0:00

Gosh, there's a lot to get into. It's the

0:02

Zach Sang Show. Hello, beautiful

0:04

human. I'm Zach. That's Dan. Welcome to the

0:06

studio. Eric, the architect is

0:08

here. We

0:12

have a brand new album to discuss. Yeah. I've

0:14

never been here before, which is

0:16

very honest and true. Right. I've never been

0:18

here before. Oh, you've never been here before.

0:20

That is true. But you've never been. You've

0:22

never made a solo album before either. Right.

0:24

No. So I want

0:26

to talk all about it. Flash, Flappo Shambi's

0:29

Life is an Uncle. There's just a lot to cover

0:31

here. But can you tell me why I guess

0:34

now is the right time to release a solo album?

0:37

But really what pushed you to want to make something

0:39

of your own on your own? I

0:41

think it was a mix of things, right? Like as

0:44

a producer, there's a lot of beats that

0:46

just go into the stratosphere. They float

0:49

around and then you kind of have

0:51

like this individual story that I think that kind of

0:53

gets missing when you in a group. So,

0:55

you know, being a producer and an artist, sometimes

0:58

juggling those things will become like, oh,

1:00

like you have this part of you that's like still

1:03

not really being told. And I always

1:05

felt like I wanted a moment to do that. And

1:07

like 2011, I released a project I almost remembered, which

1:10

not nearly as big as this, but it still

1:12

was like my first time releasing something with like

1:14

a bunch of tracks that I produced and I

1:17

really believed in it. And then Flappo Shambi's took off in

1:19

like 2012, 2013. We

1:22

did Coachella, all these things happened. And that kind of

1:24

was like, you know, so

1:26

this is my actual return to being like,

1:28

I was a solo artist kind of before

1:30

Flappo Shambi's, but people really didn't, you

1:32

know, that was like a very early part of my

1:34

career. What do you think the universe was telling you

1:37

by doing that? And

1:39

the universe speaks to me all the time. I just got

1:41

to pay attention. You know, I think that they were just

1:43

like, it's time, bro. Like, I think music

1:46

in general, we need a refresh. We need

1:48

new introspective sounds. We need new people to

1:50

start leading and especially vets, people that's been

1:53

doing it for 10 years, like me touring

1:55

and not just only the artists that

1:58

blown up after COVID, you know, like. So

2:00

many guys have now come out and I'm

2:02

so like respectable of their

2:04

progression, but it's like 2011

2:08

2012 I was like touring in

2:10

a dollar van in Flatbush You know like I

2:12

still have that as an integration as part

2:14

of my story And I feel

2:16

like that makes me different from a lot of guys

2:18

that's out here. Oh my god a hundred percent right

2:21

like that's experience That's like ten thousand plus hours into

2:23

something So and it makes its way into the music

2:25

you do and the art you create

2:27

you talked about like being a producer Parts of yourself

2:29

or your story not being told How

2:33

does it really work

2:35

right like When

2:38

you're crafting something for somebody else what role

2:40

do you feel like you play and maybe

2:43

it's different roles right when you're in the studio with

2:45

Flatbush zombies compared to maybe somebody else right like What

2:50

what do you add to that mix that

2:53

nobody else can bring me

2:55

me particularly Me yeah I

2:58

think being able to wear this

3:00

hat and then take this hat off and put a

3:02

pink hat on or a Bucket hat

3:04

or shades you know their accessories right that's how

3:06

you style yourself music is the same way when

3:08

I walk into a room Am I gonna be

3:11

an artist today? Or am I gonna be a producer

3:13

and having that ability to turn that

3:16

switch off and on I think makes me a

3:18

lot different Because I really rap you know and

3:20

I really produce for me to come

3:22

into a room I can really decide what I'm gonna

3:24

contribute to the song if anything maybe it's just my

3:26

advice Maybe it's just an arrangement. You know

3:28

maybe they want me to write a hook. You know

3:30

I love r&b music I don't have the best voice

3:33

yet But I've definitely written a lot of

3:35

singing parts that go that comparable for people who

3:37

can actually get there you know playing

3:40

instruments if I have to play piano or Maybe

3:42

even calling the right person to get into the room.

3:45

You know like I've been doing this so long I

3:47

feel like I can contribute to any record in any

3:49

genre not just hip-hop or just my

3:51

group or my own music, but volunteering

3:54

that work or help to any artists you know

3:56

and I've been doing that so this is like

3:59

This is this is what I? I love to do initially. So

4:01

maybe that's what distinguishes me more than anything. It's

4:03

like, this is my dream to do this, you

4:05

know, to be able to help myself and also

4:07

provide the help to other people. Where

4:10

do you... And I really want to talk about

4:12

that because this is something you've been doing for a very

4:14

long time. Like you started when you were 15. For sure.

4:16

I very much understand that story. Like I started this radio

4:18

show when I was 14. See?

4:21

Yeah. Like there's like, yeah,

4:23

there's just something innate in you and like you...

4:26

What really called you to music? You

4:29

grew up in the church. Yeah. But

4:31

I mean that you're around music by being

4:33

in the church. But what really

4:35

called you to it? Man, I'm

4:37

glad you mentioned churches too, right? When you

4:39

go, it's like all these people

4:41

that are really secular music is for God, right?

4:44

So everyone is so good and it's so intimidating.

4:46

I was like, oh man, like I

4:48

want to play drums. I want to play keys, but like I'm

4:51

not going to do it in church. So all these people

4:53

laugh at me under God, you know what I mean? So

4:55

this is like, yo, like I'm going

4:57

to learn this kind of in private. And I

4:59

think initially that desire to make music was my

5:01

family, like my family, no one in my immediate

5:04

family makes music, but our whole house from

5:06

every room to my uncle's, my uncle lived in the

5:08

first floor to my two brothers,

5:10

you know, and my mom and my dad.

5:12

We all had different tastes of music from

5:14

reggae to gospel to R&B, New Jack swing,

5:17

hip hop, old school hip hop, like jazz,

5:19

you know? So I'm hearing Charles Mingus downstairs

5:21

and my uncle smoking Benson and Hedges 100

5:24

cigarettes. You know, and my dad is playing

5:26

yellow man in the living room and

5:28

my mom is playing George Clinton in the bedroom. So

5:31

I'm this kid walking around like it's

5:34

noise for somebody

5:37

that doesn't understand that until I got older. I'm

5:39

like, y'all are playing me some of the best

5:41

artists ever. You know, I didn't listen

5:43

to Barney and Sesame Street, bro. Like that wasn't I was

5:46

always listening to the stuff that was beyond my age,

5:48

you know? So I was forced to grow up a

5:50

lot faster probably than most kids my age. I feel

5:52

like that allowed to do with it. Were

5:56

you called first as an artist or as a producer?

5:58

Artist. And how

6:00

do those roles today overlap, right?

6:03

Like what do you need to

6:05

have that is required for both? I

6:09

think now that I finished my album, I'm actually

6:12

gonna take this hat off and put a pink hat on,

6:14

like I said earlier. And I

6:17

think I move in checkpoints. So even

6:19

during the recording of my album, I

6:22

still scored Black Sheep, Dreds

6:24

from Black Sheep and Jay Dilla's movie on Paramount

6:26

Plus, Call the Choice is Yours. I

6:28

was still able to do that while I did this. And I still

6:31

was able to help Joey Badass with his album. I

6:35

worked with James Blake. Like I still was able

6:37

to, I don't know how, but I

6:40

guess I try to use those sessions as little

6:42

parts to pull from and pull that and bring

6:44

it back to my sessions, bring it home. I

6:47

don't know how I do it. I just make time for

6:49

it. Like I really don't, I

6:51

don't know. Do you feel like you're a collection of all the

6:53

sessions you've ever been in? I definitely say.

6:56

With a good and a bad. Yeah, right. You took with

6:58

me, yeah. Because you learn

7:00

from everything. Yeah, for sure.

7:03

So what

7:06

do you bring to that room that like, I

7:09

guess it is the ability to turn, like

7:11

to be both an artist and

7:13

a producer, but genuinely, why do people want you

7:15

in the room? Have you asked yourself that? Because

7:17

there's something beyond musical ability in

7:19

that moment, right? For sure. Like it has

7:21

to be something about you. Yeah,

7:25

man, I don't, I'm still trying to figure that out, brother,

7:27

maybe it is. Maybe you should never figure

7:29

that out. Maybe I don't want to know. I don't know. I

7:31

would hope because I'm a cool guy. I

7:34

think it's probably that. I don't know. Have

7:36

you seen the documentary about the American Music

7:38

Awards with Quincy and Lionel Richie? I've only,

7:40

yeah, it's on Netflix, right? Yeah, yeah, like

7:42

watching that, so many people was like, yo,

7:45

I'm trying to figure out if you Quincy or Lionel. I'm

7:48

like, why you say that? He's like, because you're friends

7:50

with everybody, bro. Everybody respects you, you

7:52

know. Watching

7:54

that was so inspiring. And I mean, I'm not so

7:56

self-fulfilling to say that I saw that and was like,

7:58

that's me, that's me. I definitely was

8:00

like this is just inspiring. It made me want

8:02

to go get 50 of my friends and put

8:05

up 50 mics and do it. But especially for

8:07

it being for a really good cause. Totally.

8:10

But yeah, man, like I've always had

8:12

the ability to do that. Then I do graphic

8:14

design. So studying graphic design. I did all of

8:17

my merchandise and I've been doing that since I

8:19

was 15 too, you know, like, you

8:22

know, a lot of guys I would assume when

8:24

they're on these labels, there's some

8:26

person does the work for them. Totally. I'm like, I don't

8:28

pick which one you like. And it's like five

8:30

shitty covers. And I'm just like,

8:33

I don't ever want to be in that position. I never forced

8:37

anyone to like create

8:39

a vision for me that didn't align with who

8:41

I am. I was always very hands on from

8:43

typography to step and repeats

8:45

to design, web design, data basing.

8:47

Like I'm a nerd, bro. That's why probably

8:49

they want me in a room. It's

8:52

also built on somebody who like you built a

8:54

career from nothing at a moment in time where

8:56

like the internet was at a very unique in

8:58

a very unique place. Right. Like, and

9:01

I know just because I was there, like people

9:03

knew what it was, but the

9:06

democratization of its use for content

9:09

and this idea that you can like

9:11

go and lay a flag on a

9:13

platform, whatever that platform may be like,

9:16

dude, the flatbush zombie stuff just made

9:18

its way to streaming. But that stuff

9:20

circulated all over the internet

9:22

for a very long time, you

9:25

know, during a totally different moment

9:28

in cultural history and in society.

9:30

It's crazy, you know. So when

9:33

you put all that stuff together, like one,

9:35

you have to learn. Two, you have the

9:38

tools for the first time, I think, in

9:40

like our history to learn. And then

9:43

three, you can utilize all of this

9:45

to build whatever future, whatever destiny you

9:47

fucking want. Right. So what

9:50

has compelled you to keep?

9:54

I used to have to do a ton of

9:56

things to do my show, but eventually, like, I

9:58

handed things off to other people. Why

10:00

do you continue to do absolutely everything or most

10:02

of it? I Watched

10:05

American cycle before I came here Mainly

10:11

because I'm about to go on tour and I was

10:13

like man he kind of does this thing we speak

10:15

some monologues and then in reality not

10:18

because I'm a serial killer, but Thanks

10:20

for clarifying. I just want to say that But

10:24

yeah, it's something about being in

10:26

control Not a

10:28

narcissist either. I got it. But um The

10:31

control that you have especially being independent,

10:33

you know never

10:36

having that big brother help or

10:39

some Cosign that they like,

10:41

you know how we do they can put

10:43

the arm. He's next he's next up I

10:45

never got that ever like, you

10:47

know, I've worked with all these amazing people. I never

10:49

really had anybody Step

10:51

up and tell me I'm next up or flabberg

10:53

zombies, you know, we was always like we

10:56

just From the grassroots bro Like

10:59

I don't really know a means of doing it

11:01

or allowing somebody to do that for me I

11:03

think my album was the first time actually allowed

11:05

somebody to produce for me, you know somebody

11:09

like James Blake like Working

11:11

with him. He told me so much about

11:13

how to write music that I was

11:15

always Being the person

11:17

had to make the beat and then right after and I

11:20

think that your brain at least my brain I Could

11:22

do a lot of stuff at once But I've never

11:25

been able to fully maximize one thing because my brain

11:27

is always very super active and he was

11:29

like well Chill out I'll make the beat

11:31

and you write that initially was

11:33

like it's like wait I

11:35

could actually just focus on one thing. So to what

11:38

you're saying like you can Exceed

11:41

your maximum potential if you focus

11:43

on something singular at some

11:46

moment, you know but I still am

11:48

learning how to allow people to do

11:50

that for me because um They

11:52

have to have to trust you. I'm from the hood bro. Like

11:54

we don't really We Skeptical of

11:56

everything just because the nature of kind of like you

11:58

said, like so much of it is. About. Ah,

12:01

I'm not giving credit. Or

12:04

making it seem like these things happen by

12:06

accident. Ah sagna front of the day about

12:08

the concept of people. Aiming

12:11

lower. Intentionally even outward

12:13

saying these things just in case

12:15

sit doesn't go well, they could

12:17

just downplay the own sit and

12:19

also lights. Yeah.

12:21

I'm a mile was out. But.

12:24

That might slide you what your idols Five

12:27

Years Rose is cool leg. I mean. Is.

12:30

This is not really an album those Morgan mixtape and

12:32

then it goes number one and you'd say something like.

12:35

I. Mean I'm just glad is is they would do is

12:37

like not you supposed to be like this is the

12:39

best album out. I'm as amazon promoting

12:41

my album since I worked my ass off,

12:43

I'm here to promote it. I'm here to

12:45

talk about it. Let's talk about it. But

12:48

we live in a time where like I

12:50

don't know if that's really as cool V

12:52

though I think tal the criticism dissimilar is

12:54

like a weird ego boost. The ego stroking

12:56

they were is hard for you to to

12:58

to really be so cut a you know

13:00

would be confrontational but use hard for you

13:02

to be yourself and say what you think

13:04

about your music and put it at the

13:06

level deserves without receiving like some type of

13:09

like insecure your answer like were you. In

13:11

this known blaze not putting your.

13:13

Music. In a place where league as a or

13:15

on a level that. It. Deserves to

13:18

be recognized that link and will

13:20

few somebody wants to downplay their

13:22

release and secure it is always

13:24

good. Other security bro you have

13:26

to be I've never, I've been

13:28

quiet. You. Know I've been in the

13:30

back, I've been in the cut, but I've never. Not.

13:33

Revered my work or merited myself a

13:35

hard work. Ives. I just don't. Added

13:38

to the doom Dame is not. is that

13:40

enough? This is not small enough that as

13:42

big as huge as artist everyday use be

13:44

microphones dropping sort of soundcloud. What are you

13:46

going to have you been lazy down player?

13:48

See our school A is not cool bro

13:50

you love it. Then let us know did

13:52

you love it? And I think people want

13:54

genuine music and I think that's only thing

13:56

that kept me here because I I can

13:58

be myself that people find sounds a my.

14:01

Confidence. And vulnerability. You know you

14:03

can't just be one in know.

14:05

Finally it is embody on this

14:07

album. All of that he

14:10

said that. Confidence Mana Really? I mean

14:12

bodily. I think there is one are

14:14

building confidence. Absolutely. Are you Max Beat

14:16

the it's hard to get their. To.

14:18

Pop. Your right, it exists.

14:20

We seen it yet. So. How

14:23

does this? And. How.

14:26

Long you are himself for. Five.

14:28

Years From Thirty Five. So

14:30

Thirty Five Years. He. Because

14:32

this is your life Beer. What?

14:35

From starts it. I. Would somebody

14:37

start and finish first? The first song I

14:40

recorded on this album was two three Zone.

14:44

What? About that rec that that

14:46

one record lays out. What? You're doing

14:48

for the rest of the album. So. I

14:50

made that before I moved to L

14:52

A. So I've been here for years

14:55

now. I'm I had jet

14:57

met just met James Blake on

14:59

on. I. Think I was on

15:01

Torn Twenty eighteen. And

15:03

I'm. I want to say

15:05

like he did an interview with someone and he mentioned

15:08

me in the said it I was one his favorite

15:10

artist or produces. I couldn't really believe

15:12

he said that because I've been a such a

15:14

big fan of him with the we all probably

15:16

our rights and on. Man.

15:18

I was add these big dreams right?

15:20

I had. Just. Likes.

15:23

Started. This album and I'm on this

15:25

tour and things have started. My biggest to

15:27

I've been on so far. We came on

15:29

a coffin since it is like spades props

15:31

it was just awesome legs and you know

15:34

I I still said well there's so much

15:36

about me and I've said it's amusing Mad

15:38

times I don't decide to deluxe and I

15:40

don't even think I'm super trippy bro under

15:42

so weird person I could make whatever are

15:44

manifestly know so I never really felt like

15:46

that was my full. And

15:48

me to do so would tell you have them and his room he like.

15:51

Eric. Is is different role. We. going

15:53

to the acid though he gonna make defeats and dude

15:56

other stuff like you gonna and so that my little

15:58

part of me was always like whoa What

16:00

is that album called? What is the album sound

16:02

like? And I was tucking away these like moments

16:04

and two three zone was the first time

16:06

that I've worked with James in person And we made I

16:08

think three songs that day and at

16:10

that moment. I was like, oh I'm making an album like Yeah,

16:14

even if I didn't say anything to him I

16:16

knew that this was like the creation of the next sound

16:19

so some people like oh Eric You got so much better

16:21

like two three zone is almost five years old,

16:23

you know So it just shows

16:25

you like how ahead I really was it wasn't

16:28

like James just made that beat last year or

16:30

For him and for me We were both ahead

16:33

of the game five years ago And

16:35

there was our first time really like meeting in

16:37

the studio too, but also clearly something you were

16:39

meant to do. Absolutely Absolutely.

16:42

Absolutely really interesting that you were the sober one

16:44

out of the three because it is like you

16:46

got labeled like Like

16:51

a psychedelic, you know drug drug

16:53

person. Yeah Like

16:56

you do shrooms and Molly whatever the fuck

16:58

whatever all that shit Yeah, even though you

17:00

were adamant that you would never do it.

17:02

I'll even say in the music and people

17:04

be like, oh no He's not like what

17:06

you think you're fucking around. Yeah. Yeah. How

17:08

much of your genuine self? Was

17:10

represented in flat push zombies? I think that

17:12

was a hundred percent who I am when

17:14

I'm around two of my best friends You

17:17

know cuz like I was telling my friend yesterday on

17:19

the phone I was just laughing like he

17:21

was just telling me like yo, I seen your billboard Whatever

17:25

as you like remember like when we first told

17:27

me that they called you actually I see him

17:29

in person and I think meet His eyes were

17:31

so crazy. I was like, what is like I

17:33

couldn't tell you that you see your friend every

17:35

day But like today is just different. What's going

17:37

on? He just like smiling a lot and

17:40

his girls is I was like, what do you? What's

17:42

going on? He was like, yeah, bro. I'm tripping right

17:44

now. I was like, yeah, you are bro Like he's

17:46

like nah, nah is different and we I don't know

17:48

how old we were young man. So Damn,

17:52

I was just like I never

17:54

judged but I was also like cognizant

17:57

of Their

17:59

natural, untapped, The potential to create and

18:01

I feel like people already like them arm

18:03

the idea of them and I wanted to

18:05

show them how to make music. Together.

18:08

You know, because I think that. Watching.

18:10

Me make music every day. I already saw that they

18:12

were interested in doing it and I wanted to do

18:15

a with them. and they already had doing flabby zombies

18:17

as like wherever was on tumbler and said like that

18:19

I was just the guy the me the music you

18:21

know so. Loudly. Put on know that

18:23

you know my narrative is very weird and I

18:25

think that a lot of the got lost because

18:28

of the popularity. the group me know some people

18:30

think they put me on or lights. Were.

18:32

On acid old time. I'm like bro like.

18:35

I'm. The guy the craved that should be on

18:37

acid bro less. You know how to hell did

18:39

I make old his music and I was it.

18:41

You know I am sober now. I I don't

18:43

smoke weed anymore. You know I start smoking weed

18:45

last. March.

18:48

Our twenty. I don't even smoke or suspect.

18:51

Respect. Year as a big fucking

18:53

deal bro that's a huge deal Brown

18:55

I smoke weed all die battle rifle

18:57

you no idea where it all Day

18:59

one laughing my yeah we get I

19:01

was You think we're in the same

19:04

fucking room Yes you know you imagine

19:06

not be any with a. Get.

19:08

That hit and relax or mel you out.

19:10

I don't have that urged anymore hill but

19:12

okay Marina and. I. Want to

19:14

know how that. Impacts. Your creative

19:17

process but also a you said

19:19

something really interesting was. You.

19:21

Witnessed the potential that your to friends

19:23

had even though they were fucking tripping

19:25

balls. That's. Something that sticks

19:27

with you though, are you like this ability to

19:29

see potential on someone specifically? In some when you're

19:32

going to share a studio space with and try

19:34

to make them better? I was your. Was.

19:36

Your what is it is eerily get through line

19:39

that you you can see between everybody or is

19:41

there. I.

19:43

Think bro like. When

19:45

you create a monica right leg, some people. Like.

19:48

Lil Wayne right? like the go. You know, I

19:50

don't really know the story one hello ways name.

19:52

I'm sure it was probably a name that. testimony

19:55

wonder gotten access my mother gave him given

19:57

him he knows like some d c and

20:00

growing up and his name's just Snick. My uncle used

20:02

to call me Lil' Mella. I

20:04

didn't know what the fuck that meant. Or

20:07

my dad would call me Grasshopper as a kid. I'm like, what

20:09

the fuck do these things mean? But when

20:11

I saw The Matrix, I was

20:13

like, damn, it was like 2000, 1999, 2000. I

20:17

was like, yo, this is the craziest movie of

20:19

all time. It's so crazy. And I was like,

20:21

yo, the architect was this guy in the fucking

20:23

Matrix that was able to see this grid and

20:25

all these people's lives. And it was like, how

20:27

the hell does he, he's sitting there with a

20:29

fly suit, he's in his white. He's

20:32

just sitting there like the TDK commercials like in

20:35

like watching all these people's

20:37

lives manifest. And I was like, yo,

20:39

that's my name, bro. Like I'm the

20:41

person that could see everything and also

20:43

still be composed and not sweat and

20:45

not freak out. And doesn't matter what,

20:49

doesn't matter what's going on, even the

20:51

word architecture, you know, I actually didn't

20:53

do architecture well in college and I

20:55

failed, so I dropped it. But

20:58

just what they see, right, it's a blueprint, right?

21:00

It's like a flat piece of paper, but nothing

21:02

you build in architecture is cheap. It requires time

21:04

and money. And production is the same way. You

21:06

have to kind of believe in someone enough to

21:08

say, well, I'm gonna give this guy my time

21:11

because he's gonna make this skyscraper one day, you

21:13

know? All the shit we see, this room that

21:15

we're in is constructed by an architect. Somebody had

21:17

to build it out so you can live your

21:19

dream. So that's what I wanted to provide to

21:21

people, you know? And that's kind of what the

21:24

name stuck. So maybe that's what we're

21:26

saying here. Like, I was always able to do

21:29

that somehow. When did you realize that that was

21:31

your true gift? Not

21:34

for nothing, bro. My mom passed away on

21:36

Christmas, like four

21:39

years ago, right before I moved here. And

21:41

this is the craziest thing I'm gonna tell you. I'm not even, bro, I've

21:44

already, I've had a gold record. I've been on world

21:46

tours. You would think that it would

21:48

have been during some of that, that I

21:50

would have had that vision or, you

21:52

know, maybe it's like the first time we

21:55

do Coachella or the first time somebody recognizes

21:57

you in the street. Those things

21:59

don't validate. for me. What it really was, bro,

22:01

and this is everything. This is on everything. My

22:04

mom, she suffered from

22:06

diabetes. And during

22:09

her whole life, she supported me and

22:11

my two brothers to

22:14

the utmost degree, bro. Like you couldn't ask what

22:16

better mom, right? And she

22:18

would always call us each other's names. My

22:20

brothers are Chris and Ron, right? Nobody calls

22:22

Popeye, his Ron, Ron to call him

22:24

Popeye, right? That's another story. So

22:26

she always call us each other's names. So you're

22:29

like, Chris, you know what your name

22:32

is. And I'm like, are you talking about me or him?

22:34

Which one are you talking about? And toward the end of,

22:37

you know, we say like, I didn't know at that time

22:39

was going to be end of her life, but she started calling

22:41

me Q, you know, and I was like,

22:45

and what's the name Q? Where the fuck did that come from?

22:47

I just didn't know where it was from. She was like, Oh

22:49

yeah. At the center she went

22:51

to with, because she was blind, she had

22:53

like a blind community of people that she

22:55

was with. And she

22:57

learned braille and I went to with her

23:00

to Helen Keller. So I was

23:02

around people who were very ill all the time. And the

23:04

first thing I noticed was like people that

23:06

suffer from anything they hate to be

23:08

spoken to like this. Are you okay? Oh

23:11

my God. Like why the fuck are you whispering? My mother's

23:14

like, you know, I'm blind, not

23:16

deaf. Why the fuck are you? You can speak

23:18

up. Like come and give me a hug. Come

23:20

blah, blah, blah. And I was always like, she's

23:22

actually making everybody else in his room so comfortable.

23:24

And that made me more comfortable. And then I

23:26

took that with everywhere I went.

23:28

Right? So that's not even the story, bro. So,

23:31

um, she didn't want people to know

23:33

I'm in Flapper Zombies because they just bother her. She's

23:35

with these people all the time, you know, but she

23:37

told him, Oh my son, he rap. And

23:40

then they started slowly. My dad would come with

23:42

Flapper Zombie shirt to pick her up and shit.

23:44

I'm like, Oh God. So they started figuring it

23:46

out. So you started saying, well, we don't say

23:48

your name anymore. We just call you Q. That's

23:50

why when you asked me what the Q is,

23:52

I was like, okay. So,

23:55

um, yeah, she says Q. Um,

23:58

yeah. And I'm like, who is Q? She goes. Quincy

24:01

I was like who's Quincy like Quincy Jones

24:04

and I was like okay

24:07

like where did that as far

24:09

as I know she knows I make beats but she's like you

24:11

rap and I was like yeah she's

24:13

like well Quincy Jones does everything you

24:16

know um and kind of

24:18

like when we started saying like the AMA that we

24:20

are the world post was actually in my basement as

24:22

a kid you know and I would always see it

24:24

and I was like damn you got Stevie and Bruce

24:26

Springsteen you got all these people like all over and

24:29

I was always like wow that's so cool so

24:31

I moved to LA after she

24:33

passes away and I meet Quincy Jones bro

24:36

so whether you

24:39

know I don't know like I'm in his book the last

24:41

book he published he actually writes about me in it and

24:44

um you if you want to

24:46

believe I didn't need the other stuff to tell

24:48

me that bro like it was my mom first

24:50

it wasn't even meeting Quincy Jones it was my

24:52

mother really telling me that you

24:54

know you're able to do whatever you want and

24:56

she has three kids respectfully she didn't say that

24:59

to all three of her children my my my

25:01

brothers have a different you

25:03

know mother brother's a nurse so they have a

25:05

different they're not creative they're not this creative like

25:07

like me you know I'm weird creative so

25:10

just to hear that from her that's when I got

25:12

the validation that was maybe like five years ago bro

25:15

so I lived my whole

25:17

life I had success and I never really believed or

25:20

saw that in me until I really started

25:22

to realize the power that I always had and

25:25

had to nourish it and really value

25:27

myself and then when I met Quincy Jones

25:29

it was like bro I don't that don't

25:31

happen by accident you know man yeah your

25:34

mom knew for sure your

25:37

mom knew that's so

25:40

I've never told that story till now by the

25:42

way so I appreciate your honesty yeah how much

25:44

of your family is made up in the music

25:46

you create even the stuff you do for other

25:48

people because you've talked about your life changing because

25:50

of being an uncle and

25:52

that is a life changing thing I am I

25:54

am I am an uncle you want to see

25:57

yourself in these are so funny heads in the

25:59

craziest ways yeah But

26:01

also your mom must come through in the music too. And

26:04

I'm assuming you feel your mom around you. All the

26:06

time, bro. Even just

26:08

meeting George Clinton. George Clinton, I

26:11

think for my mom it was James Brown, Marvin

26:14

Gaye, maybe the Commodores,

26:17

and George. I think that's probably Sam

26:19

Cooke, probably the top. So even

26:21

meeting this guy, I'm like, what

26:23

the fuck? You're

26:26

like, you are a monument,

26:28

you know? Like, you talking about

26:30

the crossover, hip-hop, and funk? It's like

26:32

he is, he personifies that.

26:35

And when I met him, he was so chill, bro.

26:37

He's like, yeah, he knew one of my

26:39

homies, Black Odyssey. He knew Jewon. I'm like, yeah, bro, that's

26:41

my guy. He's like, yeah, man. He starts singing the

26:43

hook of the song. He's through his 82. And

26:47

then he's like, yeah, man, Benny the Butcher. And

26:50

I was like, yo, what? He knew,

26:52

he's like Griselda. He's like talking about stuff

26:55

right now. He's more

26:57

tapped than probably my dad is. My dad is younger than

26:59

him, you know? So even meeting him, and that's

27:01

the moment I asked him. I was like, dude, I got this song on

27:03

my album. I already had the

27:06

hook and the beat, and I had everything. And

27:08

me and my friend Rudy actually wrote a

27:11

part that was inspired by him

27:14

before we even – before I even had this meeting

27:16

with him. So we talk about something kids met. We

27:18

were like, this is George Clinton's part, and then I

27:20

meet George Clinton too. That's crazy. That

27:22

I asked him, and he did the record, yeah. I

27:27

was not lying, bro. This is the way it works out.

27:29

That's insane. I mean, you believe

27:31

in manifestation. A thousand percent. Because

27:34

all of this that you tell me is like,

27:36

that is manifestation, right? Even down to seeing that

27:38

poster in your basement all the time. That is

27:41

all different forms of it. So how

27:44

does one work with an icon like

27:47

George Clinton? How does that go down? Do you give

27:49

notes? Or do you just – what do you do?

27:51

What do you do? I mean, that's

27:54

probably where I put on my producer hat, where I'm like,

27:57

I never want a person to feel like – First

28:01

of all, in the studio, I don't care

28:03

about records and blue checks and money and

28:06

who you voted for. I don't give a fuck about any of that. We

28:09

are even here. We

28:11

are all – I don't care about how much records you

28:13

saw before you stepped into this room. I approach

28:15

this record. I bring my best self, and so

28:18

does the other person. I don't value myself lower

28:20

or beneath them. That's the first thing. If it's

28:22

not in person, I

28:24

still try to command that energy but also give them

28:26

an ability to be themselves, and I don't really lead

28:28

them very much. The music, if you give it to

28:30

them the right way, they already know what to do.

28:34

This whole like, hands on your hips

28:36

and you pointing to shit on a minority

28:38

report level shit, I don't want to – you know what I mean?

28:41

The music is really the catalyst of why

28:43

we're here, so why do I need to tell you

28:45

to do very much? There's obviously pruning and trimming down,

28:47

but I always ask for more. Give

28:50

me everything – even what I asked George to do,

28:52

he gave me so much more than what I asked

28:55

him to do probably because there was less direction. There

28:57

was so much there sonically, musically, and what the song

28:59

was about. I think he

29:01

already, in hindsight, knew. And

29:03

obviously, there's like a trimming and pruning process of

29:05

making things shape and make sense

29:08

in the mix, but essentially,

29:10

it was really that, bro. It

29:12

was allowing the artist to be themselves. How

29:15

do you do that when it's carrying out

29:17

your own vision and it's your song only?

29:20

Right? Like, it's not a song for them. For sure.

29:23

But it's really yours. It's your vision. It's

29:25

my vision, yeah. So like, how do you

29:27

– he goes

29:29

from you helping them carry out their vision to

29:31

now they're helping you essentially carry out yours, or

29:33

they're adding to it. And

29:35

also, everybody hears the potential

29:38

of somebody subtracting from the vision too, you

29:40

know? For sure. I mean, you know what I

29:42

– I would say this. Let's

29:44

just say somebody like Kimbrough, right? Like,

29:47

obviously, like, Kimbrough

29:49

released an album the

29:52

year before, and she did

29:54

the same to me, right, where she FaceTimed

29:56

me, and we talked about the

29:58

song that she wanted me to do for her. Without

30:01

that, there's

30:03

nothing. If we're not in the same room, you need

30:05

to tell me what the song's about. And even if

30:07

it's not just like, yo, here's the inspiration for

30:10

it, this is what I want you to do, is literally

30:12

like, how you feeling today? What's

30:14

on your mind? Is this even a, is

30:17

it something you wanna do today? Is it something you wanna

30:19

do at all? That's the conversation that has to begin before

30:21

you even hear the music. And I think that like, I

30:25

don't wanna disappoint an artist as a collaborator or

30:27

a feature myself, so I expect the

30:29

same thing on my end. And

30:31

I think for her, I told her about the specific situation I was

30:33

in with the young lady I was with. And

30:35

she was like, oh man, I was in a similar

30:37

situation. I was like, are those

30:39

toxic? I was like, yes, cause me

30:42

and you relate to that. A song like Breaking

30:44

Point is the same situation. All of us had

30:46

went through a breakup. So I was like, yes,

30:49

like the people that I had imagined in my

30:51

head sonically sound great, but do we have something

30:53

in common aside from the music? And that's what

30:55

I'm trying to channel as an artist and as

30:57

a producer, it's like, do we

30:59

have a similar narrative that we all can express ourselves

31:01

in? So like Breaking Point, I

31:04

think two of us had just went through a breakup and the other

31:06

two were kind of still in love. Then my

31:08

other friend who played lap steel on it is very much

31:10

in love with his new son. So it's

31:14

a harmony that I'm trying to build in

31:16

world building, not just like, yo,

31:19

let's get some names to click on the internet. He's

31:22

bigger than that. And by the way, it's not

31:24

an identical vision, but it's like a similar energy

31:26

to their vision and outlook and where they're at

31:28

at that point in their life. For sure. What

31:31

do you say? It's a different way

31:33

to look at collaborators than like, you know

31:35

what I mean? Just who's gonna either sound

31:37

the best and or add to streams or

31:39

popularity. Yeah, I don't for,

31:43

I'm sure nobody would like me to say that, but I

31:45

don't really care about how cool you are

31:47

on the internet. Like, I

31:50

don't know. I would work with

31:53

a bum if he was great. Like if I

31:55

felt bummy and I felt I wanted to feel

31:57

like man, like, I don't

31:59

know. You read the mole people that book Kind

32:03

of change your perspective on homelessness in general and

32:05

but poverty is something that like wow It's

32:08

such a rigid real place that we

32:10

should never experience But it's like instead

32:12

of actually living that you can actually live through the

32:15

life of that person if you're allowing them to be

32:17

themselves And not judging them you know totally so just

32:19

imagine what how you can apply that to all the

32:21

people in your life and When you

32:23

have an issue in front of you you can do anything. That's what I feel

32:26

But do you believe anybody has the potential

32:28

to do anything with an instrument I? Think

32:31

you could do something. I don't know how good is gonna be

32:33

yeah, but yeah What do

32:35

you think you're like your real

32:38

gift is like what do you think

32:40

your truest talent is? I think my truest talent

32:42

bro is being a friend Respect

32:45

I'm a real friend bro like I may not Call

32:48

you at 12 o'clock on your birthday but

32:52

Everybody that knows me is like if you talk

32:55

to Eric bro You had at least one really

32:57

deep conversation bro like cuz I'm gonna give it

32:59

to you, bro Like I'm gonna I don't mind

33:01

Opening myself up to someone to allow them

33:04

to tell me about themselves sometimes I even

33:06

know it without them knowing it and I'm

33:08

like just tell by how you're you walked

33:10

in here or just like Your

33:12

cadence I'm like oh you want to have

33:14

one But you don't know how to bring it up and I'm

33:16

gonna I'm gonna I'm gonna tap in you know But

33:19

that's probably friendship bro like music and all that stuff

33:22

You know it's I'm blessed to be

33:24

able to do that but what I'm really good at is Being

33:27

a friend building and bringing people

33:29

together, you know We'll

33:32

be no flappy zombies if we weren't friends this whole time,

33:34

you know and To

33:36

me it doesn't matter who does what I think it's

33:38

a matter of what we accomplished together What

33:41

was it like going sober from cannabis in the

33:43

middle of making an album? It's funny

33:47

The last song that I remember recording when I was

33:49

high was Ezekiel's wheel. I was like I gotta tap

33:51

in like This

33:55

might be the last time that I Indulged

33:58

some weed but I was. But

34:00

I'm. Yeah. Finishing

34:03

album at the That's a great question Hearing

34:05

a masters sober. I've never done that like

34:07

I'm always been blasted. like listening to the

34:09

City Youth I forget. You want to ruin

34:11

me This The first time that I might.

34:14

Literally like my posture. his hands on my side.

34:18

Effect. Like I'm meditating is

34:20

said like this is a required me

34:22

to be some was more heads into

34:24

nuance and details on that. I feel

34:26

like sometimes when I'm high everything is

34:28

a soul Fire with fire broke his

34:30

is so it's an emotional experience rights.

34:33

But then it's like. I. Wanted

34:35

to say something different was want to show

34:37

myself to what I could accomplish from sobriety

34:39

and also dislike. but I don't drink alcohol

34:41

but even called ago I'm. Gonna. Kick.

34:43

That's who I'm I'm orange wine is it? Now you

34:45

know you know I think so Be will say this

34:48

well he does you But I'm like best kept as

34:50

I'll be. Smoking Blade Why don't smoke them You know.

34:53

What within the hopefully what you decide

34:55

to. Get. Rid of him As. As

35:00

a way to question. I will save.

35:03

A with. The. Realize that

35:05

I had on it is. you know, everybody

35:07

I'm around with smokes way more than me.

35:09

a motorcycle young big chief. Guys.

35:11

You know, by don't smoke cheaply. A

35:14

small good we say I feel that

35:16

I'm scared as most expensive we reserved

35:18

for you know divide brother you. Start

35:22

looking their finances. I'm like damn, this is

35:24

a whole oh God yes Darcy know what

35:26

it did me. And.

35:29

I'm so you can relate to be like i

35:31

you get paid right you get fond hours of

35:33

are really got like two city as i got

35:35

a spin to fit the it on his bets

35:37

you already took it out really was faced with

35:39

as even if think about food new the shirt

35:41

is it socks underwear you like i've really got

35:43

less the when i really have a.about as we

35:45

the does the first thing and then like. Just.

35:48

For me, like. I. Think I'm

35:50

actually. More. Creative sober

35:53

because I don't have a distraction and

35:55

I think that what we'd does to

35:57

me. like i don't on

36:00

I don't perform on any drug

36:02

or alcohol at all.

36:04

So people are like, yo Flappin' zombies contracts

36:06

are so crazy, you must be blasted up

36:08

there. I'm sober as fuck. Even

36:11

before you gave him cannabis? I've

36:13

been that way. I never, any

36:16

footage you see me jumping up and down and doing

36:18

shit, I'm sober. I wouldn't drink that whole day. I'll

36:21

drink after the show, but I won't smoke weed.

36:23

That's the first thing. I don't smoke that whole

36:25

day. And I won't drink that whole day either.

36:27

So for me, those are things

36:30

to relax and chill. I don't

36:32

know how people get so angry and want to get turnt

36:34

up off of that shit, especially weed. That doesn't make sense

36:36

to me. I'll forget that I'm performing, bro. I

36:39

would just feel like I'm about to watch

36:41

basketball or the Knicks or

36:43

some shit. Will you be able to work? You

36:45

can make music. Yeah, I can make music, but being in front of

36:48

people is just different, bro.

36:50

Y'all paid to see me today? Like,

36:53

fuck, man. That's

36:56

so funny to me. I have those sobering thoughts and

36:59

those moments of being mad high. I don't know. How

37:01

long did it take? Was it hard to give up

37:03

weed at first? Temptation,

37:05

physically? I'm not going to lie.

37:08

I started having withdrawals when

37:11

I first stopped, because it wasn't like I realized it, right?

37:13

It was just like I was busy. And I just like,

37:15

oh, shit, I didn't smoke today. And then

37:17

that became like, damn, I don't feel like going to

37:19

the shop. Then it became, damn, I

37:22

don't really want to spend $100 right now. Then

37:25

it became, fuck it, I'm going to see how long it

37:27

could go. And then it became, I think

37:30

I'm good, just like that. Wow. But

37:32

really, it starts with a distraction. Because

37:36

to me, on my last

37:40

project, Future Proof, I had said, used

37:44

to think I wasn't shit without weed, but

37:47

how could any live without me? And

37:50

I was just like, man, weed is a plant. It's a

37:52

living thing. We break it. We smoke it. But it's like,

37:54

I'm living, too. I Don't need to rely on

37:56

something else to be my vice. I Don't want

37:59

to. I don't want

38:01

to feel like the only time you like me is when

38:03

I'm. Inebriated. You.

38:05

Know why I feel like sometimes. The.

38:07

Communal part of the of weed is what I

38:09

like the most which is like everybody smoking and

38:11

talking shit. But. Then when I backed up,

38:14

I don't judge or Siegel the same I told ya.

38:16

never judge my friends and it was taken Drugs is

38:18

it. But. The same time. In.

38:21

Those moments I never felt like myself

38:23

either. Like. Like. Why am I doing this?

38:25

I don't need to smoke weed today. bombed is doing it.

38:27

Has air by smoking weed. And then like.

38:29

This. General Idol fit and will. Most people wrote

38:32

like I just don't like, I'm just too. I.

38:35

Don't know. Even in a crowd of people

38:37

I know I don't face sometimes discuss I'm.

38:40

Just. Different. I don't know. I don't know what.

38:42

Would. That stems from really is probably just like the

38:44

stuff. I'll say you were my mom and is growing

38:46

up. I. Just don't have a lot

38:48

in common with lot of people besides. Emotional.

38:52

Connection. But. General

38:54

interest everybody has thinking about like.

38:57

Some. Other shit and I'm thinking about Light the

38:59

mit to go play Persona Five right now. He

39:01

saw or like. Yeah. Think about this

39:03

and I'm thinking by like. Him.

39:06

Like. These. Is new for total

39:08

Sox from Japan. I want to buy. Why?

39:11

Why? Or like, well do bring a better

39:13

time back You know. As the cyber said

39:15

I think about in. Some

39:18

place where everybody's like my hire some say in i mean

39:20

like maybe to begin to to but for me it just

39:22

i feel like we never had to in common and like.

39:25

I'm. Already pretty high. weird without that.

39:27

You. Know fan of Damocles? may your high

39:30

without gums us. To There's no way

39:32

I was able to accomplish what I have been if

39:34

I was. It may be naturally psychedelic or tempted calling

39:36

Nine Year. I agree with that. Like I do believe

39:38

that the universe is a you. You have to be

39:40

connected somehow I think and eating. Selling the universe as

39:42

a handling. Music. being like voted

39:45

upon people and like you're just a vessel i

39:47

kind of shit i like big part of the

39:49

my my brain bleed and aca see that as

39:51

you i actually ten i'm a big manifesting i

39:54

used on egg on the universe yeah i'm i'm

39:56

i believe our aims have din or at least

39:58

i try to be So you can

40:00

listen to I've Never Been Here Before It's Waiting For

40:02

You on Amazon Music. There's going to be a link

40:04

below. I mean speaking of

40:06

being weird, Parkour. Oh that's

40:09

weird. Yeah. Like that's

40:12

number three on the album. Yeah. Well

40:14

I mean it is after, it's

40:16

after like the actual, I don't know

40:19

why I just got physical about it. But

40:21

like it is like, it is

40:23

Parkour. Yeah. Okay cool. It's,

40:26

it's, the interesting thing is

40:29

all the titles of the album, I tried to pick things that

40:31

were a bit like, I don't know, not

40:34

to shit on Andy Bousette's album but I don't want to like

40:36

click your album at 12 and see like your track list is

40:38

like forever. Love

40:41

yourself. I love it. First

40:44

day back. Like it's just stuff that when you type

40:47

it in like 90 people's songs are going to come

40:49

up. So I was like thinking like damn

40:52

what is something, what are things that if you typed

40:54

it in more than likely you're just going to find

40:56

my face on the internet. Fuck yeah. Or

40:59

what I think people forget about is because a

41:01

lot of it's visual recall, if somebody's searching and

41:03

sees a song that's titled weird, they're going to

41:05

click it right. Like one of the big case

41:07

studies on that was Alec Benjamin when he had

41:10

his like first mixtape, he had like Kill Somebody

41:12

for You or something. And that song was never

41:14

expected to do anything but they attributed the up

41:16

taking streams to the name because everybody was like

41:19

what the fuck does that mean? Right. You

41:22

know? Yeah. So people are going

41:24

to tap into Parkour. Parkour is a huge thing. It was actually

41:26

the office episode that I was thinking about. Parkour, Parkour. I

41:29

was thinking about that shit. I was like yo they fucking that

41:31

was and then I forgot like planking and all it was like

41:33

these trends and I'm like people who do

41:35

Parkour take that shit so fucking seriously. So much people

41:37

that did were hitting me up like oh bro thank

41:39

you. We need an anthem. I was like. What?

41:42

That definitely wasn't my attention. I was just trying to

41:44

get it jumping like Parkour. You know? And

41:47

it's funny when I did that. Really

41:52

like James had I don't

41:55

really remember it was he had

41:57

Moved to a different house. so was he actually. Mamoru

42:00

are we will take an eight we always does could

42:02

and talk shit. Make. Fun of people

42:04

and as make music. Arm.

42:07

As a healthy cycles healthy cycle, he's playing.

42:09

That said, Als like burrow. What is this?

42:11

And then you know I don't know. Some

42:14

people like oh I don't like Origin is

42:16

Not Olds Moon. It's. Sound. Toys.

42:18

If you're a nerd you know some it was. It is

42:20

not old soon but. Just trying something

42:22

that really represented different parts of nice you

42:24

have like the skewed voice be a my

42:26

real voice the of the high pitched voice.

42:28

So I. Thought those like three different people

42:30

and I thought it was the best way to start

42:32

the album. to be like your Eric is more than

42:34

one person. That was what I miss him with the

42:36

say back to What August My really sick. So.

42:39

I thought that was madam porn to be

42:41

first before you heard as he goes, wheel

42:43

and steaks or ambrosia even you know that

42:46

was like. One. Of them

42:48

later songs and I recorded but I blaze a come off

42:50

first is it was closer to being like sonically different than

42:52

what people expect the for me. I

42:55

mean, by the way, like a leaky burgee down

42:57

to characters that you're playing. A

43:00

l Much of those three individuals make it's

43:02

way into the album or is it like

43:04

as a the okay. We'll. Use

43:06

it like we've What is it? So. Be.

43:08

Tired their i'm play one character rec

43:10

center the right and the cards there.

43:14

Is Mandeville and right. So I saw

43:16

some people say an online like yo

43:18

subtle Mf Doom and I'm like nah

43:21

nah not like. I. Love doom

43:23

but I my is not the mad villain

43:25

is Mandeville and were when you see really

43:27

quickly like oh you china like nominal. Mandeville.

43:30

The place and you may go on. My dad is from. So.

43:32

Like Mandeville. Or Mandeville.

43:35

Mandeville. When. I was say

43:37

it butler. Arm. Is

43:40

obsolete. In Jamaica whereas like

43:42

still poverty is beautiful we know people

43:44

go to resorts in elicit and sandals

43:46

Jamaica and all the stuff but Like

43:48

is really still. pretty like

43:50

fucked up place as far as was still

43:53

happening there on my father obviously want to

43:55

escape and it comes to america as an

43:57

immigrant's that story is so common wow from

43:59

his lab which is people from Trinidad, from

44:01

Grenada, all over the Caribbean that come to

44:03

New York, specifically for this dream. A lot

44:06

of them become construction workers, electrical engineers, like

44:08

my dad. So, damn,

44:10

I was just shitting on a lot

44:13

of people last summer. I was just shitting on

44:15

people. Like, yo, this shit is garbage to me. Wow,

44:18

everybody's getting these clicks and plays, but do the

44:20

clicks and plays mean that something is good? Or do they

44:22

mean it's popular? Some of my favorite albums don't have streams

44:24

like that. And

44:26

I don't wanna use that as a ledger

44:28

to be how good something is, but we're

44:30

so infatuated with statistics and numbers that people

44:33

won't allow anything to be good

44:35

if it has too many plays or not

44:37

enough plays. It's a weird dance going on.

44:39

So, yeah, I decided that the Mondaville part

44:41

of me is the part of me that

44:43

doesn't give a fuck. And

44:45

it's the villain part of me. So, I

44:47

combined both of those words together to be

44:50

the Mondavillain. And that is a character that

44:52

you can tap into when you feel insecure

44:54

or you wanna champion your

44:56

confidence. So, that was what

44:58

I initially started writing from. I was

45:00

like, well, there's me. And then

45:02

there's the part of me that I need

45:05

to be vulnerable, but powerful. So,

45:07

the voice changes, even in the

45:09

song, Mondavillain. Originally,

45:12

when I had recorded the chorus, I was

45:14

watching Godfather. And I

45:16

was like, man, they just spoke with such

45:18

fucking the Sopranos, just this boss shit. I

45:20

was like, yo, the beat, it just called

45:23

for this attitude. So, I put ice

45:25

in my mouth. And then I started

45:27

saying the chorus, they say, look, I'm

45:29

born of fud. And when I first

45:31

played it, people would say, who is that? I'm like, that's

45:33

me. And I was like, well, I

45:35

don't want people to not understand what I'm saying, so

45:38

I'm just gonna use that as a method to rerecord

45:40

it with this other person in mind. And I think

45:42

that's when I started to be like, oh, let me

45:44

change my voice naturally instead of all the effects on

45:46

the computer and to create this character. Wait, that's real.

45:49

So, is it one? Is it you and one other

45:51

character, really? Yeah, yeah. And

45:54

is every, not every song written from his perspective

45:56

or does it go back and forth? I would

45:58

say... Anytime

46:00

the voice is changing where it's not my

46:02

natural voice. That's the character got it Yeah,

46:05

what is this character to you? Like what part

46:07

of you is in this sometimes? I think that's

46:09

who I really am, bro I just

46:12

I just want to be tolerable so the world

46:15

can click my stuff and like me the things

46:17

that I think sometimes Why people are probably not

46:19

good, but I come from a good place. I

46:21

just disheartened by laziness

46:23

and people just Not

46:25

being genuine and I try to be patient

46:29

with the world, but it just the stuff especially

46:31

with social media is just I'm so sad by

46:35

How much people devalue themselves and how much they'll

46:37

do anything for attention it bothers me a lot

46:40

So that's why I was like I can't be like that

46:42

all the time Let me just use music to be the

46:44

vessel and expression and then use this

46:46

character to blame him kind of like South Park

46:48

You know yeah, yeah, it is

46:50

interesting that you you bring up like It

46:54

is sad what people have used the internet

46:56

for because it didn't like it didn't start

46:58

this way and now I don't know what happened

47:00

is weird right. I thought it was just me

47:02

sometimes I'm just like damn guaranteed when you post

47:04

something somebody's gonna say some shit. That's like Why

47:07

bro like what the fuck and it could be

47:10

the most sad thing it's my like lol I

47:12

was like what like picture the asshole

47:14

that's doing that like It's

47:16

like put your his face or his anime avatar that

47:18

he's hiding behind cuz he doesn't want anybody to like

47:21

Geologue him and find where he lives he puts like Akira

47:24

is his fucking Avatar, he's like

47:26

typing somebody sucks, and it's just like dude like you

47:29

have time for that shit I don't have time for

47:31

that. I couldn't imagine doing that. Oh no they have

47:33

his time It

47:35

is the Internet's crazy. It's crazy, bro.

47:37

It literally is and the people are

47:39

bored bro. Yes Yes,

47:43

yes, yes, yes, what are you thinking? I've

47:45

heard you call the flatbush zombies a band and not

47:47

a group before you explain that I make

47:50

all the beats It's a band Okay,

47:54

right Hmm

47:58

what is a band? It's music,

48:01

right? That music is not outsourced

48:03

to another person. A

48:05

member that's one of the people that's on stage

48:08

produced the music that you're listening to. Is that

48:10

the like the bare bones definition?

48:13

It is to me, but I

48:15

don't know. I don't associate bands with necessarily live

48:17

music. I get that.

48:19

You know, that's what I was about to say initially. Then

48:22

I thought to myself, no, there's so many boy bands, girl

48:24

bands, whatever you want to say. Does

48:26

Backstreet Boys play their own instruments? No. But

48:28

like, would you say band and group are

48:31

interchangeable? To some. To

48:33

some. I'd say somebody like Mobb Deep,

48:35

that's still a band to me. They

48:37

have original music and their duo and

48:39

Havoc makes all the beats. That's

48:43

different from Smith

48:45

and Wesson. They're a

48:47

group. And

48:49

what's the difference there? Is somebody giving them the

48:52

music? Yeah, you still have to rely. The person

48:54

that's part, I would say the clips when they

48:56

had Pharrell was more of a band than when

48:58

they weren't. When he did the first couple albums

49:00

and when they stopped working with them or however

49:02

that worked. Sorry.

49:05

What's the difference between a performer and an artist? Not

49:09

every good artist is a good performer. Right?

49:14

Yeah. So you may sound great in the studio and

49:16

then when you're in front of people, we sound like

49:18

shit. Or some people who perform

49:20

great, they have the right energy, but their music

49:22

doesn't translate the same way. Or

49:25

they can't hold their own in the studio. Or

49:27

they need so many people to help them write that

49:30

or accomplish that dream. But on

49:32

the stage, you tear it up. I don't know. What

49:35

do you think about people who have 15 writers

49:37

on a song? Is

49:39

the song fire? I mean,

49:41

yeah. Well, you can make the case that that's how

49:43

Beyonce works, right? Yeah. Is the song fire? It's great.

49:45

And I know that Beyonce sits in the studio and

49:47

takes a bunch of different parts from a bunch of

49:49

different songs and she's the one doing it.

49:51

That's sick. Right. That's sick. Think about

49:54

what's her name? Why don't you just

49:56

meet me in the middle? Oh my God. Yeah.

49:58

Yeah. So many people touch that song. Like

50:00

a hit if that's what if you have 15 people on

50:02

the song that it goes nowhere. That's a little like Probably

50:08

one less person maybe and it would have

50:10

got a brother happens all the time. Hey,

50:12

you know, but I think I won't

50:15

say People

50:17

are infatuated with the idea of I did this

50:20

myself mentality which I think It's

50:22

kind of dumb. I mean these artists will pay people

50:25

off of song Why

50:27

though why is it so cool to just do

50:29

things, you know Like we said earlier

50:31

right like if I chose to do something myself was

50:33

cuz I feel like I can best do it But

50:35

I'm not gonna remove other people's effort to

50:38

polish mine. That's weird You

50:40

know if you did the work you absolutely should

50:42

have all representation, you know, but if you didn't

50:44

do anything Then it

50:46

is mine, you know or but I don't think

50:48

it makes it less yours because you have 15

50:50

people on it I just think that all you

50:53

guys energies created this thing together as a producer

50:55

Do you think AI hurts or helps the creative

50:57

process knees and asking that? Yeah,

51:00

cuz I don't know why that's every

51:02

major superstar about it Alan Iverson is

51:04

a great basketball player AI

51:08

but AI the technology. I

51:10

don't know like I don't know how

51:12

I feel about it. It's What

51:14

I didn't like was like when they were using

51:16

the AI to um Bring back

51:18

to it from the dead. That shit is weird or

51:21

did you keep people's voices? Only in here the other

51:23

day they go if I have a song that I

51:25

think is good for ariana grande I'm gonna fucking get

51:27

an ariana AI thing and I'm gonna put it on

51:29

there. Well, that's crazy. It's crazy I did

51:32

see people use it to reference something that

51:34

you want to sell the reference tracks. Yeah,

51:36

that's I Guess

51:38

that's cooler. But it must be weird for the artists

51:40

to hear themselves as a eyes weird as fuck. Um

51:44

Yeah, I guess I don't like it, bro Um

51:48

Just like it makes me think

51:50

about all the money that I spent, you know on real

51:53

equipment You know, I have a quick story,

51:55

you know when uh, when um the

51:59

black album When there

52:01

was a documentary that when

52:03

Pharrell was talking to Jay and he's like, yeah, like, you

52:06

talk about Allure and he's like major seven chords. And I

52:08

was like, bro, I didn't know what that means at that

52:10

time. But that sounds, Pharrell make everything sound so good and

52:12

shit. That's dope. Like, I'm looking in the video and I'm

52:15

trying to like see like, what, what,

52:17

what, what keyboard is using using the Triton Extreme? I

52:19

must have watched it so many times like also Triton.

52:21

And I remember I told my mom, I was like,

52:23

yo, if I get this, I'm going to blow up

52:26

because Pharrell got it. And there was

52:28

a beat, the sound from Allure is like when you

52:30

pressed one of the presets, it was like, I

52:33

didn't even buy it for like a pad or for

52:36

like a keyboard or a synth. Like it was for

52:38

that sound effect. I just wanted to do that stupid.

52:41

And I bought it off eBay and

52:43

I used it for like a week and I found the sound

52:45

from Allure and I just did. I was like,

52:48

damn, that's so dope. And then

52:50

it broke. And it just

52:52

makes me think like, if that was AI,

52:54

like, I never would have learned

52:56

that value a lesson. I would just been like, give

52:59

me the sound from Allure. Like, I

53:01

wouldn't understand that you don't buy something just for

53:03

a moment. And you know, you have to, you

53:05

have to understand why you purchased something that's $2,000

53:07

when you're like 19 years old,

53:09

like you can't just, money is a growing

53:11

trees, you know, AI kind of, to me,

53:14

it stops you from realizing that actual

53:16

work is required to get something beautiful.

53:19

It's, it's almost like

53:21

how fast you can type something, not really

53:24

about how smart you are, how creative you are. It's

53:26

like, God falls down steps

53:28

with carrot in his mouth and pickle in

53:30

his ass. It's like, what? Like, what

53:32

does that sound like? And we find you could

53:34

tell you should be able to tell the producer

53:36

that he plays one chord and that could take

53:38

however long. But if it's dope, it's dope. AI

53:41

kind of jolts it for me,

53:43

bro. And with the art too, it's weird too.

53:45

Like, it has this, if you

53:47

ever look at it, they can't do hands well. But

53:50

once they get that, it's gonna get scary. It's

53:52

over. Yeah, the hands are weird. They're always like

53:54

in this weird look like, like

53:56

sausages or something. You

54:01

hit the nail on the head in a few different

54:03

ways right there like it is See

54:06

it is kind of scary. It is kind

54:08

of fucking scary. It is scary Back

54:11

to scary. Yeah, by the way listen to the

54:13

album. It's waiting for you on Amazon music Also,

54:15

you can listen to Eric the architect you can

54:17

listen to Flatbush zombies all the music because it's

54:20

now on streamers Who pushes you to make that

54:22

decision? I Everybody

54:25

question so who pushes me to put things

54:27

on streaming yeah Well yeah for Flatbush zombies

54:29

because you made it very for

54:31

many many moons without it. I did yeah, you want

54:33

to make money It's

54:36

you stop yourself of being accessible. Oh, yeah,

54:38

it was cool It was really rebellious for

54:40

a while till you're like damn,

54:42

bro. We got an awesome our best

54:45

shit people like oh I never heard that what

54:47

like and to us to our fans.

54:49

They're like dude How could you not know you know

54:51

my biggest song with the group is to to to

54:54

I've seen this tattoo? Everywhere,

54:56

bro, like I see it almost

54:58

just as much as I would see flatbush

55:00

zombies And this song just got on streaming

55:03

last year isn't that crazy the song came

55:05

out 2013 So to all these

55:07

people that have been tattooing this only have heard it through

55:09

YouTube and spinner low whatever fuck

55:11

SoundCloud That's crazy to think about

55:13

but okay, but It's

55:16

wild that it's only existed in those

55:19

niche little places for as long as

55:21

it has yeah But it still turns

55:23

into something so much larger for sure

55:25

does any part of you regret not

55:27

going on to streaming sooner Maybe

55:32

a little just as the producer.

55:34

It's like it'd be nice to get paid

55:36

for that oh Yeah

55:40

Yeah, the production part I little sore. I mean

55:42

think about it palm trees is probably

55:44

one of the biggest songs on the internet I've You

55:48

tell me like I don't what happened like

55:50

your money Yeah, it

55:52

hasn't showed up. It hasn't that's it. Well. There is

55:54

not you missed out on it Yeah, we did it

55:57

we release his music before that was like the thing.

56:00

So the thing was shoot a

56:02

video and put it on the

56:04

internet. Have you thought about maybe like trying to like,

56:07

so there is something to back catalog going

56:10

viral more than ever and songs that are

56:12

really great. It doesn't matter the year. Like

56:14

I believe that like quality records like that

56:16

are timeless. Absolutely. Some of the best songs

56:19

in history were made and sat on for

56:21

years before they released and came out and

56:24

were fucking like you made

56:26

them and heard them for the very first time.

56:28

Facts. There is

56:30

something to like those songs finding new

56:32

life and then making its way to

56:35

a I don't know, more wide

56:37

home. Yeah. For people. Yeah.

56:41

Like I don't know that there's like I

56:43

have friends all the time that like we'll

56:45

have a song from two albums, three albums

56:47

ago, pop off on TikTok. Yeah. And then

56:49

it ends up really affecting their entire catalog,

56:51

right? Because like they see a surge. Yeah,

56:53

I think eventually probably will go keep going

56:55

back and getting them all but like

56:58

I was sampling so much during

57:00

the 10th year anniversary, better

57:03

of dead vinyl. So

57:05

that was in September and we toured in

57:07

December. That was really

57:09

like eye opening because we had a

57:11

successful tour and also just

57:14

on some production shit. It's like I

57:16

mean, I declare Gorilla samples. Yeah, that's

57:18

crazy. Clear Black Moon, Super Rainbow. I

57:20

had to clear. Jesus,

57:23

I don't even think about it anymore. Like so many

57:25

people, so much money and people like, put

57:27

it on. You don't care about us. Upload it

57:29

now. I'm like, you want me to go to

57:31

jail? Like you want me to not have anything

57:33

like, you know, so you fell in love with

57:35

this music, but it was so creative. It was

57:37

so emotional. We didn't think it about it. I

57:39

was in thinking 10 years from now we have

57:42

to clear those samples. And I can make the case

57:44

that if you were thinking about it, you would have

57:46

stifled the art and it would never be what it

57:49

was. Like if you were making this to fit into

57:51

a box that was super wide and mainstream that had

57:53

like standards and practices attached to it, you may have

57:55

never made those records. For sure. I agree. I

57:58

think it would have been, you would have been sold. Constricted

58:00

to be like okay. Well Why

58:03

why sample this if they're never gonna click like

58:05

the grill is grow the gorillas are like come

58:08

on Damon Auburn is probably top

58:11

10 for me and I Mean

58:14

I played I Mean

58:17

I know the real song I sampled so it was

58:19

like kind of hard to imagine it without it But

58:21

I didn't do very much so I was really worried

58:23

that he wouldn't clear it and he did So

58:26

huge because it has to be personally cleared I

58:28

think a lot of people don't even know that

58:30

rightly all down to the ad and like it

58:32

Yeah, it's down to the actual fucking artist It's

58:36

up to them or if they pass like it's whoever

58:38

was next to can or is in turn of the

58:40

decisions But it is very personal. It's

58:43

not like a label making that decision That's like somebody

58:45

taking something that we had conversation with and make a

58:47

beat and you're like, you know what? Yes,

58:49

my show. I don't want to know I don't like that then

58:52

they can't do anything about it And then if

58:54

you try to like get around it You

58:57

already aware of it. So I'll use still sue them anyway

58:59

He's like, bro, I told you not to use it and

59:01

now you did a fake version of what? You

59:04

played for me. It has to sound so different that

59:06

I don't get upset, you know, especially if you want

59:08

to be dissoci Disassociated and we're

59:10

not an easy group to listen to like

59:12

that. Like we say some shit. So I'm

59:16

grateful that all those people we didn't really get rejected by anybody

59:18

You know, I think that they see through it and

59:21

could be able to tell satire and music and that

59:23

we love this shit You know and by the way

59:25

your pop culture references are woven throughout everything that you

59:27

do your cultural references are woven even through the album

59:29

That you know, you shout out fucking Alexa on one

59:31

of the records, you know ladies Is

59:34

that a conscious thing or can you explain

59:36

to me how you craft a song like

59:38

for nothing? We'll

59:41

go back to production but like lyrically you're putting

59:43

the lyrics to production, but are you writing are

59:45

you mumbling? What are you doing? I see a

59:47

lot of people do the mumble thing I'm

59:51

a writer. I like writing. I write all the time You

59:55

just stream of consciousness a

59:57

lot of times if it's a song like

59:59

Ezekiel's wheel where it's just like bar,

1:00:01

bar, bar, bar, bar, that's extremely conscious. I'll tell you I

1:00:04

was high. So. It's

1:00:07

like you roll up the right one, you know when it's

1:00:09

the right one? I was like damn, it just keeps going.

1:00:12

Like I just kept going. But then there's a song like

1:00:14

say Jam B Jam where I'm like cool,

1:00:16

this is about an ex, I don't fuck Lizz. Do

1:00:18

you know what I mean? I don't fuck with Shorty.

1:00:20

So I wanna write something that's gonna piss

1:00:23

her off and make it catchy enough to be like

1:00:25

okay, if she hears this, she gonna be like, I

1:00:28

like this song, I fucking can't stand him though. I

1:00:30

think about little petty shit like that that's even

1:00:33

if it's, I

1:00:35

don't stretch the truth but I try to find something

1:00:37

that I feel like we all can relate to and

1:00:41

I build, I build a, I don't

1:00:43

wanna describe it, almost like after

1:00:47

see outside, I call it zooming out, right?

1:00:50

There's audience, man I don't know why I'm

1:00:52

telling everybody my, okay but whatever. There's museum,

1:00:55

right? There's museum music. And

1:00:58

I'm not saying this applies to everything but

1:01:00

for me, this is how I hear music

1:01:02

sometimes unfortunately. There's stuff for the museum and

1:01:04

there's the audience, right? All of

1:01:06

my favorite songs have museum and audience

1:01:09

qualities which means that like museum is

1:01:11

like when you go see Basquiat

1:01:14

or Picasso, you might see something that

1:01:17

say holy shit, how

1:01:19

did he do that? Wow, you have a

1:01:21

voice like Adele, you're like oh my fucking

1:01:23

gosh, how is that person doing this? And

1:01:25

then you have audience that's maybe like Jackson

1:01:28

Pollock where it's like a splash of paint. You're

1:01:30

like I could do that, I could

1:01:33

do that, that's easy. You know how much artists people

1:01:35

say that about? They be like anybody could do that

1:01:37

until they step into that place and they say holy

1:01:39

shit, like it's actually not as

1:01:41

easy as I thought. I think every good song

1:01:43

has a piece of both of those worlds. Something

1:01:46

that is so fantastic that you can't replicate it

1:01:48

and a part of it you think you can.

1:01:51

So that the person never feels left out. Sometimes when

1:01:54

I'm rapping fast and I put the

1:01:56

mic out, people are

1:01:58

like, I'm like oh shit, cause you can't. rap fast

1:02:00

like me that's my museum but

1:02:04

so much grand unzip the bag who

1:02:06

can't say that it's like everybody can

1:02:08

say that you know all hit records

1:02:10

have that element of like this person

1:02:12

provides me both of those things so

1:02:14

when I'm writing I definitely

1:02:16

think about that so forecast clear

1:02:18

says Alexa I love you but

1:02:20

you need a little extra you know like okay

1:02:23

like I check my Alexa every day to

1:02:26

um I do

1:02:29

literally every day so I was like oh yeah

1:02:31

I wonder if this is gonna make somebody that

1:02:33

Alexa go off in their crib too I just

1:02:35

thought about that like maybe when they play the

1:02:37

song or they say it it might make their

1:02:40

Alexa and then I don't know just like a

1:02:42

weird way to integrate it into something that is

1:02:44

normal in society now you know I try to

1:02:46

do that all the time well bigger minder tell

1:02:48

your echo device to play Eric the architect and

1:02:51

I've never been here before whenever you want also

1:02:54

you can follow his page on Amazon music thank you

1:02:56

for that really great organic commercial

1:02:58

yeah thank you so much

1:03:01

that was really beautiful attached

1:03:03

you really well

1:03:06

put not

1:03:09

strategy but practice I think or just I

1:03:12

don't know like I've never heard it break broken down

1:03:14

that way but it makes the most sense right like

1:03:17

you need something that is can't

1:03:20

be duplicated one of

1:03:22

one essentially but then you also need

1:03:24

something that is obtainable

1:03:27

to everybody because that's the point

1:03:29

of understanding that's the

1:03:31

point of connection you know what I mean like there is

1:03:33

something to me hearing a song

1:03:36

and being able to sing it back seven

1:03:38

conversations my boyfriend this morning like there are

1:03:40

songs in existence where you can go a

1:03:42

very long time without hearing it and the

1:03:44

second it's on you know every fucking word

1:03:46

yes and you can't maybe do all

1:03:48

of it you can do most of it yeah because

1:03:50

there's parts of it they're unobtainable to you but a

1:03:52

lot of it Resonates with you and

1:03:54

it's accessible to you. Mmm, it's interesting. It's tons

1:03:56

of songs like that, right? And it could be.

1:04:00

The whole i mean I'd say outcasts is

1:04:02

probably one of the best that. Is.

1:04:04

Like be wrapped so fast and.

1:04:07

Wow. This such the biggest raise it me but

1:04:09

they always have a part of it that we all

1:04:11

seem together and make. Some. Times

1:04:14

this avant garde. Swezey.

1:04:16

Myself: like I like really weird

1:04:18

shit. I like. You. Know Portishead

1:04:20

or was a weird to me this not

1:04:22

traditionally like. I

1:04:25

don't know. I don't know musically.

1:04:27

Maybe not the thing that people think of all the

1:04:29

time. I think of maybe hip hop music. On.

1:04:33

That's. Like my canvas so I'm always try

1:04:35

to be like why don't want people

1:04:37

to dislike the gum some fucking like

1:04:39

left real person all the time so

1:04:41

i have to make a solid colette

1:04:43

or as make a song on even

1:04:45

beef patty. to me like as much

1:04:47

as people dislike. You. Know some

1:04:49

people like I'm so Happy did or a dance

1:04:51

hall records as some people just don't understand and

1:04:53

I'm like. I'm. Jamaican Lakes I'm

1:04:56

from flat list: that song

1:04:58

sounds like. A song that

1:05:00

anybody if lab which would when you drive

1:05:02

in in the summertime when you go to

1:05:04

you may when you're in establish when you

1:05:07

in downtown Brooklyn that sounds like with the

1:05:09

streets are like to me and then to

1:05:11

get a feature on it from somebody from

1:05:13

Trinidad like I was really. Arm.

1:05:16

Encapsulating what New York City sounds and feels like

1:05:18

to me too. And I think is really weird

1:05:20

to leave their point out of it. You know

1:05:23

for again, hip hop have always been integrated since

1:05:25

Petra and would you buy on and all the

1:05:27

stuff in the nineties where they had his cross

1:05:29

over Branch and Levy and Sign like we've always

1:05:32

had. That together, when

1:05:34

I want to do one where I just

1:05:36

rat and for parts why not broken like.

1:05:39

You. Almost com to bodman is like

1:05:41

does not really. Thus,

1:05:43

Broken English our to write it straight like I

1:05:45

was just came from Jamaica with my pops. Is it?

1:05:48

You know? Is evolving a game

1:05:50

or anything easy to you or was year he

1:05:52

as part of you fear That means as if

1:05:54

I was If you a Jamaican that's how we

1:05:56

would sovereign out. of

1:05:58

me it is it's own line for sure. It's

1:06:01

like, can

1:06:03

I teach you something? Yeah, please. So like, do

1:06:07

it, right? It's do it. It's

1:06:09

like two words. But like, in,

1:06:12

I don't know why, but when you speak in Jamaican,

1:06:14

you make everything sometimes shorter

1:06:16

and you combine two things and

1:06:19

make it faster. So like, do it

1:06:21

becomes duit. So,

1:06:24

mena affiduit is I don't have to do

1:06:26

it. Mena affiduit

1:06:28

versus I don't have to do it. So

1:06:31

is the whole language born out of

1:06:33

just taking, like just

1:06:36

cutting letters out? I think it's just

1:06:38

the sound fly, bro. I don't know what it is, bro.

1:06:40

It's like a certain like vibe. I don't know what it

1:06:42

is. I don't know what it stems from. My dad says

1:06:44

it's from the Queen's English. Well, he could be capping, bro.

1:06:46

He just says it's no, but it is. He did see

1:06:49

their own version of the Queen's English. Okay. So yeah, maybe

1:06:51

there's a three line there. But I mean, it is a

1:06:53

part of the Commonwealth. I just wonder, I'm

1:06:56

so fascinated in the history of

1:06:58

Patois, mainly because I've just been

1:07:01

so heavy on my mind recently. The Bob

1:07:03

Marley movies out and a

1:07:05

lot of it's, I mean, dude,

1:07:07

they're all speaking Patois. It's

1:07:10

fascinating because you can

1:07:12

understand it as somebody just listening to it, but

1:07:15

you also may not understand all of

1:07:17

it. All of it. Yeah, yeah, yeah,

1:07:19

yeah. And it's so fascinating. Yeah, it's

1:07:22

interesting. Is it a vernacular? Is it

1:07:24

a language? I think it's a language.

1:07:28

I think it's a language. I think at

1:07:30

this point, I

1:07:32

guess I could write it, but it's

1:07:34

so formal in language and communication that I don't

1:07:36

think of it that way. Like I

1:07:39

was saying, if you're Jamaican, it's naturally going to

1:07:41

like, because you're going to say something to let

1:07:43

me know you're Jamaican because it's just you're Jamaican.

1:07:45

It is weird. I'm sure other languages the same

1:07:47

way. It's like you may be speaking English until

1:07:49

you say something. I'm like, oh, shit. You

1:07:51

from yard, bro? Like, okay. That means we can speak

1:07:53

like this now. You know, what does it mean to

1:07:55

you to have a song that's

1:07:57

all done in Patois, bro? There's

1:08:01

like George Clinton and there's that. You know what

1:08:03

I mean? Like, that's like, I

1:08:05

mean, I've always, I've made so many songs that were like

1:08:08

that, but to be honest, I didn't have the confidence to

1:08:10

put it out, bro, because I was just standing on business,

1:08:12

bro. I was just like, people gonna

1:08:14

think this. And I'm like, who cares what people think, bro?

1:08:16

I love the song. So I'm gonna put it out. That's

1:08:18

how I felt about it. That was the first time that

1:08:20

I actually made something that reminded

1:08:22

me really of my origins of dancehall

1:08:25

and reggae music. You know, I've tried

1:08:27

to do them before, but

1:08:29

I just felt like it wasn't the right time to put them out.

1:08:31

And this was like my best version and it's James Blake produced it.

1:08:33

Come on, man. Like, you're never gonna

1:08:35

see that. Like, you know, that's not gonna be

1:08:37

that. That's like something only we can make together.

1:08:40

You know, this album is genuinely the story of

1:08:42

your life. A thousand percent. I'm

1:08:44

so happy we could talk about this because it really

1:08:46

is, bro. It's pretty cool. It really is. How

1:08:49

do you know the album was finished? Because

1:08:52

somebody told no. I

1:08:55

knew it was over because

1:08:58

a song like Shook Up, it

1:09:01

was one of the last songs that was recorded.

1:09:03

And I remember at that moment I

1:09:05

thought it was over. I was like, man, I got too much

1:09:07

to choose from. And I'm an

1:09:09

incessant recorder, creative person.

1:09:12

I'm still recording. I recorded maybe

1:09:14

two weeks ago. I recorded four

1:09:16

days ago. I don't have to, but

1:09:19

I just want to. And like, it's

1:09:22

like an itch that I need to scratch all

1:09:24

the time. And music to me is so fun.

1:09:27

Like, oh, man, it's like

1:09:30

having limitations and also not having them

1:09:32

and allowing myself to

1:09:34

write about one specific topic. And

1:09:36

I like to put myself under these conditions to feel

1:09:38

like my

1:09:40

opportunity is limitless. So finishing an album and deciding

1:09:42

that it's finished really has to be on my

1:09:45

account. It can't be like, yo,

1:09:47

you got to stop. You know, I have to

1:09:49

stop myself. I have to lock

1:09:51

it off almost like a time capsule. And then I

1:09:53

can be like, okay, everything from here on is for

1:09:55

something else. But I had to, I

1:09:57

would say once I did Shook Up, that's when I was

1:10:00

I think I'm done, but like leukemia and

1:10:02

all those songs that were really personal,

1:10:05

I had to write those songs in order to

1:10:07

feel like the album was done because without them I feel

1:10:09

like it wasn't a full story. It was just a part

1:10:11

of it. So

1:10:15

okay. You can make the case that –

1:10:18

yeah, those are just some of the most emotional songs on the

1:10:20

album. So like were you stopping yourself purposefully or did you –

1:10:22

like what – I don't

1:10:24

know. I think – I

1:10:27

don't know man. I was really sad for

1:10:29

a lot of my life, the second part

1:10:31

of my life as an adult. And I

1:10:33

think that the sadness came from not being around

1:10:35

the right people every day. And

1:10:37

then the griefing of my mom and just

1:10:40

like watching all these people pass away when

1:10:42

you get older, the shine that you have

1:10:44

to do some of these things drop your

1:10:46

ambition and your drive. I've got to nourish

1:10:48

my imagination because it goes away, bro. And all

1:10:51

of us in this room one day are going to

1:10:53

lose somebody, God forbid, like not

1:10:55

now. But when you do, it will change

1:10:57

you. And what happens to

1:10:59

you is something you can't predict. And when it

1:11:02

hits you, you need to remember that these people

1:11:04

are angels if they guided you to be where

1:11:06

you are now. But

1:11:08

to say that is different than to live in it.

1:11:10

And it took me a while for me to live

1:11:12

in that reality to say that like who

1:11:14

I am is really a result of all these people that allowed

1:11:17

me to be me and allowed

1:11:19

me to feel freed. And music

1:11:21

is just a thing that I do. I could have

1:11:23

been a librarian and these people

1:11:25

would have loved me anyway. So

1:11:28

what is all the pressure and all

1:11:30

this extra insecurity for? As

1:11:32

long as the people that love you are proud of you,

1:11:34

whether they're spiritually here or not, that's what matters the most.

1:11:37

But that comes from therapy. That's

1:11:41

the right way to approach all of it.

1:11:44

Facts. Yeah. But

1:11:47

it's hard. You get lost in it,

1:11:49

right? It's easy. Totally. It's easy too.

1:11:52

And I think a lot of it comes from social

1:11:54

media, bro. We

1:11:57

all, for instance, say you just came from a...

1:12:00

hair salon, right? You just got your new shit. You're

1:12:02

gonna take a pic today. If you didn't get

1:12:05

your shit done in a while, you're not gonna take a

1:12:07

new pic. If you do it, it's going to somebody's text.

1:12:10

It's not going to the internet,

1:12:12

right? So we all, all four of us,

1:12:14

five of us, are gonna post the best

1:12:16

picture of us on our page, which means

1:12:18

that we're all looking at the best

1:12:20

versions of ourselves. Think about that shit. Fuck me

1:12:22

up the day. I was like, damn, I

1:12:25

look like shit sometimes. And I don't post those

1:12:27

pictures on the internet because we're

1:12:29

all vain and fucked up. And

1:12:31

that's not reality. We all don't look like

1:12:33

this all the time. So that makes you

1:12:35

so insecure. They say, wow, she's so beautiful

1:12:39

today. That's the one

1:12:41

she posted today. Bro,

1:12:43

nobody looks that perfect every day. But no

1:12:46

one, people do it and people post online, whatever.

1:12:48

I'm just saying in a general consensus, we

1:12:51

all are trying to deem success every

1:12:53

day by what we post, right? So

1:12:55

we're either saying we are obtaining it or yearning for it.

1:12:58

And our definition of what success

1:13:00

is, is so crazy because

1:13:02

a lot of it comes from other people. I'm

1:13:04

successful because I'm in here today. But

1:13:08

oh, you don't have no money. You didn't get paid. That's

1:13:10

not why, that's how you deem success.

1:13:13

You know, when you scroll through that shit and you see

1:13:15

somebody in a Maserati, that shit may make you feel like

1:13:17

shit if you drive in a Camry. But

1:13:19

maybe you don't like Maseratis. Maybe it's not even

1:13:21

about, maybe it's about learning to drive. I don't

1:13:23

know how to drive yet. So when

1:13:25

I learned to drive properly and have a car,

1:13:27

then I'm more successful than any of these people

1:13:29

on Instagram, just because I overcame something that was

1:13:32

a challenge for me. Well, it's about

1:13:34

personally defining what success is for you

1:13:37

and not bidding in or getting drowned

1:13:39

out by society's

1:13:42

definitions of success. We've got to change

1:13:44

that. And I think without that,

1:13:46

we're just imitating each other. So

1:13:49

true. And individuality is going away and homogenization

1:13:51

of everything is going to take over. Oh

1:13:53

my God. Why don't you want to be

1:13:55

yourself? You have a troll doll. That troll

1:13:57

is so cool. Like, thanks. Imagine if I

1:13:59

was like, that's Stupid you'd been like I

1:14:01

still like it. Yeah, totally. So why can't we

1:14:03

do that? Reptar bro, the world the world is

1:14:05

dumb. The world is right there But

1:14:09

it is wild like that's actually how you lose

1:14:11

art and individuality You

1:14:13

know I'm saying a thousand percent like if if We

1:14:17

all think success is this

1:14:19

one thing fancy car fancy

1:14:21

house, whatever. Mm-hmm I

1:14:24

mean then the reality of that is like We're

1:14:27

all just chasing after the same exact shit Like

1:14:31

you're all running the same race, but then

1:14:33

it's like Was

1:14:36

it always that way you know did we do

1:14:38

think our parents experienced

1:14:41

the same Things or

1:14:43

was it the same but just in a

1:14:45

different way? Well, I think they were chasing

1:14:47

after something most likely or I would think

1:14:49

better than whatever they went through themselves, right?

1:14:51

So like better life better dream better or

1:14:54

just the opportunity to live out

1:14:56

dreams I mean like I think that could be I kind

1:14:58

of think it was different like I Think

1:15:02

the general consensus of all your parents

1:15:04

generation was to give a better

1:15:08

Present and future to their kids and they had for

1:15:10

them for sure point blank the

1:15:12

nuances That like

1:15:14

make that up. Mm-hmm. Like what is

1:15:17

better really? that's Determined

1:15:20

be like that's individual. Yeah, but I

1:15:22

do think that there was something that

1:15:24

links A

1:15:27

lot of like past generations together, which is providing

1:15:29

what their parents couldn't provide to them or what

1:15:31

they didn't have access to you Yeah, I would

1:15:33

assume that that's a part of why your your

1:15:35

dad came here from Jamaica, right? So just to

1:15:37

provide something that he couldn't get in Jamaica for

1:15:39

his family for his family for sure And I

1:15:42

know for a fact that was the same thing

1:15:44

that my mom and dad did you know? And

1:15:47

where you didn't agree they they they

1:15:49

are they're from Patterson, New Jersey. Oh

1:15:51

shit. Yeah, I'm from right outside of

1:15:53

Manhattan. Thanks But

1:15:55

yeah, they but but common right the

1:15:58

same exact general one But

1:16:01

not exactly the same. Does

1:16:03

that make any sense? Totally makes sense. Yeah.

1:16:08

So it was probably in a different way. I just

1:16:10

think I guess because of the cameras and the

1:16:12

stuff, it's a little harder. We

1:16:18

have to remind ourselves what the goal and our

1:16:20

intentions are. It becomes more

1:16:23

difficult to remember that because there's so much comparisons. And

1:16:26

I think maybe our parents, there was

1:16:28

no – there was none of that. There was none

1:16:30

of that. It didn't exist. So it was like this is what the

1:16:32

goal was and we're going to go do it. I think now

1:16:35

you'd question that because there's

1:16:37

something telling you you can't or somebody showing

1:16:39

you that you might fail. And

1:16:42

I think that we can't succeed

1:16:45

as a society if we always

1:16:47

stopping ourselves from the what ifs. And

1:16:49

one of my favorite Fl I'll

1:17:11

take the acknowledgment because I went through a period of not

1:17:13

being acknowledged at all. So the

1:17:15

pursuit of that is more beautiful than just being

1:17:17

like stepped over like

1:17:20

those guys at Times Square that play the buckets

1:17:22

or the shit. Duke might

1:17:25

be out there all day and never get any

1:17:27

recognition. He might be better than most drummers, but

1:17:29

that's where he is it. And

1:17:32

he's physically there beneath you. So it's hard for

1:17:34

that person to get out of that situation. That

1:17:36

isn't – he would die for any type of

1:17:38

recognition. Working

1:17:40

any job. I worked at Guitar Center, bro. I

1:17:45

just wanted somebody to be nice to me. People were just so

1:17:47

fucking rude. Even when now I'm who I

1:17:49

am now, when I go to a Target

1:17:51

or a Cold Stone or

1:17:53

– if you roll with

1:17:56

me, I'm going to definitely make this person laugh before we

1:17:58

leave, bro. So I'm not going to order – like,

1:18:00

yo, bro, let me get it. I'm like, yo,

1:18:02

what's good, my guy? What's good, bro? And I

1:18:04

was like, that was like, whoa, nobody responded to

1:18:06

me like that today at all. Knowing

1:18:08

that maybe at the very small part of it,

1:18:10

that person goes home like, man,

1:18:12

that guy is kind of silly today. That shapes,

1:18:15

I mean, bro, it got me out of the situation

1:18:17

that I was in. I didn't want to work at

1:18:19

those jobs. But some little part of that day made

1:18:21

me feel like I should come to

1:18:24

work tomorrow or quit. But that's what

1:18:26

we're saying. Without those moments,

1:18:30

it's hard to value yourself, bro. Like, you don't

1:18:32

really know

1:18:34

where you stand, bro. And I just feel like

1:18:37

as old as the Earth is, we should be

1:18:39

better at executing this. We should be better at

1:18:41

communicating this with each other and segregation and all

1:18:44

this type of stuff to make

1:18:46

us feel like we don't fit in, like I said

1:18:48

to you. Like, there should be a community of people

1:18:50

that feel like that. And that's

1:18:52

how harmony should be made. It shouldn't be

1:18:54

to exclude and to poke fun of everything.

1:18:56

Sometimes we've got to just really get to

1:18:58

what it is, bro. Like, it shouldn't always

1:19:01

be jokes and memes and fucking laughter.

1:19:03

We've got to get to the real shit to be

1:19:05

so we find some positivity so we can actually change

1:19:07

the world. That's what the

1:19:09

world was for. It's like, put your

1:19:12

ego aside and let's make something that's going to make the

1:19:15

last test of time and have longevity. That's

1:19:17

what music should be doing. And

1:19:19

I hope it's that music has the hand in

1:19:22

stimulating more

1:19:25

emotional, deeper conversations. But I don't know.

1:19:29

Let's see. You're right. A lot of conversations are

1:19:31

very surface level. So the fact

1:19:33

that if you have surface level conversations,

1:19:35

you stay surface level. Oh, yeah.

1:19:37

And so nothing's ever going to be accomplished or changed. Yeah,

1:19:40

right. Because then that

1:19:43

comes with the fear of being canceled and being

1:19:47

misunderstood. And it's

1:19:53

probably not the best

1:19:56

platform to express that. But yeah,

1:19:59

sometimes. things get dicey, but everybody has

1:20:01

to walk away and be like, damn, at

1:20:03

least I understand better. Not like, still

1:20:06

thinking about the thing that pissed you off, especially

1:20:08

if somebody's sorry. I think that we can't ever

1:20:10

learn anything if we're not being honest. We

1:20:13

gotta really speak from our heart and be like, yo, if that

1:20:15

offended you, yo, I'm sorry.

1:20:17

You know, but like, not like, you're not

1:20:19

allowed to make a mistake. And I would say our parents

1:20:21

are probably way different than that, like my dad said

1:20:24

some crazy shit, bro, but I still love my

1:20:26

dad. Or like, you know, your

1:20:29

parents don't always have the best relationship with each

1:20:31

other. They argue, still love each other. You

1:20:33

know, just feel like

1:20:36

now, bro, is this crazy? I don't know if it's just

1:20:38

like, I

1:20:41

think people just becoming tolerant of each other, man.

1:20:43

It's the close quarters, it's coming out of COVID,

1:20:46

it's overstimulation. We

1:20:48

need- High-per sensitivity won't be overstimulated. It's

1:20:50

crazy. Bro, but that's why we need

1:20:52

music, man. Music has always been that

1:20:55

for me. And I

1:20:57

listen to artists, like one of my favorite projects

1:20:59

is Brian Eno's Music for the Airport. I think

1:21:01

it's called Music for Airports. It's

1:21:03

ambient music, it's just like weird dissonant.

1:21:06

Boom, boom, boom. I love it. Oh

1:21:08

my God, it's like not hearing somebody

1:21:11

talking about some shit, like, ha, yo,

1:21:13

that shit is so liberating for me. Like, it just makes

1:21:15

me feel like this is what

1:21:17

life is like sometimes. It's not overstimulation,

1:21:20

it's actually just like riding

1:21:23

a wave of current and like finding

1:21:25

normalcy- Flowing. Yeah. Mm-hmm.

1:21:28

Flowing. By the way, I've never been here before. Is

1:21:30

it waiting for you? My name is on

1:21:32

music, link below, what are you thinking? It was great. That's

1:21:35

it? Yeah, I thought you guys were great.

1:21:37

It was great. No, I'm loving every second of this conversation.

1:21:39

I've walked a whole track of time. I feel like I

1:21:41

know you, like, I feel like

1:21:43

we play basketball together or some shit. No, I fuck

1:21:45

with you. I feel- I'm not playing basketball. No, no,

1:21:48

no, no, no, no, no. But it's, I do feel,

1:21:50

I feel seen, but I also feel like I see

1:21:52

you. Yay. I get you. That's right.

1:21:54

Yeah, it's interesting. I

1:21:57

mean, the East coast energy, I don't know, but we're also similar

1:21:59

in age. Yeah, once you say Jersey, I'm like browsing Jersey all

1:22:01

the time browsing Elizabeth. I was in oh my god. Yeah,

1:22:03

my ex was from um What

1:22:06

area my boy lives in Plainsboro and

1:22:08

my girl went to? Rutgers

1:22:11

in New Brunswick. Oh my god, of course. I

1:22:14

was going to Rutgers session shit So I grew

1:22:16

up like I grew up in Patterson Okay, and

1:22:18

then I moved to Wayne but like my parents

1:22:20

like both my parents are from Patterson so like

1:22:22

right off of 80 Oh shit.

1:22:24

Yeah, it's where they used to actually make all the

1:22:26

silk and like send out all the silk and stuff

1:22:29

It's pretty cool. Also where Fetty Wap is from. I

1:22:31

don't know if we have any other famous people from

1:22:33

there, but uh 17 Yeah,

1:22:36

by the way great song Listen

1:22:40

to the album. It's beyond worth your time and

1:22:42

please come back as you release more music That's

1:22:44

my only request here. I'm coming back. Please come

1:22:46

back We're always here and more than

1:22:48

available and this is a beautiful story that it's

1:22:50

definitely of your life Thanks

1:22:53

for sharing. Thank you. Thanks for sharing the music

1:22:56

and thanks for sharing your time and energy today.

1:22:58

Absolutely Really appreciate you you as well, man. I'll

1:23:00

be back. Yeah. Thanks. Eric the architect everybody It's

1:23:05

the exact same show