0:05

Crime Stories with Nancy Greace.

0:10

I never dreamed I would put

0:12

these four words in the same

0:15

sentence. Scott Peterson

0:19

Innocence Project. You

0:22

know, I've disagreed with a lot of cases,

0:24

and this project has handled over

0:27

the years the way that they handled

0:29

it. But I've had deep respect

0:31

for them.

0:33

Not anymore.

0:35

Really, this guy has

0:37

been through an appeal, another

0:40

appeal, another appeal, a

0:42

habeas corpus and now

0:45

this based on new

0:47

evidence? What new evidence?

0:50

I'm Nancy Grece, this is Crime Stories.

0:53

Thank you for being with us here at Crime Stories and

0:55

on serious XEM one eleven. Let's take

0:57

it back and get a little reality

0:59

check on what really happened.

1:03

Listen to this. I can I help you?

1:05

Yeah, my father in

1:07

log call, he went playing golf.

1:10

Good morning, nine thirty.

1:12

My daughter has been listing since this morning and she

1:14

eight months pregnant.

1:15

She sunk her dog for a walk in the park and the

1:18

dog came home with just the lead shock and.

1:20

The dog came back without your daughter, Right.

1:22

I tak the dog name got

1:25

Peters, your stepdaughter lay

1:27

Peter. Thanks her slin

1:30

right p r F. He's

1:32

why brought the stemic Asian She's

1:35

Portugues.

1:35

Like, how old is he?

1:38

She's twenty six? Why can you she leave

1:40

the Hoffman and come back that we don't

1:42

know.

1:42

We just had a call from our son.

1:44

In law said he left this morning and nine

1:46

thirty to play Dollie that home about

1:49

a half hour ago.

1:50

Nowhere around she went to walked the dog

1:52

with walked.

1:54

It Dicky in that heart chet and

1:57

eight minute pregnant, he said, pardons.

2:04

Okay, okay, joining

2:08

me an all star panel to make sense of what

2:10

we know right now, including Christine

2:12

Lazar joining US investigative reporter

2:15

kkel CBS. They're

2:17

in La who's been on a story all

2:20

over the story, But first let me

2:22

go to the director

2:24

and founder of the Cold Case Research Institute,

2:27

star of a hit series Zone

2:30

seven podcast, Cheryl

2:32

McCollum. Did you hear what

2:34

I just heard?

2:35

Absolutely?

2:36

Okay?

2:37

This is a lightning around that means yes, no,

2:39

if you can contain yourself.

2:40

If not, I understand.

2:42

Did I not hear on one but

2:45

two occasions? And Rod

2:47

Grantsky may he rest in peace. I'm

2:50

on one call that Scott Peterson,

2:53

Lacy's husband told

2:55

him that he was golfing that morning.

2:58

Did you hear that?

2:59

Because I heard that loud and clear twice.

3:01

You know what, Cheryl McCollum, I know what I did

3:04

this morning. I woke up super early.

3:07

I made a shake from

3:09

my son, and oven

3:12

baked bacon

3:14

for.

3:14

Him and Lucy. I took

3:17

food to my mom.

3:18

I fed the cats and the dogs and

3:20

everybody, and then they

3:23

went to school.

3:24

I know exactly what happened

3:26

this morning. Now, how is

3:28

it? At first he thought he was playing golf,

3:31

and then that change to he.

3:33

Was fishing the morning his

3:35

wife disappears fishing

3:38

in the rain and the cold on

3:40

Christmas Eve.

3:41

In San Francisco. Babe, were her body turns

3:44

up?

3:45

Why?

3:45

Because I think he realized they'd

3:47

got my tag at the marina when I came

3:49

in, and he also had to pay a fee

3:52

that gives you a timestamp receipt.

3:55

He knew that was something they were going to be able

3:57

to prove.

3:58

He had no choice put the change statement.

4:00

Cheryl. My question was,

4:03

why did he say he was playing golf?

4:05

Because he law the

4:07

night before that that's what he was going to be

4:10

doing, so he had already put that in the universe.

4:12

Del Carson, high profile lawyer joining

4:14

me out of Jacksonville.

4:15

What I like about Carson.

4:16

It's not only is he high profile defense attorney.

4:18

Don't like that as much, but former

4:20

FBI and former cop

4:23

in Miami Dade. Never

4:26

a lack of business for cops in

4:28

Miami Dade. Author of Arrest

4:30

Proof Yourself. You can find him at

4:32

del Carson.

4:33

Law dot com. Okay Dell.

4:36

He said he was playing golf because

4:38

he was lying, because then he changes

4:41

story to fishing based on what

4:43

Cheryl McCollum just said. He was busted

4:45

going in and out of the marina. Look, I

4:49

don't care that there is a

4:51

guard gate when I take the children

4:54

drop off a pickup. I don't care if I'm

4:56

spotted. Why did he care?

4:58

I know the answer to this, and it is

5:01

quite simple. He's talking to his

5:03

father in law. And any

5:06

person who would leave the night before

5:08

Christmas or the day before Christmas and

5:10

go out fishing with his pregnant eight

5:13

month old wife home by

5:15

herself is not to

5:17

be believed with anything. He says.

5:20

How could a man do such a thing, And

5:22

he certainly doesn't want to be called out by his

5:24

father in law for being the absolute

5:27

incredible liar that

5:30

he is.

5:30

Another thing, let me go to

5:33

Christine Lazar and by the way, I agree

5:35

with you Dale Carson. Now it's a

5:37

cold day in h double l that

5:40

Dale Carson, who has won a lot

5:42

of Jerry trials, says a defendant

5:45

is lying. Normally he takes their side,

5:49

you know, no matter what. Christinazar

5:52

joining me, investigator reporter ca

5:54

cal Cbs.

5:56

Christina Zar. Also the

5:59

theory goes on that

6:01

Lacy.

6:01

Peterson, Now this is according to Scott Peterson,

6:04

think he's got a reason to lie, got an

6:06

his skin in the game, got a dog in the fight.

6:09

He says she was going for

6:11

a walk in the park. But isn't

6:13

it true?

6:14

Christine Lazarre that one

6:17

of the several doctors monitoring

6:19

Lacey's pregnancy testified

6:23

at the original trial that

6:25

Lacy had called the hero clinic

6:28

complaining about being dizzy when

6:30

she walked, and this doctor

6:33

told her not to exercise

6:36

or do it late in the day when

6:38

she had plenty on her tummy and

6:41

was hydrated.

6:42

Now that doctor was doctor Tina

6:44

A.

6:44

Drockey, and she was under direct

6:46

examination by prosecutor David

6:50

Harris. She called again November the

6:52

eighth, claiming she had shortness of

6:54

breath.

6:55

Again she was told don't.

6:58

Exercise early in the day.

7:01

Isn't that true, Christine Lazare.

7:04

Yes.

7:04

So at the time of the trial, I was

7:06

a reporter in Fresno and they sent

7:08

me up to Redwood City to cover it because,

7:11

as you may remember, Scott Peterson's

7:13

mistress, Amber Fry, was from

7:15

the Fresno area.

7:16

Okay, wait, just stop right there, Christine Wazar,

7:19

I think my head is physically

7:22

going to blow off because everything

7:24

you just said is true. But now I'm talking

7:27

about Lacey short of Bread. The doctor

7:29

says she wasn't going to walk in the morning,

7:32

and you brought up the F word Amber

7:34

Fry, who happens to be a very lovely

7:36

lady.

7:37

By the way, YE spent time with her and

7:39

her lawyer, who.

7:40

I admire a lot, Gloria Allread. I

7:44

mean, okay, go

7:47

ahead, I think my head is still attached

7:49

to my neck. Go ahead, Christine.

7:51

Well you know, look, I mean that really was

7:53

the I guess you could say, smoking gun

7:55

of that trial when we all sat around

7:58

and listened to those audio tes Scott

8:01

Peterson saying that he's at the Eiffel

8:03

Tower, when in reality he's

8:05

at a vigil for his missing

8:08

wife, who was pregnant with his first

8:10

child, his unborn child. Those

8:13

memories of listening to those tapes will always

8:15

stick with me being in that trial.

8:18

When this first came out

8:20

that the Innocence Project was taking on this

8:23

case, all my colleagues wanted to know what it

8:25

was like covering that trial. And I will also

8:27

say, and I know, Nancy, you were there. One

8:30

of the things we all talked about was Scott's

8:32

demeanor and how he walked into

8:34

that courtroom every day with a

8:37

swagger and a smirk on his face, like.

8:39

A cocky soob that was a

8:41

star quarterback of his own murder trial.

8:44

That's what it was like, I mean, all.

8:46

Puffed up, yes, And it was hard to wrap

8:48

your brain around the fact that even if he was

8:50

innocent, he

8:52

has a wife who is dead and his first child

8:55

who died with her, and so it

8:57

was hard to reconcile

9:00

his behavior with the crime that

9:02

we were all there.

9:03

For, you know, changing a

9:05

story from how

9:08

could you get that wrong? The day your wife

9:10

goes missing? And oh, Cheryl

9:12

McCollum, correct me, wasn't

9:15

that her father, stepfather Ron

9:17

grant Ski, calling in, not her

9:19

husband?

9:21

So he didn't even make the call.

9:23

He's showing no concern.

9:25

There's so much there.

9:26

But do you remember that, Cheryl McCollum, I

9:29

was out in Redwood City covering

9:31

the trial live, but I was

9:33

in Atlanta, as were you, in

9:35

New York much of the time when

9:37

the investigation was going on.

9:39

And I will never forget the moment. I remember

9:41

where I was.

9:42

I was standing in the lobby of my apartment

9:44

building in New York, about

9:47

eight blocks from the Court, TV studios

9:50

and HLM, and the photo

9:53

of Scott Peterson comes out with

9:56

his hand on his mistress, Amber

9:58

Fryes rear in and she

10:01

had on this beautiful red

10:03

Christmas dress and he was dressed up to

10:05

go to her Christmas party while

10:08

Lacey, eight months pregnant, stayed

10:10

home with her feet up because

10:12

she was feeling bad. Point

10:15

feet up, Cheryl McCollum, last

10:17

count you had.

10:18

Two children feet up.

10:20

She was so heavily pregnant she

10:23

had to put her feet up all the time

10:26

and was told directly by

10:29

multiple doctors do not walk

10:31

in the morning, if at all, because

10:33

she was getting dizzy to the point of thinking she was going

10:35

to pass out when she would go for a walk.

10:38

Absolutely, So, do you remember that feeling

10:40

where your ankles are swelling up. You don't even

10:42

feel like getting up, much less walking. But

10:45

she was told not to do it because she was

10:47

at risk for doing that. She needed

10:49

to rest. But Nancy, the pre and

10:52

post behavior here is something we've

10:54

talked about a lot. So not only

10:56

is he having an affair, he is doing

10:59

so where he is maintaining the relationship

11:02

with Amber fryar Fry after

11:05

Lacy goes missing. That to me is

11:07

critical because people always say, well, just

11:09

because you're having a bear doesn't make you a murderer.

11:12

Absolutely, But that behavior

11:14

after she went missing, where he's

11:17

calling Amber during the candlelight

11:19

vigil for Lacy and Connor, and he's

11:21

explaining, oh, I'm watching these fireworks

11:24

and I'm thinking of you. He's not searching

11:26

for her, he's not desperate to find

11:28

her and his unborn child. He

11:31

is trying to maintain a relationship

11:33

with somebody he's only known for

11:36

weeks.

11:36

You know, Cheryl, you just brought to my mind

11:39

who I consider to be a friend, Lacey's

11:41

mother, Sharon Roche, and I will

11:43

never forget. And I guess, Christine Lazar,

11:45

you were in the courtroom for this. I

11:48

had been out front. I've

11:51

been doing something for either it

11:53

had to be for court TV. And

11:55

I raced back in and all I

11:57

could get was a very bad.

12:00

Row seat, and I was happy

12:02

to get it all the way in the back

12:04

of the courtroom, and I'm short.

12:07

I had to take my backpack off and

12:09

sit on top of my backpack to

12:12

see Sharon Roachell on the stand. I

12:14

remember she on this beautiful yellow

12:17

outfit and when she was

12:20

describing burying Lacey

12:25

her bones of course, because she was skeletonized

12:28

by the time she washed

12:30

ashore. Lacey was buried

12:32

holding Connor, her

12:34

baby in her arms, and

12:37

I will never forget her. Looking

12:40

over at Scott Peterson and

12:42

I am reminded of

12:45

a truth. And the truth is

12:48

those most vested in

12:51

a true verdict are the victim's

12:53

family, and they Lacey's

12:56

family is convinced Scott

12:58

Peterson is guilty.

13:14

Crime Stories with Nancy Grace.

13:18

Now the innocence project is

13:21

coming in full steam

13:24

after multiple appeals climbing there's a

13:26

new evidence. But speaking of Sharon

13:28

Rochel, listen to this.

13:30

I would like to thank all of you for being here and helpings

13:33

is trying to find our daughter. I

13:39

would just like to send a message out there that whoever

13:43

has her, please please please let her

13:45

go.

13:45

Bring her back her so much, Please

13:51

close our back.

13:57

We want her and our grandson home

13:59

safely and immediately,

14:02

So please bring her.

14:03

Back to us.

14:04

You hear Ron Grantskey breaking down in

14:06

the background, and I can tell you Ron

14:10

Grantskey was very, very

14:12

emotional. He loved Lacey

14:15

so much he could hardly

14:18

ever speak before the cameras. Reminded

14:20

me a lot of my dad, very

14:23

sentimental, could hardly get through

14:25

three sentences straight without

14:28

breaking down and crying about Lacy. And now

14:30

this and Sharon Roach has to live through

14:33

the whole thing again and more

14:35

from Sharon Roache.

14:36

Lacy was just a

14:38

loving, happy, generous,

14:41

vivacious person. She just Lacey

14:44

loves life, she loves people, she loves

14:46

entertaining. She's happy, she's

14:51

She and Scott are just so much in love. They're

14:54

just I think everybody envies their relationship.

14:57

They're just perfect together.

15:00

They have a wonderful life.

15:01

They're looking forward to having their baby.

15:03

They've waited a long time, they tried for

15:05

a long time to have a baby, and she

15:08

finally became pregnant and this

15:10

is just the center of her worlds

15:12

to have her baby and be with her husband.

15:15

Now, that is what Sharon Roach thought

15:18

before this. Listen.

15:20

I met Scott Peterson November

15:23

twentieth, two thousand and two. I

15:25

was introduced to him. I was told he was

15:27

unmarried. Scott

15:30

told me he was not married. We

15:33

did have a romantic relationship. When

15:36

I discovered he was involved in the Lacy

15:40

Peterson disappearance case, I

15:42

immediately contacted the Modesto Police

15:44

department. Although

15:47

I couldn't have sold or

15:51

sold the photos of Scott and I to

15:53

tabloids, I knew this was

15:55

not the right thing to do. For

15:58

fear of jeopardizing the case or

16:00

the police investigation. I will not

16:02

comment further.

16:03

Yeah, Amberfrey was dragged through the

16:06

mud, tarred and feathered over

16:08

having a relationship with sex relationship

16:10

with Peterson, But I believe.

16:12

Her that she did not know he

16:15

was married.

16:15

She could have made probably at

16:18

least one hundred grand of selling those photos

16:20

of her story, she didn't do it.

16:23

Listen to more of Amberfry.

16:24

I am very sorry for Macy's

16:26

family and

16:29

the pain that this has caused

16:32

them, and

16:35

I pray for her safe return as

16:37

well. I

16:39

would appreciate to my friends and

16:42

acquaintances to refrain

16:45

from talking about

16:47

me to the media for profit

16:50

or recognization. I

16:55

am a single mother of a twenty three

16:57

month old child, and.

17:00

I asked to respect my hypocy.

17:03

Thank you.

17:04

Of course, her life turned upside down

17:06

and she was again tard and feathered on cross

17:08

examination when she bravely

17:11

took the stand in court. But you

17:13

know what to Karen Start joining me renowned

17:15

psychologists joining us out of Manhattan.

17:18

You can find her at Karenstart dot com. That's Karen

17:20

with a C in case you tried to find her. Karen,

17:23

did you hear Sharon Roach say that

17:25

Lacey loved entertaining?

17:28

Okay, Karen, I don't know if you remember.

17:32

You and I worked on this case together.

17:35

You were with me night after night after night

17:37

during the trial on air, and.

17:40

I remember telling you that

17:42

I had gone to Lacey's

17:44

home and actually got to look

17:46

inside, and it looked like

17:49

I could tell she loved her home. It

17:52

was decorated. I could tell on a budget, but

17:55

it was so perfectly done. I'm

17:58

getting to a point. Be

18:01

a cold day an h

18:03

E double l that

18:05

David Lynch, my husband that

18:08

you told me to marry.

18:09

By the way, would go out.

18:12

Remember Lacey was expecting all

18:14

the family to come to her place and

18:17

was getting it all ready.

18:19

I mean she was having everything, getting

18:21

her everything ready for Christmas. It

18:24

was December twenty four.

18:26

It would be a cold day in hell that

18:28

David Lynch would leave when I was

18:31

trying to get the house ready and cook

18:33

a turkey and homemade dressing and

18:35

blah blah blah blah, get

18:37

all the presents, wrap, everything done.

18:39

No way he would be there trying

18:42

to help me, and with her pregnant. No

18:44

way was he going to go golfing or fishing.

18:47

Nancy. She was eight months pregnant

18:50

and told that she should not be exercising

18:53

or doing any undue labor while

18:56

she was pregnant at that point. And

18:59

he was out golfing. Oh

19:01

wait, no, he wasn't golfing.

19:03

He was fishing.

19:04

And do you remember the interview that

19:07

they had with him when he picked up a call.

19:10

He was so nonchalant. You

19:12

would never ever guess that this man

19:14

had lost his wife and his child.

19:16

You know, the only newly discovered

19:19

evidence there is to be found at

19:22

this point is to tell me exactly

19:25

how he murdered his wife.

19:27

To doctor Todd M.

19:28

Barr joining me board certified anatomic

19:30

clinical forensic pathologists featured

19:33

in thin Places Essays from in between

19:36

doctor Barr, thank you for being with us. The

19:39

defense has thrown out so many, many,

19:41

many different theories

19:44

as to who murdered Lacy.

19:46

They said a thing. They said

19:48

a Hawaiian gang did it. Then

19:50

they said some other kind of gang did it.

19:53

Then they said oh.

19:56

One of the theories was that some

19:58

when a kidnapped Lace and cut

20:01

her open to take baby

20:03

Connor for their own. But yet when

20:06

she was found there was no indication

20:08

of that, although she was largely skeletonized.

20:11

But the state's theory, which was backed

20:14

up by medical examiners, was

20:16

that over time, weeks and

20:18

weeks and weeks in the San Francisco

20:21

Bay, the last portion

20:23

of a woman's body to decompose

20:26

would be that thick uterine wall

20:29

the womb, and that in

20:32

the end it did deteriorate

20:34

and baby Connor just floated out.

20:37

Because while she was largely

20:39

decomposed, baby Connor

20:42

looked like a little one of those little plastic,

20:45

shiny baby dolls that you get

20:47

at a store.

20:48

Sure, I mean, the fact

20:51

that the baby was in utero was

20:54

very protective, you know, in the in the cold

20:56

waters of the San Francisco Bay, you

20:59

know, that slows down decomposition.

21:02

Now, of course, Lacey's body

21:04

is exposed to all the elements, including

21:07

animal predation, you know, animals

21:10

or fish that might be you know, gnawing

21:12

on her flesh, which will actually promote

21:16

the acceleration of her decomposition.

21:20

So, yes, I agree that the baby

21:22

would have been the last one, the last one

21:24

out, so to speak, and would

21:26

have been relatively well preserved at

21:28

that point.

21:29

So would there have been any evidence

21:32

left that someone had cut her

21:35

stomach open? I mean, if they had done that, they would

21:37

have tried to get Connor out he was still in there.

21:39

Yeah, And I would think that if somebody

21:42

was you know, not a surgical

21:44

person, that was trying to open

21:46

up her abdomen to take the baby out, it's

21:50

very possible that the baby would have sustained

21:52

some sort of injury

21:55

in the process, you know. I mean

21:57

it's a tight space in the uterus,

22:00

so when you're trying to cut a baby out, there

22:03

very well could have been evidence that the

22:05

baby sustained some sort of sharp force

22:08

injury from someone trying to extract

22:10

the baby.

22:11

A homemade ccerean. Yeah,

22:14

the baby is cut out of the stomach. But

22:16

you're right, you would have expected Connor

22:19

to have some sort of cutting

22:22

or injury or something.

22:23

He had nothing.

22:24

Yes, unless it was done by an obgyn,

22:27

you know that knew what they were doing exactly.

22:30

Most of us would wouldn't know where to

22:32

make the first cut.

22:34

Even as a medical doctor.

22:35

Myself, I wouldn't. I wouldn't

22:37

know how to do a Sysyrian section because I'm not trained

22:39

as an obgyn.

22:40

Yeah. I try to tell people that all the time.

22:42

I'm like, you want me to write your will, Yeah, I'll try.

22:45

But that's like asking an ear doctor

22:47

to perform open heart surgery. But okay,

22:50

guys, we are hearing that the

22:52

Innocence Project has actually taken

22:55

on Scott Peterson's case. Now

22:57

to Cristado Zar joining US investigator

23:00

reporter KKL CBS LA.

23:03

I understand that they claim there.

23:05

Was blood spatter evidence that quote

23:08

might have exonerated

23:10

him and other suspects

23:12

who were quote overlooked.

23:15

Is that what they're basing this on.

23:16

You know, they're not saying a lot, but that is

23:19

what they are pointing to, that there was some sort

23:21

of blood spatter evidence inside

23:24

this burned out van. And as

23:26

you may remember, there was a talk

23:28

that there was a robbery in the area right

23:31

before she went missing, and could that be

23:33

linked to her disappearance. Again,

23:36

in trial, the prosecution

23:39

kind of pushed that aside and said those were completely

23:41

unrelated.

23:42

But the emphasis right now is on that van.

23:44

Well, well, you're talking about a robbery.

23:46

I thought it was a burglary.

23:48

Yes, correct, I'm.

23:49

Sorry, kind of caddy cornered to

23:51

Lacey's home there on Covena

23:53

And I believe the reason prosecutors

23:56

discount it is because they caught the burglars

23:58

and interviewed them at length and

24:01

polygraph them and decided,

24:04

yeah, that's not what happened.

24:05

Is that the burglary you're talking about?

24:08

Yes?

24:09

And I will say here in LA this

24:11

is all anybody seems to be talking about. And

24:14

a lot of people, if you look in the comment section,

24:16

if you hear the responses to the stories

24:18

we've been doing, a lot of people very upset

24:20

with the Innocent Project, feeling like this is

24:22

a case that is not worthy of their time and attention.

24:26

Most people I talk to say they believe

24:28

Scott Peterson did it. There

24:31

was a lot of circumstantial evidence in the trial.

24:34

But one thing that we kept saying as reporters

24:36

covering it back in four

24:39

if not him, then who all

24:42

signs seem to point to Scott

24:44

Peterson? And I will say, after covering

24:46

that trial and walking away from it, I did feel

24:48

like the jury made the right decision.

24:49

Well, the thing is this, we're

24:52

just touching on some of the evidence right

24:55

now, just a tiny tiny bit

24:57

of it that I

25:00

that through the trial, I heard the evidence.

25:03

I like many people agree

25:06

Peterson murdered his wife and

25:08

unborn child. As to the Innocence Project,

25:11

they actually do fine

25:14

work in many cases. There

25:16

are wrongfully convicted people

25:19

in our country and they

25:21

need to be released, and they need to be

25:23

exonerated. There are cases

25:26

out there that desperately need the

25:28

Innocence Project. So why latch

25:31

on to Scott Peterson's case like a tick,

25:34

sucking the blood out of it? Why

25:50

time stories with Nancy Greece, Guys,

25:55

speaking of guilt,

25:58

We've been talking about the mistress and I kind

26:01

of hate to even refer to her that way because she's a very

26:03

nice lady with a new life and

26:05

a new family.

26:06

Listen to this This is the

26:09

call Cheryl McCallum refer.

26:10

To where, even after

26:13

Lacey is missing,

26:15

of course dead, you hear

26:17

him continuing to lie just

26:20

to get laid what one more time?

26:21

Listen ever,

26:27

ever, ever.

26:33

Hear me?

26:37

Ever there there? Every

26:43

happy here?

26:46

Thank you.

26:49

Right there?

26:50

Yes, I wish you could.

26:54

Eye.

26:55

I think that you're there.

26:56

I'm my you.

26:57

The idle power is

27:00

unreal. It's

27:02

huge.

27:03

It's that huge.

27:05

Remember, ever

27:08

you're there. I can't hear right now, but I'll call you on

27:11

your knees.

27:13

Ever Okay,

27:21

Cheryl McCollum. My chest is hurting

27:23

now. At first I thought my head was going to blow off.

27:25

Now I think I might be having a heart attack.

27:28

Did you hear that?

27:29

Oh?

27:29

It's so near the Eiffel Tower,

27:32

and.

27:32

The celebration is quote unreal.

27:35

The crowd is huge. There was a huge crowd.

27:37

But wasn't he had his wife's vigil

27:40

when he did that.

27:41

He was literally standing also

27:43

the side during the candlelight

27:45

vigil. Keith again wanting

27:47

to keep the relationship with ambergoing,

27:50

and that thing. It's so crazy to me, even

27:54

if you're having an affair, and even if you're having

27:56

a great time with this person, that you just meant weeks

27:58

ago. If you're wife legitimately

28:01

goes missing and she's pregnant

28:03

with your unborn child, it seems

28:06

like your focus would flip because

28:08

again, your parents are going to

28:10

be hurting. Her parents are going to be scared

28:12

to death and hurting siblings. You've

28:15

got other people involved with your

28:17

marriage that are going to be connected

28:19

to Lacey and love her.

28:21

And here's the thing.

28:22

His mother in law turned on him

28:25

and understood that he was a liar and

28:27

did something to Lacey. His best friend

28:29

distanced himself because he's like, look, his

28:31

alibi is not making any sense to me. Nobody

28:35

supported him, that knew him, no

28:38

one. So everything that he started

28:40

to do again, there's some things you're

28:42

right about, Nancy, that.

28:43

We don't have.

28:44

We don't have the cause of death or at the time of death,

28:46

or a weapon, but there's things we do have.

28:49

We've got hair impliers on

28:52

his boats that we know Lacy never

28:54

went on.

28:55

He's the one that said, oh, you're probably going to

28:57

find blood in my truck. He gave

28:59

them that. He's the one that

29:02

told it. Dad, I might be pulling

29:04

an OJ.

29:05

I mean, everything he did gave

29:07

us reason to look at him, especially

29:09

when he goes on Dan Sawyer and is talking

29:11

about her in past ten where they.

29:13

Were still searching for her.

29:15

You know, Dale Carson joining me, high

29:17

profile defense attorney joining us out of Jacksonville,

29:19

former FBI and beat cop

29:22

in Miami, Dade del Carson,

29:24

I want to hear what you think about

29:27

the changing defense theories

29:29

and about this blood spatter,

29:32

But first let me ask you something about the Nocence

29:34

Project, which I have long held

29:36

in esteem.

29:37

I don't believe you have ever heard me rant

29:40

and rave about.

29:41

The Nisons Project, because they have actually

29:44

led to some exonerations

29:47

that were desperately

29:49

needed by Lady Justice. So

29:52

deal Carson. What I find very curious

29:56

is you heard Christine Lazar. She's

29:59

a very well known and

30:03

respected investigative reporter joining

30:05

us out of.

30:05

KKEL CBS LA.

30:07

She said that the Innocence

30:10

Project has not revealed what the

30:12

quote new evidence is. Why

30:16

if it's new evidence, man, and it was proven

30:18

Scott Peterson isson, I would be shouting

30:20

from the rooftops.

30:22

Well, I took the opportuite to read the

30:25

appeal essentially, and it's

30:28

fairly lengthy, but there are just

30:30

points that you've already mentioned frankly,

30:33

the two burglars. They've been interviewed,

30:36

a van with a mattress in it that had

30:38

blood in it, the argument that the dog

30:40

was out and Lacey'd been walking

30:43

the dog and she was abducted

30:45

by these individuals. I mean, it's

30:47

fairly laid out, and the Innocent Project

30:50

does an excellent job where it's needed. I

30:52

think this is more of a publicity stab

30:55

than it is anything else, and I don't

30:57

think it's particularly necessary. I think it's a waste

30:59

of their resources and energies

31:02

on something is fairly clear. I

31:04

mean, the most interesting thing to me from an investigative

31:07

perspective is the fact that her

31:09

head and her hands were missing. Those are

31:11

identity clues, and there's

31:13

only one person who would do something like that

31:15

and we all know who that is. So

31:18

yes, in any large, major

31:20

case, there's going to be evidence, just as

31:22

there was the Atlantic kid killings that

31:25

I was involved with, where there's

31:27

additional evidence that shows up years

31:29

later. But that doesn't mean that the

31:31

individuals who's been convicted is somehow

31:34

innocent.

31:34

Can I point something out.

31:36

A legal aspect that I think

31:38

will immediately quash this appeal newly

31:40

discovered means newly

31:43

discovered the

31:46

van and the plus purported sidings of Lacey

31:48

before he disappearance. We're

31:51

known at the time of trial. This

31:54

is not newly discovered. I'm

31:57

only curious regarding

31:59

the blood. The project

32:01

is asking DNA testing to be done on blood

32:05

and that previously unheard interviews

32:07

with witnesses.

32:09

Be re examined. There is nothing

32:13

new.

32:13

I mean, am I missing something, Christine wis

32:15

are the blood they're talking about

32:17

the blood spatter they're referring to, if

32:20

it exists, would have been in that van.

32:22

Is that the blood they're talking about.

32:24

Well, look, I mean they're not saying a lot. They're

32:26

not giving us specifics.

32:28

A lot of this is just us trying

32:30

to read between the lines and figure out where

32:32

there had is that because so many people are surprised

32:35

that this is a case that the Innocent's Project

32:38

has decided to take on.

32:40

At this point, we're being told that

32:42

it has something to do with blood in that van.

32:45

That they had the van at the time of trial.

32:47

The van was discoverable at the time

32:50

of trial, and under the law,

32:52

if this was evidence that could be discoverable

32:55

at the time of the trial, it is not quote

32:58

newly discovered, which is required

33:01

for a case to go forward on appeal on

33:04

the grounds of newly discovered evidence.

33:07

It's not newly discovered.

33:10

That said, I would still want the truth. But

33:13

back to the facts.

33:15

Remember when Amber Fry was

33:17

entertaining that call from Peterson the night

33:19

of his wife's vigil, As Cheryl McCollum

33:22

described, going off to the corner and calling

33:24

Amber Fry pretending he's in Paris quote

33:26

near the Eiffel Tower. Man, he can shoot

33:28

a line of well, let's

33:30

see, I gave up cursing crap. But

33:33

she knew he was under suspicion

33:37

when she took that call.

33:38

She was recording it for police.

33:41

And how do you think that made her feel? Knowing

33:43

a guy and likely killed his

33:45

wife and he was out.

33:47

And you're cooperating with police. She

33:49

did it anyway. Now she confronts

33:52

him, listen.

33:53

For me this elaborate night about her

33:55

missing and this tragedy and that and

33:58

that this will be the holidays without

34:00

her, said Amber.

34:04

God, I don't want to fight with you, but you

34:07

know that I never said tragedy

34:09

or missing.

34:10

Oh yes, you said you've watched your wife obviously

34:14

without me staying much.

34:15

But we were.

34:17

Yes, you did, I did.

34:19

Okay, So either he's clairvoyant

34:22

or he's a killer. Help

34:25

me out, Sheryl Nancy.

34:28

He told another mistress

34:30

named Janet that kids

34:32

were gonna disrupt his lifestyle.

34:35

He told other people his wife

34:38

was dead.

34:39

He has done so many things

34:41

before she went missing. He

34:43

got an insurance policy for a quarter of a million

34:46

dollars, He bought the boat. He you

34:48

know, good things

34:51

to line up to be a single person,

34:53

it would appear, and then after

34:56

she goes missing, the lives kept going.

34:58

He didn't want to take a polygraph. He

35:00

told the detective. There's no outside people,

35:03

there's no third party in our marriage. Our marriage

35:05

is fine. But he continued

35:07

to call Amber. He continued to say, look,

35:10

everything's good here.

35:11

There's no problem.

35:13

You know, even when this case got so

35:15

hot, Lacy's face was everywhere.

35:18

Everybody's concerned about this young woman

35:21

who is so adorable and eight

35:23

and a half months pregnant, and they want

35:26

to focus on this watch that was pawned. Let

35:28

me ask you something, what criminal

35:30

kidnaps this person?

35:32

The case gets hot as fire.

35:34

And they wait a week to pawn her

35:36

watch. That doesn't make any sense.

35:39

There are two Croton Croto

35:43

in watches Pond and

35:46

it has never been established that

35:48

that was Lacy's watch

35:50

that she had inherited.

35:52

Croton I think is a brand of watch.

35:55

Hey, you left out the fact that.

35:57

He immediately ordered

35:59

the poor Horn channel, added that to

36:02

the cable bill, and tried to

36:04

sell the house in the car. Now, this is when Lacey

36:06

is still missing. Obviously,

36:09

Karen Start, you're the shrink. He's not

36:11

expecting her to walk through the front door. It

36:14

would be again a cold day in hell

36:16

that David Lynch adds on the porn

36:18

channel.

36:19

When I'm missing.

36:20

It's like I go

36:22

to the school for a reason for the children,

36:25

and he orders the porn channel while I'm gone. No,

36:27

because he knows I'm going to walk in and

36:29

see porn on the TV.

36:31

No, that would not do.

36:34

But Peterson wasn't worried.

36:36

He knew Lacey was never

36:39

coming home.

36:40

Karen Start, that's right, Nancy.

36:42

And how about when he was telling

36:44

everybody and people need to hear

36:46

this that he could

36:49

not go into the nursery, he could not

36:51

go into Connor's room until

36:53

they were back and somebody and he was definitely

36:56

going to keep that door closed, and then they

36:58

discovered that he was used yet as

37:00

storage. He led again, he

37:03

had things in there. He had no respect

37:05

for the fact that he still didn't even

37:07

know what was going to happen with this baby.

37:10

Guys, I want to cut forward to

37:12

our cut ten sixteen. I want

37:14

you to analyze more

37:16

of what Peterson did at the time

37:19

Lacey quote goes missing.

37:21

Listen.

37:22

At nine thirty am Christmas Eve, Scott

37:24

Peterson goes fishing in his brand new boat.

37:27

Peterson claims the fishing trip is a last

37:29

minute decision. He planned to go golfing, but

37:31

it was too cold and blustery for golf, so

37:33

he went fishing. Lucky for Scott, even

37:36

though his decision to fish was last minute,

37:38

he bought a two day ocean fishing license

37:40

on December twenty second. Peterson fishes

37:43

without success and returns home late in the afternoon.

37:45

When he gets home, Scott finds Lacey's

37:48

car in the driveway. Their dog, Mackenzie,

37:50

is in the backyard, but the house is empty.

37:52

After he takes the time to shower and change

37:54

clothes, Scott Peterson goes to a neighbor's

37:56

house to see if they've seen Lacey. The neighbors

37:58

hadn't seen Lacey, so Scott calls

38:01

Lacey's mother, Sharon. According to Fox

38:03

News, Scott Peterson doesn't say, have

38:05

you spoken to Lacey today? Do

38:07

you know where Lazy is? He tells

38:10

Lacey's mother that Lacey is

38:12

missing.

38:13

Okay, yeah, No.

38:15

When I'm looking for David, when he goes

38:17

out of town or he has some meeting

38:19

or something, I would never say David's

38:22

missing. I go, hey, where's David?

38:24

Have you seen your dad? Something like that,

38:27

And that is what Sharon roach to testify to

38:29

on the stand. So he's out on a secret

38:32

boat, Christine Lazar

38:34

is joining us KKEWCBSLA. He's

38:37

out on a secret boat that he didn't tell anybody

38:39

about. He has he went

38:41

fishing last minute, although

38:43

we know two days before he

38:46

got a fishing license, so

38:48

it's not last minute.

38:50

Isn't it true?

38:51

Christine Lazar that when he gets home,

38:54

the dog Withckenzie's in the backyard with

38:57

the gate locked.

38:58

Was it the backyard gate? Lot?

39:01

Anybody jump in that? Can remember that?

39:03

I do remember that from trial.

39:04

So what the dog let himself in and lot the gate?

39:07

Right?

39:08

Well, the defense argued, as

39:10

you may remember that a neighbor had put

39:13

the dog in there and had closed the.

39:14

Gate, And did that neighbor come forward at trial?

39:16

No?

39:17

Right, Okay? What exactly

39:20

is the Innocence Project doing?

39:23

They're refusing to state what the

39:26

newly discovered evidence is. And

39:28

my question is, if they're all about the truth

39:30

coming out, then why keep it a secret?

39:33

What are they hiding and why are

39:35

they hiding it?

39:37

Or is there really nothing there?

39:39

Take a Listen to Crime Onlines Rachel

39:41

Benia.

39:42

Scott Peterson's former attorney, Mark

39:44

Garrigos on TMZ Live says

39:46

he can debunk all the prosecution evidence,

39:49

but said he believes the jury was laser

39:51

focused on Peterson cheating on his wife.

39:54

The filing by the La Innocence Project

39:56

says Peterson's claims of actual innocence

39:59

is support by newly discovered evidence

40:01

and more.

40:03

Listen in court documents, The Los

40:05

Angeles Innocence Project is asking for

40:07

witnesses who may have seen Lacey walking

40:09

her dog. There may be witnesses who

40:11

saw Lacy Peterson alive after her

40:13

husband left Modesto to go phishing caron

40:16

reports, Police and prosecutors said Lacy

40:19

was murdered before Scott Peterson left

40:21

town. In court document, Scott

40:23

Peterson wrote, during the search to find

40:25

Lacey, the police continually ignored

40:27

evidence, including eyewitness reports

40:29

that Lacy was alive and walking our dog

40:31

the day she disappeared. The project

40:34

is asking for all reports detailing

40:36

investigative actions taken in response

40:38

to eyewitness accounts reporting sightings

40:40

of Lacy Peterson on or after December

40:43

twenty fourth, two thousand and two.

40:44

None of that, deal, Carson, is

40:47

new evidence.

40:48

You're exactly right, none of it is

40:50

new. And as you say in

40:52

appellate work, you have to have evidence

40:55

that was not discovered at the time,

40:58

and if they don't have that, they don't meet

41:00

the boundary for that to

41:03

be appealed effectively.

41:05

And again they're dredging up

41:07

the burglary across

41:10

the street Caddy Corner to Lacey's home.

41:12

Listen.

41:12

Another request from the La Innocence Project

41:15

is information regarding the burglary that

41:17

took place at the Medinas house across

41:19

the street from the Peterson's home sometime

41:22

between December twenty four and December

41:24

twenty six. Kron

41:26

reports that the two burglars were caught and during

41:29

their interviews with police, denied

41:31

having anything to do with Lacy Peterson.

41:33

The La Innocence Project seeks

41:35

a complete copy of the Medesto Police

41:37

Department's investigation into the

41:40

burglary, as well as Modesto Police

41:42

Department reports on the steps

41:44

they took to verify the alibis

41:46

of the two burglars, Stephen Todd

41:48

and Donald Glenn Pearce, establishing

41:51

their whereabouts on December twenty four,

41:53

two thousand and two.

41:54

And is this the

41:57

blood they're talking about? Listen?

42:00

Suspicious van fire happened on Christmas

42:02

Day, less than a mile from the Peterson

42:04

home, the day Lacy Peterson was reported missing,

42:07

and the LA Nison's Project once reports

42:09

from the police Department and Fire Department concerning

42:11

the investigation of what they call an

42:13

incendiary fire of an orange van containing

42:16

a mattress with a parent bloodstains. Court

42:18

documents show the van appeared to have been

42:21

intentionally ignited to cover up a crime.

42:23

Cheryl McCollum, did I just hear

42:25

the word apparent. They

42:28

don't even know.

42:30

If that's blood, correct, So

42:33

again, you walk this thing through

42:35

forensically.

42:36

We don't have blood that came back as

42:38

Lacey. We don't have blood that came back from

42:40

Scott in that van. We don't have blood

42:42

that came back from anybody.

42:44

Else in that van.

42:45

We don't have an eyewitness that saw the van

42:47

on fire. We don't have these two burgerers

42:50

running from that van. We don't have

42:52

clothing from Lacey. We don't have hair from Lacey.

42:54

We don't have anything in that van connected

42:57

to her. We do, however, have

42:59

her hair in the pliers in

43:01

the toolbox inside the boat

43:04

that she was never in, never fool with. We

43:06

do have his blood in his truck that he

43:09

said we would find. We don't have him

43:11

searching for her, looking for her, calling

43:13

the police about her. He didn't do any

43:15

of that, none of it. But what we

43:17

do have is an insurance policy, multiple

43:20

affairs, him telling people before

43:22

she went missing that she was dead. He

43:25

refused to take a polygraph. I mean,

43:27

it just goes on and on and on, and even though

43:29

it's circumstantial. You and

43:31

I both have worked how many cases where

43:33

somebody was killed for a lot less than two hundred

43:35

and fifty thousand dollars.

43:37

This is all I have to say, Scott

43:40

Peterson, I'm going

43:42

to have my hot tea. You

43:45

stick to your Pruno, your

43:47

jailhouse hooch, because you're

43:49

going to need a lot of it when

43:51

this appeal is rejected,

43:55

and I'm sure it will never concern

43:58

you at all what

44:00

You're doing to what is left

44:03

of Lacey's family.