0:03

Welcome to the You Can Heal Your Life

0:05

podcast. My name is Chris Anne Donnelly and

0:08

I am so excited to be here today

0:10

as a guest interviewer. I am

0:12

the creator of the Lightseers Tarot, the Muse Tarot,

0:15

and Oracle Deck for Business called The Secret Creators

0:17

Oracle and the Tarot of Curious Creatures. And

0:20

I'm here today with a very,

0:22

very special guest. Her name is

0:24

Vicky Iskandar. She is a

0:26

Hey House author. She is

0:29

also a master of

0:31

Chinese metaphysics and so many

0:34

different metaphysical arts

0:36

in that she is the creator

0:38

of the Chinese Five Elements Oracle.

0:42

And I have

0:44

been connected with you, Vicky, for a little

0:46

bit on Instagram. And this is the first

0:48

time we actually get to talk in person.

0:50

So I'm so excited. Welcome, welcome. Yeah, I'm

0:52

so happy that we get to meet

0:54

here. It's just, yeah, it's been very

0:57

exciting since the Oracle came out. And

0:59

I'm just very happy to be here.

1:01

Yes. And you do beautiful daily card

1:05

draws on Instagram for us. And I've been

1:07

following those and learning a little bit more

1:09

about your work and some of the stuff

1:11

you do. I wanted to mention

1:13

that I am very

1:15

curious about your

1:18

story, truly,

1:20

because you are an Indonesian

1:23

born Chinese woman. You

1:26

then went on to

1:28

study an MBA at

1:30

NYU. And then you had

1:32

a calling almost like from

1:35

what I read in your bio. It sounds like

1:37

you had this beautiful calling from

1:39

your ancestors to dive

1:42

into some of the work that you're doing

1:44

now. Can you tell me a little bit about that and what that was

1:46

like? Yes, actually.

1:48

Well, it actually started with Western astrology

1:50

right after I finished my MBA. And

1:52

that was the, that was the year

1:54

of the dragon in 2000. And

1:59

I just finished my MBA, you know, I

2:01

went to a really good school at

2:03

NYU and I didn't know what

2:05

to do. So I was just browsing

2:08

at a bookstore one day and looking

2:12

at the astrology books and an astrologer

2:14

happened to be there and he was

2:17

meant to be and she asked

2:19

you know what I was looking for and just

2:21

she pointed me to a

2:23

few astrological books that I started

2:25

studying and these were serious astrology

2:28

books by Robert Hand and

2:31

a few others. So I

2:33

started diving into western astrology first

2:35

and just became

2:39

fascinated with the metaphysics. I

2:41

grew up in Indonesia where

2:44

metaphysics is part of our

2:46

daily life basically and the

2:49

Taoist culture and

2:54

my childhood basically we would have astrology books

2:56

and the tarot card playing around. I mean

2:58

I actually don't know who bought them, maybe

3:01

my father you know, but

3:03

yeah so it's always been

3:06

a daily part of life

3:08

there but I was never

3:10

really deep into the Chinese

3:12

astrology until 12 years

3:15

after I started learning western

3:17

astrology and just started getting

3:19

more calls from my ancestors

3:21

to go deeper into

3:24

Chinese astrology and you

3:26

know of course growing up as a Chinese

3:28

I'm familiar with the 12 animal signs but

3:31

that was pretty much it. I knew

3:33

what sign I was and I knew

3:35

what sign of the year it would

3:37

be but that was it and I

3:40

learned about the 60 pillars when

3:44

I started learning Chinese astrology and

3:48

then also around the same time I

3:50

started learning qigong and through

3:53

the movements of qigong I really

3:55

felt my ancestors calling me. Beautiful.

3:57

Can you talk to us about

4:00

The sixty pillars I believe that's connected

4:02

to your deck. Yes,

4:04

So the Sixty Pillars are the

4:06

possible combinations of the Five elements

4:08

and the Pope Animal science. And

4:10

ever since I learned about the

4:12

Sixty Fillers, I've always had a

4:15

picture on my mind. In and

4:17

out of the Sixty Pillars as

4:19

an oracle dec. The

4:21

sixteenth possible combinations in it's it's

4:24

They've always been an oracle system.

4:27

And having them as an oracle

4:30

deck which I had never seen

4:32

before to me is just another

4:34

way of reading and understanding the

4:37

Sixty Killers and I was. I

4:39

was writing daily guidance on Instagram

4:41

and Facebook. And. That was

4:44

more about western. A solid you, but

4:46

I started incorporating that sixty fillers into

4:48

the daily guidance and that's how life.

4:50

That's really how I learned the elements

4:52

to deeper. Basically cost is it's unless

4:55

you're really delve into it everyday and

4:57

and not is all the elements are

4:59

on. Shoot, it's the they're just elements.

5:01

red meat just fill separate from us.

5:03

But then once you actually get to

5:05

know the elements and you realize though

5:08

we're not separate from the elements, were

5:10

part of the elements were part of

5:12

nature. he so. And. And.

5:15

With the sixty fillers, I just

5:17

felt that the animals people are

5:19

familiar with the top animal finds,

5:21

but not many have heard about

5:23

the sixty pillars and distillers I

5:25

use in the Chinese calendar to

5:27

measure cycles of time. So.

5:29

For example, February Fourth,

5:31

Twenty Twenty Four tix us into the

5:33

Astrology Co. Year of the Woods Dragon.

5:36

And. The Fire Tiger month. so

5:38

deaths to the pillars and each

5:40

of the sixty Pillars contain so

5:42

much energetic information from the elements

5:45

that can provide us with insights

5:47

and messages when we use them

5:49

as an oracle. Just

5:51

like in the Sixty Four hex the

5:53

grounds in the eating So than that

5:55

was the birth of the Oracle deck

5:58

and my hope is that one they

6:00

to sixty pillar of will become. A

6:02

familiar to Chinese metaphysics in to see

6:05

us as the eating hex the ground

6:07

since this five elements and twelve animal

6:09

science are very really the ball and.

6:11

Approachable. So the sixty

6:13

pillar then like one would be the

6:15

the Would rat and when will be

6:17

the earth rat and will be the

6:19

fire Paid right or to provide. And

6:22

yeah and it's the five elements would

6:24

start with would. And

6:26

then it would fire. Earth,

6:28

Metal and water. And.

6:31

Animal sign. There's a ranking and up

6:33

to an end or sub. It starts

6:35

with the rat as of that and

6:37

I also love that you talked about

6:39

the way when you start to notice

6:41

the elements that they really are all

6:43

around us are or there in as

6:45

even right like we're are them and.

6:47

They are us. We're not separate

6:49

from nature and is it. Something.

6:54

That you notice. In

6:56

things in like everything.

6:58

Do you see the five elements you know in your

7:00

food and in the not? have? Not just in the

7:02

in the weather or in the water, in the air

7:05

sort of thing. Yes,

7:07

and. He. Have I know

7:09

the said. In. A in the

7:11

environment around us. A

7:13

thing most most places are quite balanced

7:15

in the elements in and of course

7:18

it interprets season tickets. Also, each season

7:20

is dominated by elements, but I can

7:22

also see it in the people that

7:24

I need either, so I can see

7:26

when someone. Is some.

7:29

Has a lot of fire in them

7:31

because that's a lot of joy and

7:33

happiness. or when someone is a lot

7:36

of more metalworkers that's very a me.

7:38

I can actually smell metal in the

7:40

person for some reason and it's to

7:42

seen there's little bit of metallic of

7:44

smell to it or. And

7:48

earth is just very earthy and

7:50

nurturing. so it's the i can

7:53

see that in people. And.

7:55

Hello to where on Earth and be like. A

7:59

water person. It.

8:01

Depends whether it's a year or yeah

8:03

manifestation of the water but I find

8:05

even more a person is very wise

8:07

his delivery psychic because he and Morris

8:09

about with done this by going deep

8:11

into themselves. Whereas young water

8:14

can be all over the place in the

8:16

like an ocean they're just see the unless

8:18

it's contain line unless they're ground that than

8:20

it's it's it's it's self worth to basically

8:22

to contain themselves cause there's no will be

8:25

a lot of interesting I'm going all over

8:27

the place and waters receptive right? So he

8:29

goes to everywhere So yeah so he doesn't

8:31

need though some kind of container that an

8:33

element for the last on would just because

8:36

they know their people listening who are thinking

8:38

okay now I'm trying to figure out which

8:40

one I might be. So how would

8:42

a would person possibly be? Would.

8:46

Person or a young would

8:48

is is. Very.

8:50

We will would person in general he

8:52

it was very compassionate also very creative.

8:54

Gus Would is the with has an

8:57

upward energy so it's like flowers like

8:59

you know that the and manifestation and

9:01

that's usually the more artistic one So

9:03

they just like to make things new

9:05

to fool yourself so you use when

9:07

the way someone for some Italy in

9:10

Thailand. I was really impressed by just

9:12

the way people for their flowers every

9:14

morning like the lotus flower in the

9:16

works of art so it's. Things.

9:18

Like that like it's this. Would.

9:22

Would hazard neck with making

9:24

everything beautiful. And. They're

9:26

also very compassionate said that's one

9:28

thing about Would Elements. I.

9:31

Love that! So I have a question

9:33

for you about this deck because I

9:35

know every day you give us. A

9:38

card. And. You

9:40

start card based on a random card

9:43

pull that you do or is that

9:45

based on the actual calendar. so

9:48

i've been doing have been pulling the cart

9:50

based on the actual a calendar skus i

9:52

know that lot of people actually are interested

9:55

in the oracle not yes an oracle system

9:57

but also to learn about the elements of

9:59

the day so that's what I have been

10:01

doing with my daily guidance and

10:05

Once a month. I also do a pool. I'm in

10:07

a cart pool with an Oracle But

10:10

yeah, but every day because there's just so many

10:12

the elements can tell us so many things So

10:15

I just feel that doing a daily

10:18

Guidance based on the elements of the

10:20

day actually very helpful. So if someone

10:22

were to get this deck Which

10:25

is very beautiful by the way, I haven't

10:27

said that but it is gorgeous. I love

10:29

it I'm I'm so grateful that you sent

10:31

it to me But

10:35

if someone were to use this The

10:38

way I used it when I first got it of

10:40

course was the typical way where I just pull a

10:42

random card and I get A message of the day.

10:44

So as the author creator of

10:46

the deck, you think that's a fantastic way to use

10:48

it as well like we're

10:50

sure it randomly or we could almost use

10:53

it in a way where we check out

10:55

what the Chinese calendar says the

10:57

day is and we can almost use it in

10:59

a predictive way almost Almost

11:03

in an astrological way We can also then

11:05

tune into what's Friday gonna be

11:07

like and go and look at the card and go

11:09

and read the message Am I

11:11

correct in understanding that? Yeah, you can use

11:13

it either way actually That's what I love

11:16

about just the 60 fillers because where

11:18

they work as an Oracle system So you can you know,

11:20

you can pull a card and then I've this

11:23

cards are just very responsive I don't

11:25

know if you feel that way, but you know, just

11:27

just it's it

11:29

connects to you in a in its own way and

11:34

As an Oracle system it does basically yeah,

11:36

if you're if you're just pulling a card

11:38

a day then it does

11:40

it does its work and of course when you're

11:43

Looking at the card of the day, you know, let's

11:45

say let's let's say the card of or let's I'm

11:47

just Let's say the card of the

11:49

month because this is the card of the month, which is the

11:52

fire tiger for February 2024

11:54

and it's a lot about

11:57

joy. So So it's

11:59

the The theme of the

12:01

on is just to have to share.

12:03

Guess Sherry Joy, Hear your life. The

12:06

more you share your life. The more

12:08

joy you will have cultivate for

12:10

yourself. And actually that's joy is

12:12

the message of the Oracle dec.

12:15

One of the things that's coming to mind

12:17

as a as a reader. people often come

12:19

to us and they ask us questions about

12:21

the future, the what predictive readings and they

12:23

often want to know a timeline. and there's

12:25

a lot of different ways to look at

12:27

timelines but I feel like your deck could

12:29

be really fantastic in giving us set dates

12:31

almost. You know it. might you know, pay

12:34

attention to exploit just by pulling a card

12:36

we would be able to then. Offer

12:38

a really fantastic framework for.

12:41

When people may expect things to happen.

12:44

Yeah. Well I'm and some people are

12:46

doing and I know, ah, people are

12:48

doing it for them. To them it's

12:50

not just about that. they can also

12:52

be among trade or or a certain

12:54

certain moment in time even when and

12:56

you may not even be able to

12:58

connect to it until later when the

13:00

actual month or date happens and you're

13:02

like oh my god you know this

13:04

is Mrs. The carpet came out and

13:06

then it's a water fake month So

13:09

it's yeah, that's that's that's another way

13:11

because timing is yeah. The the pillars

13:13

are also about timing. So. Yeah, that

13:15

that's That's something that. People.

13:17

Can do enough. seem to seem a lot

13:19

of. Creative. Ways that people

13:22

are using the deck for. So I'm

13:24

just very glad that you know that

13:26

that and that I've defined the deck.

13:28

That's just their responsive to what people need.

13:31

Can you sumptuous a bit about? I

13:33

know that you have your your Western

13:35

in your Chinese astrology and we're moving

13:37

into some really. Long

13:40

cycles, right? Now. We're stepping in

13:42

to some twenty years cycles I believe

13:44

in. Oh yeah, so could you give

13:46

us a little bit of insight into

13:48

this mega twenty year cycle that were

13:50

slipping into. Yeah,

13:52

so the would dragon year

13:54

basically? Takes us into this

13:57

new twenty or cycle that we call

13:59

Period Nine or the Age of Nine

14:01

And this a twenty year cycle that's

14:03

ruled by the fire. Try Graham Pen.

14:05

There are you. So it's based on

14:08

the try Graham and. Than

14:10

the period. Nine is the loss of

14:12

the try grander nine try grounds on

14:14

a program sorry on a try grounds

14:16

that. Theory. Of Nine is

14:19

basically the loss of the hundred

14:21

eighty. Year. Grand

14:23

Cycle. So so we're.

14:25

Heading into. Yeah. Some

14:27

really interesting times the have basically

14:29

in it. So fire fire element

14:32

is about joy and this about

14:34

light. So the message of the

14:36

fire try drum is. Basically.

14:40

At the at the most basic

14:42

is to cultivate inner joy and

14:44

that's the key to driving in

14:46

the next twenty years. And.

14:49

It's. It's a high. It's been

14:52

very highly anticipated in the among

14:54

the Chinese Metaphysics community. Because.

14:57

In twenty years as a long time and. Oh

15:00

we just finishing up or with

15:02

in the were basically completing. The.

15:05

Last period before period Nine which

15:07

is period Kate and period A

15:09

itself is a period. Associate it

15:11

with knowledge and a little a

15:13

broader. And. Within the last

15:15

twenty years in a with the

15:17

rice and social media and the

15:19

internet basically it sooner and then basically

15:21

the founders of all the social media

15:24

companies were on the person A

15:26

fight would be a to paypal of

15:28

the the the month and try ground

15:30

up so that represents the age

15:32

of eight that basically that the person

15:35

if occasion of that. So in terms

15:37

of period nine it's some. Is.

15:39

Associated with the heart and also

15:42

the middle sister, which in the

15:44

modern world translates into middle age

15:46

women. So Nice of Nine highlights

15:48

the rice of feminine power. After

15:51

twenty yourself useful masculine energy

15:54

that dominated in the. Period.

15:56

eight and so we can expect and

15:59

we've been seeing this because it starts

16:01

period nine. I mean, we don't just

16:04

go into one period. There's always

16:06

a transitional time. So we've been

16:08

seeing more women taking leadership positions

16:11

in their communities and their

16:13

professional circles. So

16:16

if you think about it, like 20 years ago, we

16:19

couldn't imagine meeting people through social

16:21

media or just doing this with

16:23

you, basically. So

16:26

think about what could happen in the next 20 years.

16:29

Fire is the element that

16:32

helps us raise our frequency. And

16:34

it's basically it will be easier to jump

16:36

in and out of different realms in the

16:39

next 20 years as fire

16:41

trigram opens up other realms.

16:43

And that includes metaphysics, the spiritual

16:45

realms, metaverse, AI,

16:48

and the energetic realms. Basically, it's a

16:50

lot of light, a lot of light

16:52

work too. So our

16:55

consciousness will elevate,

16:57

basically. We can

16:59

elevate, we can really access the higher

17:01

realms. And the

17:04

key to access that higher realms

17:06

is to reach into the light.

17:09

And light is basically our inner joy. So

17:11

joy is the key to a higher frequency.

17:14

And it doesn't

17:16

mean that in the next 20 years, it

17:19

will be easier to find joy. And as

17:21

you know, the world is just, it's hard

17:23

to get to find joy. And

17:25

as the world gets more

17:28

divided, it will be harder to find it.

17:30

So the fire trigram, basically, the

17:32

message is to reach for the light. And

17:36

that ability to just to just shift

17:38

into a state of inner joy is

17:40

especially critical since it's

17:44

just so much harder to raise our frequency

17:48

than it is to just let our frequency

17:50

drop. And that's just the

17:53

way gravity works. So, And

17:56

you know what I think is amazing and I

17:58

think very divine is that.? The character

18:00

for the in manifestation of

18:03

fire elemental is called being

18:05

In China's metaphysics, And

18:07

which reminds me of Louise he's saying about

18:09

listening to your inner the. Digging

18:12

is are you in fire? Devious?

18:14

Actually in the Fire Karen businesses

18:16

and as associated with joy and

18:18

light in the heart so thing

18:20

that's another way. The divine speaks

18:22

to us through the elements. So.

18:26

And while we're talking about Period nine,

18:28

I just want to share message from

18:30

the Try ground. As.

18:33

The spring out the fire truck. Graham this is

18:35

a criminal penalty Just kind of peek through and

18:37

it was looking for my notes so I just

18:40

know it wants to share a message. So

18:42

for those people's lives. So if you're

18:44

listening, the try Graham. There are three

18:46

lines and what? What I'm looking at

18:48

on the screen there is a a

18:50

line at the top. A

18:52

split the plane and idol and then

18:55

another line at the bottom. Very good.

18:57

Yeah, so you have basically at So

18:59

it has a broken he in line,

19:02

that broken Lenawee Polian line in the

19:04

center and it's between two solid lines

19:06

that we call the young lines and

19:09

this broken young lion in the center

19:11

is what represents the middle sister or

19:13

middle aged woman. In our

19:15

modern times, it also represents an open

19:17

heart in the center and it doesn't

19:19

matter what gender you are actually as

19:22

the energy of the fire. Try Graham

19:24

Safer for those who are in touch

19:26

with their heart. And. The life

19:28

with them and and the divine

19:30

feminine within so so. We can

19:32

also see this gap in the

19:34

broken line in the center as

19:36

the portal. So. You can

19:38

see that there's a portal through the heart that

19:40

we can access in the next twenty years. While.

19:43

Wearing Period Nine that ruled by this

19:45

fire Try. Graham. So. We

19:47

may be up in a we may be

19:49

up and down emotionally in our in our

19:51

frequency us law because that's just the nature

19:53

of fire element in a just the up

19:56

and down. Well. we can

19:58

still climb up in the let's see let's

20:00

say we feel depressed or we feel down a

20:02

little bit, so our frequency drops a little bit,

20:04

but we can still climb up to

20:07

the higher frequency if we practice light

20:09

work and cultivate inner joy and return

20:11

to our center. So

20:14

this is the message of the fire trigram. So

20:17

there is a portal there that you can

20:19

access through the heart. But,

20:21

and then I wanna show you

20:24

the trigram of the following cycle after

20:26

period nine, which is a new cycle

20:29

called period one. And that's ruled by

20:31

the water trigram. So, and

20:33

this is 20 years from now, but it's

20:35

worth noting that the lines are now reversed.

20:38

So instead of two solid lines

20:40

between, I mean, two solid lines

20:42

on the outside, now we have

20:44

two broken lines on

20:47

the outside and we have a solid young

20:49

line in the middle. So

20:51

if you see the lines as portals, the

20:54

line in the center is now

20:56

solid. So that portal to the

20:59

higher frequency that we saw in

21:01

period nine basically has closed. So

21:04

it will be difficult for those who

21:06

have fallen into the lower frequencies to

21:08

go up because the portal has closed. And,

21:12

but then those who have managed to stay

21:14

in the higher frequency can keep climbing

21:16

up can keep raising their frequency. There's

21:19

just no limit. And it's

21:21

just, that's, and that's why I keep

21:23

stressing how important it is in the

21:25

next 20 years to just keep

21:27

our frequency high. Through

21:30

the heart. And that's the source of

21:32

our inner light, our inner ding. I

21:34

love it. I love it. We have

21:36

20 years to kind of play with

21:38

this inner ding and just enjoy and

21:40

bring as much joy as we can

21:42

into our lives. And thank

21:45

you for that. What a beautiful vision for

21:47

the next 20 years. I'm on board. Me

21:50

too. I'm looking forward

21:52

to it. Yeah. Is

21:54

there anything else that you would like people to know

21:56

about working with the deck or playing with the deck

21:59

or I mean, It is absolutely, it

22:01

is a stunning deck. It's so bright,

22:03

the colors are so beautiful. I

22:07

know that I've mentioned to you that I studied acupuncture,

22:09

and so for me, I see all of the, even

22:11

the elements of the body in this deck. I mean,

22:14

there's so many different uses for this deck, and I

22:16

just wanna make sure that I'm not missing, I'm sure

22:18

there's so many more, but is

22:20

there anything that you want people to know about it? Yeah,

22:23

well, in each card, so we have

22:25

either a yin or yang manifestation of

22:27

one of the five elements. They're

22:30

called the heavenly stems, or I call

22:32

them heavenly frequencies, and

22:34

in the cards, they're represented by

22:36

landscape or the environment, so for

22:39

sure, like a water element

22:41

would be, would be like

22:43

a water snake here, the heavenly frequency

22:45

will be water, so you'll see the

22:47

snake in water,

22:51

and the animal signs

22:53

themselves also belongs to one of the

22:55

five elements, and most of

22:57

them also contain hidden elements, so

23:00

very early on, I knew that I wanted

23:02

the cards to be embedded with symbols and

23:05

hidden elements of the animal signs

23:07

and signature markers for special pillars,

23:10

so for example, let me just show you

23:12

the wood dragon, because we're going into the

23:14

wood dragon here, and

23:16

the wood dragon has yang wood in

23:18

the heavenly frequency, which is forest

23:21

and trees, and you

23:23

see the dragon here emerging from a tree, and

23:27

I chose the banyan tree here, because

23:29

the wood dragon itself is one

23:31

of the special pillars that contain

23:34

high spirituality, so

23:36

that's actually, that's also one defining thing

23:38

about 2024, and

23:41

in the card, the

23:43

high spiritual pillars are

23:46

marked by the infinity symbol, which here

23:48

looks like an upside down one, looks

23:50

like a number eight, and

23:52

that indicates spiritual strength, and

23:55

the banyan tree itself also represents

23:58

strength, growth, and enlightenment. Whereas

24:01

young wood itself represents leadership,

24:03

new beginnings and compassion. Whereas

24:06

the dragon also is a

24:08

sign that commands reference and

24:10

respect. So, and

24:12

then you see the dragon here in the colors,

24:15

which is light blue and also there's

24:18

a little bit light green and a

24:20

little bit of earthy colors because it's

24:22

a young earth sign, but also contains

24:25

hidden water and yin wood, hidden

24:27

yin water and yin wood. And

24:30

that's the color inside the dragon.

24:32

So, so these symbols and hidden

24:34

elements are like Easter eggs. It's

24:36

kind of like a fun treasure hunt for

24:38

those who are already expert in Chinese astrology

24:40

as they may be able

24:42

to spot this hidden elements in

24:44

the cart. And for example, the snakes, all

24:47

the patterns here within the snakes,

24:49

they represent the hidden elements within

24:51

the snake. So, and to

24:55

me, it's also educational for those who

24:57

are interested in learning Chinese astrology because

24:59

the hidden elements are quite, you know, I

25:01

mean, they're hidden. So most people don't really

25:03

look at the sign through the hidden elements,

25:05

but this hidden element actually can tell you

25:07

a lot. So, yeah, so

25:10

that's that's one thing about the cards.

25:14

And yeah, I'm hoping that people will get

25:17

into that. I love it.

25:19

People will go deeper and deeper the more that they

25:21

play with them. Right. So for anyone

25:23

who is interested, I would

25:25

say yes, in Chinese astrology, of course, but

25:27

also if you're just someone who loves animal

25:30

decks or nature decks, this deck

25:32

will speak to you. That's my experience

25:34

with it is that it just has its own

25:36

special voice and the animals,

25:38

you know, I love

25:41

animals. So, of course, the deck is it's perfect for

25:43

me. Thank you so

25:45

much. Well, thank you. Thank you so much

25:47

for your time with us today, Vicki, and

25:50

for your beautiful work. you