0:00

Mind of a Monster, the podcast from

0:02

ID, is back and this season they're

0:04

covering The Butcher Baker. In the 80s

0:06

over 20 women go missing in Anchorage,

0:08

Alaska. Women turning up dead in the

0:10

woods and others are kidnapped, but their

0:12

stories aren't taken seriously by the police,

0:15

even though these crimes all point to

0:17

one man. On this podcast, uncover how

0:19

serial killer Richard Hanson evades arrests for

0:22

over a decade, and hear from victims

0:24

along with police and Alaska state troopers

0:26

who were there on the ground investigating

0:29

the case. Listen to Mind of

0:31

a Monster, The Butcher Baker, on

0:33

Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you get

0:35

your podcasts. A

0:48

year before Serhat was arrested, the

0:51

filmmaker Zebariah Newman climbed out of

0:53

his car in the parking garage

0:55

of Serhat's clinic. This

0:57

was as close as Zeb and his

1:00

camera were allowed to come to the

1:02

building itself. In

1:05

the dim light he spotted his friend

1:08

Jeffrey Drew waiting for him. Jeffrey

1:10

was about to undergo yet another

1:13

blood draw at Serhat's clinic. It

1:16

had been almost two years since

1:18

Jeffrey started his HIV trial. He'd

1:20

been getting his blood drawn regularly,

1:22

and each time he was told

1:24

that his HIV levels were undetectable.

1:27

The experimental treatment seemed to be working.

1:31

But Jeffrey was starting to get impatient.

1:34

He wanted to know if Serhat's

1:36

donor cell injections had retrained his

1:38

immune system to fight the virus.

1:42

As Zeb turned on his camera that

1:44

morning in the parking garage, Jeffrey

1:46

was having trouble summoning his usual

1:48

charisma. He's, you know,

1:51

he's annoyed. He's lacking patience.

1:54

He even says that morning on film, like,

1:56

I'm feeling bratty. I

1:58

don't want to be here, do this. this anymore. Eventually

2:02

Jeffrey got up and trudged

2:04

inside alone. When

2:08

he came back out, his mood wasn't any better.

2:11

The two men sat in Jeffrey's car

2:13

talking. Jeffrey doesn't

2:15

cry. He's not a very emotional

2:17

person, but he was

2:20

very emotional and he

2:22

got angry, you know, and he felt

2:24

a little used and abused. If

2:27

it was a cure, then Sarah Hart

2:29

stood to make a lot of money.

2:32

He said, I think that they might make a billion dollars

2:34

and I didn't get anything. He said, I

2:36

didn't even get a fruit basket. But

2:39

Jeffrey kept going on with the trial.

2:41

He'd been risking his life now for

2:44

nearly two years. It was too

2:46

late to stop now. Even

2:49

if someone else made billions from it, he

2:51

was still hopeful his contribution could make a

2:53

difference in the fight against HIV AIDS.

2:57

Then one day, Zeb heard from

2:59

Jeffrey, he'd gotten some good

3:02

news. There was this

3:04

idea that Jeffrey was going to go

3:06

to Washington, D.C. and sit with Dr.

3:08

Fauci and have a conversation about HIV

3:10

and he's going to sit before some

3:12

organization. They're going to look at his

3:14

data and they're going to either grant

3:16

us the money to do

3:19

a nationwide government funded trial or

3:21

not. But there was

3:23

something even more exciting in the works. And

3:26

they're either going to say Jeffrey is HIV cured or

3:28

not. Jeffrey

3:30

waited to hear more about the trip. He

3:33

kept reaching out to the clinic, but they

3:35

kept putting him off. Eventually

3:38

in the spring of 2022, Zeb heard from Jeffrey. Oh, I

3:40

think Dr.

3:44

Sirhots in trouble. That

3:49

was a serious understatement. And

3:52

Jeffrey would soon have a lot more than

3:54

a trip to worry about. Like,

3:57

was anything he thought he knew about

3:59

the doctor? actually

4:02

real. Go

4:30

to adt.com today or call 1-800-ADT-ASAP to learn more.

4:40

From Wondery, I'm Laura Beale and

4:42

this is Dr. Depp. Bad

4:44

Magic. This

4:46

is Episode 5. The

4:48

Data Are The Data. Over

4:58

5,000 miles away from Los

5:00

Angeles, Enochian investor Lé Abilgo

5:02

sat in his home in

5:04

Denmark, staring at

5:06

an email he'd just received. His

5:09

mouth hung open in shock. On

5:12

his screen was an article saying that the

5:14

company co-founder had been arrested on

5:17

murder-for-hire charges. As

5:20

he told the Danish podcast Dr. No, I

5:25

walked out to the bathroom and threw up.

5:28

At first I didn't believe it. Abilgo

5:32

was used to the boom and

5:34

bust roller coaster of investing and

5:36

had stared down major losses in

5:38

the past without even blinking. But

5:41

this arrest was different. This

5:43

time someone had been killed and

5:46

the motive prosecutors were pursuing connected

5:48

right back to the biotech company.

5:53

He found the many sides of the

5:55

company's scientific founder hard to square as

5:57

he told the podcast. It

6:00

is difficult for me to understand that

6:02

you can call yourself a doctor without

6:04

being one. You can

6:07

be arrested for participating in and

6:09

hiring assassins, and at the

6:11

same time be a genius. Abilgo

6:14

turned off his phone and locked himself

6:16

in his bedroom. He

6:19

knew many people would be calling him

6:21

with questions, and he wouldn't

6:23

be able to answer any of them. What's

6:27

at stake from Enochian at this point is

6:30

its absolute survival. The

6:34

Hindenburg team was scrambling to finalize

6:36

their story after news of Serhat's

6:39

arrest. The market

6:41

was watching Enochian, but that could change

6:43

any day, so they needed to get

6:45

their report out as quickly as

6:47

possible. They worked around

6:49

the clock checking and rechecking every claim

6:52

in their article, making sure that

6:54

every accusation was backed up with

6:56

evidence. Anything short of that

6:58

meant... All you have to

7:00

show for your 12-month investigation is an

7:03

investment loss on top of

7:06

all the research expenses, on top of

7:08

the legal bills, and

7:10

in a case like Enochian, you might also

7:12

have an incredibly wealthy, murderous

7:14

psychopath who's not very fond

7:16

of you. It

7:19

wasn't enough for the report to be true. It had

7:22

to be ironclad. Thomas,

7:26

from Hindenburg, knew he needed

7:28

to put the team's findings

7:31

to Enochian's executives before the

7:33

story published. You have the privilege

7:35

of putting in a final phone

7:37

call that you've got them down to rights.

7:40

Hey, your top scientist

7:42

has been arrested on

7:45

murder-for-hire charges. What have

7:47

you got to say? I mean,

7:49

that is a real, real buzz. But

7:52

this time, things weren't quite that

7:54

cinematic. That feat of trying

7:57

to get anybody on the company, on the way, to the market, is

7:59

a real, real thing. The record was an absolute

8:02

nightmare. The CEO,

8:04

Mark Dybul, wouldn't take Thomas's calls.

8:07

Neither would a key member of the board

8:10

of directors, Carol Brozgard, or

8:12

the man who brought Serhat into the

8:14

company, Chairman Renee

8:16

Sendlove. They were

8:18

stonewalling, and the strategy was

8:20

working. Because each

8:22

day that Thomas failed to get

8:24

someone to comment, Enoki and Stock

8:27

was climbing back up. By

8:29

May 27, two days

8:31

after Serhat's arrest, the stock

8:33

had almost erased its losses.

8:36

And if it kept climbing, it

8:38

could be financially disastrous for Hindenburg.

8:44

We're sorry. Your call

8:46

cannot be completed as dialed. Please

8:48

check the note. Two days before Hindenburg

8:50

planned to go to press, Thomas

8:52

was still trying to find someone

8:54

to talk to at Enoki-en. I

8:57

just kept trawling and trawling through SEC filings

9:00

and other documents and finally came

9:03

across a US phone

9:05

number, probably several years old. But,

9:07

hey, I think it was

9:09

a Florida number from Retollection. And

9:11

so I think, well, what the hell? Put

9:14

in the call. Guy

9:16

answers the phone. Hey, is this Renee?

9:19

Yeah, yeah, it's Renee. It

9:22

was the Renee Sendlove, the

9:24

chair of Enoki-en, the

9:26

man who had merged his company with

9:29

Serhat. Thomas said

9:31

he was a journalist and Renee stayed

9:33

on the line. I said,

9:36

did you know at the

9:38

time that you did this merger deal,

9:40

at the time that you announced it, that

9:42

you were dealing with a felon? In

9:46

2017, Serhat had been arrested

9:48

on 14 felony counts relating

9:50

to fraud and theft. It

9:53

had never been clear how much

9:55

Renee and Enoki-en knew about Serhat's

9:57

criminal charges. The

10:00

nays response caught Thomas off guard. And

10:03

he said, yes, we knew, but

10:05

he only had to pay a fine of 400 bucks. And

10:08

I knew exactly what that was about. And

10:11

I didn't see that there was any need to

10:13

discuss that. He also

10:15

said that he didn't think Sarah Hunt had

10:17

been convicted. Thomas

10:20

didn't think that was the whole picture.

10:23

If anyone looked at the case

10:25

file, they'd see a series of

10:27

high value financial deaths and frauds

10:29

that might concern any potential

10:31

business partner. So

10:33

he tried again. Why

10:36

didn't you stop it? You

10:38

know, Renee Sinless said to him, he says, regardless

10:41

of anything that's happened, I still have

10:43

to admit he's a genius, whether

10:46

he's a doctor or not. Renee's

10:49

belief in Sarah Hunt's abilities

10:51

had not changed. It's

10:54

like, how do you square that

10:56

circle? Just

10:59

how do you do it? You hired him because

11:01

you thought he was a doctor. Everything pointed

11:03

the fact that he's a doctor. He

11:05

can't be a genius, whether he's

11:07

a doctor or not. He's either

11:09

a genius and a doctor, or

11:11

he's an absolute con man that

11:13

you've fallen for. But Sinless seemed

11:15

to believe that both things were

11:17

possible. Thomas

11:19

pressed Renee about Sarah Hunt's arrest in

11:21

the murder for hire plot. He

11:24

said, I don't care whether

11:26

he's guilty or not. If

11:29

he is guilty, he needs to be punished for

11:31

it. And if he's not guilty, well, good

11:33

for him. How,

11:36

how is chairman of a

11:39

US listed company? Can

11:41

you be telling me that you do not

11:43

care if your founder and

11:45

scientific founder is guilty or

11:48

not of conspiracy to

11:50

murder? We

11:54

reached out to Renee Sinless for this

11:56

story, but he declined to comment. It

12:02

was June 1st, 2022, a week since Serhat was arrested.

12:08

The markets were going to open in just

12:11

over an hour, and Anokian stock was

12:13

down just 60 cents from

12:15

where it was before. Nate

12:18

sat in his office chair reading the

12:20

story one last time. We

12:23

focused largely on his

12:25

background, so we focused on

12:28

how he had apparently fabricated

12:31

every bit of his educational background

12:33

that we could find, that he

12:35

didn't graduate with multiple PhDs, that

12:37

he didn't have any medical degrees

12:40

or license. He was

12:42

in fact a low-level Turkish

12:45

street magician who

12:47

had fled the country after

12:49

charges of defrauding locals in

12:52

Turkey. And we

12:54

also highlighted, of course, his massive

12:56

white-collar crime spree that he undertook

12:58

right when he got to the

13:00

U.S., just really a

13:02

buffet of various different flavors

13:05

of white-collar fraud. The

13:08

article also detailed his treatment

13:10

of cancer patients from Denmark

13:12

and Pennsylvania. We really

13:14

focused on his history to date

13:16

to show that this is not

13:18

the Michelangelo you think you have.

13:20

This guy is a complete con

13:23

artist. Nate

13:25

checked in with his team, and

13:27

when everyone gave the all clear, he

13:30

pressed the button to publish

13:32

their investigation into Serhatkumwukju. And

13:36

just went outside and took a long walk

13:38

and smoked a cigarette. And

13:41

the reaction when I came back was

13:43

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doctor The

17:47

article began to rocket around the internet

17:50

It made its way to Guy Rokin the

17:52

podcaster who'd interviewed Sarah hot I

17:55

get a DM LinkedIn message

17:57

from someone who I don't know being

18:00

like, hey, have you seen

18:03

this article? Your podcast

18:05

episode is referenced. I

18:07

open it up and the title

18:10

is Miracle Cures and Murder for

18:12

Hire. How a spoon bending Turkish

18:14

magician built a six hundred million

18:16

dollar NASDAQ listed scab based on

18:18

a lifetime of lies. And

18:21

boy, was I I was

18:23

just blown away by this article.

18:27

He thought back to Sarah had party had

18:29

gone to in the Hollywood Hills. Suddenly,

18:32

all the magicians that were there made

18:34

more sense than nothing

18:36

else did. The hiring of

18:38

the hit man is some next level

18:41

shit for me. That

18:43

is and then and then

18:46

those like the medical fraudulence and

18:48

the degree of just I

18:51

mean, it it it's

18:54

it's really baffling. The

18:57

Hindenburg team began hearing from people all

18:59

over the world. The

19:01

reaction was like, holy shit, like,

19:04

what are you even talking about?

19:06

Fake magician who lies about scientific

19:08

research is not the

19:11

norm for, you know, criticism

19:13

of a public company listed on the NASDAQ.

19:17

Sure enough, Enoki and share price

19:19

dropped again. Hindenburg's

19:22

report had spooked investors

19:25

and their short sell had worked. Yes,

19:29

in this case, we did make

19:31

more than the cost of research for

19:33

our short. Nate won't

19:36

say how much they made, but

19:38

the risk had paid off. Sometimes

19:40

you can even be right on facts, wrong

19:42

on timing. There's all sorts

19:44

of reasons why a stock can go

19:46

up. So it is often

19:49

a very risky, I mean, always

19:51

really a risky endeavor. But,

19:53

yeah, no, this one, this one was one

19:55

that worked for us. Enochian's

20:01

reaction to the story was

20:03

immediate. The day the

20:05

story went up, its CEO Mark

20:07

Dybul wrote a letter to Enochian

20:09

shareholders. I have

20:11

spoken to some of you about the

20:13

serious and disturbing news that broke last

20:15

week about Sir Hatkum Ruchu. They

20:19

try and tell us in the press release

20:21

there has never been a formal role for

20:23

Gom Ruchu in the company. And

20:26

his remaining informal role as the

20:28

scientific advisors concluded. So they kind

20:30

of say we stand by his credentials

20:33

but he's not got a hand in

20:35

the day to day running of the company. This

20:38

was damage control. So

20:40

the company came out and said

20:42

that they strongly refuted our findings.

20:46

But noticeably in the press release where

20:48

they claimed that everything was great, they

20:51

stopped referring to Sir Hatkum as

20:53

Dr. Sir Hatkum. They

20:55

just started calling him Sir Hatk at that

20:57

point. Enochian

21:00

called Hindenburg's article quote, misleading

21:02

propaganda intended to drive the

21:05

company's stock price down. They

21:08

said there had never been a formal role

21:10

for Sir Hatk in the company and

21:12

that his informal role of

21:15

scientific advisor had concluded.

21:18

And they were insistent that their

21:20

patents still had the potential to

21:22

cure deadly diseases. In

21:24

other words, they were saying that

21:26

even if Sir Hatk was a

21:28

multiple fraudster and suspected murderer his

21:30

ideas still had merit. Deibel

21:33

wrote, the science is

21:35

the science. The data

21:38

are the data. But

21:44

how could Sir Hatk's medical miracles be

21:46

believed if it lied about everything else?

21:50

One of the people focused on that question

21:52

was Zeb. He

21:54

was wondering what it meant for his

21:56

friend Jeffrey. was

22:00

concerned with was is Jeffrey okay? I

22:03

started to trace back in my mind all of

22:05

the times where he appeared sick

22:09

or run down. I started

22:12

to question like was his undetectable status

22:14

real? You know, like why, it just

22:16

everything started to flash in my mind

22:19

and Jeffrey was very quick to

22:21

reassure me and everyone that

22:23

he was okay. But

22:26

I don't believe that he was super okay. Zeb

22:30

knew that Jeffrey didn't want to ruin the

22:32

trial by going back on his old medication.

22:36

Even when he'd been too sick to leave

22:38

his house, he hadn't given up on Serhat's

22:40

cure. So Jeffrey

22:42

called Serhat's clinic and

22:45

called and called. No

22:47

one there could tell him what to do. So

22:50

he went back on a regimen of

22:52

antiretroviral drugs and ended

22:54

his HIV treatment trial. We

23:01

reached out to Mark Dybul from

23:03

Enochian about Jeffrey's treatment and he responded,

23:06

we had no involvement in the administration

23:09

of this treatment to Mr. Drew. Moreover,

23:12

Enochian had no involvement with

23:14

any treatment conducted by Seroff

23:16

Clinic and did not work

23:18

with the Seroff Research Institute

23:20

on any HIV treatment. Mark

23:24

Dybul, however, was aware of Jeffrey's

23:26

trial and Enochian stood

23:28

to benefit financially from any positive

23:31

outcome. As

23:34

far as Zeb could tell, the whole

23:36

thing was a huge loss for his

23:38

friend. When

23:41

we would do these press events

23:43

and these Q and A's, the

23:47

just pride

23:49

that he felt for potentially being a part of

23:53

something that would help so many people was

23:56

just massive for him. And

23:59

so when all of that happened, that got taken away and suddenly

24:01

he got put back on medication, it

24:05

was devastating. Jeffrey

24:09

had spent two years of his life

24:11

sacrificing his well-being in the search for

24:13

a cure. Had it

24:15

all been a sham? We'll

24:18

never know how much this has affected

24:20

his physical body and what the ramifications

24:22

of this will be and will

24:24

he be able to withstand like cancer or

24:27

some other type of sickness or disease that

24:29

comes with life? It's

24:33

incredibly infuriating. We

24:37

did reach out to Jeffrey for this story

24:40

but he declined to comment. Not

24:46

long after Serhat's arrest, Zeb's

24:48

documentary on Jeffrey was taken down

24:50

by the streaming service that bought it.

24:53

For Zeb, that was tragic. I

24:56

feel like in this

24:58

entire tsunami of terrible

25:00

bullshit, Jeffrey's

25:03

story has been totally lost. And

25:07

his act of service and his

25:09

just willingness to put

25:11

his life on the line to

25:14

honor his fallen brothers that have

25:16

died from this disease has totally

25:18

been lost. A

25:25

month after Hindenburg's article came

25:27

out, another statement was posted

25:30

on Anokian's website. The

25:32

company said they'd been reviewing Serhat's test

25:35

results. Quote, the

25:37

results of this investigation verified

25:39

key primary data for the

25:41

company's HIV and cancer pipelines.

25:45

But that wasn't all. The

25:47

company also disclosed that Serhat had

25:49

faked the results of animal studies

25:51

for their COVID and hepatitis B

25:54

treatments. In this case, the

25:56

data wasn't the data. As

25:59

a result, the company... will

26:01

initiate legal action against Gamrukju

26:03

over the falsified data. Enochian

26:06

was now taking to court

26:08

its own inventor and co-founder,

26:11

the man they described as a

26:14

genius. They

26:16

sued Serha alleging that they had been

26:18

duped and they had no idea that

26:21

it was just a big fraud all

26:23

along and how could this

26:25

happen, just such a horrific surprise. And

26:28

my thought was that this was just

26:30

entirely disingenuous to show if anyone asked, like,

26:32

look, we were also surprised by this. We

26:34

had no idea. I mean, we were in

26:36

line to make tens of millions of dollars

26:39

from these lies and there were

26:41

red flags all over the place, but how could anyone have

26:43

seen this? By

26:45

the time the lawsuit was filed, Enochian's

26:47

share price had fallen to $2.11 a

26:49

share and

26:52

the company and its investors had lost

26:55

hundreds of millions of dollars as a

26:57

result. The largest

26:59

holder of Enochian stock was Serha

27:02

Gamrukju himself and his family members

27:04

and related entities. So the

27:07

biggest loser in the stock

27:09

market was Serha himself, which

27:12

is exactly how it should

27:14

be in our view. The

27:16

CEO and several other executives and board

27:19

members had stock, so they

27:21

also lost significant amounts

27:23

of their paper holdings. The

27:29

fallout from the revelations about Serha was

27:31

worse for the patients and the people

27:34

who loved them, those

27:36

who had placed their hope in Serha's

27:38

hands. I think what he did

27:40

was he prayed on vulnerability wherever

27:42

he could find it and looked for

27:44

the absolute most vulnerable

27:47

people he could find and

27:50

came in with a smile on his

27:52

face and a calm voice and credentials

27:54

in the white lab coat and

27:57

pretended that he was going to solve their

27:59

most horrific problems. problem in exchange for a

28:01

lot of money and

28:04

people bought it. What

28:07

was going through Serhat's mind as he

28:09

offered these treatments? It's

28:12

tough to pinpoint the motivation for

28:14

Serhat. Certainly money. I

28:17

think he was motivated also by fame. I

28:20

think possibly motivated by

28:22

a desire for respect

28:24

amongst peers or intelligent

28:26

people. But

28:29

perhaps there's something else. That

28:31

same look that his old school friend saw in

28:33

his eyes long ago back in

28:35

Turkey. That same hysteria

28:37

when he first saw a magic

28:39

trick. The delight of

28:42

deception. A lot

28:44

of times with someone like him,

28:47

they're also motivated by a joy

28:49

in tricking people and

28:52

using his wits to get money from

28:54

people. Like a predator that feels a

28:57

sense of joy from his

29:00

prey. Welcome

29:08

back inside our proactive newsroom. Joining me now

29:10

is Dr. Mark Dibel. In

29:13

late 2023, Anokian CEO was

29:15

excited to make an announcement.

29:18

He is the CEO of Renovaro Biosciences.

29:20

Dr. Dibel, great to see you. How

29:22

are you? Great. How are you? Nice

29:24

to be with you, Steve. Thanks for joining us. Anokian

29:26

had a new name and a new

29:28

focus. Renovaro, it means

29:30

to renew, is focused

29:33

on platform approaches to

29:35

strengthen our own immune system, to

29:37

renew the immune system, to retrain

29:39

it so that it can control

29:41

diseases on its own. With

29:43

a new name came a new focus

29:46

on cancer. They

29:48

were planning a merger with an

29:50

up-and-coming AI company to supercharge their

29:52

cancer detection. And

29:54

that HIV treatment that Jeffrey went

29:56

through so much for in

29:59

their annual report. the company announced they

30:01

were dropping plans to make it into

30:03

a clinical trial. In

30:06

a separate statement to us, Mark

30:09

Dibel said the results from the patient

30:11

were promising and that he's

30:13

hopeful the approach will be evaluated.

30:17

As Enochian went public with the

30:20

rebrand, their stock surged once more.

30:23

Nate has seen it all before. I

30:26

think it's just a cheap tactic

30:28

to try and sort of gloss

30:30

over the fact that they had just

30:32

run this massive entity filled

30:34

with lies and just change the story a

30:37

little bit and see if they can sell

30:39

the new story to people. And

30:42

sadly, I think it will work. I

30:44

think it's already clear that they've

30:47

managed to pump their stock back up. They've

30:49

got people excited about this new

30:51

AI venture that seems completely outrageous.

30:55

And my guess is they will, if they

30:57

haven't already, dump stock

30:59

on the people that are buying into the

31:02

new story. And I think they'll probably just

31:04

keep doing it over and

31:06

over and over again until and

31:08

unless they are actually stopped. Meanwhile,

31:13

one of the largest shareholders

31:15

of Renovaro's stock is

31:17

behind bars. Serhat

31:20

is still awaiting trial on murder for

31:23

higher charges relating to the kidnapping and

31:25

death of Gregory Davis. He

31:27

has pled not guilty. If

31:30

convicted, he faces up to life in prison.

31:35

Serhat's trial isn't scheduled to

31:37

start until October 2024. We

31:42

reached out to him, his family and

31:44

his attorneys, but all declined to comment.

31:51

In the meantime, according to Serhat's

31:53

friend, Brooke Casey, he's making the

31:55

most of his time behind bars.

31:58

He sort of sees this as an opportunity. He's

32:00

been, you know,

32:03

raising the consciousness of the people

32:05

that he's met in incarceration, teaching

32:08

meditation, teaching yoga. He's

32:11

taking this as this moment to, you

32:14

know, meditate and to, you

32:16

know, have access

32:19

to people that he wouldn't

32:21

have had access to. People

32:24

who might be looking for a guru or

32:27

a magician or a

32:29

genius who can make all of

32:32

their problems vanish. I

32:36

think in that respect,

32:38

I'm very fortunate. I

32:42

can say pretty much over 90% of

32:44

things I've come up with panned out and

32:49

less than 10% that

32:51

then panned out taught me a lot.

33:26

From Wendry, this is episode five

33:29

of five of Doctor Death, Bad

33:32

Magic. I'm your

33:34

host, Laura Beale. This series

33:36

is written by Benjamin Gray. Producer

33:39

is Nika Singh. Senior

33:41

producer is Russell Cinch. Story

33:43

editor is Alison Weintraub. Senior

33:46

editor is Rachel B. Doyle. Mixing

34:00

by Kyle Randall. Senior

34:02

Managing Producer is Lata Pandya.

34:05

Coordinating Producer is Heather Beloga.

34:08

Produced by Storyforce. Music

34:10

Supervisor is Scott Velasquez for

34:12

Friesan Sync. Special

34:14

thanks to Jesper Peterson, Ali

34:17

Dashty, and Guy Rokin of the

34:19

Fancy Lab Code Guilds Podcast. And

34:22

to Nate Anderson and the staff at

34:24

Hindenburg Research for use of their reporting.

34:26

Executive Producers are Bly Pagan Fast

34:29

and Corey Shepherd Stern for Story Our

34:33

Executive Producers are George Lavender, Marsha

34:35

Louie, and Jen Sertens for

34:37

Wondering.