This episode, Flyn is in conversation with Head of Endineering, Joe Macleod.

With a 20+ year career in product design, both digital and tangible, Joe has a wealth of experience in UX and HCD. During his time at Nokia and as Head of Design at UsTwo, Joe became concerned about the end of the customer journey and started a campaign to make off-boarding as important as on-boarding. This ultimately led him to write a book called ‘Ends.’ and launch the World's first customer ending consulting business: ‘andEnd.’

In Joe’s own words, focusing on the end may seem counterintuitive and a hard sell to a client that is all about shipping product. So, throughout this episode, we unpack why ‘clean and considered endings’ should be seen as a competitive advantage, not as a barrier to sale. Joe has spent over 15 years thinking about this and has case studies galore but we also find time to relive the early days of UsTwo, when Nokia was the king of phones and how a “profoundly” dyslexic person went about writing a book.

Special thanks to our friends Streamtime for their ongoing support. Check them out at www.streamtime.net/adr2020 to get an exclusive 20% listener discount!

Links:andEnd. www.andend.coTwitter: twitter.com/mrmacleodLinkedIn: www.linkedin.com/in/josephmacleodEnds. in print: www.amazon.com.au/Ends-Overlook-Products-Services-Shouldnt/dp/9163936445Ends. in Audible: www.audible.com.au/pd/Ends-Why-We-Overlook-Endings-for-Humans-Products-Services-and-Digital-and-Why-We-Shouldnt-Audiobook/B07NJD1TCBInclude Design Twitter: twitter.com/IncludeDesignUsTwo: www.ustwo.comUX Australia: www.uxaustralia.com.au/conferences/ux-australia-2019/speaker/joe-macleod-2019/

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