0:00

Hey, it's Ariel. Today, I want to

0:02

share something new with you. It's the first

0:04

episode of a new podcast from vice

0:06

called Havana syndrome.

0:08

It's hosted by reporters, Adam Entes,

0:11

and John Lee Anderson, as they investigate

0:13

a series of mysterious health incidents

0:16

that started affecting US diplomats and

0:18

spies abroad in late twenty sixteen.

0:21

These debilitating illnesses were first

0:23

reported in Havana Cuba, thus

0:26

the name. But then diplomats

0:28

and spies reported similar symptoms

0:30

all over the world in China, London,

0:32

and even on the grounds of the White

0:34

House. To this day,

0:37

the US government says it doesn't know what

0:39

or who may have caused these illnesses.

0:42

But in this series, Adam and

0:44

John Lee traveled the world, speaking

0:46

to multiple sources who claimed they got

0:48

sick too, as well as government officials

0:50

charged with solving the mystery. And

0:53

they have uncovered some surprising

0:55

new clues that could help us finally

0:57

get an answer. Subscribe

1:00

to Havana syndrome wherever you get your podcast.

1:03

And for a sneak peek, here's

1:05

the first episode. Hey,

1:12

That's me. I

1:16

was figure out here. Something's

1:20

wrong with me. I

1:26

started trying to drive about an hour ago.

1:29

I bought a sense of balance

1:31

and basically

1:35

for the last I'm

1:37

having a stroke or something. I don't

1:42

know how having a hard time talking.

1:46

I can't start feeling.

1:55

It's mid November twenty twenty. And an

1:57

official with the National Security Council,

1:59

who well called John, leaves these voicemails

2:02

for his wife.

2:06

I don't know if you've gotten either of my

2:08

messages, but I

2:12

have had a really hard time of speaking,

2:15

and

2:18

it it really just the line ended.

2:21

As John is leaving work that day,

2:23

something happens. Something

2:26

that to this day, he still can't explain.

2:30

It's around five PM on the grounds

2:32

of the white house. And

2:34

he hears this ringing in his ears. He's

2:37

in pain, but he keeps walking. His

2:41

body goes numb. He's having

2:44

trouble moving his hands and fingers. He's

2:46

panicking. But he's still just

2:48

trying to get home. So

2:52

he makes his way out of the White House gates

2:54

into the park outside, and

2:56

that's where John on collapses, falls

2:59

straight to the ground. Now,

3:05

this is a young guy, late thirties,

3:07

healthy, and here he is outside

3:09

the White House thinking he's gonna die.

3:14

I just I don't wanna worry you,

3:17

but I I'm Somehow

3:22

John gets himself a lift, which takes

3:24

him to the hospital. Any

3:27

doctor rushes over to him, takes

3:29

a look at him and asks, are you on drugs?

3:32

John shakes his head no. Doctors

3:35

find three cell phones on him and

3:37

a White House ID badge A

3:40

few hours pass and John regains

3:42

his speech. The doctors suspect

3:44

he had a massive migraine with aura.

3:47

In other words, a bad

3:49

fucking headache.

3:56

He has no idea what's going

3:57

on. But eventually, a

4:00

possibility presents itself. One

4:02

that even by his own admission is hard to

4:04

imagine. Because

4:06

of his job with the National Security Council,

4:09

he has access to very sensitive

4:11

information. About some

4:13

of the most bizarre health anomalies

4:15

of our time. There

4:18

has been a significant increase

4:20

in reports of health incidents affecting

4:23

US spies and diplomats in

4:25

recent months.

4:27

What John realized was that what

4:29

he experienced is eerily

4:31

similar to the symptoms reported by

4:33

spies and diplomats in

4:34

Cuba, in China, in

4:36

Russia. A range of debilitating

4:39

symptoms, including headaches, nausea,

4:42

vertigo, trouble seeing or

4:43

hearing. So

4:44

he wonders, is that what this

4:46

is?

4:47

Suspected cases have spread across

4:49

more than half a dozen More than a hundred and

4:51

thirty possible cases now reported

4:53

across the globe. He and his colleagues

4:55

begin to think maybe what happened

4:57

to him wasn't a massive

4:58

migraine. Maybe it's

5:01

Ivana syndrome. Some had

5:03

even been diagnosed with traumatic brain

5:05

injuries, but one or a

5:07

move is causing the symptoms is still

5:09

unknown. The first attacks happen

5:11

in Havana Cuba I'm

5:15

Adam Entes, and I'm John

5:17

Leandroson from Vice

5:19

World News. This is of

5:21

Madison.

5:48

Episode one. Get

5:50

off the x. So

5:54

can we just start with when did you first

5:56

hear about Havana syndrome? I'd

5:58

had a coffee with the source and he told me

6:00

something was brewing in

6:01

Havana. But that was a week or two before the

6:03

story broke. So some US government

6:05

personnel who were working at our embassy

6:07

in Havana Cuba They've

6:09

reported some incidents which have

6:11

caused a variety of physical

6:13

symptoms. I'm not gonna Okay. So just to give the

6:15

audience a little background here, about a

6:17

year after the news broke in November

6:19

twenty eighteen, you and John Lee

6:21

Anderson published a story together in the New

6:23

Yorker, which really becomes the definitive

6:25

piece on the mystery of the Havana syndrome.

6:28

How did you all start working together? I

6:30

knew I wanted to do this story. The intelligence

6:32

community in the world of spy craft is

6:34

my wheelhouse. But I had absolutely no

6:36

connections in Cuba at all. So

6:38

I talked to my editor David Remnik

6:40

about it, and he told me to get in touch with

6:42

John Lee. I

6:44

know of no reporter who knows Cuba better

6:46

than John Lee. He lived and

6:48

reported in Cuba for years and

6:50

he wrote the definitive book on the life of

6:52

revolutionary Chegg

6:53

Avera. When Adam called

6:56

me, I was excited at the prospect of

6:58

working on the story. He's

7:00

obviously a phenomenal reporter in his unright.

7:03

Just the year before, he'd won the Pulitzer for

7:05

his reporting on the Russia investigation. I

7:07

thought great. With Adam's background reporting

7:10

on espionage and my knowledge of

7:12

Cuba, it could be fun and we could make a

7:14

great team. When

7:19

we started our reporting on this, what we discovered

7:21

is that there was a severe lack of understanding

7:23

and agreement. Among people within the

7:25

US government as to what the Havana

7:27

syndrome even was. A

7:29

lot of them had their suspicions concerning

7:32

who or what was behind him. But

7:34

didn't know for sure. What

7:36

was clear was that the incidents had huge

7:38

implications. Could

7:40

the US no longer keep its diplomats

7:42

and spies around the world safe.

7:45

But for the longest time, it was impossible

7:47

for me to find a single victim of this mystery

7:49

illness who would talk to us about

7:51

their experience. Until

7:54

I found Audrey. Okay.

8:04

One freaking day. And

8:09

you're just sitting in here in the heat without the

8:11

with the window down. You you just really like the heat

8:13

that much, Adam? But

8:15

it's not nice Southern California to

8:17

So where I mean, where are we? Right now,

8:19

Adam. We are in Roanoke, Virginia,

8:22

and we're heading to the home of

8:24

American diplomat. All the

8:26

calls that we've had have been on the phone.

8:28

This is the first meeting we've had face to

8:30

face. Audrey

8:33

Lee is a pseudonym that we used

8:35

for the article. She didn't even

8:37

tell me her real name. At

8:39

first, she would only talk to me on the

8:41

phone and wouldn't even tell me where

8:43

she was. I didn't

8:45

really know much about her other than she

8:47

was a diplomat, a consular official

8:50

at the US embassy in Nevada from

8:52

two thousand fifteen to two thousand seventeen.

8:54

But the secrecy around

8:56

this story made me question whether

8:58

she really worked for the state department or

9:00

whether she was a

9:01

spy. Hi. Hello.

9:03

I'm sorry. I'm on my own voice.

9:05

And we're we're talking facts and everything. I'm

9:08

sorry, Adam. I'd known her for three

9:10

years before she agreed to meet with

9:12

me. I appreciate it. Oh, yeah. We should we should also

9:14

talk about mains. Along with

9:16

our producer, Jesse Alejandro Castro, what do

9:18

you wanna do?

9:20

So I am in a

9:22

much better place in terms of using my name

9:24

now than I was the last time we

9:25

spoke. So if you want -- Okay. -- we can we

9:28

can go with

9:28

that. And

9:30

that's when Audrey, to my surprise,

9:33

agreed to have us reveal her true

9:35

identity. I'm Tina

9:37

Anifer. I'm a career for service officer with

9:39

the Department of State. Okay.

9:43

So not a spy, but she has a

9:45

very experienced foreign service

9:47

officer. Tina is in her early

9:49

fifties, blonde, super

9:51

friendly, and welcoming, but she's got

9:53

this look about her. Her eyes

9:55

look

9:55

tired. When we meet her, She

9:58

seems almost out of breath. Here,

9:59

see, here we are. That's my husband. He's

10:01

working. He's in the middle of a her work call. He knows

10:03

of it

10:03

right now. So please head on through.

10:05

Oh, wow. In early two thousand seventeen,

10:08

Tina's living with her husband and twelve year old

10:10

twins in a quiet neighborhood in

10:12

Havana Cuba called Cubana

10:14

Khan. It's the neighborhood where many

10:16

foreign diplomats and also the

10:18

spies pretending to be diplomats

10:20

live. It's

10:22

a leafy suburb on the west end of the

10:24

city, lots of villas and comfortable

10:26

houses, and also some mansions

10:28

built in the forties and fifties just

10:30

before the revolution. Tina and

10:32

her family get to stay in an even nicer

10:35

home than some of her colleagues. The

10:37

Cuban police maintained entry booth throughout

10:39

the neighborhood to keep a close eye on

10:41

the foreigners, as well as to keep the

10:43

place secure. There is extra vigilance

10:46

wherever Americans live. And

10:48

so in the second year of her posting,

10:50

Tina and her family are living in this

10:52

big house with a backyard full

10:54

of tropical flowers and mango

10:56

trees.

10:57

This is one of the most troubling interviews

10:59

I've done partly because Tina has

11:01

had health problems for years. And

11:03

even though we'd spoken on the phone and I

11:05

knew she was

11:06

sick, I didn't realize how debilitating her

11:08

condition was. Now if you could

11:10

tell me the story of the event, you

11:12

know, if I remember right, your

11:14

husband was away from business at the time.

11:16

You know, you maybe start the story when you're

11:18

coming home from work.

11:21

Sure. Well, I don't

11:23

remember coming home from work that day unfortunately,

11:26

but I must have come

11:28

home relatively early because I usually did

11:30

when he was gone, just so the kids had

11:32

somebody there. We

11:36

had pasta for dinner. Always

11:39

a a favorite for the kids, and it's

11:41

an easy, lazy mama meal for me

11:44

who my husband isn't

11:45

there. Who's a much better cook than I am. So

11:47

so we had pasta and we had

11:49

already eaten. After

11:50

dinner, the kids go upstairs to play

11:53

and Tina cleans up. So

11:55

it's probably a little bit after

11:57

eight, not a hundred percent sure, but just based

11:59

on where the kids are. Standing

12:02

at the kitchen window, washing the dishes, know

12:04

I'm washing the big pasta box. It's heavy

12:06

in my hands. I can actually feel it when I

12:08

think about it. So the water's

12:10

running, which is the only

12:12

real sound that I can hear.

12:14

Tina is at the sink. The lights are

12:16

on. It's around eight o'clock,

12:18

so it's dark outside. She can't

12:20

see them. But she knows the Cuban police

12:22

are stationed at the guard post in

12:24

front of her neighbor's house.

12:26

And right in

12:28

the midst of that pot

12:30

washing is when

12:32

I felt it.

12:34

I didn't hear anything

12:36

except the water running. The

12:39

sensation that I felt was overwhelming

12:42

sense of inexplicable

12:44

anxiety. There was no reason for it. I

12:47

was not stressed at all.

12:49

And there was

12:52

an incredible pressure and pain

12:55

in my head and my ears.

12:57

I'd never felt anything like

12:59

that before. I felt

13:02

paralyzed. And I

13:04

think it's just of those that you're in a dream

13:06

and you can't move. That's kind of

13:08

how it felt. It

13:12

was the most bizarre feeling. It

13:17

went on

13:21

for who knows how long

13:23

made be a couple of minutes.

13:32

But in the midst of it, in the midst of just standing

13:34

there gripped in all of this

13:37

pain and and anxiety,

13:38

I did remember caring the

13:41

security officer. His voice is

13:43

ringing in my head. Tina's

13:45

now remembering how she had recently

13:47

overheard a security officer

13:49

warning her colleagues that if they

13:51

ever thought something or someone was

13:53

after them, that they should immediately get off

13:55

the ax. Meaning, get away from

13:57

the site, the ax where you

13:59

think you're being

14:00

targeted. St. Get off

14:02

the x. Move to a different

14:04

part of the house, put something between

14:06

you and the source of whatever's trying to

14:08

harm you. As

14:11

soon as I recall those words, I I

14:14

moved and I moved quickly and

14:16

I went into maybe

14:18

fifteen feet into the family

14:20

room, which has kind of oddly angled

14:22

walls. So I put sort of a

14:24

wall and a half between myself and what I

14:26

assumed was the source, which was either kitchen

14:28

window or the open screen door next to the kitchen

14:31

window. And

14:33

all of a sudden, it was it was like a

14:35

a spell have been broken. The anxiety

14:38

went away immediately. The

14:40

pressure reduced as well.

14:45

And I'm just trying to get a hold

14:47

of myself, my thoughts,

14:49

I'm very confused, very disoriented

14:51

still. And In

14:53

the midst of all of that, I remembered that the

14:55

kids were upstairs,

14:57

and I freaked

14:59

out because now all of a

15:01

sudden, I I realized my kids might have just

15:03

gotten hit by that

15:04

thing. She runs

15:06

up the stairs. Turn to my left

15:08

and they're sitting in

15:10

their bedroom on the floor.

15:12

Playing a board game together

15:14

of all things. I

15:17

have never felt such relief

15:19

in my life as

15:21

when I saw them there. And so

15:23

I'm trying to kind of calm down and collect

15:25

myself a little bit, hey, that

15:27

was weird. Did you guys feel

15:29

that? Did you hear anything?

15:31

That was really interesting. Wasn't it? They looked

15:33

at me like I was crazy. They had no idea what I

15:35

was talking about. And I just walked

15:37

down the hall and went into the

15:39

bedroom and I lay down and that was

15:41

it. I I didn't sleep, but

15:43

I also just I couldn't focus on

15:45

anything. I was just

15:48

mentally adrift. The

16:02

next morning, you come down and you're

16:04

fixing breakfast. I was wondering if you can tell me

16:06

about fixing breakfast for the

16:07

kids. Wasn't so much fixing breakfast

16:10

is facilitating. My

16:12

son is

16:14

health obsessed. And

16:17

so I think he was probably trying to

16:19

torment his sister with the ingredients of the

16:21

cereal she was consuming. And he asked me

16:23

if I wouldn't mind reading them off. Day

16:25

before, no problem. I

16:27

was kind of vain about my eyesight because I was,

16:29

you know, in my late forties and I still didn't

16:31

need glasses, I could still read everything just

16:33

fine. And so I would laugh at my

16:35

peers and be like, No glasses

16:37

for me. And he asked me if I would

16:39

read the ingredients on the side of the cereal box.

16:41

Sure. Of course. Took it down. Looked

16:43

at it. Blurry.

16:48

I can't

16:51

read. Any why can't I read anything?

16:53

And I'm moving it around, you know, how older

16:55

people do that when they're trying to

16:57

focus on something closer, further away,

16:59

this way, that way, blinking my eyes,

17:01

adjusting my gaze, adjusting my

17:03

head tilt, nothing. It

17:05

was a blur, absolute

17:07

blur. And

17:10

that was

17:13

when I realized something

17:16

was wrong. There's

17:34

a backstory to what happened in Tina's

17:37

Kitchen, a history here. and

17:39

a half years before that night

17:41

in December two thousand fourteen.

17:43

Good afternoon. Today,

17:46

the United States of America is changing

17:48

its relationship with the people of

17:50

Cuba. President Obama makes a

17:52

surprise televised announcement that he's ordering

17:54

the full rest duration of diplomatic

17:57

ties with Cuba. We will

17:58

end an outdated approach that

18:00

for decades has failed to advance

18:02

our interests. And

18:04

instead, we will begin to normalize relations

18:06

between our two

18:07

countries. At the same time, in

18:10

Havana, on Cuban state television.

18:15

President Rahul Castro informs the

18:17

Cuban people of the news. One of

18:19

the last stand vestiges of the cold

18:21

war is seemingly being pulled down

18:23

in the

18:23

Americas. The

18:24

world learns that the two countries have been engaged

18:27

in secret talks for months.

18:29

And now there are plans to fully reopen the Cuban

18:31

embassy in Washington as well as

18:33

the US embassy in

18:34

Havana. They

18:35

shut the embassy in nineteen sixty

18:38

one, two years after the Cuban revolution

18:40

had dramatically changed the relationship

18:42

between the two countries. But

18:44

since the seventies, the Americans had

18:47

maintained a bare bones diplomatic mission

18:49

where people could do basic things like

18:51

process

18:51

visas, stuff like that, and that

18:54

was

18:54

it. But with Obama's

18:57

announcement, the two countries would

18:59

fully restore relations. The

19:01

fancy term diplomats like to use for this

19:03

international reunion

19:05

is Rupash Ma. When you

19:07

heard the news that

19:09

there was Rupash Ma going on,

19:12

What was that

19:12

like? Hearing the

19:13

news? It was pretty

19:17

thrilling. For a foreign service

19:19

officer like Tina, the

19:21

full restoration of diplomatic relations

19:23

is a once in a lifetime opportunity.

19:25

A friend of mine texted

19:28

saying, dude, turn your TV on now. It

19:30

was on. It was being announced on on

19:32

television. She'll

19:33

be part of a staff that helps steer

19:35

a historic opening. It will

19:37

be hard work but Tina's thrilled.

19:40

And and I was

19:43

shocked that that this

19:45

place I thought I was gonna go to that was

19:47

gonna be super closed off and super isolated. All of

19:49

a sudden, it's gonna be an embassy, and it's gonna be

19:51

a big deal, and and Rob Prashmont. And we're

19:53

gonna be best friends for the

19:54

Cubans, and everything's gonna be great. Everything's gonna be wonderful. Yeah.

19:56

I can't wait to go. That

19:58

was it.

19:59

As the number two

20:02

consular official at the embassy, her

20:04

job is to manage teams that help

20:06

American citizens abroad.

20:08

Section, making sure Visa adjudications

20:10

are running the way they're supposed to, making sure

20:12

the American citizen services section has

20:14

everything they need an American citizen

20:16

emergency. Obviously, everyone drops everything

20:19

and focuses on that. If you're

20:21

a US citizen who traveled to Cuba

20:23

and lost your passport and need help

20:25

getting home, if you just got

20:27

arrested after a drunken fight in a rum

20:28

bar, Tina's team would be your

20:31

one phone call from jail.

20:32

There is

20:36

much work

20:39

to be done. With the loosened travel restrictions authorized

20:42

by the Obama administration, US tourists

20:44

are about to flood the island for the first

20:46

time since JFK was in

20:48

office. It's

20:49

an incredible about face because until this

20:52

point, the state of US Cuban

20:54

relations had almost been suspended in

20:56

time. In Havana,

20:58

the US embassy building itself

21:00

had slowly deteriorated over

21:02

the decades. It's located on the

21:04

city's famous waterfront promenade known as

21:06

the Malekon. I remember seeing

21:09

six feet wave splashing against

21:11

the building I was in the

21:13

building. It was a Saturday

21:15

because we were doing That's former

21:17

US ambassador to Cuba, Jeff Del Arendez.

21:20

Remembering what it was like at the beleaguered embassy building

21:22

in nineteen ninety three during the

21:24

so called storm of the

21:25

century. And

21:26

was literally stuck there overnight.

21:29

Tidel Castro was on the radio talking about how we

21:31

was going to rescue

21:34

folks in buildings that were along the

21:36

Mallecon. And, of course, we were all

21:38

joking that the US intersection would

21:40

be the last building in Havana that would ever

21:42

get rescued in this circumstance,

21:45

which means half a century of tensions and

21:48

counterintelligence efforts are also

21:50

about to be brought to the

21:51

surface. For years,

21:54

the US and Cuba had not only

21:56

been suspicious of each other. They

21:58

were enemies. Short of war, they

22:00

engaged in some of the most ambitious

22:02

by operations against each

22:05

other. Cuba could really get under

22:07

the CIA's skin. Cuban

22:09

intelligence is legendary in Spire

22:11

World. They're particularly good at

22:13

recruiting Americans and

22:15

preventing the CIA from

22:17

recruiting Cuban

22:18

sources. I had a neighbor in Havana where

22:20

I lived for years who'd been sent to the US

22:22

right after the revolution as

22:24

a counterintelligence plan. She was a double

22:27

agent. One of the advantages the

22:29

Cubans had was an ideological

22:31

one.

22:31

There were

22:31

Americans who were very critical of American

22:34

policy in Latin American Health swear

22:36

and felt admiration for the Cuban cause.

22:39

Some of these people felt such sympathy

22:41

that they crossed the line and started

22:43

working for the Cubans. And a few

22:45

ultimately reached very high levels within the intelligence

22:48

community. So that two thousand

22:50

fourteen announcement of renewed diplomatic

22:52

relations was about to

22:54

create some new opportunities for spies

22:56

on both sides. The

22:59

CIA already had a station

23:01

in Havana, It was located within the US embassy

23:03

building, but it was very small. Only

23:05

three or four officers who couldn't do

23:07

much intelligence gathering on the island because

23:10

Cuban counterintelligence was so good at thwarting

23:12

them.

23:12

The Cuban government also had the

23:15

embassy building surrounded. They

23:17

had picked the guards stationed

23:18

outside, The US also

23:21

assumed that the local janitorial and

23:23

maintenance staff were informants

23:24

too. But the CIA tried

23:27

the best it could to do its work

23:29

without being discovered. Almost all the CI officers

23:31

in Havana operated under diplomatic

23:34

cover. They would work at the embassy during the

23:36

day, then sneak through a

23:38

back a staircase that would take them to the station,

23:40

located behind an unmarked door with

23:42

a special lock. And

23:44

no outsiders were allowed to go past

23:46

the second floor of without

23:48

being escorted for fear that they would

23:50

try to locate and bug the station.

23:52

We asked the CIA for

23:55

official comment on their security

23:57

situation at the embassy and they

23:59

declined. But Tina has

24:01

nothing to do with any of that. Her

24:03

job is to make sure US citizens are

24:05

safe and having fun in Havana. Her

24:07

kids start school there. She and her husband

24:09

host parties and make friends with other

24:11

diplomats in the area. It all

24:13

feels quite normal. Except for

24:17

the parts that aren't. Because if

24:19

you are a US spy or even a

24:21

diplomat in Cuba, you know you're

24:23

being watched. We

24:24

had heard stories of harassment and we

24:26

just hadn't experienced it. We

24:29

didn't have you know, our dogs didn't get

24:31

poisoned and We

24:33

didn't

24:33

find, you know, presence left behind in

24:35

the toilet. Turds in the toilet. It's

24:37

one of the most common forms of harassment

24:39

from Cuban counterintelligence. Because

24:41

it's ambiguous. Maybe your wife forgot the

24:44

flesh or your housekeeper or

24:46

it's a spy letting you know

24:48

we're watching

24:49

you. didn't have our tires

24:51

slashed or anything like that. And we've heard other

24:53

people tell these horrible stories. We've never

24:55

experienced any of

24:56

it.

24:56

certain parts of the world, this kind

24:59

of harassment is par for the

25:01

course. Usually, it's done in this

25:03

ambiguous way that leaves room for

25:05

plausible deniability. Oh, did someone enter my

25:07

house through the window or did I leave the

25:09

window open? But other

25:11

times, it's unambiguous. An

25:14

FBI officer based in Israel once told

25:16

me that he remembers coming home

25:18

and finding that someone had

25:21

strung up a bunch of condoms across his apartment

25:23

ceiling as if trying to say welcome

25:25

to your new assignment. It's

25:27

juvenile but effective. It's

25:29

the job of the spies to keep track

25:31

of this kind of stuff. That's

25:34

not really something that Tina spends a lot

25:36

of time thinking about. But one

25:39

day, she actually did have her own weird

25:40

experience. So it

25:41

had to have been that last year,

25:43

twenty sixteen to twenty seventeen that we were

25:45

there. Something that may have been nothing or could

25:47

have been a sign that the Cubans wanted her

25:49

to know that she was being watched. We

25:52

got home and something smells

25:54

just dreadful. And

25:56

we, of course, went straight to the fridges and the

25:59

freezer and then big standing freezer

26:01

which is of course where we store all of our

26:03

meat because you buy your meat whenever you can get it

26:05

and then you

26:05

freeze it.

26:06

And and it had been turned off. It had been

26:09

unplugged and turned turned

26:11

off. Tina takes it in stride. Maybe

26:13

one of her kids accidentally unplugged

26:15

the

26:15

fridge. It's impossible to know for sure.

26:17

I think we just sort of chuckled and set

26:19

up. There it is. We got one.

26:21

That was that was our one

26:22

thing, and that was the only time. Anything

26:25

like that happened until, you

26:28

know.

26:30

So, you know, we

26:33

obviously in the In the podcast, we're gonna tell the

26:35

story of the beginning of Havana

26:37

syndrome, the first reported

26:37

cases. And I was wondering what

26:40

you

26:40

remember hearing at the water cooler.

26:42

Here's

26:44

where it

26:47

all goes downhill. That's

26:55

after the break.

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29:22

I honestly don't remember the

29:25

first thing I

29:26

heard. But I knew that several people had

29:29

been sent to Miami for medical evaluations.

29:31

It was all

29:34

very unclear why. One

29:37

day, a few weeks before the episode

29:39

in Tina's Kitchen, she remembers

29:41

getting pulled into a private meeting

29:43

with the console general and a call

29:45

who had just returned from Miami.

29:47

And this person described everything

29:51

in in pretty

29:54

extensive

29:54

detail. This is Tina's first

29:57

indication outside the rumor

29:59

mill that something is indeed a

30:01

miss at the embassy. At

30:03

least two of her colleagues have

30:05

suddenly come down with headaches,

30:07

nausea, vertigo, and

30:09

they had heard a strange buzzing

30:11

sound before they got sick. As

30:13

we were sitting there

30:13

listening, he and I just kept looking at each other,

30:16

like, is this is this for

30:18

real? Is this a thing? This

30:20

doesn't make any

30:20

sense. Everything was going great. Why? What?

30:23

What is happening? Tina

30:25

and her boss agree to keep the information

30:28

confidential. Because they don't want to start a panic at the

30:30

embassy. Pretty soon,

30:31

wild theories start floating around at

30:33

the embassy, especially among those

30:35

with children. A lot of them go to school together

30:37

in Havana, and it becomes a source

30:39

of gossip amongst the parents.

30:42

Some people think that maybe this is just food

30:45

poisoning while others are speculating that it

30:47

could be something far more sinister

30:49

that someone might actually be targeting US officials

30:52

with some kind of secret weapon. Were

30:56

you scared?

30:57

Not at all. I mean,

30:59

scare for my colleagues. Yes. Personally

31:02

or for my family, no.

31:04

Because at that point, III think we all

31:06

had an idea in our heads of who was being targeted.

31:08

And it was, you know, folks who were

31:10

more on the security side

31:13

Not me. Nobody's gonna

31:16

try to recruit me. I'm not one of the people that

31:18

has special information that they're

31:20

interested

31:20

in. Nobody really cares about

31:22

my work or what I do.

31:24

And then the incident

31:26

in Tina's Kitchen

31:28

happens. Overwhelming sense of inexplicable

31:32

anxiety, radical pressure and pain

31:34

in my head and my hair. Never like

31:36

that before.

31:40

But even though Tina has this

31:43

lingering headache, She doesn't link it back to

31:45

the mass illnesses and what her boss told

31:46

her. Her first reaction is

31:49

denial. So you had this

31:51

experience and you you have

31:53

these implications for

31:55

your health that you clearly

31:56

register, what do you do

31:59

with this information? Nothing

32:02

is the answer for

32:05

a solid month and

32:07

change. Absolutely nothing. I didn't say anything

32:09

to anyone, not even my husband. Crisis

32:11

Tina takes over at that moment. And

32:13

I shut down completely. I

32:15

was just fine. I'm fine. There's

32:18

nothing wrong. There's nothing to see

32:20

here. Everything is fine. I

32:24

told myself that I

32:26

had imagined it that it was psychological.

32:29

I had heard the rumors. I was clearly affected

32:31

by them. And

32:34

So now my body is manifesting symptoms

32:37

that I don't actually

32:37

have. But

32:39

she's tired all the

32:40

time. And of

32:41

course, I'm not

32:42

sleeping. Her headaches

32:43

are getting worse, and she's losing

32:45

her memory. I think my son

32:47

even mentioned something. You don't normally sound

32:50

stupid mama. You some kind of you

32:52

know, slow.

32:56

Well, thanks kiddo, but yeah.

32:59

Yeah. Mama's just a little tired.

33:01

And most unsettling for Tina,

33:03

she can't keep up at work. I would

33:05

read emails, and by the time I will get to the

33:07

end, I wouldn't remember a single thing about what I

33:09

had just read. Words will kind of jump a

33:11

little bit on the

33:12

screen. Things would move and

33:15

shake. And

33:16

I think everybody saw how

33:19

I looked. My boss, the consul general, called it

33:21

the elephant in the room because I wasn't

33:23

talking about it with

33:23

anyone, but I looked like a zombie. I looked like

33:26

absolute crap.

33:27

This goes on for weeks. Tina's

33:30

symptoms are getting worse, but she

33:32

still doesn't tell anyone. I do

33:34

remember thinking to myself that

33:37

I don't wanna contribute to the rumor

33:38

mill. I don't wanna let everybody down. I just

33:41

wanna keep my

33:42

head down, do my job, and I'll be fine.

33:45

I will absolutely be fine. I will mind over and matter my way out

33:47

of this and I'm just gonna keep my

33:49

mouth shut.

33:53

Behind the scenes, the US government is

33:56

scratching its head. In the two

33:58

months leading up to Tina's kitchen

34:00

incident in March twenty seventeen, US

34:03

intelligence officers stations in Nevada had

34:05

reported incidents in which they

34:07

felt pulsating pressure in their heads. These

34:09

were people who were pretending

34:11

to be diplomats working at

34:13

the embassy. But who were actually CIA

34:16

officers. These officers were prepared

34:18

to get

34:19

harassed, but getting

34:20

hurt that's against the unwritten

34:22

rules of the spy game. You

34:24

can fuck with each other, but you can't

34:26

hurt each other. The

34:29

CIA officers also reported that during their strange

34:31

health incident, they'd also heard a very

34:33

loud sound. Some

34:36

said, the sound was almost like In

34:38

some cases, the sound seemed

34:40

to follow them wherever they went within

34:44

their homes. And it would

34:46

continue for a period of minutes at

34:48

least until they opened the door to the

34:49

outside, at which point the

34:52

sound

34:53

would stop. The CIA is ensured what to make of the incidents that

34:56

the spies were reporting. They got

34:58

so sick that they had to seek treatment

35:00

back in

35:02

the states. Then things get

35:04

weirder. When the CIA

35:06

sends officers on temporary

35:08

assignment to Havana, even these

35:10

new arrivals start getting

35:12

sick at their hotel hotels.

35:14

Doctors cannot identify

35:17

the source of the

35:19

illness. Some of them just start

35:21

calling it the thing. Privately,

35:26

top US government officials hold Cuba

35:28

responsible because even if

35:30

Cuba isn't causing

35:32

these illnesses, They must at least know who or what

35:34

is. They control everything on the

35:36

island. But the Cubans

35:38

say, they have no idea what the Americans are

35:40

talking about.

35:49

By now, Americans have a real medical mystery on their

35:52

hands, one that appears to be

35:54

spreading. Is it the result of

35:56

some new

35:58

illness? Or is it the result of a weapon? The US

36:00

government doesn't know and it's divided

36:02

about how to respond. It's

36:05

two thousand seventeen, just a few

36:07

months into a new presidential

36:10

administration. Obama is out, along

36:12

with the officials who pushed to

36:14

restore relations. And Cuba is dealing with its own change in

36:16

regime in the wake of Fidel Castro's

36:18

death. And so some

36:20

CI officers want to pull

36:22

their people

36:23

off the x, meaning out of Cuba

36:26

because they don't know how to keep them safe

36:28

anymore in this

36:30

environment.

36:31

Eventually, The press finds out about all the mystery illnesses in

36:34

Cuba and starts asking

36:36

questions. But the Trump administration

36:38

doesn't have any answers, and they're

36:40

starting to get a

36:42

lot of black for not keeping

36:44

US personnel safe, so they make an unprecedented

36:46

decision.

36:49

The CIA decides to close its station

36:51

in Havana, an extraordinary

36:54

step. Even in the most war torn

36:56

of places, Bakdad Cabot.

36:58

The CIA station has stayed

37:00

open, but not in Cuba.

37:02

And at this point,

37:04

Rex Tillerson, the secretary of state has

37:06

little choice but to do the same and pull his

37:09

diplomats

37:09

out. The US State

37:11

Department said today all but

37:13

essential American diplomatic staff are going

37:16

home. They did some bad things

37:18

and President Donald

37:20

Trump seems to blame the

37:22

Cubans today, but there's no evidence Cuba was behind

37:24

this.

37:30

It's always amazed me that they had no hard

37:32

evidence when they made this huge decision

37:34

to pull off the island. Talk

37:37

about flying blind.

37:38

By the end of September two thousand seventeen, all

37:41

non essential embassy staff are

37:43

sent home. Then a month

37:45

later, in Washington

37:46

DC, the

37:48

US spells an equal number of Cuban diplomats. After

37:51

all those efforts to restore

37:54

relations just a few

37:56

years prior, now the back

37:58

to square

38:00

one. And

38:03

this is

38:04

when things get even crazier.

38:06

Despite getting off the x

38:08

leaving Cuba, American officials

38:10

report more incidents, not

38:12

in Cuba, but in Russia, and then

38:15

in China, then in Austria,

38:17

then in Colombia, then in Vietnam, and

38:19

then in Kyrgyzstan, and more and

38:21

more. Around the world, diplomats and spies and

38:23

members of the US military continue

38:25

to report mysterious incidents that get

38:28

put into the same category as

38:30

the bizarre our affliction first reported in Havana

38:32

Cuba. And then the list expands to

38:34

include White House staffers

38:36

who report incidents first

38:38

in London and then within

38:40

steps of the Oval Office

38:42

itself.

38:45

Yeah. That's me. I

38:47

figured out

38:49

here. Something's wrong with

38:52

me. It's not

38:55

supposed to change. Tell me if

38:58

I'm walking with that. No. You're

38:59

right. Alright.

39:02

Alright. Let's go let's go

39:04

over to the gate, I guess. So

39:08

we're outside the White

39:10

House. This is probably the most

39:12

secure place on the planet.

39:15

There are cameras

39:18

dangling from all of

39:20

the light posts on

39:22

the street. If you look to the top of the

39:24

White House, you'll see

39:28

occasionally, snipers with binoculars,

39:30

you know, looking out and scanning

39:32

the crowds that pass

39:34

by. So obviously

39:36

not the kind of place that you'd expect

39:38

anything like what he thinks

39:40

happened

39:41

to him here. Yeah.

39:44

I have had a

39:46

really hard time of speaking.

39:52

At first, it starts as sort of rumors that

39:54

there were incidents in Washington,

39:57

in the Washington area.

39:59

I'll be honest, I was quite skeptical, and

40:01

it just just seemed outlandish to

40:04

me because

40:04

it it's so brazen.

40:07

It would so brazen of a foreign intelligence

40:09

service to think that it can get away

40:11

with

40:11

it, you know, on

40:14

American soil.

40:15

The difference

40:15

is when you talk to the person who's

40:18

involved and that sort of, you

40:20

know, it convinces you

40:22

that they are really suffering

40:24

Honestly, I I don't

40:26

I don't

40:26

know what is going on. Right? But

40:29

I have no doubt in my

40:31

mind that that John

40:34

experience exactly what he's describing, that he

40:36

is a completely reliable narrator

40:38

of what happened to

40:39

him. I do not

40:41

know what happened to him. For

40:45

what it's

40:48

worth, John

40:50

was himself skeptical at first

40:52

that what happened to him could be Havana syndrome.

40:54

But after discussing it with his

40:55

colleagues, it occurred to him that this

40:58

could be

41:00

it.

41:00

And that's been a running theme throughout our years reporting

41:03

this story. There is still

41:05

no definitive evidence that any of

41:07

these incidents actually happened. Except

41:10

for the fact that are reporting these symptoms. Symptoms

41:12

that these patients' doctors have

41:15

argued are very real. And

41:18

so if the cause is some kind of

41:20

weapon, if this is the result

41:23

of a series of

41:24

attacks, Someone has

41:26

perpetrated the perfect

41:27

crime. And so

41:29

now, we're trying to figure out

41:31

what is Havana

41:33

syndrome. Is it even

41:36

real? And

41:36

if it is, who's doing it?

41:39

And why is it taking so long for

41:41

the US to solve this? Is

41:44

there something that the United States, one of the most

41:47

powerful countries in the history of the world,

41:49

has been missing this whole

41:52

time,

42:10

They've killed people's dogs.

42:13

They've urinated in mouthwash. They've

42:15

put feces onto your door handle, so you'd

42:17

come and grab

42:20

They do some sort of damage to your car. This was just part

42:22

of this long game of them always,

42:24

letting you know that they're

42:25

there, letting you know that they can get

42:27

to you. But also they

42:30

wanna find what gets under your skin and they

42:32

exploit

42:33

it. That's next time

42:37

on Havana syndrome.

42:50

Havana syndrome is hosted and reported

42:52

by Adamentos and me,

42:54

John Leander It's

42:56

produced and reported by Julian Nutter,

42:58

Jesse Alejandro Cottro, and

43:00

Ramon Campos Iriante,

43:02

an edit an executive produced by Ani Abilis

43:04

and Kate Osborn with original

43:06

composition and sound design by

43:08

Steve Byrne.