

like taking some drugs so it

37:50

was like already weird and when we

37:53

get to this house it was like

37:55

a much smaller group of people. It was

37:57

like in the colder months maybe like a fall. We're

38:00

all getting messed up, we're all drinking, whatever,

38:02

and you can see it's like nobody else is

38:04

coming to this party. Nobody else

38:06

is coming around, there's nobody like catching them like, hey,

38:09

where are you at? Like

38:11

nothing. So it was like weird. And

38:13

there was this one girl who was

38:16

there and like, definitely wasn't from New York because

38:18

she had an accent. And

38:21

she told something like, bless your heart, like, what

38:23

are you guys doing here? She was a little

38:25

bit older than us, like mid 20s, maybe.

38:29

I remember like Rex's like

38:31

laser focus on her and I only know

38:33

that for sure because there was like not

38:35

that many people there. All of

38:37

a sudden you've had like a clatter and this

38:39

girl comes out of the room and she's like,

38:42

like, looks scared or like annoyed,

38:45

mostly scared. A little while later,

38:47

like 45 minutes, an hour

38:49

goes by and you just hear

38:51

like a blood curdling scream.

38:54

And like, she's like, no,

38:56

no, absolutely no. Please no.

38:59

She came out of the room and she

39:02

looked terrified. She just sat there

39:04

on the couch and she like didn't move. Nothing.

39:08

All her arms were crossed and she was scared. And

39:11

I couldn't find my friend at that point. And

39:14

I'm like, what's going on? Are you okay? And one of

39:16

the older guys was like, Dylan, I need to like shut

39:18

up. Like none of my business is on

39:20

my business. Why she's creating? She's

39:22

not talking. She's not answering. It

39:24

was like, I'm bugging out my friend. He was with

39:27

some girl somewhere and I like, I

39:29

just was uncomfortable. I was like sitting on a

39:31

couch, this old guy yelling at me to mind

39:33

my own business. Like, and I just

39:35

like couldn't be there anymore. I called my

39:38

friend who had like no ties to these

39:40

people whatsoever from when I would know like

39:42

that, like from a different hand and they

39:45

came and like picked me up as I'm waiting for them. It

39:48

was like 30 minutes until they were going to get there. My friend finally

39:50

comes out and was like, you okay? Like, what are you doing? I'm like,

39:52

I'm just going to go home. I'm really tired. Like

39:54

I'll call you tomorrow. like

40:00

that. Like nobody opened the door like this guy don't

40:02

want me to show up. She's fine. She said she's

40:04

fine. I walk away, walk away, walk away. I was

40:06

like, oh my god, I gotta get the fuck out

40:08

of here. I'm like, I just never, I

40:11

never went back. These are just not people I

40:13

want in my life. So

40:17

that was like the final straw for you. Yeah.

40:20

I felt very alone.

40:22

I felt in danger. Like I truly did.

40:24

I, all the, all the times I was

40:27

partying with them. Like I never felt

40:29

the need to leave. Like no matter what,

40:31

I felt really just like nobody was going

40:33

to care if anything happened to

40:35

me either. Like something obviously happened to her.

40:37

So I was like, I just gotta get

40:40

out of there. I feel really trapped. Like

40:42

I'm fucked if anything happens. Like I'm fucked.

40:44

I'm alone. I was like alone. Her

40:49

story gives a unique insider

40:51

perspective into these parties while

40:53

also lining up with previous

40:55

witness statements, whether

40:57

Rex Huerman and James Burke were anything more

40:59

than two men who may have traveled in

41:01

the same circles. We don't know. I did

41:05

ask John Ray if the Oasis gentleman's

41:07

club ever showed up in his investigation

41:09

and here's what he had to say. The

41:12

Oasis club in Smith town,

41:14

your hometown was notorious. It's

41:16

closed now, but it

41:18

was a notorious center of

41:21

sexual perversion. I remember that

41:23

it was a off limits place. You

41:25

wouldn't go there unless you were into that kind of

41:27

stuff. Everybody knew it. Everybody

41:29

knew what it was. In fact,

41:32

there was a raid upon the

41:34

Oasis conducted by the fire department

41:36

and the local police. After the

41:38

raid took place, they got hit

41:40

with a bunch of fire violations

41:42

and safety violations, not with any

41:44

criminal arrests because there was no

41:46

law that they could think of

41:49

that they were violating with the sex. But there

41:51

was a list of 140 people who were

41:53

there, 140, many of whom were very prominent

42:00

that list we've asked for by

42:02

way of a FOIL and they've refused it to us so far.

42:05

FOIL stands for Freedom of Information

42:07

Act, a process with which the

42:09

public and journalists can request government

42:12

documents. We're doing a

42:14

lot of legwork on the OASIS and

42:16

on the people who went there that

42:19

we do know about. The amount of

42:21

time I put in has generated some

42:23

fruit out of the OASIS. I have

42:25

more than I told everybody about

42:28

the OASIS and about the people

42:30

who were there and what they were doing there

42:33

and with whom I have a

42:35

lot of that. There's definitely a girl who

42:37

was a heroin addict who worked there as

42:39

a stripper and she

42:41

disappears and she's found in

42:43

Lakeland, Conchima. For

42:48

me, one of the most disturbing aspects of

42:50

all of this in all of these accounts

42:52

is a lack of respect or care for

42:54

women and sex workers in general. I

42:57

understand that this was before that 2016

42:59

MeToo scandals, but that said, it

43:01

doesn't take a genius to see

43:03

that this pervasive attitude towards women

43:05

not only contributed to the deaths

43:08

of the GILGO4, but may very

43:10

well explain why solving the crime

43:12

didn't become a priority until 2021

43:14

when the task force was formed.

43:18

I had one more question for our source. If

43:20

you could estimate how many people saw Rex,

43:22

Huerman and James Burke together, what would you

43:25

estimate? At least a

43:27

dozen. I know at least a dozen. For

43:30

sure. Before

43:54

we go, there's one last thing I'd like to

43:56

say. We are so grateful for

43:58

the continued support we've had. received from all

44:00

of you over the last nine months. And

44:03

we're excited to announce that in June and July of

44:06

2024, we'll be

44:08

releasing a series of beep dive episodes

44:10

that will be released weekly instead of

44:12

monthly. Get ready for

44:14

more in-depth investigation into all things having

44:16

to do with the Long Island Serial

44:19

Killer case. If you

44:21

have a question, theory, or subject that you'd

44:23

like us to cover, you can email us

44:25

as always at unraveledtips.com. Or

44:29

you can contact me directly on

44:31

Instagram at Alexis Linkletter. Unraveled

44:36

is produced by Joke Productions 4ID. The

44:39

executive producers and writers of this

44:41

podcast are Joke Fincen, Biagio

44:43

Messina, and myself, Alexis Linkletter. Executive

44:46

producer for ID is Annie

44:49

Mangani. Our editor is Kaitlin

44:51

Cleveland. Lisa Rivakoff is our associate producer.

44:53

The music and score that you've heard

44:56

in this podcast is by Biagio Messina.

44:59

Subscribe on Apple Podcasts or

45:01

wherever you get your podcasts. It

45:03

helps a lot when you subscribe, wait and review

45:05

the podcasts that you enjoy listening to. Thank

45:08

you for listening and thank you for your support.

45:11

trust me. I have to continue your journey over and over. Make

45:15

safe. balls Don't

45:28

sharpen from Amazing Kids.

45:37

Bigel057 was kid everything. But that marked one of

45:39

the darkest chapters. On ID

45:41

and stream on Macs.